Hidden Type

[MikeDawg]

Grass/Flying/Fire talonflame could be interesting.

The main draw: Stab grass natural gift. I don't know this meta, so this is pure theorymon, but in standard, talon struggles with the setup because it's both niche and just barely not strong enough to ko what it needs to (rotom, ttar, etc.). With stab, at least one of those problems is alleviated, and this meta, i think, is more suites to the extra coverage (think water gliscor, random rock types, etc.)

Natural gift also allows the use of acrobatics if that is important to you.

Grass alleviates the water weakness, but it adds on a weakness to ice.

Lonnnnng post

The issue with this post is how it completely oversimplifies pokemon to being an entirely typing-based battle. Sure, adding normal (for example) to weavile will give it a triple fighting weakness, but it isn't taking any hits regardless, three times super effective or otherwise. It struggles to take even neutral attacks, so unless you are looking to accomplish some particular immunity-based niche, focusing on its defensive typing is futile. Adding something like fighting to power up low kick would be a much better option.

Great typing only goes so far. It has to be tailored to the pokemon (ex. Ice is great offensively, terrible defensively. Weavile isn't going to become a defensive behemoth even without ice typing.)

 

[OLD GREGG (im back baby)]

Just started playing this today and really like what I see.
The rotoms, especially rotom-w and rotom-h, have great dual typings/levitate to slap hp dragon onto for some neat 4x resistances to common offensive types.

 

[11pikabro]

I'm liking this meta, but I can't help but notice how changing a Pokémon's defensive typing can also mess with its potential. I'm conflicted over what I could do with Celebi's typing, for instance. Maybe give it Rock or Poison typing, I guess, depending on its partners, though adding either type will neutralize a useful resistance or two.
Then there's Ferrothorn, who may as well not add a type in order to keep its numerous resistances, though I am interested to see if Dark STAB Knock Off has potential.

I'm also noticing that plenty of Pokémon are giving up their Ice resists/neutralities in favor of Flying, Grass, or Dragon typing, like Mega Aggron. Maybe Hail might have a chance to prove itself here? Probably not, since I'm also finding plenty of Fire-types.

 

[Ghoul King]

Ferrothorn is generally best off adding Water typing, which adds zero weaknesses, reduces the Fire weakness, and its only real cost is that Ferrothorn is no longer resistance to Electric. I've seen Ghost Ferrothorn though, presumably for punishing Fighting users, though it seems pretty sub-optimal to me given that Ferrothorn often worth hitting with Knock Off anyway to remove its Rocky Helmet or Leftovers. Not even getting into those Pokemon that will use Dark Pulse or Shadow Ball as their best option in the first place...

In Celebi's case adding Poison is probably the most overall optimal thing, reducing its double weakness to bug, removing its Poison weakness, and the only cost is it no longer resists Ground and Psychic -and it's generally tough enough that this isn't a dealbreaker. Plus immunity to Toxic is nice, albeit it has Natural Cure anyway so it's not super important. But being able to stay in regardless of Toxic is useful.

The issue with this post is how it completely oversimplifies pokemon to being an entirely typing-based battle. Sure, adding normal (for example) to weavile will give it a triple fighting weakness, but it isn't taking any hits regardless, three times super effective or otherwise. It struggles to take even neutral attacks, so unless you are looking to accomplish some particular immunity-based niche, focusing on its defensive typing is futile. Adding something like fighting to power up low kick would be a much better option.

Great typing only goes so far. It has to be tailored to the pokemon (ex. Ice is great offensively, terrible defensively. Weavile isn't going to become a defensive behemoth even without ice typing.)

I cannot imagine why you selected Weavile as an example, since it can and does run Ghost routinely in this meta to entirely erase its Fighting weakness at no particular cost, including allowing it to switch in on Fighting types safely.

The post is merely about exploring whether it is possible to cover a double weakness on those Pokemon that have one, and covering the implications of trying to cover them. Bug/Flying Pokemon, for instance, are flat-out unable to escape having a double weakness -which is particularly relevant to the defensively oriented Vespiquen. Meanwhile, Gyarados and Gliscor both have great options for helping with their double weakness -and in both cases their preferred coverage leaves them triply weak to Freeze Dry. (I am seriously considering adding a Freeze Dry user to my team because of a combination of Water Gliscor, Ground Gyarados, Grass Rotom-Wash, and assorted less important Pokemon that would hate to be hit by it)

Furthermore, the vast majority of Pokemon with double weaknesses are fairly bulky, or more accurately are trying to be bulky with the double weakness off-setting their durability. Even the likes of Mega Scizor, priority sweeper supreme, is surprisingly hard to kill if you aren't picking on its weakness to Fire.

Not only that, but even a fragile Pokemon is often less fragile than it seems if you can cut down on its weaknesses. Weavile can frequently survive neutral hits intact without need of a Focus Sash -it just has too many weaknesses you can pick on for it to matter in normal play. Being able to cover some of its weaknesses might lead to Weavile being able to run items other than Life Orb (Trying to survive by killing the enemy first) and Focus Sash.

A much better criticism of my post is that I completely ignored the mind-games angle -Ghost is such an obviously optimal type for Pokemon with a double Fighting weakness that most players are going to assume your Tyranitar is part-Ghost and make no attempt to Mach Punch it or whatever, to the point that you can effectively benefit from this immunity without actually giving your Tyranitar Ghost typing. Then you can give it some typing that either punishes what they're expecting to work (Dragon covers its weaknesses to Grass and Water, Flying covers its weakness to Ground and Grass while reducing the Fighting weakness, etc) or that focuses exclusively on providing STAB. (Ground for Earthquake?)

 

[Knuckstrike]

Baton passing seems to have gotten quite a boost. Previously a smeargle would get obliterated by everything not locked into a ghost-type move but now it can get one or two free immunities it can find time to switch in more easily. A normal/ghost type for example is immune to three types.
I wish I could bring ubers for STAB V-CREATE RAYQUAZA

 

[xJownage]

Baton passing seems to have gotten quite a boost. Previously a smeargle would get obliterated by everything not locked into a ghost-type move but now it can get one or two free immunities it can find time to switch in more easily. A normal/ghost type for example is immune to three types.
I wish I could bring ubers for STAB V-CREATE RAYQUAZA

Mega rayquaza will have an even bigger nuke

 

[Ghoul King]

Tried out Cryogonal: too fragile, and too limited of a movepool. Too bad, since it's the fastest Freeze Dryer. Trying out Articuno next.

Maybe Cryogonal will work for somebody else's team, but I have my doubts at this point. Sad.

 

[DinaIsha]

Ice types are in fact pretty useless here. The only reason they were used in the first place was for their STAB. Now that it has been given to everything, they have fallen out of favour. Best typing to add to Ice would probably be Steel or Ground.

 

[Scarf]

Uh, is this supposed to happen?
(Context: 3 Turns into the game, I set up Stealth Rock and whirlwind out his Gyarados into Talonflame, who took no prior damage)

Screenie

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Replay

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http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/hiddentype-169948492

 

[TSM ryan]

Uh, is this supposed to happen?
(Context: 3 Turns into the game, I set up Stealth Rock and whirlwind out his Gyarados into Talonflame, who took no prior damage)

Screenie

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Replay

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http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/hiddentype-169948492

i mean logically he should always live with a quarter of his health in case he's for some reason bug or ice as his third type, so no it shouldn't happen.

edit: or not? idk man, if that math makes sense to you, sure. i'm js fire did 25% damage from rocks, then the flying type made it 50%, so one would assume another weakness would make it 75%.

 

[Zewwok]

Actually, yes. By the looks of it that was bug type, which gives it an 8x weakness to stealth rock, which is 8 x 12.5%, or 100%. This previously was not coded, so it will only have started recently.

 

[DinaIsha]

Look like it was coded after all. I guess if GameFreak ever brings out Triple Types, this is how it would work.

i'm js fire did 25% damage from rocks, then the flying type made it 50%, so one would assume another weakness would make it 75%.

About the damage, a neutral SR damage would be 12.5%, a single weakness to SR takes 25% and a double weakness 50%. So it's only natural that a triple weakness should do 100% (1x, 2x, 4x and 8x in a simpler math).

If you ever find a way to increase a Pokemon's HP above 100%, let me know.

 

[Ghoul King]

A single weakness to Stealth Rock takes 25% damage. 12.5% is Stealth Rock's neutral damage.

Also Showdown's current behavior is probably an accurate reflection of how the games work, but not necessarily. There is not currently a three type combination that can occur in the actual games where it would be relevant -especially since there's nothing that causes a Pokemon to have three types on a switch-in anyway.

Ice types are in fact pretty useless here. The only reason they were used in the first place was for their STAB. Now that it has been given to everything, they have fallen out of favour. Best typing to add to Ice would probably be Steel or Ground.

Adding Steel to Ice gives you a double weakness to Fighting and Fire. Covering up Rock and Steel weaknesses is nice? (To be fair, I actually did add Steel to Cryogonal, because Flash Cannon was its best possible new STAB, resisting Rock is important to making Rapid Spin not a cruel joke, and the big motive was countering various Pokemon who don't have Fighting or Fire moves)

Re: Articuno. It's actually working pretty well thus far. Wish it was a little faster, but the two main threats I have it for are Gyarados (It actually outspeeds it before a Dragon Dance) and Gliscor. (The worst thing it can do is hit it with Toxic)

 

[Esprite]

Noivern is crying in a corner over this meta

 

[Red Cat]

Noivern is crying in a corner over this meta

I know, right? An Other Meta just doesn't seem right without Noivern being able to get STAB Boomburst. Too bad there is no HP Normal.

 

[DinaIsha]

Boomburst is still a good move. And Dragon\Flying\Steel is among the best of types to have.

 

[Klang]

Finally a tier other than Inverse that I can use Gogoat in!

Gogoat @ Leftovers
Ability: Sap Sipper
EVs: 68 HP / 252 Def / 188 SpD
Impish Nature
IVs: 30 SpD (Steel)
- Horn Leech
- Leech Seed
- Toxic
- Milk Drink

Possessing solid 123 / 62 / 81 bulk, leech seed, and reliable recovery, the only thing really keeping Gogoat back was the fact that its defensive typing was far from desirable. However, with an added steel typing, Gogoat becomes a solid mixed wall, and one of the few Steel/Grass types with reliable recovery other than Synthesis (Synthesis is bad since Tyranitar and Hippowdon are both popular). It is also one of the few things that can reliably counter Kyurem-B with STAB fusion bolt, a Pokemon that can rip apart the best of stall teams if unprepared for. The EV spread is kind of weird, but with Gogoat's very high HP stat dropping most of the defensive investment in defensive stats is ideal. It's kind of random though, so some optimization could be done.

Finally, Gogoat is badass. That is more than enough reason to use it.

 

[OLD GREGG (im back baby)]

I've been having a lot of fun with HP steel Gourgeist. Has a really strong physically defensive presence with leech seed, will-o-wisp, and priority shadow sneak.

 

[GiveUsYourBones]

I wonder if Trick-or-Treat and/or Forest's Curse is viable in this meta just to screw up some strategies. I'm guessing it wouldn't be worth the moveslot, but has anyone tried it yet?

 

[11pikabro]

Never really thought the type change would be outstanding, but Electric Mega Gardevoir has been a superb member of my team. Instead of opting for a defensive typing like Steel, I thought that Gardevoir should get a type it could use to complement its wallbreaking traits.

It has been luring in all the Steel types who have opted for Flying typing, causing them to be OHKO'd by STAB Thunderbolt rather than saved from a Focus Blast. The Electric typing itself has also been helpful in surprising Flying spam users and preventing the Speed-decreasing Paralysis status. Add these traits to an already impressive wallbreaker to get one incredible Hidden Type threat.

Electric Gardevoir does still get checked easily by Gengar, fast Ground-type users like Sand Rush Excadrill, and bulky Grass-Steel types like that Gogoat Kl4ng posted, but finding the right partners to check these threats wasn't much of a hassle for me.

 

[Ghoul King]

So hey I'm first on the ladder and not budging from that position. Here's my team.

Team O' Doom

Dressin' (Gardevoir) (F) @ Gardevoirite
Ability: Trace
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 30 SpA (Added type: Electric)
- Hyper Voice
- Shadow Ball
- Thunderbolt
- Will-O-Wisp

Will O Wisp is Dressin's "safe" move -it surprises me how often absolutely everything on the enemy team is going to be unhappy with a Burn. It's also there for Shedinja, particularly in conjunction with Shadow Ball -Shedinja can protect itself from one or the other, but the closest it get to protecting against both is Lum Berry+Dark typing or Focus Sash+Fire typing, which I've yet to see either of. Dressin' herself is used fairly sparingly -she can't heal, she's not immune to Toxic, Burn, Sandstorm, or Hail (I haven't seen Hail yet), she doesn't resist Stealth Rock nor is she immune to Spikes, and I don't have anybody to pass Wishes to her, so I have to have a very good reason to switch her in. One trick I have picked up is that I realized Mega Gardevoir doesn't increase Defense any over regular Gardevoir -so against Physical threats I will often hold off on Mega Evolution if there's any possibility of getting use out of Trace later in the match. (Tracing Regenerator and switch-healing her, tracing Wonder Guard and sweeping the entire enemy team because they can't touch her, tracing Intimidate on a switch-in to more safely switch in on the Intimidator, etc)

It's nearly impossible to wall Dressin', barring Eviolite Chansey. Steel/Grass comes close, but barring the odd Grass Heatran that frequently means it's a Physical attacker I drop a Will O Wisp on, and the double Fire weakness can be exploited by multiple team members. There's probably other combinations that would be reasonably effective, using Electric immunity Abilities for instance, but I've yet to see them.

The Electric typing is fantastic, and ensures that Dressin' can reliably counter Flying Heatran (Which most Heatran are), providing Steel resistance (Without providing Fire vulnerability like Steel would), and similarly actually allows Dressin' to revenge-kill Talonflame -usually Talonflame Brave Birds into Dressin', expecting a OHKO, removes 50% of her health, and then the Thunderbolt is a OHKO. (Calcing it, they must all be Banded Talonflames, otherwise it would be noticeably less) Flare Blitz with a Band will usually OHKO Dressin' (Always, if she's lost anything to Stealth Rock/Spikes/Sandstorm/previous attackers), but so far that's only happened once. Similarly, a Ground Talonflame would probably handily kill Dressin', being immune to Thunderbolt, which I would only discover after losing half her health -but every Talonflame I've encountered has been Steel, which incidentally has allowed me to Flamethrower them to death with Pinky with surprising frequency. In general, Dressin' has excellent offense and especially often throws people -everyone expects their Steel-typed Pokemon, or Fire/Psychic, or similar, to wall Dressin' just fine, and then Thunderbolt rips off most or all of their health while they thought they were safe setting up.

Dressin's biggest flaw is probably that I don't have her speed-specced. This has cost me against Gliscor that I would'ved OHKOed with Hyper Voice but they Earthquaked me before I moved, against Speed-specced Dragonite, and other things like that. On the other hand, her combination of bulk and offense has saved the day so many times I can't bring myself to change it.

Sometimes I wonder if Steel typing would be better, mostly when Sandstorm and Toxic are being thrown around, but then I remember it would compromise her ability to counter Flying Heatran (Or non-Flying Heatran, for that matter), and in general dramatically reduce her offensive pressure, and I'm OK with my decision.

Rage (Gyarados) (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 30 SpA / 30 SpD (Added type: Ground)
- Waterfall
- Earthquake
- Ice Fang
- Dragon Dance

It surprises me how often people still try to hit Rage with an Electric move, blithely expecting to rip her up. I'm not sure if people just aren't giving any thought to what Gyarados would want, or if they're assuming she's a Mega Gyarados (For whom Ground would actually be pretty sub-optimal), but either way, free turns for me. Rage is a weird utility Pokemon for the team -she's not got the kind of offensive pressure other team members have, she doesn't produce the runaway-train effect that Punkette and Meany Face can pull off, and yet she remains a consistently useful member of the team because she can switch in on expecting Electric moves (Most notably Volt Switches) without fear, switch in on Earthquakes without fear, and in general shrug off most attacks, but especially Physical attacks because of her Intimidate. I've sometimes wondered if Moxie would be a worthwhile trade over Intimidate, but I switch her out so often I'm not convinced it would be that helpful. She's also, amusingly enough, one of my fastest team members, and often ends up troubleshooting things that can outspeed most of my team, such as Landorus-Therian.

The big appeal of adding Ground is of course covering Gyarados' double Electric weakness, but it also removes Rock/Stealth Rock weakness and adds STAB to Earthquake, which I'd want to run anyway. The added weaknesses to Ice and Grass don't crop up very often -and Rage is generally best off switching out on problematic Grass types anyway, if she can't OHKO them with Ice Fang- and I've only once seen someone other than myself running Freeze Dry, or indeed a Pokemon that can learn Freeze Dry at all!

The EVs are generic. Go fast, kill things hard, have teeny bit extra durability.

Punkette (Scrafty) (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Moxie
EVs: 60 HP / 252 Atk / 196 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 30 Def / 30 SpA / 30 SpD (Added type: Poison)
- Drain Punch
- Knock Off
- Poison Jab
- Dragon Dance

Knock Off, Knock Off, Knock Off.

It's not the only thing Punkette does, but it's by far the most common thing for her to do. Tyranitar? Assume it's Ghost, Knock Off. Bisharp? Assume it's Ghost, Knock Off. Ferrothorn? Knock Off to get rid of its Rocky Helmet/Leftovers, and if it wasn't Super Effective, then I Drain Punch it. (If it was, I Knock Off it again) Really, basically anything that isn't probably a Mega (And even some of those, like Tyranitar) gets hit with Knock Off -in part because if the enemy switches, it basically doesn't matter what switches in, it's probably unhappy being hit with Knock Off. Using Punkette has convinced me that Ghost is not the best thing to add to Eviolite Chansey -it already doesn't want to be hit with Knock Off, and now you're making its one weakness Knock Off? Even if it survives the first hit, it's probably not going to survive a second.

Punkette is also a catchall troubleshooter. She's immune to Toxic, resists Grass and Poison (She's been crucial in overcoming Mega Venusaur), and if she can pull off a couple of Dragon Dances can frequently Moxie her way to a clean sweep of the entire enemy team. Just the threat of this possibility alone can force the enemy to switch, either allowing a free Knock Off on the switch-in (Breaking Dragonite's Multiscale, for instance) or giving Punkette a turn to Dragon Dance, potentially leading to this uncontrolled sweep. As such, even though I often find myself wondering whether I should have Intimidate, to make it safer for her to switch in on enemies, or Shed Skin, so she can shrug off Burns, I have never actually moved away from Moxie -its threat provides so much of her offensive pressure and sorely punishes a variety of mistakes the enemy might make.

Only two things, thus far, have proven to be a major problem for her. Ghost Mega Tyranitar, and Talonflame of any kind. Ghost Mega Tyranitar just laughs off everything Punkette does, and if I switch it's going to Dragon Dance, and my team really struggles to deal with Dragon Danced Tyranitar, so that's cost me matches. Talonflame on the other hand will OHKO Punkette, no questions asked, no amount of Dragon Dances will save you now. Fortunately it has to revenge switch in most of the time -it cannot take Knock Off after a boost or two, and won't be happy taking even an unboosted Knock Off. Even then, I just switch out, crying a little inside at sacrificing that +2-4 on Attack and +1-2 on Speed.

Poison is a fantastic added typing for Scrafty, reducing the Fairy weakness to a manageable level, removing the Fighting weakness that often gets Scrafty OHKOed by Close Combats, High Jump Kicks, or even just Drain Punches delivered by hard-hitting foes, while throwing in immunity to Toxic and providing surprisingly useful Poison, Bug (U-Turn), and Grass resistances. This has saved me a surprising number of times, and Fire is the only thing I consider anywhere near a contender, due to it providing immunity to Burn -and even then, Poison only adds one weakness, where Fire adds two and announces itself when switching in on Stealth Rock.

The EVs are because I need 201 Speed to outspeed most threats after one Dragon Dance, and anything more that I need more to outspeed is probably not within EV reach, while otherwise I want some bulk on Punkette, in part to sustain Moxie rampages.

Meany Face (Dragonite) (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Multiscale
EVs: 56 HP / 252 Atk / 200 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 30 SpD (Added type: Steel)
- Iron Head
- Dragon Claw
- Roost
- Dragon Dance

If the enemy lacks Heatran, Meany Face can often set up on something and kill the entire team without much issue. There are other things, like Prankster Sableye with Will O Wisp, that can mess it up, but Heatran is the only thing I've seen people actually pack. Skarmory is also something of a check, assuming it's packing Whirlwind. Otherwise it's just more time to set up. Meany Face is, amusingly, my primary counter to enemy Fairies, is a check to enemy Dragons, and in general frequently subs in to deal with something no team member is specifically competent against. The fact that it's walled by any random Steel type (So long as they aren't part Fairy, Dragon, Rock, or Ice) isn't really a big deal -it has to be something like Heatran (Burning Meany Face), Skarmory (Whirlwinds me out), or something else that can cripple Meany Face or remove her stat boosts. Otherwise she just Dragon Dances until she can outspeed their healing, or she's maxed, or whatever I feel is the minimum needed to outspeed something crucial on the enemy team, such as Kyurem-Black that's probably Scarfed, and then goes on to KO whatever is supposed to wall her.

Seriously, Meany Face frequently sweeps entire enemy teams, basically by herself.

Not much else to say about her -she's only got one weakness, she's got STAB on Iron Head, she can set up and kill way more things than she "should" be able to. I've seen a number of different Dragonite builds from other people, but none of them seems to match Meany Face's performance.

I honestly don't remember if the EVs are what Showdown shoved on me or if I made a deliberate effort to tweak them. Regardless, they work for much the same reason as Punkette's EVs work -the bulk is nice, and while I need Speed I don't need that much after a Dragon Dance -which Meany Face will pretty much always get a chance to do if I'm switching her in, barring Stealth Rocks breaking her Multiscale while up against a noticeably boosted opponent.

Pinky (Clefable) (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 30 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 Spe (Added type: Fire)
- Moonblast
- Flamethrower
- Calm Mind
- Moonlight

Everybody assumes it's Steel typed. Nope, Fire, for Flamethrower STAB. It still covers up the Steel weakness, and the untouched Poison weakness doesn't crop up too much, since many Pokemon can't (Or won't) run Poison as coverage and not many Poison Pokemon have shown up in this meta. Plus people frequently assume it's Steel (Or at least are too afraid of the consequences of being wrong) and thus don't hit Pinky with Poison moves. Phantom typing benefits!

Pinky himself frequently destroys Steel-typed foes, whether they are just unsuspecting Skarmories (Who aren't running Dragon typing), Steel Landoruses, or whoever, or are actual offensive Steel threats expecting to freely switch in and destroy him. He's also got a weird relationship with Heatran: he has essentially zero ability to hurt Heatran, but most Heatran aren't any better against him. If it weren't for the fact that so many Heatran are running Roar (Or occasionally Earth Power, but my opponents often refuse to use it on Pink, for reasons that mystify me), things would be firmly in Pinky's favor, since he could just Calm Mind up (With the occasional Moonlight) until either Heatran switched or it was time to melt it with Moon Blast. As is Pinky still frequently gets Heatran's Special Attack down, paving the way for someone else (Dressin') to deal with it in relative safety.

Pinky is also a fantastic check to most Dragonite. If they aren't running Steel, Moon Blast is horrible news for them. If they are running Steel, I can Flamethrower and possibly Burn them in the deal. In any event he's neutral to Iron Head and immune to Dragon, so barring the occasional Flinch, Pinky will usually take apart Dragonite, because it almost always Dragon Dances/Hone Claws (Multiscale broken by testing Flamethrower) and then Iron Heads (Dragonite finished off with either a second Flamethrower or a Moon Blast, depending on how effective Flamethrower was) with Pinky still having about 30% health remaining.

Pinky is also a huge frustration to a variety of opponents that expect to be able to Toxic him out of the way. Most people assume Pinky is Unaware -and sometimes switch out when they have substantial set-up and basically have the match in the bag! It surprises me, actually, how often my opponent overlooks the fact that Pinky switched in on Stealth Rocks without taking damage and then tries tossing Toxic on him anyway.

The funny thing is, Pinky is a huge bag of weaknesses -Poison, Rock, Ground, and Water all, none of which are good to be weak to. Nonetheless, Pinky often survives for a surprisingly long period of time, probably partly because my opponents never seem to guess that Pinky is part Fire -luck into killing him easily because they're using Earthquake anyway? Absolutely. Assume he's Steel and Earthquake him? Yep. Actually guess he's Fire, even after being melted by a Flamethrower? Not that I've noticed.

I've found the Fire typing fantastic, though really Pinky is one of the low-performance members of the team. He'd probably be the first to go if I found the team started struggling consistently.


Devastator (Slowbro) (M) @ Assault Vest
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
Modest Nature
IVs: 30 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 Spe (Added type: Fire)
- Scald
- Psyshock
- Flamethrower
- Ice Beam

My latest team member, replacing Hitmontop (Steel), who replaced Articuno (Ground), who replaced Cryogonal (Steel), who replaced Crawdaunt. (Fighting)

Devastator is an experiment, and one that's working fairly well thus far, for all that he means that 2/3rds of my team is weak to Ground, instead of just half. Thus far he's proven fairly solid, which I hadn't really expected, in all honesty, though I may yet to decide to return to Fighting Crawdaunt for the priority and sheer stopping power. (Crawdaunt was an amazing lead and made a huge difference in my ability to deal with Tyranitar, particularly Mega Tyranitar, which Devastator doesn't help against at all. On the other hand, when I was running Crawdaunt my team was painfully vulnerable to Will O Wisp) In any event nobody ever seems to expect Flamethrower out of Slowbro, presumably because it's a Water type and they're just assuming it can't get Fire moves.

I still don't have a clear sense as to whether Devastator is adding much to the team or not. Some of his utilities overlap with other team members and/or make me remember how awesome Crawdaunt was, such as his ability to take on Flying Heatran just fine, which is both. I haven't used him enough to say how well he works. The idea was he could be used to soak hits and make my team less vulnerable to being chipped away -but I haven't actually gotten that use out of him. Maybe I just haven't fought the right kind of team for him to shine.

The added Fire typing covers the Grass and Bug weaknesses, but in exchange adds Ground and Rock weaknesses. I dunno, there's no really amazing type to add to Water/Psychic, and just the fact that people never anticipate it is huge. Unfortunately, my team is very Ground weak, and Devastator just makes things worse. Again, I may yet revert to Crawdaunt. Alternatively I could swap Fire typing for Grass or Bug typing, which would actually resist Ground, cover up the Grass weakness, and cover up the Electric weakness in the case of Grass. (Though making the Bug weakness horrendous)

So that's the team.

Most every member of my team has defensive utility from its typing, but also offensive utility. I didn't really think anything of this when I was doing it. It was only when I hit the top of the ladder and was startled by my own success that it occurred to me to compare my teams against enemy teams -at which point I noticed that this aspect of my team is atypical. Most teams I've fought have between 0-3 members of the team deriving an offensive benefit from their typing, with 0 actually being the most common number. I crush most enemy teams by such a large margin -when my team-building skills are mediocre and my prediction skills inferior to high-tier players in every other meta I've played- that I am convinced this is the key difference that has allowed me to take -and hold- first on the ladder.

It's why I'm making this post now, rather than waiting until the end of the month to do a retrospective, because I honestly want the meta to have the chance to fully develop before it's gone.

 

[Red Cat]

So hey I'm first on the ladder and not budging from that position. Here's my team.

Team O' Doom

Dressin' (Gardevoir) (F) @ Gardevoirite
Ability: Trace
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 30 SpA (Added type: Electric)
- Hyper Voice
- Shadow Ball
- Thunderbolt
- Will-O-Wisp

Will O Wisp is Dressin's "safe" move -it surprises me how often absolutely everything on the enemy team is going to be unhappy with a Burn. It's also there for Shedinja, particularly in conjunction with Shadow Ball -Shedinja can protect itself from one or the other, but the closest it get to protecting against both is Lum Berry+Dark typing or Focus Sash+Fire typing, which I've yet to see either of. Dressin' herself is used fairly sparingly -she can't heal, she's not immune to Toxic, Burn, Sandstorm, or Hail (I haven't seen Hail yet), she doesn't resist Stealth Rock nor is she immune to Spikes, and I don't have anybody to pass Wishes to her, so I have to have a very good reason to switch her in. One trick I have picked up is that I realized Mega Gardevoir doesn't increase Defense any over regular Gardevoir -so against Physical threats I will often hold off on Mega Evolution if there's any possibility of getting use out of Trace later in the match. (Tracing Regenerator and switch-healing her, tracing Wonder Guard and sweeping the entire enemy team because they can't touch her, tracing Intimidate on a switch-in to more safely switch in on the Intimidator, etc)

It's nearly impossible to wall Dressin', barring Eviolite Chansey. Steel/Grass comes close, but barring the odd Grass Heatran that frequently means it's a Physical attacker I drop a Will O Wisp on, and the double Fire weakness can be exploited by multiple team members. There's probably other combinations that would be reasonably effective, using Electric immunity Abilities for instance, but I've yet to see them.

The Electric typing is fantastic, and ensures that Dressin' can reliably counter Flying Heatran (Which most Heatran are), providing Steel resistance (Without providing Fire vulnerability like Steel would), and similarly actually allows Dressin' to revenge-kill Talonflame -usually Talonflame Brave Birds into Dressin', expecting a OHKO, removes 50% of her health, and then the Thunderbolt is a OHKO. (Calcing it, they must all be Banded Talonflames, otherwise it would be noticeably less) Flare Blitz with a Band will usually OHKO Dressin' (Always, if she's lost anything to Stealth Rock/Spikes/Sandstorm/previous attackers), but so far that's only happened once. Similarly, a Ground Talonflame would probably handily kill Dressin', being immune to Thunderbolt, which I would only discover after losing half her health -but every Talonflame I've encountered has been Steel, which incidentally has allowed me to Flamethrower them to death with Pinky with surprising frequency. In general, Dressin' has excellent offense and especially often throws people -everyone expects their Steel-typed Pokemon, or Fire/Psychic, or similar, to wall Dressin' just fine, and then Thunderbolt rips off most or all of their health while they thought they were safe setting up.

Dressin's biggest flaw is probably that I don't have her speed-specced. This has cost me against Gliscor that I would'ved OHKOed with Hyper Voice but they Earthquaked me before I moved, against Speed-specced Dragonite, and other things like that. On the other hand, her combination of bulk and offense has saved the day so many times I can't bring myself to change it.

Sometimes I wonder if Steel typing would be better, mostly when Sandstorm and Toxic are being thrown around, but then I remember it would compromise her ability to counter Flying Heatran (Or non-Flying Heatran, for that matter), and in general dramatically reduce her offensive pressure, and I'm OK with my decision.

Rage (Gyarados) (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 30 SpA / 30 SpD (Added type: Ground)
- Waterfall
- Earthquake
- Ice Fang
- Dragon Dance

It surprises me how often people still try to hit Rage with an Electric move, blithely expecting to rip her up. I'm not sure if people just aren't giving any thought to what Gyarados would want, or if they're assuming she's a Mega Gyarados (For whom Ground would actually be pretty sub-optimal), but either way, free turns for me. Rage is a weird utility Pokemon for the team -she's not got the kind of offensive pressure other team members have, she doesn't produce the runaway-train effect that Punkette and Meany Face can pull off, and yet she remains a consistently useful member of the team because she can switch in on expecting Electric moves (Most notably Volt Switches) without fear, switch in on Earthquakes without fear, and in general shrug off most attacks, but especially Physical attacks because of her Intimidate. I've sometimes wondered if Moxie would be a worthwhile trade over Intimidate, but I switch her out so often I'm not convinced it would be that helpful. She's also, amusingly enough, one of my fastest team members, and often ends up troubleshooting things that can outspeed most of my team, such as Landorus-Therian.

The big appeal of adding Ground is of course covering Gyarados' double Electric weakness, but it also removes Rock/Stealth Rock weakness and adds STAB to Earthquake, which I'd want to run anyway. The added weaknesses to Ice and Grass don't crop up very often -and Rage is generally best off switching out on problematic Grass types anyway, if she can't OHKO them with Ice Fang- and I've only once seen someone other than myself running Freeze Dry, or indeed a Pokemon that can learn Freeze Dry at all!

The EVs are generic. Go fast, kill things hard, have teeny bit extra durability.

Punkette (Scrafty) (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Moxie
EVs: 60 HP / 252 Atk / 196 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 30 Def / 30 SpA / 30 SpD (Added type: Poison)
- Drain Punch
- Knock Off
- Poison Jab
- Dragon Dance

Knock Off, Knock Off, Knock Off.

It's not the only thing Punkette does, but it's by far the most common thing for her to do. Tyranitar? Assume it's Ghost, Knock Off. Bisharp? Assume it's Ghost, Knock Off. Ferrothorn? Knock Off to get rid of its Rocky Helmet/Leftovers, and if it wasn't Super Effective, then I Drain Punch it. (If it was, I Knock Off it again) Really, basically anything that isn't probably a Mega (And even some of those, like Tyranitar) gets hit with Knock Off -in part because if the enemy switches, it basically doesn't matter what switches in, it's probably unhappy being hit with Knock Off. Using Punkette has convinced me that Ghost is not the best thing to add to Eviolite Chansey -it already doesn't want to be hit with Knock Off, and now you're making its one weakness Knock Off? Even if it survives the first hit, it's probably not going to survive a second.

Punkette is also a catchall troubleshooter. She's immune to Toxic, resists Grass and Poison (She's been crucial in overcoming Mega Venusaur), and if she can pull off a couple of Dragon Dances can frequently Moxie her way to a clean sweep of the entire enemy team. Just the threat of this possibility alone can force the enemy to switch, either allowing a free Knock Off on the switch-in (Breaking Dragonite's Multiscale, for instance) or giving Punkette a turn to Dragon Dance, potentially leading to this uncontrolled sweep. As such, even though I often find myself wondering whether I should have Intimidate, to make it safer for her to switch in on enemies, or Shed Skin, so she can shrug off Burns, I have never actually moved away from Moxie -its threat provides so much of her offensive pressure and sorely punishes a variety of mistakes the enemy might make.

Only two things, thus far, have proven to be a major problem for her. Ghost Mega Tyranitar, and Talonflame of any kind. Ghost Mega Tyranitar just laughs off everything Punkette does, and if I switch it's going to Dragon Dance, and my team really struggles to deal with Dragon Danced Tyranitar, so that's cost me matches. Talonflame on the other hand will OHKO Punkette, no questions asked, no amount of Dragon Dances will save you now. Fortunately it has to revenge switch in most of the time -it cannot take Knock Off after a boost or two, and won't be happy taking even an unboosted Knock Off. Even then, I just switch out, crying a little inside at sacrificing that +2-4 on Attack and +1-2 on Speed.

Poison is a fantastic added typing for Scrafty, reducing the Fairy weakness to a manageable level, removing the Fighting weakness that often gets Scrafty OHKOed by Close Combats, High Jump Kicks, or even just Drain Punches delivered by hard-hitting foes, while throwing in immunity to Toxic and providing surprisingly useful Poison, Bug (U-Turn), and Grass resistances. This has saved me a surprising number of times, and Fire is the only thing I consider anywhere near a contender, due to it providing immunity to Burn -and even then, Poison only adds one weakness, where Fire adds two and announces itself when switching in on Stealth Rock.

The EVs are because I need 201 Speed to outspeed most threats after one Dragon Dance, and anything more that I need more to outspeed is probably not within EV reach, while otherwise I want some bulk on Punkette, in part to sustain Moxie rampages.

Meany Face (Dragonite) (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Multiscale
EVs: 56 HP / 252 Atk / 200 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 30 SpD (Added type: Steel)
- Iron Head
- Dragon Claw
- Roost
- Dragon Dance

If the enemy lacks Heatran, Meany Face can often set up on something and kill the entire team without much issue. There are other things, like Prankster Sableye with Will O Wisp, that can mess it up, but Heatran is the only thing I've seen people actually pack. Skarmory is also something of a check, assuming it's packing Whirlwind. Otherwise it's just more time to set up. Meany Face is, amusingly, my primary counter to enemy Fairies, is a check to enemy Dragons, and in general frequently subs in to deal with something no team member is specifically competent against. The fact that it's walled by any random Steel type (So long as they aren't part Fairy, Dragon, Rock, or Ice) isn't really a big deal -it has to be something like Heatran (Burning Meany Face), Skarmory (Whirlwinds me out), or something else that can cripple Meany Face or remove her stat boosts. Otherwise she just Dragon Dances until she can outspeed their healing, or she's maxed, or whatever I feel is the minimum needed to outspeed something crucial on the enemy team, such as Kyurem-Black that's probably Scarfed, and then goes on to KO whatever is supposed to wall her.

Seriously, Meany Face frequently sweeps entire enemy teams, basically by herself.

Not much else to say about her -she's only got one weakness, she's got STAB on Iron Head, she can set up and kill way more things than she "should" be able to. I've seen a number of different Dragonite builds from other people, but none of them seems to match Meany Face's performance.

I honestly don't remember if the EVs are what Showdown shoved on me or if I made a deliberate effort to tweak them. Regardless, they work for much the same reason as Punkette's EVs work -the bulk is nice, and while I need Speed I don't need that much after a Dragon Dance -which Meany Face will pretty much always get a chance to do if I'm switching her in, barring Stealth Rocks breaking her Multiscale while up against a noticeably boosted opponent.

Pinky (Clefable) (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 30 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 Spe (Added type: Fire)
- Moonblast
- Flamethrower
- Calm Mind
- Moonlight

Everybody assumes it's Steel typed. Nope, Fire, for Flamethrower STAB. It still covers up the Steel weakness, and the untouched Poison weakness doesn't crop up too much, since many Pokemon can't (Or won't) run Poison as coverage and not many Poison Pokemon have shown up in this meta. Plus people frequently assume it's Steel (Or at least are too afraid of the consequences of being wrong) and thus don't hit Pinky with Poison moves. Phantom typing benefits!

Pinky himself frequently destroys Steel-typed foes, whether they are just unsuspecting Skarmories (Who aren't running Dragon typing), Steel Landoruses, or whoever, or are actual offensive Steel threats expecting to freely switch in and destroy him. He's also got a weird relationship with Heatran: he has essentially zero ability to hurt Heatran, but most Heatran aren't any better against him. If it weren't for the fact that so many Heatran are running Roar (Or occasionally Earth Power, but my opponents often refuse to use it on Pink, for reasons that mystify me), things would be firmly in Pinky's favor, since he could just Calm Mind up (With the occasional Moonlight) until either Heatran switched or it was time to melt it with Moon Blast. As is Pinky still frequently gets Heatran's Special Attack down, paving the way for someone else (Dressin') to deal with it in relative safety.

Pinky is also a fantastic check to most Dragonite. If they aren't running Steel, Moon Blast is horrible news for them. If they are running Steel, I can Flamethrower and possibly Burn them in the deal. In any event he's neutral to Iron Head and immune to Dragon, so barring the occasional Flinch, Pinky will usually take apart Dragonite, because it almost always Dragon Dances/Hone Claws (Multiscale broken by testing Flamethrower) and then Iron Heads (Dragonite finished off with either a second Flamethrower or a Moon Blast, depending on how effective Flamethrower was) with Pinky still having about 30% health remaining.

Pinky is also a huge frustration to a variety of opponents that expect to be able to Toxic him out of the way. Most people assume Pinky is Unaware -and sometimes switch out when they have substantial set-up and basically have the match in the bag! It surprises me, actually, how often my opponent overlooks the fact that Pinky switched in on Stealth Rocks without taking damage and then tries tossing Toxic on him anyway.

The funny thing is, Pinky is a huge bag of weaknesses -Poison, Rock, Ground, and Water all, none of which are good to be weak to. Nonetheless, Pinky often survives for a surprisingly long period of time, probably partly because my opponents never seem to guess that Pinky is part Fire -luck into killing him easily because they're using Earthquake anyway? Absolutely. Assume he's Steel and Earthquake him? Yep. Actually guess he's Fire, even after being melted by a Flamethrower? Not that I've noticed.

I've found the Fire typing fantastic, though really Pinky is one of the low-performance members of the team. He'd probably be the first to go if I found the team started struggling consistently.


Devastator (Slowbro) (M) @ Assault Vest
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
Modest Nature
IVs: 30 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 Spe (Added type: Fire)
- Scald
- Psyshock
- Flamethrower
- Ice Beam

My latest team member, replacing Hitmontop (Steel), who replaced Articuno (Ground), who replaced Cryogonal (Steel), who replaced Crawdaunt. (Fighting)

Devastator is an experiment, and one that's working fairly well thus far, for all that he means that 2/3rds of my team is weak to Ground, instead of just half. Thus far he's proven fairly solid, which I hadn't really expected, in all honesty, though I may yet to decide to return to Fighting Crawdaunt for the priority and sheer stopping power. (Crawdaunt was an amazing lead and made a huge difference in my ability to deal with Tyranitar, particularly Mega Tyranitar, which Devastator doesn't help against at all. On the other hand, when I was running Crawdaunt my team was painfully vulnerable to Will O Wisp) In any event nobody ever seems to expect Flamethrower out of Slowbro, presumably because it's a Water type and they're just assuming it can't get Fire moves.

I still don't have a clear sense as to whether Devastator is adding much to the team or not. Some of his utilities overlap with other team members and/or make me remember how awesome Crawdaunt was, such as his ability to take on Flying Heatran just fine, which is both. I haven't used him enough to say how well he works. The idea was he could be used to soak hits and make my team less vulnerable to being chipped away -but I haven't actually gotten that use out of him. Maybe I just haven't fought the right kind of team for him to shine.

The added Fire typing covers the Grass and Bug weaknesses, but in exchange adds Ground and Rock weaknesses. I dunno, there's no really amazing type to add to Water/Psychic, and just the fact that people never anticipate it is huge. Unfortunately, my team is very Ground weak, and Devastator just makes things worse. Again, I may yet revert to Crawdaunt. Alternatively I could swap Fire typing for Grass or Bug typing, which would actually resist Ground, cover up the Grass weakness, and cover up the Electric weakness in the case of Grass. (Though making the Bug weakness horrendous)

So that's the team.

Most every member of my team has defensive utility from its typing, but also offensive utility. I didn't really think anything of this when I was doing it. It was only when I hit the top of the ladder and was startled by my own success that it occurred to me to compare my teams against enemy teams -at which point I noticed that this aspect of my team is atypical. Most teams I've fought have between 0-3 members of the team deriving an offensive benefit from their typing, with 0 actually being the most common number. I crush most enemy teams by such a large margin -when my team-building skills are mediocre and my prediction skills inferior to high-tier players in every other meta I've played- that I am convinced this is the key difference that has allowed me to take -and hold- first on the ladder.

It's why I'm making this post now, rather than waiting until the end of the month to do a retrospective, because I honestly want the meta to have the chance to fully develop before it's gone.

Honestly, the teambuilding and battling skills of most players on the ladder are so bad that it isn't that difficult to get really high on the ladder if you are a competent player and play enough battles. Your team looks pretty good though. I'm not sure why you have Shadow Ball on Gardevoir since Hyper Voice and Thunderbolt have really good coverage already. Taunt might be a better option to make easier to break stall teams. I don't think Iron Head is a great option on Dragonite since any Steel type will resist both of its STABs, and Steel is obviously a common hidden type. I think you'd be better off using Earthquake even if you keep the Steel type on Dragonite. Change Moonlight to Softboiled on Clefable since you are using Magic Guard. I don't really like the Fire typing on Slowbro. Adding a SR weakness kind of defeats the purpose of Regenerator. Adding a Dark type to Slowbro might work because it gets rid of those Ghost and Dark weaknesses as well as giving Slowbro STAB Foul Play. The Bug and Fairy weaknesses suck though.

 

[OLD GREGG (im back baby)]

So hey I'm first on the ladder and not budging from that position. Here's my team.

Team O' Doom

Dressin' (Gardevoir) (F) @ Gardevoirite
Ability: Trace
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 30 SpA (Added type: Electric)
- Hyper Voice
- Shadow Ball
- Thunderbolt
- Will-O-Wisp

Will O Wisp is Dressin's "safe" move -it surprises me how often absolutely everything on the enemy team is going to be unhappy with a Burn. It's also there for Shedinja, particularly in conjunction with Shadow Ball -Shedinja can protect itself from one or the other, but the closest it get to protecting against both is Lum Berry+Dark typing or Focus Sash+Fire typing, which I've yet to see either of. Dressin' herself is used fairly sparingly -she can't heal, she's not immune to Toxic, Burn, Sandstorm, or Hail (I haven't seen Hail yet), she doesn't resist Stealth Rock nor is she immune to Spikes, and I don't have anybody to pass Wishes to her, so I have to have a very good reason to switch her in. One trick I have picked up is that I realized Mega Gardevoir doesn't increase Defense any over regular Gardevoir -so against Physical threats I will often hold off on Mega Evolution if there's any possibility of getting use out of Trace later in the match. (Tracing Regenerator and switch-healing her, tracing Wonder Guard and sweeping the entire enemy team because they can't touch her, tracing Intimidate on a switch-in to more safely switch in on the Intimidator, etc)

It's nearly impossible to wall Dressin', barring Eviolite Chansey. Steel/Grass comes close, but barring the odd Grass Heatran that frequently means it's a Physical attacker I drop a Will O Wisp on, and the double Fire weakness can be exploited by multiple team members. There's probably other combinations that would be reasonably effective, using Electric immunity Abilities for instance, but I've yet to see them.

The Electric typing is fantastic, and ensures that Dressin' can reliably counter Flying Heatran (Which most Heatran are), providing Steel resistance (Without providing Fire vulnerability like Steel would), and similarly actually allows Dressin' to revenge-kill Talonflame -usually Talonflame Brave Birds into Dressin', expecting a OHKO, removes 50% of her health, and then the Thunderbolt is a OHKO. (Calcing it, they must all be Banded Talonflames, otherwise it would be noticeably less) Flare Blitz with a Band will usually OHKO Dressin' (Always, if she's lost anything to Stealth Rock/Spikes/Sandstorm/previous attackers), but so far that's only happened once. Similarly, a Ground Talonflame would probably handily kill Dressin', being immune to Thunderbolt, which I would only discover after losing half her health -but every Talonflame I've encountered has been Steel, which incidentally has allowed me to Flamethrower them to death with Pinky with surprising frequency. In general, Dressin' has excellent offense and especially often throws people -everyone expects their Steel-typed Pokemon, or Fire/Psychic, or similar, to wall Dressin' just fine, and then Thunderbolt rips off most or all of their health while they thought they were safe setting up.

Dressin's biggest flaw is probably that I don't have her speed-specced. This has cost me against Gliscor that I would'ved OHKOed with Hyper Voice but they Earthquaked me before I moved, against Speed-specced Dragonite, and other things like that. On the other hand, her combination of bulk and offense has saved the day so many times I can't bring myself to change it.

Sometimes I wonder if Steel typing would be better, mostly when Sandstorm and Toxic are being thrown around, but then I remember it would compromise her ability to counter Flying Heatran (Or non-Flying Heatran, for that matter), and in general dramatically reduce her offensive pressure, and I'm OK with my decision.

Rage (Gyarados) (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 30 SpA / 30 SpD (Added type: Ground)
- Waterfall
- Earthquake
- Ice Fang
- Dragon Dance

It surprises me how often people still try to hit Rage with an Electric move, blithely expecting to rip her up. I'm not sure if people just aren't giving any thought to what Gyarados would want, or if they're assuming she's a Mega Gyarados (For whom Ground would actually be pretty sub-optimal), but either way, free turns for me. Rage is a weird utility Pokemon for the team -she's not got the kind of offensive pressure other team members have, she doesn't produce the runaway-train effect that Punkette and Meany Face can pull off, and yet she remains a consistently useful member of the team because she can switch in on expecting Electric moves (Most notably Volt Switches) without fear, switch in on Earthquakes without fear, and in general shrug off most attacks, but especially Physical attacks because of her Intimidate. I've sometimes wondered if Moxie would be a worthwhile trade over Intimidate, but I switch her out so often I'm not convinced it would be that helpful. She's also, amusingly enough, one of my fastest team members, and often ends up troubleshooting things that can outspeed most of my team, such as Landorus-Therian.

The big appeal of adding Ground is of course covering Gyarados' double Electric weakness, but it also removes Rock/Stealth Rock weakness and adds STAB to Earthquake, which I'd want to run anyway. The added weaknesses to Ice and Grass don't crop up very often -and Rage is generally best off switching out on problematic Grass types anyway, if she can't OHKO them with Ice Fang- and I've only once seen someone other than myself running Freeze Dry, or indeed a Pokemon that can learn Freeze Dry at all!

The EVs are generic. Go fast, kill things hard, have teeny bit extra durability.

Punkette (Scrafty) (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Moxie
EVs: 60 HP / 252 Atk / 196 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 30 Def / 30 SpA / 30 SpD (Added type: Poison)
- Drain Punch
- Knock Off
- Poison Jab
- Dragon Dance

Knock Off, Knock Off, Knock Off.

It's not the only thing Punkette does, but it's by far the most common thing for her to do. Tyranitar? Assume it's Ghost, Knock Off. Bisharp? Assume it's Ghost, Knock Off. Ferrothorn? Knock Off to get rid of its Rocky Helmet/Leftovers, and if it wasn't Super Effective, then I Drain Punch it. (If it was, I Knock Off it again) Really, basically anything that isn't probably a Mega (And even some of those, like Tyranitar) gets hit with Knock Off -in part because if the enemy switches, it basically doesn't matter what switches in, it's probably unhappy being hit with Knock Off. Using Punkette has convinced me that Ghost is not the best thing to add to Eviolite Chansey -it already doesn't want to be hit with Knock Off, and now you're making its one weakness Knock Off? Even if it survives the first hit, it's probably not going to survive a second.

Punkette is also a catchall troubleshooter. She's immune to Toxic, resists Grass and Poison (She's been crucial in overcoming Mega Venusaur), and if she can pull off a couple of Dragon Dances can frequently Moxie her way to a clean sweep of the entire enemy team. Just the threat of this possibility alone can force the enemy to switch, either allowing a free Knock Off on the switch-in (Breaking Dragonite's Multiscale, for instance) or giving Punkette a turn to Dragon Dance, potentially leading to this uncontrolled sweep. As such, even though I often find myself wondering whether I should have Intimidate, to make it safer for her to switch in on enemies, or Shed Skin, so she can shrug off Burns, I have never actually moved away from Moxie -its threat provides so much of her offensive pressure and sorely punishes a variety of mistakes the enemy might make.

Only two things, thus far, have proven to be a major problem for her. Ghost Mega Tyranitar, and Talonflame of any kind. Ghost Mega Tyranitar just laughs off everything Punkette does, and if I switch it's going to Dragon Dance, and my team really struggles to deal with Dragon Danced Tyranitar, so that's cost me matches. Talonflame on the other hand will OHKO Punkette, no questions asked, no amount of Dragon Dances will save you now. Fortunately it has to revenge switch in most of the time -it cannot take Knock Off after a boost or two, and won't be happy taking even an unboosted Knock Off. Even then, I just switch out, crying a little inside at sacrificing that +2-4 on Attack and +1-2 on Speed.

Poison is a fantastic added typing for Scrafty, reducing the Fairy weakness to a manageable level, removing the Fighting weakness that often gets Scrafty OHKOed by Close Combats, High Jump Kicks, or even just Drain Punches delivered by hard-hitting foes, while throwing in immunity to Toxic and providing surprisingly useful Poison, Bug (U-Turn), and Grass resistances. This has saved me a surprising number of times, and Fire is the only thing I consider anywhere near a contender, due to it providing immunity to Burn -and even then, Poison only adds one weakness, where Fire adds two and announces itself when switching in on Stealth Rock.

The EVs are because I need 201 Speed to outspeed most threats after one Dragon Dance, and anything more that I need more to outspeed is probably not within EV reach, while otherwise I want some bulk on Punkette, in part to sustain Moxie rampages.

Meany Face (Dragonite) (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Multiscale
EVs: 56 HP / 252 Atk / 200 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 30 SpD (Added type: Steel)
- Iron Head
- Dragon Claw
- Roost
- Dragon Dance

If the enemy lacks Heatran, Meany Face can often set up on something and kill the entire team without much issue. There are other things, like Prankster Sableye with Will O Wisp, that can mess it up, but Heatran is the only thing I've seen people actually pack. Skarmory is also something of a check, assuming it's packing Whirlwind. Otherwise it's just more time to set up. Meany Face is, amusingly, my primary counter to enemy Fairies, is a check to enemy Dragons, and in general frequently subs in to deal with something no team member is specifically competent against. The fact that it's walled by any random Steel type (So long as they aren't part Fairy, Dragon, Rock, or Ice) isn't really a big deal -it has to be something like Heatran (Burning Meany Face), Skarmory (Whirlwinds me out), or something else that can cripple Meany Face or remove her stat boosts. Otherwise she just Dragon Dances until she can outspeed their healing, or she's maxed, or whatever I feel is the minimum needed to outspeed something crucial on the enemy team, such as Kyurem-Black that's probably Scarfed, and then goes on to KO whatever is supposed to wall her.

Seriously, Meany Face frequently sweeps entire enemy teams, basically by herself.

Not much else to say about her -she's only got one weakness, she's got STAB on Iron Head, she can set up and kill way more things than she "should" be able to. I've seen a number of different Dragonite builds from other people, but none of them seems to match Meany Face's performance.

I honestly don't remember if the EVs are what Showdown shoved on me or if I made a deliberate effort to tweak them. Regardless, they work for much the same reason as Punkette's EVs work -the bulk is nice, and while I need Speed I don't need that much after a Dragon Dance -which Meany Face will pretty much always get a chance to do if I'm switching her in, barring Stealth Rocks breaking her Multiscale while up against a noticeably boosted opponent.

Pinky (Clefable) (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 30 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 Spe (Added type: Fire)
- Moonblast
- Flamethrower
- Calm Mind
- Moonlight

Everybody assumes it's Steel typed. Nope, Fire, for Flamethrower STAB. It still covers up the Steel weakness, and the untouched Poison weakness doesn't crop up too much, since many Pokemon can't (Or won't) run Poison as coverage and not many Poison Pokemon have shown up in this meta. Plus people frequently assume it's Steel (Or at least are too afraid of the consequences of being wrong) and thus don't hit Pinky with Poison moves. Phantom typing benefits!

Pinky himself frequently destroys Steel-typed foes, whether they are just unsuspecting Skarmories (Who aren't running Dragon typing), Steel Landoruses, or whoever, or are actual offensive Steel threats expecting to freely switch in and destroy him. He's also got a weird relationship with Heatran: he has essentially zero ability to hurt Heatran, but most Heatran aren't any better against him. If it weren't for the fact that so many Heatran are running Roar (Or occasionally Earth Power, but my opponents often refuse to use it on Pink, for reasons that mystify me), things would be firmly in Pinky's favor, since he could just Calm Mind up (With the occasional Moonlight) until either Heatran switched or it was time to melt it with Moon Blast. As is Pinky still frequently gets Heatran's Special Attack down, paving the way for someone else (Dressin') to deal with it in relative safety.

Pinky is also a fantastic check to most Dragonite. If they aren't running Steel, Moon Blast is horrible news for them. If they are running Steel, I can Flamethrower and possibly Burn them in the deal. In any event he's neutral to Iron Head and immune to Dragon, so barring the occasional Flinch, Pinky will usually take apart Dragonite, because it almost always Dragon Dances/Hone Claws (Multiscale broken by testing Flamethrower) and then Iron Heads (Dragonite finished off with either a second Flamethrower or a Moon Blast, depending on how effective Flamethrower was) with Pinky still having about 30% health remaining.

Pinky is also a huge frustration to a variety of opponents that expect to be able to Toxic him out of the way. Most people assume Pinky is Unaware -and sometimes switch out when they have substantial set-up and basically have the match in the bag! It surprises me, actually, how often my opponent overlooks the fact that Pinky switched in on Stealth Rocks without taking damage and then tries tossing Toxic on him anyway.

The funny thing is, Pinky is a huge bag of weaknesses -Poison, Rock, Ground, and Water all, none of which are good to be weak to. Nonetheless, Pinky often survives for a surprisingly long period of time, probably partly because my opponents never seem to guess that Pinky is part Fire -luck into killing him easily because they're using Earthquake anyway? Absolutely. Assume he's Steel and Earthquake him? Yep. Actually guess he's Fire, even after being melted by a Flamethrower? Not that I've noticed.

I've found the Fire typing fantastic, though really Pinky is one of the low-performance members of the team. He'd probably be the first to go if I found the team started struggling consistently.


Devastator (Slowbro) (M) @ Assault Vest
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
Modest Nature
IVs: 30 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 Spe (Added type: Fire)
- Scald
- Psyshock
- Flamethrower
- Ice Beam

My latest team member, replacing Hitmontop (Steel), who replaced Articuno (Ground), who replaced Cryogonal (Steel), who replaced Crawdaunt. (Fighting)

Devastator is an experiment, and one that's working fairly well thus far, for all that he means that 2/3rds of my team is weak to Ground, instead of just half. Thus far he's proven fairly solid, which I hadn't really expected, in all honesty, though I may yet to decide to return to Fighting Crawdaunt for the priority and sheer stopping power. (Crawdaunt was an amazing lead and made a huge difference in my ability to deal with Tyranitar, particularly Mega Tyranitar, which Devastator doesn't help against at all. On the other hand, when I was running Crawdaunt my team was painfully vulnerable to Will O Wisp) In any event nobody ever seems to expect Flamethrower out of Slowbro, presumably because it's a Water type and they're just assuming it can't get Fire moves.

I still don't have a clear sense as to whether Devastator is adding much to the team or not. Some of his utilities overlap with other team members and/or make me remember how awesome Crawdaunt was, such as his ability to take on Flying Heatran just fine, which is both. I haven't used him enough to say how well he works. The idea was he could be used to soak hits and make my team less vulnerable to being chipped away -but I haven't actually gotten that use out of him. Maybe I just haven't fought the right kind of team for him to shine.

The added Fire typing covers the Grass and Bug weaknesses, but in exchange adds Ground and Rock weaknesses. I dunno, there's no really amazing type to add to Water/Psychic, and just the fact that people never anticipate it is huge. Unfortunately, my team is very Ground weak, and Devastator just makes things worse. Again, I may yet revert to Crawdaunt. Alternatively I could swap Fire typing for Grass or Bug typing, which would actually resist Ground, cover up the Grass weakness, and cover up the Electric weakness in the case of Grass. (Though making the Bug weakness horrendous)

So that's the team.

Most every member of my team has defensive utility from its typing, but also offensive utility. I didn't really think anything of this when I was doing it. It was only when I hit the top of the ladder and was startled by my own success that it occurred to me to compare my teams against enemy teams -at which point I noticed that this aspect of my team is atypical. Most teams I've fought have between 0-3 members of the team deriving an offensive benefit from their typing, with 0 actually being the most common number. I crush most enemy teams by such a large margin -when my team-building skills are mediocre and my prediction skills inferior to high-tier players in every other meta I've played- that I am convinced this is the key difference that has allowed me to take -and hold- first on the ladder.

It's why I'm making this post now, rather than waiting until the end of the month to do a retrospective, because I honestly want the meta to have the chance to fully develop before it's gone.

Ive faced this team a couple of thimes and I give it two thumbs up. The Slowbro is an excellent addition and I think it should stay.

 

[Ghoul King]

Honestly, the teambuilding and battling skills of most players on the ladder are so bad that it isn't that difficult to get really high on the ladder if you are a competent player and play enough battles.

I had a particular opponent I kept beating who was quite competent and had a solid team -and who just could not beat me. I haven't named them because I didn't get permission from them to do so and I don't want to accidentally embarrass them or something, but it was my battles against them that caused me to realize something was going on.

Your team looks pretty good though.

Thanks!

I'm not sure why you have Shadow Ball on Gardevoir since Hyper Voice and Thunderbolt have really good coverage already. Taunt might be a better option to make easier to break stall teams.

What I'd like is a good move for letting her deal with Steel/Grass (Especially Flashfire Grass Heatran) and Steel/Ground types, but I don't think Gardevoir has such a move in its set. (Even if it has Focus Blast, I hate running it) As is Shadow Ball has helped me push neutral damage through on a number of targets, often on the switch-in, as well as menacing Ghosts that switch in -and Ghost is frequently run on Ferrothorn, surprisingly.

Even so, I might try out Taunt, just to utterly shut down Eviolite Chansey, which otherwise often forces me to switch.

I don't think Iron Head is a great option on Dragonite since any Steel type will resist both of its STABs, and Steel is obviously a common hidden type. I think you'd be better off using Earthquake even if you keep the Steel type on Dragonite.

Heatran is literally the only reason I'd run Earthquake over Iron Head, and 9 times out of ten, it's Flying Heatran. Everything else that runs Steel is either something I can and should switch out on, or just provides me an opportunity to keep driving my stats up and then push through the resistance.

Change Moonlight to Softboiled on Clefable since you are using Magic Guard.

I'll keep that in mind if rain becomes popular. (Or I guess Hail or Sand) For the moment it's repeatedly saved my bacon against Charizard Y (And a couple of time against Ninetales), because even if they're removing 60-70% of his health with Fire Blast, I'm healing all/most of it back because of the Sun. It's not like I can keep him in on Tyranitar anyway.

I don't really like the Fire typing on Slowbro. Adding a SR weakness kind of defeats the purpose of Regenerator. Adding a Dark type to Slowbro might work because it gets rid of those Ghost and Dark weaknesses as well as giving Slowbro STAB Foul Play. The Bug and Fairy weaknesses suck though.

STAB Foul Play intrigues me, but my team already at times struggles to KO specific Fairies -part of the reason so much of my team is weak to Ground is because I often find myself needing that much protection from Fairy, and everything that resists Fairy is weak to Ground. I'll keep it in mind.

 

[canno]

Heatran is literally the only reason I'd run Earthquake over Iron Head, and 9 times out of ten, it's Flying Heatran. Everything else that runs Steel is either something I can and should switch out on, or just provides me an opportunity to keep driving my stats up and then push through the resistance.

Electric Dragonite might be cool with Thunder Punch maybe? Electric on any flying-type has practically no downside (I guess in Gravity, and vs Smack Down and Thousand Arrows, but those are pretty rare especially the last one being unreleased ;P). It also provides a nifty Flying resist, paralysis immunity, and STAB on Thunder Punch to smack around some of the common sub Flying-types (I'm looking at you, Mr. Tran). I wish Thunder Punch was a bit stronger, but this is still a neat typing imo for it. Obviously Steel has it's advantages, but Electric might be worth a try.