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The niche that Haxorus has is that it has the ability to break through Unaware users, which only Gyarados can do. It's also faster than Gyarados and has a larger attack stat than most of the DDancers in the tier. I've used it and it truly is an underrated Pokemon. Mold Breaker is a fantastic ability for a DDcer. As you stated, Clone, Gyarados is a Mega. The competition for a Mega Slot just is THAT important right now. It also has Swords Dance, making it a deadly late game cleaner with a monstrous Attack stat. Also, unlike most DDancers, it's not weak to Stealth Rock. (Gyarados is weak before Mega Evolving, same with Altaria and Char, and Char stays weak to them, while Dragonite loses its ability entirely after them.) Haxorus is a Pokemon that has the capability to fill in for a Mega Pokemon if it doesn't fit your team. It really doesn't deserve to go Unranked right now.
Pardon how messy this post was.
Any thoughts on Dragalge for B-? Specs hits ridiculously hard and the bulky set checks some pretty big threats, LO Gengar being a big one along with Keldeo, Raikou etc. TSpikes are really annoying for almost every team without Tentacruel to deal with and puts a lot of pressure on the opposing team to get rid of the hazards quickly before half of their team gets poisoned. I think it’s at least as good as the likes of Lucario, Zapdos, Alomomola and Mega Chomp so I’d like to hear some opinions.
I'm definitely in favor of moving Dragalge up. Its bulk and typing let it switch into so much, and Adaptability Draco Meteor (or even Sludge Wave) is basically a "click and watch something die" button. I have found that in every game I've used it, it's been a factor regardless of whether I won or lost. It can even act as a pivot for your team against Volt-Switchers. I would say B-/B are both good rankings for it because all of its disgusting power is immediate, but it is held back by subpar physical bulk, atrocious speed and a weakness to EQ.
So after a bit of testing this particular Pokemon on the ladder for a couple of months, I can safely say this Pokemon deserves the ranking I'm going to propose.
Sorry that gif might make your eyes bleed Entei
C -----> At least C+
Entei's viability has shot up recently since it received Sacred Fire in an event. The Choice Band set is an absolute monster right now. There are very few Pokemon that enjoy switching into Sacred Fire. Those few Pokemon are Flash Fire users, who all get nailed by Bulldoze. Even Pokemon that resist Sacred Fire hate getting Burned. Sacred Fire, is simply put, one of the single most spamable moves in the game. Entei has decent bulk as well, allowing it to take a lot of non-super effective hits. Entei also has access to Extreme Speed, allowing it to pick off Pokemon that would normally outspeed Entei, like Talonflame. Entei also has the advantage of beating a lot of common threats like M-Sableye, M-Pinsir and Bisharp.
tl:dr: Spam Sacred Fire and win
252+ Atk Choice Band Entei Sacred Fire vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Sableye: 172-204 (56.5 - 67.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Entei Sacred Fire vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Diancie: 114-134 (47.3 - 55.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after burn damage
252+ Atk Choice Band Entei Sacred Fire vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mega Aerodactyl: 140-165 (46.5 - 54.8%) -- 65.2% chance to 2HKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Entei Sacred Fire vs. 244 HP / 0 Def Gliscor: 204-240 (57.9 - 68.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Poison Heal
252+ Atk Choice Band Entei Sacred Fire vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mega Gyarados: 114-135 (34.4 - 40.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
I support Azelf to B. Being of the best suicide lead options for HO it is almost guaranteed to get it's job done, whatever that might be. A focus sash set of taunt/explosion/fire blast/stealth rock either prevents every setter from doing there job with the base 115 fast taunt (bar priority klefki, a Scolipede after one protect and the even more rare Mega Aero) or sets itself before anyone can stop it. M-Sabeleye is a pain but can be taken advantage of from the start with another lead. Other common leads are utterly destroyed or severely crippled by the little pixie. Ferro, Skarmory, Chesnaught, and Steelix/Aggron are all picked off by fire blast. Even Bisharps hoping to counter you off the start are beaten 1v1 (60 SpA Azelf Fire Blast vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Bisharp: 272-320 (100 - 117.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO). The greatness of explosion can't be expressed enough for HO as it allows you to essentially stop set-up sweepers hoping to take advantage of you off the bat and also damaging many pokemon to the point where a priority move can finish them off. More importantly, it lets you choose who to soften for your win condition to finish off later. A successful choice for myself is exploding on defensive Rotom-W who often are sent out in fear of a coverage move being used against another mon or after seeing fire blast. With Rotom-W weakened it allows many HO mons such as Talonflame and BD Azumarill to go to work. Before looking at its potential offense capabilities remember that its main value still comes from setting up/preventing hazards something no other HO option can do better. While this set is effective, Azelf has many other options to take advantage of including dual screens for set-up sweepers and one of the fastest rain dances. Benefits Azelf has over others with these options is that the use of explosion guarantees no waste of the precious rain or screen turns.
I'm definitely in favor of moving Dragalge up. Its bulk and typing let it switch into so much, and Adaptability Draco Meteor (or even Sludge Wave) is basically a "click and watch something die" button. I have found that in every game I've used it, it's been a factor regardless of whether I won or lost. It can even act as a pivot for your team against Volt-Switchers. I would say B-/B are both good rankings for it because all of its disgusting power is immediate, but it is held back by subpar physical bulk, atrocious speed and a weakness to EQ.
To elaborate on this, I must say that Crawdaunt has absolutely no business being ranked higher than Dragalge. They both have pretty much the same niche as being very slow yet ridiculously powerful wallbreakers with incredible STAB but are somewhat frail. Hell, that said, Dragalge actually has special bulk where Crawdaunt has... no bulk. I would promote bestdragonever to B or B- as well, if only because it is no less deserving of B rank than Crawdaunt.
To elaborate on this, I must say that Crawdaunt has absolutely no business being ranked higher than Dragalge. They both have pretty much the same niche as being very slow yet ridiculously powerful wallbreakers with incredible STAB but are somewhat frail. Hell, that said, Dragalge actually has special bulk where Crawdaunt has... no bulk. I would promote bestdragonever to B or B- as well, if only because it is no less deserving of B rank than Crawdaunt.
Crawdaunt does have its advantages that keep it on par, if not on on a higher level than Dragalge. First of all, Crawdaunt's speed, while not impressive at all, is definitely a step above Dragalge's, allowing it to outrun up to unboosted base 80's I believe. This is a big advantage as Crawdaunt will outrun a lot more walls than Dragalge. Also, let's not forget Crawdaunt has priority, and very powerful priority at that, threatening fast n' frail Pokemon (Beedrill is OHKO'd) and giving you insurance against certain sweepers (Excadrill). Next, Crawdaunt's moves are way more spammable. Knock Off is useful no matter what, and Crabhammer is ridiculous. Crawdaunt's power output with a Life Orb is nearly the same as Dragalge with a Choice Specs, and that's assuming Dragalge goes for the move that halves its special attack...
Finally, Crawdaunt gets walled by pretty much one, uncommon set (defensive Mega Altaria) while Dragalge can't get past the more common blobs. Overall, Crawdaunt is more reliable and has greater staying power than Dragalge.
Dragalge's most important advantage is its bulk, but Crawdaunt clearly has its own advantages at its disposal allowing it to have a better matchup against many teams.
The thing about crawdaunt is that it's mitigated to one role and one role only while dragalge can provide tspikes support on top of its ability to wall-break. Bulk isnt everything but in regards to the crawdaunt v dragalge comparison, neither is their ability to wall-break. I don't think crawdaunt is fantastic in the meta-game as it was during its initial hype and that its best role is against heavy stall and hyper offense, while dragalges support utility that it has gives it a little more variety in its arsenal to benefit its team-mates in the long run.
Not sure about the validity of my posting here, but it's been bugging me for quite some time that this change hasn't been implemented, if everything I'm saying here is retarded, which is very likely, feel free to overlook it. Anyway. Mega Charizard Y: A > A+
Megazard Y has some of the best offensive prowess in the OR/AS metagame, with its base 159 SpA, great offensive typing, potent movepool and that grizzly Drought ability he has potential to 2HKO a vast vast portion of the metagame. I didn't run calcs for everything, but I pinned Megazard Y against everything in S rank through to A- rank, running the bulkiest sets of opposing mons and no hazard damage to make it a fair gauge, I've split it into two drop tabs: things that have a 95% chance or higher to be 2HKOed and mons with a less than 95% chance to be 2HKOed by Megazard Y using the specially offensive/special based mixed set of Naive, Fire Blast, Solar Beam, Focus Blast, Air Slash/EQ. The results were as follows:
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Solar Beam vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Keldeo: 332-392 (102.7 - 121.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Mega Metagross in Sun: 576-678 (191.3 - 225.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Mega Sableye in Sun: 279-328 (91.7 - 107.8%) -- 50% chance to OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Solar Beam vs. 240 HP / 16 SpD Assault Vest Azumarill: 240-284 (59.8 - 70.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Bisharp in Sun: 840-990 (308.8 - 363.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Focus Blast vs. 144 HP / 0 SpD Mega Charizard X: 175-206 (52.5 - 61.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 96+ SpD Clefable in Sun: 280-330 (71 - 83.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Solar Beam vs. 0 HP / 0- SpD Mega Diancie: 312-368 (129.4 - 152.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Gengar in Sun: 397-468 (153.2 - 180.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 244 HP / 192+ SpD Gliscor in Sun: 288-339 (81.8 - 96.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Poison Heal
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Solar Beam vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Gyarados: 244-288 (73.7 - 87%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
4 Atk Mega Charizard Y Earthquake vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Heatran: 284-336 (73.7 - 87.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 0- SpD Landorus in Sun: 420-495 (131.6 - 155.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 8 SpD Landorus-T in Sun: 373-441 (97.6 - 115.4%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Lopunny in Sun: 324-382 (119.5 - 140.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Latios in Sun: 144-169 (48.1 - 56.5%) -- 87.5% chance to 2HKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Solar Beam vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Mega Slowbro: 366-432 (92.8 - 109.6%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Thundurus in Sun: 378-445 (126.4 - 148.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 220+ SpD Celebi in Sun: 464-548 (114.8 - 135.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Excadrill in Sun: 894-1052 (247.6 - 291.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 168 SpD Ferrothorn in Sun: 960-1132 (272.7 - 321.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Mega Gallade in Sun: 279-328 (100.7 - 118.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 0- SpD Garchomp in Sun: 200-236 (56 - 66.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Gardevoir in Sun: 241-285 (87 - 102.8%) -- 18.8% chance to OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Solar Beam vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Manaphy: 306-360 (75.7 - 89.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Manectric in Sun: 378-445 (134.5 - 158.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Mega Pinsir in Sun: 680-804 (250.9 - 296.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Solar Beam vs. 252 HP / 212+ SpD Rotom-W: 216-256 (71 - 84.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 248 HP / 176 SpD Mega Scizor in Sun: 1056-1248 (307.8 - 363.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Solar Beam vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Slowbro: 366-432 (92.8 - 109.6%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Focus Blast vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Tyranitar in Sand: 404-476 (100.2 - 118.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 232 HP / 4 SpD Thick Fat Mega Venusaur in Sun: 270-318 (75.2 - 88.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Aerodactyl in Sun: 164-193 (54.4 - 64.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Diggersby in Sun: 390-459 (125 - 147.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Heracross in Sun: 602-710 (200 - 235.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 112 SpD Hippowdon: 237-280 (56.4 - 66.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Jirachi in Sun: 452-534 (111.8 - 132.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 172 HP / 0 SpD Magnezone in Sun: 686-810 (211.7 - 250%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 0- SpD Thick Fat Mamoswine in Sun: 528-624 (147 - 173.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Solar Beam vs. 248 HP / 16 SpD Starmie: 342-404 (105.8 - 125%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 132 HP / 0 SpD Assault Vest Tornadus-T in Sun: 229-270 (68.9 - 81.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Out of everything in the S - A- category, only five mons were spared the 2HKO. Bulky Mega Altaria and SpD Talonflame are also exceptions in comparison to their other sets, the more offensive variants of both of those would fall into the above list of >95% chance to be 2HKOed.
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Altaria in Sun: 150-177 (42.3 - 50%) -- 0.4% chance to 2HKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 248 HP / 252+ SpD Talonflame in Sun: 143-168 (39.8 - 46.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 72 HP / 0 SpD Latias in Sun: 126-148 (39.4 - 46.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 88 HP / 0 SpD Gyarados in Sun: 156-185 (44.1 - 52.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Politoed: 110-130 (28.6 - 33.8%) -- 0.8% chance to 3HKO
I'm not calcing out the rest, but you see my point here, he's one tough motherfucker with very few things that actually appreciate switching into him. It is arguable that Zard Y is too reliant on the Sun, but Politoad is the only one that seems to prove that, Tyranitar and Hippowdon are both O-2HKOed in Sand, and base 159 is a very potent SpA even unboosted. Zard Y also has reliable recovery which coupled with his pretty good base 115 SpD, and the Sun again eliminating one of his weaknesses it's not the frailest of mons, definitely not the bulkiest but it's not very accurate describing him as paper thin. Zard Y can also run physical, the less preferred set but quite potent, the Sun boost does help to elevate his somewhat sub-par base 104 Atk to the point where some more specially oriented walls expecting Fire Blast crumble (looking at you, Chansey [252 Atk Mega Charizard Y Flare Blitz vs. 4 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey in Sun: 333-393 (51.8 - 61.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO]).
The drawbacks I see in Zard Y are:
4x weakness to Rocks, not the best physical bulk, exceptionally average speed tier. Regardless, I don't think these issues are prominent enough to hold Zard Y back from A+, S rank would be pushing it a bit but I'd still argue that being one of, if not the best wallbreaker in the game well entitles him to a bump.
Not sure about the validity of my posting here, but it's been bugging me fro quite some time that this change hasn't been implemented, if everything I'm saying here is retarded, which is very likely, feel free to overlook it. Anyway. Mega Charizard Y: A > A+
Megazard Y has some of the best offensive prowess in the OR/AS metagame, with its base 159 SpA, great offensive typing, potent movepool and that grizzly Drought ability he has potential to 2HKO a vast vast portion of the metagame. I didn't run calcs for everything, but I pinned Megazard Y against everything in S rank through to A- rank, running the bulkiest sets of opposing mons and no hazard damage to make it a fair gauge, I've split it into two drop tabs: things that have a 95% chance or higher to be 2HKOed and mons with a less than 95% chance to be 2HKOed by Megazard Y using the specially offensive/special based mixed set of Naive, Fire Blast, Solar Beam, Focus Blast, Air Slash/EQ. The results were as follows:
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Solar Beam vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Keldeo: 332-392 (102.7 - 121.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Mega Metagross in Sun: 576-678 (191.3 - 225.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Mega Sableye in Sun: 279-328 (91.7 - 107.8%) -- 50% chance to OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Solar Beam vs. 240 HP / 16 SpD Assault Vest Azumarill: 240-284 (59.8 - 70.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Bisharp in Sun: 840-990 (308.8 - 363.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Air Slash vs. 144 HP / 0 SpD Mega Charizard X: 163-193 (48.9 - 57.9%) -- 96.9% chance to 2HKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 96+ SpD Clefable in Sun: 280-330 (71 - 83.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Solar Beam vs. 0 HP / 0- SpD Mega Diancie: 312-368 (129.4 - 152.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Gengar in Sun: 397-468 (153.2 - 180.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 244 HP / 192+ SpD Gliscor in Sun: 288-339 (81.8 - 96.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Poison Heal
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Solar Beam vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Gyarados: 244-288 (73.7 - 87%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Focus Blast vs. 248 HP / 192+ SpD Heatran: 222-262 (57.6 - 68%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 0- SpD Landorus in Sun: 420-495 (131.6 - 155.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 8 SpD Landorus-T in Sun: 373-441 (97.6 - 115.4%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Lopunny in Sun: 324-382 (119.5 - 140.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Latios in Sun: 144-169 (48.1 - 56.5%) -- 87.5% chance to 2HKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Solar Beam vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Mega Slowbro: 366-432 (92.8 - 109.6%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Thundurus in Sun: 378-445 (126.4 - 148.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 220+ SpD Celebi in Sun: 464-548 (114.8 - 135.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Excadrill in Sun: 894-1052 (247.6 - 291.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 168 SpD Ferrothorn in Sun: 960-1132 (272.7 - 321.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Mega Gallade in Sun: 279-328 (100.7 - 118.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 0- SpD Garchomp in Sun: 200-236 (56 - 66.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Gardevoir in Sun: 241-285 (87 - 102.8%) -- 18.8% chance to OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Solar Beam vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Manaphy: 306-360 (75.7 - 89.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Manectric in Sun: 378-445 (134.5 - 158.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Mega Pinsir in Sun: 680-804 (250.9 - 296.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Solar Beam vs. 252 HP / 212+ SpD Rotom-W: 216-256 (71 - 84.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 248 HP / 176 SpD Mega Scizor in Sun: 1056-1248 (307.8 - 363.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Solar Beam vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Slowbro: 366-432 (92.8 - 109.6%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Focus Blast vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Tyranitar in Sand: 404-476 (100.2 - 118.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 232 HP / 4 SpD Thick Fat Mega Venusaur in Sun: 270-318 (75.2 - 88.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Aerodactyl in Sun: 164-193 (54.4 - 64.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Diggersby in Sun: 390-459 (125 - 147.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Heracross in Sun: 602-710 (200 - 235.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 112 SpD Hippowdon: 237-280 (56.4 - 66.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Jirachi in Sun: 452-534 (111.8 - 132.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 172 HP / 0 SpD Magnezone in Sun: 686-810 (211.7 - 250%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 0- SpD Thick Fat Mamoswine in Sun: 528-624 (147 - 173.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Solar Beam vs. 248 HP / 16 SpD Starmie: 342-404 (105.8 - 125%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 132 HP / 0 SpD Assault Vest Tornadus-T in Sun: 229-270 (68.9 - 81.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Out of everything in the S - A- category, only five mons were spared the 2HKO. Bulky Mega Altaria and SpD Talonflame are also exceptions in comparison to their other sets, the more offensive variants of both of those would fall into the above list of >95% chance to be 2HKOed.
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Altaria in Sun: 150-177 (42.3 - 50%) -- 0.4% chance to 2HKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 248 HP / 252+ SpD Talonflame in Sun: 143-168 (39.8 - 46.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 72 HP / 0 SpD Latias in Sun: 126-148 (39.4 - 46.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 88 HP / 0 SpD Gyarados in Sun: 156-185 (44.1 - 52.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Politoed: 110-130 (28.6 - 33.8%) -- 0.8% chance to 3HKO
I'm not calcing out the rest, but you see my point here, he's one tough motherfucker with very few things that actually appreciate switching into him. It is arguable that Zard Y is too reliant on the Sun, but Politoad is the only one that seems to prove that, Tyranitar and Hippowdon are both O-2HKOed in Sand, and base 159 is a very potent SpA even unboosted. Zard Y also has reliable recovery which coupled with his pretty good base 115 SpD, and the Sun again eliminating one of his weaknesses it's not the frailest of mons, definitely not the bulkiest but it's not very accurate describing him as paper thin. Zard Y can also run physical, the less preferred set but quite potent, the Sun boost does help to elevate his somewhat sub-par base 104 Atk to the point where some more specially oriented walls expecting Fire Blast crumble (looking at you, Chansey [252 Atk Mega Charizard Y Flare Blitz vs. 4 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey in Sun: 333-393 (51.8 - 61.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO]).
The drawbacks I see in Zard Y are:
4x weakness to Rocks, not the best physical bulk, exceptionally average speed tier. Regardless, I don't think these issues are prominent enough to hold Zard Y back from A+, S rank would be pushing it a bit but I'd still argue that being one of, if not the best wallbreaker in the game well entitles him to a bump.
While that list is fine, Zard Y has to get a safe switch in on some of those. Even then, 1v1, he loses. Jolly Mega-Pinsir, Mega-Diancie, Megaman, Mega-Aero, Banded-Talonflame, Lati@s, Scarfed Lando-T, Thundurus, Sash Garchomp all can watch him come in, then kill him before he can attack. Manaphy can speed tie if Timid, and nobody wants to see Solarbeam take 3 turns to fire because it got off rain dance first.
I'm not saying he doesn't destroy families, but some of those calcs would only happen due to bad plays or Rock moves having shit accuracy.
I see that, the calcs were more to show how few things can safely switch into him safely and take a hit more than how he can safely switch into anything else. It's just usually quite a safe assumption to make that when Zard Y gets a safe switch in then something is going to die, or at least take a very large amount so they can be relatively easily revenged later. I wasn't really going for a play-by-play scenario on how each scenario will ultimately end (yes Manaphy can win a speed-tie, Chomp can outspeed and hi it like a train next turn, Mamo could have a Sash, etc) or showing how many things he counters with some of the things I calced, it's more to demo the raw power he has as a wallbreaker against a significant 'superior' portion of the OU metagame, which is what Zard Y is all about. If he gets a safe switch-in, then things are quite likely in your favour unless your opponent is running one of the few things it cannot touch very well, and those are pretty few for the most part.
Ditto to Unranked
Complete garbage because it's useless against bulkier/stallier teams and can be taken advantage of by offense with smart play. Most of the stuff you're revenging doesn't like to be locked into one move anyway.
Sylveon to B+ or A-
This thing hits way to hard to be this low, lol. It's got great Special bulk and passable Physical bulk so it can come in on something and proceed to fire off a nuke that dents even resists.
252+ SpA Choice Specs Pixilate Sylveon Hyper Voice vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Metagross: 153-180 (50.8 - 59.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Pixilate Sylveon Hyper Voice vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Metagross: 129-152 (42.8 - 50.4%) -- 1.2% chance to 2HKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Pixilate Sylveon Hyper Voice vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Mega Scizor: 139-164 (49.4 - 58.3%) -- 98.8% chance to 2HKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Pixilate Sylveon Hyper Voice vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Scizor: 167-197 (59.4 - 70.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Pixilate Sylveon Hyper Voice vs. 252 HP / 168 SpD Ferrothorn: 106-126 (30.1 - 35.7%) -- guaranteed 4HKO after Leftovers recovery
(Mega) Metagross and Offensive (Mega) Scizor lose a shit ton of health on a resisted hit while Ferrothorn loses a sizable 33%, imagine if you predict correctly and smack them with Shadow Ball or Hidden Power (Shadow Ball can kill pre-Mega Metagross while HP Fire does up to 82%, Scizor and Ferrothorn just die). Offense just doesn't have any good switch-ins while bulkier teams need to watch out for coverage or Baton Passing to something that can kill Chansey after you force out Sableye. It definitely has issues like the aforementioned "meh" physical bulk and slow Speed, but it'll always put in some work.
Yeah, I agree with sylveon raising to at least B+ rank. Its specs set is really damn good. As proven above, hyper voice is extremely spammable to the point that plenty of resists wont enjoy taking a hyper voice to the face. Having pretty good bulk all around, decent coverage to hit plenty of stuff and baton pass to not be a momentum killer if anything.
B+ rank fits really well for Sylveon at the moment.
I also agree with a B+ for sylveon. Its specs set being the monstrous set of all them , but it can run CM sets , Walls and etc. I feel Crawdaunt should be put ahead of Dragalge also just because its meant to do damage and leave basically. Life Orb can wall break while Sashed can almost always guarantee a +2 Hit with the ability. Although it may be frail its easier to use than a Draglage which you can end up being walled by being locked into some move.
Even with the amount of raw power that it posesses sylveon has one fatal flaw, it's speed. At a measly 60 base speed it can't outspeed some of the potent walls in the meta game without investing heavily into it. This flaw means that sylveon can't be switched into attacks freely because in many cases it'll be forced to take 2 hits before it can attack. Resulting in it being very easily crippled. This also doesn't take into account entry hazards and other forms of passive damage.
Although it's an incredible wallbreaker it is largely out classed by mega-gard as a fairy wallbreaker. I think that sylveon should raise to B but not any higher. It's speed really stops it from being a more potent threat.
Aye, but Specs wallbreaker isn't Sylve's only asset, she has capability to be a cleric as well, plus there's the CM set. True, CM is outclassed by Clef and there may be better clerics and wallbreakers, but Sylve is not a one trick pony, she can pull off multiple sets quite effectively which I do think entitles her to a significantly higher place than she is now. Maybe the A ranks are out of her league, but she fits B+ just fine imo.
Aye, but Specs wallbreaker isn't Sylve's only asset, she has capability to be a cleric as well, plus there's the CM set. True, CM is outclassed by Clef and there may be better clerics and wallbreakers, but Sylve is not a one trick pony, she can pull off multiple sets quite effectively which I do think entitles her to a significantly higher place than she is now. Maybe the A ranks are out of her league, but she fits B+ just fine imo.
That's true however sylveon just doesn't do anything better then clefable except as a wallbreaker. As a wish passer clefable does this better because it has access to magic guard which allows her to pass wishes off more often as she won't be forced to heal herself as often. Clefable also has better physical bulk (not by a ton) that allows her to better take on the physical threats that other fairys, including sylveon, could only dream of. Her only notable set is her special wallbreaker set but that suffers from her poor speed and underwhelming movepool that basically force her into spamming Hyper voice which is easily checked by every steel type in the tier.
I'm not denying that she is a bad addition to a team I'm just pointing out her flaws that hold her back from stardom. If she was just a little faster and had access to fire blast then she would be a more potent wallbreaker. But as it stands there is nothing sylveon does better then clefable (wish passer, cleric, CM, tank) or mega-gard (stupidly powerful special wallbreaker).
Ditto to Unranked
Complete garbage because it's useless against bulkier/stallier teams and can be taken advantage of by offense with smart play. Most of the stuff you're revenging doesn't like to be locked into one move anyway.
This isn't true. Ditto is actually very good against stall in stall vs stall match ups as it effectively has unlimited PP (which potentially translates to unlimited Heal Bells, Wishes, Stealth Rocks, Defogs, Taunts, etc.) and it can grab advantage just by switching in and tracing abilities like Regenerator, Natural Cure, Poison Heal and Magic Bounce. Also it's the only Pokemon that punishes setting up that isn't easily removed by Gothitelle (Quagsire and Clefable being the two main ones). It gives stall insurance against Baton Pass too. There is no reliable way to counter every common set up sweeper any more, so Ditto is an extremely useful 6th member on defensive teams.
It forces out threats that ordinarily could blow defensive teams apart: NP 3 attacks Thundurus, LO SD Garchomp, SD Charizard X, Belly Drum Azumarill, SD Diggersby, Magnezone + SD Pinsir combo, TG + Rain Dance Manaphy, etc.
I remember seeing at least one or two Ditto stall teams that peaked the ladder during XY and my own did on the Greninja suspect ladder, it actually provides really unique team support that definitely deserves acknowledgement, if anything it's underrated
That's also true (looks like we're just having a string of agreeing with eachother but somehow arguing anyway XD), but bear in mind that Clef is A+ rank, and Mega Gardevoir is A. Having a mon who can perform commendably, though not as professionally, the same role as Clef or Mega Gard should not be quite that distant from them. If you need a special Fairy wallbreaker without taking up a Megaslot then Sylve is pretty much the only mon that can fill that category. I'm not saying it's as good or better than the A grade Fairies because it isn't, but it's a top-class B+ Fairy, a good ways below its rivals but not the lower end of 'good'.
People think Sableye should be banned... That's fucking stupid. When's the last time somebody whose not a total fucking retard actually lost to this thing. You don't really need to counter it unless your team is really defensive. It dies to pretty much every strong attack in two hits and its typing isn't all that great. All it does is take fighting attacks. Being as slow as a goddamn Ferrothorn means you probably want to pack resistances to Water, Fire, Ground, or something else. Plus, there's a shitton of fairy pokemon that eat this guy for breakfast. Gardevoir, Diancie, Clefable, Altaria, etc. That weakness actually hurts really bad. In all honesty this was very overhyped when it's not all that good it just looks really good on paper. If you face one just send in Keldeo and start firing off scalds until you get a burn and let him die. He's really pretty much dead once statused, and can't come in on status moves until after mega evolution. He's bulky in the sense he can wall some things that come in, but he can't come in on top threats and just wall them. Also both Zards eat him for breakfast. He's good but jesus fucking christ you retards want to ban this, he hits like a wet towel with the same coverage and can't be directly statused. The only place he's even very good is stall teams. I would suggest A- or something but then you'd all label me as nuts so I'll just put this out there for know. I don't watch it very closely, but I highly doubt anyone in SPL has gotten swept by a Sableye. It's a pokemon that's bad against actually good players and only really succeeds vs. people that don't expect it at all.
Landorus-T --> S
Ok, you can't argue that something consistently getting 30%+ usage (which I don't think we've had in OU since Tyranitar in ADV without a ban) is not a good pokemon, in fact one of the best. The BEST scarfer, one of the best stealth rock supporters, the best intimidate spam user, probably the best pivot, etc. I don't really see the case for the drop well expressed anywhere. The pivot, scarf, and defensive sets are all really good, plus it has an awesome movepool. Don't see how the fuck it's on par with mega slowbro ffs.
Landorus-I --> S
The metagame discussion/suspect suggestion thread offers this thing up along with Metagross and Sableye (lol retards) as things to ban. I don't see the case for banning this guy if he's not even ranked as one of the best pokemon in the tier. The last two bans both came from some "S+" tier iirc, and I think if this guy is to be next he should at least be S. Plus, unstoppable wallbreaker is pretty cool and all that. The main reason not to spam this is because Landorus-T is around, and I'm not kidding. If you could use both, it would probably be pretty common.
Slowbro and Manetric's Megas need to drop and Raikou should probably go straight to A. But I'm busy right now with work.
Clearing out B+ I see! It's a very interesting rank since alot of mons in there appear to be in some sort of limbo between B+ and A-. Imo if inflation of this rank is a concern we may just need to bump up some of the mons that are the better B+ ranks just because of the very scarce amount of mons in A- (A- has 11 B+ has 20 A has 17 A+ has 18 clearly B+ is the problem) Anyways I'l get onto my large number of nominations but be warned I ramble a lot so be wary of the wall of text I'm about to hit all of you with.
Torn-T rise to A: If there is any mon who favored greninja's ban its this guy right here. Torn-T immediately rose into one of the top tier ou mons in the post-gren meta which lead to its rise to A- but it clearly is showing to be more than capable of continuing its rise. Like all genies torn-t possess a massive movepool that can be tailored to the teams needs making it a wonderful glue to a lot of teams right now. Between taunt stallbreaking sets, AV, and LO Torn-t finds itself being more splashable among the common builds of the tier. Having regenerator is such a boon as it allows it to pivot in and out throughout the match while not caring too much about rocks too much so the bombardment of torn-t's utility is generally harder for the opponent to remove. What really stands out to me is how this mon simultaneously rips through balance and handles offense in one slot. The most common playstyle balance has great difficulty switching into stab hurricane and the few things that can risk getting hit by a coverage move or just lose momentum to u-turn to let another threat continue to pressure them. That sexy 121 speed tier lets torn handle a lot of the faster mons found in the tier as well which adds to how lethal torn-t is in the meta right now. So let's raise this mon and by judging from it's appearances in spl and from how high level players view it this move up seems very logical.
Raikou rise to A-: I can't be the only one to realize how good raikou is becoming in this meta. The speed tier it sits at is golden right now allowing it to check the threats sitting in base 110 while tying with the rising starmie at 115. While raikou's movepool is kinda dry it actually has exactly what it needs except for non rash aura sphere. With boltbeam coverage, volt switch, and a choice of shadow ball or extrasensory raikou has some nice coverage to work with and gains a lot of momentum along with it. Raikou also has a few different sets that are usable such as AV, specs, and subcm which give it some merit over it's big brother Mman as raikou can now fill in some roles that Mman cannot. The "poor man's manectric" now seems a lot more viable now that it can serve some different roles that Mman cannot while also saving that beloved mega slot which is all shown by raikou's recent ascent into our OU tier.
Kingdra rise to A-: In the past it made sense to keep politoed a rank above the other rain members since it is the staple of all rain teams. Well it would appear that kingdra has quickly become a staple among rain teams as well. I doubt anyone has seen a rain team without kingdra and that is for very good reason. It has two different sets that allow kingdra to pair up with any swift swimmer imaginable. The potent omastar+kingdra core shows how frightening LO kingdra is after holes have been punched through the opposing team and the Mpert/kabu+kingdra cores shows how well specs kingdra can work as a powerful wallbreaker itself. So what exactly is stopping someone from dropping kingdra for another swift swimmer? The typing and speed are the advantages kingdra has over the others. Being the fastest swimmer allows kingdra to revenge scarfers who can otherwise force out and take away momentum from the other swimmers which is huge considering rain is very offensive and momentum is key to these teams. The typing also comes into play as it allows kingdra to come in more often than some of the other swimmers(i guess Mpert can too if it's mega already). So basically imo kingdra should sit in A- next to politoed as kingdra is a very defining member of this playstyle and will always be used in any rain core along with politoed.
Mega Beedrill should stay in B+:Vertex made a nice post about Mbee and why it should stay and I support it all the way. First off I don't see opportunity cost as too big of an argument since if your mega slot is going toward volturn you have only two options in Mman and Mbee. Aside from the opportunity cost stuff Mbee has a lot of attributes that make it a solid B+ mon plus it pairs well with a lot of the top tier OU mons. Clearly momentum is the name of the game when it comes to our gen 1 bug type. That speed tier is absolutely incredible allowing you to take full advantage of Mbee's powerful u-turns to gain momentum on almost the entire tier and since u-turn is not immune to anything(unlike voltswitch) you can spam it for days. I'd also like to draw some attention to protect since a lot of people say it is a flaw while it actually helps Mbee out. Since Mbee is so ridiculously fast scarfers are the best way of revenging it most notably lando-t who can even reliably switch into it. Well protect hilariously allows you to screw over these scarfers and actually provides you with more momentum because the opponent has now locked themself into a single move allowing you to play around it accordingly. Although Mbee's movepool is pretty damn dry it actually has all it needs to support it's team by either luring in tran with drill run or crippling switchins with knock off so it's favorite teammate magnezone/ton can trap stuff. This leads to how Mbee puts pressure on opposing teams when trying to switch into it. Do you risk switching in an offensive mon to get smacked by adaptability boosted poison jab? Or do you risk switching in skarm only to get u-turned on and cooked by zone? This effectively makes Mbee feel as if it has no true counters since they either A. get trapped by zone/ton or B. just get repeatedly smacked by u-turns until they get killed by Mbee or another teammate. This is one huge advantage over Mman since its common switchins cannot be trapped as easily since goth does not really find a place on these type of teams. I won't try to make it appear as if I am overhyping bee though since it does have it's fair share of flaws such as being frail af and is severely hampered by rocks which is what is keeping it from a more defining rank such as A-. Imo this mon receives way too much hate from what I've seen since it's actually a very solid mon just like a lot of the other B+ mons that it fits in well with.
Honestly I have more mons to talk about but this post is already long as shit so I guess I'l save it for later. Again apologies for this massive wall of text and if you actually read all of my rambling I applaud you m8.
Is it really necessary to call people retards, asterat? It makes your post look bad.
And I'd like to think that Landorus-T dropped, because none of its sets bar Choice Scarf are really spectacular. I find both Hippowdon and Garchomp to be better Defensive Stealth Rock setters than Landorus-T, Swords Dance/Rock Polish sets aren't even deserving of A rank on their own (imo), and people are overhyping the ability to pivot. Good players are well-prepared for it (Land-T) solely because of the popularity of U-turn and Ground STABs.
Maybe unspectacular, but Lando-T is superbly versatile with so many possible sets. There is the Scarf everyone loves, defensive lead/pivot, offensive lead/pivot, various bulky offensive lead spreads, Sub SD, Sub RP, double dance, he has access to U-Turn, Knock Off, Smack Down support is cool too, it can run so many bloody sets effectively. Yeah, it might not excel at all of them beyond anything else, but I struggle to think of anything else in the tier with as much potential as Lando who's as easy to slap on a team. I don't want to be a sheep here, but I can see the reason why this thing is everywhere like the plague in OU and I do think it deserves to have S rank back.
Is it really necessary to call people retards, asterat? It makes your post look bad.
And I'd like to think that Landorus-T dropped, because none of its sets bar Choice Scarf are really spectacular. I find both Hippowdon and Garchomp to be better Defensive Stealth Rock setters than Landorus-T, Swords Dance/Rock Polish sets aren't even deserving of A rank on their own (imo), and people are overhyping the ability to pivot. Good players are well-prepared for it (Land-T) solely because of the popularity of U-turn and Ground STABs.
Garchomp can't take Charizard-X at all and Hippowdon lacks U-Turn. Also, Landorus-T resists fighting moves from stuff like Heracross and Gallade. I think those others have merits, but Landorus-T is definitely the best one around. Choice scarf is incredibly spectacular to the point I think it deserves S. It's amazing in the same way specs Keldeo is amazing, and subcm Keldeo more or less equates to pivot Landorus-T. Double dance is comparable to endeavor or scarf etc. Anyways, I really think it deserves S rank just because of pivot and choice scarf sets. Nothing else does choice scarf even close to as well.
AM Edit: Removed arguing.
Why is terrakion still B+? To me, it simply has no place in a metagame where almost have the pokemon resist fighting. In a metagame infested with Sableye, Landorus-T, Latios, Metagross, Clefable, Mew, etc. Also, its speed tier is kind of bad because there are so many base 110s as of ORAS and it doesn't hit hard enough to plow through resists. Stone Edge is unreliable and too much resists close combat, I think it should drop to like B-. It's an ok scarfer but I honestly would rather use Tyranitar if you want a rock scarfer because it supports the team by trapping with pursuit. The only set I really see as ok is suicide lead, but even then it's kind of mediocre when there are other suicide leads available. If you don't think I'm right, note Terrakion just dropped to UU which is a sign nobody seems to think its very good anymore.
Pinsir just dropped to UU as well but does that make it bad? You really can't totally rely on usage as being a selling point to your case that something is bad unless it has to do with a variety of meta-game trends. B- is way underselling Terrakion when it's definitely not less viable than Quagsire and Mandibuzz of all things.
