4th Gen OU (Rate+Help please!)

[affinity]

Hola. I'm not entirely new to competitive pokemon, but I am new to these forums. I've been running 2 teams for the past week or so, and I decided this is the better of the 2. However, it could still use some work. Some things you will notice are that I lack Rapid Spin and Taunt supports, as well as a truly reliable wall. But, 5/6 of my pokes resist Stealth Rock, which makes not having RS not too big of a deal. I think my biggest problem is my lack of creativity, so tell me what you guys think.

Attacking Lead:

SR/Trapper:

Mixed Attacker:

Physical Sweeper:

Substitute/Trap:

Scout/Revenge:

Lucario (Lonely)
- Ability: Inner Focus
- Item: Focus Sash
- EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 HP
Moves: Close Combat, Counter, Extreme Speed, Crunch

Has a pretty good handle on most set-up and suicide leads I have run into thus far. Can hit everything for at least neutral damage with this move-set. With Focus Sash and Extreme Speed, I can freely use any move first turn, and if the other poke out-speeds Lucario I have a priority move to turn to. Counter works well for leads that are going to attack me, or feel forced to do so. STAB CC, Crunch, and XS, partnered with good predicting in Counter, allow 2HKOs on a lot of common leads. Also, Inner Focus and immunity to Sandstorm are obvious pluses. Other moves I considered for Crunch's spot were Hidden Power Ice/Electric. I decided to go with Crunch, considering I have other answers to anything HP Ice/Electric would've covered.

The Lucario lead and trapping Magnezone combo often allow me to take out any common threats to my DD Ttar, which makes setting up a little easier.

Heatran (Modest)
- Ability: Flash Fire
- Item: Passho Berry
- EVs: 252 SpA / 56 HP / 200 Spe
Moves: Stealth Rock, Magma Storm, Hidden Power Electric, Explosion

With access to SR, a trapping move, Explosion, as well as providing another worthwhile switch in to Fire attacks, I immediately liked the Heatran set suggested by Chicken. Also, adding another poke that is unaffected by Sandstorm was an attractive attribute. Explosion lets me go out for big damage after setting up SR if Heatran's will cease to be useful once they are set up. Chicken also pointed out that my team has trouble with Water types, and considering Heatran readily invited Water types, Passho Berry+HP Electric were good choices.

Infernape (Naive)
- Ability: Blaze
- Item: Life Orb
- EVs: 252 SpA / 192 Spe / 64 Atk
Moves: Fire Blast, Close Combat, Grass Knot, Hidden Power Ice

This thing is a great wallbreaker. STAB CC and Fire Blast will usually make Skarmory, Blissey, etc flee at sight. If I outspeed their next switch in and haven't given away my set already, HP Ice and Grass Knot give me solid attacks against a fair number of Infernapes common counters, bar Gyarados or light weight Water types. I have switch in options that will sponge any of Infernapes weaknesses, as well. Unfortunately, Infernape is the one poke on my team that takes damage from Sandstorm, and that doesn't resist SR damage.

Tyranitar (Jolly)
- Ability: Sand Stream
- Item: Lum Berry
- EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 HP
Moves: Dragon Dance, Stone Edge, Crunch, Ice Punch

With only one teammate who gets hit by Sandstorm, and plenty of coverage/counters in my team that allow this to set-up, this thing is a beast. With high base attack power, STAB Stone Edge and Crunch pack a punch after a DD. I chose Ice Punch for the 4th slot. It hits a lot of things that like to switch into Ttar pretty hard, and if they know I have might scare some things off allowing me to set up with DD.

Magnezone (Naive)
- Ability: Magnet Pull
- Item: Leftovers
- EVs: 252 SpA / 216 Spe / 40 Atk
Moves: Thunderbolt, Hidden Power Fire, Substitute, Explosion

I was worried about Skarmory, Bronzong, and certain Metagross builds, so Magnezone felt like a good choice. Trapping and HP Fire give me a good option to take out slower Steel types, or ones who don't know EQ. Set up a Sub and HP Fire away. Thunderbolt is the obvious STAB choice, it craps on Gyarados, a trapped Empoleon, or other Water types. As long as I can get a Sub set up, Magnezone should be able to fulfill its role.

Works well with Lucario to take out Ttar's threats. Also, Explosion gives me an option to finish off anything else that gives my team problems.

Flygon (Adamant)
- Ability: Levitate
- Item: Choice Scarf
- EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 SpD
Moves: Earthquake, Outrage, U-Turn, Stone Edge

Creative? No. Effective? Yes. This is one of the most overused things, but it is just too good. A great way to transition into DD Ttar with good scouting, paired with 2 strong STAB moves and Stone Edge. Also, it is a great switch in to anything using EQ, which can cause a lot of problems for my team normally. There isn't much to be said about this set, I'm sure most of you are sick of seeing it. A move I considered over Stone Edge was ThunderPunch.

___________________________

I've finally been able to start testing my line up more, and I'm definitely loving it, but I'd still love to hear ratings and any suggestions you guys can offer. Thanks!

 

[BKC]

Cool team, the only real threats I see are stall and offensive grass types. Swampert is the weak link, in my opinion; it's really just a liability in this metagame, as stall teams spike all over it and offensive teams use it as a free switch into their grass type (Breloom or Shaymin, for example). Stall's multiple spikes will easily wear down your grounded team (bar Flygon but he isn't getting past defensive Rotom-A or ResTalk Gyarados) and you lack a solid switch-in to the aforementioned grass types, whether it's Breloom's Focus Punch or Shaymin's Seed Flare. To fix this, I recommend using a Heatran over Swampert. It is the #1 most used Pokemon in the 4th gen OU metagame for a reason; its fantastic typing gives it alot of free switchins to set up Stealth Rock. However it tends to lure in powerful water types such as Starmie and Suicune; your team does not like these much either. Not to worry, though, as with the set I am going to recommend, you will be able to take them out quite easily, which will help Tyranitar sweep near the end-game.

here is the set

Heatran @ Passho Berry | Modest | EVs: 56 HP / 252 SpA / 200 Spe
Stealth Rock / Magma Storm / Hidden Power Electric / Explosion

Speed EVs outrun Breloom.

So lets delve into how this set helps your team out. First off, unlike Swampert who actually baited spikers/grass types to come in, Heatran will be able to scare them off. This set will also help you dismantle stall's core quite well, as these teams use ResTalk Gyarados (who, keep in mind, walls your Infernape) as their primary Heatran switch-in. You will be able to surprise kill them with HP Electric and then Ape will run through them like a knife through butter. As I mentioned before, Heatran lures in Starmie (who also will counter Infernape quite well as long as it doesn't switch into a Grass Knot). With the Passho Berry, you can tank a Hydro Pump and then kill or at least severely weaken it with HP Electric. Flygon can then finish it off and because teams with Starmie often don't have another Infernape check, you will be able to absolutely destroy them with it.

That fixes the team's major problems as far as I can see. Breloom can still come in on Tyranitar, though; this is easy to fix. Simply use a Lum Berry and Ice Punch on Tyranitar. This way you can Dragon Dance in its face as its Spore is foiled and then smack them with a +1 Ice Punch, which will take them out quite handily. Lum Berry also will let you set up Dragon Dance for free versus defensive Rotom-A carrying Will-O-Wisp; Ice Punch will hit Gliscor more powerfully than Aqua Tail did.

Good team and good luck!

 

[affinity]

Thanks for the advice, I'll definitely test that out! If I like it, the only problem is finding a Modest Heatran that's Hidden Power is Electric. Any easy way to get a hold of one?

 

[GengarSwitch]

After Flygon and Swampert are gone you can get swept by a scarf Flygon. Might I suggest Rotom-A as your tank replacing Swampert, as it is imune to ground. You need to cover for your ground weakness more than just one levitating dragonfly.

 

[Porii Sames]

Yeah SDLuke looks like it could give some troubles too.

My main problem with Luke is that it has serious issues with Machamp, which is a very common lead.

I think Dos might be good over Swampert as it solves your Flygon problem, your grass problem (to an extent, BounceDos could work better), and your Luke problem.

Hope I helped :D

 

[ChaosZekrom]

You may want to run Adamant Nature on Lucario since you have no special attacks and Lonely Nature decreases your defense.
For TTar use Earthquake or Pursuit instead of Aqua Tail since Earrthquake gives coverage while Pursuit leaves Reuniclus no where to go.

 

[BKC]

You may want to run Adamant Nature on Lucario since you have no special attacks and Lonely Nature decreases your defense.
For TTar use Earthquake or Pursuit instead of Aqua Tail since Earrthquake gives coverage while Pursuit leaves Reuniclus no where to go.

Lonely nature maximizes the damage that physical attacks will do and therefore maximize the damage Lucario can Counter back. Aqua Tail on Ttar helps Tar deal with Gliscor and Hippowdon, who'd otherwise stop the set cold; Pursuit on a DD set is just dumb because the object is to sweep, not trap things. Also, this is a 4th gen team, so Reuniclus doesn't exist yet.

 

[krum]

Adamant nature is the prefered nature on Lucario my friend. Adamant raises attack to the max just like Lonely but instead of lowering your defense, it lowers your special attack. You arent using any special attacks so it doesn't matter if you lower it but defense is always needed... I hope this makes sense to you. good luck.

 

[affinity]

Adamant nature is the prefered nature on Lucario my friend. Adamant raises attack to the max just like Lonely but instead of lowering your defense, it lowers your special attack. You arent using any special attacks so it doesn't matter if you lower it but defense is always needed... I hope this makes sense to you. good luck.

I understand that, but this isn't a SDLucario, it is an attacking lead that uses counter. Trust me, I know about all of the natures. As Chicken said, Lonely nature optimizes Counters damage potential because I take more damage then normal, but can never be OHKO'ed.

Yeah SDLuke looks like it could give some troubles too.

My main problem with Luke is that it has serious issues with Machamp, which is a very common lead.

I think Dos might be good over Swampert as it solves your Flygon problem, your grass problem (to an extent, BounceDos could work better), and your Luke problem.

Hope I helped :D

Machamp is a 50/50 shot with my Lucario lead. They will always open with Dynamic Punch (I'd expect) so it is up to whether I hit myself in confusion or not. If the Counter lands, that Machamp is gone. But if that fails, I have to pray Flygon or Infernape can clean it up.

As of now I am running Heatran over Swampert.

I've been testing my team with the adjustments Chicken suggested (Heatran over Swampert, Ice Punch & Lum Berry on Ttar) on Pokemon online, and it has been working very well. The trick has been keeping Flygon alive long enough to protect my pokes from EQs and other Ground attacks, considering those obliterate everyone else.

Things I may test are Azelf, Rotom-W, or Gyarados if I have too many problems with Ground.

Thanks for the suggestions everyone!

 

[Porii Sames]

Smart Machamps will go BP/Ice Punch/Sedge/Payback and THEN Dynamicpunch.

My problem is you have 5 Fighting weaks on your team, which can give you serious issues vs. something like Luke. Machamp also seems to decimate your team. I'd suggest an offensive Rotom-A (wash probably) to deal with that.

Otherwise, good luck with your team!

Another recommendation I would make is perhaps a Dragonite along with Flygon. Flygon carries a whole lot of weight, saving you from many threats and, if it dies Outraging, then there are MANY things that screw you over badly (see: fighting and ground types). Dragonite can provide some backup punch and not make you so dependent on saving Flygon imo.

 

[affinity]

I see what you are saying, I was considering testing Rotom-W. If I were to include it, what do you think it would best replace?