Blastoise (Update)

I nabbed this from Thund91 after it hadn't been updated in a while, so it was definitely a joint effort. I made the changes listed below and hopefully did a decent job of combing through it for errors and mentions of Roserade :P . I've been extremely busy with school as of late, so I've been a bit less efficient than I would have liked (I haven't gotten lazy), but that's life I guess.


http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/blastoise

Changes:

• Rewrote every set, reflecting new UU.
  [*]Removed Choice Band set, gave it mention in Other Options.
  [*]Added team options, reflecting new UU.
  [*]Rewrote all other sections.
• Made changes to wording/comments.
  [*]Changed sections to reflect current UU metagame.
  [*]Added truncated paragraphs and Overview section.
  [*]Added Choice Scarf and Rest Talk Shuffler set.

Analysis by Thund91 & Diesel
----------------------------------------------------------------------

[Overview]

<p>Despite competition from bulkier Waters and a plethora of Rapid Spinners, Blastoise remains a staple Pokemon of the UU tier. Its main purpose is as a Rapid Spinner, which it does very well with its strong defenses and great typing. Its excellent movepool allows it to serve other functions, however, including offensive and stall-based variants.</p>

[SET]
name: Utility
move 1: Surf
move 2: Rapid Spin
move 3: Toxic / Yawn / Foresight
move 4: Ice Beam / Roar / Rest
item: Leftovers
ability: Torrent
nature: Bold
evs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 6 SpA

[SET COMMENTS]

<p>Blastoise is one of a handful of Pokemon gifted with the ever-useful Rapid Spin, and because of its bulk and great defensive typing it can easily find the opportunity to use it. It has little trouble switching in on common walls and using Rapid Spin to blow away any entry hazards the opponent has set up. In addition to Rapid Spin, it has a number of good options for further team support such as Roar and Toxic, as well as good offensive type coverage provided by Surf and Ice Beam. Blastoise makes a great teammate because of its versatility and ability to deal with a large variety of Pokemon.</p>

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

<p>Surf is Blastoise's main form of STAB, and a no-brainer on any bulky Water. The last two slots are not as straight forward, as Blastoise's excellent movepool allows it to take a few routes to support its team. Toxic is a great option for wearing down fellow bulky Waters and other walls. Yawn is also a decent choice to put an enemy to sleep or force a switch. Foresight allows Blastoise to be a more dedicated Rapid Spinner, as it will be able to use Rapid Spin against Ghost-types. It still must be weary of Thunderbolt from Mismagius and Rotom, however. Ice Beam allows Blastoise to actually do something to Grass-types that switch in on it. If you opt for Toxic in the third slot, Roar is an option to scout the enemy's team, rack up entry hazard damage, and prevent stat boosters from setting up. Protect is also an option in the last slot, as it can help scout out Choice users, and allows for an extra turn of Leftovers recovery while working well alongside both Toxic and Yawn. Rest deserves a mention as well, as Blastoise unfortunately lacks an instant recovery move.</p>

<p>Ghost- and Grass-types are the bane of Blastoise. Ghost-type Pokemon prevent Blastoise from Rapid Spinning successfully, assuming it does not have Foresight. Spiritomb has the defenses to take Surf easily, while Mismagius and Rotom both threaten with Thunderbolt. Specially defensive variants of Registeel, Spiritomb, and Arcanine all work very well in tandem with Blastoise, walling Ghost-types when outfitted with the proper moves. Additionally, Blastoise can double switch to a Pursuit user to rid itself of Mismagius and Rotom, a role that can be filled by Spiritomb, Drapion, or Skuntank. Meanwhile, Grass-types like Venusaur and Leafeon can switch into Blastoise easily and attack or Swords Dance. Altaria is one of the best switch-ins to Venusaur, as it does not fear any of its attacks, and can absorb Sleep Powder thanks to Natural Cure. Venusaur itself also makes a great switch-in to Grass-types, although it must be wary of Hidden Power Ice or Fire. Arcanine and Moltres can also switch in on Grass-types and scare them off. Fire-types will also benefit greatly from Blastoise due to their weakness to Stealth Rock. Rest Talk Arcanine works especially well, as it can absorb Sleep Powder and Toxic. From there it can use Sleep Talk to pummel opponents with Flare Blitz or shuffle them with Roar to allow entry hazards to chip away at their HP.</p>

<p>Although not mandatory, a Wish user can prolong Blastoise's presence tremendously. Leafeon makes a great partner because it resists Blastoise's weakness to Grass and Electric, while Blastoise resists Leafeon's Fire and Ice weaknesses. Chansey and Clefable can fill the same role and also provide a special wall for your team. Clerics are also good friends of Blastoise since it fears status moves, especially Toxic. They are also great if you are running Rest in the last slot and don't want to leave Blastoise vulnerable.</p>

[SET]
name: Rest Talk Shuffler
move 1: Surf
move 2: Rest
move 3: Sleep Talk
move 4: Roar
item: Leftovers
ability: Torrent
nature: Bold
evs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 6 SpA

[SET COMMENTS]

<p>This set takes a completely different approach to using Blastoise, while keeping it in the defensive role to which it is accustomed. The "Rest Talk" strategy not only gives Blastoise a way to heal itself, but also allows it to absorb the status moves it normally loathes. Meanwhile, Roar is used to shuffle opponents, allowing entry hazards to take their toll while Blastoise tanks hits. Roar also makes Blastoise extremely difficult to set up on, which opponents will inevitably attempt to do once Blastoise uses Rest. Conveniently, Sleep Talk also overrides Roar's -5 priority, meaning it can phaze slower opponents before they can attack. Surf's STAB and neutral type coverage make it a great attack to use with this set, and will allow Blastoise to wear down opponents in its sleep.</p>

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

<p>This set functions well on any team that incorporates Spikes and Stealth Rock, although it functions best on a stall team where it can be supported by other defensive Pokemon. Even without entry hazards, however, it still serves multiple useful purposes. Roar makes it a great phazer, and its bulk allows it to take many boosted physical attacks and then force the opponent to flee. It is especially useful against Curse and Calm Mind users, such as Registeel, Slowbro, and Miltank, that may prove difficult to take down with attacks. Rest allows it to function as the team's status absorber and in addition to removing Roar's negative priority, using Rest and Sleep Talk makes Blastoise very difficult to take down, especially for opposing stall teams.</p>

<p>It is worth noting that Rapid Spin can replace Roar, but doing so changes the function and purpose of the set completely. With Rapid Spin, Blastoise plays much like it does in the Utility set, but with the addition of a recovery move and the omission of a status move. Stray away from replacing Roar with Ice Beam or Toxic, as Milotic can use these significantly better.</p>

<p>Pairing entry hazards with this set is imperative to its usefulness; without them, Blastoise is simply killing time. There are plenty of options available for Stealth Rock users, but Registeel is one of the best at handling Blastoise's weaknesses. Do not expect to find a Spiker in UU that pairs well with Blastoise defensively, as there really isn't one. For this reason, Spikers like Omastar, Qwilfish, and Cloyster are best used in the lead slot.</p>

<p>Grass- and Electric-types, as well as other powerful special attackers like Alakazam and Mismagius, need to be removed for Blastoise to be truly effective, although it does enjoy Roaring them away when they try to switch in. Chansey is, of course, the best Pokemon in the tier at walling special threats, and does so with ease. Additionally, it can utilize Aromatherapy to shorten Blastoise's slumber. The aforementioned specially defensive variants of Registeel, Spiritomb, and Arcanine all make for great checks to Blastoise's common switch-ins. Rest Talk Weezing does an excellent job at walling Grass-types, and can be used in tandem with Blastoise to shut down almost all physical sweepers in the tier. Venusaur also provides great synergy with Blastoise, and can handle both Grass- and Electric-types while having its own weaknesses to Fire and Ice attacks covered by Blastoise. Altaria works well also, having access to Heal Bell and Natural Cure, and just needs to be wary of Hidden Power Ice and boosted special attacks.</p>

[SET]
name: Tortoise of Choice
move 1: Water Spout / Hydro Pump
move 2: Ice Beam
move 3: Hidden Power Grass
move 4: Surf / Rapid Spin
item: Choice Specs / Choice Scarf
nature: Timid / Modest
evs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

<p>Although slapping Choice Specs on a Blastoise may seem like an awkward fit, when paired with the turtle's HGSS acquisition, Water Spout, it makes for a very potent combination. Water Spout is a move that, despite its awesome power, is very rarely seen outside of the Uber tier, which is mostly attributable to the low Speed of its two NU owners: Octillery and Wailord. Blastoise, however, is not only considerably faster than these two, it is also primarily used as a defensive Pokemon, which gives it the surprise factor that its counterparts lack.</p>

<p>The beauty of this set lies not in its raw attack power, but instead in its ability to lure and destroy UU's spin blockers; Rotom, Mismagius, and Spiritomb. When your opponent has Stealth Rock up in the early game, switching in Blastoise will immediately coax out their Spin blocker and allow it to deal out a swift death with Water Spout. Quickly dispensing of these Pokemon will allow Rapid Spinners like Donphan and Claydol to perform their jobs with ease, which in turn will reap many benefits for your team. As demonstrated by the damage calculations below, standard variants of Rotom and Mismagius will be OHKOed after Stealth Rock damage, while most Spiritomb will take massive damage and be primed for an easy 2HKO.</p>

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

<ul class=”damage_calculation”>
<li>87.5% HP Water Spout vs. 4 HP / min SpD Mismagius - 87.4% - 103.4%</li>
<li>87.5% HP Water Spout vs. max HP / min SpD Rotom - 98% - 115.8%</li>
<li>87.5% HP Water Spout vs. max HP / min SpD Spiritomb - 73.4% - 86.8%</li>
<li>Max HP Water Spout vs. max HP / 212 SpD Clefable - 55.8% - 65.7%</li>
<li>Ice Beam vs. min / min Venusaur - 77.7% - 91.7%</li>
<li>Ice Beam vs. 4 HP / min Sceptile - 95% - 112.1%</li>
<li>Hidden Power Grass vs. 248 HP / min SpD Milotic - 36.1% - 42.7%</li>
<li>Hidden Power Grass vs. max HP / 4 SpD Slowbro - 51.8% - 61.4%</li>
<li>Hidden Power Grass vs. max HP / min SpD Azumarill - 51% - 60.4%</li>
</ul>

<p>The attacks on this set are pretty much standard operating procedure in UU in terms of type coverage. Ice Beam covers Altaria and Grass-types, while Hidden Power Grass smacks bulky Waters who will attempt to wall Blastoise. A second Water-type move is often necessary to give Blastoise a STAB move when its HP drops below a certain point. When running Surf, Water Spout is the preferable attack while Blastoise's HP exceeds 63%. It should be noted that Rapid spin is also a viable option in the last slot if you do not want to use a dedicated Rapid Spinner. However, switching Blastoise into Stealth Rock twice - once to KO the opponent's Spin blocker and once to Rapid Spin - hurts Water Spout greatly, to the point that Hydro Pump will usually be the superior option.</p>

<p>Choice Scarf is a viable option over Choice Specs if you want to transform Blastoise into a revenge killer of sorts. With a Modest nature and a spread of 16 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpA / 232 Spe it climbs near the top of the Speed tiers, outpacing all base Speed 120s. Being faster than the likes of Sceptile and Alakazam will certainly surprise your opponent. Without Choice Specs, however, Blastoise becomes significantly less powerful, and can struggle to achieve the KOs it needs to. Therefore, entry hazards are important to pair with this set in order to weaken fragile Pokemon. When played correctly, this set's Speed can make it a very potent check quite a few sweepers. It should be noted that while it does not score the same OHKOs on Ghost-types, it outspeeds them and 2HKOes easily if they stay in.</p>

<p>As mentioned, this set is made to be best friends with a Rapid Spinner. Donphan and Claydol both make solid partners and have the added bonus of immunity to Electric attacks. Hitmontop is also an option, although Foresight allows it to effectively take on Spin blockers by itself. Pairing Blastoise with any of these Pokemon makes for a trustworthy method of eliminating entry hazards, which allows Stealth Rock-weak Pokemon to reach their full potential. Some of the most fearsome attackers in UU fit this bill, including Scyther, Moltres, Swellow, Houndoom, and even Charizard (if you have some serious Red/Blue nostalgia).</p>

[Team Options]

<p>Since Blastoise's primary job is to Rapid Spin, a grounded Poison-type is very useful as it is susceptible to Toxic Spikes. Drapion and Venusaur are two great candidates as they easily handle the Grass attacks aimed at Blastoise. Leafeon makes a great defensive partner because they cover each other's weaknesses well, and it can heal Blastoise with Wish. Nidoqueen also makes a good defensive partner and can handle almost any variant of Toxicroak, a very threatening pokemon who can set up easily against Blastoise. Speaking of Poison, a cleric, such as Altaria or Clefable, is very useful for ridding Blastoise of status.</p>

<p>Ghost-types that block Rapid Spin are a major hindrance to Blastoise. A Pursuiter, such as Drapion or Spiritomb, is very helpful in taking down Mismagius and Rotom. Spiritomb is a bit trickier due to its dedicated bulk, but multiple strong attacks from powerful sweepers will bring it down (Toxic helps too), so something that can set up on Spiritomb is a definite plus. Blastoise also pairs well with Pokemon who can absorb status, since it won't enjoy being poisoned. Steel- and Poison-types, such as Registeel and Venusaur, can gain easy switch-ins to the inevitable Toxic aimed at Blastoise.</p>

[Optional Changes]

<p>Blastoise has a few handy options that have yet to be mentioned. Haze can get rid of stat boosts, but it is usually overshadowed by Milotic in this department. Like Hitmontop, Blastoise has access to Foresight, which allows it to use Rapid Spin against Ghost-types, but Hitmontop typically does this better since it does not fear Ghost-types the same way Blastoise does.</p>

<p>If you're in the mood for a gimmick, Blastoise also has access to both Counter and Mirror Coat, allowing it to score a surprise KO on an unsuspecting opponent. It can survive most non-STABed Grass and Electric attacks, making Mirror Coat a good option if you're willing to take the hit. Meanwhile, it is very difficult to OHKO from the physical side, so Counter allows it to bounce back those attacks for heavy damage.</p>

<p>Blastoise has some nifty physical moves like Waterfall, Ice Punch, and Earthquake, but these should be avoided. Azumarill, Feraligatr, and Kabutops completely outclass it in this department, although Blastoise does have the element of surprise on its side, if nothing else.</p>

[Counters]

<p>Despite its unimpressive defenses, Rotom is a great counter to Blastoise, since it blocks Rapid Spin and can threaten with Thunderbolt or Trick. The same can be said for Mismagius, as it usually carries Thunderbolt. Spiritomb can also get in Blastoise's way, but it won't be happy if it gets hit with Toxic.</p>

<p>Generally speaking, Grass-types are the number one threat to Blastoise in UU, namely Sceptile, Venusaur, and Leafeon. Venusaur can switch in on Blastoise the easiest, as it does not fear Toxic. If Blastoise lacks Rest, Toxic from the likes of Uxie or Milotic will make sure it doesn't stick around much longer. Lanturn won't enjoy Toxic, but can switch in easily and defeat Blastoise with Thunderbolt. Chansey can switch in on Blastoise at any time and wall it to no end.</p>

<p>Substitute users, such as Toxicroak, Feraligatr, and Azumarill, can all set up on Blastoise if it lacks Haze or Roar. Rest Talk stat boosters, such as Calm Mind Spiritomb or Curse Registeel, also give Blastoise trouble if it lacks these moves, since they can shrug off Yawns and Toxics. Toxicroak is a big threat because it absorbs Surf thanks to Dry Skin and is immune to Poison.</p>

<p>Blastoise's lack of an instant recovery move means that you can keep chipping away at it, but it can also do the same to you, so beware.</p>

I'm bad at full grammar checks but you wrote water jet instead of aqua jet

First time proof reading, just a few nitpicks I managed to find, reviewed Utility, Rest Talk Shuffler and Choice Scarf.

Utility


Rest Talk Shuffler


Choice Scarf


This set is alright. It has the surprise factor that will let you lure in ghosts expecting a rapid spin and either OHKO or 2HKO them, which opens a path for another Pokemon.

good job

I don't know if this deserves an entire set of its own or if it should be put with the Utility set but Foresight + Rapid Spin is probably one of its best sets.

[SET]
name: Foresight + Rapid Spin
move 1: Foresight
move 2: Rapid Spin
move 3: Surf
move 4: Rest / Roar
item: Leftovers
ability: Torrent
nature: Bold
evs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 6 SpA

I personally believe that this should be added as a different set since this aims to spin to its fullest. Blastoise has a great defensive typing and great defense on both ends in comparison with Hitmontop. Roar is another crux that Blastoise has, allowing it to beat Calm Mind Crotomb if it decided to set up on you after Rapid Spinning. This can succesfully spin on most spin blockers, with the exception of Rotom. Although non-bulky versions are sometimes 2HKO'd by Surf.

I do realize that this is very close to CB but it's not exactly, mostly in that it can spin as well as attack and that it's not locked on a move. After a liechi boost (if liechi is used) and it's in the torrent zone, Aqua Jet essentially becomes Bullet Punch from CB scizor running off (much) lower attack. In rain... it's really powerful. It may seem gimmicky, but I've used it to great success on shoddy.

[SET]
name: Torrent Abuse
move 1: Waterfall
move 2: Rapid Spin/Substitute
move 3: Aqua Jet
move 4: Return
item: Leftovers / Liechi Berry
ability: Torrent
nature: impish / adamant
evs: 252 HP / 6 Def / 252 Atk

Found 4 things you may want to edit:

(overview)

<p>Despite competition from bulkier Waters and a plethora of Rapid Spinners, Blastoise remains a staple Pokemon of the UU tier. Its main purpose is Rapid Spinning, which it does very well with its strong defenses and great typing. Its excellent movepool allows it to serve other functions, however, including offensive and stall-based variants. (may want to edit this sentence; variants and functions don't match up, so to speak; maybe "However, its excellent movepool allows it to use stall-based and offensive sets") </p>

(Restalk)

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

<p>This set functions well on any team that incorporates Spikes and Stealth Rock, whether it is balanced or pure stall. Even without entry hazards, however, it still serves multiple useful purposes. Roar makes it a great phazer, and its bulk allows it to take many boosted attacks then force the opponent to flee. It is especially useful against Curse and Calm Mind users that may prove difficult to take down with attacks. Rest allows it to function as the team's status absorber. Using Rest and Sleep Talk is beneficial because Blastoise will need to be comfortable taking hits in order to fulfill its job. As mentioned, it also allows Roar's negative priority to be ignored while sleeping.</p>

[Team Options]

<p>Since Blastoise's primary job is to Rapid Spin, a grounded Poison-type is very useful as it is susceptible to Toxic Spikes. Drapion and Venusaur are two great candidates as they easily handle the Grass attacks aimed at Blastoise. Leafeon makes a great defensive partner because they cover each other's weaknesses well, and it can heal Blastoise with Wish. Nidoqueen also makes a good defensive partner and can handle almost any variant of Toxicroak, a very threatening pokemon who can set up easily against Blastoise. (add in a sentence about the usefullness of a cleric when using blastoise; aromatherapy/heal bell (from leafeon I might add) stops if from being destroyed by toxic)</p>

<p>Ghost-types that block Rapid Spin are a major hindrance to Blastoise. A Pursuiter, such as Drapion or Sneasel, is very helpful in taking down Mismagius, Froslass, and Rotom. Spiritomb is a bit trickier due to its dedicated bulk, but multiple strong attacks from powerful sweepers will bring it down (Toxic helps too). Blastoise also pairs well with Pokemon who can absorb status, since it won't enjoy being poisoned. Steel- and Poison-types, such as Registeel and Venusaur, can gain easy switch-ins to the inevitable Toxic aimed at Blastoise.</p>

Just a nitpick, in the overview you say there are a plethora of rapid spinners. Yet, in the first line on the first set you say "Blastoise is one of the few Pokemon gifted with the ever-useful Rapid Spin".

Thanks, guys, I covered most of that stuff, let me know how I did. There were a couple edits I disagreed with.

@Breludicolo - That set can be used much more effectively by Feraligatr or Azumarill.

Utility


Rest Talk Shuffler


Changes / additions in black
Removals in red
Comments in blue

Nice job Diesel, and congratulations on your well-deserved ladybug! I might edit the others later, we shall see :)

Thanks a lot, Snorlaxe! Finally made those edits, I've been swamped (2 midterms yesterday FTL).

Diesel my homeboy, I have some suggestions, this is a great write-up by the way.

-for the Choice Scarf set, i would personally like to add Dugtrio as a possible partner. having tested this set since water spout was released, i could easily say that dugtrio traps chansey without shed shell. its a perfect raikou lure as well since they trade off electric-type attacks exceptionally well.

-for defensive pairs, I always like to pair my bulky waters with RestTalk Arcanine - specifically for Sleep Powder Venusaur. with entry hazards deployed, arcanine can easily roar away many opponents, chipping away their health slowly. with their health down, the opponent's hp range is hopefully low enough for water spout to ohko them. but for defensie pairs in general, RestTalk Arcanine is the way to go.

Hope this helped.

Thanks, gents. Does what I added sound about right, Franky?

i didn't check the specs part but there are errors there if you are going to add it...

Added, thanks. You don't need to c+p the entire article if you're only making like two changes btw. And [ hide ] tags are your friend.

Personally, and this may just be me, I feel that you should have kept the Choice Band set as a listed option. I say this because in terms of its movepool and base stats, Blastoise's special and physical attacking prowess has similar potential. However, I have found that because so many people rely solely on its Special Attacking capabilities, that the Choice Banded (and/or Life Orbed) moveset had the potential to hurt some of my opponents.

As I've said before, it's completely overshadowed by Azumarill and Feraligatr. Prove to me it isn't and I'll include it.

I would just like to say that Choice Band on Blastoise and Choice Specs on Blastoise both have potential.

You can put a Choice Specs on a Feraligatr or a Choice Band on a Ninetales and it can "work" because of the surprise against their usual counters (mainly looking at the Blastoise's Choice Band set with this) but I don't think it'll be that great later in the game against other foes (so-called gimmicks). However, for Blastoise, Waterfall (or Aqua Tail)/Ice Punch/Earthquake/Rapid Spin can fill a unique half role of a powerful, unexpected attacker and a Rapid Spinner, somewhat like the Choice Band Donphan set.

Blastoise's Choice Specs set has some potential due to its power at first sight, but the lack of Speed on it doesn't really help it on the long run. Going Timid helps it a bit (capping at 280, which outruns neutral max Speed base 90 Pokemon) but it seems to still not be enough. Of course though, it'll work better with paralyze support from the team so Blastoise can stay Modest. As always, there's the "surprise" value from when Blastoise deals out a huge amount of damage (like 2HKOing 252 HP/252 Sp Def Calm Clefable). If the enemy are mostly paralyzed or are naturally slow without Speed EVs or the likes, Choice Specs (Water Spout) may turn out to be lethal.

EDIT: I may try for some logs Monday, but that's not a guarantee.
Yeah, sorry, I was lazy about this as well. I'm trying to avoid playing video games and start being productive to others and myself, but it's kinda ironic at the same time, lol.

Thanks, AromaFlora.

If you guys can provide logs proving physical Blastoise's merit I'll be happy to consider it for a set. Provide all reasonable logs, though, not just good ones.

I've been lazy (slash completely forgetting) about testing choice specs, so I apologize for that. I'll get to it this week.

Should it be noted on the utility set that Yawn could be used as a 'lure' to make opponet switch thier rapid spinner out, so unless they carry two Ghost-types you could get an easy Rapid spin in.
This unfortunately requires Blastoise take some damage (even more if they stay in even when knowing their mon will fall asleep) so it mightn´t be effective many times.

I decided to give the Specs set the boot and relegate it to OC. Looking for some more edits.

Diesel said:

I decided to give the Specs set the boot and relegate it to OC. Looking for some more edits.

Click to expand...

Though it's not "official" yet - because we haven't done the official voting thing - I think you should just note that it is a definite possibility for Blastoise to have some major changes (such as the Specs set being kept but revamped).

These include:



I have not tested the Choice Scarf set, but I will now that I realize that the set is on this revamp.

Well, yea, I removed the Zzz set because it sucked ass. It surprises me you didn't find the Shuffler set more effective, though. I found it extremely effective, to the point that it could win games for me by itself with entry hazards + status. Maybe it's significantly less effective in this meta? I created it in the previous one and was pretty enamored with it. I'd be curious to see how you're using it.

And even though it's not "official" should I go ahead and add the Specs set with the way you designed it? If so, I'll do that after testing it so I know what I'm talking about. What kind of team(mates) did you use it with?

Diesel said:

Well, yea, I removed the Zzz set because it sucked ass. It surprises me you didn't find the Shuffler set more effective, though. I found it extremely effective, to the point that it could win games for me by itself with entry hazards + status. Maybe it's significantly less effective in this meta? I created it in the previous one and was pretty enamored with it. I'd be curious to see how you're using it.

And even though it's not "official" should I go ahead and add the Specs set with the way you designed it? If so, I'll do that after testing it so I know what I'm talking about. What kind of team(mates) did you use it with?

Click to expand...

I meant: You "should" because I am suggesting it, not because you "need" to - it isn't official (yet).

Anyway, the shuffler set was "OK" until I used Rest. Once I used Rest, Blastoise was either relying on 1/3 to stop being set up on, or simply worthless because he couldn't do anything productive except get forced out. Pokemon like Torterra, Steelix, and even Luxray don't have this problem because they pose somewhat of an offensive threat even with bulky EVs. I found Toxic + Surf better....as I realized that Milotic completely outclasses it. If I wasn't using Rapid Spin + Roar/Yawn, I felt that Blastoise was a lackluster supporter. That said, I wouldn't remove it just yet, because the other UU QCers can (and to be honest probably will) question my decisions.

I am fairly confident about the specs set though; I gathered logs.

Speaking of - and to answer your question - I used Blastoise with a couple teams, but the main one I really liked was when I used it in tandem with Moltres/Scyther (LO/CB respectively) and Donphan (Rapid Spin variant). When you send out Blastoise on a team that has Stealth Rock up, they will almost assuredly switch something like Rotom or Froslass in to block Rapid Spin. Specs Blastoise utterly destroys both of these Pokemon with Specs Water Spout / Hydro Pump (and even Surf). This leaves Donphan free to Rapid Spin. Donphan also checks Raikou who can't afford to set up Calm Minds on a Specs Water Spout, so it works out quite well.

If you're opponent starts to get the hang of your tactic, and switches a water resist in, you can switch it up and use Rapid Spin if you carry it.

Just a quick fix: your Counters section mentions Cresselia.

Yea I'll add the Specs set, I don't think I was really using that to the best of its ability. I guess all I can say for the Shuffler set is that I had very different results. If I find the time (not likely in the next week) I'll retest it and post logs, or speak to other QC members and see what they think.