Move Sticky Web

[alexwolf]

Someone mentioned Shuckle a while back due to the fact that he gets both SR and SW post-Pokebank, and I've been testing him with what I'd say is reasonable success:

Shucks @ Custap Berry
Sturdy | Careful | 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef
- Stealth Rock
- Sticky Web
- Knock Off
- Bulldoze / Toxic

Does reasonably well at setting up both hazards, and thanks to Sturdy and Custap it rarely doesn't get to do both (though Taunt is a bit of a problem, but Knock Off can annoy most taunt-users). The other two slots are mainly for filler, since Shuckle's primary job is just to set up and die, but they've come in handy now and again. I've been running Bulldoze mainly to sabotage things that try to set up on Shuckle, since it allows most things to be revenge-killed, or at least to lose most of their speed boosts if they run those. Pretty reliant on Spinblock support, though, since it won't often get the chance to setup again.

Mega Gardevoir with Shuckle's hazards has been working pretty well for me as a stallbreaker.

Custap Berry has not been found in X and Y, and seeing as we won't be able to transfer items via PokeBank, we most likely won't be able to use it for a long time. That said, this is a better moveset for Custap Berry Shuckle:

- Stealth Rock
- Sticky Web
- Encore
- Final Gambit

Encore means that you are not set up bait for boosting sweepers and Sub users, and is a must on lead Shuckle. Final Gambit allows Shuckle to bring in a teammate unharmed whenever it wants, conserving momentum, and also allows it to protect its hazards against both rapid spinner and defog users, as long as Shuckle is in Custap Berry range. Finally, Final Gambit allows Shuckle to break the Sub of a Pokemon that Shuckle has Encored after setting up a few hazards, giving huge momentum for its team.

 

[Flamebot]

Honestly the two best users (IMO they are the best) don't have much hitting power.
Shuckle can take a few hits and set it put, along with SR. Other than that, he's not to useful(You could say shell smash and Baton pass to I guess) Garvantula on the other hand, can hold something like Focus shash to set Stickyweb up. Tho garvantula is very frail and doesn't have that great of a hitting power (but you could trap the opponent to, using it's trapping move, IF you survive another turn).
This move is awesome tho, it can make HO have a really hard time getting around it, especially if there Defogger or spinner is down.

I think that come Pokebank, there will be more users of this move. Perhaps more viable ones.

 

[TrophyHunterallday]

I find shuckle to be the best user of this move..Because it does no need to lead..Not only that but you can use it as a physical or special wall and it also gets Rocks and Knock off for support..Yes,smeargle gets all the moves mentioned above but you have to lead with it..

I agree with you. However i have had the opportunity to set up mid game hazards (SR and SW) with my smeargle in a battle last week. And that mid game hazard made all the difference. It was reasonably equal being 3 and 3 but the SR destroyed a talon flame that my Jolly Talon couldn't have taken out without it. As long as you have spore you can use a fodder to get in smeargle. Especially with maxed out speed. I find that MOST pokemon can effeciently set up Mid games but smeargle with focus sash and shuckle give the best chances.

EDIT: The point of the post is to point out that if used at the right time, Smeargle can use set up mid game also

 

[Payton64]

I've been thinking about sticky web, and how best to run it on my team. Apparently the move does not slow down anything with levitate or flying (or clear body). This is a problem for a couple of reasons.

Mainly talonflame. I know he already gets priority on flying, but since hes so fast it enables him to get around stuff like sucker punch mawile. Who are the best sweepers and pokes to compliment a team like this?

I've been running a Sticky Web team on Showdown for the last week or so and it does much better than I thought it would. I use a standard galvantula for my sticky webber, Hydreigon, Togekiss and Bisharp as my sweepers, Tentacruel as my tank and Mega-Banette for prankster destiny bond. I'll detail my sweepers for you-

Hydreigon@life orb
hasty
252spd 200sp.atk 56 atk
draco meteor
fire blast
u-turn
flash cannon

Togekiss@leftovers
timid
252spd 128sp.atk 128hp
air slash
roost
aura sphere
dazzling gleam

Bisharp@assault vest
jolly
252spd 128atk 128def
iron head
brick break
psycho cut
sucker punch

So I'm not the best competitive Pokemon battler, but these guys have been doing wonders for me. In my opinion, sweepers on a sticky web team should have all-around good stats with speed being a little below average. That way, you have bulky sweepers who are also incredibly fast.

The two main problems that I run into with my team are priority attackers (specifically Talonflame)and Espeon's magic bounce. I handle Espeon pretty easily with Galvantula's bug buzz. For priority attackers, you honestly have to hunker down with something like Tentacruel. His toxic spikes also work really well with this team by adding damage to the sticky web speed decrease.

Whenever my opponent sends out their mega or something that is just plain annoying, that's when I send out my Mega-Bannette. If it's weak, I can revenge kill it with sucker punch. If it's strong, I can use my priority destiny bond to get rid of it.

 

[DinaIsha]

Galvantula is the current best user imo. It beats all the Magic Bouncers available in the game (Espeon, Mega Absol and Xatu) and even some taunters (Greninja and the rare lead Talonflame). It can't even 2OHKO Spinners though, as they tend to be defensive, but it can definitely punch a hole in them. It also severely damages Pranksters with Compound Eyes Thunder. What's more? With HP Ice equipped, it can hit things like Gliscor and Garchomp in the face, especially since they tend to switch in on Thunder (Too bad that the HP nerf doesn't allow you to KO them. Then again, you can predict a switch and spam Thunder again to damage whatever is coming in). The paralysis chance from Thunder isn't shabby too.

I really wish I had the replay of a PS video where I set up Sticky Web and swept with LO Mamoswine alone (I'd set up SR, so taking out Talonflame wasn't hard. Mamoswine survives unboosted BB or FB from Talonflame).

I can see Shuckle in RU at best. Defensive Ariados can attempt to set up Sticky Web and Toxic Spikes in RU or UU, but that's about it. The move's distribution is terrible. If Scolipede got Sticky Web, it would be abused as heck.

 

[KMEB]

Masquerain is one of the more fun (not the best, that would obviously be galvantula or smeargle) users of the move.

Its really a 2-Pokemon chain-

Whimsicott with eject button-
Light screen, taunt, memento, stun spore

Masquerain with leftovers-
Sticky web, quiver dance, baton pass, hydro pump/air slash/bug buzz

Generally, you just open with whimsicott, do whatever it takes to make sure masquerain has two turns to set up, then sticky web, quiver dance, and baton pass to aggron, Nidoking, scrafty, or a whole host of other Pokemon.

Aggron, I find, often does better than other Pokemon for a few reasons-

Rock head, aggronite
Hone claws
Iron tail/dragon rush
Earthquake
Head smash

1-If your opponent switched to try and take down masquerain, it probably will have been something aggron can destroy, which means you have a turn to home claws.
2- aggron is held back by 3 things- devastating weaknesses to fighting and ground, low speed, and low special defense. With sticky web and a quiver dance or 2, aggron easily outspeeds mega lucario, which is one hell of a baseline. Two quiver dances and proper EVs allows it to tank an aura sphere from mega mewtwo Y.
3-speed boosting sweepers can easily be ended by priority. Aggron in particular pretty much always dies to Mach punch. But aggronite, at the the cost of recoil free head smash, allows aggron to bypass the OHKO that would result from a Mach punch or aqua jet.

Masquerain has just the right ability to make the set work, and pairing up with whimsicott keeps secret sediments off the feild and buys it the time needed. Running clefable alongside with healing wish means that masquerain can often do it twice per match.

Even if you devote half your team to support, a solid offensive core will make this a difficult team to stop. I tend to go with aggron, Nidoking and porygon-z (who can ditch agility to run unresisted tri-attack/darkpulse/discharge/nastyplot and still, thanks to sticky web, outspeed almost anything)

Obviously this falls apart instantly in the face of the more OP megas and such, buT UU will be arriving soon, and I intend to be ready!

 

[El_Sargento]

Is this a thing? She's somewhat bulky (55-63-90-50-80-42) with Eviolite. Not necessarily a lead.

Swadloon @ Eviolite
Ability: Overcoat/whatever ability is legal with Sticky Web and tutor moves
EVs: 248 HP / ??? Att / ??? Def / ??? SDef / ??? Spd
Careful/Impish/Adamant? Nature
- Synthesis
- Sticky Web
- Seed Bomb/Toxic
- Magic Coat/Toxic

I suck at explanations and calcs, and my english isn't good enough for long sentences. Deal with it.

 

[TheLonelyUmbreon]

I think this move is incredibly broken because most grounded pokes don't even have a chance to even hit the opponent regardless of counter play this move can destroy most teams with out effort. This makes most pokes easy to ko and to set up on, I know there are pokes that can sweep regardless of the speed drop but its just those pokes and flying/levitate pokes that sticky web doesn't do any harm to. This just makes the other player's chance of winning slim to none and I hope I see it getting banned.

 

[GenXXZ]

In my opinion, Galvantula is the best user. Such an offensive hazard requires an offensive hazard setter, and Galvantula fits the bill. Although not exactly a powerhouse, it does have access to an extra accurate Thunder, and a dual STAB that actually gets some pretty good coverage. Volt Switch helps you keep your momentum; an EXTREMELY important asset to any team using Sticky Web, and Galvantula can also abuse the hazard itself, so, yeah!

 

[El_Sargento]

I think this move is incredibly broken because most grounded pokes don't even have a chance to even hit the opponent regardless of counter play this move can destroy most teams with out effort.

Poor distribution, predictable users... and Defog and Rapid Spin exist, you know.

It's your fault if your team is composed enterely of speedy (not anymore :p) and squishy sweepers...

 

[FlyThai]

I think this move is incredibly broken because most grounded pokes don't even have a chance to even hit the opponent regardless of counter play this move can destroy most teams with out effort. This makes most pokes easy to ko and to set up on, I know there are pokes that can sweep regardless of the speed drop but its just those pokes and flying/levitate pokes that sticky web doesn't do any harm to. This just makes the other player's chance of winning slim to none and I hope I see it getting banned.

I would hate to see sticky web banned because im having too much fun sweeping with Bisharp

 

[Sergeant Spooky]

I think this move is incredibly broken because most grounded pokes don't even have a chance to even hit the opponent regardless of counter play this move can destroy most teams with out effort. This makes most pokes easy to ko and to set up on, I know there are pokes that can sweep regardless of the speed drop but its just those pokes and flying/levitate pokes that sticky web doesn't do any harm to. This just makes the other player's chance of winning slim to none and I hope I see it getting banned.

Haha, what? Broken? With fliers, levitators, the occasional balloon users, things that don't really mind speed drops like bulky attackers or priority users, the existence of Defog and Rapid Spin, and the fact that there's only one decent user of Sticky Web, I found to be really not that great.

 

[SomeDrunkRockLee]

I do have a question here, actually. Why the &*#(%&*^* is anyone possibly using Smeargle as a hazad setter/suicide lead? Let's look at what smeargle does. It tries to spore something, sets up stealth rock or sticky web, and then dies. Possibly uses a momento to help get a sweeper in, but it usually dies first. Additionally, thanks to the fact that defog is running rampant in the current meta and rapid spin still exists (and the fact that magic bounce users can wall any Smeargle lacking baton pass (although Mega Absol and Espeon can probably both 2shot smeargle (if not oneshot) but I'm too lazy to do calcs) suicide leads to get up hazards are virtually pointless. Beyond that, smeargle has terrible stats, including a 75 base speed that basically everything decently offensive in the meta can beat, giving smeargle little to no possible use.

Also, just the fact that smeargle takes up an entire spot on your team.
An entire spot.
That could be running a perfectly functional pokemon that actually works.
Is devoted to smeargle so it can die and make your opponent waste a turn using defog/rapid spin. And possibly get something asleep, although with the reverted sleep mechanics + grass types (and overcoat users) being immune to spore, that's iffy at best.

I don't really understand this.

 

[Antonius the Great]

I think this move is incredibly broken because most grounded pokes don't even have a chance to even hit the opponent regardless of counter play this move can destroy most teams with out effort. This makes most pokes easy to ko and to set up on, I know there are pokes that can sweep regardless of the speed drop but its just those pokes and flying/levitate pokes that sticky web doesn't do any harm to. This just makes the other player's chance of winning slim to none and I hope I see it getting banned.

Woah woah woahhhh broski. It's an awesome move but I wouldn't call it a complete game changer for every match.

1. Defog or Rapid Spin eliminate it and force you to have to set it up again, and a lot of teams carry at least one of these moves. In addition to that, Defoggers aren't affected by the speed drop (bar Scizor, who still doesn't mind it anyways) and defensive Rapid Spinners don't care about the Speed drop much.
2. Stall still exists and doesn't give a flying tortoise about this move, and it ends up being a waste of time to set it up.
3. It is situational to use this move, because many teams don't even benefit from it. Why doesn't Stall or Hyper Offense like the Speed drop enough to dedicate a team slot for it? Most teams would not want to waste a team slot on this move
4. It's extremely predictable because almost nobody uses Galvantula or Leavany in OU so seeing one of those Pokes on a team easily lets them know that they're gonna need to take out that Poke and be prepared to spin/blow it away

I didn't really mean to be rude or anything (if it seemed like it) but I've been thinking of things that would make the move not as viable, and these were pretty much what I had on my mind already.

Aside from that.. I posted my set for Galv on the Galv thread but it wasn't very much liked xD It actually functions very well though, tell me what you all think, this goes with what SDRL above me mentioned about suicide leads being pointless:

Galv @ Leftovers
Timid Nature
Trait: Swarm/Unnerve
::Sticky Web
::Thunder Wave
::Volt Switch
::Bug Buzz
EVs: 252 HP/4 SpA/252 Spe

I call him my "momentum-turner" for bulky offense. Basically, you only lead if they have an obvious lead as well, ie Forretress, and I go anti-lead if they have something like Heatran that they're gonna lead with to take out Galv. Aside from that, I know he's frail, but he isn't OHKO'd by a lot, mostly due to his typing. His goal is using Sticky Web, obviously. If he is outspeed by the opposing lead, he uses TWave and then Volt Switches out to stay alive for later in the game, and if parahax work in your favour, you could even get the Web up after TWave (but I don't take my chances). By doing these two things and Volt Switching out, he is able to turn momentum your way easily. Bug Buzz is there to give it a SE move to hit Espeon which will try to bounce back the web. It 2HKOs offensive Espeon. The issue is getting him back in, but his opportunity comes against walls and when one of your pokes has been KOd.

Idk, the description does it no justice, it functions well for me when I try it.

 

[DinaIsha]

I hope I see it getting banned.

Stealth Rock, a hazard that plays a major role in tiering isn't banned so far. I see now reason why Sticky Web should be banned. Have a Spinner if you have a Hazard Setter on your team. Otherwise, you can just use a Defogger, which has received a huge buff this time around.

 

[neooo]

I do have a question here, actually. Why the &*#(%&*^* is anyone possibly using Smeargle as a hazad setter/suicide lead? Let's look at what smeargle does. It tries to spore something, sets up stealth rock or sticky web, and then dies. Possibly uses a momento to help get a sweeper in, but it usually dies first. Additionally, thanks to the fact that defog is running rampant in the current meta and rapid spin still exists (and the fact that magic bounce users can wall any Smeargle lacking baton pass (although Mega Absol and Espeon can probably both 2shot smeargle (if not oneshot) but I'm too lazy to do calcs) suicide leads to get up hazards are virtually pointless. Beyond that, smeargle has terrible stats, including a 75 base speed that basically everything decently offensive in the meta can beat, giving smeargle little to no possible use.

Also, just the fact that smeargle takes up an entire spot on your team.
An entire spot.
That could be running a perfectly functional pokemon that actually works.
Is devoted to smeargle so it can die and make your opponent waste a turn using defog/rapid spin. And possibly get something asleep, although with the reverted sleep mechanics + grass types (and overcoat users) being immune to spore, that's iffy at best.

I don't really understand this.

The people using Smeargle for a suicide status lead don't understand what they're doing either, you're not alone.

 

[Toljik]

Smeargle can defeat some of its counters with the right moves, though it does have a case of 4MSS because of it. Taunt works well against Defog users since many of the common ones are slower than Smeargle. Dark Void can get around Grass type switch-ins, though the 80% accuracy can be infuriating. It can't completely stop Magic Bounce users, but it can get around them temporally with Skill Swap or Parting Shot, or Encore if they use Smeargle as setup bait. Fast Taunters (like Sableye) are stopped by Magic Coat unless they predict it.

Obviously it can't run all of those moves, but it's no worse than Garvantula and Shuckle.

 

[rachet67]

All sticky web users, bar shuckle are essentially suicide leads, and nearly every team this generation has rapid spin or defog. You basically play a 5 vs 6 game after the opponent spends one turn using defog. Would have been game breaking last gen when there were no reliable spinners and no defog, but it really won't be that useful until some decent defensive mon gets it (don't tell me shuckle is viable).

 

[neooo]

All sticky web users, bar shuckle are essentially suicide leads, and nearly every team this generation has rapid spin or defog. You basically play a 5 vs 6 game after the opponent spends one turn using defog. Would have been game breaking last gen when there were no reliable spinners and no defog, but it really won't be that useful until some decent defensive mon gets it (don't tell me shuckle is viable).

One of the biggest issues is the fact that while you can spinblock with a ghost to ensure your hazards stay put, when people use defog on something that also has 3 other useful moves, you're really losing out big time. Wasting two turns can potentially lose you the game while your opponent is stating up, killing whatever you have in, or setting hazards or screens of their own.

 

[rachet67]

Is Defog really that common? The only Pokemon in OU that run it more than 20% of the time are Skarmory and Mandibuzz.
Though to be fair, the standard Garvantula cannot 1HKO either of them.

Some form of hazard removal is on almost every team, or at least most good teams. Because Garvantula and other sticky web users are suicide leads, you don't have to have skarmory in on them. You just kill them when they try to set up, preferably with a mon that can get around focus sash, and switch into skarmory as soon as possible.

 

[Toljik]

Some form of hazard removal is on almost every team, or at least most good teams. Because Garvantula and other sticky web users are suicide leads, you don't have to have skarmory in on them. You just kill them when they try to set up, preferably with a mon that can get around focus sash, and switch into skarmory as soon as possible.

I know most teams have hazard removers, but other people in the thread were mentioning Defog specifically.

 

[rachet67]

Well defog is just as common, more reliable (with a cost), and has more good users (Zapdos, Skarmory, Mandibuzz) than rapid spin. Even the good rapid spinners get walled be specific ghosts (for example excadrill and tree-whatsitsname)

 

[Toljik]

Well defog is just as common more reliable (with a cost), and has more good users than rapid spin.

It's not as common as Rapid Spin. There's 1 OU Pokemon that runs it the majority of the time (Mandibuzz), versus 3 that run Rapid Spin the majority of the time (Excadrill, Starmie, Donphan). Even Skarmory, who I mentioned earlier, runs it only 1/3rd of the time.

And the cost is heavy. Unless you're going to play with no entry hazards, you need to Defog after the opponent sets their hazards, but before you set your own.

 

[rachet67]

The cost is not that heavy, just don't set up rocks until you either your oppenent can no longer set them up or you don't care. Donphan sucks, gets walled by so many spinblockers, excadrill has problems with some, and starmie is beaten by aeigislash. Defog can't be blocked on the other hand. This whole conversation is on the wrong thread anyways, as both can clear sticky web.

Where are you getting these statistics by the way?

 

[Toljik]

This: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6677789/ It's the Gen VI OU moveset statistics for December.

And it is on the right thread. Sticky Web's viability depends on the viability of Rapid Spin and Defog.