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Black & White Battle Subway Records (now with gen. 4 records!)

Discussion in 'Orange Islands' started by Peterko, Mar 23, 2011.

  1. lolnub

    lolnub

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2010
    Messages:
    230
    Super doubles streak: 171

    [​IMG]
    Tornadus @ Flying Gem
    Adamant Nature
    252 Atk / 252 Spe / 6 HP
    Stats lvl 50: 155/183/90/128/100/163
    Tail Wind
    Acrobatics
    Taunt
    Substitute

    [​IMG]
    Heracross @ Flame Orb
    196 Spe / 252 Atk / 36 HP / 20 Def / 4 SpD
    Stats lvl 50: 159/194/98/53/116/130
    Adamant Nature
    Close Combat
    Facade
    Shadow Claw
    Protect

    [​IMG]
    Hydreigon @ Life Orb
    Modest Nature
    6 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    Stats lvl 50: 168/112/110/194/110/150
    Flamethrower
    Dragon Pulse
    Dark Pulse
    Protect

    [​IMG]
    Metagross @ Normal Gem
    Adamant Nature
    204 Spe / 48 HP / 252 Atk
    Stats lvl 50: 162/205/150/103/110/116
    Explosion
    Iron Head
    Bullet Punch
    Earthquake

    Team stratagie should be obvious. First turn Tailwind + Protect, so Heracross has enough speed to outspeed the whole Tower and have a sky-high attack stat of 291. No Megahorn because of the chance to miss, and I really never had de need for it. Tornadus has Taunt for Trick Room and stupid stallmons. Substitute is standard and so is Acrobatics + Flying Gem.
    Hydreigon is in the back to take care of Psychic types. He really kills those. Metagross is just a cool mon and Normal Gem + Explosion kills a lot of things. Earthquake is really handy because 2 are immune and Heracross resists. Iron Head over Meteor Mash for accuracy and Bullet Punch for priority. The team was really cool to use and hadn’t I misplayed badly I could have gone much futher.
    The team is really good against those stupid hail teams, because of Heracross and Metagross just demolishing those with Close Combats and Iron Heads. Even Hydreigon can pull of his weight with Flamethrower. The biggest problem of this team are legendary teams, and especially those with Suicune and or Cresselia, because those are damn bulky and live a hit from every mon in my team. Another thread is when one of the leads could be a TR lead and the other can kill Tornadus so I don’t get Tailwind up. Most of the time though, I can handle those too.

    Log of battle 172

    Psychic Sambala (Mr. Mime, Spiritomb, Medicham, Bronzong)

    Turn 1
    Heracross Protect
    Tornadus Tail wind
    Mr. Mime Light Screen
    Spiritomb will-o-wisp Tornadus

    Turn 2
    Spiritomb Sucker Punch Tornadus (70/155)
    Tornadus Acrobatics Spiritomb (just before half)
    Heracross Facade Mr. Mime (to red)
    Mr. Mime Psychic Heracross (51/159)

    Turn 3
    Spiritomb Sucker Punch Tornadus KO
    Heracross Shadow Claw Spiritomb to red
    Mr. Mime Psychic Heracross KO
    I send out metagross and hydreigon

    Turn 4
    Spritomb custap berry activated suckerPunch, metagross 81/162
    Metagross Bullet Punch Spiritomb KO
    Hydreigon Dark Pulse Mr. Mime KO
    Opp. Send out Bronzong and Medicham
    Tailwind petered out

    Turn5
    Hydreigon Protect
    Medicham Hi Jump Kick Metagross KO
    Bronzong Safeguard

    Turn 6
    Hydreigon Dragon Pulse Medicham to red
    Medicham Hi Jump Kick Hydreigon KO

    Man, I really made to many mistakes in this match. Second turn I should have killed Mr. Mime with Tornadus and Heracross, because the Spiritomb doesn’t really pose a thread to me. On the 3 turn I should have seen the SuckerPunch coming and should have killed Mr. Mime with Heracross. Turn 5 was just really mean. Had Medicham gone for Hydreigon I would have won, because then Medicham crashed and Metagross KOd it then with Iron Head. Bronzong should not be a problem then because he would have been killed by Hydreigon and Metagross.

    Oh well, it is a great team and I loved using it. It is a bit similar to Peterko’s team (Tornadus, metagross, medicham, Hydreigon), but I didn’t know did have that team when I started with it.

    Here are some other logs of battles I lost and almost lost in other streaks with this team.

    Show Hide

    Battle against Veteran Leron (Entei, Cresselia, Landorus, Regirock)

    Turn 1
    Heracross protect,
    Tornadus Tailwind,
    Entei Overheat heracross (protected),
    cresselia Trick Room

    913 | Entei | Lonely | Focus Sash | Overheat | Flame Charge | Fire Fang | Stone Edge | Atk/Spd

    986 | Cresselia | Bold | BrightPowder | Psychic | Substitute | Toxic | Trick Room | HP/SpD

    Turn 2
    Heracross switch to hydreigon
    Tornadus Substitute
    Cresselia psychic hydreigon
    Entei Stone edge Tornadus attack missed

    Turn 3
    Hydreigon Protect
    Cresselia Substitute
    Entei Stone Edge Tornadus (sub fainted, LO resoil)
    Tornadus acrobatics Entei to red

    Turn 4
    Tornadus Taunt Cresselia
    Cresselia toxic (can’t use because of taunt)
    Entei Stone Edge Tornadus KO (LO resoil, sliver of health left)
    Hydreigon Dark pulse cresselia (to Red)
    Tailwind petered out

    Turn 5
    Switch in Metagross
    Metagross Bullet Punch Entei KO
    Cresselia Psychic Metagross (151/162)
    Hydreigon Dark Pulse Cresselia (to Red)
    Trick Room Ended

    Turn 6
    Opp Switch in landorus
    Metagross Bullet Punch Cresselia KO
    Landorus Earthpower Metagross KO
    Hydreigon dragon pulse Landorus to red

    987 | Landorus | Timid | Focus Sash | Earth Power | Psychic | Sludge Bomb | Grass Knot | Spd/SpA

    Turn 6
    Heracross Protect
    Landorus Psychic Heracross (protected)
    Hydreigon Dragon Pulse Landorus KO
    Regirock SuperPower Hydreigon KO

    975 | Regirock | Jolly | Sitrus Berry | Rock Polish | Rock Slide | Superpower | Explosion | Atk/Spd

    Turn 7
    Heracross Close Combat regirock KO

    1-0


    Show Hide

    Battle against ace trainer Farley (Zoroark, Vaporeon, Braviary, Umbreon)

    Turn 1
    Braviary Protect
    Heracross Protect
    Tornadus Tailwind
    Vaporeon ice beam tornadus KO
    Switch in hydreigon

    Turn 2
    Hydreigon protect
    Heracross Close Combat Braviary, it’s a zoraork, hanging on with his focus band.
    Zoroark Counter, heracross KO
    Vaporeon Ice Beam, Hydreigon protected
    Switch in Metagross

    Turn 3
    Hydreigon Dragon Pulse Vaporeon (half health)
    Metagross earthquake, zoroark hang on with his focus band, vaporeon to red
    Zoroark Focus Blast Hydreigon KO
    Vaporeon Ice Beam Metagross Frozen solid (132/162)

    Turn 4
    Zoroark Dark Pulse Metagross 59/162
    Vaporeon Shadow Ball 3/162
    Metagross Frozen sollid

    Turn 5
    Zoroark Dark Pulse Metagross KO

    0-4

    Streak: 90


    Show Hide

    Battle Against gentleman kavan (Thundurus, Cresselia, Virizion, Latias)

    Turn 1
    Heracross switch out to metagross
    Cresselia Helping hand Thundurus
    Tornadus Substitute
    Metagross hit by focus blast (36/155)

    Turn 2
    Metagross switch out to Hydreigon
    Tornadus Tail Wind
    Thundurus Focus Blast hit hdyreigon KO
    Cresselia Icy Wind (sub fainted)
    Metagross switch in

    Turn 3
    Tornadus Substitute
    Metagross Explosion (sub tornadus fainted, thundurus fainted, cresselia over half health)
    Cresselia Icy Wind Tornadus (37/155)
    Opp switch in Virizion
    I switch in heracross

    Turn 4
    Tornadus Acrobatics Virizion (coba berry activated KO)
    Heracross Façade Cresselia (still not in read, I had no guts boost)
    Cresselia Icy Wind TOrnadus Attack Missed, Heracross 145/159
    Opp Switch in Latias

    Turn 5
    Tornadus Acrobatics Latias
    Heracross Façade Latias KO
    Cresselia Icy Wind (tornadus 3/155, heracross 96/159)

    Turn 6
    Cresselia Safeguard
    Heracross Façade KO
    1-0


    Show Hide

    Battle against harlequin arlamis (Golem, Hariyama, Reuniclus, Slowbro)
    Turn 1
    Hariyama used Detect
    Tornadus Acrobatics Hariyama (protected)
    Heracross Used Close combat golem (KO)
    Hariyama’s Flame orb activated
    Opp send out reuniclus

    Turn 2
    Heracross Protect
    Tornadus Acrobatics hariyama (KO)
    Reuniclus Trick room
    Opp send out slowbro

    Heracross protect, failed
    Tornadus Substitute
    Slowbro Psychic heracross KO
    Reuniclus Rock slide sub tornadus fainted

    Slowbro blizzard Tornadus KO, metagross 140/162
    Reucniclus Rock slide metagross 127/167

    Hydreigon Protect
    Slowbro Blizzard Hydreigon protect, metagross 119/162
    Metagross Explosion Reuniclus fainted, slowbro to yellow

    Slowbro blizzard, hydreigon 44/168, Frozen solid
    Hydriegon frozen solid

    Slowbro Blizzard KO
    0-1

    93 wins
  2. Tmac944

    Tmac944

    Joined:
    Jul 25, 2010
    Messages:
    9
    Alright, my Super Doubles team is hardly record-worthy so far, as I've only made it to battle 44. I recently made some changes to try to sort out issues I had with hail teams, and I think I should actually be able to make it far this time.

    Adamant Terrakion @ Life Orb
    Justified
    252 Atk/ 252 Spd/4 HP
    -Protect
    -Earthquake
    -Rock Slide
    -Close Combat

    Leading with Whimsicott, depending on the speed of what I'm facing, I'll either lead with a Protect from Terrakion coupled with a Tailwind from Whimsicott, or go straight for the Beat Up on Terrakion coupled with whatever attack move I need. This has worked extremely well so far, and there are only a few matchups that I have issues with. Terrakion doesn't like taking a hit, but Latios and Heatran can generally clean up whatever Terrakion leaves behind.



    Timid Whimsicott @ Air Balloon
    Prankster
    252 HP/ 252 Spd/ 4 Def
    -Tailwind
    -Beat Up
    -Charm
    -Helping Hand

    Air Balloon keeps Terrakion from hitting it with a +4 Earthquake after Beat Up, giving me a more accurate multi-hit move to work with. Earthquake takes out about 60% of my health otherwise, and I'd rather not just waste the potential Tailwind or Helping Hand if I can help it. Beat Up also helps me take out Sturdy/focus sashes, so Whimsicott stays fairly useful even with a Tailwind up and Terrakion at +4 Attack. Helping Hand is always nice to give Latios or Heatran the little boost they need to OHKO.



    Modest Latios @ Choice Specs
    Levitate
    252 Sp. Atk/252 Speed/ 4 HP
    - Psychic
    - Thunderbolt
    - Ice Beam
    - Draco Meteor

    Latios is meant to clean up whatever Terrakion can't handle, though I can also switch it in if I predict an Earthquake that will KO Terrakion without me being able to get a hit off. Unfortunately, Latios being Modest makes it slower than I'd like, but the added power is really helpful, and I figured that after a Tailwind, speed generally won't be much of an issue. I tend to pick Ice Beam and Thunderbolt more often than I should, and that often gets me into trouble, as I keep forgetting that a Draco Meteor is still stronger than a neutral Boltbeam even after -2. The accuracy factor is also a deterrent, as one wrong miss often spells disaster for my team.



    Timid Heatran @ Power Herb
    Flash Fire
    252 Sp. Atk/ 252 Spd/ 4 HP
    -Overheat
    -Flamethower
    -Solarbeam
    -Earth Power

    Since Explosion got nerfed, I figured there wasn't any reason to bother still running it. Heatran should help out a lot against the hail teams that gave me trouble when I was using Scizor instead, as its quadruple resistance to Ice combined with powerful STAB Fire attacks gives it the durability I need to plow through Ice teams. After Tailwind, it's fast enough to outspeed anything in the Subway. Power Herb gives it more coverage in Solarbeam, but I'm not sure if I should just ditch either Flamethrower or Overheat in favor of Protect, so I can guard myself from Earthquakes from Terrakion and opponents alike. Having the last-ditch overkill option in Overheat is nice, but I find myself not needing the extra power often.


    I'm currently at the 21st battle, though I've gotten to ~40 numerous times before using Scizor instead of Heatran and losing to just about the same thing every time. Suggestions? I'm looking to at least beat Emmet this time around, though after all this effort it'd be a shame if I didn't try to refine this team to make it past 70 for a spot on the list. Is the Terrakion + Beat Up combo just too gimmicky to safely get me far?

    EDIT: I managed to beat Emmet! However, I promptly lost my 50th battle. I got lazy and didn't Tailwind for some reason, and a speedy Arcanine destroyed me because Intidmidate made Terrakion too weak to even finish Arcanine off. Latios was easy pickings for the Arcanine's speedy Crunch, and the last two Pokemon were Tentacruel and Kingdra, soundly destroying my poor Heatran. Ah well, I got as far as I wanted to anyway.
  3. atsync

    atsync Where the "intelligence" of TRAINERS is put to the test!
    is a Pokemon Researcheris a Contributor to Smogon

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2011
    Messages:
    1,014
    I got a streak of 150 in singles with the following team:

    [​IMG]

    Whimsicott @ Focus Sash
    Prankster
    Timid
    IVs: 31/x/31/x/31/31
    EVs: 36/0/252/0/0/220
    Stats: 140/78/137/90/95/180

    Charm
    Memento
    Taunt
    Worry Seed

    [​IMG]

    Cottonee @ Eviolite
    Prankster
    Calm
    IVs: 31/x/31/x/31/31
    EVs: 252/0/92/0/164/0
    Stats: 147/42/92/50/100/86

    Taunt
    Memento
    Stun Spore
    Flash

    [​IMG]

    Dragonite @ Leftovers
    Multiscale
    Adamant
    IVs: 31/31/31/x/31/31
    EVs: 204/252/0/0/0/52
    Stats: 192/204/115/99/120/107

    Dragon Claw
    Dragon Dance
    Substitute
    Roost

    Using Cottonee and Whimsicott together is basically the same as using 2 Whimsicotts together. Basically I wanted to try a team with 2 Prankster cripplers. I went with Cottonee because I liked the idea of having a back-up Taunter, and the back-up Memento helps with Roar and Whirlwind leads (I can sacrifice Whimsicott and then Cottonee to ensure that Dragonite can't be swapped out while it boosts). Cottonee is also surprisingly bulky with Eviolite (and support from Whimsicott) so Flash spamming is easier. I still use Stun Spore over Cotton Spore despite Whimsicott knowing Worry Seed now, because the paralysis is so helpful for Dragonite.

    Cottonee could be replaced by other Prankster pokemon though. Illumise could run a set of Struggle Bug/Charm/Flash/Thunder Wave which could work nicely. Volbeat lacks Charm but it has Trick as an egg move (and having no Charm isn't so bad thanks to Whimsicott). When the Snarl TM gets released, Murkrow could run Snarl/Featherdance/Thunder Wave/Taunt. I'm thinking of trying Illumise actually.

    This team is rather slow, with sets of 7 approaching 40 minutes and beyond. However, the biggest problem for me has been the ridiculous amount of critical hits that have flown my way. There was one battle where I was against this:

    684 | Gallade | Adamant | Scope Lens | Psycho Cut | Stone Edge | Night Slash | X-Scissor | Atk/SpD

    I never felt threatened by it, but I swear nearly every 2nd hit it got was a crit. I was able to maximise my stats against it but after that it refused to let me keep my sub up at 100%. I actually ran out of sub PP but was thankfully able to avoid the crit at the right time and the battle went smoothly after that. Also, I faced at least 8 teams with 3 Focus Sash/Sturdy pokemon, though I survived them all.

    I lost to a team that lead with Weavile 4. I forgot to save the battle so this is going by memory. Anyway Weavile has Taunt so I chose to Taunt it myself. I mispredicted and it hit me with Ice Punch. I Memento and send in Cottonee. I am thinking that Weavile is just going to attack me again so I Stun Spore and it hits. But then Weavile DOES Taunt. Cottonee Struggles against him a few times which breaks the Focus Sash at least but it dies before Taunt ends. In goes Dragonite. I try to set up, hoping for some luck with Paralysis, but it Taunts me. I am forced to kill it with Dragon Claw. The opponent sends in Probopass 4. Now I know it is going to be long and difficult if I want to win, but I'm gonna try! I'm still in Taunt so Dragon Claw does laughable damage. Probopass breaks the sub. One more Taunt turn so I use Dragon Claw, but then Probopass gets a crit and kills me.

    Not sure if that last crit mattered because I'm too lazy to calculate the damage, though this battle does demonstrate the main flaw with using only one Sweeper: if something goes wrong, then that's it. No second chances. At least when I was using Bisharp I had a back up to give me a chance of getting out of this, though obviously I can't cripple the lead as easily.

    Well 150 is a good streak though so yay.
  4. Mr. XYZ

    Mr. XYZ

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2011
    Messages:
    60
    Very interesting atsync. Obviously it´s slow but I like that idea. Sadly Switcheroo isn´t legal with Memento
  5. Chinese Dood

    Chinese Dood

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2008
    Messages:
    1,072
    Interesting team, atsync, and good job on that streak!

    Some thoughts:
    - Have you considered Murkrow? It can Feather Dance / Taunt / Twave / Filler = torment/roost/haze... Mainly Twave > stun spore. No memento though.

    - vs that Gallade, you really shouldn't have that much trouble... If it's at least at -4... DD once then sub roost while DDing should be ok, unless you're crazy horrible luck with crits... If you're low on sub pp, just roost stall it out of Psycho Cut / Stone Edges first, then DD Roost, etc. Critical Hit Night Slash only does like 55% max to Dragonite (without Multiscale), so you can DD without sub even when Multiscale not activating.
    EDIT:... Hm, I was just thinking, maybe you had sub issues because you're trying to only DD when behind a sub? With something that does not have status inducing attacks, you don't need to do that for Dragonite. You can just DD, take a hit, sub, then roost back to full health, and repeating in that cycle (DD when at full health subless). If that wasn't the case, then nvm! :P

    - I know I mentioned Murkrow, but at the same time, I think that an issue with the team is the ice weakness, maybe? With a good ice resist, for example, you could have 1st turn Charmed Weavile. If it taunts, then you can just switch to your ice resist, then get Whimsicott back in to taunt/more charm, etc.

    - Probopass's crit totally mattered. From what I gathered, Weavile never got to attack Dragonite, so with leftovers, Dragonite should be at 100 - 1/4 + 1/16 = 13/16 (81.25%) health left.

    Adamant (Scope Lens) Probopass Stone Edge does 70% max.
    Life Orb Modest Probopass Power Gem does less.
  6. atsync

    atsync Where the "intelligence" of TRAINERS is put to the test!
    is a Pokemon Researcheris a Contributor to Smogon

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2011
    Messages:
    1,014
    Thanks guys!

    Yeah trust me I've bitched about Switcheroo + Memento Whimsicott being illegal all the time in this thread lol. Switcheroo isn't really ideal for this team anyway given how everything is ice weak (another reason to replace Cottonee).

    Gee thanks for calculating that lol. That doesn't please me at all. I guess I'd rather lose to hax than embarassingly bad misplay though.

    Yes I did notice the ice problem after a while, since if I don't paralyse and/or flash them they are tricky to play against (I would likely have to Roost without a sub, which could end in a freeze). Illumise/Volbeat are DEFINATELY looking good now (Volbeat can Trick opponents into non-ice stuff which would be awesome; it would be much like Jumpman's use of Mesprit). Yes I know Volbeat doesn't resist Ice but no Prankster pokemon does sadly. I guess a non-Prankster pokemon could be an alternative too. I'll just have to come up with some crippling ice resistant pokemon (preferbly something interesting). So many things to try...

    I'll admit that I do play rather cautiously when setting up Dragonite. I hate setting up naked. However, Multiscale generally saves you from crits (only really strong Ice and maybe Dragon attacks would KO you) so that could be something that I should try to remember when playing with him. Meh I don't even know why I bought up Gallade, it was just something that I remember being annoying to me!
  7. Chinese Dood

    Chinese Dood

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2008
    Messages:
    1,072
    My bad, Dragonite should actually be at 87.5% since it has one more turn of leftovers as Probopass breaks sub. Haha, sorry about that, but I was actually 99.9% sure that the crit was necessary even before doing any calculations, since I've used Dragonite before and I know how bulky it is even without Multiscale.

    To be honest! If you're going to trick-scarf, you don't need a Prankster. The scarf + speed EVs will provide enough speed (in most cases depending on who you're using) to trick. Of course, Prankster will benefit from the turn even after tricking, but something bulky without prankster (like Mesprit/Uxie) seems safer than a frail tricker.

    The need for a good ice resist was a big reason for the decision on my mono Volcarona in my recent Stoutland-Volcarona-Dragonite team (the alternative was the obvious Suicune, but I've used Suicune so much that I wanted to try something faster, and Volcarona is awesome at being faster and could sweep a good portion of teams even with just 2 or 3 QDs).

    Totally Random (open)

    O yeah, on a totally unrelated topic... I recently found out that Luxray could do the exact same thing my Stoutland did (including the Intimidate part) except no charm (probably scary face/light screen/roar in place of charm), but is slower and less bulky. Typing-wise, both one weakness (ground vs fighting for Stoutland), but 2 resists (flying/electric) instead of one immunity (ghost for Stoutland). Stoutland is likely superior. Maybe, I might try out Luxray with Scary Face sometime for that Smeargle-Espeon combo though.

    Yesterday out of no where I was thinking of Intimidate Gyarados with Twave/Taunt/Torment/Spite for crippling (maybe Dragon Tail somewhere if it fits). It's sort of CRAZY how... Gyarados does not learn Scary Face. I mean, I think his face is pretty scary looking. ... yes me and my Intimidate crippler ideas... next thing you know I'll be using a Timid Intimidate Qwilfish with Twave/Taunt/Explosion/Haze, which is probably one of the worst crippler idea I thought about lol.

    Then I was thinking Sturdy Donphan @ Ground Gem??? - Scary Face / Knock Off / Earthquake / Charm (Maybe Mudslap somewhere?)... Basically all Clear Body pokemon are weak to ground (White Smoke Torkoal even haha, but that's not in Subway), so whatever I can't scary face, I can kill it with EQ. But Tentacruel outspeeding is a concern, as is the one metagross that has speed EVs that also has magnet rise. Only Aerodactyl and Tauros can scary face and EQ and is faster than Tentacruel... Tauros does have Intimidate, but nothing much else (Scary Face / EQ / Spite? / Magic Coat? / Incinerate?). Aero has Taunt/Torment/Stealth Rock. (I'm talking about pairing this initial crippler with Spore-Baton Pass Smeargle + Espeon/something receiving Smeargle boosts, by the way).

    Hm, I really *should* get back into Double (like start thinking of something for VGC at least), but for some reason feel like playing Single Subway more. :P

    Sorry for random randomness.
  8. atsync

    atsync Where the "intelligence" of TRAINERS is put to the test!
    is a Pokemon Researcheris a Contributor to Smogon

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2011
    Messages:
    1,014
    Yeah Uxie and Mesprit could work but I don't have them right now and I can't be bothered playing through diamond again (I already killed/released them in my current save file to get Heatran). I haven't released Cresselia though. That could maybe work...

    Actually I was thinking that Dragonite wasn't the best choice of sweeper for Whimsicott and Cottonee. Hell, Volcarona could work! I think I'm done with Cottonee though. I want to try something else. I'll probably go back to a 1 crippler + 2 sweepers set up anyway, since it's faster and less repetitive.
  9. Chinese Dood

    Chinese Dood

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2008
    Messages:
    1,072
    Haha Volcarona is good, but it can't be the only sweeper if you are using Mono QD rest (Of all things ... Physical Soundproof Exploud will always win I think unless it gets burnt from Flame Body, but one has earthquake. Mr. Mime/Electrode are either special attackers or weak physical {seriously, Lonely Mr. Mime???} so can be rest-stalled easily). And if you aren't using rest... ... it'll be tough setting up sometimes.
  10. atsync

    atsync Where the "intelligence" of TRAINERS is put to the test!
    is a Pokemon Researcheris a Contributor to Smogon

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2011
    Messages:
    1,014
    Yeah you're right about Volcarona. I was only half serious when I suggested it lol. I suppose you could run HP Bug for Exploud (ewwww...).

    I've been thinking more and I think I actually WILL get myself a Uxie and try that over Cottonee. Even if it doesn't work out, it can't hurt to have one...
  11. Tebow

    Tebow

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2012
    Messages:
    10
    Currently at a 91 streak with this team i derived from combining pieces of succesful team posted here

    Stoutland @ Focus Sash
    Jolly - Intimidate
    Max Hp and Max Speed
    Thunderwave
    Snarl
    Charm
    Sand Attack

    Volcarona @ Leftovers
    Bold - Flame Body
    Max HP and Defense
    Substitute
    Quiver Dance
    Flamethrower
    HP Ground


    Suicune @ Chesto Berry
    Bold - Pressure
    NOt exactly sure on Spread but i think Max HP and Defense
    Subsitute
    Calm Mind
    Rest
    Scald


    Lead With Stoutland. paralyze and/or Cripple according to the type of attacker it is, and squeeze in Sand Attack When i can.

    If the Enemy has Rock, Flying, or Water Attacks, set up and Sweep With Suicune. Otherwise Set up and sweep with Volcarona

    By the way, where do u guys go to get the Screen that shows ur current and previous Record Streaks?
  12. NoCheese

    NoCheese

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2011
    Messages:
    154
    Your streaks are listed in the Vs. Recorder in the Key items section of your bag. Frustratingly, you can't use it while you are on the subway platform.
  13. Tebow

    Tebow

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2012
    Messages:
    10
    Thanks
  14. pifou69

    pifou69

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2012
    Messages:
    6
    Battle Subway Doubles
    Streak: 228
    Team: Politoed, Ludicolo, Toxicroak, Ferrothorn

    Proof

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
    Politoed @ Choice Scarf
    Ability : Drizzle
    IVs: 31/x/31/31/31/31
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 254 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Surf
    - Ice Beam
    - Psychic
    - Scald

    [​IMG]
    Ludicolo @ Absorb Bulb ***RideTheDUX
    Ability : Swift Swim
    IVs: 31/x/31/31/31/31
    EVs: 36 HP / 4 Def / 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 212 Spd
    Modest Nature
    - Fake Out
    - Surf
    - Grass Knot
    - Ice Beam

    Same as R. Inanimate (thank you for that) and same strategie but with scald on hypnosis for Politoed (never use).

    [​IMG]
    Toxicroak @Focus Sash
    Ability: Dry Skin
    IVs : 31/31/31/x/31/31
    EVs: 6HP/252Atk/252Spe
    Nature: Adamant
    - Fake Out
    - Drain Punch
    - Sucker Punch
    - Taunt

    [​IMG]
    Ferrothorn @ Leftovers
    Ability : Iron Barbs
    Nature : Sassy
    IVs: 31/31/31/x/31/0
    EVs: 252 HP/252 SpD/6 Atk
    - Curse
    - Gyro Ball
    - Protect
    - Leech seed

    How I loss :

    Vs Scientist with Gyarados, Excadrill, Salamence, Lucario

    Turn 1 vs Leviator, Excadrill
    Ludicolo Grass knot Gyarados (about 75% HP)
    Politoed surf, escadrill with red HP
    Excadrill Poison jab, ludicolo KO, Excadrill KO (life Orb)
    Gyarados dragon dance

    Turn 2
    Toxicroak out
    Salamence out
    Switch Politoed for Ferrothorn
    Salamence earthquake, Coatox resist with focus sash earthquake,
    Gyarados earthquake, Coatox KO, CH Ferrothorn (14 HP)
    Ferrothorn Leech seed Salamence

    Turn 3
    Politoed out
    Ferrothorn protect
    Politoed ice beam salamence, salamence ko
    Gyarados earthquake, politoed about 60% HP

    Turn 4
    Lucario out
    Politoed ice beam lucario
    Lucario aurasphere Ferrothorn, KO
    Gyarados aqua tail politoed, KO

    May have win if I double surf first turn.
  15. Chinese Dood

    Chinese Dood

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2008
    Messages:
    1,072
    @pifou69: Yeah, double surf or surf + fake out Excadrill. Gyarados isn't as big of a threat as Excadrill. I guess you just thought surf would KO Excadrill, not an unreasonable assumption I guess, drizzle surf and all.

    Also, you double posted the same post. Might want to remove one of those posts.

    @Tebow: Glad to see Stoutland and Volcarona being used. Hope you get far.
    EDIT: O yeah, forgot to mention, Flamethrower + HP Ground means you'll be helpless vs Flash Fire Balloon Houndoom. That's the only one though, and if Suicune is around if/when you face it, then you're totally fine. I remember I chose HP Rock instead of HP Ground for my Volcarona because of that (didn't end up even using it, heh), but Ground is likely better most of the time.
  16. ashez

    ashez

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2009
    Messages:
    177
    How is it even possible to double post something with a two hour time gap?

    Some great streaks lads :)
  17. some_guy

    some_guy

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2011
    Messages:
    16
    Subway Freakonomics

    Hey, I noticed that a little while back there was some scepticism/annoyance about less experienced players getting really high streaks.
    I think we can safely say that most people who play some pokemon don't put as much effort in as the likes of Peterko/R Inanimate and many others, however this doesn't necessarily mean they will get lower streaks.

    If you have a player who can create/copy a team, and has enough know-how to have a 1/10 chance of making it to 100, that would also mean that they had a 1/100 chance of getting to 200
    300 = 1/1,000
    400 = 1/10,000
    500 = 1/100,000 etc.

    It's not hard to imagine 10,000 people out there giving the subway a go, and if they all have 10 tries then it's actually likely that someone will make it to 500.

    However, to get above 900 would be 1 in 1billion, which considering the limited number of serious subway players is a crazy number.

    (Jump/Peterko's old HGSS streaks would be 1/100,000,000,000,000,000,000,000!)

    So my point is that statistically it's likely that a lot of reasonable attempts will come up with a high streak, but an incredible streak (like R Inanimate's recent one or the Peterko/Jump HGSS streaks) are very unlikely in this way.

    This data is obviously not exact, but is does indicate there'll always be a point where better tactics/ideas/play will count for more than luck. So keep at it, and don't let the hax wear you down!

    As I said, I'm not making reference to the records of anyone on here, I'm just pointing out that luck plays a part in the subway, but ultimately skill is more important.
  18. pifou69

    pifou69

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2012
    Messages:
    6
    Just wanted to edit my post and quote it :-(
  19. Bruno Magno

    Bruno Magno

    Joined:
    May 15, 2011
    Messages:
    744
    Absolutely stupid question: how to see this in game? On DPP there were some screens, at the Battle Tower, showing the streak you were doing, but in the Subway?
  20. Peterko

    Peterko Never give up!
    is a Researcher Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2005
    Messages:
    1,070
    Bruno Magno the same question was asked and answered like 5 posts above you... Vs. Recorder in your bag (key items).

    I´ll lean out of the window and think that you´re talking about my slight annoyance about investing a lot of effort and other people just getting higher streaks...just like that.

    Here´s the thing. The more you play, the more hax you experience...up to a point when you identifiy / predict that this "shit" can happen (lol and it will, trust me) ... I often find myself just sort of "praying" (hopefully that and that won´t happen, which is funny because I can´t control the RNG during a battle). The best I can do is play flawlessly and most of my losses were due to misplay and bad luck rather than bad luck alone, resulting in my whining (not always) and being disappointed in myself (almost always). What I do, is I simply not giving up.

    And believe me, I´ve seen it all...and there´s still things that surprise me from time to time. Now, from that experience, I´m instantly able to see situations where a particular team loses, no matter how good it is and no matter how good the user is.

    The thing is, that if you don´t have as much experience and don´t predict the worst case scenario and just play not knowing/predicting all the stuff and make decision in the mindset of a "not so experienced" Subway player while you make mistakes from time to time (sometimes you won´t get away with 1 mistake because the AI punishes those instantly) AND still get a higher streak, it´s a tad more difficult to belive for us "more experienced" players. And no I don´t think I´m the most experienced nor with the most play time in the world.

    We´re talking about believability of streaks here and unfortunately that´s a subjective topic, because as we said many times, there´s no 100% way to prove streaks, unless we all meet somewhere in real life and play our streaks in front of witnesses or something crazy like that.

    What I´m trying to say is that yes, those streaks (non-fanatic players with solid teams) are possible from a statistic point of view and as we see they actually exist, but from a subjective point of view of a person that is like 2 hours away from a 999:59 game time (95% of it in the Subway) over the last 10 months (2 month break), who knows what he´s doing (most of the time lol), they "seem" or "feel" even less probable.

    Long story short, I know it is possible, but it´s not easy to take. Learning to accept those streaks just like that, without emotions, is part of growing up for me. Oh well, I still sometimes fall into that emotionally weaker state, nobody´s perfect. I´m at least giving my best to beat those records, that´s the best thing I can do.


    On topic of records, I haven´t played much this week, I´m at 91 with the Cloyster team, don´t know when I´ll continue. Good luck everyone, keep up the good work.

    EDIT: At 119 now, also 999:59 :)
  21. Chinese Dood

    Chinese Dood

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2008
    Messages:
    1,072
    Good job on your 999:59! :P I remember having that in Diamond. It was mostly from traditional breeding rather than Battle Tower though...Oooooh all those hours of breeding when RNG wasn't so easily manipulated...

    I'm trying to come up with something unique (or at least not too commonly used... like Drizzle rain team) and viable in Double Subway... hasn't happened yet.
  22. Chill

    Chill

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2007
    Messages:
    3,580
    Yeah, I also had the 999 hours in Diamond from breeding. What the hell was I thinking? Haha.

    I haven't passed a streak of 36 yet in doubles so I started in singles now. I can't ever seem to find to find 3 team members that work well together without compounding weaknesses. For example I was using thunderus and Dragonite together but..ice weak. It's frustrating but I think it's mostly due to the pool of pokemon that I have to chose from at the moment. If I shift some stuff over I should do much better.
  23. Chinese Dood

    Chinese Dood

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2008
    Messages:
    1,072
    Dragon + Steel, or Dragon + Water, or Water + Steel type is usually a good start for making singles team, if you're going for weakness/resistance typing coverage. You can't really go wrong with any of those, unless your water + steel share same weaknesses (Dragon/Steel or Dragon/Water can't really share same weakness unless the secondary typing provide same weaknesses).

    If you just don't want too many weaknesses but don't care much for resistance, pure normal types aren't bad (Blissey or Eviolite Chansey/Porygon2 come to mind as pretty good. Snorlax can work too). Just pair it with something that is immune to or resists fighting. Ghosts do work fairly decently with Normal for weakness<->immunity.
  24. RiggyRob

    RiggyRob

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2012
    Messages:
    25
    Can anyone guess what the viability of a Ninjask passing a Substitute, Speed and Hone Claws boosts to a Choice Scarf Rampardos would be? I'm getting tired of misplaying with my (IMO fairly reliable) Staraptor/Garchomp/Suicune team.
  25. Tebow

    Tebow

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2012
    Messages:
    10
    Yeah i just faced it today. I wasnt sure if there was a flash fire + ballon in the Subway. Luckily i had suicune left to take it out. Im at 125 or so now.... still going strong.

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