Shaymin-S (Update)

capefeather · Oct 5, 2010

http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/shaymin-s

Uh, hi. I kind of forgot that I'd reserved this, actually, lol, so apologies on the delay. Now that it's been basically confirmed that I have the responsibility for this, here I go!

I basically picked up where Darkmalice left off:

Darkmalice said:
Made the behemoth thread more concise and updated it (finally!). Overview is basically a smaller Opinion section. Most of the EVs section was irrelevant to Alternate options, so it was removed (the only useful stuff only applied to the SubSeed set, and it was moved to the set comments). Kept all the information (except Ominous Wind in Alternate options) and tried to keep it as close as possible to the original thread!

My main goal for each set is to make it worthwhile to read the entire set + Team Options, and do away with redundant technical details. I also want the reader to think for himself/herself at least a little bit about what kinds of STABs or super-effective moves counters/partners might use.

Status: DONE!

Maybe it can be shortened even further, and suggestions for that are welcome, but I'm done for today. Ugh, writing/revising an analysis shouldn't take this long.

[Overview]
Shaymin-S's brilliant traits, such as a STAB move that crushes both Kyogre and Groudon and a base Speed that beats even Darkrai's, make it a powerful threat in Ubers. It is also very capable of abusing the significant impact of luck in Ubers with its infamous Serene Grace ability combined with its dreaded STABs Seed Flare and Air Slash, often turning the tables upon the opponent even in the direst of situations. Unfortunately, it is fairly frail by Uber standards, being only slightly bulkier than Darkrai. It's also weak to Stealth Rock and forced out by many common Pokémon like Dialga and Scizor. Nevertheless, Shaymin-S is an excellent choice for almost any offensive Uber team because of the significant impact that it can make on the opponent in a relatively short time.

[SET]
name: Choice Scarf
move 1: Seed Flare
move 2: Air Slash
move 3: Earth Power
move 4: Hidden Power Ice
item: Choice Scarf
nature: Timid / Modest
evs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
A Choice Scarf enables Shaymin-S to become both a great revenge killer and a decent lead. It's also arguably the best offensive answer to Rock Polish Groudon, as it is immune to Earthquake, and it can outrun most Groudon even after a Rock Polish and OHKO it with its powerful STAB Seed Flare. As a lead, it should try for an Air Slash flinch against Deoxys-A and Deoxys-S leads, which will usually prevent them from setting up entry hazards, and it easily beats Groudon leads who don't invest heavily in Special Defense.

Both of Shaymin-S's STABs allow it to get out of many tough situations thanks to Seed Flare's 68% overall Special Defense drop rate, as well as Air Slash's 57% overall flinch rate and neutrality against most Pokémon in the Uber environment. Earth Power 2HKOes most Steel-type switch-ins, though specially defensive Dialga will survive two Earth Powers, usually even after a Special Defense drop. Hidden Power Ice allows Shaymin-S to revenge kill Garchomp, opposing Shaymin-S, and Dragon Dance Rayquaza lacking ExtremeSpeed.

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]
Non-lead Shaymin-S should have a Modest nature to guarantee Seed Flare's OHKO on faster variants of Kyogre with Stealth Rock damage. The only somewhat common Pokémon in Ubers who will outspeed Modest Shaymin-S are Timid Choice Scarf Darkrai, opposing Shaymin-S, and Mewtwo. When used as a lead, Shaymin-S should be Timid so that it can outspeed the aforementioned Darkrai, another common lead.

Leaf Storm is an option to use in place of Seed Flare with a Modest nature, which OHKOes both max HP Kyogre and 4 HP / 0 SpD Darkrai after Stealth Rock damage. However, this leaves Shaymin-S vulnerable to Calm Mind users like Latias and Mewtwo, and Leaf Storm lacks the Special Defense lowering effect of Seed Flare. Thus, it should only be used if Shaymin-S's team really needs the KOs that Leaf Storm provides. Don't use Leaf Storm with a Timid nature, as the only benefit to doing so is gaining an OHKO on 4 HP / 0 SpD Kyogre after Stealth Rock.

Generally, Choice Scarf Shaymin-S's biggest foes resist its STABs or have extremely high special bulk. Scizor and Dialga can heavily dent Shaymin-S with most of their attacks, with Choice Band Scizor dealing at least 53% with Pursuit, which is potentially fatal with Stealth Rock in play, while Dialga can set up on Shaymin-S with Bulk Up. Lugia, opposing Shaymin-S, Rayquaza, Ho-Oh, Latios, and Latias can switch into Seed Flare and Earth Power and either threaten Shaymin-S immediately or set up. The massive defensive stats of Giratina, specially defensive Skarmory, and Blissey allow them to shrug off Shaymin-S's assaults to cripple it in various ways (e.g. status, phazing, PP stalling), as long as Seed Flare doesn't net too many Special Defense drops. Giratina-O is a more offensive check that can pick off a weakened Shaymin-S with Shadow Sneak. Finally, Wobbuffet can easily trap and revenge kill Choice Scarf Shaymin-S with Mirror Coat.

In terms of teammates, mixed variants of Dialga, Palkia, and Rayquaza can lure in most of Shaymin-S's defensive checks. For a more threatening approach, Darkrai and Calm Mind Mewtwo can set up on and crush Shaymin-S's checks quite well. Alternatively, Wobbuffet can trap and KO many of Shaymin-S's checks. For Mixed Dialga, it's best to revenge kill it via Pokémon like Garchomp and Lucario. Good defensive partners include Kyogre, Groudon, Jirachi, and Blissey.

Something to note about leading with Choice Scarf Shaymin-S is that it often relies on Air Slash's flinch rate to beat other leads such as Darkrai, so having a Sleep Talker waiting in the wings such as Kyogre is advisable. Hidden Power Fire is a viable option on this set to destroy Scizor leads and Forretress or Skarmory switch-ins. However, it requires Shaymin-S to lower its Speed IV to 30, meaning that opposing Choice Scarf Shaymin-S will beat it.

There are also several leads that almost always beat Shaymin-S: Choice Scarf Mewtwo outspeeds Shaymin-S and OHKOs with Ice Beam, while 252 HP Kyogre, Dialga, and Tyranitar can survive one of Shaymin-S's attacks and OHKO in retaliation. Scizor leads trouble Shaymin-S that lack Hidden Power Fire, 3HKOing with Bullet Punch. An allied Blissey can easily wall lead Kyogre, Dialga, and Mewtwo, while Groudon can switch into Tyranitar and Scizor and severely damage or OHKO them with Earthquake or a Fire-type attack. Although Draco Meteor will do a huge amount of damage to Groudon, STAB Earthquake will often scare Dialga off as well. While Palkia and Latias can destroy Kyogre, several lead Kyogre carry Thunder Wave to take advantage of these switch-ins. A Dialga of your own can switch into Mewtwo, Kyogre, and Scizor, and threaten them with Draco Meteor, Thunder, and Fire Blast respectively.

[SET]
name: SubSeed
move 1: Substitute
move 2: Leech Seed
move 3: Seed Flare
move 4: Air Slash / Hidden Power Fire / Earth Power
item: Leftovers
nature: Timid
evs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
The main idea of the SubSeed strategy is to switch into Pokémon who Shaymin-S can scare out, set up Substitute as they switch, and then either attack the next switch-in or use Leech Seed. Substitute is a great scouting tool for both Shaymin-S and partners looking to answer some of its checks. Shaymin-S is the fastest Leech Seed user outside of the sun, and it can pose an offensive threat with its base 120 Special Attack and Seed Flare Special Defense drops. Leech Seeding common switch-ins such as Blissey and Giratina allows Shaymin-S to restore huge amounts of health per turn, even making up for the Substitute HP loss in the former case. Eventually, Blissey will run out of Seismic Toss PP, and Shaymin-S can then pound Blissey with Seed Flare until her battered special bulk can take no more.

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]
Seed Flare can cause a lot of switches, due to its high chance of halving the opponent's Special Defense, forcing the opponent's Pokémon to take more damage from entry hazards and Leech Seed. For the last moveslot, Air Slash is generally the best choice due to its flinches wasting Leech Seed turns. Air Slash is also super effective on two other Leech Seeders seen in Ubers, Jumpluff and Ludicolo. However, Air Slash can leave Shaymin-S open to huge threats like Bulk Up Dialga and Scizor, the latter whom has Bullet Punch's priority and U-turn to break Shaymin-S's Substitute and switch out simultaneously. Because of this, Hidden Power Fire is viable to OHKO Scizor and 2HKO Metagross and Skarmory in the sun. Alternatively, Earth Power 3HKOs the standard Bulk Up Dialga, preventing it from Rest stalling Shaymin-S. Earth Power also 2HKOes Metagross and offensive Dialga. Finally, Hidden Power Ice can OHKO Rayquaza, Garchomp, and opposing Shaymin-S; Rayquaza may attempt to set up on Shaymin-S otherwise.

Investing in defenses is not beneficial, as Shaymin-S's Substitutes will still be broken from most of the attacks thrown at it. Just maxing out Speed and Special Attack is recommended. This set can use 252 HP EVs to make Shaymin-S's Substitutes unbreakable by Blissey's Seismic Toss, but the power loss is often not worth it.

Entry hazard support is particularly crucial to this set's success, punishing the opponent for the many switches that this set causes. Wobbuffet support is also highly recommended, as many players rely on Choice Scarf holders like Palkia, Dialga, and Garchomp to defeat most Shaymin-S sets. Shaymin-S is thus an effective scout for almost all of these Pokémon with Substitute, and in turn allows Wobbuffet to revenge kill them more easily later in the match. Wobbuffet can also help Shaymin-S to find time to set up with Encore. Tickle Wobbuffet in particular can be paired with a Pursuit user, such as Tyranitar or Scizor, to eliminate Lugia.

SubSeed Shaymin-S's problems are largely dependent on the last move, as mentioned earlier. In general, though, Ho-Oh, Lugia, Giratina, and Giratina-O can all stall Shaymin-S out. Tyranitar is one of the most reliable counters to Giratina-O, and can use Taunt + Dragon Dance to set up on Lugia, Skarmory, and Giratina. When using Hidden Power Fire, make sure you use Groudon with Shaymin-S, as the sun is required for the KOs on every one of these Pokémon, except of Scizor.

[SET]
name: Life Orb
move 1: Seed Flare
move 3: Air Slash
move 2: Earth Power
move 4: Hidden Power Ice / Hidden Power Fire / Growth
item: Life Orb
nature: Timid
evs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Shaymin-S has great offensive stats to pull off a simple Life Orb set, netting many important OHKOs with its STABs and Earth Power that it cannot normally obtain on Darkrai, Kyogre, Shaymin-S, Heatran, and most Groudon, as well as 2HKOs on Garchomp, Palkia, Rayquaza, Metagross, most Dialga, most Jirachi, and Scizor assuming Stealth Rock damage. A Special Defense drop from Seed Flare can even put Lugia, Latias, Giratina, Giratina-O, and Skarmory within 2HKO range from Air Slash, though in Skarmory's case, the probability is very small. Hidden Power Ice will turn some of these 2HKOs into OHKOs, while Hidden Power Fire easily OHKOs Scizor and 2HKOs Skarmory in the sun.

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]
Alternatively, Growth can be used in the last slot, which enables Shaymin-S to net even more KOs that it would otherwise miss, turning 2HKOs on Garchomp, Palkia, and Dialga into OHKOs. In particular, +1 Earth Power OHKOes max HP Dialga 66% of the time after Stealth Rock damage. When using Growth, Leftovers becomes a viable item option, as it lets Shaymin-S survive in battle longer and a Growth boost provides more power than a Life Orb does.

The Life Orb recoil compounds Shaymin-S's frailty, sometimes not even getting a chance to KO Scizor before it goes down to Bullet Punch. Scizor is best dealt with using Dialga, Palkia, or Mewtwo lures before attempting to sweep with Shaymin-S. The IVs can be reduced to 29 to reduce Stealth Rock and Life Orb damage by 1, but it will take two turns of Life Orb recoil to make up for the lost HP.

There are four particular Choice Scarf holders that outspeed Shaymin-S and resist both Seed Flare and Air Slash; Dialga, Metagross, Jirachi, and Heatran. Wobbuffet and defensive Groudon are helpful against them. Kyogre and Heatran can easily switch into Jirachi's and Metagross's Ice Punches and Heatran's Fire Blast, whilst retaliating with powerful STABs. Note that none of these threats enjoy Shaymin-S's Earth Powers, so you can try hitting them on the switch.

[SET]
name: Choice Specs
move 1: Seed Flare
move 2: Air Slash
move 3: Earth Power
move 4: Hidden Power Ice / Hidden Power Fire
item: Choice Specs
nature: Timid
evs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Choice Specs Shaymin-S wields great power without the need to set up or the constant recoil of Life Orb. Seed Flare deals massive damage to many Pokémon, OHKOing Darkrai, Kyogre, and Groudon, while also having a chance to OHKO offensive Mewtwo and Garchomp, and even giving Rayquaza trouble in setting up. Air Slash almost always 2HKOes 252 HP / 168 SpD Careful Scizor, and always 2HKOes Rayquaza, Darkrai, Garchomp, and Palkia after Stealth Rock damage. Earth Power 2HKOes Dialga, Metagross, and Jirachi, while Hidden Power Ice almost always 2HKOes Lugia with a Modest nature. With a Timid nature, it still OHKOes Garchomp and Rayquaza and after Stealth Rock damage and 2HKOes 86 HP / 96 SpD Giratina-O 90% of the time. Alternatively, Hidden Power Fire roasts Scizor and Skarmory.

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]
Timid is the preferred nature to outspeed Darkrai, but Modest is reasonable if you have Spikes support for the very real possibility of 2HKOing Blissey, Palkia, and Rayquaza, and OHKOing Garchomp and Mewtwo with Seed Flare.

The few Pokémon who can take Choice Specs Shaymin-S's Seed Flares are generally Shaymin-S's biggest threats. These include Blissey, Skarmory, Latias, Lugia, Choice Scarf Dialga, Heatran, opposing Shaymin-S, and Scizor, all of whom can immediately retaliate against Shaymin-S. Rayquaza is another check, though it will lose if Seed Flare gets a Special Defense drop. If running Modest, it is wise to have a Sleep Talker like Kyogre to deal with Darkrai. Alternatively, Choice Scarf Heracross can switch into most of Darkrai's moves and can OHKO with its STABs. Choice Scarf Dialga, Palkia, and Mewtwo are all excellent revenge killers of Darkrai.

[Team Options]
Like most offensive Pokémon, Shaymin-S greatly appreciates Stealth Rock support, as it nets Shaymin-S several vital KOs. Shaymin-S's Stealth Rock weakness shortens the life of this already frail Pokémon, hence Forretress makes a great teammate due to its access to Rapid Spin. Forretress can also take Ice-type moves aimed at Shaymin-S and set up Spikes to net Shaymin-S further KOs. Giratina-O can spinblock for Shaymin-S and help it to beat stall teams. With Calm Mind, it can lure in and defeat Skarmory, Blissey, Lugia, Heatran, and Bulk Up Dialga. Gengar and Giratina are other alternatives, with Gengar being able to defeat Scizor and some of Rayquaza's sets depending on whether it uses Life Orb or Choice Scarf. In addition, using Pokémon who attract Groudon's or Garchomp's Earthquakes like Dialga, Metagross, Jirachi, and Heatran is highly recommended, as this can give Shaymin-S a free switch in. In particular, Choice Scarf Jirachi can threaten Rayquaza, opposing Shaymin-S, and defensive Pokémon with Trick.

There are many partners to choose from in terms of lures. Mixed Dialga can pose as a Choice Scarf user, luring in Blissey, Latias, Skarmory, Metagross, Lugia, and Wobbuffet, and slam them with Outrage (OHKOing Latias) or Fire Blast. Mixed Dialga can also destroy Adamant Swords Dance Rayquaza and opposing Choiced Shaymin-S. Mixed Palkia and Mixed Rayquaza can also lure in most of the aforementioned. Darkrai and Taunt + Calm Mind Mewtwo can set up on and crush Lugia and Giratina, though Darkrai cannot safely switch into Latias's Dragon Pulse and will require her to be weakened. Mewtwo can lure Scizor in, only to OHKO it with Fire Blast, and can use Selfdestruct to gain a surprise KO on Blissey, or Taunt her to gain an advantage. Finally, Mewtwo can revenge kill opposing non-Choice Scarf Shaymin-S with Ice Beam. Haban Berry Garchomp can lure Choice Scarf Dialga in as it uses Swords Dance and then survive Dialga's Draco Meteor while OHKOing Dialga with a Swords Dance boosted Earthquake in return. Yache Berry Garchomp does the same with Choice Scarf Jirachi, Metagross, and Heatran. Bulk Up Dialga can use Choice Scarf Jirachi, Metagross, and Scizor as set-up bait.

There are also many good options for defensive partners. Heatran is notable for resisting almost all of Shaymin-S's weaknesses and vice versa, and the pair resists 15 of the 17 types between them. In the sun, Heatran can also OHKO Scizor, opposing Shaymin-S, Dialga, Metagross, and Jirachi with Fire Blast, and OHKO opposing Choice Heatran with Earth Power. Kyogre and Steel-types in general have similar defensive synergy with Shaymin-S, and Kyogre can run Calm Mind or absorb sleep with Sleep Talk. Blissey can defeat Dialga without physical attacks, opposing Shaymin-S without Leech Seed, Latias without Refresh or Safeguard, and Lugia if she has Toxic. Groudon, especially defensive support variants, resists Rock-type moves and can handle Dialga, Blissey, and Scizor. It can also lure Skarmory, opposing Shaymin-S, Lugia, and Latias, OHKOing the former two with Overheat and using Toxic on the latter two. Garchomp resists Rock-type and Fire-type moves as well. Scizor can easily switch into Deoxys-A's, Choice Scarf Kygore's, and Mewtwo's (without Fire Blast) Ice Beams, as well as Dragon-type attacks from Choice Scarf Palkia and Garchomp, and retaliate immediately. Specially defensive Choice Band Tyranitar can survive Mewtwo's Aura Sphere and destroy Mewtwo with Crunch or Pursuit whilst taking little damage from any incoming Ice Beams.

An alternative to checking some of Shaymin-S's defensive checks and revenge killers is simply to trap them. Tickle Wobbuffet paired with a Pursuit user, such as Scizor or Tyranitar, can spell doom for both Blissey and Lugia. Both Scizor and Tyranitar are capable of destroying Latias with Pursuit, whilst Tyranitar can utilize Taunt and Dragon Dance to set up on Blissey, Lugia, and Skarmory. Wobbuffet also spells doom for most Choice Scarf users, Darkrai being a notable exception.

[Optional Changes]
Swords Dance is an alternative, but Shaymin-S has a poor physical movepool and is completely walled by Lugia, Giratina, Giratina-O, and almost any Steel-type Pokémon. Hidden Power Rock OHKOs Ho-Oh and 2HKOs Rayquaza and Shaymin-S after Stealth Rock damage, but otherwise, it's outclassed by Hidden Power Ice. Quick Attack has priority, but its low power is off-putting even against Deoxys-A. Secret Power is another option that can paralyze the opponent 60% of the time.

As an alternate STAB, Grass Knot has 100% accuracy, four times the PP of Seed Flare, and 120 Base Power against most Pokémon in Ubers. However, it only hits Wobbuffet for 60 Base Power and Mew and Manaphy for 20 Base Power. Grass Knot also lacks Seed Flare's chance of lowering the opponent's Special Defense by two stages, one of Shaymin-S's best selling points. Energy Ball is another 100% accurate Grass-type attack that still hits Manaphy for a large amount of damage with a 40% chance of dropping the foes Special Attack, but the power loss generally makes it an inferior option.

Type-resisting Berries, such as Yache Berry, could be considered, but Mewtwo and Kyogre will still OHKO Shaymin-S through a Yache Berry. Both Petaya Berry and Salac Berry are viable options for an offensively oriented Substitute set. Finally, Wide Lens will allow Shaymin-S to have a more accurate Seed Flare and Air Slash.

Psych Up can be used to steal the foe's stat ups, but it is far less reliable than Growth and Swords Dance are. Shaymin-S has Safeguard and Aromatherapy for status protection, but it's generally too frail to use them effectively. Worry Seed can stop Giratina and Dialga from using their main method of recovery, Rest, but it's generally not worth the moveslot. Toxic cripples both Lugia and Latias if they attempt to switch into Shaymin-S. Synthesis is Shaymin-S's only recovery move beyond Rest, and it can be used to extend Life Orb Shaymin-S's life span when paired with Groudon's eternal sunlight. Finally, Shaymin-S is arguably the best user of Healing Wish due to its 127 base Speed stat. Healing Wish can restore a weakened sweeper to full health, giving it another chance to sweep when its counter is most likely weakened.

[Counters]
Blissey is often the most reliable counter to Shaymin-S. She can absorb most of its attacks with ease and either cripple Shaymin-S with Thunder Wave or Toxic, or simply OHKO Shaymin-S with Ice Beam with Stealth Rock support. However, she loses against the SubSeed variant, and she may be 2HKOed by a Modest Choice Specs Seed Flare if Blissey's Special Defense is halved. Specially defensive Skarmory can take Shaymin-S's assaults, except for Hidden Power Fire, and simply Whirlwind Shaymin-S away (causing it to take more damage from Stealth Rock) or OHKO Shaymin-S with Brave Bird with Stealth Rock in play. Although Lugia and Latias risk falling to Air Slash flinches after a Seed Flare Special Defense drop, they can take most of Shaymin-S's assaults and OHKO it with Ice Beam and Dragon Pulse, respectively, after Stealth Rock damage. Lugia can also use Whirlwind to stop Shaymin-S from stalling with Leech Seed.

Ho-Oh can switch into any of Shaymin-S's attacks and OHKO with Sacred Fire. Scizor can easily switch into Seed Flare and threaten any Shaymin-S without Hidden Power Fire. Scizor 2HKOs Shaymin-S with Bullet Punch and can U-turn for heavy damage as well as scout possible switch-ins. Choice Band Scizor can even use Pursuit to put Shaymin-S into the KO range of Stealth Rock on its next switch-in (provided that Shaymin-S has already taken Stealth Rock damage.) However, a Choice Specs boosted Air Slash will 2HKO Scizor. Choice Scarf Dialga and Heatran can easily switch into Seed Flare and Air Slash. They can also OHKO Shaymin-S with Fire Blast (or Draco Meteor in Dialga's case). Choice Scarf Jirachi and Metagross resist Seed Flare and Air Slash and can OHKO Shaymin-S with Ice Punch. However, Dialga, Heatran, Metagross, and Jirachi are 2HKOed Earth Power (Heatran is OHKOed). Faster Pokémon like Mewtwo, Deoxys-A and Choice Scarf Garchomp, Palkia, Darkrai, and Kyogre can revenge kill non-Choice Scarf Shaymin-S with Ice Beam or STAB Dragon-type attacks. However, Choice Scarf Mewtwo can outspeed even Choice Scarf Shaymin-S.

firecape · Oct 10, 2010

~~KOFFI~~

QC approved 1/3.

capefeather · Oct 10, 2010

Actually, DO concise update shenanigans need QC? I suppose that this one does due to the minor HG/SS updates that had to be mentioned (Shadow Sneak Giratina-O, Brave Bird Ho-Oh), but I wasn't sure.

calze6 · Oct 28, 2010

There is still a lot of text written here. Where most just have been moved to OC. If there is stuff that aren't common or useful, such as mentioning taunt + DD T-tar on a shaymin analysis.

capefeather · Oct 28, 2010

I actually didn't touch OC much more than darkmalice did. I'm having trouble understanding what you're saying exactly.

calze6 · Oct 29, 2010

The thing mentioned taunt dd t-tar pairs well with it. I find that situational and can also be removed, along with a lot of other uncommon sets and info.

capefeather · Oct 29, 2010

If Dragonite's dex mentions Lopunny then I don't see what's wrong with mentioning Tyranitar on Shaymin-S.

If one of the four sets is not viable anymore then you can pick it out specifically. It would be much more helpful if you did that. This goes for OC as well.

Fireburn · Nov 11, 2010

I honestly think this is as short as it is going to get lol.

QC APPROVED (2/3)

Jibaku · Dec 4, 2010

FIRECAPE SUCKS

QC approved 3/3.

I'd slash Timid over Modest on Scarfmin-S

capefeather · Dec 4, 2010

Done. GP Stage woo!

If there are still "fatty" parts in the analysis then feel free to point them out. I've done my best to suck it dry already, though.

Aeron Ee1 · Dec 5, 2010

[Overview]
Shaymin-S's brilliant traits, such as a STAB move that crushes both Kyogre and Groudon and a base Speed that beats even Darkrai's, make it a powerful threat in Ubers. When holding a Choice Scarf, it's one of the best answers to Rock Polish Groudon. (not overview material) It is also very capable of abusing the significant impact of luck in Ubers. Special Defense drops from Seed Flare and Air Slash flinches are fairly common, with its infamous ability, Serene Grace, Shaymin-S's use of luck can often turning the tables upon the opponent, even in the most dire situations.Unfortunately, Shaymin-S is fairly frail by Uber standards, being only slightly bulkier than Darkrai is. It's also weak to Stealth Rock and forced out by many common Pokémon like Dialga and Scizor. Nevertheless, Shaymin-S is an excellent choice for almost any offensive Uber team, because of the significant impact it can make on your opponent in a relatively short amount of time.

[SET]
name: Choice Scarf
move 1: Seed Flare
move 2: Air Slash
move 3: Earth Power
move 4: Hidden Power Ice
item: Choice Scarf
nature: Timid / Modest
evs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
A Choice Scarf enables Shaymin-S to become both a great revenge killer and a decent lead. It's also arguably the best offensive answer to Rock Polish Groudon; Shaymin-S is immune to Groudon’s Earthquakes (moved), can outrun most Groudon even after a Rock Polish, and it can easily OHKO it with Seed Flare. As a lead, Shaymin-S can go for an Air Slash flinch against Deoxys-A and Deoxys-S leads, usually preventing them from setting up, and beat Groudon leads that don't invest heavily in Special Defense with its powerful Seed Flare.

Seed Flare is Shaymin-S's primary STAB attack, with 120 Base Power, decent accuracy, and high chance to sharply lower Special Defense stats. Air Slash is the secondary STAB, and it gets Shaymin-S out of many tough situations thanks to its 57% overall flinch rate and neutrality against most Pokémon in the Uber environment. Earth Power 2HKOes most Steel-type switch-ins weak to it, though specially defensive Dialga will live through two Earth Powers, usually even after a Special Defense drop. Finally, Hidden Power Ice allows Shaymin-S to revenge kill Garchomp, opposing Shaymin-S, and Dragon Dance Rayquaza without ExtremeSpeed.

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]
When not in the lead position, Shaymin-S should have a Modest nature, to guarantee Seed Flare's OHKO on faster variants of Kyogre with Stealth Rock damage. The only somewhat common Pokémon in Ubers who will outspeed Shaymin-S after the nature change are Timid Choice Scarf Darkrai, Shaymin-S, and Mewtwo(moved). However, Lead Shaymin-S should be Timid, so it can outspeed the former, another common lead.

Leaf Storm is a viable option in place of Seed Flare with a Modest nature, OHKOing both a max HP Kyogre and a 4 HP / 0 SpD Darkrai after Stealth Rock damage. However, this leaves Shaymin-S vulnerable to be setup on by Calm Mind users like Latias and Mewtwo. Leaf Storm also lacks the 68% chance (taking accuracy into account) of halving the opponent's Special Defense. Generally, Seed Flare should always be the Grass-type STAB move of choice, unless your team really needs the KOs that Leaf Storm provides. Don’t use Leaf Storm with a Timid nature, as the only benefit to doing so is gaining an OHKO on a 4 HP / 0 SpD Kyogre after Stealth Rock.

Generally, Choice Scarf Shaymin-S’s biggest foes resist its STABs or have extremely high special bulk. Scizor and Dialga can heavily dent Shaymin-S with most of their attacks, with Choice Band Scizor dealing at least 53% even with Pursuit, which is potentially fatal with Stealth Rock in play, while Dialga can even set up with Bulk Up. Lugia, opposing Shaymin-S, Rayquaza, Ho-Oh, Latios, and Latias can switch into Seed Flare and Earth Power and immediately threaten or even set-up Substitute or attacks. The massive defensive stats of Giratina, specially defensive Skarmory, and Blissey allow them to shrug off Shaymin-S’s assaults to cripple it in various ways (e.g. status, phazing, PP stalling), as long as Seed Flare doesn’t net too many Special Defense drops. Giratina-O is a more offensive check that can pick off a weakened Shaymin-S with Shadow Sneak. Finally, Wobbuffet can easily trap and revenge kill Choice Scarf Shaymin-S with Mirror Coat.

In terms of teammates, Mixed Dialga, Mixed Palkia, and Mixed Rayquaza can lure in most of Shaymin-S's defensive checks and KO them with some smart prediction. For a more threatening approach, Darkrai and Calm Mind Mewtwo can set up on and crush Shaymin-S's checks quite well. Alternatively, Wobbuffet can trap and KO Shaymin-S's checks. For Mixed Dialga, it's best to revenge kill it with Pokémon like Garchomp and Lucario(moved). Good defensive partners that synergize well with Shaymin-S include Kyogre, Groudon, Jirachi, and Blissey.

Something to note about leading with Choice Scarf Shaymin-S is that it often relies on Air Slash’s flinch rate to beat other leads such as Darkrai. In Darkrai’s case, so a Sleep Talker like Kyogre is advisable to solidify the lead win. As a lead, Hidden Power Fire is a viable option to destroy Steel-type switch-ins and leads not weak to Earth Power. However, it requires Shaymin-S to lower its Speed IV to 30, meaning that opposing Choice Scarf Shaymin-S will beat it.

There are also several leads that almost always beat Shaymin-S. Choice Scarf Mewtwo outspeeds Shaymin-S and OHKOs with Ice Beam, while 252 HP Kyogre, Dialga, and Tyranitar can survive one of Shaymin-S's attacks and OHKO in retaliation. Scizor leads trouble Shaymin-S that lack Hidden Power Fire, 3HKOing it with Bullet Punch. An allied Blissey can easily wall lead Kyogre, Dialga, and Mewtwo, while Groudon can switch into Tyranitar’s Stone Edge or Scizor and severely damage or OHKO most of them with Earthquake or a Fire-type attack. Although Draco Meteor will do a huge amount of damage to Groudon, STAB Earthquake will often scare Dialga off as well. While Palkia and Latias can destroy Kyogre, several lead Kyogre carry Thunder Wave to take advantage of these switch-ins. A Dialga of your own can switch into Mewtwo, Kyogre, and Scizor, and threaten them with Draco Meteor, Thunder, and Fire Blast respectively.

A lot of weird floating sentences, I moved most of them to where I thought it was most appropriate.

[Overview]
Shaymin-S's brilliant traits, such as a STAB move that crushes both Kyogre and Groudon and a base Speed that beats even Darkrai's, make it a powerful threat in Ubers. It is also very capable of abusing the significant impact of luck in Ubers with its infamous ability, Serene Grace, often turning the tables upon the opponent in the most dire situations. Unfortunately, Shaymin-S is fairly frail by Uber standards, being only slightly bulkier than Darkrai. It's also weak to Stealth Rock and forced out by many common Pokémon like Dialga and Scizor. Nevertheless, Shaymin-S is an excellent choice for almost any offensive Uber team because of the significant impact it can make on your opponent in a relatively short amount of time.

[SET]
name: Choice Scarf
move 1: Seed Flare
move 2: Air Slash
move 3: Earth Power
move 4: Hidden Power Ice
item: Choice Scarf
nature: Timid / Modest
evs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
A Choice Scarf enables Shaymin-S to become both a great revenge killer and a decent lead. It's also arguably the best offensive answer to Rock Polish Groudon; Shaymin-S is immune to Groudon’s Earthquakes, can outrun most Groudon even after a Rock Polish, and it can easily OHKO it with Seed Flare. As a lead, Shaymin-S can go for an Air Slash flinch against Deoxys-A and Deoxys-S leads, usually preventing them from setting up, and beat Groudon leads that don't invest heavily in Special Defense with its powerful Seed Flare.

Seed Flare is Shaymin-S's primary STAB attack, with 120 Base Power, decent accuracy, and high chance to sharply lower Special Defense stats. Air Slash is the secondary STAB, and it gets Shaymin-S out of many tough situations thanks to its 57% overall flinch rate and neutrality against most Pokémon in the Uber environment. Earth Power 2HKOes most Steel-type switch-ins weak to it, though specially defensive Dialga will live through two Earth Powers, usually even after a Special Defense drop. Finally, Hidden Power Ice allows Shaymin-S to revenge kill Garchomp, opposing Shaymin-S, and Dragon Dance Rayquaza without ExtremeSpeed.

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]
When not in the lead position, Shaymin-S should have a Modest nature, to guarantee Seed Flare's OHKO on faster variants of Kyogre with Stealth Rock damage. The only somewhat common Pokémon in Ubers who will outspeed Shaymin-S after the nature change are Timid Choice Scarf Darkrai, Shaymin-S, and Mewtwo. However, Lead Shaymin-S should be Timid, so it can outspeed the former, another common lead.

Leaf Storm is a viable option in place of Seed Flare with a Modest nature, OHKOing both a max HP Kyogre and a 4 HP / 0 SpD Darkrai after Stealth Rock damage. However, this leaves Shaymin-S vulnerable to be setup on by Calm Mind users like Latias and Mewtwo. Leaf Storm also lacks the 68% chance (taking accuracy into account) of halving the opponent's Special Defense. Seed Flare should always be the Grass-type STAB move of choice, unless your team really needs the KOs that Leaf Storm provides. Don’t use Leaf Storm with a Timid nature, as the only benefit to doing so is gaining an OHKO on a 4 HP / 0 SpD Kyogre after Stealth Rock.

Generally, Choice Scarf Shaymin-S’s biggest foes resist its STABs or have extremely high special bulk. Scizor and Dialga can heavily dent Shaymin-S with most of their attacks, with Choice Band Scizor dealing at least 53% with Pursuit, which is potentially fatal with Stealth Rock in play, while Dialga can set up with Bulk Up. Lugia, opposing Shaymin-S, Rayquaza, Ho-Oh, Latios, and Latias can switch into Seed Flare and Earth Power and immediately threaten set-up or attacks. The massive defensive stats of Giratina, specially defensive Skarmory, and Blissey allow them to shrug off Shaymin-S’s assaults to cripple it in various ways (e.g. status, phazing, PP stalling), as long as Seed Flare doesn’t net too many Special Defense drops. Giratina-O is a more offensive check that can pick off a weakened Shaymin-S with Shadow Sneak. Finally, Wobbuffet can easily trap and revenge kill Choice Scarf Shaymin-S with Mirror Coat.

In terms of teammates, Mixed Dialga, Palkia, and Rayquaza can lure in most of Shaymin-S's defensive checks and KO them with some smart prediction. For a more threatening approach, Darkrai and Calm Mind Mewtwo can set up on and crush Shaymin-S's checks quite well. Alternatively, Wobbuffet can trap and KO Shaymin-S's checks. For Dialga, it's best to revenge kill it with Pokémon like Garchomp and Lucario. Good defensive partners that synergize well with Shaymin-S include Kyogre, Groudon, Jirachi, and Blissey.

Something to note about leading with Choice Scarf Shaymin-S is that it often relies on Air Slash’s flinch rate to beat other leads such as Darkrai, so a Sleep Talker like Kyogre is advisable to solidify the lead win. Hidden Power Fire is a viable option to destroy Steel-type switch-ins and leads not weak to Earth Power. However, it requires Shaymin-S to lower its Speed IV to 30, meaning that opposing Choice Scarf Shaymin-S will beat it.

There are also several leads that almost always beat Shaymin-S. Choice Scarf Mewtwo outspeeds Shaymin-S and OHKOs with Ice Beam, while 252 HP Kyogre, Dialga, and Tyranitar can survive one of Shaymin-S's attacks and OHKO in retaliation. Scizor leads trouble Shaymin-S that lack Hidden Power Fire, 3HKOing it with Bullet Punch. An allied Blissey can easily wall lead Kyogre, Dialga, and Mewtwo, while Groudon can switch into Tyranitar or Scizor and severely damage or OHKO them with Earthquake or a Fire-type attack. Although Draco Meteor will do a huge amount of damage to Groudon, STAB Earthquake will often scare Dialga off as well. While Palkia and Latias can destroy Kyogre, several lead Kyogre carry Thunder Wave to take advantage of these switch-ins. A Dialga of your own can switch into Mewtwo, Kyogre, and Scizor, and threaten them with Draco Meteor, Thunder, and Fire Blast respectively.

capefeather · Dec 5, 2010

Thanks, Aaron Ee1, but I wanted to say a few things about disagreements with some of your fixes. However, these are all just my opinion on how I think that dex entries should be written, and if "the book" contradicts anything that I say then anyone is free to throw it at me.

The main issue is wordiness. There are some phrases that are just being large without really saying much, like "amount of time". I've tried my best until now to reduce the amount of empty wording and I intend to continue to do so. In particular, I don't like "babying" the reader. I do understand the importance of clarity, but there comes a time when trying to explain that Grass is super-effective against Water gets in the way of the real selling points like threatening the weathers for an OHKO. This especially affects the use of detailed move descriptions. Maybe people will disagree with me, but the listed moves are hyperlinked and people can readily get the detailed low-down from those links if they want. Oh, and the term "synergy" is overrated.

Oglemi · Jan 30, 2011

Slam slam, oh hot damn, everybody don't you understand

So if you're too school for cool, you can party like a fool

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[Overview]

Shaymin-S's brilliant traits, such as a STAB move that crushes both Kyogre and Groudon and a base Speed that beats even Darkrai's, make it a powerful threat in Ubers. It is also very capable of abusing the significant impact of luck in Ubers with its infamous Serene Grace ability combined with its dreaded STABs Seed Flare and Air Slash, often turning the tables upon the opponent even in the direst of situations. Unfortunately, it is fairly frail by Uber standards, being only slightly bulkier than Darkrai. It's also weak to Stealth Rock and forced out by many common Pokémon like Dialga and Scizor. Nevertheless, Shaymin-S is an excellent choice for almost any offensive Uber team, (remove comma) because of the significant impact that it can make on the opponent in a relatively short time.

[SET]
name: Choice Scarf
move 1: Seed Flare
move 2: Air Slash
move 3: Earth Power
move 4: Hidden Power Ice
item: Choice Scarf
nature: Timid / Modest
evs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

A Choice Scarf enables Shaymin-S to become both a great revenge killer and a decent lead. It's also arguably the best offensive answer to Rock Polish Groudon, as it is immune to Earthquake and can outrun most Groudon even after a Rock Polish to and OHKO it with its powerful STAB Seed Flare. As a lead, it can go should try for an Air Slash flinch against Deoxys-A and Deoxys-S leads, which will usually preventing them from setting up entry hazards, and it easily beats beat Groudon leads who don't invest heavily in Special Defense.

Both of Shaymin-S's STABs allow it to get out of many tough situations thanks to Seed Flare's 68% overall Special Defense drop rate, as well as Air Slash's 57% overall flinch rate and neutrality against most Pokémon in the Uber environment. Earth Power 2HKOes most Steel-type switch-ins, though specially defensive Dialga will live through survive two Earth Powers, usually even after a Special Defense drop. Hidden Power Ice allows Shaymin-S to revenge kill Garchomp, opposing Shaymin-S, and Dragon Dance Rayquaza lacking ExtremeSpeed.

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

Non-lead Shaymin-S should have a Modest nature to guarantee Seed Flare's OHKO on faster variants of Kyogre with Stealth Rock damage. The only somewhat common Pokémon in Ubers who will outspeed Modest Shaymin-S are Timid Choice Scarf Darkrai, opposing Shaymin-S, and Mewtwo. When used as a lead, Lead Shaymin-S should be Timid, (remove comma) so that it can outspeed the aforementioned Darkrai, another common lead.

Leaf Storm is an option to use in place of Seed Flare with a Modest nature, and OHKOs OHKOing both a max HP Kyogre and a 4 HP / 0 SpD Darkrai after Stealth Rock damage. However, this leaves Shaymin-S vulnerable to Calm Mind users like Latias and Mewtwo and Leaf Storm lacks the Special Defense lowering effect of Seed Flare. Thus, it should only be used if Shaymin-S's team really needs the KOs that Leaf Storm provides. Don’t't (correct apostrophe) use Leaf Storm with a Timid nature, as the only benefit to doing so is gaining an OHKO on a 4 HP / 0 SpD Kyogre after Stealth Rock.

Generally, Choice Scarf Shaymin-S’s's biggest foes resist its STABs or have extremely high special bulk. Scizor and Dialga can heavily dent Shaymin-S with most of their attacks, with Choice Band Scizor dealing at least 53% with Pursuit, which is potentially fatal with Stealth Rock in play, while Dialga can set up in Shaymin-S's face with Bulk Up. Lugia, opposing Shaymin-S, Rayquaza, Ho-Oh, Latios, and Latias can switch into Seed Flare and Earth Power and either threaten Shaymin-S immediately or set up. The massive defensive stats of Giratina, specially defensive Skarmory, and Blissey allow them to shrug off Shaymin-S’s's assaults to cripple it in various ways (e.g. status, phazing, PP stalling), as long as Seed Flare doesn’t't net too many Special Defense drops. Giratina-O is a more offensive check that can pick off a weakened Shaymin-S with Shadow Sneak. Finally, Wobbuffet can easily trap and revenge kill Choice Scarf Shaymin-S with Mirror Coat.

In terms of teammates, mixed variants of Dialga, Palkia, and Rayquaza can lure in most of Shaymin-S's defensive checks. For a more threatening approach, Darkrai and Calm Mind Mewtwo can set up on and crush Shaymin-S's checks quite well. Alternatively, Wobbuffet can trap and KO many of Shaymin-S's checks. For Mixed Dialga, it's best to revenge kill it via Pokémon like Garchomp and Lucario. Good defensive partners include Kyogre, Groudon, Jirachi, and Blissey.

Something to note about leading with Choice Scarf Shaymin-S is that it often relies on Air Slash’s's flinch rate to beat other leads such as Darkrai, so having a Sleep Talker waiting in the wings like Kyogre is advisable. Hidden Power Fire is a viable option here on this set to destroy Scizor leads and Forretress or Skarmory switch-ins. However, it requires Shaymin-S to lower its Speed IV to 30, meaning that opposing Choice Scarf Shaymin-S will beat it.

There are also several leads that almost always beat Shaymin-S. Choice Scarf Mewtwo outspeeds Shaymin-S and OHKOs with Ice Beam, while 252 HP Kyogre, Dialga, and Tyranitar can survive one of Shaymin-S's attacks and OHKO in retaliation. Scizor leads trouble Shaymin-S that lack Hidden Power Fire, 3HKOing with Bullet Punch. An allied Blissey can easily wall lead Kyogre, Dialga, and Mewtwo, while Groudon can switch into Tyranitar or and Scizor and severely damage or OHKO them with Earthquake or a Fire-type attack. Although Draco Meteor will do a huge amount of damage to Groudon, STAB Earthquake will often scare Dialga off as well. While Palkia and Latias can destroy Kyogre, several lead Kyogre carry Thunder Wave to take advantage of these switch-ins. A Dialga of your own can switch into Mewtwo, Kyogre, and Scizor, and threaten them with Draco Meteor, Thunder, and Fire Blast respectively.

[SET]
name: SubSeed
move 1: Substitute
move 2: Leech Seed
move 3: Seed Flare
move 4: Air Slash / Hidden Power Fire / Earth Power
item: Leftovers
nature: Timid
evs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

The main idea of the SubSeed strategy is to switch into Pokémon who Shaymin-S can scare out, set up Substitute as they switch, and then either attack the next switch-in or use Leech Seed. The Substitute Shaymin-S creates is a great scouting tool for both Shaymin-S and its partners looking to answer some of its checks. Shaymin-S is the fastest Leech Seed user in arbitrary clear weather, and it can pose an offensive threat with its base 120 Special Attack and Seed Flare Special Defense drops. Leech Seeding common switch-ins such as Blissey and Giratina allows Shaymin-S to restore huge amounts of health per turn, even making up for the Substitute HP loss in the former case. Eventually, Blissey will run out of Seismic Tosses, and Shaymin-S can then pound Blissey with Seed Flare until her battered special bulk can take no more.

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

Seed Flare can cause a lot of switches, due to its high chance of halving the opponent's Special Defense, forcing the opponent's Pokémon to take more damage from entry hazards and Leech Seed. For the last moveslot, Air Slash is generally the best choice due to its flinches wasting Leech Seed turns. Air Slash is also super effective on two other Leech Seeders seen in Ubers, Jumpluff and Ludicolo. However, Air Slash can leave Shaymin-S open to huge threats like Bulk Up Dialga and Scizor, the latter whom has Bullet Punch's priority and U-turn to break Shaymin-S's Substitute and switch out simultaneously. Because of this, Hidden Power Fire is viable to OHKO Scizor and 2HKO Metagross and Skarmory in the sun. Alternatively, Earth Power 3HKOs the standard Bulk Up Dialga, preventing it from Rest stalling Shaymin-S. Earth Power also 2HKOes Metagross and offensive Dialga. Finally, Hidden Power Ice can OHKO Rayquaza, Garchomp, and opposing Shaymin-S; Rayquaza may attempt to set up on Shaymin-S otherwise.

Investing in defenses often means little results in no benefits, as Shaymin-S’ 's Substitutes will still be broken from most of the attacks thrown at Shaymin-S it. Just It is recommended to just max out Speed and Special Attack as with the previous set. (Refrain from mentioning other sets in other sets.) The Substitute + Leech Seed This set can use invest in 252 HP EVs to make its Shaymin-S's Substitutes unbreakable by Blissey’s's Seismic Toss, but the power loss is often not worth it.

Entry hazard support is particularly crucial to this set's success, punishing the opponent for the many switches that this set causes. Wobbuffet support is also highly recommended, as many players rely on Choice Scarf holders like Palkia, Dialga, and Garchomp to defeat most Shaymin-S sets. Shaymin-S is thus an effective scout for almost all of these Pokémon with Substitute, allowing and in turn allows Wobbuffet to revenge kill them more easily later in the match and help various sweepers in return (see Wobbuffet's page for more details on that). Wobbuffet can also help set up Shaymin-S find time to set up with Encore. Tickle Wobbuffet in particular can be paired with a user of Pursuit (preferably Tyranitar or Scizor) to eliminate Lugia.

SubSeed Shaymin-S's problems are largely dependent on the last move, as mentioned earlier. In general, though, Ho-Oh, Lugia, Giratina, and Giratina-O can all stall Shaymin-S out. Thus, the teammates mentioned for the Choice Scarf set are great teammates for this set. Additionally, Tyranitar is one of the most reliable counters to Giratina-O, and can use Taunt + Dragon Dance to set up on Lugia, Skarmory, and Giratina. When using Hidden Power Fire, make sure you use Groudon with Shaymin-S, as the sun is required for the KOs on every one of these Pokémon, (comma) except of Scizor.

[SET]
name: Life Orb
move 1: Seed Flare
move 3: Air Slash
move 2: Earth Power
move 4: Hidden Power Ice / Hidden Power Fire / Growth
item: Life Orb
nature: Timid
evs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

Shaymin-S has great offensive stats to pull off a simple Life Orb set, netting many important OHKOs with its STABs and Earth Power that it cannot normally obtain on Darkrai, Kyogre, Shaymin-S, Heatran, and most Groudon, as well as 2HKOs on Garchomp, Palkia, Rayquaza, Metagross, most Dialga, most Jirachi, and usually Scizor assuming Stealth Rock damage. A Special Defense drop from Seed Flare can even put Lugia, Latias, Giratina, Giratina-O, and Skarmory within 2HKO range from Air Slash, though with in the case of Skarmory, the probability is very small. Hidden Power Ice will turn some of these 2HKOs into OHKOs, while Hidden Power Fire easily OHKOs Scizor and 2HKOs Skarmory in the sun.

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

Alternatively, Growth can be used in the last slot and it enables Shaymin-S to net even more KOs that it would otherwise miss, turning 2HKOs on Garchomp, Palkia, and Dialga into OHKOs. In particular, +1 Earth Power OHKOes max HP Dialga 66% chance of the time after Stealth Rock damage. When using Growth, Leftovers becomes a viable item option, as it lets Shaymin-S survive in battle longer and a Growth boost provides more power than a Life Orb does.

The Life Orb recoil, however, compounds Shaymin-S's frailty, sometimes not even getting a chance to KO Scizor before it goes down to Bullet Punch. Scizor is best dealt with using Dialga, Palkia, or Mewtwo lures before attempting to sweep with Shaymin-S.

There are four particular Choice Scarf holders that outspeed Shaymin-S and resist both Seed Flare and Air Slash; Dialga, Metagross, Jirachi, and Heatran. Wobbuffet and defensive Groudon are helpful against them. Kyogre and Heatran can easily switch into Jirachi’s's and Metagross’ 's Ice Punches and Heatran's Fire Blast, whilst retaliating with powerful STABs. Note that none of these threats enjoy Shaymin-S’'s Earth Powers, so you try hiting them on the switch.

The IVs can be reduced to 29 to reduce Stealth Rock and Life Orb damage by 1, but it will take two turns of Life Orb recoil to make up for the lost HP.

Move this last mini-paragraph above the others. Lately, we've been organizing sets so that they describe in order: what the moveset's goal is, what the moves do, what the EV/IVs do, and what counters this set and who are good teammates. It's not of the utmost importance to do so, but in this case, it seems awkward to have a tiny little paragraph at the end of AC, kind of in the middle of nowhere.

[SET]
name: Choice Specs
move 1: Seed Flare
move 2: Air Slash
move 3: Earth Power
move 4: Hidden Power Ice / Hidden Power Fire
item: Choice Specs
nature: Timid
evs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

Choice Specs Shaymin-S wields great power without the need to set up or the constant recoil of Life Orb. Seed Flare deals massive damage to many Pokémon, OHKOing Darkrai, Kyogre, and Groudon, while also having a chance to OHKO offensive Mewtwo and Garchomp, and even giving Rayquaza trouble in setting up. Air Slash almost always 2HKOes 252 HP / 168 SpD Careful Scizor, and always 2HKOes Rayquaza, Darkrai, Garchomp, and Palkia, (remove comma) after Stealth Rock damage. Earth Power 2HKOes Dialga, Metagross, and Jirachi, while Hidden Power Ice almost always 2HKOes Lugia with a Modest nature. With a Timid nature, it still OHKOes Garchomp and Rayquaza and after Stealth Rock damage and 2HKOes 86 HP / 96 SpD Giratina-O 90% of the time. Alternatively, Hidden Power Fire roasts Scizor and Skarmory.

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

Timid is the preferred nature to outspeed Darkrai, but Modest is reasonable if you have Spikes support for the very real possibility of 2HKOing Blissey, Palkia, and Rayquaza, and OHKOing Garchomp and Mewtwo with Seed Flare.

The few Pokémon who can take Choice Specs Shaymin-S’s's Seed Flares are generally Shaymin-S’s's biggest threats. These include Blissey, Skarmory, Latias, Lugia, Choice Scarf Dialga, Heatran, opposing Shaymin-S, and Scizor, all of whom can immediately retaliate against Shaymin-S. Rayquaza is another check, though it will lose to a if Seed Flare gets a Special Defense drop. Most of the partners mentioned in the Choice Scarf set are thus valuable for the Choice Specs set. If running Modest, it is wise to have a Sleep Talker like Kyogre to deal with Darkrai. Alternatively, Choice Scarf Heracross can switch into most of Darkrai’s's moves and can OHKO with its STABs. Choice Scarf Dialga, Palkia, and Mewtwo are all excellent revenge killers of Darkrai.

[Team Options]

Like most offensive Pokémon, Shaymin-S greatly appreciates Stealth Rock support, as it nets Shaymin-S several vital KOs. Shaymin-S’s's Stealth Rock weakness shortens the life of this already frail Pokémon, hence Forretress makes a great teammate due to its access to Rapid Spin. Forretress can also take Ice-type moves aimed at Shaymin-S and set up Spikes to net Shaymin-S further KOs. Giratina-O can spinblock for Shaymin-S and help it to beat stall teams. With Calm Mind, it can lure in and defeat Skarmory, Blissey, Lugia, Heatran, and Bulk Up Dialga. Gengar and Giratina's Altered Forme-O are other alternatives, with Gengar being able to defeat Scizor and some of Rayquaza's sets depending on whether it uses Life Orb or Choice Scarf. In addition, using Pokémon who attract Groudon’s's or Garchomp’s 's Earthquakes like Dialga, Metagross, Jirachi, and Heatran is highly recommended, as this can give Shaymin-S a free switch in. In particular, Choice Scarf Jirachi can threaten Rayquaza, opposing Shaymin-S, and defensive Pokémon (with Trick).

There are many partners to choose from in terms of lures. Mixed Dialga can pose as a Choice Scarf user, luring in Blissey, Latias, Skarmory, Metagross, Lugia, and Wobbuffet, and slam them with Outrage (OHKOing Latias) or Fire Blast. Mixed Dialga can also destroy Adamant Swords Dance Rayquaza and opposing Choiced Shaymin-S. Mixed Palkia and Mixed Rayquaza can also lure in most of the aforementioned. Darkrai and Taunt + Calm Mind Mewtwo can set up on and crush Lugia and Giratina, though Darkrai cannot safely switch into Latias’s's Dragon Pulse and will require her to be weakened. Mewtwo can lure Scizor in, only to OHKO it with Fire Blast, and can use Selfdestruct to gain a surprise KO on Blissey, or Taunt her to gain an advantage. Finally, Mewtwo can revenge kill opposing non-Choice Scarf Shaymin-S with Ice Beam. Haban Berry Garchomp can lure Choice Scarf Dialga in as it uses Swords Dance and then survive Dialga's Draco Meteor while OHKOing Dialga with a Swords Dance boosted Earthquake in return. Yache Berry Garchomp does the same with Choice Scarf Jirachi, Metagross, and Heatran. Bulk Up Dialga can use Choice Scarf Jirachi, Metagross, and Scizor as set-up bait.

There are also many good options for defensive partners. Heatran is notable for resisting almost all of Shaymin-S's weaknesses and vice versa, and the pair resists 15 of the 17 types between the two of them. In the sun, Heatran can also OHKO Scizor, opposing Shaymin-S, Dialga, Metagross, and Jirachi with Fire Blast, and OHKO opposing Choice Heatran with Earth Power. Kyogre and Steel-types in general have similar defensive synergy with Shaymin-S, and Kyogre can run Calm Mind or absorb sleep with Sleep Talk. Blissey can defeat Dialga without physical attacks, opposing Shaymin-S without Leech Seed, Latias without Refresh or Safeguard, and Lugia if she has Toxic. Groudon, especially defensive support variants, resists Rock-type moves and can handle Dialga, Blissey, and Scizor. As well, it Not only that, but it can lure Skarmory, opposing Shaymin-S, Lugia, and Latias, OHKOing the former two with Overheat and using Toxic on the latter two. Garchomp resists Rock-type and Fire-type moves as well. Scizor can easily switch into Deoxys-A's, Choice Scarf Kygore’s's, and Mewtwo’s's (without Fire Blast) Ice Beams, as well as Dragon-type attacks from Choice Scarf Palkia and Garchomp, and retaliate immediately. Specially defensive Choice Band Tyranitar can survive Mewtwo’s's Aura Spheres and destroy Mewtwo with Crunch or Pursuit whilst taking little damage from any incoming Ice Beams.

An alternative to checking some of Shaymin-S's defensive checks and revenge killers is simply to trap them. Tickle Wobbuffet paired with a Pursuit user, such as like Scizor or Tyranitar, (comma) can spell doom for both Blissey and Lugia. Both Scizor and Tyranitar are capable of destroying Latias with Pursuit, whilst Tyranitar can utilize Taunt and Dragon Dance to set up on Blissey, Lugia, and Skarmory. Wobbuffet also spells doom for most Choice Scarf users, Darkrai being a notable exception.

For Mixed Dialga, it's best to revenge kill it via Pokémon like Garchomp and Lucario.

[Optional Changes]

Swords Dance is a viable alternative, but Shaymin-S has a poor physical movepool and is completely walled by Lugia, Giratina, Giratina-O, and almost any Steel-type Pokémon. Hidden Power Rock OHKOs Ho-Oh and 2HKOs Rayquaza and Shaymin-S after Stealth Rock damage, but otherwise, it’s's outclassed by Hidden Power / Ice. Quick Attack has priority, but its low power is off-putting even against Deoxys-A. Secret Power as an option that can paralyze the opponent 60% of the time.

Grass Knot can replace Seed Flare as an alternate STAB attack. It has 100% accuracy and four times the PP of Seed Flare, as well as 120 Base Power against most Pokémon in Ubers. However, it only hits Wobbuffet for 60 Base Power attack and Mew and Manaphy for 20 Base Power. Grass Knot also lacks Seed Flare's chance of lowering the opponent's Special Defense by two stages, one of Shaymin-S’'s best selling points. Energy Ball is a 100% accurate Grass-type attack that still hits Manaphy for a large amount of damage with a 40% chance of dropping the foes Special Attack Defense, but the power loss generally makes it an inferior option.

Type-resisting bBerries, (comma) such as Yache Berry, (comma) could be considered, but Mewtwo and Kyogre will still OHKO Shaymin-S through a Yache Berry. Both Petaya Berry and Salac Berry are viable options for an offensively oriented Substitute set. Finally, Wide Lens will allow Shaymin-S to have a more accurate Seed Flare and Air Slash.

Psych Up can be used to steal the foes’'s stat ups, but it is far less reliable than Growth and Swords Dance are. Shaymin-S has Safeguard and Aromatherapy for status protection, but it’s's generally too frail to use them effectively. Worry Seed can stop Giratina and Dialga from using their main method of recovery, Rest, but it’s's generally not worth the moveslot. Toxic cripples both Lugia and Latias if they attempt to switch into Shaymin-S. Synthesis is Shaymin-S’s's only recovery move beyond Rest and Leech Seed, and it can be used to extend Life Orb Shaymin-S’s's life span when paired with Groudon’s's eternal sunlight. Finally, Shaymin-S is arguably the best user of Healing Wish due to its 127 base Speed stat. Healing Wish can restore a weakened sweeper to full health, giving it another chance to sweep when its counter is most likely weakened.

[Counters]

Blissey is often the most reliable counter to Shaymin-S. She can absorb most of its attacks with ease and either cripple Shaymin-S with Thunder Wave or Toxic, or simply OHKO Shaymin-S with Ice Beam with Stealth Rock support. However, she loses against the SubSeed variant, and she may be 2HKOed by a Modest Choice Specs Seed Flare if Blissey's Special Defense is halved. Special defensive Skarmory can take Shaymin-S's assaults, (comma) except for Hidden Power Fire, (comma) and simply Whirlwind Shaymin-S away (causing it to take more damage from Stealth Rock) or OHKO Shaymin-S with Brave Bird with Stealth Rock in play. Although Lugia and Latias risk falling to Air Slash flinches after a Seed Flare Special Defense drop, they can take most of Shaymin-S's assaults and OHKO it with Ice Beam and Dragon Pulse, respectively, after Stealth Rock damage. Lugia can also use Whirlwind to stop Shaymin-S from stalling with Leech Seed.

Ho-Oh can switch into any of Shaymin-S's attacks and OHKO with Sacred Fire. Scizor can easily switch into Seed Flare and threaten any Shaymin-S without Hidden Power Fire. Scizor 2HKOs Shaymin-S with Bullet Punch and can U-turn for heavy damage as well as scout possible switch-ins. Choice Band Scizor can even use Pursuit to put Shaymin-S into the KO range of Stealth Rock on its next switch-in (provided that Shaymin-S has already taken Stealth Rock damage.) However, a Choice Specs boosted Air Slash will 2HKO Scizor. Choice Scarf Dialga and Heatran can easily switch into Seed Flare and Air Slash. They can also OHKO Shaymin-S with Fire Blast (or Draco Meteor in Dialga’s's case). Choice Scarf Jirachi and Metagross resist Seed Flare and Air Slash and can OHKO Shaymin-S with Ice Punch. However, Dialga, Heatran, Metagross, and Jirachi are 2HKOed Earth Power (Heatran is OHKOed). Faster Pokémon like Mewtwo, Deoxys-A and Choice Scarf Garchomp, Palkia, Darkrai, and Kyogre can revenge kill non-Choice Scarf Shaymin-S with Ice Beam or STAB Dragon-type attacks. However, Choice Scarf Mewtwo can even outspeed Choice Scarf Shaymin-S.

Concision my ass. Lol, very clean write up, almost nothing to change even for the first GP check.

GP 1/2

capefeather · Jan 30, 2011

Revisions added. Thanks!

Komodo · Jan 30, 2011

~GP check 2/2~

capefeather said:
[Overview]
Shaymin-S's brilliant traits, such as a STAB move that crushes both Kyogre and Groudon and a base Speed that beats even Darkrai's, make it a powerful threat in Ubers. It is also very capable of abusing the significant impact of luck in Ubers with its infamous Serene Grace ability combined with its dreaded STABs Seed Flare and Air Slash, often turning the tables upon the opponent even in the direst of situations. Unfortunately, it is fairly frail by Uber standards, being only slightly bulkier than Darkrai. It's also weak to Stealth Rock and forced out by many common Pokémon like Dialga and Scizor. Nevertheless, Shaymin-S is an excellent choice for almost any offensive Uber team because of the significant impact that it can make on the opponent in a relatively short time.

[SET]
name: Choice Scarf
move 1: Seed Flare
move 2: Air Slash
move 3: Earth Power
move 4: Hidden Power Ice
item: Choice Scarf
nature: Timid / Modest
evs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
A Choice Scarf enables Shaymin-S to become both a great revenge killer and a decent lead. It's also arguably the best offensive answer to Rock Polish Groudon, as it is immune to Earthquake, and it can outrun most Groudon even after a Rock Polish and OHKO it with its powerful STAB Seed Flare. As a lead, it should try for an Air Slash flinch against Deoxys-A and Deoxys-S leads, which will usually prevent them from setting up entry hazards, and it easily beats Groudon leads who don't invest heavily in Special Defense.

Both of Shaymin-S's STABs allow it to get out of many tough situations thanks to Seed Flare's 68% overall Special Defense drop rate, as well as Air Slash's 57% overall flinch rate and neutrality against most Pokémon in the Uber environment. Earth Power 2HKOes most Steel-type switch-ins, though specially defensive Dialga will survive two Earth Powers, usually even after a Special Defense drop. Hidden Power Ice allows Shaymin-S to revenge kill Garchomp, opposing Shaymin-S, and Dragon Dance Rayquaza lacking ExtremeSpeed.

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]
Non-lead Shaymin-S should have a Modest nature to guarantee Seed Flare's OHKO on faster variants of Kyogre with Stealth Rock damage. The only somewhat common Pokémon in Ubers who will outspeed Modest Shaymin-S are Timid Choice Scarf Darkrai, opposing Shaymin-S, and Mewtwo. When used as a lead, Shaymin-S should be Timid so that it can outspeed the aforementioned Darkrai, another common lead.

Leaf Storm is an option to use in place of Seed Flare with a Modest nature, which OHKOes both max HP Kyogre and 4 HP / 0 SpD Darkrai after Stealth Rock damage. However, this leaves Shaymin-S vulnerable to Calm Mind users like Latias and Mewtwo, and Leaf Storm lacks the Special Defense lowering effect of Seed Flare. Thus, it should only be used if Shaymin-S's team really needs the KOs that Leaf Storm provides. Don't use Leaf Storm with a Timid nature, as the only benefit to doing so is gaining an OHKO on 4 HP / 0 SpD Kyogre after Stealth Rock.

Generally, Choice Scarf Shaymin-S's biggest foes resist its STABs or have extremely high special bulk. Scizor and Dialga can heavily dent Shaymin-S with most of their attacks, with Choice Band Scizor dealing at least 53% with Pursuit, which is potentially fatal with Stealth Rock in play, while Dialga can set up on Shaymin-S with Bulk Up. Lugia, opposing Shaymin-S, Rayquaza, Ho-Oh, Latios, and Latias can switch into Seed Flare and Earth Power and either threaten Shaymin-S immediately or set up. The massive defensive stats of Giratina, specially defensive Skarmory, and Blissey allow them to shrug off Shaymin-S's assaults to cripple it in various ways (e.g. status, phazing, PP stalling), as long as Seed Flare doesn't net too many Special Defense drops. Giratina-O is a more offensive check that can pick off a weakened Shaymin-S with Shadow Sneak. Finally, Wobbuffet can easily trap and revenge kill Choice Scarf Shaymin-S with Mirror Coat.

In terms of teammates, mixed variants of Dialga, Palkia, and Rayquaza can lure in most of Shaymin-S's defensive checks. For a more threatening approach, Darkrai and Calm Mind Mewtwo can set up on and crush Shaymin-S's checks quite well. Alternatively, Wobbuffet can trap and KO many of Shaymin-S's checks. For Mixed Dialga, it's best to revenge kill it via Pokémon like Garchomp and Lucario. Good defensive partners include Kyogre, Groudon, Jirachi, and Blissey.

Something to note about leading with Choice Scarf Shaymin-S is that it often relies on Air Slash's flinch rate to beat other leads such as Darkrai, so having a Sleep Talker waiting in the wings such as Kyogre is advisable. Hidden Power Fire is a viable option on this set to destroy Scizor leads and Forretress or Skarmory switch-ins. However, it requires Shaymin-S to lower its Speed IV to 30, meaning that opposing Choice Scarf Shaymin-S will beat it.

There are also several leads that almost always beat Shaymin-S:(colon) Choice Scarf Mewtwo outspeeds Shaymin-S and OHKOs with Ice Beam, while 252 HP Kyogre, Dialga, and Tyranitar can survive one of Shaymin-S's attacks and OHKO in retaliation. Scizor leads trouble Shaymin-S that lack Hidden Power Fire, 3HKOing with Bullet Punch. An allied Blissey can easily wall lead Kyogre, Dialga, and Mewtwo, while Groudon can switch into Tyranitar and Scizor and severely damage or OHKO them with Earthquake or a Fire-type attack. Although Draco Meteor will do a huge amount of damage to Groudon, STAB Earthquake will often scare Dialga off as well. While Palkia and Latias can destroy Kyogre, several lead Kyogre carry Thunder Wave to take advantage of these switch-ins. A Dialga of your own can switch into Mewtwo, Kyogre, and Scizor, and threaten them with Draco Meteor, Thunder, and Fire Blast respectively.

[SET]
name: SubSeed
move 1: Substitute
move 2: Leech Seed
move 3: Seed Flare
move 4: Air Slash / Hidden Power Fire / Earth Power
item: Leftovers
nature: Timid
evs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
The main idea of the SubSeed strategy is to switch into Pokémon who Shaymin-S can scare out, set up Substitute as they switch, and then either attack the next switch-in or use Leech Seed. Substitute is a great scouting tool for both Shaymin-S and partners looking to answer some of its checks. Shaymin-S is the fastest Leech Seed user outside of the sun, and it can pose an offensive threat with its base 120 Special Attack and Seed Flare Special Defense drops. Leech Seeding common switch-ins such as Blissey and Giratina allows Shaymin-S to restore huge amounts of health per turn, even making up for the Substitute HP loss in the former case. Eventually, Blissey will run out of Seismic Toss, and Shaymin-S can then pound Blissey with Seed Flare until her battered special bulk can take no more.

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]
Seed Flare can cause a lot of switches, due to its high chance of halving the opponent's Special Defense, forcing the opponent's Pokémon to take more damage from entry hazards and Leech Seed. For the last moveslot, Air Slash is generally the best choice due to its flinches wasting Leech Seed turns. Air Slash is also super effective on two other Leech Seeders seen in Ubers, Jumpluff and Ludicolo. However, Air Slash can leave Shaymin-S open to huge threats like Bulk Up Dialga and Scizor, the latter whom has Bullet Punch's priority and U-turn to break Shaymin-S's Substitute and switch out simultaneously. Because of this, Hidden Power Fire is viable to OHKO Scizor and 2HKO Metagross and Skarmory in the sun. Alternatively, Earth Power 3HKOs the standard Bulk Up Dialga, preventing it from Rest stalling Shaymin-S. Earth Power also 2HKOes Metagross and offensive Dialga. Finally, Hidden Power Ice can OHKO Rayquaza, Garchomp, and opposing Shaymin-S; Rayquaza may attempt to set up on Shaymin-S otherwise.

Investing in defenses is not beneficial, as Shaymin-S's Substitutes will still be broken from most of the attacks thrown at it. Just maxing out Speed and Special Attack is recommended. This set can use 252 HP EVs to make Shaymin-S's Substitutes unbreakable by Blissey's Seismic Toss, but the power loss is often not worth it.

Entry hazard support is particularly crucial to this set's success, punishing the opponent for the many switches that this set causes. Wobbuffet support is also highly recommended, as many players rely on Choice Scarf holders like Palkia, Dialga, and Garchomp to defeat most Shaymin-S sets. Shaymin-S is thus an effective scout for almost all of these Pokémon with Substitute, and in turn allows Wobbuffet to revenge kill them more easily later in the match. Wobbuffet can also help Shaymin-S to find time to set up with Encore. Tickle Wobbuffet in particular can be paired with a user of Pursuit (preferably Pursuit user such as Tyranitar or Scizor) to eliminate Lugia.

SubSeed Shaymin-S's problems are largely dependent on the last move, as mentioned earlier. In general, though, Ho-Oh, Lugia, Giratina, and Giratina-O can all stall Shaymin-S out. Tyranitar is one of the most reliable counters to Giratina-O, and can use Taunt + Dragon Dance to set up on Lugia, Skarmory, and Giratina. When using Hidden Power Fire, make sure you use Groudon with Shaymin-S, as the sun is required for the KOs on every one of these Pokémon, except of Scizor.

[SET]
name: Life Orb
move 1: Seed Flare
move 3: Air Slash
move 2: Earth Power
move 4: Hidden Power Ice / Hidden Power Fire / Growth
item: Life Orb
nature: Timid
evs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Shaymin-S has great offensive stats to pull off a simple Life Orb set, netting many important OHKOs with its STABs and Earth Power that it cannot normally obtain on Darkrai, Kyogre, Shaymin-S, Heatran, and most Groudon, as well as 2HKOs on Garchomp, Palkia, Rayquaza, Metagross, most Dialga, most Jirachi, and Scizor assuming Stealth Rock damage. A Special Defense drop from Seed Flare can even put Lugia, Latias, Giratina, Giratina-O, and Skarmory within 2HKO range from Air Slash, though in Skarmory's case, the probability is very small. Hidden Power Ice will turn some of these 2HKOs into OHKOs, while Hidden Power Fire easily OHKOs Scizor and 2HKOs Skarmory in the sun.

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]
Alternatively, Growth can alternatively be used in the last slot, which enables Shaymin-S to net even more KOs that it would otherwise miss, turning 2HKOs on Garchomp, Palkia, and Dialga into OHKOs. In particular, +1 Earth Power OHKOes max HP Dialga 66% chance of the time after Stealth Rock damage. When using Growth, Leftovers becomes a viable item option, as it lets Shaymin-S survive in battle longer and a Growth boost provides more power than a Life Orb does.

The Life Orb recoil compounds Shaymin-S's frailty, sometimes not even getting a chance to KO Scizor before it goes down to Bullet Punch. Scizor is best dealt with using Dialga, Palkia, or Mewtwo lures before attempting to sweep with Shaymin-S. The IVs can be reduced to 29 to reduce Stealth Rock and Life Orb damage by 1, but it will take two turns of Life Orb recoil to make up for the lost HP.

There are four particular Choice Scarf holders that outspeed Shaymin-S and resist both Seed Flare and Air Slash; Dialga, Metagross, Jirachi, and Heatran. Wobbuffet and defensive Groudon are helpful against them. Kyogre and Heatran can easily switch into Jirachi's and Metagross's Ice Punches and Heatran's Fire Blast, whilst retaliating with powerful STABs. Note that none of these threats enjoy Shaymin-S's Earth Powers, so you can try hitting them on the switch.

[SET]
name: Choice Specs
move 1: Seed Flare
move 2: Air Slash
move 3: Earth Power
move 4: Hidden Power Ice / Hidden Power Fire
item: Choice Specs
nature: Timid
evs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Choice Specs Shaymin-S wields great power without the need to set up or the constant recoil of Life Orb. Seed Flare deals massive damage to many Pokémon, OHKOing Darkrai, Kyogre, and Groudon, while also having a chance to OHKO offensive Mewtwo and Garchomp, and even giving Rayquaza trouble in setting up. Air Slash almost always 2HKOes 252 HP / 168 SpD Careful Scizor, and always 2HKOes Rayquaza, Darkrai, Garchomp, and Palkia after Stealth Rock damage. Earth Power 2HKOes Dialga, Metagross, and Jirachi, while Hidden Power Ice almost always 2HKOes Lugia with a Modest nature. With a Timid nature, it still OHKOes Garchomp and Rayquaza and after Stealth Rock damage and 2HKOes 86 HP / 96 SpD Giratina-O 90% of the time. Alternatively, Hidden Power Fire roasts Scizor and Skarmory.

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]
Timid is the preferred nature to outspeed Darkrai, but Modest is reasonable if you have Spikes support for the very real possibility of 2HKOing Blissey, Palkia, and Rayquaza, and OHKOing Garchomp and Mewtwo with Seed Flare.

The few Pokémon who can take Choice Specs Shaymin-S's Seed Flares are generally Shaymin-S's biggest threats. These include Blissey, Skarmory, Latias, Lugia, Choice Scarf Dialga, Heatran, opposing Shaymin-S, and Scizor, all of whom can immediately retaliate against Shaymin-S. Rayquaza is another check, though it will lose if Seed Flare gets a Special Defense drop. If running Modest, it is wise to have a Sleep Talker like Kyogre to deal with Darkrai. Alternatively, Choice Scarf Heracross can switch into most of Darkrai's moves and can OHKO with its STABs. Choice Scarf Dialga, Palkia, and Mewtwo are all excellent revenge killers of Darkrai.

[Team Options]
Like most offensive Pokémon, Shaymin-S greatly appreciates Stealth Rock support, as it nets Shaymin-S several vital KOs. Shaymin-S's Stealth Rock weakness shortens the life of this already frail Pokémon, hence Forretress makes a great teammate due to its access to Rapid Spin. Forretress can also take Ice-type moves aimed at Shaymin-S and set up Spikes to net Shaymin-S further KOs. Giratina-O can spinblock for Shaymin-S and help it to beat stall teams. With Calm Mind, it can lure in and defeat Skarmory, Blissey, Lugia, Heatran, and Bulk Up Dialga. Gengar and Giratina are other alternatives, with Gengar being able to defeat Scizor and some of Rayquaza's sets depending on whether it uses Life Orb or Choice Scarf. In addition, using Pokémon who attract Groudon's or Garchomp's Earthquakes like Dialga, Metagross, Jirachi, and Heatran is highly recommended, as this can give Shaymin-S a free switch in. In particular, Choice Scarf Jirachi can threaten Rayquaza, opposing Shaymin-S, and defensive Pokémon with Trick.

There are many partners to choose from in terms of lures. Mixed Dialga can pose as a Choice Scarf user, luring in Blissey, Latias, Skarmory, Metagross, Lugia, and Wobbuffet, and slam them with Outrage (OHKOing Latias) or Fire Blast. Mixed Dialga can also destroy Adamant Swords Dance Rayquaza and opposing Choiced Shaymin-S. Mixed Palkia and Mixed Rayquaza can also lure in most of the aforementioned. Darkrai and Taunt + Calm Mind Mewtwo can set up on and crush Lugia and Giratina, though Darkrai cannot safely switch into Latias's Dragon Pulse and will require her to be weakened. Mewtwo can lure Scizor in, only to OHKO it with Fire Blast, and can use Selfdestruct to gain a surprise KO on Blissey, or Taunt her to gain an advantage. Finally, Mewtwo can revenge kill opposing non-Choice Scarf Shaymin-S with Ice Beam. Haban Berry Garchomp can lure Choice Scarf Dialga in as it uses Swords Dance and then survive Dialga's Draco Meteor while OHKOing Dialga with a Swords Dance boosted Earthquake in return. Yache Berry Garchomp does the same with Choice Scarf Jirachi, Metagross, and Heatran. Bulk Up Dialga can use Choice Scarf Jirachi, Metagross, and Scizor as set-up bait.

There are also many good options for defensive partners. Heatran is notable for resisting almost all of Shaymin-S's weaknesses and vice versa, and the pair resists 15 of the 17 types between them. In the sun, Heatran can also OHKO Scizor, opposing Shaymin-S, Dialga, Metagross, and Jirachi with Fire Blast, and OHKO opposing Choice Heatran with Earth Power. Kyogre and Steel-types in general have similar defensive synergy with Shaymin-S, and Kyogre can run Calm Mind or absorb sleep with Sleep Talk. Blissey can defeat Dialga without physical attacks, opposing Shaymin-S without Leech Seed, Latias without Refresh or Safeguard, and Lugia if she has Toxic. Groudon, especially defensive support variants, resists Rock-type moves and can handle Dialga, Blissey, and Scizor. It can also lure Skarmory, opposing Shaymin-S, Lugia, and Latias, OHKOing the former two with Overheat and using Toxic on the latter two. Garchomp resists Rock-type and Fire-type moves as well. Scizor can easily switch into Deoxys-A's, Choice Scarf Kygore's, and Mewtwo's (without Fire Blast) Ice Beams, as well as Dragon-type attacks from Choice Scarf Palkia and Garchomp, and retaliate immediately. Specially defensive Choice Band Tyranitar can survive Mewtwo's Aura Sphere and destroy Mewtwo with Crunch or Pursuit whilst taking little damage from any incoming Ice Beams.

An alternative to checking some of Shaymin-S's defensive checks and revenge killers is simply to trap them. Tickle Wobbuffet paired with a Pursuit user, such as Scizor or Tyranitar, can spell doom for both Blissey and Lugia. Both Scizor and Tyranitar are capable of destroying Latias with Pursuit, whilst Tyranitar can utilize Taunt and Dragon Dance to set up on Blissey, Lugia, and Skarmory. Wobbuffet also spells doom for most Choice Scarf users, Darkrai being a notable exception.

[Optional Changes]
Swords Dance is an alternative, but Shaymin-S has a poor physical movepool and is completely walled by Lugia, Giratina, Giratina-O, and almost any Steel-type Pokémon. Hidden Power Rock OHKOs Ho-Oh and 2HKOs Rayquaza and Shaymin-S after Stealth Rock damage, but otherwise, it's outclassed by Hidden Power Ice. Quick Attack has priority, but its low power is off-putting even against Deoxys-A. Secret Power is another option that can paralyze the opponent 60% of the time.

As an alternate STAB, Grass Knot has 100% accuracy, four times the PP of Seed Flare, and 120 Base Power against most Pokémon in Ubers. However, it only hits Wobbuffet for 60 Base Power attack and Mew and Manaphy for 20 Base Power. Grass Knot also lacks Seed Flare's chance of lowering the opponent's Specially Defense by two stages, one of Shaymin-S's best selling points. Energy Ball is another 100% accurate Grass-type attack that still hits Manaphy for a large amount of damage with a 40% chance of dropping the foes Special Attack, but the power loss generally makes it an inferior option.

Type-resisting Berries, such as Yache Berry, could be considered, but Mewtwo and Kyogre will still OHKO Shaymin-S through a Yache Berry. Both Petaya Berry and Salac Berry are viable options for an offensively oriented Substitute set. Finally, Wide Lens will allow Shaymin-S to have a more accurate Seed Flare and Air Slash.

Psych Up can be used to steal the foe's stat ups, but it is far less reliable than Growth and Swords Dance are. Shaymin-S has Safeguard and Aromatherapy for status protection, but it's generally too frail to use them effectively. Worry Seed can stop Giratina and Dialga from using their main method of recovery, Rest, but it's generally not worth the moveslot. Toxic cripples both Lugia and Latias if they attempt to switch into Shaymin-S. Synthesis is Shaymin-S's only recovery move beyond Rest, and it can be used to extend Life Orb Shaymin-S's life span when paired with Groudon's eternal sunlight. Finally, Shaymin-S is arguably the best user of Healing Wish due to its 127 base Speed stat. Healing Wish can restore a weakened sweeper to full health, giving it another chance to sweep when its counter is most likely weakened.

[Counters]
Blissey is often the most reliable counter to Shaymin-S. She can absorb most of its attacks with ease and either cripple Shaymin-S with Thunder Wave or Toxic, or simply OHKO Shaymin-S with Ice Beam with Stealth Rock support. However, she loses against the SubSeed variant, and she may be 2HKOed by a Modest Choice Specs Seed Flare if Blissey's Special Defense is halved. Specially defensive Skarmory can take Shaymin-S's assaults, except for Hidden Power Fire, and simply Whirlwind Shaymin-S away (causing it to take more damage from Stealth Rock) or OHKO Shaymin-S with Brave Bird with Stealth Rock in play. Although Lugia and Latias risk falling to Air Slash flinches after a Seed Flare Special Defense drop, they can take most of Shaymin-S's assaults and OHKO it with Ice Beam and Dragon Pulse, respectively, after Stealth Rock damage. Lugia can also use Whirlwind to stop Shaymin-S from stalling with Leech Seed.

Ho-Oh can switch into any of Shaymin-S's attacks and OHKO with Sacred Fire. Scizor can easily switch into Seed Flare and threaten any Shaymin-S without Hidden Power Fire. Scizor 2HKOs Shaymin-S with Bullet Punch and can U-turn for heavy damage as well as scout possible switch-ins. Choice Band Scizor can even use Pursuit to put Shaymin-S into the KO range of Stealth Rock on its next switch-in (provided that Shaymin-S has already taken Stealth Rock damage.) However, a Choice Specs boosted Air Slash will 2HKO Scizor. Choice Scarf Dialga and Heatran can easily switch into Seed Flare and Air Slash. They can also OHKO Shaymin-S with Fire Blast (or Draco Meteor in Dialga's case). Choice Scarf Jirachi and Metagross resist Seed Flare and Air Slash and can OHKO Shaymin-S with Ice Punch. However, Dialga, Heatran, Metagross, and Jirachi are 2HKOed Earth Power (Heatran is OHKOed). Faster Pokémon like Mewtwo, Deoxys-A and Choice Scarf Garchomp, Palkia, Darkrai, and Kyogre can revenge kill non-Choice Scarf Shaymin-S with Ice Beam or STAB Dragon-type attacks. However, Choice Scarf Mewtwo can outspeed even Choice Scarf Shaymin-S.

Red is remove
Blue is an edit

One of the best analyses I've read, hardly anything to change, just minor things.

capefeather · Jan 31, 2011

Thanks, Komodo! Ready for upload now, I think.

Fireburn · Feb 12, 2011

Uploaded.

Shaymin-S (Update)

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firecape

This is the end...

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calze6

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calze6

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Fireburn

BARN ALL

Jibaku

Who let marco in here????

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Aeron Ee1

Nom nom nom

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Oglemi

Zoltraak

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Komodo

Huff

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Fireburn

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