Ambipom (Update)

Flora

Yep, that tasted purple!
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a Top Contributor Alumnusis a Top Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus
429.png

Ambipom Xia's old thread for reference

Banedon wrote Pure Baton Passer so give him credit upon upload.

---------------

[Overview]

<p>Quick and versatile, Ambipom is a widely popular choice for any offensive team in need of a hand. Thanks to his incredible base 115 Speed and great movepool, he can effectively act as a lead, late-game sweeper, weather supporter, or even Baton Passer. Ambipom's base 100 Attack isn't too shabby either, as combined with the rare ability Technician, his attacks will start madly ripping almost anything to shreds. He has a couple of issues though, namely his fragility, lack of resistances, and the fact that he can't get through certain physical walls with his power alone. Still, even with these flaws, Ambipom is rightfully placed as a top-tier threat in UU due to his famed hit-and-run tactics that anyone should watch out for.</p>

[SET]
name: Lead
move 1: Fake Out
move 2: Taunt
move 3: Low Kick / Pursuit / Payback
move 4: U-turn / Return
item: Life Orb / Silk Scarf
ability: Technician
nature: Jolly
evs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

<p>Ambipom has all of the ingredients he needs to become a successful lead. Fake Out should generally be used first to not only break Focus Sashes, but to gain vital information on your opponent; what item your opponent's lead Pokemon is holding, what the response to Ambipom was, or even the identification of the opponent's set by determining how much damage it received from Fake Out are helpful clues. Taunt, in tandem with Ambipom's amazing Speed, prevents common leads, such as Uxie, Omastar, and Qwilfish, from setting up disastrous entry hazards on your side. The other moves are just the icing on the cake: Low Kick is recommended for bashing Omastar, Kabutops, and Registeel, while U-turn is useful for scouting your opponent's predicted moves. Against leads such as Mismagius, Uxie, and Mesprit, there are two Dark-type moves that can be considered over Low Kick. Pursuit can trap the aforementioned Pokemon and take priority over both pixie's U-turn, while Payback is the more powerful choice in general. If you feel that U-turn is redundant, then Return is a valuable option to deal consistent damage to many common Pokemon. Life Orb is the preferred item as it boosts the power of Ambipom's every attack to a deadly level, but Silk Scarf can be used instead to boost both Fake Out's and Return's damage output without any recoil.</p>

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

<p>It should be noted that even though this Ambipom is a lead, you can still effectively utilize him during mid- and late-game if you can preserve his HP. Switching Ambipom on a double switch and Taunting set-up sweepers is a good way to save yourself from a loss. Moreover, Ambipom's Ghost immunity and access to Pursuit allows him to eradicate Ghost-types, such as Nasty Plot Mismagius and Choice Scarf Rotom, who could be lingering around.</p>

<p>As this Ambipom's purpose is to scout for information, stop set-up attempts, and drain the opponent's HP over time, any sweeper with a Fighting resistance and Stealth Rock weakness will thoroughly enjoy Ambipom's company. Moltres and Scyther love coming in from Ambipom's U-turn in order to use U-turn again to keep momentum on your side, or use a powerful attack such as Fire Blast or Aerial Ace, respectively. Other Pokemon with just a Fighting resistance or a Stealth Rock weakness are great partners as well. Toxicroak and Nidoking are capable of threatening a wide majority of the metagame with their immense coverage and unpredictability, while Arcanine and Altaria can dish out decent amounts of damage and take repeated punishment thanks to their respectable bulk.</p>

<p>Ambipom has a couple of poor lead match-ups, especially against Spiritomb, Alakazam, and Hariyama. Spiritomb and Hariyama take little damage from Ambipom and can smack him with Pursuit and Close Combat, accordingly, while Alakazam has Inner Focus to stop Fake Out and Psychic to destroy Ambipom. Additionally, Ambipom has trouble defeating several bulky leads, such as Uxie, Omastar, and Cloyster, as they can take repeated hits and 2-3HKO back with their respective STAB attacks. Although he shares a Fighting weakness with Ambipom, Houndoom can be an impressive partner due to his ability to eliminate Spiritomb, Alakazam, and Uxie with his STAB attacks. Meanwhile, a Uxie of your own is capable of stopping Hariyama, Omastar, and Cloyster, thanks to his tremendous bulk and access to Psychic and Thunderbolt.</p>

[SET]
name: All-Out Attacker
move 1: Fake Out
move 2: Return
move 3: Low Kick
move 4: Pursuit / Payback
item: Life Orb
ability: Technician
nature: Jolly
evs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

<p>Although this set is quite similar to the Lead set, it is different in that it lacks Taunt and focuses on sweeping later in the game with four attacks. Start off the battle with Fake Out, as it is essentially free damage against the opponent (unless Ambipom is met with a Ghost-type). Afterward, Ambipom should follow up with the appropriate attacking move. Return gives Ambipom a reliable attack to bash any Pokemon not resistant or immune to it. Low Kick smashes Rock- and Steel-type Pokemon who dare get in Ambipom's way. Pursuit prevents Ghost-types not called Spiritomb from switching out freely. Payback is a viable option over Pursuit for dishing out more overall damage against Ghost-types, which is helpful against the aforementioned Spiritomb, who otherwise completely walls this set.</p>

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

<p>Entry hazard users are great partners for this set since they build up damage over time, which will eventually lead to the opponent's team being weakened enough for this Ambipom to pick off each foe. You can consider using Fighting-resistant entry hazard users such as Qwilfish and Nidoqueen to set up Toxic Spikes (and Spikes, in Qwilfish's case), as well as Uxie and Mesprit to set up Stealth Rock. Make sure that these Pokemon can also retaliate back against Fighting-types outside of using entry hazards. Both Uxie and Mesprit can use Psychic to damage opposing Fighting-types, while Qwilfish and Nidoqueen can use their respective STAB moves to slowly destroy most Fighters.</p>

<p>Support in the form of Wish and clerics can be beneficial to this Ambipom, since his health will be rapidly draining overtime and status may have been afflicted upon him. Noteworthy Wish users include Leafeon and Gardevoir, while notable clerics include Uxie and Mismagius. Although he doesn't resist Fighting, Leafeon has the ability to rack up more entry hazard damage via Roar. Gardevoir, along with Mismagius, can burn physical threats with Will-O-Wisp. All four Pokemon also have access to boosting moves that can help soften the opponent's team so that Ambipom can sweep easily in the long run.</p>

[SET]
name: Weather Support
move 1: Rain Dance / Sunny Day
move 2: Fake Out
move 3: Taunt
move 4: U-turn
item: Damp Rock / Heat Rock
ability: Technician
nature: Jolly
evs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

<p>With great Speed and various weather support moves in his arsenal, Ambipom makes a wonderful weather supporter. This set can be used as either a lead or a back-up supporter, depending on your tastes. First, use Fake Out to not only dent the foe, but to also break Focus Sashes, which could be troubling for most weather sweepers. Next, follow up with your chosen weather move to ensure seven turns of rampage from your weather sweeper. If the scenario calls for it, Taunt can be utilized to block crippling status or set-up attempts made by the opposing Pokemon. Finally, smack the opposition with U-turn and switch out to a weather sweeper. However, keep in mind that if Ambipom uses U-turn, it is likely that your weather sweeper will be damaged when switching in. As such, it might be better off just letting Ambipom faint on the set-up turn.</p>

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

<p>252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Spe can be used as an alternative EV spread, improving Ambipom's chances of setting up weather multiple times throughout a battle. The lack of offensive power this spread yields is moot, as Fake Out and U-turn aren't meant to be dealing much damage, anyway. To demonstrate Ambipom's bulk with this spread, here are some calculations:</p>

<h3>Damage Calculations</h3>

<ul class="damage_calculation">
<li>Physically Defensive Milotic Surf: 40.7% - 48.3% (3HKO)</li>
<li>Morning Glory Arcanine ExtremeSpeed: 40.7% - 48% (3HKO)</li>
<li>SubSeed Sceptile Leaf Storm: 78.2% - 92.4% (2HKO)</li>
<li>Sweeper Scyther Brick Break: 75.1% - 88.7% (2HKO)</li>
</ul>

<p>Depending on the weather, Ambipom requires teammates who can sweep under such conditions, especially with a Fighting resistance; Qwilfish, Exeggutor, and Vileplume are all great candidates for this. During rain, Qwilfish can boost his Attack with Swords Dance, then blast his foes with Waterfall and Poison Jab. When he's done, he can deliver a devastating Explosion to an unlucky victim. Despite not having a Fighting resistance, Gorebyss is also an excellent Swift Swimmer to consider due to his high Defense and extreme special attacking prowess. On the sunny side, Exeggutor can sleep foes with Sleep Powder and obliterate them with his multitude of powerful attacks such as Leaf Storm and Psychic. Like Qwilfish, Exeggutor can utilize Explosion to take down a foe with him while giving a teammate a free switch-in. Lastly, Vileplume, though inferior to Exeggutor, is another great Chlorophyll abuser due to his STAB Sludge Bomb.</p>

[SET]
name: Pure Baton Pass
move 1: Agility
move 2: Nasty Plot
move 3: Baton Pass
move 4: Taunt
item: Leftovers / Chople Berry / Lum Berry
nature: Timid
evs: 252 HP / 4 SpD / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

<p>Ambipom is the only UU Pokemon who is capable of passing both Agility and Nasty Plot. Although he is not bulky by any means, he does have access to Taunt, allowing him to disable phazers before they can break the pass. Furthermore, his blistering Speed allows him to outspeed most of UU before an Agility boost, and literally the entire tier afterward. This allows Ambipom to play as a deadly single-Pokemon passer. If the defender is caught off-guard, this set can effectively win the game in a turn.</p>

<p>All four moves on this set are critical. Agility and Nasty Plot are the main reasons to use Ambipom, allowing him to pass deadly boosts to a teammate. Taunt is necessary to stop moves such as Whirlwind, Trick, and Encore from ruining Ambipom's strategy. The EVs and item choice are more flexible. Leftovers helps Ambipom survive several hits while setting up. This can be especially critical if the first receiver fails. However, it does give away Ambipom's moveset. Chople Berry covers Ambipom's only weakness, allowing him to boost in the face of powerful Fighting attacks. This is very helpful because Fighting attacks are one of the main defenses against Baton Pass Ambipom. The last option is Lum Berry; although Taunt can already protect Ambipom from status, an unexpected sleep, chance to freeze, or (to a lesser extent) paralysis move can essentially remove Ambipom from the game. Both Chople Berry and Lum Berry do not give away Ambipom's hold item, and may trick the opponent into thinking that Ambipom is using a more conventional attacking set.</p>

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

<p>Maximum Speed is mainly used in case Ambipom is unable to pull off an Agility. This depends on the situation; if Ambipom can only pass one boost, then, for example, a 612 Speed Moltres is not much harder to stop than one with 306 Speed if the enemy has Milotic or Chansey, while the same cannot be said about a 698 SpA Moltres. If you are willing to overlook this possibility, you can shift 252 EVs from Speed to either defensive stat with a defense-boosting nature. This gives Ambipom more bulk while still enabling him to outspeed most Scarfed Pokemon after an Agility. Since neither Technician or Pickup help this Ambipom, you can choose either ability.</p>

<p>As a stand-alone Baton Passer, Ambipom requires specific team support to be successful. Ambipom is not bulky and is not receiving defensive boosts, so dual screens are almost mandatory. Uxie stands out as a screener due to his gargantuan defenses and access to U-turn or Memento, allowing him to get Ambipom in safely. Gardevoir is less bulky, but has access to Wish and Healing Wish, helping Ambipom pull off a second pass if needed. Though Alakazam is extremely frail, he has access to a very fast Taunt, stopping the opponent from setting up on the screening turns. Ambipom can also be used as part of a longer Baton Pass chain, where defensive passers such as Gorebyss and Drifblim can help Ambipom boost to +6 SpA.</p>

<p>For receivers, Moltres is the best general option. The fiery bird has perfect coverage, reliable recovery, and resists Fighting, Ambipom's only weakness. Additionally, he has enough bulk to survive most priority attacks. However, Moltres is 4x weak to Stealth Rock. Since Ambipom cannot Rapid Spin, this can stop Ambipom from passing to Moltres in the first place. Other possible receivers include Magneton, who has 13 resistances, and Venomoth, who can deal a lot of damage with Tinted Lens and has access to a sleep-inducing move in Sleep Powder.</p>

<p>Ambipom is most vulnerable during his passing stage. Phazing moves ruin Ambipom if they are successful, and even if Ambipom has Taunt, using it wastes a precious dual screen turn. Powerful Fighting STAB attacks can force Ambipom to pass before he gathers its boosts, which dramatically weakens the sweeper. If Ambipom is being used as a stand-alone passer, Substitute is a deadly threat. The receiver is forced to take an attack before he can sweep, which could possibly result in him taking big damage or even being KOed. Other anti set-up moves such as Perish Song and Encore can force Ambipom to switch out, erasing all of his boosts in the process. Finally, Brick Break destroys screens while hitting Ambipom super effectively. Take caution and scout ahead for the aforementioned threats before switching in this Ambipom.</p>

<p>For a similar team utilizing a single Baton Passer, read <a href="dp/articles/uber_battling_adv">this guide to Uber battling in ADV</a>. The article is written for a different tier, but many of the ideas are relevant. For more information on how to build a pure Baton Pass team, read <a href="dp/articles/baton_pass_chains"> this specialized guide to Baton Pass chains.</a>.</p>

[SET]
name: Offensive Baton Pass
move 1: Nasty Plot
move 2: Baton Pass / Water Pulse
move 3: Swift
move 4: Taunt / Water Pulse
item: Life Orb
ability: Technician
nature: Timid
evs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

<p>At first glance, it may seem silly to play around with Ambipom's vastly inferior Special Attack, but he can actually become quite frightening after a few Nasty Plot boosts. However, Ambipom's sole purpose is to not only sweep, but to also pass Nasty Plot boosts to an even more threatening sweeper. Swift is the best attacking option, as it receives a useful Technician boost, greatly improving its power. Taunt stops any foe from ruining Ambipom's sweep or pass. If you want Ambipom to cover more threats, then you can replace either Baton Pass or Taunt with Water Pulse, which also obtains a Technician boost. Together, Water Pulse and Swift offer perfect neutral coverage in UU, outside of Shedinja.</p>

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

<p>Similar to the Pure Baton Pass set, this set appreciates powerful special sweepers as receivers. Moltres is the single best receiver due to his Fighting resistance and sheer power. To show just how powerful Moltres is after a Nasty Plot pass, he can always OHKO Bulky Water Milotic with Hidden Power Grass after Stealth Rock. There are other good receivers too, such as Sceptile and Milotic, but they are vulnerable to Fighting attacks. However, Sceptile is fast enough to cause destruction with his attacks, while Milotic has the bulk to stay in and dish out heavy damage.</p>

<p>Special walls and phazers are deadly threats to Ambipom if he lacks Taunt. Specifically, Chansey can smash Ambipom with repeated Seismic Tosses, while Milotic can obliterate him with Surf. Moreover, Chansey can paralyze the recipient with Thunder Wave, while Milotic can wash the boosts away with Haze. Fitting Fighting-types such as Toxicroak in your team would be a huge boon to Ambipom's success. Toxicroak can comfortably switch in on Chansey and Milotic, use Substitute to block status, and smash them with its powerful Fighting-type attacks.</p>

[Team Options]

<p>Ambipom appreciates having a teammate who can eliminate physically-bulky Pokemon who will usually wall him. The most prominent defensive monsters, Donphan, Steelix, and Omastar, are all 3HKOed by Ambipom's respective attacks, and can 2HKO back with their STAB moves. To take care of such threats, utilizing a bulky Grass-type such as Tangrowth can be useful. Tangrowth takes little damage from the aforementioned foes' STAB attacks, and can either put them out of commission with Sleep Powder or slam them with Power Whip. Spiritomb also must be terminated due to its Ghost / Dark typing, impressive bulk, and access to Pursuit. Take advantage of Spiritomb's lousy coverage by switching in Fire- and Steel-types, such as Moltres and Substitute Aggron, in order to obliterate the tomb. Additionally, bulky Fighting-types are deadly to Ambipom, as they can survive his attacks and OHKO him back with a Fighting attack. Psychic-types are ideal partners for this reason, as they can switch into Fighters with ease and blast them with Psychic. Uxie is particularly invaluable as it can spread around paralysis and set up Stealth Rock to aid Ambipom.</p>

<p>Any Pokemon who is faster than Ambipom and has a dangerous array of attacks, namely Dugtrio, Sceptile, and Alakazam, should be destroyed so that Ambipom can sweep easier. You should have a combination of Pokemon to safeguard Ambipom from the aforementioned Pokemon. For instance, Weezing can handle Dugtrio and Sceptile with Will-O-Wisp and Flamethrower, while Spiritomb can trap and kill Alakazam with Pursuit, as well as dent Dugtrio and Sceptile on their way out should the scenario occur. Drapion can also be used to block Sceptile's and Alakazam's advances due to his impressive defensive typing and access to Pursuit.</p>

[Optional Changes]

<p>Ambipom has quite an interesting bag of other moves to play around with. Fake Out and Last Resort can be a lethal moveset by itself, but it is incredibly vulnerable to any Ghost-, Rock-, and Steel-type Pokemon. It should be noted that Fire Punch and ThunderPunch should never be used, because Return does more damage than both of them even if they hit super effectively. Fire Punch does hit Steel-types, though Low Kick does more damage. Aerial Ace receives a Technician boost and can be used to strike Fighting-types, but has little use outside of that. Seed Bomb is available to obliterate Rock-, Water-, and Ground-types, such as Omastar, Rhyperior, and Kabutops, if you can find a moveslot for it. Double Hit has a niche of getting through Substitutes while having a Technician boost for both hits, but it has 90 accuracy, and Substitute is seen more commonly on Ghost-types. Knock Off can be used to remove items if Ambipom can't do anything else to the opponent. On the special side, Ambipom can utilize Hidden Power Fighting, Thunderbolt, and Grass Knot. When using Hidden Power Fighting, make sure to set the Base Power to 59 and use an IV spread of 31/31/30/28/30/30 in order to receive a Technician boost while preserving the best overall IVs. With a Timid nature and 252 SpA EVs, Hidden Power Fighting can OHKO Aggron and 2HKO Rock Polish Rhyperior and Support Omastar; Thunderbolt has a chance to 2HKO Azumarill, while obtaining clean 2HKOs on Scyther and Moltres; and Grass Knot is able to OHKO Rhyperior, Omastar, and Kabutops.</p>

[Counters]

<p>Since most Ambipom carry U-turn, it is hard to completely counter him. The most reliable counter for Ambipom is Spiritomb, as Ambipom's Payback only 3HKOes him, and if Ambipom attempts to switch out, Spiritomb can use Pursuit to deal over 80% damage with a Choice Band. Additionally, without Taunt, Spiritomb can cripple him with Will-O-Wisp. Any bulky Pokemon with sufficient defenses can withstand Ambipom's attacks and retaliate back for a 2HKO. Great examples of such Pokemon include Donphan, Milotic, and Omastar. Precisely, bulky Fighting-types spell trouble for Ambipom. Hariyama can absorb any of Ambipom's attacks and OHKO back with Close Combat, while Hitmontop has Intimidate to lower Ambipom's Attack and Mach Punch to outspeed and pulverize Ambipom. Faster sweepers are also dangerous to Ambipom, as they can outspeed and smash him with powerful attacks, but they must be careful when switching into Return. Sceptile OHKOes Ambipom with Leaf Storm, Dugtrio removes him with Earthquake given he has been weakened enough, and Alakazam destroys the monkey with Psychic.</p>
 
How is Ambipom better than Lopunny at Baton Passing? Lopunny's Encore arguably makes it better, IMO.
 
yes, Nasty Plot. Frankly, it doesn't matter whether it's outclassed, it only matters if a set works for it to be displayed.

A weather (Sun/Rain) set deserves mention, but in AC I believe. (Weather/Taunt/U-turn/STAB Attack (Fake Out or Return or Double Hit), I ran max speed and max HP, others might want max attack) For Rain, Qwilfish resists Fighting. Not many Fighting types dare to switch into Ambipom anyway due to Fake Out and Return dealing massive damage, and Mesprit Uxie is commonly found on weather teams to patch up the Fighting weakness. I've played weather and most of the time Rock types and Steel types come in on Ambipom only to be Taunted...

Another AC option is Grass Knot? Helps against Kabutops, Rhyperior, Omastar?
 
Hiya

2 things:

1. That lead moveset is outdated. Pursuit NEEDS to be a primary slash due how common Mismagius is. Otherwise it's absolutely shut down by pretty much every ghost type. The moveset should be:

[SET]
name: Lead
move 1: Fake Out
move 2: Pursuit / Payback
move 3: Taunt / Low Kick
move 4: U-turn / Return
item: Life Orb / Silk Scarf
ability: Technician
nature: Jolly
evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

2: I think the lead set should drop to #2. It's been losing it's effectiveness lately, and I think the Life Orb sweeper set is so much more potent.
 
@ YaM, I already mentioned Grass Knot in the BP + Attack set. Not sure if I'd want to be going mixed with Grass Knot in the first two sets with it.

And yeah, a weather set does seem nice. Qwilfish can't take all the Fightings attacks for long though (Toxicroak's Cross Chop deals 47.1% - 55.5% to 4 HP Qwilfish). I'll wait for more input on it.

@ PK Gaming, gotcha, thanks a lot! To me, it was either kill Mismagius or kill Omastar. I always found entry hazards to be more annoying than Mismagius, regardless if Omastar was using Surf right off the bat. But yeah, thanks for updating me on the metagame trends. =) I also dropped the set to the second slot.

edit: Two sides. >.< I'll wait on your edit Bluewind for your results.
 
I'm not really sure about those changes in the set to be honest. Yes, the lead set will be walled by Ghosts, but isn't the point of the lead set to fare well against... leads? I know Low Kick ain't amazing either, as Rhyperior will own you pretty bad, but I'm not really sure this should be the exact order of slashes, especially when Missy is the only Ghost you'll find in the Lead position. Also, I'm pretty sure Lead should be brought back to top as it's Ambipom's most common set, and because he is the most common lead in UU (which irks me).

Finally, as you said, there should be some sort of weather set. Weather / Fake Out / U-turn / another move is what I have in mind; I think it could be refined and work. I'll get back to you when I test this thing a little.

Oh, and slash Life Orb over Leftovers on the offensive passer set, you'll really need something to hit your opponents harder when using Ambipom.
 
Flora said:
- (Read Banedon's post about this set. It makes the set actually look kinda icky but wow at the same time.)

Lol, now that I look at that post again although it's all still valid it makes me feel really stupid because I was such a mediocre player at that time and my teams reflected my lack of skill ...

Anyway: NP Ambipom isn't outclassed because it's the only Pokemon in UU that can pass both Nasty Plot and Agility. Whether to use NP Ambipom as opposed to SD Gligar is a completely different choice and leads to completely different teams. Where Ambipom only has a 2x weakness to Fighting, Gligar has a 4x weakness to Ice, which can make a successful pass hard. Physical recipients are also vulnerable to Intimidate. Against that, special recipients will have to deal with Chansey, while there is no single, omnipotent physical wall, and physical recipients have wider access to priority moves. In short, different teams and different Pokemon, and pure BP Ambipom isn't outclassed in any way.

Moltres is still the best general recipient, but it is 4x weak to Stealth Rock, so packing your team with fast Taunters help. My last team used Magneton as a partner to Moltres, since it is the only reasonable NP receiver that conveniently resists Rock. There're other receivers out there, such as Gardevoir (who's completely walled by Chansey, unfortunately). Venomoth might work as well thanks to Tinted Lens. Pass to Venomoth, Sleep something, Sub, and sweep with Bug Buzz + one other coverage move. One receiver that I tried and didn't work is Glaceon, who's walled by Milotic + completely destroyed by Technitop, although it can heal itself with Wish. Although I've not used them, I doubt Rotom and Mesprit work because they aren't very powerful. Rotom has low SpA, while Mesprit's isn't much better - not to mention Psychic isn't very good STAB, resisted by Registeel.

It's still very much a do-or-die strategy - you either sweep horribly or get swept horribly. It is also a very deadly, if somewhat cheap, strategy. Make one wrong move, either from misprediction or simply a lack of knowledge about your opponent's strategy, and you're looking at the wrong end of a +2/+2 sweep. But it is also somewhat cheap because your moves are so static, match after match after match. You do the same things with the single-minded strategy of setting up the sweeper, almost regardless of what your opponent is doing. In fact it's even possible to list your moves out before the match starts. I still feel rather guilty when I sweep with Moltres, not to mention feel quite angry whenever I get swept by a similar team ...

But once again I digress. I don't know what the previous EV spread was aiming to achieve, but I don't know what 252 HP / 252 Spe is trying to achieve either. Ideally, when passing, you'll be behind screens and your opponent not have had the chance to switch to a counter. So on the turn that they switch out, you get to put up Agility. That Agility should make you faster than every Pokemon in the metagame, or a TrickScarfer royally destroys the strategy. The Pokemon I use as benchmark is Timid Scarf Rotom; faster Scarfers are very rare. The rest of the speed can go to one of the defensive attributes, although I don't know which (not an expert there).

For counters, powerful Fighting STAB, phazing moves you didn't anticipate, Brick Break and Substitute are probably the most important. As I wrote before Hariyama is deadly against this strategy if you don't know what set it's running. Other powerful Fighting STAB like Hitmonlee's Close Combat might force you to pass before you can gather +2/+2, which weakens the sweep dramatically (not to mention loses you the very important surprise factor on the second pass). Substitute means your receiver has to take a hit before it can sweep. Since you're not passing defensive boosts, this can end the sweep right there. Fortunately Taunt can protect against Substitute too. Status can still incapacitate Ambipom as it switches in after the screener does its job, but it's something you can bypass with Memento / slow U-turn followed by Taunt. Finally there's priority, but that's more of a threat to the receiver than it is to Ambipom.

You might want to use Pick Up as the ability instead of Technician, in case of ... I don't know ... Pokemon with Skill Swap (lol).

On other sets, I agree with Bluewind and YaM that weather deserves a set. Fake Out eliminates Focus Sash, which is otherwise a big hindrance to weather sweepers - a Ludicolo that cannot OHKO its target might take big damage or get statused. A trade between Sash and a sweeper is definitely in the Sash's favour. Ambipom is also fast and so difficult to Taunt.

Also agree with Bluewind about the lead set. Yes ghosts can switch in, but instead of trying to get Ambipom to handle them all, you could include a ghost counter in your team like Registeel. I've also had my Mismagius Taunted out of Substitute a couple of times. Risky move on Ambipom's part, but it works.
 
So I guess the main problem here is figuring out a good EV spread for the Pure Baton Passer. Perhaps we should try a Impish/Careful spread with 252 HP/252 Def/4 SpD (or 4 Def/252 SpD) and see how it performs from there? Seems bad at first but you'll never know unless you try.

Otherwise, everything's back to how I had it at the start. Sorry PK.

Oh, and Weather Support added as the last set. If people vouch for higher, let me know.

edit: Good point Oglemi. Moved WS above both BP sets.
 
I honestly think the Weather Support set should go above the 2 Baton Pass sets. I think in the past year I've seen maybe 3 people using Ambipom as a Baton Passer. While Ambipom may be unique as a Baton Passer, he's also rather unique as a Weather Supporter, being so fast and having Fake Out, U-turn, and Taunt in its disposal, not to mention its used only slightly less than the Lead and LO sets.
 
Yeah, what Oglemi said. The weather set is something that was always around and is used quite a bit, but for some reason people never cared enough to write about it. I should have something to say on the order of slashes tomorrow.
 
I think pure Baton Pass should go above offensive Baton Pass. Aside from that, I can do the writeup for the pure Baton Pass set, if you wish.
 
Ok, sorry, it took me a while to get around posting here. Anyways, on the Lead set, I came to the conclusion this should be the order of slashes:

name: Lead
move 1: Fake Out
move 2: Taunt
move 3: Low Kick / Pursuit / Payback
move 4: U-turn / Return

I tried to differenciate Lead and LO sets as much as possible, hence why I made Taunt the main option without any slashes, as it stops other leads from setting up SR and stuff like Uxie from setting weather. U-turn is another breaking point, so I decided to keep it the main option over Return. The rest just went in the third slot.

On the weather set, everything looks fine. Taunt stops other weather leads from setting up, so you should probably mention that on the write-up (except for Electrode, but you can actually beat him some good predicitons and bluffs). Not too fond of U-turn, but it still stops unpleasant double switches, which is rather cool.

Outside of that everything looks good. The fast spread should be kept on pure Baton Passer in case you can only get an NP off, as a Scyther switch in could completely fuck you up otherwise just by using Brick Break or a Mismagius by using Taunt. Finally, mention that Water Pulse can be used over Baton Pass on the offensve passer if you want to sweep with Ambipom, but that Persian tends to do it better with a slightly higher SpA and access to Hypnosis, that incapacitates a counter. Oh, and de-slash Leftovers, that guy REALLY REALLY needs the boost from LO.

Santa approves this:

stamp3z.png
 
No problem. I'm pretty patient to wait and not nag. You're the one doing the tedious testing after all.

I've made your changes. Thanks!

edit for below: I like. I've added that mention in.
 
Maybe in the AC of Weather Ambipom you could mention moving 252 EVs from Atttack to HP. Gives Ambipom more bulk to allow it to possibly set up Weather a second time. Helped me on teams with only 2 pokemon for weather setup so it was crucial for Pom to stay alive. Attack EVs are not so important as Fake Out and U-Turn are for breaking sashes not really for damage. However if Ambipom survives your sweepers will likely have to take a hit for it.
 
@Bluewind - but then again, wouldn't you be using Agility first, which makes you faster than both Scyther and Mismagius?

I forgot this last time, but I think Chople Berry (the one that negates Fighting weakness for a turn) deserves a slash on the pure Baton Pass set.

I really should get to writing the analysis ...

[SET]
name: Pure Baton Pass
move 1: Agility
move 2: Nasty Plot
move 3: Baton Pass
move 4: Taunt
item: Leftovers / Chople Berry / Lum Berry
ability: Pickup
nature: Timid
evs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

<p>Ambipom is the only UU Pokemon capable of passing both Agility and Nasty Plot. Although it is not bulky by any means, it does have access to Taunt, allowing it to disable phazers before they can break the pass. Furthermore, its blistering speed allows it to outspeed most of UU before Agility and literally the entire tier afterwards. This allows Ambipom to play as a deadly single-Pokemon passer. If the defender is caught off-guard, this set can effectively win the game in a turn.</p>

<p>All four moves on this set are critical. Agility and Nasty Plot are the boosts to pass and the main reason to use Ambipom. Taunt is necessary to stop moves like Whirlwind, Trick and Encore from ruining Ambipom's strategy. The EVs and item choice are more flexible. Leftovers helps Ambipom survive hit while setting up. This can be critical especially if the first receiver fails. However, it does give away Ambipom's moveset. Chople Berry covers for Ambipom's only weakness, allowing it to boost in the face of powerful Fighting attacks. This is very helpful because Fighting attacks are one of the main defenses against Baton Pass Ambipom. The last option is Lum Berry. Although Taunt can protect Ambipom from status, an unexpected sleep or (to a lesser extent) paralysis move can remove Ambipom from the game. Both Chople Berry and Lum Berry do not give away Ambipom's hold item and may bluff the opponent into thinking Ambipom is using a more conventional attacking set.</p>

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

<p>Maximum speed on this set is mainly in case Ambipom is unable to use Agility. This depends on the situation; if Ambipom can only pass one boost then a 612 Spe Moltres is not much harder to stop than one with 306 Spe if you have a Milotic or a Chansey, while the same cannot be said about a 698 SpA Moltres. If you are willing to overlook this possibility, you can shift 252 EVs from Spe to either defensive stat with a boosting nature. This gives Ambipom more bulk while still being able to outspeed most Scarfed Pokemon after an Agility. A Timid nature is used to minimize damage if Ambipom hits itself when confused.</p>

<p>As a standalone Baton Passer, Ambipom requires team support to be successful. Ambipom is not bulky and not receiving defensive boosts, so Screens are almost mandatory. Uxie stands out as a screener with gargantuan defenses and U-turn / Memento to get Ambipom in safely. Gardevoir is less bulky but has access to Wish and Healing Wish, helping Ambipom pull off a second pass if needed. Alakazam is even less bulky but has access to a very fast Taunt, stopping the opponent from setting up on the screening turns. Ambipom can also be used as part of a longer Baton Pass chain, when defensive passers such as Gorebyss and Drifblim can help Ambipom boost to +6 SpA.</p>

<p>For receivers, Moltres is the best general option. It has perfect coverage, recovery, and resists Fighting, Ambipom's weakness. It also has enough bulk to survive priority attacks. However, Moltres is 4x weak to Stealth Rock. Since Ambipom cannot Rapid Spin, this can stop Ambipom from passing to Moltres in the first place. Other possible receivers include Magneton, who has 13 resistances, and Venomoth, who can deal a lot of damage with Tinted Lens and has access to a sleep move.</p>

<p>For a similar team utilizing a single Baton Passer, read http://www.smogon.com/dp/articles/uber_battling_adv. The article is written for a different tier, but many of the ideas are relevant. For more information on how to build a pure Baton Pass team, read http://www.smogon.com/dp/articles/baton_pass_chains.</p>

****Maybe this should go in the counters section****
<p>[Baton Pass] Ambipom is most vulnerable during its pass. Phazing moves destroy Ambipom if they are successful. Even if Ambipom Taunts, they burn a turn on the dual screens. Powerful Fighting STAB can force Ambipom to pass before it gathers its boosts, which dramatically weakens the sweep. If Ambipom is being used as a standalone passer, Substitute is a deadly threat. The receiver is forced to take an attack before it can sweep, possibly taking big damage or even being knocked out. Other anti set-up moves such as Perish Song and Encore can force Ambipom to switch out, losing all its boosts in the process. Finally, Brick Break destroys screens while hitting Ambipom super-effectively.</p>
 
That depends on your team and the battle conditions in which you find yourself in, though. Let's agree that a 612 Speed Moltres is not much harder to stop than one with 306 Speed if you have a Milotic or a Chansey; while the same cannot be said about a 698 SpA Moltres. It all boils down to the situation, and it'd be pretty lame to lose to something like those Pokés because you don't have the Speed to beat them.
 
BlueWind covered just about everything with differentiating the LO Cleaner and the Lead set. Maybe give Choice Band a sentence? I wouldn't slash it because it really is not as good as Tauros, but it can have that boost to Fake Out for a one-time use, and a stronger Pursuit to eliminate Mismagius and come in later and spam Return.

Otherwise, consider this STAMPED
 
BlueWind covered just about everything with differentiating the LO Cleaner and the Lead set. Maybe give Choice Band a sentence? I wouldn't slash it because it really is not as good as Tauros, but it can have that boost to Fake Out for a one-time use, and a stronger Pursuit to eliminate Mismagius and come in later and spam Return.

Otherwise, consider this STAMPED

IIRC Thund tried to write up a CB Ambipom set a while ago. It is definitely worth using, so I think slashing it is good. His real defining feature as a Choice Bander in comparison to Tauros is 1) higher Speed and 2) access to U-Turn, making him a pretty fine scout early game as well. Slashing in U-Turn with Fake Out and slash in Choice Band wouldn't be a bad idea, IMO.
 
IIRC, Thund put it up for for QC checks and (IIRC) it was rejected, hence why I didn't bring it up. I think it could get a mention on the offensive set, but a slash might be too much.
 
I remember Thund's CB set... I'll put it into AC for the Life Orb set. This would mean that U-turn should get an AC mention with Choice Band now, I would imagine. Thanks BA!
edit: U-turn over Fake Out, yeah.

There is a bunch of CW threads as of now. I'm not sure when I'll get to writing this, but I'll eventually be done.

edit: lol, I'm writing it now. Sorry UU backlog. =(
 
It was rejected because it played too similarly to LO set, IIRC. If CB were to be slashed, then yeah, U-Turn should be slashed with Fake Out, since getting locked in Fake Out is kinda crappy.
 
Hmm, does anyone think that the Life Orb set should be renamed? It's kind of awkward when the first set has Life Orb as its first option. "Physical Attacker" is probably what I'm going with. Or, "Attacker" alone but that feels weird.

edit: and lol, if me and Komodo finish writing out our respective analyses, the whole page will be Copyediting. Then we need to convert QC members into GP members...
 
I wrote the pure Baton Pass set up, it's on post #17. I took the liberty to change a few things, such as making Chople Berry a main slash and Pickup the ability. I hope that's OK. I also stole Bluewind's comment on passing NP without Agility, I think it illustrates the point well. Writeup is a bitis shoddy ... for that I apologize; my keyboard's 's' key isn't working so each time I have to type 's' I ctrl + v instead. It's very troublesome to type a capital 's', so I tried to avoid typing "speed".

Otherwise this suddenly struck me: Ambipom doesn't need 252+ speed to outspeed Mismagius and Scyther. How about making the fast spread 252 HP / 176 Spe / 80 Def / Jolly?

EDIT: Wait, that would open it to other Ambipom, who are also common Taunt users. Nevermind.
 
Back
Top