np: ORAS OU Suspect Process, Round 3 - Wandering Ghosts [Aegislash remains in Ubers]

[Lady Alex]

Very disappointed with this suspect test. While it's a great check to some of OU's current top-tier threats, it neuters the viability of several otherwise solid, viable pokemon. With Aegislash back in OU, the metagame will likely warp itself around pokemon that are able to deal with Aegislash and pokemon that greatly benefit from its presence. The OP states that the main purpose of this test is to determine whether or not Aegislash brings a level of stability the metagame needs, even if it's "overcentralizing." I heavily disagree with the mentality of re-introducing a pokemon that has traditionally been an extremely stagnating force on the metagame for the sake of stability.

Naturally, a pokemon like Aegislash is going to make the metagame more stable. When you have a pokemon with debatably the best typing in the game, effective 150 attacking and defensive stats, the ability to run multiple sets that are all relatively difficult to check, a stable, but incredibly stagnant metagame is going to result. The same would happen if we introduced something absurd like Giratina-O into the meta. Sure, we'd come up with a way to deal with it, though it would be at the cost of having to dedicate our entire team building either to stopping the opponent's or ensuring that our own cripples the other team.

I think there are changes that need to be made to the meta, for sure, but reintroducing Aegislash is definitely not one of those changes. I'll very likely be voting to keep it banned.

 

[Enki]

I was one of the people who wanted Aegislash ou back then, boy how wrong I was, that metagame was toxic as fuck, and not because Aegislash is "broken".
So what changed on the entire coinflip situation? Majority of voters who voted for ban were just a bunch of guillible fools? idk, it sure doesn't bring a positive ring to the whole Suspect process if we go that way, Sure Aegislash checks a shitload of new threats introduced in ORAS, scratch that, he checks all relevant ones, so my question is: what did ORAS brought that helps dealing with Aegislash? i can't name any relevant new megas, even Serperior or Tyrantrum (released in ORAS) have trouble against it, and Mega Sableye, even with heavy Special Defensive investments is still 2hked by Spooky Plate's Shadow Ball, oh and Aegislash is faster, yeah, have fun with that.

I don't really see a reason to unban it at the moment, it's not that it will be the great savior against the matchup problem that plagues the tier as stated in the OP, and the toxics coinflips are still pretty much the same, not to mention two 'mons (Lando Incarnate and Bisharp) still gets another boost, as if they need more as it stands.

Of course, if the free Aegislash "faction" can convince me and others about the good things Aegislash will bring (and hopefully, FAR outweighing the negative ones) please, do so, after all we are all (hopefully) trying to strive for a better metagame, but we all have different ideas.

 

[Empress]

There's absolutely no reason why Aegislash should return to OU. We all know why it was banned before: raw power and bulk, uncompetitive 50/50s (to a degree), and centralizing the entire metagame around itself. Obviously this wouldn't be as ridiculous as unbanning Giratina-O, but we already know what Aegi matches up well against. It won't simply perform well against the 3 megas mentioned in the OP; it will blanket check much of the metagame just like it did in the XY era. The very presence of Aegi will turn Jirachi, Celebi, Hawlucha, and Starmie back into shitmons and will put a huge strain on much of the A through B ranks. The OU metagame already struggles with diversity, and as we all know, an overly centralized metagame is not an enjoyable one. How will even less diversity be healthy for the OU metagame? We don't check broken Pokemon with other broken Pokemon in OU. Moreover, though centralization does promote skill to an extent, there's no skill involved with using Aegislash- attack, click KS, repeat. I'll play the ladder a bit to see if I'm misguided, but as it stands now, I strongly believe Aegi should remain banned.

 

[tehy]

too bad it was the most common set.

you mean lefties shadow ball / shadow sneak / king's shield / Sacred Sword | Iron Head | Flash Cannon

?

that's not mixed aegislash, mixed aegis is usually Life Orb HP ice / shadow ball / flash cannon / sacred sword

to be honest maybe i should've just said 'all out offensive aegis' as the above set really is more mixed, that's what it was actually called though

 

[Of Moose & Men]

js Aegislash will bring a more skill-based metagame because centralization -> less games decided by matchup (but also less diversity) In the giratina suspect topic there was already a great post about teambuilding skills + diversity vs. skills in games + centralization and I will make a bigger post about that because I am on my phone now but it is important to realise whether we want a diverse or a centralized metagame (and if the centralization of aegislash is positive or negative)

Uhm, gotta wonder where you're pulling that logic from. . . Aegi being on both teams doesn't alleviate match up reliance, as a matter of fact it exacerbates it. There will always be a match up reliance in ORAS nothing is changing that. The only thing AAegi is doing when it comes to this is making a good portion of the OU we have now next to useless. Centralization -> not healthy. When the game becomes who can kill aegi first, it just isn't fun. Yea, its THE blanket check, but to be quite honest this potential drop is the exact opposite of what we should be doing. Matter of fact it goes against EVERYTHING we've ever strived for. We've said "broken beats broken" is not a good argument for years, and now here we are having a suspect completely on that basis. I can't say I agree with this one bit. When you take teambuilding and drop a massive shit on it with the reintroduction of one Pokemon, it should REALLY tell you something. When a massive portion of OU becomes dead weight because of one mon, how can you sit here and say that is healthy? Yea, don't get me wrong, aegi is a great check to the "borderline broken" ( i use borderline extremely lightly) but we're regressing and that's not something i can agree with.
Aside from that, I've voiced my opinion on this plug n' play monster far too many times and won't go into more detail unless provoked.

Regardless, this thing is the most unhealthy mon to ever hit OU (that isn't overly broken).

Keep this shit Ubers.

 

[Darth Darkrai]

Lol, this is a great April Fool's joke! I mean it's a bit late for it, but that just makes it even better in my opinion, because of how unexpected it is! Much better than the Gira-O joke in my opinion!

Alright, in all seriousness, I'd like to raise a serious question, which is a similar one to what I raised during the Gira-O suspect test, which I totally did not fall for at all, by the way. The question is: how exactly does this shift the meta away from the balance archetypes that are currently in heavy use? Just like Gira-O, Aegislash works just as well on Balance as it does on offense, thanks to its ability to switch between being a wall and being an attacker basically at will. In fact, Aegislash stands an excellent chance of being the most heavily used Pokemon on balance teams. Once balance teams start running Aegislash, however, a lot of things that might actually be able to take them on in the current meta are going to lose viability. The only offensive Mega introduced in ORAS that actually stands a chance against it is Mega Lopunny, thanks to Scrappy, but even she still is a bit iffy thanks to King's Shield crippling her. But something else does stand a relatively good chance: Landorus-I. In fact, the thing that many (not necessarily me, cause I was still on the fence) people were hoping would be the next suspect test actually looks to get even better from Aegislash's unbanning. People mentioned that Aegislash stands a pretty good chance against Lando, since it can 2HKO it with Shadow Ball. But...

252 SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Landorus Earth Power vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Aegislash-Shield: 322-382 (99.3 - 117.9%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO

252 SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Landorus Earth Power vs. 252 HP / 0+ SpD Aegislash-Shield: 291-346 (89.8 - 106.7%) -- 37.5% chance to OHKO

252 SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Landorus Earth Power vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Aegislash-Shield: 273-322 (84.2 - 99.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252 SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Landorus Earth Power vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Aegislash-Shield: 244-291 (75.3 - 89.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

So, even the most specially defensive version of Aegislash can't avoid being 2HKO'd by Lando's Earth Power even in the Shield Form (King Shield notwithstanding), even if it runs Leftovers. And that specially defensive version has to be in Blade form to do anything to Lando, which makes it easy for Lando to kill it. Lando might have a difficult time switching into an offensive variant of Aegislash in Blade form, but it has relatively little trouble switching into any Shield form Ageislash. Landorus isn't a great counter to every form of Aegislash, but it can counter it if it comes in on a Shield form, and is an effective check to all forms. The only way this would change is if it became standard for Aegislash to start running HP Ice just to deal with Lando. Otherwise, however, OU's premiere Pokemon isn't gonna see any drop in usage, nor will balance teams, and considering that they are two of the main things that people have been complaining about in OU right now, that's a bit of a problem. Now, I'll admit that I haven't tried out the suspect ladder yet. Maybe I'll be surprised when I do. However, right now, I'm not too keen on Aegislash returning to OU.

 

[stardust93]

im all in for aegislash being back in ou here's why. it actually checks quite abit in the ou tier. it breaks stall (which imho has increased quite abit in ou thanks to the bans of many wall breakers). while it is true it creates alot of 50 50s, it can still be statused with a burn para sleep despite using king shield. mandibuzz/mega sableye are good counters to aegislash. its weak to the most common types in the ou tier. its sets are rather predictable. and sometimes its sooo obvious when your opponent is going for a king shield. yes lando i becomes a bigger threat but seriously that thing has been a threat even when greninja was around. so i don't see why people are making a big deal about lando i. its probably the ONLY overcentralizing pokemon thats never been suspect tested for a long time. but yet we play around such an over centralizing mon. so i don't see why we cant play around this as well.

 

[Nimbus125]

Now, I am not the most experienced OU player, in fact, I usually play Ubers. But I did heavily play before the Aegi ban, and seeing this back brings up a situation in which neither decision wins, because this is the wrong move. If it stays Ubers, match-up is still a problem as it’s really difficult to plan for everything. If it drops to OU, teams will be the most repetitive thing ever. Speaking with experience in Ubers, I would MUCH rather take hard teambuilding over a boring game.

Let’s look at ORAS Ubers: Primal Groudon is on over 3 quarters of the higher ladder teams, creating a centralizing force that everybody has to prepare for. Things like Dialga, Deo-S, and Zekrom fell off the face of the planet due to it. But, while it shook things up hard, Ubers still survived somewhat, even if very stale. Aegislash in OU would do the exact same thing, but even WORSE.

The fact that it kills off basically every viable mega (except Gyarados), makes the best pokemon in OU even BETTER, and helping Bisharp, a very dangerous threat, while making at least a quarter of the tier useless being considered better than hard teambuilding is ludicrous. In my opinion, challenging teambuilding is almost a good thing, as it keeps people on their toes, and stops people from trying to counter everything. Granted, the level it is in OU is too high, but dropping Aegi is not the solution, especially because the logic of dropping it is flawed too. It’s not FIXING the problem, it’s hiding the problem by introducing something even worse. Two wrongs don’t make a right. The correct move would be a ban on something that deserves it, thus removing the threat altogether. Dropping something that blanket-checks, if not blanket-counters a quarter of the tier for free as a way of justifying not having a match-up based meta is not the way to go.

Keep Aegislash in Ubers.

 

[lighthouses]

"Oh you guys all said it should be ubers in XY and now you're saying it should stay wtf!!!!!!!!11"
It was a completely different metagame people, chill o-o

 

[Plague von Karma]

Well, well. It was destined to happen. In my eyes, Aegislash is kind of 50/50 in my eyes. When it was in OU, it was on a rampage. However, that was in XY. This is ORAS. There are very strong Earthquake users running around now (I'm looking at you, Mega Metagross), so maybe Aegislash could be a little less potent now? And don't forget the Scrappy Mega Playboy Punny (See what I did there?) with HJK. However, despite the counters, these take up a Mega Slot, leaving less room for stronger and potent megas, and even a move slot or two. You'd have to build your team to stop it. Also, it's probably gonna be seen every 3rd team, just like Grenny and the 'Flame. Could be horrible to see. I have so far been happy with the current meta, being diverse and all.

Overall, I am 50/50, but leaning towards him staying banned based on personal preference for the meta.

 

[SketchUp]

Uhm, gotta wonder where you're pulling that logic from. . . Aegi being on both teams doesn't alleviate match up reliance, as a matter of fact it exacerbates it. There will always be a match up reliance in ORAS nothing is changing that. The only thing AAegi is doing when it comes to this is making a good portion of the OU we have now next to useless. Centralization -> not healthy. When the game becomes who can kill aegi first, it just isn't fun. Yea, its THE blanket check, but to be quite honest this potential drop is the exact opposite of what we should be doing. Matter of fact it goes against EVERYTHING we've ever strived for. We've said "broken beats broken" is not a good argument for years, and now here we are having a suspect completely on that basis. I can't say I agree with this one bit. When you take teambuilding and drop a massive shit on it with the reintroduction of one Pokemon, it should REALLY tell you something. When a massive portion of OU becomes dead weight because of one mon, how can you sit here and say that is healthy? Yea, don't get me wrong, aegi is a great check to the "borderline broken" ( i use borderline extremely lightly) but we're regressing and that's not something i can agree with.
Aside from that, I've voiced my opinion on this plug n' play monster far too many times and won't go into more detail unless provoked.

Regardless, this thing is the most unhealthy mon to ever hit OU (that isn't overly broken).

Keep this shit Ubers.

fyi I am also pro ubers on aegi but with other reasons. Aegi was banned from a supportive and centralizing point of view, not from an offensive point of view (it does not sweep teams)
Centralization leads to many teams which are the same (less diversity) which leads to more games decided because of skill instead of matchup. I support a diverse metagame, because teambuilding will be rewarded and there is a big group of viable pokemon to choose from. Both has its downsides of course but I will come back to that point in a few hours

 

[Empress]

im all in for aegislash being back in ou here's why. it actually checks quite abit in the ou tier. it breaks stall (which imho has increased quite abit in ou thanks to the bans of many wall breakers). while it is true it creates alot of 50 50s, it can still be statused with a burn para sleep despite using king shield. mandibuzz/mega sableye are good counters to aegislash. its weak to the most common types in the ou tier. its sets are rather predictable. and sometimes its sooo obvious when your opponent is going for a king shield. yes lando i becomes a bigger threat but seriously that thing has been a threat even when greninja was around. so i don't see why people are making a big deal about lando i. its probably the ONLY overcentralizing pokemon thats never been suspect tested for a long time. but yet we play around such an over centralizing mon. so i don't see why we cant play around this as well.

Please... no...

Aegi checks more than "quite a bit" in the OU tier- it blanket checks damn near the entire metagame. Calling its sets "predictable" is incorrect as well- you nearly never know what Aegi is running. Mixed? Sacred Sword? Head Smash? If you mispredict what Aegi is running, you'll pay dearly. Bisharp? Sacred Sword. Mandibuzz? Head Smash, which iirc was a decent lure for Mandi back in the day. Also we HAVE been making a big deal about Lando-I; many players have wanted to see it go on the suspect block for some time now; there's no denying that it's overcentralizing in today's OU. Just because we haven't suspected Lando does not mean we should unban Aegi- they are completely different Pokemon.

Oh, one more thing: "it's weak to the most common types in the OU tier." So should we unban Ho-Oh for being 4x weak to SR? Should we unban Ice Arceus for having the worst defensive type in the game? Moreover, Ghost/Steel is far from a bad defensive typing; please don't make me explain why.

 

[Of Moose & Men]

fyi I am also pro ubers on aegi but with other reasons. Aegi was banned from a supportive and centralizing point of view, not from an offensive point of view (it does not sweep teams)
Centralization leads to many teams which are the same (less diversity) which leads to more games decided because of skill instead of matchup. I support a diverse metagame, because teambuilding will be rewarded and there is a big group of viable pokemon to choose from. Both has its downsides of course but I will come back to that point in a few hours

I wasnt referring to its offensive capabilities at all. All i spoke about were its defensive capabilities. I spoke on probably not even a quarter of what made this thing a problem as we can both clearly see. Also, i didn't say it would be less skill based, i said there will still be a match up reliance regardless of what happens. There are enough mons to worry about in OU, we know this, and thats half of what makes match up such a pain in the ass. Now, we've added aegi, let that sink in. so essentially what that boils down to is, teams consist of the following. . . Aegi (to check damn near everything) + thing(s) to kill aegi + 3/4 mons. As you said, it removes the diversity, and that's extremely unfortunate, however, it is not removing the match up reliance. It's still there. Yea, perhaps its suppressed a little bit, but to say it removes it just isn't true Sadly.

 

[Alfalfa]

This argument is flawed as it can be applied to A LOT of mons. I will use your words as an example.


Mega Lopunny

Do you like umbreon? Fast offensive mons? Hydreigon? *Mega Lopunny* makes it unviable

Mega Alataria
Do you like umbreon? Do you like most non scarf mons named ferrothron? *Mega Altaria*

None of those Pokemon are as centralizing as Aegislash. Aegislash controls teambuilding to requiring at least 2-4 team slots to be dedicated towards being able to handle Aegislash. Umbreon suffers for more reasons than just Mega Altaria / Mega Lopunny, since many of the roles it can play are not worth meriting any form of usage in OU, except for checking Aegislash.

 

[teamsnickers]

Guys when discussing this can we just keep from using the 700bst argument...(and the 50/50)
that was the stupidest thing I ever heard on the forums (and thats saying something..)

 

[firehusky]

Don't really agree with this suspect, Aegislash is pretty overcentralizing. Aegislash literally blanket checks like half the meta, mega metagross lacking earthquake, mega gallade (50/50), mega pinsir, mega diancie, the list goes on. It's super unpredictable. Switch in your bisharp? Sacred sword. Mandibuzz? Aegislash learns head smash. With king's shield, aegislash forces a ton of 50 / 50s. Got your mega gallade out, knock off? King's shield. SD? Shadow ball RIP. In XY, this was definitely a very controversial ban but with ORAS, aegislash checks a ton more stuff so I feel like keeping it in ubers is the way to go. Reintroducing aegislash is only going to make the meta even staler, with every team needing to bring multiple checks and counters (depending on its possible sets) to it. I'm definitely going to be voting ban on this one.

 

[Chillarmy]

LIVE BY THE SWORD

Honestly, though, I'm all for bringing Aegis back. Idrc about the "centalization" problem because Aegis wasn't the kind of "top" threat capable of wrapping entire games around itself, and nor mandatory to run on every team. Aegis will save us a ton of time which would otherwise go into "balancing" this shithole tier; seriously, why ban everything else and when we can just push OU to a fairly stable stage with Aegis? Sure, we'll get a rather centralizing threat, but it won't get to the point where, during teambuilding at least, we're dedicating team synergy itself just to circumvent Aegis's overall utility (we also won't lose track of this tier once Gen 7 drops, as we've been doing almost every other gen's OU).

EDIT: Agreeing with teamsnickers here. Can we not not get into the "50/50" or "700 BST" arguments? They were butt in XY and definitely not valid now.

 

[Sucker Lunch]

I would just like to remind everyone that the Aegislash suspect test results were extremely close. Literally the anti-ban and ban sides were like 50/50. So it's not correct to speak as if Aegislash's ban from OU was a dominant majority. Sorry if this post doesn't really contribute, but I've been noticing that people are commenting as if Aegislash had a 70% ban majority or something.

 

[4daptability]

As someone who was on the pro-ban side of Aegislash's suspect test, I actually believe that we didn't give Aegislash a fair trial, especially when it came to voting. I feel that it resulted in a ban mainly because of Aldaron's 24 hour policy regarding the thread especially given the fact that the last two votes were likely to be anti-ban. At the time, we had just banned Deo-S and Deo-D and didn't allow the metagame time to develop and stabilize before testing Aegislash, and the timing was all-around awful.

At the moment, I can't see any potential issues with the potential unbanning of Aegislash, bar the possibility of M-Sableye Stall becoming a dominant force against balanced teambuilds due to the possible lack of offensive Fairy types in general, due to the presence of Aegislash. It might not even become an issue, seeing as though said builds can employ mons like Pursuit Bisharp or Mandibuzz that can be utilized to trap/threaten and wear down opposing Aegislash to help their chances of victory with the help of their M-Sableye check (and that's assuming that the two would both be used on Stall together, which they might not).

I will edit/update this post as I become more familiar with the Aegislash meta, but I think it's safe to say that this thing deserves a fair and unbiased suspect test.

 

[Halcyon.]

Honestly kinda disappointed with the way people have been receiving this test when so many people were saying how excited they were to see Giratina tested. I mean jesus just play the meta for a few days before making #stupidboldedstatements and jumping to conclusions.

I'm kinda upset this was tested before Landorus since it was such a great partner to it, and it's going to make Aegi seem broken by extension when we all know Landorus is the problem. To the people who will inevitably vote to ban it because of its great ability to pair with Zard/Lando/Keld, please remember that Lando is like 100% going to be banned when it gets tested and that other Pursuit users work just as well as Aegi in these roles. But whatever.

I still think this boils down to whether we want a centralized meta or a match up-based one (I made a big ass post about it in the Giratina thread). It's a lesser of two evils thing. And if you honestly think ORAS OU doesn't have too many threats to handle, you're kidding yourself. Play a different meta and you'll see how matchup (while still a thing) is much less of a problem in a meta where extremely relevant threats don't span all the way from OU to RU.

Can't believe I interupted my vacation in Florida for this shit.

 

[thesecondbest]

KEK

Alright, if Aegislash was to be unbanned, tell me, how many things in the metagame would become unviable? Taking a list off the top of my head, Mega Metagross (Would HAVE to run EQ, and even then it's iffy), Celebi, Jirachi, Mega Aerodactyl, Mega Gallade, Mega Scizor, Mega Pinsir would have to run EQ, Breloom, Hawlucha would go to shit... There are just so many decent Pokemon that would be completely unusable. Aegislash was literally on 70-80% of teams when it was allowed, and the metagame has finally adapted to it being gone. Frankly, what we have now is a very stable metagame, with the exception of Lando, and I would hate to ruin that by throwing Aegi in to the mix. It causes an extreme amount of centralization that literally nobody wants. Every team has to be prepared for it. Bringing down broken to handle broken is not a way to handle the metagame, as many people have stated before.

Aegislash relies on a disgusting 50/50 chance to win. You either beat it, or you don't. You either set up thinking it's going to King's Shield and die, or it King's Shields and you're screwed. I get that's not a reason for it to be banned, but I don't really care what people say. Playing a game of stop and go is NOT enjoyable, no matter how much you want it to be.

Then again, it's not particularly hard to handle... if you have plenty of checks to it. It limits team building to an insane degree. I know this is a different metagame from XY, but I would hate to see things like Celebi and Jirachi become complete shit again. I'm leaning towards keeping this banned, but w/e.

the point is not whether aegi/ makes things unviable, it's if it's to broken itself. I can make the same arg about shedinja "every team will need to run a spin blocker and a bisharp. celebi jirachi, megagross..." you get the point. It's not about if it beats too much, its about if too little beats it. So thats why i think it isnt broken. It has no reliable recovery, so on stall you have to pass it wishes or heal bell after it rests. Landos beat it, chomp beats it, it cant beat keld most of the time, bisharp and zard eat it for breakfast... so it can never pull off a sweep effectively. Its best role is king shield 3 attacks, and the only argument there is 50-50s are op. But then why haven't we banned thunder wave? Twave is a risk free move that benefits you 25% of the time. King shield might give them a free set up turn, but with twave it doesnt matter since you'll be faster next turn to compensate. I'll agree with you that aegislash is good, but good in a way that helps it check the metagame and make sure stuff like megagross and altaria aren't too broken, not good in a way that lets it beat the whole tier. TL;DR VOTE NO BAN FREE AEGISLASH 2015
(oh and if aegislash stays we can get mawile to stay <3)
(and if you're worried about lando i and char y then we bring back giratina, which this helps balance. And this will check the faries that beat tina. It all comes together perfectly <3)

 

[TheKingKarp]

holy crap im excited to see the OU metagame finally going back to being a decent metagame....
sure its a bit overcentralizing (not as bad as some other mons imo) but it was one the glue of the tier during XY. After its ban the metagame slowly disintegrated to trappers+ sweepers and now we just have an honestly pretty shitty metagame which is heavily matchup based. I wanted Aegi to never get banned but instead of just yelling at each other lets just see how it works in the tier and have fun. Good luck everybody :] #freethesword

EDIT: In response to the 50/50 match up problem, U turn and sucker punch are pretty much the same. Will the bisharp sucker punch or pursuit my Lati? will the lando u turn or eq? its still a 50/50 just beceause its aegislash doesnt make the 50/50 "worse" people need to understand this, keep an open mind to a new mon just bc it was banned before doesn't crazy now. Please stay respectful

 

[B0bGary]

"Omg how beautiful Aegislash is not OP is just skill reliant"
>Attack
>Tap King's Shield
>Repeat
Lol

Also Aegi is not OP is overcentralizing which is a lot different
Do you expect it to have low usage given that he checks/counters basically all the popular mons rn bar Landos and Keldeo? This shit is literally capable of beating any playstyle due to its movepool, stats and typing, has no true counters and forces you to limit teambuilding while not making the tier benefit for its presence at all.
Idk why people keep saying it would be wealthy, I hope you guys change your mind while laddering.

>Attack
>Tap King's Shield
>Repeat

If you believe that's how to use an Aegislash, then how is it hard to predict? If you are versing an unskilled player that uses moves in that order, it is very easy to work around. A good Aegislash user would mix it up, attacking when you think it will shield. Also, I you say it's a 50/50 chance of a player shielding or attacking, think about this situation:

I have a Mega Sceptile in red health. I'm versing a Bisharp with sucker punch. I outspeed Bisharp, so if I use an attack I can kill, but if he uses sucker punch on the turn I attack it's all over. I have to use substitute on the turns I predict him to use sucker punch. Eventually I will have to attack and so will he.

That's the same type of prediction that happens with Aegislash. So I don't understand how you can think Aegi play is not skill related.

 

[Alfalfa]

holy crap im excited to see the OU metagame finally going back to being a decent metagame....
sure its a bit overcentralizing (not as bad as some other mons imo) but it was one the glue of the tier during XY. After its ban the metagame slowly disintegrated to trappers+ sweepers and now we just have an honestly pretty shitty metagame which is heavily matchup based. I wanted Aegi to never get banned but instead of just yelling at each other lets just see how it works in the tier and have fun. Good luck everybody :] #freethesword

I disagree. Aegislash had a very negative presence in the metagame due to how much it limited teambuilding. Sure, there are a plentiful amount of threats to handle in OU, but people are still fully capable of making teams that are capable to standing up to the plethora of threats that have to be prepared for in OU. It has been pretty clear over the past 8-10 months that we do not want a metagame centralized around a couple of threats that make a countless number of Pokemon unviable simply by these top threats existing.. The byproduct of this is usually a metagame that is match-up dependent, but that does not mean the metagame is impossible to win with a match-up disadvantage, excluding HO-based teams that are usually very vulnerable to select playstyles, such as rain offense.

 

[RichieTheGarchomp]

After a almost a year gone, Aegi is being suspected. See, I really fangirl'ed Aegi to come back to OU (I joined a few months before aegi was banned, you see.) but now going into deeper thought about it i can see why it wouldn't be that welcoming to OU. It has gained checks and counters since it left the stage, some like Sashgar (and full hp lo gar in some cases), MSab, MPedo, MGallade (it sd's on the switchin and KO's with Knock off. Sadly, it cant ko without rocks if max defense investment) MLop, etc. Sadly, Aegi's presence is still too overwhelming. MMeta will probably be mid A rank, a whole bunch of mons will lose viability (MGarde, Rachi, and the others) and it just checks so much shit.

I dont want it back just because it will make the meta shittier then it is already. dont wanna type much because it really didnt change that much, in fact it checks more then it did in XY.