Ladder Balanced Hackmons

[Beauvoir]

Since I've started playing BH, after the EV-limit change, I've had a ton of problems making a good enough team to check abilities like -ate, Imposter, and also Contrary. It's been popping up on almost every team for some time now.
Since I dislike using the top abilities like these, I sometimes lose many times in a row. (>:I)

But alas! I've stumbled upon a set that, laughably, works well against some of these nuisances.
(This is obv meant to be a stall set btw. This is in case I run into trouble.)

Wondeer Guard (Xerneas) @ Leftovers
Ability: Fur Coat
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Metal Burst
- King's Shield
- Recover
- Infestation

And just look at how some of these calcs go against some threats!

• 252+ Atk Choice Band Refrigerate Kyurem-B Extreme Speed vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Fur Coat Xerneas: 178-210 (39 - 46%)

• 252+ SpA Refrigerate Kyurem-W Boomburst vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Xerneas: 291-343 (63.8 - 75.2%)

• 252+ SpA Choice Specs Aerilate Rayquaza Boomburst vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Xerneas: 397-468 (87 - 102.6%) -- 18.8% chance to OHKO

• 252+ Atk Mega Mewtwo X V-create vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Fur Coat Xerneas: 150-176 (32.8 - 38.5%)
  
  
• +3 252+ Atk Mega Mewtwo X V-create vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Fur Coat Xerneas: 374-440 (82 - 96.4%)

• +6 252+ Atk Slaking Extreme Speed vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Fur Coat Xerneas: 349-411 (76.5 - 90.1%)

Problems I see are that this set loses to Shell Smash/Geomancy Stored Power MMY (survives against Tail Glow versions), just barely survives Specs Boomburst Rayquaza and loses to Belly Drum Slaking if it holds anything.

Even though I have a Prankster HS/Curse Giratina to help out a bit, good help on switch-out-tos would be gladly appreciated and maybe considered...

 

[Whatwasthatnoise]

It's not Specs Rayquaza you should be worrying about, it's specs Kyurem. Or Megagarde. I have never seen a Specs Rayquaza (Plenty of LO ones but never a Specs) and it would be unlikely for them to leave it in on you in any case (If you bring Xern in on a Rayquaza it usually means it's Pixilate, and if they already know what it does they still won't leave it in)

Specs Kyuw on the other hand is terrifying to face without something like Regenvest Kyogre or a Soundproof (And has been even before 510). Soundproof Arc/TTar also neatly checks BBurst Rayqaza with the proper EVs. Talk to Adrian Marin for information on Soundproof Arceus.

As for Contrary/Belly Drum, Prankster/Unaware is best to deal with them. Personally I find that Unaware Darm-Z works like a charm on basically everything, but something like a Prankster Ghost-type might be useful too.

Or you could just be boring and run an Imposter Chansey but where's the fun in that?

 

[Uselesscrab]

Specs Kyurem-White isn't as great as you might think. Particularly against offense, it's outsped by way too many prominent threats to be effective. I can see how it would be more useful against stall, though.

 

[xJownage]

specs kyurem-w is actually scary for offensive teams at times. why? because literally nothing can switch into specs boomburst. Offensive teams carrying slower mons literally are forced to sack a mon often and if sturdinja comes out it can just volt switch out (provided it predicts). Its much scarier for stall, but it is definitely not dead weight for offense because anything that cant kill it or is slower forces the opp to sack a mon.

 

[Pikachuun]

specs kyurem-w is actually scary for offensive teams at times. why? because literally nothing can switch into specs boomburst. Offensive teams carrying slower mons literally are forced to sack a mon often and if sturdinja comes out it can just volt switch out (provided it predicts). Its much scarier for stall, but it is definitely not dead weight for offense because anything that cant kill it or is slower forces the opp to sack a mon.

And this is why I have Registeel and Sturdinja on my team...
Then again Magma Storm kills them both so

 

[Whatwasthatnoise]

specs kyurem-w is actually scary for offensive teams at times. why? because literally nothing can switch into specs boomburst. Offensive teams carrying slower mons literally are forced to sack a mon often and if sturdinja comes out it can just volt switch out (provided it predicts). Its much scarier for stall, but it is definitely not dead weight for offense because anything that cant kill it or is slower forces the opp to sack a mon.

This. Barring particularly bulky Steels or Kyogre (And even then they can't take repeated hits) Kyuw kills anything that switches in. If you bring it in to revenge something, you can sponge weaker hits (Or even stronger ones if against an offense team you don't feel the need to keep it alive for, like Cube/Quaza Espeed) and annihilate it. And it rips stall teams into tiny little shreds if they don't carry a Soundproof, because very little can take multiple Boombursts.

True, it loses to faster things. The same is true of quite a large number of things you don't want pointed at your team, and if Kyuw gets in on something slower than it, you're probably going to lose a team member, as they are quite capable of running full coverage (Including Magma Storm, for all the pesky Steels and Shedinja)

 

[Heisenerg]

Honestly I don't think Specs are necessary especially with the EV reduction; a NeverMeltIce/Life Orb boosted Boomburst already hits hard enough and Fake-Out + Extremespeed comes in handy so often and is even better than before with the reduced bulk of all Pokemon, allowing it to beat stuff Specs KyuW can't like mGengar and MMY.

yay 100th post

 

[PokemonMasterDebater]

Some new ORAS info was released today.
http://bulbanews.bulbagarden.net/wi...rther_details_about_Primal_Groudon_and_Kyogre

To sum up Primal Groudon gets an ability called Desolate Land, that will make Water type moves fail and summons sun. Kyogre gets an equivalent for rain called Primordial Sea that causes Fire type moves to fail. The effects of these abilities disappear as soon as the user switches out. Primordial Sea is a better form of Flash Fire most of the time, and Desolate Land is a good alternative to other water immunity abilities, as they also let you power up your own Water/Fire type coverage, and possibly strip away weather from your opponent on the rare occasion that you see someone using weather.

Both PG and PK's new moves got English names, but the only other thing we know about them is that they are spread attacks.

In addition Gallade, Sharpedo, and Camerupt all got Mega Evolutions. M-Gallade is irrelivent unless MM2X gets banned, M-Sharpedo probably is not gonna be as good as M-Gyara is now, and Camerupt might be irrelevant too if Primal Groudon is Ground/Fire as some suspect, but if not he could be a great Desolate Land user.

 

[Ranger Mike]

While groudon and camerupt have shitty typings they have a huge niche in dry skin as stopping ph ogre and drizzlepalk are gonna be huge in this new meta. Sharpedo can run mixed sheer force or something, will be interesting, and I, for one think that mega gallade will be a really solid regenvester due to it's SpD most likely getting at least 20 points.

 

[Talpr0ne]

While groudon and camerupt have shitty typings they have a huge niche in dry skin as stopping ph ogre and drizzlepalk are gonna be huge in this new meta. Sharpedo can run mixed sheer force or something, will be interesting, and I, for one think that mega gallade will be a really solid regenvester due to it's SpD most likely getting at least 20 points.

Shitty typing is a grossly unaccurate claim, as you have Fire, Poison, Steel, Fairy and Bug resistances as well as an Electric and burn immunity, while only being weak to Ground if you run any of Water Absorb, Dry Skin, Storm Drain or Desolate Land.

Primal Groudon was confirmed to be a Ground-Fire type a while ago btw.

 

[Pikachuun]

PG and PK's new moves got English names, but the only other thing we know about them is that they are spread attacks.

Wrong.
We also know that PG's move is Ground type, and PK's move is Water type.

GF wouldn't not give them STAB, and PG's is SE on Blaziken in the trailer.

 

[PokemonMasterDebater]

Wrong.
We also know that PG's move is Ground type, and PK's move is Water type.

They wouldn't not give it STAB, and PG's is SE on Blaziken in the trailer.

I assumed that was a given. I meant we don't know the BP, if they have secondary effects, or will be effected by other abilities like Mega Launcher (although that is likely for PK's since it has the word Pulse in its name)

Primal Groudon was confirmed to be a Ground-Fire type a while ago btw.

I must have missed that, thanks.

 

[Whatwasthatnoise]

Camerupt might have some minor niche in Special offense, but anything that wants Sun (And isn't me messing around with Charizard's Mega-Evolutions) will probably want Desolate Land over Drought, barring Solar Power and Chlorophyll. Same goes for Rain, but with Swift Swim and Hydration. Not that these see much use.

Drizzlepalk and Droughtzard (Not that the latter really exists) will enjoy these. People messing around with Primal Ogre (Simple Shell Smash->Megaogre maybe?) will also like this. Maybe even Scizor, depending on how this works with Mold Breaker.

 

[Heisenerg]

Maybe even Scizor, depending on how this works with Mold Breaker.

Mold Breaker only ignores abilities, whereas in this case the weather is providing an immunity.

 

[Lcass4919]

well, back on the whole topic of priority spam, i just battled a team utilizing it, and i must say it was pretty easy to work around... of course, im not implying if its broken or not, but still.

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/balancedhackmons-163116265

on a different (and the entire reason to bring up that battle) topic, im trying out my VERY first 6th gen team ive made in bh, and im very proud of the results so far. personally i find regigigas to be a hidden gem of bh atm, since it has strong priority, a powerful 140 stab move, anti imposter shenanigans, and decent bulk with max hp investment. it can consistantly heal itself up by using spiky sheild, and i have 2 checks to setup sweepers, so they dont scare me too much if i underpredict. of course the loss of speed and bulk is notable, but the power is beautiful and much appriciated imo

 

[Fossil_Maniac_27]

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/balancedhackmons-163507713
I have defeated -ate spam.
Honestly, the one thing thing I've seen true from most -ates is that they can't do much of anything to sturdinja outside of rocky helmet.

 

[Piccolo Daimao]

I just run a Soundproof Mega Aggron to deal with them. It has the added benefit of forcing switches (Perish Song) of Flying types that it can't trap with Thousand Waves.

 

[DinaIsha]

You've probably seen this already, but it never hurts to boggle your mind with silly mathematical pleasures.

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/balancedhackmons-163814957

Eviolite Chansey Imposter-ing a Shuckle = 250 HP / 345 Def / 345 SDef

Plus, it had Cosmic Power to boot. The match itself ended in an unwanted ragequit. But imagine that bulk.. taking ~20% from a +6 (albeit non-STAB) Psycho Boost after only 2 turns of CP.

 

[verbatim]

The issue with that is that Imposter is that it is in and of itself suited primarily to non-stalling endeavors because you can only have, at most, 20 turns before you Struggle.

 

[Halliday]

Post 2000 on BH thread, also it doesn't work the way you have it set up, the equivalent BST defenses of the chansey-shuckle are WAY higher than 345

 

[Mowtom]

Why wasn't the Chansey-Shuckle affected by Curse?

 

[Uselesscrab]

Why wasn't the Chansey-Shuckle affected by Curse?

Didn't watch the replay, but it was probably Magic Guard.

 

[Ranger Mike]

Garchomp-Mega @ Icicle Plate
Ability: Skill Link
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Judgment
- Shell Smash
- Bone Rush
- Rock Blast

Here is a REALLY good late game cleaner: Skill link garchomp, this thing wrecks so many things all you need is ate users eliminated. Judgement is for imposters, shell smash is obligatory, bone rush is stab, and rock blast ties it in for a really good coverage of the infamous edgequake. So how do you think that this set does? What does it beat that other garchomps don't? Is this outclassed by technichomp? Discuss

 

[Halliday]

I think that the biggest weakness of that set is that it tries to be a 4x ice weak set up sweeper in an -ate infested metagame. That really hurts it's chances against any competent player. Technichomp is viable primarily because it works more as a wallbreaker than a sweeper, and as such doesn't care about being forced out by -ates nearly as much.

 

[Fossil_Maniac_27]

Garchomp-Mega @ Icicle Plate
Ability: Skill Link
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Judgment
- Shell Smash
- Bone Rush
- Rock Blast

Here is a REALLY good late game cleaner: Skill link garchomp, this thing wrecks so many things all you need is ate users eliminated. Judgement is for imposters, shell smash is obligatory, bone rush is stab, and rock blast ties it in for a really good coverage of the infamous edgequake. So how do you think that this set does? What does it beat that other garchomps don't? Is this outclassed by technichomp? Discuss

I actually tried a set similar to that, except I used an aerilate rayquaza instead of a garchomp. I think it was something like
Rayquaza @ Icicle Plate
Ability: Aerilate
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Boomburst
- Thunderbolt
- Judgment
- Giga Drain
I don't know why I put giga drain on there, I just did. I could use another move. I used this on an -ate spam team to try it out. It was effective, but it's not my main team. I used the -ate team on my alt.