ORAS OU The Serperior Advantage RMT

[malomyotismon]

Good Day everyone welcome to my new serperior base team, The serperior advantage, making use of a new core involving everyone's favourite grass snake. Inspiration came from the corse thread in the ou competitive section, where a core for mega gyarados, serperior and talon flame existed for a nicely packaged, fire/water/grass core. Now with out further adue the team.

Contrary
4 Hp / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid
-Leaf Storm
-Dragon Pulse
-Hidden Power (Fire)
-Giga Drain

Serperior, an interesting pokemon, filling a role in ou no other pokemon can, a blitzing contrary abuser. Thanks to contrary serperior can fire off base 130 stab move, which at the end of the day, boosts it's mediocre special attack 2 stages! Her movepool may be barren but it's passable enough to make do. the set utilities the standard move set for serperior, leaf storm for stab boosting move, hidden power fire for steels, grass types ect., dragon pulse for decent neutral coverage against dragon types and giga drain as an offensive healing move, and the eves as standard for maximum special offensive. Serperior acts to take out the water based threats, namely rotom-w, which are a threat to the other 2 members of the core.

Gale Wings
80 HP / 252 Atk / 176 Spe
Jolly
-brave bird
-Flare Blitz
-Roost
-Swords Dance

Talonflame the second member of the initial core core of the team, talonflame deals with the nasty steel, grass and fire types out that serperior and gyarados cannot reliably handle. The set is the standard swords dance set, with roost for healing purposes, swords dance to boost and sweep and duel stab recoil moves to lay the hurt on the opposing pokemon. eves are to maximize offensive presence, the eves and nature allow for maximum bulk and offensive, while out speeding relevant threats such as thunderous, in addition to being non divisible by 4 at level 50 or 100 .

Intimidate
88 Hp / 192 Atk / 4 SpD / 224 Spe
Jolly
-Waterfall
-Crunch
-Dragon Dance
-Earthquake

The water half and final member of the initial F/G/W core, mega gyarados deals with the biggest threat to the team -heatran, who walls talonflame and serperior, while being a ferrothorn in the side of scizor. The dragon dance set allows for gyarados to set up and sweep or weaken threats such as lando-t for talonflame to finish off in a pinch. The set is a straight farward all out attacking dragon dancer with maxium eves in attack and speed with an adamant nature to hit hard, with 4 hp eves to remain negative at level 50 or 4 def at level 100, through it's not entirely relevant unless gyarados plans to stay as a non mega. Earthquake has been added to better deal with rotom-w. On adivce from slumerz, i changed nature and ev set.

Levitate
24 Atk / SpA / 252 Spe
Timid
-Draco meteor
-earthquake
-psyshosck
-Defog

With talonflame and to a lesser extent, gyarados on the team, the need for some hazard control is vital. Latios ()not only is on of the best in the ou tier at this job, but latias complments nicely with talonflame in terms of it's typing, drawing away electric and water attacks away from it. The set is another simple straight forward offensive defogger set, maximum speed and special attack, with on the suggestion of albaore to use earthquake to nail heatran.

Flash Fire
4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
timid
-Stone Edge
-Flash cannon
-Earth Power
-Fire Blast

On the suggestion of pirate, heatran replaces scizor as the teams go to steel, as a choic scarf user heatran takes pride of place through killing threats such as talonflame and revenging slow dragons such as garchomp with relative impunity. The set allows heatran to hit hard with stab overheat, flash cnanon for fairies, hp cie for quad ice weak pokemon and stone edge for talonflame and pals. Eves are distrobutd to maximize special attacking potential.

Intimidate
248 Hp / 252 Def / 8 Spe
-stone edge
-earthquake
-u-turn
-Stealth Rock

Albacore suggested a more offensive sr user for the team as clefable was a bit docile. His set is the straight forward bulky pivot, with max hp and defense with a little in speed to outpace uni vested base 90 tier speed pokemon.

Import

Hide

Gyarados @ Gyaradosite
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 88 Hp / 192 Atk / 4 SpD / 224 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Waterfall
- Crunch
- Earthquake

Talonflame (F) @ Sharp Beak
Ability: Gale Wings
EVs: 80 HP / 252 Atk / 178 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Brave Bird
- Flare Blitz
- Roost
- Swords Dance

Serperior (F) @ Life Orb
Ability: Contrary
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Leaf Storm
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Dragon Pulse
- Giga Drain

Latios (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 24 Atk / 232 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Psyshock
- Earthquake
- Defog

Heatran @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Fire Blast
- Flash Cannon
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Stone Edge

Landorus-Therian (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 Spe
Impish Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Stone Edge
- Earthquake
- U-turn

 

[pi3rate]

a huge monster to your team would be taunt talonflame it sets up on -2 clef,scizor, and even serperior/lati at some point of the battle. Id suggest you to run heatran over talonflame not only does this give talonflame a free moveslot now not having to run a fire type move anymore but it lets you check talonflame and also revenge kill mons like mega pinsir. With scizor gone you kinda have a weakness to bisharp if you let it set up which is why instead of flare blitz now you can run will-0-wisp it lets you catch tars and landos and beat bisharp 1v1 if it comes down to it. The last thing i think that should be changed is that you should change latios with latias to deal with mega manectric better since before you didnt really have a solid switch into it besides lati and clef. With serperior and talonflame taking on keld you dont need psyshock on lati and it also lets you lure in bisharp. Healing wish lets you support talonflame and mega gyar stay as long as possible to have its sweeping capabilities. Here are the sets I suggest hope they help.

Sets

Latias (F) @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 88 HP / 168 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Defog
- Hidden Power [Fighting]
- Healing Wish

Talonflame @ Sharp Beak
Ability: Flame Body
EVs: 168 HP / 252 Atk / 88 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Will-O-Wisp
- Brave Bird
- Roost
- Swords Dance

Heatran @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Overheat
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Flash Cannon
- Stone Edge

 

[malomyotismon]

thank you for your suggestions pirate , i have decidd to incorporate them into my team, but I wonder, whats your opinion of ancient power over stone edge on heatran?

 

[Disciple_1]

thank you for your suggestions pirate , i have decidd to incorporate them into my team, but I wonder, whats your opinion of ancient power over stone edge on heatran?

SE hits zard y and Talonflame much harder than ancient power

 

[malomyotismon]

Yes, sorry I should have been more specific, I had concerns over the accuracy of stone edge and if the potential damage out put difference wasn't substantial enough to merit it, but volcanora is on the up in usage so there is the fire moth to consider too :). Again thank you for your input pi3rate and Disciple_1 , testing for the team is going well on showdown.

 

[Albacore]

This team looks really weak to Heatran, especially since your main win condition is completely walled by it, so you probably need a lure to it. You could run Natural Gift with an Apicot Berry on Talonflame but that would probably not be a great idea since you have to forfeit a useful move and the lure can only work once. A better idea would be EQ Latios over Latias, it's not as effective a lure since a few people expect EQ but it's also less detrimental to Latios's effectiveness as a whole. I guess you could run EQ Latias instead of EQ Latios for a better lure but Latias also hits Heatran a lot less hard and needs more attack EVs to guarantee the OHKO

I also think you should run Psyshock on Latias/Latios since otherwise you can't beat MVenusaur or Charizard Y. Though you do have Talonflame for MVenu if rocks are up it can't switch into these two properly and it's better to have multiple checks to these two Pokemon since HP Fighting doesn't seem necessary since you don't really seem weak to Bisharp given that you have MGyara and Wisp Talon as checks.

You should really run Earth Power on Heatran, I don't think HP Ice is really needed and Earth Power enables you to hit opposing Heatran and not be setup fodder for XZard who can completely sweep you at +1. And run a Timid nature, you don't need any attack investment for Stone Edge to KO what it needs to.

Finally I don't think Clefable is ideal for this team since it's mainly offensive by nature and Clefable may be a bit too passive and let certain wallbreakers come in for free multiple times in a battle. Maybe you could try Landorus-T : this helps a lot your slight weakness to DD XZard and gives you a secondary check to Talonflame in case Heatran gets weakened to the point where Brave Bird KOs which could definitely happen. You could also try out Rocky Helmet Garchomp which is great at weakening Talonflame as well as physical attackers in general and can be a great choice if Bisharp gives you trouble.

sets

Talonflame @ Apicot Berry
Ability: Gale Wings
EVs: 112 HP / 252 Atk / 144 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Brave Bird
- Swords Dance
- Natural Gift
- Roost / Will-O-Wisp

Latios @ Life Orb
Ability : Levitate
EVs : 24 Atk / 232 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Psyshock
- Earthquake
- Defog

Heatran @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Overheat
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Flash Cannon
- Stone Edge

Landorus-Therian @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 Spe
Impish Nature
- Stealth Rock
- U-Turn
- Earthquake
- Rock Slide / Stone Edge

Garchomp @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Outrage / Dragon Claw
- Swords Dance / Fire Blast

Garchomp @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Impish Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Dragon Claw
- Toxic

Hope this helps!

 

[malomyotismon]

This team looks really weak to Heatran, especially since your main win condition is completely walled by it, so you probably need a lure to it. You could run Natural Gift with an Apicot Berry on Talonflame but that would probably not be a great idea since you have to forfeit a useful move and the lure can only work once. A better idea would be EQ Latios over Latias, it's not as effective a lure since a few people expect EQ but it's also less detrimental to Latios's effectiveness as a whole. I guess you could run EQ Latias instead of EQ Latios for a better lure but Latias also hits Heatran a lot less hard and needs more attack EVs to guarantee the OHKO

I also think you should run Psyshock on Latias/Latios since otherwise you can't beat MVenusaur or Charizard Y. Though you do have Talonflame for MVenu if rocks are up it can't switch into these two properly and it's better to have multiple checks to these two Pokemon since HP Fighting doesn't seem necessary since you don't really seem weak to Bisharp given that you have MGyara and Wisp Talon as checks.

You should really run Earth Power on Heatran, I don't think HP Ice is really needed and Earth Power enables you to hit opposing Heatran and not be setup fodder for XZard who can completely sweep you at +1. And run a Timid nature, you don't need any attack investment for Stone Edge to KO what it needs to.

Finally I don't think Clefable is ideal for this team since it's mainly offensive by nature and Clefable may be a bit too passive and let certain wallbreakers come in for free multiple times in a battle. Maybe you could try Landorus-T : this helps a lot your slight weakness to DD XZard and gives you a secondary check to Talonflame in case Heatran gets weakened to the point where Brave Bird KOs which could definitely happen. You could also try out Rocky Helmet Garchomp which is great at weakening Talonflame as well as physical attackers in general and can be a great choice if Bisharp gives you trouble.

sets

Talonflame @ Apicot Berry
Ability: Gale Wings
EVs: 112 HP / 252 Atk / 144 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Brave Bird
- Swords Dance
- Natural Gift
- Roost / Will-O-Wisp

Latios @ Life Orb
Ability : Levitate
EVs : 24 Atk / 232 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Psyshock
- Earthquake
- Defog

Heatran @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Overheat
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Flash Cannon
- Stone Edge

Landorus-Therian @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 Spe
Impish Nature
- Stealth Rock
- U-Turn
- Earthquake
- Rock Slide / Stone Edge

Garchomp @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Outrage / Dragon Claw
- Swords Dance / Fire Blast

Garchomp @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Impish Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Dragon Claw
- Toxic

Hope this helps!

thanks for your help, i made the changes to the team with the suggestions and a few changes of my own.

 

[AzureRain]

I don't really like the fact that you're neglecting Brave Bird over Flare Blitz on Talonflame. You need that priority in order to threaten mons like the ever so common Mega Loppunny, which otherwise punches holes through even resisted hits.

 

[Disciple_1]

Seriously you need priority on Smogon Bird and it's item benefits birdspam not flare blitz. Also I would change eq to HP Fighting as it deals with pursuit trappers and heatran and Ferrothorn as well. Instead of SE, try rock slide on lando-t. Yeah you lose some power but what you lose in power you make up in accuracy. There is another gimmick move you could try instead of SE - Smack Down. This will let you KO Rotom-W with eq after smack down on the switch.

 

[malomyotismon]

thanks for pointing that out, peregrine should have brave bird over wil-o-wisp, made a mistake in the old editing XD, as you can see from the import :). hidden power fighting is still very weak, while it hits bisharp hard for the ko, it's not able to put much of a dent into heatran or ferrothorn, the former being a thorn in the side for the team.

 

[AzureRain]

Seriously you need priority on Smogon Bird and it's item benefits birdspam not flare blitz. Also I would change eq to HP Fighting as it deals with pursuit trappers and heatran and Ferrothorn as well. Instead of SE, try rock slide on lando-t. Yeah you lose some power but what you lose in power you make up in accuracy. There is another gimmick move you could try instead of SE - Smack Down. This will let you KO Rotom-W with eq after smack down on the switch.

Smack Down + EQ can't OKHO typical defensive Rotom-W on the switch with his defensive Lando-T build.

 

[Disciple_1]

Smack Down + EQ can't OKHO typical defensive Rotom-W on the switch with his defensive Lando-T build.

I know....... It's just a gimmick told to me by der twist. But it does KO after SR damage

 

[AzureRain]

I know....... It's just a gimmick told to me by der twist. But it does KO after SR damage

There's a very low chance after SR, since you have to take into account leftovers recovery and the fact that you need near max on both Smack Down and EQ. It's a good set that catches people by surprise, I'm just saying you need to run a lot more Atk investment to be able to KO on the switch.

 

[malomyotismon]

aLL right thats the team sprun ing existant on wi fi and showdown now, thanks for the help guys. If anyone wnats to give there opions on how to better than team even more so, please do so I aprechiate any feedback given.

 

[malomyotismon]

bump

 

[DragonAscent]

I could be wrong on this, but I think you want gyara to be jolly to outspeed stuff like sceptile, bee, and aero after a DD.

 

[malomyotismon]

I could be wrong on this, but I think you want gyara to be jolly to outspeed stuff like sceptile, bee, and aero after a DD.

It's definately an option, but the extra power of adamant is really nice and both are covered by other tema mates in heatran and talonflame (lando-t for bee-drill). So long s they are dealt with before hand.

 

[eren]

I know it's kinda late, but... I'll rate anyway! :]

First Off: The Standard (LVL 100) Spread for Mega Gyara should be applied here: 88 Hp / 192 Atk / 4 SpD / 224 Spe
With Jolly Nature, this allows you to outspeed Mega Lopunny and Mega Manectric and OHKO them. The only possible way you can outspeed mega drill, Sceptile, and aero (at +1 obv) is max speed jolly... The reason i suggest this spread is because your team is pretty weak to lando-I... I guess I'll write up some Calcs...

Hide

252 SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Landorus Psychic vs. 88 HP / 0 SpD Talonflame: 205-243 (64.2 - 76.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
0 Atk Life Orb Landorus Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Latios: 265-312 (88.6 - 104.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
252 SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Landorus Psychic vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Serperior: 159-187 (54.6 - 64.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Life Orb Landorus Hidden Power Ice vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Landorus-T: 374-442 (98.1 - 116%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock (81.3 to OHKO without sr)
E: 252 SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Landorus Psychic vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Landorus-T: 182-214 (47.7 - 56.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery Lando dies to psychic e.e
And Heatran just dies to ep...

So in reality nothing wants to switch into Lando-I on ur team... And with that spread ur almost guaranteed to live two psychics in ur base form, if you want a guarantee, you can change ur spread to: 88 Hp / 172 Atk / 24 SpD / 224 Jolly Sike I lied- crits can happen :|
This allows you a switch into Lando-I without playing any: does he have this move games unless ur utterly real and switch into Heatran predicting Psychic...

Secondly: I suggest you a run a spread of: 88 Hp / 252 Atk / 168 Spe with a jolly nature- still allows you to outspeed max timid Raikou, have slightly more bulk, and still OHKO max timid timid Thundurus at +2 after sr with brave bird...

E: mfw I read this and I thought "First Grade Writing >:l"
E2: used the team on the ladder around 1400: worked pretty well :]
E3: the 4 EVs in Atk on Heatran don't necessarily matter being that ur chance is really high and the 4 EVs only raise ur chance of OHKO by 6%. But 4 Def or SpD really don't matter but help taking a hit.

Hide

4- Atk Heatran Stone Edge vs. 120 HP / 0 Def Talonflame: 316-376 (96.6 - 114.9%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO

0- Atk Heatran Stone Edge vs. 120 HP / 0 Def Talonflame: 316-372 (96.6 - 113.7%) -- 75% chance to OHKO

^ sd variants

0- Atk Heatran Stone Edge vs. 68 HP / 0 Def Talonflame: 316-372 (100.6 - 118.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
^ Band variants

0- Atk Heatran Stone Edge vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Talonflame: 316-372 (88 - 103.6%) -- 25% chance to OHKO

4- Atk Heatran Stone Edge vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Talonflame: 316-376 (88 - 104.7%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO
^ bulk up variants

 

[AzureRain]

I know it's kinda late, but... I'll rate anyway! :]

First Off: The Standard (LVL 100) Spread for Mega Gyara should be applied here: 88 Hp / 192 Atk / 4 SpD / 224 Spe
With Jolly Nature, this allows you to outspeed Mega Lopunny and Mega Manectric and OHKO them. The only possible way you can outspeed mega drill, Sceptile, and aero (at +1 obv) is max speed jolly... The reason i suggest this spread is because your team is pretty weak to lando-I... I guess I'll write up some Calcs...

Hide

252 SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Landorus Psychic vs. 88 HP / 0 SpD Talonflame: 205-243 (64.2 - 76.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
0 Atk Life Orb Landorus Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Latios: 265-312 (88.6 - 104.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
252 SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Landorus Psychic vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Serperior: 159-187 (54.6 - 64.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Life Orb Landorus Hidden Power Ice vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Landorus-T: 374-442 (98.1 - 116%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock (81.3 to OHKO without sr)
E: 252 SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Landorus Psychic vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Landorus-T: 182-214 (47.7 - 56.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery Lando dies to psychic e.e
And Heatran just dies to ep...

So in reality nothing wants to switch into Lando-I on ur team... And with that spread ur almost guaranteed to live two psychics in ur base form, if you want a guarantee, you can change ur spread to: 88 Hp / 172 Atk / 24 SpD / 224 Jolly Sike I lied- crits can happen :|
This allows you a switch into Lando-I without playing any: does he have this move games unless ur utterly real and switch into Heatran predicting Psychic...

Secondly: Your tflame spread doesn't allow you to outspeed Thundurus priority wise meaning that even if you use brave bird- u still get paralyzed at +2... Meaning that ur sweep can be impeded... For this reason I suggest you a run a spread of: 120 Hp / 252 Atk / 136 Spe with a jolly nature- allowing you to outspeed max timid Thundurus, have slightly more bulk, and still OHKO at +2 after sr with brave bird...

E: mfw I read this and I thought "First Grade Writing >:l"
E2: used the team on the ladder around 1400: worked pretty well :]
E3: the 4 EVs in Atk on Heatran don't necessarily matter being that ur chance is really high and the 4 EVs only raise ur chance of OHKO by 6%. But 4 Def or SpD really don't matter but help taking a hit.

Hide

4- Atk Heatran Stone Edge vs. 120 HP / 0 Def Talonflame: 316-376 (96.6 - 114.9%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO

0- Atk Heatran Stone Edge vs. 120 HP / 0 Def Talonflame: 316-372 (96.6 - 113.7%) -- 75% chance to OHKO

^ sd variants

0- Atk Heatran Stone Edge vs. 68 HP / 0 Def Talonflame: 316-372 (100.6 - 118.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
^ Band variants

0- Atk Heatran Stone Edge vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Talonflame: 316-372 (88 - 103.6%) -- 25% chance to OHKO

4- Atk Heatran Stone Edge vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Talonflame: 316-376 (88 - 104.7%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO
^ bulk up variants

His Talonflame spread already outspeeds Timid Raikou, which is faster than Thundurus. Not sure what you mean by him being outprioritized.

 

[eren]

His Talonflame spread already outspeeds Timid Raikou, which is faster than Thundurus. Not sure what you mean by him being outprioritized.

I read adamant in one of his post's regarding talonflame's nature....
E: you can actually get away with running 168 Speed and 88 hp
Edits made to my post

 

[AzureRain]

I read adamant in one of his post's regarding talonflame's nature....
E: you can actually get away with running 168 Speed and 88 hp
Edits made to my post

Yeah, 168 Speed and 88 Hp is enough. I'm assuming he's trying to speed creep other SD Talons, but even then only 172 is needed.

 

[malomyotismon]

Agreed and made changes to the gyarados ev spread in nature. Talon will stay with his current ev spread to have a non divisible by 4 number at level 50 for wi fi purposes and the extra sped can always be nice for out speeding other talons, through most i believe run the same. Thanks for the advice, it's nic, it's got m using this team again on wi fi, while I work on my new one.