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Ladder Balanced Hackmons
- Thread starter verbatim
- Start date
My approach against Refrigerate Kyu-B (Cube) is to get either SR or Spikes up and if I see a Cube I just Imposter it with Chansey because I haven't faced one that is Anti-Imposter to my recollection. Since many teams I've encountered that run Cube also run Shedinja, this prevents a switch in to wall the Cube or brings out their anti-Cube. If they have an Anti-Cube, such as one of the mons Rumors posted, taking it out will keep them uneasy about bringing in their Cube again.
Also what works for me is if the Cube doesn't have recovery, then switching Chansey in and out will wear it down with Fake Outs and if the Cube does have recovery then Chansey should be able to drain it's limited 8 pp of ExtremeSpeed.
Also what works for me is if the Cube doesn't have recovery, then switching Chansey in and out will wear it down with Fake Outs and if the Cube does have recovery then Chansey should be able to drain it's limited 8 pp of ExtremeSpeed.
The complete shutdown is from encore, which forces struggle if it's locked into fake out (afaik)
Honestly, Shield Dust looks like a waste of an ability, if you really want to stop Fake Out ES Kyu-B, just use Flash Fire Mega Scizor. A fire immunity is much better than Shield Dust (Shield Dust's main purpose is to stop Sacred Fire from burning) Fake Out flinch immunity isn't that relevant because Fake Out is relatively weak and any smart player will not be a victim of Encore a second time.
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Shield Dust would be extremely useful if Serene Grace becomes common, however. But that's probably unlikely. It kind of feels like one of those nifty on paper but too niche to use in practice. Kind of like Wonder Skin, which lets you dodge moves like Trick and Psycho Shift. Sounds great, but the stuff Wonder Skin covers that Magic Bounce doesn't is too uncommon to make it worth running. Likewise, there are other abilities that'll cover what you usually need to worry about that Shield Dust handles, like Flash Fire.
It's not a bad ability, per say, but just be sure you're using it for the right reasons.
It's not a bad ability, per say, but just be sure you're using it for the right reasons.
I believe that using fake out after the first turn merely makes it have no effect.
What do you all think about skill swapping Truant? I think it's an okay strategy. Definitely forces a switch, giving you a chance to set something up. And if they stay in (I don't know why they would, but this is hypothetical), you can just protect on the turns they get to attack. Then, when they're loafing around, you can recover/spin/attack them, whatever the situation necessitates.
Skill Swapping Truant is similar to Skill Swapping Normalize, except that with Normalize if the user (Ghost type) is fast they don't need to be able to take a hit while the Truant swapper is going to have to be able to take a hit. The only real advantage I see with Truant is any mon could use it to force a switch, while Normalize only works for Ghosts.
If they stay in, if you use Mean Look or equivalent, then they are trapped while you can use Protect.
How would this work for anti-Imposter?
Ho-oh @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 SDef / 252 Spd
- Shift Gear
- Earthquake/Spore
- Sacred Fire/Flare Blitz/V-Create
- Powder
Powder has priority and 32 PP so you can spam it until Blissey runs out of PP for the Fire move of choice.
Ho-oh @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 SDef / 252 Spd
- Shift Gear
- Earthquake/Spore
- Sacred Fire/Flare Blitz/V-Create
- Powder
Powder has priority and 32 PP so you can spam it until Blissey runs out of PP for the Fire move of choice.
I'd put that more as Imposter resistant than anti-Imposter since Chansey could safely stall you out of 15 Powder PP, switch out, and then switch back in to repeat. They can also copy your boosts, which means that their fire attacks are going to be hitting you disproportionately hard.
An anti-Imposter is something that neutralizes Imposter as a threat entirely, whether by being immune to Imposters while hitting them back (Judgement ghosts), KOing them before they can do much or anything at all (Scarf Contrary Kyu-W with Draco Meteor or Stone Plate Judgement Charizard-Y), or rendering them helpless (Imprison or luring an Imposter into, say, mono-Psychic attacking Jirachu and then switching in a Dark-type Magnent Pull user).
An anti-Imposter is something that neutralizes Imposter as a threat entirely, whether by being immune to Imposters while hitting them back (Judgement ghosts), KOing them before they can do much or anything at all (Scarf Contrary Kyu-W with Draco Meteor or Stone Plate Judgement Charizard-Y), or rendering them helpless (Imprison or luring an Imposter into, say, mono-Psychic attacking Jirachu and then switching in a Dark-type Magnent Pull user).
Kit Kasai
Love colored magic
I've been theorymonning a bit with Adrian about a ref/pix counter, and here's what we've come up with:
Regirock @ Leftovers
Ability: Soundproof
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 SDef / 252 Spd
Bold Nature
- Infestation
- Perish Song
- Recover
- Filler
I've only done some preliminary testing on this so far, but it's shown some promise.
This thing can take hits from xerneas for days, and can also wall common coverage moves it carries (unless for some reason it has grass knot). It can then proceed to perish trap it and get a free kill.
Cube is a bit more complicated of a set. It can take coverage moves like bolt strike and earthquake decently, but takes almost 50% from close combat (not actually sure if cube carries that). However, it can easily take non SFE moves from cube and shut it down.
And aelirate looks pathetic in front of this.
EDIT:
here's a replay:
Regirock at turn 17
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/balancedhackmons-69875057
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/balancedhackmons-69875057
Meanwhile, fur coat regice
jk
Regirock @ Leftovers
Ability: Soundproof
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 SDef / 252 Spd
Bold Nature
- Infestation
- Perish Song
- Recover
- Filler
I've only done some preliminary testing on this so far, but it's shown some promise.
This thing can take hits from xerneas for days, and can also wall common coverage moves it carries (unless for some reason it has grass knot). It can then proceed to perish trap it and get a free kill.
Cube is a bit more complicated of a set. It can take coverage moves like bolt strike and earthquake decently, but takes almost 50% from close combat (not actually sure if cube carries that). However, it can easily take non SFE moves from cube and shut it down.
And aelirate looks pathetic in front of this.
EDIT:
here's a replay:
Regirock at turn 17
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/balancedhackmons-69875057
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/balancedhackmons-69875057
Meanwhile, fur coat regice
jk
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Of course, you run up against the problem that most non-Pix/Refri/Aeri Special attackers can kill you quite easily, and your main method of dealing damage falls flat in the face of anything capable of doing enough damage to force you into continuous Recovering. It walls Pixerneas well, but Cube tends to smack you with either SE coverage or repeated Extremespeeds. Neither of which it likes, as (IIRC) both are 3HKOs. That's not even mentioning set-up versions. Kyu-W really depends on the moves it's running, as SE Earth Power tends to sting a lot.
That said, if it gets Infestation off on something it walls effectively (And there are a fair few of those) it's going to Perishtrap them. It can potentially do this repeatedly, without switching. And the filler can be something that negates/mitigates it's problems, or just general team support.
That said, if it gets Infestation off on something it walls effectively (And there are a fair few of those) it's going to Perishtrap them. It can potentially do this repeatedly, without switching. And the filler can be something that negates/mitigates it's problems, or just general team support.
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King's shield or encore could be a good fillers against kuy-b. King's shield could really help against the general e-speed spammers.
Encore could also be nifty just incase against the setup varitations but it's pretty risky so idk.
Encore could also be nifty just incase against the setup varitations but it's pretty risky so idk.
Kit Kasai
Love colored magic
The core of this set is soundproof, which allows you to take boomburst and perish trap.
Also, your encore strat only works if they switch in on you, so you can't use it to check cube.
So today, I found out that you can only mega evolve once in BH. This isn't how it's supposed to be, right? (I was testing a team of mega stone-based strategies against my friend, but only one of them actually worked, and that was the first one I used. :/)
It's probably just never been decided whether multiple stone mega evolutions can occur, so we've been using the default behavior. I'm not sure if the "level" of hacking present in BH would allow for multiple stone evolutions in battle though, since the extent of what's allowed in hackmons is doable by modifying a pokemon's data outside of battle (moveset, ability, forme, EVs).
This set sounds good?
Pinsir-Mega @ Leftovers/Sharp Beak
Ability: Aerilate
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 SDef / 252 Spd
Adamant Nature
- Belly Drum
- Extreme Speed
- Megahorn
- Drain Punch
Pinsir-Mega @ Leftovers/Sharp Beak
Ability: Aerilate
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 SDef / 252 Spd
Adamant Nature
- Belly Drum
- Extreme Speed
- Megahorn
- Drain Punch
Yveltal and even Rayquaza are bulkier and have better secondary STABs.
This set is a high risk high reward set. If the speed tie is won against a full HP Imposter Chansey with Eviolite switch in, then it can pull the OHKO with ExtremeSpeed.
+6 252+ Atk Aerilate Mega Pinsir Extreme Speed vs. +1 252 HP (Base 250 HP) / 252 Def Mega Pinsir: 788-930 (111.9 - 132.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
This is of course assuming you can pull that Belly Drum off, which could be difficult to pull off and survive a hit. Now if it can be pulled off, since Drain Punch isn't a very reliable source of recovery, this is pretty much a one shot deal. So I'd recommend that either the opponet is asleep, or you have a sub up before attempting the sweep.
Also, hazards are going to be highly recommended before using this because if you come in, pull off the Belly Drum, and they switch into Sturdy Shedinja, that Pinsir set has nothing to hurt Shedinja and nothing to regain HP, because Drain Punch will recover 0% against Shedinja. This means that M-Pinsir will need to be switched out and won't be able to pull off any more Belly Drums.
I'd recommend if you want to improve this set, change out Megahorn for Leech Seed or Infestation to take down the bug, and replace Belly Drum with Swords Dance. Though if this happens then M-Pinsir can no longer have a chance to OHKO a full HP Imposter, that pink blob can even survive a crit it looks like.
+2 252+ Atk Aerilate Mega Pinsir Extreme Speed vs. +1 252 HP / 252 Def Mega Pinsir: 396-468 (56.2 - 66.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
There's something that all those Pokemon lack, they aren't as beast as Pinsir. :D
I kind of disagree, since most of BHXY has been based on speculation, since the 3DS can't actually be hacked as easily as it was last gen. There is no reason why megas shouldn't be allowed to evolve with stones more than once if they can exist without stones an infinite number of times.
Yveltal @ Leftovers/Lum Berry/Safety Goggles
Ability: Fur Coat
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 SDef / 252 Spd
Sassy Nature
- Low Kick
- Roost
- Whirlwind
- Oblivion Wing/Knock Off
At first I thought Fur Coat would have no true use in BH, once Tail Glow Ghostceus made a comeback, I started to see value in the bird, it counters the mentioned threats very well, not only that but with Low Kick, it can dish out a lot of damage against both Mega Gyarados and Mega Tyranitar. Whirlwind provides a safe way to deal with boosting sweepers. The reason this Yveltal is using Fur Coat is to wall lethal threats such as Protean M2X. I suggest using this set only for pure stall teams or balanced because its role is to wall certain threats that aren't as important as others to offense.
Ability: Fur Coat
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 SDef / 252 Spd
Sassy Nature
- Low Kick
- Roost
- Whirlwind
- Oblivion Wing/Knock Off
At first I thought Fur Coat would have no true use in BH, once Tail Glow Ghostceus made a comeback, I started to see value in the bird, it counters the mentioned threats very well, not only that but with Low Kick, it can dish out a lot of damage against both Mega Gyarados and Mega Tyranitar. Whirlwind provides a safe way to deal with boosting sweepers. The reason this Yveltal is using Fur Coat is to wall lethal threats such as Protean M2X. I suggest using this set only for pure stall teams or balanced because its role is to wall certain threats that aren't as important as others to offense.
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This set seems great for its overall defensive utility, yet I see one small problem:
252 Atk Protean Mega Mewtwo X Play Rough vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Fur Coat Yveltal: 160-190 (35 - 41.6%) -- 74.6% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
As you can see, yvetal cannot switch in after SR as it stands a good chance of being 2hkod. Its a relatively minor problem though, as hazards are easy to keep away with defog and all. You could also bait a non-SE attack which this set could could easily switch in on. I dont want to say much more without using the set, but it looks good man imo.
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I would be more scared about Bolt Strike, which probably 2HKOes easily (I've been using this a bit since there seems to be a great deal of regenerator mons with Nuzzle this days (Mainly Kyogre and Ho-oh) so it's an easy way to OHKO them (and it's great on both MX & MY since Assault Vest is a common item on them so you can break them without risking Paralysis)