CAP 20 CAP 20 - Part 1 - Concept Discussion

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jas61292

used substitute
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Since much of what I would say about the ones I like has already been said, and they seem to be well received for the most part, I'm instead going to just focus on Sticky Web Support and why I do not think it is a great idea.

First off, I have always disliked concepts that focus too much on one move. Some moves, such as Substitute (as seen in another concept here), are versatile enough and prevalent enough that you can have a ton of discussion about the move without ultimately forcing a project that is mostly "give it the move and now make it OU viable." Sticky Web, unfortunately, is not really one of these moves. We don't have a ton of experience with it in OU, as the only users of it kinda suck in the tier. A mon that has the move but actually has other reasons to use it would be new, and while that sounds great, honestly, for a concept like this, it really is not. We have no idea how a viable Sticky Web user will effect the tier, so we would have no good reason to really go in any particular direction besides making the CAP OU viable. In the end, it would boil down to "give it sticky web, and make it good, but don't break it." You could add other goals, but that would be going beyond the concept itself in an attempt to just find focus in an otherwise unfocused project.

Secondly, as others have mentioned, Sticky Web is arguably just not that great in OU. Sure, the current setters are bad, but if it was really that great of a move, they would be worth using. As it stands, there are so many pokemon immune to it in the metagame, that it often doesn't make itself worthwhile. Now obviously there is a difference between a mon only being used for the move, and a mon that can carry it and do other things too, but, unless the move is incredibly useful in the metagame, it is really hard to focus a project on it, as the only guarantee that it will actually use it is to make it have few better options. And if we do that, we may very well end up with another Galvantula or something.

Furthermore, its hard to even call this an unexplored move. It may be to an extent in OU, but in other tiers we have already seen exactly how it can impact things. Either it is THE strategy (and makes it unfun), or it is quite niche.

Overall, this is the kind of concept I would never really like in the first place, but the way the metagame is shaped right now makes it so it is even harder than it might otherwise be to get much out of it.
 

nyttyn

From Now On, We'll...
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Alright, so here's your slate! As previously mentioned, the overwhelming desire for CAP 20 is a concept with a concrete goal, and clear definition, resulting in this slate:

The Cowardly Lion
Use the Boost to Get Through!
Choiced Choice Scarf


Ultimately, the arguments against Sticky Web Support were strong enough to get it, ultimately, dropped from the slate. As mentioned before, what we need right now is a stable, concrete concept we know we can pull off - and thanks to the nature of the current metagame being unfavorable towards Sticky Web, I am highly concerned that we could potentially wind up with a pokemon that flat out doesn't work. I would absolutely LOVE to see this concept on a future CAP, but for right now, I think it is...dare I say it, too risky.

Onto the polls.
 
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