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Bit By Bit (Peaked #1)

Discussion in 'BW Other Teams' started by Django, Jun 5, 2012.

  1. Django

    Django
    is a Smogon Media Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Forum Moderator Alumnus

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    [​IMG]

    Stall has always been one of my favorite playstyles, as the ability to safely handle as many threats as reliably as possible is really attractive. Its hard to pull off in NU however, which is such an offensive metagame with so many stallbreakers waiting around every corner. At some point in #neverused we were talking about how Duosion beats a lot of stall teams, and Worry Seed Tangela with Toxic Spikes support was brought up. Me and CrashingBoomBang thought lets go with it and set about building a team around it. The results were mediocre at best, and Worry Seed Tangela in itself turned out to be average at best. It eventually morphed into something really effective, and peaked after the ladder reset at 1403 on the alt "send me a file".


    Team Building:
    Show Hide

    So we started with Tangela, obviously. It originally ran Sleep Powder / Synthesis / Giga Drain / Hidden Power Ice, since Regen was illegal with Worry Seed.
    [​IMG]
    The biggest problem with Tangela as a physical wall is its weakness to Emboar, so we went with Alomomola to fix that problem, as well as Garbardor for Toxic Spikes.
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    After that we needed a way to beat Gorebyss as well as a spinner. Cryogonal and Lickilicky were added.
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    Braviary completely destroyed the team, so Regirock was thrown in, which came with Stealth Rock.
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    The lack of spinblocker was crippling, so Frillish came in for Alomomola.
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    The team was working OK, but struggled vs Haunter really badly. I got pretty mad at this, and replaced Regirock with Probopass, as well as replacing Tangela with Musharna.
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    This did cause a gigantic Dark type (and Absol) weakness. So Tangela came back over Musharna. A phazer was also really needed, so Probopass made way for Bastiodon.
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]


    [​IMG]

    Tangela (F) @ [​IMG]
    Trait: Regenerator
    EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 Spd
    Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
    ~ Sleep Powder
    ~ Knock Off
    ~ Giga Drain
    ~ Hidden Power [Ice]

    Despite initially being a random gimmick, Tangela fell back into pretty much its standard set. It serves a very important role for this team, being able to take on almost every physical attacker in the tier, bar Emboar and a few other Pokemon. For the brief period I tested Musharna instead of it my team often fell apart because of Pursuit Pokemon, leaving me in no doubt who the best Physical wall in NU is. Sleep Powder is another great reason to use it, and despite this team relying heavily on Toxic Spikes it’s still useful for catching Braviary, among others, on the switch. Knock Off is chosen over Leech Seed as it really helps to wear down Musharna, and cripples Duosion to the point where it can be KO’d by Cryogonal later on. This is essential as beating those two Pokemon was the initial reasoning for putting Tangela on the team. Hidden Power Ice was chosen over Fire in order to hit Fraxure / Shelgon, who occasionally gave the team trouble, while still letting it beat Sawsbuck. 248 HP is used for an odd HP number, and 8 Speed for spped-creeping Golems.

    [​IMG]

    Garbodor (F) @ [​IMG]
    Trait: Stench
    EVs: 252 HP / 160 Def / 96 Spd
    Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
    ~ Toxic Spikes
    ~ Spikes
    ~ Gunk Shot
    ~ Rock Blast

    Toxic Spikes are absolutely essential for this team to work. They stop so many dangerous sweepers like Gorebyss from completely wrecking the team, as well as wearing down every opposing team lacking a Poison type. Some games I look at the other team and think: “OK no Posion type or spinner, lets set up Toxic Spikes and win”. Spikes can also be pretty damn useful, and are the weapon of choice when I do see a Poison types. Its a real shame there is such a lack of hazard setters in NU, particularly for Toxic Spikes. Stuff like Whirlipede just doesn’t cut it, and initially I was not impressed with having to use Garbador, but it definitely pulls its weight. With heavy investment in defense (the Speed EVs are to outrun Golem as well as Adamant Cacturne and Modest Exeggutor), and an Air Balloon, it easily gets two to three layers of hazards up against Golem. This is the reason for using Air Balloon, as Golem is really common on offensive teams and often there is no other window to get Toxic Spikes up before it’s too late. It also makes a great surprise for Sawk who think they can Earthquake the obvious Poison type switch in. It is surprisingly bulky and can set up hazards on lots of common Pokemon including Rotom-S, Torterra, Regirock and Probopass. Rock Blast is there to stop Cryogonal switching in, and also hurts Braviary who cannot OHKO Garbardor.

    [​IMG]

    Cryogonal @ [​IMG]
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    ~ Ice Beam
    ~ Hidden Power [Ground]
    ~ Recover
    ~ Rapid Spin

    Every stall team needs a spinner, and this is no exception. LO Cryogonal is my favorite (and I would say the most reliable) spinner in NU, as well as being the only “offensive” Pokemon this team has, even though its role is primarily defensive. LO Ice Beam 2HKO’s standard Misdreavus after Stealth Rock, which is absolutely amazing and allows it to spin the moment it gets a free turn, as it can KO any Ghost switching it. It also outspeeds and KO’s Haunter and Drifblim (before Unburden), so all in all its a great spinner. Not to mention its a fantastic Pokemon outside of spinning, providing some much needed Speed to the team, as well as a good win condition for late game. Hidden Power Ground hits Bastiodon and Probopass, who can be annoying to wear down because of Toxic Spikes immunity. Cryogonal maintains good special bulk even without investment, and this makes it part of my answer to Vileplume, one of the most annoying Pokemon to face with this team. As long as Cryogonal can avoid Sleep Powder, it’s good to go.

    [​IMG]

    Frillish (M) @ [​IMG]
    Trait: Water Absorb
    EVs: 248 HP / 216 Def / 44 Spd
    Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
    ~ Taunt
    ~ Recover
    ~ Toxic
    ~ Night Shade

    A spinblocker is perhaps even more important to a stall team than a spinner, and Frillish is the most reliable one in NU. It beats every single Rapid Spinner (bar SD Armaldo) one on one, and checks loads of dangerous Pokemon on the side. Cryogonal cannot break through Frillish, unless it runs Substitute and Toxic which is just a dumb set, Torkoal flat out loses and Armaldo struggles to keep up if it switches into Toxic Spikes. Wartortle can be irritating to face if it runs Foresight, but luckily that is rare. Other variants of Wartortle usually run Rest, but over the course of the battle they will never break down Frillish. Outside of Spinblocking, Frillish provides my best answer to Samurott, who would otherwise break down this team pretty easily. It also provides a good switch in to Emboar, provided I can predict properly. The Speed EVs outrun minimum Speed Golem. Taunt is my best response to Calm Mind Duosion and Musharna, and Frillish stops them being such massive threats as they are to most stall teams. I used Toxic instead of Will-O-Wisp as honestly I need to wear down threats as fast as possible, burning stuff like Musharna (if Toxic Spikes aren’t down) just doesn’t cut it. Night Shade is the most reliable damage Frillish can deal.

    [​IMG]

    Lickilicky (F) @ [​IMG]
    Trait: Own Tempo
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 SDef / 4 Spd
    Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)
    ~ Wish
    ~ Protect
    ~ Dragon Tail
    ~ Heal Bell

    Lickilicky is the glue holding this team together. Heal Bell and Wish support are absolutely essential to the way the rest of the team works; letting Garbador and Bastiodon sacrifice their health to get hazards, letting Cryogonal take a hit or two to spin, and just generally slowing the opponent down. It is also the teams best answer to Shell Smash Gorebyss, along with Toxic Spikes. Once Toxic Spikes are down, Lickilicky can often stall entire teams, especially when you consider anything that will beat it is handled by either Tangela or Frillish. Dragon Tail can be brutal once hazards are up, preventing anything dangerous from switching in and brutalising the opposing team. Throughout the match Lickilicky can also phaze both Duosion and Musharna, working the opposing team into a situation where Cryogonal can clean up later on. The only issue I have with Lickilicky is that it is massive set up bait for a lot of Pokemon who carry Substitute (stuff like SubCM Serperior) who can then cause massive problems if Toxic Spikes aren’t up or Bastiodon cannot phaze them...

    [​IMG]

    Bastiodon (F) @ [​IMG]
    Trait: Sturdy
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SDef
    Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
    ~ Stealth Rock
    ~ Protect
    ~ Roar
    ~ Magic Coat

    This slot in the team has changed the most, but I think it will stay as Bastiodon for the forseeable future. Stealth Rock is absolutely essential, beating down Braviary and Magmortar, who can otherwise shred this team. Bastiodon also provides half of the solution to beating Braviary, being able to scout for Superpower with Protect. If Braviary does use Superpower, then Tangela or Frillish can easily switch in, and Bastiodon takes Brave Bird with ease. Initially this team lacked a phazer outside of Lickilicky, but the more traditional Roar has been a complete revelation, stopping a lot of dangerous sweepers and racking up so much more damage with hazards. On top of this, Bastiodon is a great stop to Haunter and most offensive Psychic types such as Gardevoir, who can pose a large threat. Oh and Drifblim. Magic Coat doesn’t see a lot of usage, but it is fantastic for bouncing back Taunt from Skuntank (and others) as well as bouncing back hazards or status moves for fun. Bastiodon definitely has a good niche in NU, and should see some more usage.

    Threats:

    This team covers most of the prominent threats in NU, so I’m just going to cover the ones that give it the most problems (and no I will not be using this team anymore, fuk counterteams).

    Arbok - As dumb as it sounds I am really weak to Arbok. Coil / Gunk Shot / Earthquake / Rest with Shed Skin can beat most of the team, Cryogonal being the best answer to this provided I can weaken it. The problem comes when they randomly carry Sucker Punch and snipe Cryogonal. Has to be played around very well and hope the opponent makes a mistake.

    Serperior - SubCM is the danger, and it can be dealt with by Bastiodon and Cryogonal (ish) but Bastiodon lacks recovery, and Cryogonal can be KO’d by +1 HP Rock. If Toxic Spikes are up it can be stalled, but often they are run with Poison types, becoming a massive issue.

    Duosion - Immune to Toxic Spikes, which is annoying as hell. Calm Mind Psyshock can cause huge problem if Frillish is weakened or dead. Lickilicky can phaze it, and I have to work into a position where Cryogonal will sweep.

    Muk - In a similar boat to Arbok, but often easier to deal with since it has no Shed Skin. Once it uses Rest I can phaze it and then because of the new Sleep mechanics continue to phaze whenever it comes in and stop it recovering.

    Ursaring - SD is really really annoying, especially if it gets in on one layer of Toxic Spikes. I have to stall it with status damage, switching smart between Frillish Tangela and Bastiodon. One mispredict however, and the team will have a big hole.

    Skuntank - This is basically the most annoying thing to play with this team, which is unfortunate as Skuntank gets loads of usage. It absorbs Toxic Spikes, can beat Tangela with Taunt / Sludge Bomb, and can Pursuit trap Frillish. If they run Skuntank and a spinner my life becomes really difficult, and I have to play very carefully with Frillish. Bastiodon is a good response, but has to make sure it hits Taunt with Magic Coat.

    Garbodor - Very annoying since it absorbs my Toxic Spikes and sets up hazards all over every member of the team. Its also hard to kill since I have so little offense, and Cryogonal loses to Garbardor. Basically I have to set up hazards alongside it then phaze with Bastiodon, then outplay the opponent later on.

    Absol - Really annoying, until I figure out its set. SD Megahorn or just plain Fire Blast can snipe Tangela easily, and it can also Pursuit trap Frillish. Toxic Spikes help to wear it down immensely. It’s often a coinflip deciding what to do against Absol.#

    Shoutouts to:

    CrashinBoomBang
    for building the initial team with me, then counterteaming every version after that.
    Keiran for the banner at the top
    NoLuckInvolved for suggesting Bastiodon, as well as a number of other things and generally making me think about what I was doing a lot more.
    #neverused for being a really cool channel [=

    Importable:
    Show Hide
    Tangela (F) @ Eviolite Trait: Regenerator
    EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 Spd
    Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
    - Sleep Powder
    - Knock Off
    - Giga Drain
    - Hidden Power [Ice]
    Garbodor (F) @ Air Balloon
    Trait: Stench
    EVs: 252 HP / 160 Def / 96 Spd
    Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
    - Toxic Spikes
    - Spikes
    - Gunk Shot
    - Rock Blast
    Cryogonal @ Life Orb
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Ice Beam
    - Hidden Power [Ground]
    - Recover
    - Rapid Spin
    Frillish (M) @ Eviolite
    Trait: Water Absorb
    EVs: 248 HP / 216 Def / 44 Spd
    Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
    - Taunt
    - Recover
    - Toxic
    - Night Shade
    Lickilicky (F) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Own Tempo
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 SDef / 4 Spd
    Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)
    - Wish
    - Protect
    - Dragon Tail
    - Heal Bell
    Bastiodon (F) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Sturdy
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SDef
    Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
    - Stealth Rock
    - Protect
    - Roar
    - Magic Coat


    Ladder Peak:
    Show Hide
    [​IMG]


    Thanks for reading and I hope you liked the team.
  2. blunder

    blunder

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    Messages:
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    i actually played against you while also laddering and this team was so hard to take down xD Really well built and the only problem I see is Absol Really as the Mixed Lure Set does quite a number on you. Besides that, excellent team and congrats on ladder peak :]
  3. Django

    Django
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    Thanks. Yeah mixed lure can be an absolute bitch to take down, and generally the best thing I can do is get Toxic Spikes down and then predict around it. It was generally easier to play against when I had Regirock on the team, as it could take a Superpower, but I can't really afford that luxury with lots or Substitute Haunter running around.
  4. pokemonnerd

    pokemonnerd

    Joined:
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    So just explain to me: how is that Bastiodon a stop to Haunter when it can't attack, HP Ground almost kills you anyway and it can just siphon off HP with Pain Split?
  5. Django

    Django
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    Because I need a safe switch in to the ever present Sub Disable and SubSplit Haunters, who can then get it off the field before it damages the rest of the team. Once it it out I can work the opposing team into a position where Cryogonal can OHKO Haunter late game.

    Also HP Ground Haunter is non existant.
  6. Sweet Jesus

    Sweet Jesus Neal and Jack and me, absent lovers...

    Joined:
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    Messages:
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    Pretty awesome, I remember beating this team once and losing 3 or 4 times. Even now that I have it in front of me I still find it hard to find something that can counter it. Klang can only be phazed to death, resists SR and can be threatening with sub to protect from dragon tail plus he beats cryogonal before he can make anything serious. Strong LO psychic types with Focus Blast (read Gardevoir) can also be pretty damaging (especially as a lead). This being said I wouldn't change anything for them.

    I don't think there's much that can be changed for the best on this team since the synergy is so good, but I still have one suggestion.

    You might want to think twice about will-o-wisp over toxic, you already have T spikes and it could cripple skuntank to possibly recover and switch out on a weaker pursuit (not sure if he has the bulk to pull it off, but at least it would leave it weakened). You could also deal slightly better with the rare swords dance armaldo. Plus if T spikes didn't touch something it's possibly because it's immune to poison so burn can be a cool status to run too. I’m sure you’ll have the skill to know when not to use it and wait for T spikes to be set.


    Again, Great team and congrats on stalling your way to number 1.
  7. Django

    Django
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    Well Klang 100% loses to Frillish, and gets mauled by Spikes, so I've never really had a problem with it. You are are right about Gardevoir and other Psychic types, they can punch huge holes straight from turn one. Normally I have to try and get Lickilicky in safely then phzae them, and hopefully set up Toxic Spikes later to stall them. It would be cool if I could fit Skuntank or something on the team, but I just can't find room.

    I have actually thought about Will-O-Wisp, but have yet to test it. It does seem useful for the ability to catch Skuntank and Armaldo, but then leaves me slightly weaker to Musharna (if Toxic Spikes are not down). If I ever play with this team again, I would probably test WoW.

    Thanks for the comments.
  8. MMF

    MMF Give me the strength to part this sea

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    Fantastic team Django! This is probably the most solid and accomplished NU stall team I've seen so congrats on that. (even if I am undefeated against this team xD)

    Theres only one thing I can suggest that might help you out. And that would be to switch your Cryo set to the Spdef set. This gives you Haze which would help you beat all non-Psyshock CM Duosions and Musharnas. The big downside is you lose your only real form of offense and you lose a way to 2hko Bastiodon and company. But all in all good job dude!
  9. Django

    Django
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    I am very reluctant to switch to defensive Cryogonal, as it leaves my team so toothless. Also, Cryogonal is great for revenge killing Emboar and Magortar, or at least forcing them out, racking up hazard damage in the process. Its actually my most useful Pokemon in a lot of matches, being the closest thing I have to a "win condition". Going defensive opens up a lot of holes, albeit closer some.

    Thanks for the comments
  10. NuclearMedicineT

    NuclearMedicineT

    Joined:
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    Ah man this is such a cool team. Building stall teams is not an easy thing to do, I can tell you that much. You have so many roles for pokes to fill up in those six slots..
    But yeah, really well done. This team looks very solid. But I think you might want to change Magic Coat on Bastiodon? If you change it to Toxic you can give Will-o-wisp to Frillish which is great against Pursuit-trappers not to mention being able to stall out Poison types so you can set up your T-spikes. Gives an answer to offensive Armaldo too. Leaves Bastiodon as Taunt bait I guess but still.
  11. Django

    Django
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    That could be interesting actually. The only issue I have is it leaves me very vulnerable to Taunt Skuntank, as it can pretty much beat every member of the team if I don't catch it with Will-O-Wisp as it switches in. Magic Coat lets me switch in and bounce back the Taunt, at which point I can phaze Skuntank and kill it with hazards. Bouncing random Will-O-Wisps and Sleep Powders is also amazing.

    Thanks for the comments though.

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