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Dec 20th, 2012, 11:04:48 AM
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#1 | ||
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winter is coming
     
Super Moderator
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 2,329
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Kaleidoscope
Kaleidoscope ♪ Overview       Introduction Hello, Smogon. I'll begin this by saying that this team is kind of modest in terms of ladder accomplishments; having only peaked the UU Suspect ladder at top 3 by going like 42-5 (I haven't laddered with it since). However, other good players who I've shared this team with (Bloo, Jabba, and McMeghan have all used it a bit) have done pretty well with it, and since I sure as hell am not going to use a team that got leaked in #genvuu for SPL, I decided to just post it. The name "Kaleidoscope" was picked because for one, its a great song, and also because the color scheme of my six Pokemon reminded me of one. The premise of the team is actually really basic: overload the opposition with special attackers to break down their defenses and have one of them sweep eventually--which is why I ended up with six specially based Pokemon. This is a concept I wanted to try for a while now, and around the time I posted Strobe I was in a team-building mood, so that's when the first draft of this team was created. Over the course of the past couple of months, however, the team slowly morphed into what it is today, miraculously managing to keep its theme intact. Although to be honest, I don't think its at its best just yet, so feel free to suggest changes and whatnot; who knows? maybe I overlooked something you might think of. Anyway, let's get into the team before my introduction bores you to death. In Detail  Azelf
 Nidoqueen
 Venomoth
 Zapdos
 Chandelure
 Kingdra
Final Look
      Conclusion There really isn't much else to say about the team itself, so I'll keep this short. First, I'd like to give you some pointers on how to properly use this team in case you decide to try it for yourself (there's an importable below). The most important thing to do is to keep the team's goal in mind: "overload the opposition with special attackers". This means that it's okay to sacrifice one, two, or even three team members to weaken a special wall to the point where another Pokemon can sweep (most likely Kingdra, in such cases). Although you have to keep in mind that while this team isn't meant to take hits, but rather dish them out, sometimes you have to keep certain team members alive at all costs; use the team preview to your advantage here, its really a big help. Speaking of team preview, take full advantage of it when using this team; you need to create, at minimum, a rough game plan before sending out your lead, not doing so will most likely lead to a loss. Anyway, that's all I have to say, but if you have any questions, feel free to ask. Thanks for reading! Major Threats Quote:
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 Last edited by kokoloko; Dec 25th, 2012 at 12:58:05 AM. |
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Weavile - This fucker is the number one threat to the team for sure. This is mostly due to my utter lack of Dark-type resistances and the fact that two of the Pokemon bulky enough to take a Night Slash are hit super effectively by Ice Punch. If you see one of these on the opposing team, you have to keep Chandelure alive and with its Scarf for as long as you can or set up with Venomoth before it can sweep you.
Snorlax - Curse variants are the biggest problem; Choice Band ones get worn down quickly and RestTalk ones are only annoying once you force them to Rest. CurseLax, however, can set up on pretty much the whole team and cause enough damage to create an uphill battle for me before going down.
Rhyperior - I have Nidoqueen to switch into Stone Edge / Rock Blast and Zapdos to switch into Earthquake, both of which do massive damage to it, but this requires perfect prediction on my part, which is something I like to avoid. The best way to keep it from hurting the team to much is to not let it come in more than once, but even that's kinda hard to do.
Houndoom - Similar to Weavile in the sense that it hits everything neutrally with Dark-types STAB and has a secondary STAB to hit bulky things even harder. Zapdos being faster helps against it now.
Krookodile - Until very recently, I had never gotten swept by a Choice Scarf Krookodile with this team, but this speaks only to how rare it is on the ladder. In reality, its one of the team's biggest weaknesses, because a single kill from Crunch means I get swept. Even more annoying is the fact that if its Jolly it outspeeds even Venomoth at +1, so its really hard to play around.
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Dec 20th, 2012, 3:47:02 PM
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#2 |
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 586
St. Louis, MO
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Hi kokoloko,
This is an extremely good team, I've been staring at it for quite some time trying to come up with meaningful changes, but am not coming up with much. Swampert fixes most of your problem Pokemon but it isn't like that fits into this team at all lol. I'll just leave some minor nitpicks for you to consider. On Venomoth you should be using Bug Buzz instead of Sludge Bomb. Sludge Bomb loses out on the Nidos (as well as every Steel) while Bug Buzz only loses to Chandelure, who can be slept or dealt with through the proper switch. On Zapdos you could consider a moveset of Thunderbolt / HP Ice / Roost / Baton Pass. You retain great coverage, especially considering you mostly just nuke stuff with Tbolt anyway. Baton Pass in the 4th slot is a pretty evil way to retain boosts in the face of a counter. You could go back to Venomoth and continue to set up on something like Raikou (more of a paper threat, but still requires good prediction to beat with your team as is), or pass to another sweeper to continue beating up on your opponent's team. Finally, on Kingdra I suggest using max speed Timid. The minor increase in bulk you currently use isn't really worth it considering you hold Life Orb anyway, and it sucks to lose to max speed 85s pre RD / QD, or to not at least force the speed tie with Scarfcross with a QD boost or opposing max speed Kingdra under Rain. Your team doesn't seem to really struggle against defensive builds at all, but using max speed on Kingdra (and even potentially Zapdos) could give you the upper hand on opposing offensive teams. Special walls will already be weakened by the time Kingdra takes the stage, so the slight loss in power shouldn't hurt you. Great team! |
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Dec 21st, 2012, 3:10:42 AM
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#3 |
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you know you loved me, xoxo
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 817
elsewhere
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Hey kokojoko!!!!!
Right away, it's pretty obvious that anything with QuakeEdge coverage is seriously messing up the team. Nothing you have is really switching into stuff like CB Flygon (carrying Stone Edge), Rhyperior, or even random Krookodile all that easily. In addition, physical Virizion isn't ever going to sweep you, but you'll be hard pressed to handle repeated switch-ins from it, especially with Stealth Rock down. The fact that it can freely switch in against Kingdra isn't that great for you either. Finally, general strong Pokemon like CB Crobat are pretty problematic for you if Stealth Rock is down, since they'll be forcing you to sacrifice things to bring in your checks. Overall, basically all of these problems can be handled pretty well without Stealth Rock being up, so there are a couple things that you might want to try out. While it's undeniably a really weird option, you could try something like Offensive Blastoise over Kingdra. Something like Hydro Pump / Hidden Power Electric / Ice Beam / Rapid Spin seems pretty cool, and while it doesn't really give you a solid option to use against Hail, having a spinner, especially one offensive enough to consistently get spin rocks away throughout the game, is really nice for you. Offensive Blastoise also beats basically all of the offensive spinblockers in the UU metagame right now, and since your team wrecks all defensive teams, that's really all you need to be able to do. Anyways, basically everything else is just minor nitpicks. Grass Knot is a slightly better option for Azelf than Thunderbolt, hitting Blastoise for only a bit less, while having the benefit of handling Rhyperior, Swampert, and Krookodile, something that Thunderbolt + Psyshock doesn't really give you the option to do. I'd also drop Sludge Bomb for Bug Buzz, as Bug Buzz gets better coverage on a fair amount of UU, and you're neither outspeeding nor killing Darmanitan and Victini with Sludge Bomb anyhow, so it's basically useless. Finally, while this is more of a personal preference than anything else, I'd suggest swapping Nidoqueen's Fire Blast with Flamethrower, which KOs the majority of the things that Fire Blast did (and with Focus Blast the coverage is somewhat redundant anyhow). Anyways excellent team koko! |
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Dec 21st, 2012, 6:36:03 AM
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#4 |
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Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 2
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Why are you choosing Nidoqueen over Nidoking? In my opinion, for LO Sweeping Nidoking is much better than Queen.
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Dec 21st, 2012, 6:56:50 AM
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#5 |
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 612
With Xerneas, in the Garden of Eden
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Well Queen is much bulkier than King, so it can generally live longer. Also, I agree with Friar that Venomoth should have Bug Buzz instead of Sludge Bomb as it allows you to hit Steels.
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Bearkiller on PS and IRC. May also go by the name of Grima on IRC. I play League of Legends, so there's that. Also free Genesect plz. My LP. |
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Dec 21st, 2012, 7:07:22 AM
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#6 |
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,467
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for some reason i remember i used to running hp water over hp grass on Zapdos (when i still played UU, which is a loooooooongass time ago). i forgot why but it probably had better coverage or something.
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nyuu~ This is the world we live in
And these are the hands we're given Use them and lets start trying To make it a place worth living in. |
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Dec 21st, 2012, 11:24:20 AM
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#7 |
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gone (?)
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 735
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the team's pretty solid, i liked it! but, offensively speaking, don't you sort of have low physical power? your entire team is specially based, I can see it having problems in taking down stuff like Snorlax and other special walls. and defensively, as you said, it lacks dark resistances.
well, the only change i can think of is using a SR Cobalion of a Jolly Nature, with 244 HP / 72 Def / 192 Speed evs, over Azelf, so you can deal with Snorlax (and you can beat CurseLax if you use Taunt on it), Weavile (I think you can survive a couple of Low Kicks), and at least revenge kill Houndoom, while still having a SR user. on the Rhyperior issue, well, it's probably impossible to reliably counter the rock rhino without prediction, and you can revenge it with Kingdra, so i don't really think it's that much of a threat... |
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Dec 21st, 2012, 4:01:14 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 65
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Quote:
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Dec 21st, 2012, 5:31:45 PM
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#9 |
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 53
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Edit: Trying to help is unappreciated here.
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Known as Shahnaz on PS/PO Sometimes, a song is all you need to instantly like a game. This is one of those songs: 'Bastion'-Build that wall Found the best Song of Healing ever made: Theophany -Terrible Fate Last edited by LionKingMax; Dec 23rd, 2012 at 1:31:41 PM. |
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Dec 21st, 2012, 5:56:46 PM
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#10 | |
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dreams of ladybugs crushed forever
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 5,366
five years here and i can't change my custom title :(
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Quote:
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i was nobody we're all a little bit strange, don't worry about it |
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Dec 21st, 2012, 10:21:52 PM
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#11 | |
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dreams of ladybugs crushed forever
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 5,366
five years here and i can't change my custom title :(
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Cobalion @ Expert Belt Trait: Justified EVs: 76 Atk / 200 SAtk / 232 Spd Naive Nature - Sacred Sword - Hidden Power [Ice] - Volt Switch - Stealth Rock It's quite simple - I wanted Cobalion to be a viable lead that got up Stealth Rock, beat Curselax and Weavile, and still be useful in other situations. Sacred Sword is the only physical attack on your team and it is used to negate the need for Taunt to beat Curse Snorlax - guaranteed 2HKO with these EVs. HP Ice surprises Gligar and Flygon with nice damage, a OHKO on the latter, and a OHKO on the former if it gets a Quiver Dance. Volt Switch is just a great move and I think it's worth giving up Taunt to use. The only leads this can't handle that Azelf could set up on would be Scarf Darm / Victini. Those leads are good set up fodder for Rain Dance Kingdra though, so why not? Edit: Seriously, this Cobalion really rounds out your team. While Azelf is great I usually let it die pretty early. This Cobalion can stick around if it needs to and punch things in the face. Feel free to run Close Combat if you want to do actual damage to a few more Pokemon though.
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i was nobody we're all a little bit strange, don't worry about it Last edited by cim; Dec 22nd, 2012 at 9:20:29 AM. |
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Dec 22nd, 2012, 12:18:28 PM
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#12 |
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winter is coming
Super Moderator
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 2,329
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Thanks for the responses everyone, I'll try to reply to all of you in this post.
Friar, thanks for the rate. I actually use switch back and forth between Bug Buzz and Sludge Bomb every so often (I probably should have mentioned that), and they both have their advantages. I like the idea of Baton Pass on Zapdos actually, but the problem is I really kind of need Hidden Power Grass on it to try and prevent Swampert / Rhyperior from setting Stealth Rock early-mid game. About Kingdra, the problem with going Timid is that the 10% loss in power is actually a lot,especially when I'm already trying to avoid using Hydro Pump as much as possible. Windsong, interesting suggestion, but the main problem with it is that Blastoise can't even begin to compare to Kingdra offensively. Besides, Rapid spin isn't all that important when you're preventing early-game Spikes via Taunt and mid-game Spikes via offensive pressure. This ins't the type of team that should give the opponent any room to do shit like that. Grass Knot is something I've heavily considered before, but the problem is that it fails to 2HKO even 252/0 Blastoise like Thunderbolt does; which is important because Chandelure can't block against it. I'll probably try it out anyway, though. NoirEtBlanc, the reason I use Nidoqueen is because I don't use it solely as a QuiverPass recipient, but also as a mid-game tank. Chieliee, Hidden Power Water hits Rotom-H and Steelix, but misses out on Swampert, which is a more important target for this team. Blue_Star, as Warb said, the whole point of the team is using all special attackers. As for your (and cim's) suggestion, something you two aren't considering is that Cobalion fails to outpace Froslass and that it adds even more to the teams Ground- weakness. It won't help me gain/conserve momentum nearly as well as Azelf, which is not something I'm keen on giving up. LionKingMax, you really should play the game more if you're saying a team with Venomoth, Nidoqueen, Chandelure, and Zapdos is weak to Heracross. That's all I can say about you. Thanks everyone! EDIT: I got wind that Wonder Skin blocks Roar/Taunt 50% of the time on Pokemon Showdown, but I had my suspicions that it was a glitch. So V4 tested it in-game for me, and it turns out its true, so protip: use Wonder Skin on Venomoth.
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Last edited by kokoloko; Dec 22nd, 2012 at 1:52:07 PM. |
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Dec 22nd, 2012, 7:14:15 PM
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#13 |
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 281
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Yes this team actually has a shitload of weaknesses like rd kingdra which ohkos and outspeeds all your guys after set up but you'll be extremely hard pressed to find time to exploit these weaknesses if you try to set up against like zapdos you're getting brutally ohkod or at best you'll die to one turn of lo recoil (now i would be interested to see how you deal with mystic water rd kingdra hehe). if you want to say this team is weak to pokemon x because pokemon x can sweep after just one turn of set up, look carefully at the team and see if pokemon x can actually set up anywhere. i would guess apart from guys like bisharp (who will always shit on offensive teams because sd+sucker punch+lots of resists) you actually can't set up pokemon x.
That said kokoloko i think your team is weak to fast specs and band users like cb crobat which can ohko almost everyone on your team and even zapdos gets 2hko if your opp can get sr up after a turn of lo recoil (not as hard as you make it seem i would think, with azelf at least they get rocks up half the time). this could be fixed somewhat by simply changing chandelure to timid so he can outspeed and maul crobat (bb recoil would kill him if fire blast doesn't). You say timid "just doesn't hit hard enough" but unless you need modest for something specific then I would strongly suggest Timid (because honestly Chandelure will always hit at least fairly hard). This team is pretty solid but I wish you didn't have to keep on playing aggressively to check threats, some guys simply can't be beat like that like SD Pass Ninjask which might sound noobish but it could probably pass to something and just kill you.
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find me at chess.com !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! username= dA_pIFSTER |
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Dec 23rd, 2012, 1:17:51 PM
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#14 |
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winter is coming
Super Moderator
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 2,329
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Crobat is not usually a problem because 1. CB ones are rare, and 2. Zapdos tanks it with no problems if Stealth Rock isn't up (and the chances of there being SR up and them having CB Crobat are pretty low).
About Chandelure, I don't exactly remember which KO it was that I wanted modest for but I think it was vs 0/4 Mew with Shadow Ball. I'll do some calcs and get back at you. That said, you're right, every offensive team is kind of weak to fast powerful Pokemon; and yeah opposing RD Kingdra destroy me now that I think about it... I think I'll max out mine's Speed to at least have a chance against them. I'm also considering going 252+ Speed on Zapdos for a couple reasons: one, to be faster than all Scarf Heracross and Darmanitan at +1, and to be faster than Houndoom. I'll do some testing and probably add a change log to the OP. Thanks for the reply, pif. EDIT: Yeah, here's some calcs vs things it commonly hits: Shadow Ball vs 0 / 4 Mew: 83.3% - 98.5% with Timid; 91.5% - 107.9% with Modest. Shadow Ball vs 252 / 0 Swampert: 38.6% - 45.5% with Timid; 41.8% - 49.8% with Modest. Shadow Ball vs 252 / 0 Blastoise: 37.6% - 44.8% with Timid; 41.4% - 48.9% with Modest. Shadow Ball vs 248 / 244 Rhyperior: 37.4% - 44.3% with Timid; 41.1% - 48.5% with Modest. The most important one obviously being Mew, but weakening phazers to the point where they are OHKO'd by Venomoth is cool too.
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Last edited by kokoloko; Dec 23rd, 2012 at 2:10:07 PM. |
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Dec 23rd, 2012, 2:12:48 PM
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#15 |
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Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 234
Santa Fe, Argentina
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OK this is a great team, I've seen it in action being used by cim and it has amazing sweeping potential in almost every one of its members.
That said, there are some suggestions that I can do that may be worth it, one is running enough Speed on Nidoqueen to creep on 144 Speed EVs Crobat, since it's kind of a benchmark for her. The problem with this is that she's forced to run 224 Speed EVs with a neutral nature, which really cuts her bulk. That said, she can still tank Scarf Hera's hits with ease and burn it to the ground. It's up to you. I really think you should run enough Speed on Zapdos to outpace Scarf Hera and Darmanitan at +1, you could settle for Jolly Hera and put the rest into HP, then again you can simply go with max Timid to also get the jump on Jolly Darm (though I'm not sure how common they are). Iirc, though, max Speed neutral base 100s outspeed positive nature base 85s and all Rotom-A, that way you can continue running a Modest nature to strike everything hard at +1. About Chandelure, yea with a Modest nature it gets a guaranteed OHKO on 0/4 Mew after SR, with a Timid nature it'll only happen 11 out of 16 times. Feel free to make that decision though, I've always thought that Chandy should run Modest to make full use of its amazing Special Attack stat, but I guess outspeeding max Speed base 130s is kind of a big deal, especially considering a well played CB Crobat, however rare it may be, can really threaten your team if Zapdos isn't healthy enough. Anyway amazing team once again, kokoloko. I really like it how most hazard setters really struggle to set up against you, since that way you can keep your field clean and get an easier sweep (Taunt Aerodactyl screws you over, though :P) Luvdisc'd PS: Amazing use of Memento on Scarf Chandy, I've seen it in action and it's completely game changing! Also, #venomothforubers2013, make it happen lol |
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Dec 24th, 2012, 3:16:32 PM
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#16 |
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Bakuman ;<
  
Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 7,186
Bergenfield
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Powerful team, kokoloko, and a beautiful RMT to match! Azelf SR lead is among the most solid ones out there - definitely keep it! I personally prefer LO on mine since it can actually hurt shit with it, but it's up to you. Don't change TBolt to Grass Knot; the power drop is quite notable (ie you fail to 2HKO Blastoise now). I guess Life Orb would help compensate, though.
I agree with cim in the Cobalion choice. It gives you a strong answer to Weavile and Snorlax, as well as preventing Krookodile from spamming Crunch. I suggest CM LO Cobalion over Nidoqueen, though, since nothing sets up rocks as well as Azelf, and I believe Cobalion is a fine replacement as a bulky CM recipient. It has STAB Focus Blast to punch holes through Snorlax and Umbreon and complement well with its STAB Flash Cannon and HP Rock. Since its defense is already colossal, pass it a few CM boosts and it would be nearly untouchable.  Cobalion @ Life Orb | JustifiedTimid | 20 HP / 252 SpA / 236 Spe ~ Focus Blast ~ Flash Cannon ~ Calm Mind ~ Hidden Power Rock Another idea with which you may want to fool around: Specially Mixed Emboar & CM Meloetta. Emboar provides perfect resistance against both Houndoom and Weavile, as well as halting Krookodile's Moxie sweep with Crunch; it can lure in Rhyperior / Swampert and destroy them with Grass Knot, and says "fuck no" to Umbreon and Snorlax with its STAB Fighting assaults. It has 65 base Speed, just fast enough to be faster than Adamant Honchkrow with +ve Speed Nature, and 100 base SpA, high enough special stat to make use of QDs.  Emboar @ Life Orb | BlazeNaive | 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe ~ Fire Blast ~ Grass Knot ~ Superpower ~ Focus Blast Note: Expert Belt may be used to preserve Emboar's bulk. No Atk needed to OHKO Empoleon, Umbreon and Snorlax with Superpower (even with Expert Belt!) If you are to fit Emboar, it'll most likely be over Chandelure. Emboar checks most of the threats you mentioned outside of NP Azelf, which is why I mention pairing it with CM Meloetta, who can tank their hits with ease and destroy NP Azelf and Mew with a super effective Shadow Ball. Meloetta would most likely have to replace Nidoqueen, which means you lose your Stone Edge resist, but with Emboar replacing Chandelure, Rhyperior would have very few opportunities to throw out a hit, imo. You may want to go with Grass Knot on Azelf, though.  Meloetta @ Life Orb / Leftovers | Serene GraceModest or Timid | 252 SpA / 252 Spe ~ Psychic ~ Calm Mind ~ Shadow Ball ~ Focus Blast As for minor fixes, I suggest Leftovers on Zapdos. This way Zapdos can preserve its bulk and can spend more time attacking rather than Roosting. Zapdos already hits like a truck already. Hopefully leftovers would help to keep Zapdos healthy enough to tank CB Brave Birds. Definitely keep HP Grass; the last thing you want is Rhyperior to pin down the thunderbird or Swampert from phazing away Zapdos after receiving CM boosts. Also, I feel embarrassed suggesting this, since I'm pretty sure you have tried it out already, but Focus Sash on Venomoth might be an item worth testing out. Focus Sash can be a difference of surviving hits from Scarf Darmanitan / Scarf Flygon and nabbing that second or third QD boost that will then be passed to one of your special sweepers. Anyways, sorry for the big rate, but these are mere suggestions rather than a strong recommendation or anything of the sort - thanks for sharing your powerful team! |
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Dec 24th, 2012, 7:21:52 PM
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#17 |
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dreams of ladybugs crushed forever
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 5,366
five years here and i can't change my custom title :(
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I don't see much of a problem with the Froslass matchup, Koko. If they have one, just lead Chandelure, or even Wonder Skin Venomoth - if Taunt connects, they get just one layer of Spikes and you bring Chandelure in completely free.
As for CM Cob, yup, it beats Snorlax / Weavile and does a lot better with Quiver Dances but I just can't stand missing. Koko clearly hates missing just as much as me seeing as he's running two water moves on Kingdra koko i would encourage you to play a small handful of matches with cobalion and fuck with his moveset (and the teammate he replaces)- he's not an All Star like azelf is but he really rounds out your team and can run a virtually identical set, plus Volt Switch at least helps keep SOME momentum. another ground weakness fucking sucks though. too bad rotom-h isn't a ghost... I haven't been able to bring myself to give up Life Orb on Zapdos. You still just miss the KO on some Water / Grounds unboosted as is. I would leave Nidoqueen as is - she has little to fear from Crobat anyway
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i was nobody we're all a little bit strange, don't worry about it |
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Dec 26th, 2012, 1:02:04 PM
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#18 |
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 206
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Fantastic team. This remains the only team on the UU ladder to beat mine (I was the guy with the rest/talk Snorlax who kept complaining cause sleep talk didn't pick the moves I needed it to). I honestly don't have any advice except to refute some of the inputs provided by others, specifically those advocating Cobalion instead of Nidoqueen. Nidoqueen is a much better baton pass recipient for two reasons: no life orb recoil, and a much better special movepool. Cobalion's movepool is limited to Focus Blast (very unreliable), Flash Cannon (poor attack type), Volt Switch (weak and forces you to lose your boosts), and Hidden Power (weak). Nidoqueen can hit pretty much anything for super effective damage using Sheer Force boosted moves and it can destroy everything else by a 135 base power, no drawback, STAB Earth Power. Once you pull off the Quiver Dance pass to Nidoqueen it's pretty much already game over unless the opponent has a scarf Flygon or something. The lack of life orb recoil makes up for Cobalion's bulkier defenses.
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Dec 26th, 2012, 6:26:01 PM
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#19 |
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 88
Chirac, Fuck Yeah.
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I really agree for the last Major Threat, the mighty Scarfed Krookodile.
But as long as you keep Zapdos full health, it will be no longer a problem. In fact, I faced this team playing a friend, and I had ScarfKrook in my team, but Zapdos forced it to Stone Edge / Crunch, which are both held by Nidoqueen. So yeah the team is pretty nice, and also not so difficult to use because when you play it you immediately see the main goal. It shows us how to make a good team in a simple but difficult to apply concept. I think it deserves a lovdisc. Hoping it will be in the Archives. PS: I enjoyed a lot the lead too, which provides you a very good matchup most of the time. The lead is still useful, even in 5th gen, yep!
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LGI LESLIES Last edited by da hui; Dec 26th, 2012 at 6:56:19 PM. |
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Jan 2nd, 2013, 12:55:20 AM
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#20 |
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winter is coming
Super Moderator
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 2,329
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Thanks for the continued replies, guys, I really do appreciate it.
I've been testing some stuff out lately (mostly the things I have listed under Possible Changes in the OP, but some other stuff that's been suggested by people here as well) and to be honest, every time I change what I have in the OP, the offensive synergy of the team either decreases or falls apart completely. Before I forget, Cobalion over Nidoqueen is terrible for a few reasons, but mostly because you now flat-out lose to SubCM Raikou and get hammered to shit by Zapdos. A couple notes: I really wish Grass Knot hit Blastoise for 100 BP; it would be 100% better than Thunderbolt for this team if it did. Wonder Skin is really fucking good. Its gotten me out of tight situations like Venomoth vs. Venomoth after mine had already put something else to sleep (and made me be able to reliably set up on dumb ladder shit like Confuse Ray Dusclops, lol). Not to mention Its already been at least twice that I ended up beating Blastoise / Swampert 1 on 1 because it missed Roar against Venomoth.
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