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A brand new Metagross idea.
- Thread starter Slice n Dice
- Start date
Going with StrangerDanger, here, this set looks promising with the also uncommon, SpecialGross set. Both would require a "+Atk/Spatk, -Spe" Nature to work and Hammer Arm is a great alternative to Explosion when dealing with Special Walls like Blissey, Snorlax, Cradily and Regice.
Something like:
MixGross
Nature - Quiet
EVs - 252 SpAtk / 44 Atk / 212 HP
Item - Life Orb / Expert Belt
Hammer Arm
Gyro Ball / Psychic / Meteor Mash
HP Fire
Grass Knot
EVs generate 354 HP / 316 Atk / 316 SpAtk.
When factoring in the Life Orb you will have approx. 410 Atk and 410 SpAtk. You will be losing 35 HP per, every attack.
Hammer Arm replaces Explosion on standard SpecialGross sets, allowing him to 2HKO several Special Walls such as Cradily, Blissey, Snorlax and Regice. Grass Knot and HP Fire are a strong attacking combination, hitting many of Meta's common counters. Swampert, Donphan and Hippowdon are all OHKO'd by LO Grass Knot. HP Fire is a 2HKO on Skarm and Tangrowth.
The second slot is reserved for your STAB Move.
It's already low speed, coupled with Hammer Arm powers up Gyro Ball, allowing to hit upto 150 Base Power. The toss-up is between Gyro Ball and Psychic. Without Psychic, Weezing is bound to wall you, whilst Gyro Ball is generally, a better STAB Attack when dealing with common "Bulky" sweepers like Chomp and Mence. Also, it can have a higher Base Power.
You are, however still walled by threats like Dusknoir and Spiritomb, pokemon that are fairly defensive on boths sides, pokes that also weaken Gyro Ball with their very low speed.
Hammer Arm VS Explosion
The option of Hammer Arm over Explosion is the main choice that'll differentiate this from a standard SpecialGross. Whereas, on a standard SpecialGross, Explosion is your only way to deal with Blissey and other special walls, Hammer Arm allows Meta to battle on, to another day.
However, there are several cases, where Explosion can be seen as a better option. SpecialGross can come in on a onced CM'd Cune, take a Surf, then retalliate with Explosion stopping the setup. MixGross doesn't share this luxury.
Similiar things can be said for most setup pokemon. MixGross can never OHKO Gyarados, unless it's carrying ThunderPunch or HP Electric, which leaves it easily walled by common counter. Again, Explosion is a good way to defuse any tense setup situation.
EDIT: Looking over this set, its move-combination is exactly the same as MixApe with Gyro Ball / Psychic over Nasty Plot.
Something like:
MixGross
Nature - Quiet
EVs - 252 SpAtk / 44 Atk / 212 HP
Item - Life Orb / Expert Belt
Hammer Arm
Gyro Ball / Psychic / Meteor Mash
HP Fire
Grass Knot
EVs generate 354 HP / 316 Atk / 316 SpAtk.
When factoring in the Life Orb you will have approx. 410 Atk and 410 SpAtk. You will be losing 35 HP per, every attack.
Hammer Arm replaces Explosion on standard SpecialGross sets, allowing him to 2HKO several Special Walls such as Cradily, Blissey, Snorlax and Regice. Grass Knot and HP Fire are a strong attacking combination, hitting many of Meta's common counters. Swampert, Donphan and Hippowdon are all OHKO'd by LO Grass Knot. HP Fire is a 2HKO on Skarm and Tangrowth.
The second slot is reserved for your STAB Move.
It's already low speed, coupled with Hammer Arm powers up Gyro Ball, allowing to hit upto 150 Base Power. The toss-up is between Gyro Ball and Psychic. Without Psychic, Weezing is bound to wall you, whilst Gyro Ball is generally, a better STAB Attack when dealing with common "Bulky" sweepers like Chomp and Mence. Also, it can have a higher Base Power.
You are, however still walled by threats like Dusknoir and Spiritomb, pokemon that are fairly defensive on boths sides, pokes that also weaken Gyro Ball with their very low speed.
Hammer Arm VS Explosion
The option of Hammer Arm over Explosion is the main choice that'll differentiate this from a standard SpecialGross. Whereas, on a standard SpecialGross, Explosion is your only way to deal with Blissey and other special walls, Hammer Arm allows Meta to battle on, to another day.
However, there are several cases, where Explosion can be seen as a better option. SpecialGross can come in on a onced CM'd Cune, take a Surf, then retalliate with Explosion stopping the setup. MixGross doesn't share this luxury.
Similiar things can be said for most setup pokemon. MixGross can never OHKO Gyarados, unless it's carrying ThunderPunch or HP Electric, which leaves it easily walled by common counter. Again, Explosion is a good way to defuse any tense setup situation.
EDIT: Looking over this set, its move-combination is exactly the same as MixApe with Gyro Ball / Psychic over Nasty Plot.
VERY nice gentlemen, this set looks very promising. I will have to try it myself!
does meta learn trick room?
Question:
Seeing as how Groos actually has pretty darn awesome physical defenses (just above Skarmory according to DT's Skarmcents) and 90 Base Sdef:
Metagross @ Leftovers
252 HP/252 Defense Brave/Relaxed 0 Spe
~ Hammer Arm
~ Gyro Ball
~ Rest
~ Sleep Talk
A Restalker solves a lot of problems with PP, since you can Hammer Arm in your sleep to lower speed.
Seeing as how Groos actually has pretty darn awesome physical defenses (just above Skarmory according to DT's Skarmcents) and 90 Base Sdef:
Metagross @ Leftovers
252 HP/252 Defense Brave/Relaxed 0 Spe
~ Hammer Arm
~ Gyro Ball
~ Rest
~ Sleep Talk
A Restalker solves a lot of problems with PP, since you can Hammer Arm in your sleep to lower speed.
lol.
gravediggers
gravediggers
I blame user Chris is me for double posting on the first page, making all responses (which are current) on the second page.
Besides, the idea isn't that horrible.
Metagross shouldn't be walling with an Earthquake weakness. Skarmory is so good because the best physical attacks are resisted by it (Earthquake, Dragon Attacks, Crunch, and the like) While Metagross resists just Dragon out of the useful ones. It'd catch a lot of people by surprise, but no wall wants to be taking a 200BP attack (Earthquake) against most of the pokemon it's supposed to be walling.
Still, at least it'd be better then trying a Wall Metagross in advance. There were even more earthquakes going around.
Still, at least it'd be better then trying a Wall Metagross in advance. There were even more earthquakes going around.
Metagross' ONLY physical weakness is Earthquake, most of the common ones of which he'd run from with a sweeper set anyway. Like Skarmory, Groos has the distinct advantage of being nuetral to Fighting. What makes Metagross different then Skarm is no Electric weakness and resistance to Ice. With higher Base SDef and HP, Groos could easily take nuetral special hits, although Bulky Waters would still be a nuisance. Fire types would signal a switchout, but most of them won't switch into Groos for fear it might have Agility or predict whatever with EQ.
Registeel does perfectly fine at walling, as does Regirock, and they both have Earthquake weaknesses.
Besides, that set isn't exactly walling stuff, but tanking instead.
They need 519 Speed for Gyro Ball to equal Meteor Mash.
After a Hammer Arm Speed drop, they need 343 Speed.
After 2 Hammer Arm Speed drops or an Iron Ball, they need 259 Speed.
I wouldn't use an Iron Ball, though. I'd rather use a Life Orb or Leftovers. Rest, Sleep Talk, Gyro Ball, Hammer Arm has some promise, since you increase in effectiveness the longer you stay in, Metagross is a tough nut to crack, and Gyro Ball has crap PP.
After a Hammer Arm Speed drop, they need 343 Speed.
After 2 Hammer Arm Speed drops or an Iron Ball, they need 259 Speed.
I wouldn't use an Iron Ball, though. I'd rather use a Life Orb or Leftovers. Rest, Sleep Talk, Gyro Ball, Hammer Arm has some promise, since you increase in effectiveness the longer you stay in, Metagross is a tough nut to crack, and Gyro Ball has crap PP.
Takes one to know one lol.
Sorry for having nothing to add to this discussion, just wanted to point out some irony.
