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2nd Coming V2.0

Discussion in 'BW OU Teams' started by HasKal, Apr 17, 2013.

  1. HasKal


    Mar 10, 2013
    Team Name: 2nd Coming V2.0


    Hey, I am HasKal. About a month ago I posted my first team on RMT called 2nd Coming, which got some great feedback. This second version incorporates much of that feedback although not all of it. The changes that I made certainly helped me to get to higher ratings on the ladder and better results against pokemon that previously were problematic. So here goes.....


    Latios @ Choice Scarf
    Ability: Levitate
    Nature: Timid (+Spe,-Atk)
    EVs : 252 SpA, 252 Spe, 4 HP
    Moves: Trick / Psychic / Draco Meteor / Surf

    Description: In my previous team I had a Choice Scarf Alakazam, which I replaced with Choice Scarf Latios. Though slower and bit less powerful than Alakazam, Latios's much better bulk and better coverage over more prominent threats makes it the better choice. Trick allows it cripple almost all walls and stall pokemon, particularly the pink blobs and ferrothorn. Similar to Alakazam, it allows Latios to stop +1 Volcarona (after 1 Quiver Dance) as Latios is still faster and can Trick on the Choice Scarf. Latios dies in the process, but Volcarona is usually locked into Bug Buzz, which makes it more manageable. Scarf also lets it beat Scarf variants of Terrakion, Keldeo and Salamence.
    The moves are standard ones with Psychic being chosen over Psyshock to ensure an unconditional OHKO on Conkeldurr, who can decimate the rest of the team after 1 Bulk Up.
    The only downside to using Latios over Alakazam is that it leads to a tricky situation with Venusaur in the sun, as Latios is faster than Modest variants but slower than Timid variants(which are comparatively rare). This has cost me a match or two at times.
    P.S: I know that the standard sets on Smogon suggest Timid nature on Venusaur, but I have seen most people use Modest in practice.


    Rotom-W @ Leftovers
    Ability: Levitate
    Nature: Modest
    EVs: 232 HP, 56 SpA, 220 Spe
    Moves: Hydro Pump / Volt Switch / Pain Split / Will-o-wisp

    Description: This is the standard bulky attacker set of Rotom-W, taken from Smogon. My choice for a lead in most situations except versus Sun teams. The HP investment is important, as it allows to take powerful hits from many pokemon such as +0 Outrage from Garchomp,Dragonite and Salamence, and burn them in return with Will-o-wisp. Hydro Pump is pure power, and puts the hurt on most pokemon under the rain, which is pretty ubiquitous considering the number of rain teams in use. Volt Switch is pretty good, and helps preserve momentum. Pain Split fits really well, as it gives very decent recovery, and despite the investment in HP, still works likes a charm against most pokemon. The 220 speed EVs are crucial as it allows Rotom to cripple Breloom leads with Will-o-wisp, and also Gliscor leads if the opponent is inexperienced enough to stay in and not use Protect(It's surprising how often this happens).


    Ferrothorn @ Leftovers
    Ability: Iron Barbs
    Nature: Relaxed
    EVs: 252HP, 88 Def, 168 SpD
    Moves: Power Whip / Leech Seed / Stealth Rock / Gyro Ball

    Description: This is one of my unchanged pokemon from the first team. Again, the standard set from Smogon. The nature and EV spread make Ferrothorn an amazing mixed wall, although I mostly use it against special attackers. Leftovers and Leech Seed provide just enough recovery to function in all but very few cases. Spikes is pretty self explanatory, while Power Whip and Gyro Ball are used for offense. The exclusion of Protect / Thunder Wave might raise questions, but the merits of using Gyro Ball justify the decision in my eyes. At full or near full health (>= 88%), Ferrothorn survives a Focus Blast from Alakazam and Gengar, and can OHKO in return with Gyro Ball. Plus it generally works well on many other pokemon, due to Ferrothorn's abysmal speed. Ferrothorn is my go-to-guy to counter most Draco-Meteor Dragons, and in general a very good defensive pivot.


    Tentacruel @ Leftovers
    Ability: Liquid Ooze
    Nature: Bold (+Def,-Atk)
    EV's: 252 HP, 236 Def, 20 Spe
    Moves: Rapid Spin / Toxic / Scald / Protect

    Description: I previously had a Forretress in this spot, which I replaced. Tentacruel works similarly to my Forretress, being able to switch in to almost the same pokemon except for Mamoswine. The resistances are also pretty similar, being able to counter Scizor, Conkeldurr and other fighting types. The addition of Toxic allows me to use Toxic stalling now, which is pretty effective technique. The synergy is maintained just as before, plus giving me an effective switch in to Infernape(Latios works for this too,but I have been caught by U-Turn Ape a few times), which is still pretty common. Liquid Ooze is used so as to catch opposing Ferrothorn off-guard, as the 'damage' done due to Leech Seed and Burn(from Scald or Rotom-W's WoW) puts on a lot of pressure. Also punishes Conkeldurr and Toxicroak looking to abuse Bulk Up + Drain Punch, although Tentacruel can't do anything to Toxicroak in return.


    Infernape @ Life Orb
    Ability: Blaze
    Nature: Naive(+Spe,-Def) / Hasty(+Spe,-Spd)
    EVs: 252 Atk, 4 SpA, 252 Spe
    Moves: Close Combat / Overheat / U-Turn / Stone Edge

    Description: I previously had an Offensive Quiver Dance Volcarona in this spot, but the inclusion of Latios gave me a good special attacker so I swapped in Infernape. The physically based mixed attacker set is quite effective and underrated in the current metagame. The type coverage is impeccable and with Infernape's attacking stats and Life Orb boost is able to take on a large number of threats.
    Close Combat is staple, and is great move that doesn't need much explaining.
    I chose Overheat over Fire Blast as most players are smart enough to switch to fire-resist or a special wall after one attack, hence the higher BP of Overheat is more useful. Also with good prediction can be used to surprise switch-ins, as Landorus-T and Gliscor are both OHKO'd after prior damage.
    U-Turn allows Infernape to scout and escape would be checks, also offers great VoltTurn synergy with Rotom-W.
    Stone Edge allows Infernape to nail dangerous pokemon like Gyarados, Salamence(non-Scarf), Dragonite(after Mutliscale is broken) and Volcarona.
    The lack of Grass Knot means Infernape is walled by most water types, but they are dealt with by Rotom-W and Ferrothorn.


    Haxorus @ Choice Band
    Ability: Mold Breaker
    Nature: Jolly
    EVs: 252 Atk, 252 Spe, 4 HP
    Moves: Outrage / Earthquake / Superpower / Dual Chop

    Description: Choice Band Haxorus with Jolly nature is highly underrated. Although it does not possess the sheer power of Adamant natured variants, if used correctly, it can dominate late-game. With a Jolly nature Haxorus can outrun most variants of Hydreigon and can OHKO. Against Sun teams, Jolly Haxorus works as an amazing lead, netting a OHKO with Earthquake on the first turn itself as most people don't invest in speed on their Ninetales. This helps to put pressure on the opponent. Also it allows Haxorus to check non-Scarf variants of Jirachi too, as again a lot of people just don't invest enough in speed. Mold Breaker lets it take on Levitate users such as Rotom-W and Bronzong. Superpower gives decent coverage over Steel-types and can OHKO Ferrothorn after a little prior damage. Dual Chop is great because it lets Haxorus hit through substitutes, stopping Focus Punch Breloom in particular. Also Dual Chop lets it effectively revenge kill Dragonite without locking into Outrage, as Mold Breaker negates Multiscale. In general as well it is a safe STAB option to use, in case I don't want to lock in Outrage. Outrage itself is ridiculously powerful, and can score OHKO's on a lot many pokemon even without an Adamant nature.

    Extra Remarks

    This team is definitely a better team than my previous one, allowing me to overcome a lot of hurdles. It still has its flaws though, the foremost being a lack of priority moves. This has cost matches more than once, and I am currently in the process of trying out Mach Punch on Infernape. Trick Room teams occasionally are troublesome, but not as much. Also hax sometimes becomes a big factor, as there a lot of moves without 100% accuracy on the team such as Draco Meteor, Stone Edge and so on.

    I would appreciate feedback a lot, and will definitely try to use it to improve the team further.
  2. dcae

    dcae naughty list

    Dec 9, 2011
    Hey there! Got the request. This is a nice usage of weatherless offense, but a few tweaks here and there can improve it as a whole. First of all, a quick look through your team reveals strong synergy, so no major issues to address. Looking at the pokemon one through one, I see you have chosen to use both Ferrothorn and Forretress. Your team in general has no need for a Rapid Spinner, but you wanted to run Stealth Rock. I see that your team, without Forretress, would have trouble with Terrakion. For this, I recommend running Utility Landorus-T. The addition of this gives you a solid setter of rocks, while maintaining momentum with U-turn, and using huge its huge attack stat to dish out the hurt. The set completely counters Terrakion and can deal with most Dragons as an emergency check. With the addition of this you have a solid Volt-turn core of Rotom, Lando, and Ape.

    [​IMG]Landorus T @Leftovers
    Trait: Intimidate
    EVs: 200 HP/ 64 Atk / 244 Def
    Nature: Adamant
    -Stone Edge
    -Stealth Rock

    The EV set can be tweaked to add speed in order to outspeed relevant threats such as Tentacruel, if you wish.

    Now, the addition of this puts a lot of burden on Rotom-W due to three Ice weaknesses. Because of this, I recommend replacing Haxorus with a Specs Keldeo. Specs Keldeo offers a lot of synergy with your team, along with a great speed tier coupled with monstrously strong attacks. This set would not offer priority, but instead sheer power, which was what your Haxorus brought to the table as well. The set is as follows:

    [​IMG]Keldeo @Choice Specs
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    Nature: Timid
    -Hydro Pump
    -Secret Sword
    -Icy Wind/Hidden Power Ice
    -Hidden Power Electric/Hidden Power Bug/Surf

    The choice in the final slot is up to what irritates you the most. If you choose to run Surf, run Hidden Power Ice over Icy Wind.

    On your Infernape set, I would definitely have Naïve nature, because Infernape has Fire typing to absorb Bullet Punch and Ice Shard, and you don't want to cut down on its defense, especially with Life Orb. Overall, this is a really cool team, and I hope I helped! Good luck!

    tl;dr (open)

    Landorus T > Forretress
    Keldeo > Haxorus
    Naïve > Hasty on Infernape
  3. Mosquiton

    Mosquiton Tette

    Sep 10, 2010
    Ehi dude, i got your request!

    Your team seems to have a good base for a rain team and in my humble opinion Infernape in this team has no purpose, so I want to advise you to put Politoed instead to give a huge support to members of your team: Tentacruel would get an extra recovery of HP thanks to raindish and blacksludge, and with protect it becames even more painfull to face; Ferrothorn would have his weakness to fire affievolite,and will wall all the dragons and Latios with a fire move .The set that you want to recommend is the specs with timid nature, in this way you will have a huge offensive power given by the stab rain specs. making timid max speed you will have the opportunity to outsppedare Breloom, Dragonite and Mamoswine. At this point I suggest a quick change that will improve the offensiveness of your team: I'm talking to insert Garchomp> Haxorus getting a Pokémon much faster with access to StealthRock. The set that you want to recommend is a bit 'special: Swordance stealth rock MainStabs @ Focus Sash. In this way, you will have the security to put the rocks on the ground but also the chance to become a powerful Wallbreaker thanks to its access to sworddance that will double your attack. The only Pokemon who resist are Sakrmory and Bronzong, but both are disintegrated by the enormous power of water to stab Politoed. As a last thing I want to advise you to put the spikes> Stealthrock to Ferrothorn since we gave it to Garchomp.

    Show Hide

    >Politoed over Infernape
    >Spikes over Stealthrock @Ferrothorn
    >Garchomp over Haxorus

    Politoed (M) @ Choice Specs
    Trait: Drizzle
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Surf
    - Ice Beam
    - Focus Blast
    - Hidden Power [Grass]

    Garchomp (M) @ Focus Sash
    Trait: Rough Skin
    EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4 HP
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Outrage
    - Swords Dance
    - Stealth Rock
    - Earthquake
  4. tintinwong


    Feb 12, 2012
    I like Mosquito's changes. However, If you notice, nothing on the team is weak to stealth rock, making tentacruel's rating go down on the useful scale.
    Also, the team would then have 1 physical attacker and a ferrothorn, and 4 special attackers.
    I would propose changing tentacruel to a choice banded scizor, as it not only puts back the U-turn part of the volt turn combo you originally had, and it has offensive presence too.
  5. Ninetale3


    Dec 23, 2011
    Nice team

    From what I can tell off the bat is that this team doesn't have much need for tentacuel as it isn't really hazards weak, but it does need the poison typing to handle fighting types without resorting to latios. I highly recommend support scolipede in place of tentacruel.

    Scolipede@focus sash
    Nature: jolly
    Trait: swarm
    Evs: 252 atk, 252 speed, 4 hp
    earthquake/rock slide
    toxic spikes

    This set is a great pivot to fighting types while giving your team more hazard tools to play with. This set also gives you a direct answer to psychics. calm mind reuniclus in particular as it looks like it could be a bit of a headache to the team when haxorus is out of the equation.
  6. deadflame


    Oct 29, 2011
    If you do put in Scolipede, then I see the need for a Spin Blocker. Probably Jellicient, as it pairs extremely well with Ferrothorn. But a strong part of me feels that all these changes might completely clash with the original purpose of this team in the first place. I am conflicted. I guess I would just test the changes and give us your thoughts.
  7. HasKal


    Mar 10, 2013
    @Dcae: Thanks for the rate, I like your idea about using Landorus-T, will try it out. On the Keldeo suggestion, I would rather not do it as Haxorus is the only out and out physical attacker I have, dropping him would leave me only Infernape with which to break down special walls.

    @Mosquiton: I didn't really notice it before, but you are right, this can be a decent rain team. I will try it out surely, as I have never played with a rain team before. But that would become a whole a new team in itself, because I made this team with the intention of being weather-independent. Still I will definitely try out the rain team, considering so many people have told me that rain is awesome.

    @Ninetale3: I started using Scolipede to test it out, will let you know how it works out. Thanks for the rate
  8. Cp3nohornets


    Mar 19, 2013
    Not a bad team, not a great team. My only real issue with teams like this is that for the most part they are set up bait seeing as your team doesn't have a true lead. My recommendation would be to replace Ferrothorn with a defensive Skarmory. Skarmory lets you SR, spikes, Taunt, Whirlwind, or Roost all but ensuring your team doesn't get set up on and recovering back any damage, all while laying down entry hazards of your own.

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