It's All About Control

mf

formerly monkfish
is a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnus
This team was built on the principle of control: taking and keeping the momentum of the game. Every pokemon on this team has a way of forcing the opponent's hand, giving me a window of opportunity to build momentum.

At A Glance
260.png
212.png
135.png
130.png
286.png
330.png

SWAMPERT | SCIZOR | JOLTEON | GYARADOS | BRELOOM | FLYGON

In Depth

I started off with a recommendation by Justinawe: he claimed that the combination of CB Scizor and Specs Jolteon was rampaging all over the current metagame.

The Partners
212.png

Scizor (M) @ Choice Band
Ability: Technician
EVs: 248 HP/252 Atk/8 Spd
Adamant nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Bullet Punch
- U-turn
- Superpower
- Pursuit

U-turn is one of the best moves for keeping momentum, and Scizor is probably its best user, hitting its counters hard and immediately switching to something that will force them out. Bullet Punch is universally useful. Superpower hits Heatran and Magnezone if Scizor's more suitable teammates are down; Pursuit is another fantastic move for keeping control of the battle, putting my opponent in a checkmate position.

135.png

Jolteon (M) @ Choice Specs
Ability: Volt Absorb
EVs: 4 HP/252 Spd/252 SAtk
Timid nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Thunderbolt
- Shadow Ball
- Hidden Power [Grass]
- Baton Pass

Thunderbolt is of course the primary move, tearing through anything without a sizeable SpD investment. I rarely use Shadow Ball or Hidden Power, although they are a useful plan B in a pinch. Baton Pass is what really makes this set golden; Jolteon forces switches from such a huge number of things that it is really easy to scout them and move to an appropriate counter. It is annoying that it carries Intimidate drops too, but it is rare that Salamence will be bold enough to risk a Thunderbolt (and if they have the balls to bring in Gyarados then fair play to them!)

Jolteon and Scizor make a very nice offensive combination. Both hit very hard, very fast, giving me immediate checks to some of the more threatening OU presences like NP/SD Infernape, (Adamant) DDGyara, DDTar, CM Latias etc.
Scizor whacks things hard on the physical side with STAB CB U-Turn, frequently luring in bulky waters that have trouble with the Jolteon they then find themselves facing. Forcing switches is the name of the game here, and both do it extremely well, wearing down the opponent while staying in complete control of the game. Jolteon is notoriously fragile, but slow U-turns from Scizor practically guarantee that it can get in with minimal damage.

--

I decided that next I wanted a Stealth Rock user, to exploit the switches that Scizor and Jolteon force. Recently I have had marginal success with Swampert.

The One Who Kicks It Off
260.png

Swampert (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Torrent
EVs: 252 HP/4 Atk/252 Def
Relaxed nature (+Def, -Spd)
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Ice Beam
- Protect

Swampert is a fantastic lead in the current metagame, taking on Azelf, Heatran, Metagross and Aerodactyl with relative ease. This is another standard moveset, but standard for a reason - it works amazingly well. SR helps out Scizor and Jolteon as mentioned before; EQ and IB have good coverage and scare off a lot of dangerous pokemon (Metagross, Heatran, Salamence). The real beauty of this set, though, is Protect. Pretty much everything Swampert encounters will be planning to mess him up, and with Protect things get a whole lot easier. Metagross, Heatran and Azelf explode into it; Jirachi and Rotom reveal their Tricks; Choiced U-turners let me know exactly what they're planning. It also allows Swampert to effectively regain 12.5% of its health through leftovers, since it is untouchable on the Protect turn.

Swampert is a handy switch-in to the Heatran and Magnezone that enjoy coming into Scizor. It's also nice to have a general safety-net for Salamence if they come in on a U-Turn or Jolteon Baton Pass. It also gives me another option to handle Rotom (in different ways depending on the type).

--

My next three choices weren't quite so clear-cut, and I spent quite a few games testing different pokemon in these slots. Skarm/Bliss/Roserade didn't work out - my team became too stallish, a playstyle which I'm not great at. I tried combinations of Metagross, Tyranitar and Heatran but the ground weakness was too severe.

The first one I settled on was Gyarados - I realised that I needed something that could take Fighting, Ground and Water with relative ease.

The One Who Shrugs It Off
130.png

Gyarados (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 248 HP/248 Def/12 Spd
Impish nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Waterfall
- Roar
- Sleep Talk
- Rest

At first I tried Dragon Dance variants, which worked OK but not brilliantly - I usually have to bring him in relatively early, which means counters to the DD set are often in high health, and he is then down to 50% HP the next time he comes in. However, the Roar/ST set is excellent for this purpose. Having a bulky yet threatening pokemon who can both psuedohaze and take status is a great facet to my team. Forcing switches is the name of the game, and with Roar in combination with Scizor and Jolteon I can almost be certain to reveal at least 5 of the opponent's team swiftly. The ability to restore health is invaluable to a pokemon who can get in easily but with a penalty of 25% each time.

Gyarados obviously has great synergy with Jolteon, and I can play guessing games with my opponent if they expect a Jolteon switch in but get Swampert instead. Scizor and Gyarados both lure bulky waters - Roar and U-turn help to whittle them down and ensure they are not problematic.

--

The next choice is the one that has proven to be the best in my opinion, a truly underrated pokemon who decimates much of the metagame: Breloom!

The One Who Ties It All Together
286.png

Breloom (M) @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
EVs: 48 HP/252 Atk/208 Spd
Adamant nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Spore
- Substitute
- Focus Punch
- Seed Bomb

Breloom is really having a fun time in the current metagame. With Scarf TTar running around everywhere and Celebi nowhere to be seen, Breloom really comes into his own. The key to using Breloom is not Sporing too early - with Sleep Clause it is easy to let one pokemon go to sleep then switch to a counter. By Substituting on the inevitable switch, Breloom gets three excellent options to tackle the switch-in. Spore is Breloom's "control" move, allowing him to decide which of his few counters should be neutralised.

Scizor's U-turn, Jolteon's Baton Pass and Swampert's grass- and water-luring abilities provide plenty of opportunities for Breloom to come in and set up a Substitute. Scizor and Breloom really work well together, both with huge attack stats and each being able to prevent their counters from getting comfortable. In addition, Scizor's Pursuit makes life a lot harder for any Celebi, Latias or Rotom who would come in on Breloom's Focus Punch

--

The final team member is the one I have had the most trouble deciding. I wanted another way to control the game by forcing switches and allowing Jolteon or Breloom to get in for free - in addition, I needed something that wouldn't mind being tricked a Scarf from pesky Jirachi. I settled on Flygon.

The One Who Scares You Away
330.png

Flygon (M) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 80 HP/252 Atk/176 Spd
Adamant nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Earthquake
- U-turn
- Outrage
- Stone Edge

Earthquake and U-turn are the key moves here, Earthquake scaring off the likes of Infernape, Scarf Heatran, Jolteon et al. while still having the option to regain momentum via U-turn. Outrage is a useful way to deal a lot of damage to random set-up pokemon who I need to remove at the expense of Flygon, and wreaks havoc when Steels are off the field. Stone Edge is a poor move and to be honest I have never used it - I should probably run Fire Blast here.

Flygon's U-turn maintains the team concept of control, while its speed and power keep things in check. It's another answer to Celebi (and one who isn't HP-Fire weak) and another Thunderbolt/Earthquake immunity to keep my opponent guessing.

Strategy
Swampert is first up, and I usually follow the same tactics for the (common) leads:
Metagross - Earthquake while they SR, followed by Protect in the hope that they will Explode
Azelf - Ice Beam while they SR/Taunt, (then another Ice Beam if they Taunted) followed by Protect to see what set they're running (and hopefully catch an Exploder)
Heatran - Earthquake immediately - if I can get rid of Heatran it gives Scizor a much easier time. They rarely run HP Grass, but I protect on the second turn just in case (if I didn't OHKO)
Swampert - They will usually assume that there's mutual agreement of "lets both get SR up". In fact, I will get SR up later - right now I'm going straight to Breloom to set up a Sub and start punching.
Jirachi - Protect. If they Trick, go to Flygon; if not, SR
Aerodactyl - Ice Beam twice. Usually they Taunt then SR... without actually harming Swampert at all.
Mamoswine - Ice Beam to break the sash, then straight to Gyarados. I could probably just SR but Mamoswine is pretty beefy and I prefer to keep Swampert in good shape for the early-game at least.

Once SR is up, I try to stick to Scizor/Breloom/Jolteon/Gyarados and start putting holes in things. Swampert then serves as emergency backup if I need a switch for Metagross or Tyranitar. The goal is to get Breloom in as soon as possible, find out his counters, then whittle them down with Jolteon and Scizor.

This team has problems with:
- Electivire. My team falls to the set of Thunderbolt/Earthquake/Ice Punch/HP[Grass]/Flamethrower - I have to keep switching to find out which of these moves the opponent has. Electivire is especially annoying because it can dent Breloom, so I can't immediately go to it from Jolteon.
- Fast Taunters like Gliscor and Skarmory that can stop Breloom Sporing them.
- Latias & Celebi. Breloom is the main wallbreaker of the team but even he can't break these walls. Scizor helps a lot here but sadly HP[Fire] is still rampant so he has to be careful. Jolteon's Shadow Ball can scare them away but won't prevent them from simply coming back in later. Thankfully as mentioned, Tyranitar is the #2 most common pokemon at the moment, meaning most people are more wary of that than Scizor. If Latias lacks Recover (it often does) I can whittle it down with Focus Punch. Celebi is the main culprit here since its Natural Cure shrugs off Spore with ease.
- Dragons in general. I only have one Steel pokemon, who isn't particularly fond of Flamethower or HP[Fire]. I haven't encountered Kingdra yet but I have a feeling that if given the chance to set up (on Scizor Bullet Punch, for instance), it would decimate me.

Please rate my team, and suggest fixes if you think they are appropriate :)
 
Why hasnt this got more rates? Its an amazing team IMO i have one just like it. Im not really an experienced rater but i do have one suggestion. Since this team is focused around forcing switches you might want to try a second entry hazard: spikes. They help you wear down celebi and electivire who you say give your team trouble. Skarmory+Swampert is a decent combo so i would recomend a skarmory somewhere. Probably over scizor. You already have 2 checks to gengar (flygon and jolteon) and 2 checks to salemence (flygon and swampert, possibly gyrados) so you wont be missing him too much. If you dont want to replace scizor the next to go should probably be breloom since you already have jolteon to take care of bulky waters, or gyrados since skarm fills a similar roll. I know you said you dont like stalling, but that gyrados of yours isnt sweeping any better then a skarmory. And as for your threat list i would remove gliscor (trust me hes not getting past swampert or gyrados, or even breloom if he lacks areal ace) and skarm (taunt skarm is not faster then breloom, and if somethings already spored focus punch does alot) and add lucario, as once gyra is gone he can sweep your whole team. Stone edge versions do that anyway but thankfully they are rare. Here is the skaromry set:

Skarmory @leftovers/shed shell
Impish/careful nature
252hp 252spd 4def
~Spikes
~Whirlwind
~Roost
~Brave bird

I would probably run more speed but thats up to you

Edit: Replace jolteons hp grass with hp ice. Skarm (if you decide to use him), Breloom and gyrados shit all over swampert. Hp ice will help you beat gliscor, breloom, and bulky dragonite easier. Also you could test dragon dance over roar on gyados to give you a late gae sweeper.
 
I would advise this unless you really need the sleep support
Breloom (M) @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
EVs: 48 HP/252 Atk/208 Spd
Adamant nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Spore/Substitute
- Swords Dance
- Mach Punch
- Seed Bomb

And i agree a lot with this:Why hasnt this got more rates? Its an amazing team IMO i have one just like it. Im not really an experienced rater but i do have one suggestion. Since this team is focused around forcing switches you might want to try a second entry hazard: spikes. They help you wear down celebi and electivire who you say give your team trouble. Skarmory+Swampert is a decent combo so i would recomend a skarmory somewhere. Probably over scizor. You already have 2 checks to gengar (flygon and jolteon) and 2 checks to salemence (flygon and swampert, possibly gyrados) so you wont be missing him too much. If you dont want to replace scizor the next to go should probably be breloom since you already have jolteon to take care of bulky waters, or gyrados since skarm fills a similar roll. I know you said you dont like stalling, but that gyrados of yours isnt sweeping any better then a skarmory. And as for your threat list i would remove gliscor (trust me hes not getting past swampert or gyrados, or even breloom if he lacks areal ace) and skarm (taunt skarm is not faster then breloom, and if somethings already spored focus punch does alot) and add lucario, as once gyra is gone he can sweep your whole team. Stone edge versions do that anyway but thankfully they are rare. Here is the skaromry set:

Skarmory @leftovers/shed shell
Impish/careful nature
252hp 252spd 4def
~Spikes
~Whirlwind
~Roost
~Brave bird
 
Hey this is a really good idea. I should make a team around this sometime! I do see some things with your team though, like the abundance of choice users. This could really hamper you when you mispredict, even though you have uturn if they don't switch when you uturn you could potentially lose a pokemon from a powerful attack. You could try out a charge beam jolteon with baton pass and change one of your pokemon to a special attacker to have something benefit from it. It will hve a lot more sweeping potential with a life orb as well. Just something to consider good luck.
 
Why hasnt this got more rates?
Because the raters can't find anything wrong with it?

Anyway, I could see a Lucario with Stone Edge (and possibly even without) being major trouble for this team, as pointed out before. None of the suggestions so far help to deal with this. Flygon at the moment is your best bet, but if he is hit by one resisted attack, he is sure to be KOed by +2 Extremespeed. I am not sure how this might otherwise affect your team, but have you considered Scarf Tyranitar over Flygon? He checks all (non bullet punch) versions of Lucario quite reliably, and can still revenge DDtar with Superpower, and MixMence with Stone Edge. He also deals with Celebi and Latias, two of your recorded weaknesses. And I suppose trapping is a form of control right?

Good luck anyway.
 
I'm sure they can, I definitely can.

For starters I have very few safe switch-ins to bulky waters. In particular, fast Suicune with CM, Surf, Ice Beam and HP Electric can decimate the entire team (I have to sacrifice something to get Jolteon in and even then it's not a safe bet). Starmie has the same effect, though I can Pursuit it with Scizor.

Lucario is an issue, and although Tyranitar is a nice solution to that, he doesn't help against bulky waters.

As I mentioned, I tried Skarmory but Spikes will often get spun away - without a spin blocker it's largely useless. Toxic Spikes would help with Suicune but again, without a ghost I can't rely on them.

I'd like to utilise Spikes/Toxic Spikes, that would massively help with my Celebi and Bulky Water problems. This requires a spin blocker, I'd probably go with Trick Rotom-H. Replacing Scizor with a semi-offensive Forretress might help, being more defensive and able to take out Ghosts who expect a Rapid Spin with Payback.

Thoughts?
 
It felt like I got more use out of expert belt jolteon than specs jolteon. It doesn't hit as hard, but the type coverage is very useful.

HP:grass seems very pointless on specs jolteon. At best you can predict a swampert switch in, but that's all. You also have breloom who is probably the hardest swampert counter there is. I think HP:ice gives better coverage and is more useful.
 
Jirachi with TrickScarf over Scizor could be another out to Suicune.. sorta. Get it stuck on Surf and then just Roar it out with Gyarados.
 
While you certainly have most offensive threats covered because Scizor + Flygon covers most every offensive threat, and you have Jolteon as insurance, perhaps the biggest problem I see with your team is the lack of a reliable way to get around a stall team. You saw that Breloom is your team's main wallbreaker, and against many types of teams, I think you have a valid point. Most Bulky Offensive and balanced teams cannot hold out against Breloom attacks for very long, especially if SR is up, because many of Breloom's counters are Flying types. However, against a stall team, Breloom becomes much less effective. While Celebi is a rare sight, there are almost zero stall teams that dont have one of Gyarados / Gliscor / Latias, who all wall Breloom pretty hard AND pack recovery to live through repeated hits, unlike, say Salamence who is SR weak and unlikely to pack Roost on a more offensive team.

There are two things I think you can do to help with your stall problem. The first would be to run a bulky Gyarados. This variant is more of an offensive threat, and can cripple stall teams through its use of Taunt. I think this variant fits your team a little better as well because you do not have a lot of entry hazards on the team to abuse Roar with. Breloom can take advantage of many of Gyarados' switch ins, such as Vaporeon, to start its offensive onslaught. Basically, you keep your synergy, but gain more of an offensive threat and have an easier time against Stall. This set also fits your theme because Taunt forces your opponent to attack :P Here is the set I had in mind:

Gyarados @ Leftovers
Adamant / Intimidate
156 HP / 108 Atk / 100 Def / 144 Spe
-Dragon Dance
-Taunt
-Waterfall
-Stone Edge

Stone Edge grants great coverage along with Waterfall, but in addition smacks around Flying types who could wall Breloom.

Now, I think making Breloom more of a threat against a Stall team is a good idea as well. I think dropping Substitute is a good idea for a few reasons. One, you can run a third attack, which I'm thinking should be Facade. Facade really screws around with some of Breloom's "counters," especially when you consider that Breloom will be statused almost 100% of the time due to its Toxic Orb. Facade, together with Spore, will really screw with your average stall team. Against offensive teams, Breloom still finds many opportunities to come in, as you said, and instead of Substituting you can fire off a Facade or scout your opponents Breloom counter. Unless it happens to be a Rotom, you will have probably put a nice chunk of damage on a counter. The key with this set is nailing the correct target with Spore so that you can incapacitate your opponents best Breloom switch in. In summary, your team needs defensive play coverage, and this Breloom set provides just that. While this set does not perform quite as well as the SporePuncher against offensive teams, as I said you have a very good core to deal with offense in Scizor + Flygon + Jolteon, so it should work out just fine. Also, with a little prediction, this set can work just fine against offenisve teams through Spore and the right attack. Here is the set:

Breloom @ Toxic Orb
Jolly / Poison Heal
4 HP / 252 Attack / 252 Speed
-Spore
-SuperPower
-Seed Bomb
-Facade

If you find that Lucario is too much of a headache, you could try Mach Punch over SuperPower, but this leaves you really stuck against Skarmory outside of Spore. In addition, I think you can deal with Lucario pretty easily through Gyarados, but also through smart playing if Gyara is down. Scizor's Bullet Punch still does a large chunk, especially after defense drops, so you can still play around it imo, making changing much of your lineup a non issue.

The final bit of advice that I have is changing your lead. Swampert, while an effective lead, does nothing to gain your team momentum, and actually can just lead to free Spikes for your opponent, which really hurts your team, especially your main offensive core of Scizor and Jolteon. Stuff like Skarmory and Forretress have no problems setting up on you. In addition, I think a better answer to Rotom is needed. While Swampert can take on an offensive Rotom fairly easily (barring the odd Leaf Storm), it fails against the defensive version, as does much of your team, once again reiterating a stall problem. Also, many of the Pokemon Swampert counters are fairly easily stopped by the rest of your team, especially Scizor and Flygon being able to stop these Pokemon, such as Metagross and Tyranitar. I also see just one Steel type as a potential issue because of your many choice items and Breloom (regardless of moveset). These decisions make Dragon types more likely to be able to come in and attack, and I think Scizor alone may not be able to weather the storm of powerful attacks. To solve both of these issues at once, I recommend a Heatran lead. This lead, especially with a Shuca Berry, can cause real issues to many Dragons as well as taking on Rotom well. While there are many variations on the standard Heatran lead being used at the moment, I think the standard lead is your best bet. I like what Explosion brings to your team because it can deal with problematic Pokemon in general, but especially smack stuff like Blissey and Suicune for either a KO or severely weaken them. This helps Jolteon in the case of Blissey (and other notable Explosion targets such as Latias and Snorlax who can switch into Thunderbolt) and Gyarados in the case of Bulky Waters should Breloom not be able to deal with them. You can also explode on dragons such as Salamence you could try to Earthquake you, while you survive due to Shuca Berry. This helps Breloom especially. Here is the set I had in mind:

Heatran @ Shuca Berry
Naive / Flash Fire
4 HP / 252 Special Attack / 252 Speed
-Fire Blast
-Earth Power
-Explosion
-Stealth Rock

On offensive Suicune: I dont think you are as weak to it as you think. It might take a sacrifice, but you can easily overwhelm with with Jolteon and Flygon together in a one two smash (Thunderbolt + Outrage, possibly Earthquake). It might be one of your biggest threats, but you can still take it out, so it will by no means 6-0 you.

Good Luck with your team!
 
Back
Top