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DPP OU Bleed

Discussion in 'RMT Archive' started by BKC, Mar 17, 2013.

  1. BKC

    BKC
    is a Tutoris a Smogon IRC AOPis a Tiering Contributoris a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis Smogon Frontier's Castle Valetis a Past WCoP Winneris the Smogon Tour Season 16 Champion

    Joined:
    May 22, 2010
    Messages:
    3,669
    Bleed


    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]

    It's been almost two years since I posted my last DPP RMT, and about a year since I posted an RMT at all. However I felt like doing something for my 2K and since a few people have asked me to post this team I figured I would. It's easily been the best/most successful DPP team I've ever made; it won a Smogon Tour, went undefeated whenever I used it in ST14, including going 2-0 in the finals, and has just been a really reliable team as a whole.

    teambuilding (open)

    In March 2012, I was building a team around a set I'd never used before, Life Orb Aerodactyl. It seemed to function best with sand; I'd been using Tyranitar a lot, and decided to try Hippowdon instead.

    [​IMG][​IMG]
    SpDef Hippowdon | LO Aero

    Aero seemed to force a lot of switches. Blessed as I am with extraordinary brainpower, I used my brilliant powers of logic to deduced that Spikes Roserade would pair well with it. Scarf Rotom-A was also added for spin-blocking + revenge-killing duties.

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    SpDef Hippo | Spikes Rose | Scarf Rotom | LO Aero

    I run waters on almost all my teams, and Starmie seemed to be the best fit here, since it is the best spinner in the tier, something very much appreciated on a team with Aerodactyl.

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    SpDef Hippo | SpikesRade | Scarf Rotom | Bulky Starmie | SubRoost Aero

    Mostly everything seemed to be covered, except for the fact that I had no Steel. So, I threw on WishCM Jirachi. The idea was that it could tank stuff, pass Wishes to Hippo/Starmie early-/mid-game, and sweep late-game when its counters'd been worn down.

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    SpDef Hippo | SpikesRade | Scarf Rotom | Bulky Starmie | WishCM Jira | SubRoost Aero

    With this initial version of the team, I won a tour. There were some issues with it, though; I'd managed to maneuver around them for the most part, but if they were played well, they had the potential to give me a really tough time, namely Breloom. I also wasn't liking how Jirachi was dead weight with its current set, since it was hard-pressed to heal itself, and didn't sweep very often. I mentioned these issues to my buddy Fakes, who had made a near carbon copy of the team on his own; his version, however, had specially defensive Jirachi with Wish | Protect/U-turn | Toxic/Body Slam| Iron Head instead of the WishCM set I had. I tried the SpD set out and suddenly Jirachi was consistently performing much better.

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    SpD Hippo | SpikesRade | Scarf Rotom | Bulky Starmie | SpD Jira | SubRoost Aero

    I liked the team a lot at this point. However, physical dragons were a pain in the ass, since my only Steel didn't like taking Earthquakes. I decided to try Skarmory over Jirachi, which freed up Roserade to run Toxic Spikes.

    [​IMG][​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    SpD Hippo | Skarm | TS Rose | Scarf Rotom | Bulky Starmie | SubRoost Aero

    I messed around with Forretress + different waters, as well as Venusaur over Roserade, but that didn't work out too well. I went back to Skarm / Rose / Star and it was the most reliable version that, after all my testing and experimenting, had proved itself to be the best team I'd ever made.
    Say hi.


    [​IMG]
    Hippowdon***Lethargica
    Sand Stream | Leftovers
    248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SDef | Careful / Impish
    ~ Stealth Rock
    ~ Slack Off
    ~ Earthquake
    ~ Ice Fang

    Hippo should definitely see more use than it currently does. It gets up SR with incredible ease, whips up the sand that makes Aerodactyl so deadly, and counters a ton of shit, namely Dragonite, CM Jirachi, and Tyranitar. Careful is unbelievably bulky on the special side; to give you an idea of how monstrous it is, it lives Surf from Specs Kingdra. Impish is a viable alternative though because you still live mostly everything you need to on the special side while gaining some nice physical bulk which is useful for fending off Tyranitar, who is the best mon in DPP. Ice Fang forces LO Aero to Roost so you can EQ its face off and also hits Dragonite / Gengar / Breloom.

    [​IMG]
    Skarmory***Pravus
    Keen Eye | Leftovers
    248 HP / 16 Def / 244 SDef | Impish
    ~ Spikes
    ~ Whirlwind
    ~ Roost
    ~ Brave Bird

    Skarm pairs well with Hippo since they come in on each others' weaknesses to set up hazards early game. Impish with SpD investment is the most useful spread overall for tanking Outrages & Draco Meteors. Skarm holds off a lot of nigs in general, most notably DD Kingdra, offensive Suicune, and Breloom (sort of).

    [​IMG]
    Roserade***Combustion
    Natural Cure | Black Sludge
    248 HP / 84 Def / 176 SDef | Calm
    ~ Toxic Spikes
    ~ Rest
    ~ Leaf Storm / Grass Knot / Energy Ball
    ~ Hidden Power [Fire]

    Rade lays down and/or absorbs Toxic Spikes while checking a lot of stuff. Usually gets a free switch into opposing Rotom after it switches in on Starmie. If Skarm is weakened, Rose covers its back against Shaymin and Suicune.

    [​IMG]
    Rotom-H***Electric Red
    Levitate | Choice Scarf
    240 HP / 24 Def / 92 SAtk / 24 SDef / 128 Spd | Timid
    ~ Thunderbolt
    ~ Trick
    ~ Overheat
    ~ Shadow Ball

    Ghostface here blocks spin and revenge kills almost everything. Overheat is good coverage against steels, mainly used for destroying Forretress & Lucario.

    [​IMG]
    Starmie***obZen
    Natural Cure | Leftovers
    248 HP / 176 Def / 12 SAtk / 16 SDef / 56 Spd | Bold
    ~ Hydro Pump
    ~ Thunderbolt
    ~ Rapid Spin
    ~ Recover

    Easy spin against the most common SR mon in the game on a team with an SR weak mon...yes please. The defense investment makes it harder for ScarfTar to trap me and lets me counter Gyarados better, as well as switch into shit like Gliscor's Earthquake more easily. Hydro over Surf to leave larger dents in Rotom trying to spinblock. A faster spread to outrun Gengar & Infernape can work but I prefer the much increased bulk.

    [​IMG]
    Aerodactyl***Bleed
    Pressure | Leftovers
    248 HP / 116 SDef / 144 Spd | Jolly
    ~ Substitute
    ~ Roost
    ~ Taunt
    ~ Rock Slide

    Bleed...this prehistoric terror is absolutely incredible. Once he gets going, he's more than capable of soloing entire teams with little to no effort. He wears his unfortunate victims down with sand + hazards + Rock Slide; more offensive mons cannot stomach too many of these, while defensive mons struggle to do damage and are prevented from healing themselves or phazing Aero out thanks to Taunt. He also drains PP ridiculously fast with Pressure and is very hard to kill with a special attack by virtue of having a Special Defense stat of 323 under sand.

    Unfortunately, Aero doesn't cover too much defensively and has a lot of weaknesses that you only have 5 slots to cover, so playing around some threats is going to be a tricky dance. However, Aero is so goddamn good at what he does that it is definitely worth it to not have everything perfectly covered. Give him a try and I guarantee he will produce excellent results.

    ---

    So yea that's the team!! I kinda half-assed the rmt so I might make it look pretty l8r idk. Any suggestions would be gr8. Thanks 4 reading :toast:

    Last Look
    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]

    shoutouts arent done yet ill finish them sometime (open)

    6A9 Ace Matador | i'm saving the best for last so may as well get this trash out of the way LOL nah but seriously i met you when i first joined the scooters and i'm glad i did! not only are you a stupidly good pkmner, youre also a v smart guy in general who i can talk to about a million different things, and youve got your friends' backs, which is a very appreciated quality. i'll get you to like metal someday

    Atticus |

    gene |

    Gouki |

    Bluewind |

    Aldaron |

    franky |

    Floppy | GORGIE!!!

    bro fist | aka xxph2cloudstrifexx & subtle enigma, i have known you ever since i was an annoying 13 year old at regileague/pc101. we can remember all the great shit there from dubby being a retard to latimence being the best metagame ever. youre also "ok" at pokemon i guess. play on east this year por favor

    Fiction | a true beastarooni. known you since regileague days!! a good bruv who "shag"s "mum"s for "fiver"s, whatever that is

    Funkasaurus | another boy from the good ol pc101 days although i used to think you were a (BAN ME PLEASE) until you asked me to tutor you... now youre one of my ~best friends~ online!! i was so proud when you went 3-0 in wcop :') mr. we dont care anymore is also the starter of the beastaroonis and the true creator of :| fuk cbt

    Jirachi | refuses to let me cyber rape him dr ciel-style through VMs what the fuck man

    PenguinX |

    Heist |

    tab |

    Poppy |

    Smith | this is a placeholder. i promised you some time ago youd get the biggest shoutout in my 2k so just hold on for a bit

    Lavos Spawn | he did the art!!!

    undisputed |

    Bloo |

    Stone_Cold |

    dragonuser |

    Thatsjustpeachy |

    kd24 |

    Haunter |

    Delko |

    Harsha |

    yee |

    ThatsMyLatios |

    Darren |

    High Impulse |

    windsong |

    CrashingBoomBang |

    Ginku | youre ok for po trash & your taste in rap aint half bad either

    Fakes |

    Lohgock |

    Stallion |

    McMeghan | i think youre like my competitive rival. we have played for so many different tourneys, most notably spl III semis & tour 14 finals... youre unfairly lucky but youre a really good player and a good guy!!

    Ojama |

    trickroom |

    Blue_Star |

    Honus |

    DoomVM |

    ala |

    august |

    Taylor |

    Sir |

    ToF | youve been occasionally helping me out with dp teams ever since spl2 right up till tour finals vs mcm...even though youre hotheaded af youre a good guy, a really solid player & i'm glad you got a trophy

    Tanner |

    soviet |

    Furry |

    LizardMan |

    Trollmonchan | [4:34:04 PM] Melanie: give me a shoutout fuckr

    M Dragon |

    CTC |

    Princess Bri |

    Problems | i dont think i've ever met anyone with worse grammar xD youre a cool dude even tho your accent makes it sound like youre permanently drunk and/or high

    Hot N Cold |

    jasonpwn | even though youre pretty retarded youre a good kid & i give you mad props for sticking up to limitless

    Novaray | if you stop trying to fit in everywhere youll be a lot better off

    Sayonara | i'm glad youve kicked the habit of posting an rmt every 3 weeks or so. i still remember you as kira light & expert physics lol

    anyone i havent mentioned specifically from the scooters or east - if it werent for team tournaments i wouldnt still be playing pokemon & you guys are the reason for that
    Jirachee likes this.
  2. Lavos Spawn

    Lavos Spawn
    is a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Past WCoP Winner

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2012
    Messages:
    2,960
    6-0'd by toxic/drill peck/tbolt zapdos...dunno how youre successful with such a glaring weakness!

    will rate more later, whoever drew the art is fkn picasso
  3. mbh

    mbh

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2010
    Messages:
    32
    Waited long for this team, cause you promised to make a RMT :) Anyways I really like the team and playstyle (Stall in general with some creative choices), however when playing this or other versions of this team, I feel some things are really annoying. For things like Luce you rely very much on Rotom and you dont have hard counters to Machamp, Loom and so on (I feel that Loom is really bad, cause it gets free setups on Aero, Starmie, Hippo/Rotom in some situations, 2HKOing anything on the team w/ FP/SB and it is so hard to take down, additionally it puts sth to sleep cause you dont have an absorber...however i ran roar on hippo so yeah). Other then that, the team is awesome and I hope we┬┤ll see more of these in the future from you aswell.
  4. LizardMan

    LizardMan A mo so true.
    is a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Past WCoP Winner

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2008
    Messages:
    2,771
    This team is fantastic. I always enjoyed using it and felt it was fun to play.

    The greatest single mon weakness this team probably has are subbing ghosts. Mainly because Starmie is slower than Gengar or Sub LO Rotom-w, and can't easily get a spin off. Gengar is definitly managable because you have Hippo, but thankfully LO Sub Rotom-w is rare since it can 2HKO your entire team with Thunderbolt and Shadow Ball except Hippowdon who doesn't do a lot with Ice Fang.

    Watch out for Passho Heatrans too. Fire Blasts hit everything hard except Aerodactyl who is weak to SR, or Starmie who could end up losing to HP Grass with Passho Berry. Or Grass Knot HP Fire CM Jirachi. (they don't exist, and you have Scarf Rotom-h and Hippowdon can live a hit.)

    They aren't too big of issues and isn't worth fixing because all teams tend to have annoying pokemon or paper weaks like these. You are most definitly a good enough of a player to play around such threats so just be aware and I am sure you are.

    Luvdisc'd and congrats on your tour win. The team is very great, and the success the team has had and how well known it is just speaks for itself. It is nice to see another RMT from you.

    PS:Where is my shoutout, I knew you for like 3 years. (:<
  5. BKC

    BKC
    is a Tutoris a Smogon IRC AOPis a Tiering Contributoris a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis Smogon Frontier's Castle Valetis a Past WCoP Winneris the Smogon Tour Season 16 Champion

    Joined:
    May 22, 2010
    Messages:
    3,669
    fighting mons are assholes. i would use celebi over roserade if it weren't for my extreme paranoia of toxic spikes, but since no one seems to be using them [christ knows why], i'll give it a shot.

    passho tran's never been too big an issue. hp grass/electric doesn't kill starmie, so i can pivot into aero, taunt it to prevent sr from being laid down and work from there.

    lo rotom-w has never really been that big a deal between hippo/rade/rotom/aero but i can see it being a douche... i'll try roar on hippo again.

    thanks guys :toast:
  6. LizardMan

    LizardMan A mo so true.
    is a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Past WCoP Winner

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2008
    Messages:
    2,771
    If you were to use Celebi, Gengar and Sub Roost Zapdos may become a bit more annoying. So be careful.

    It almost makes me want to fit in a Blissey, but there is nothing you could drop. If you want to go full stall, you could go Hippo | Celebi | Skarmory | Blissey | Rotom-w | Starmie. Although I wouldn't reccomend that since Aerodactyl has been crucial to this team's success because of how rare and anti metagame the set is.

    So having a slight annoyance to certain threats is probably worth the trade off. You may lose Toxic Spikes by adding Celebi which is bad for Aerodactyl, but I don't think it would be that bad. Thunder Wave Celebi can allow Aerodactyl to hax things to death easily.

    What do you think about making Rotom-h faster than max speed Adamant Kingdra? They are rare, but it may come in handy since it would outrun Aerodactyl and Rotom-h.

    Edit:248 HP / 20 Def / 20 SDef gets better overall defenses than 240 HP / 24 Def / 24 SDef on Rotom-h
  7. Mulligan

    Mulligan

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2009
    Messages:
    574
    I didn't forget :(

    Boss team. I been Luvdisc'd it lol. Anyway, there really isn't much to say or much to do to improve it. The only thing I could suggest is that you may as well stick with an Impish nature on Hippowdon. Since you use Skarm to tank Dragon moves, the only other big SpA threat you'd use Hippo for is LO Zapdos. With Careful, Zapdos can never 2HKO with HP Ice/Grass. However, I think the ability to deal with Tyranitar better is more valuable since Tyranitar is arguably the best 'mon in DPP OU and it's more common than Zapdos. With Impish, Zapdos literally only has, like....a 2% chance to 2HKO (not positive, but I know it's really, really small). So, the pros outweigh the cons.

    The Ice Fang slot is debatable. I'd honestly stick with it because Breloom is such a pain :/. Deals with Dragonite, too, like you said. Plus, Sub Rotom-A, while a big threat, is so rare. But, I could see Roar working too. Two phazers is never a bad thing, IMO, and of course it allows you to blow away any Breloom behind a Sub.

    Might be a stupid question, but what do the 84 Def EV's do for Rose? If it's to switch into Breloom and other fight 'mons better, that's fine. But, the reason I ask is that LO Starmie can 2HKO most of the team with proper prediction(I assume Rotom-H is not 2HKO'd with those EV's). You might want to try moving 76 EV's from Defense to Special Defense, maxing it out. 248 HP/252 SpD Rose is never 2HKO'd by LO Starmie's Ice Beam, so it gives you another switch-in for it and takes pressure off Rotom. It also doubles as a solid LO Shaymin switch-in FWIW, even though Skarm can do it too. LO Shaymin looks like a concern, but if Aero gets in and you kept SR off the field, it can't beat you.

    Lavos' art is BEAST lol(Smeargle's Studio worthy?). That Hippo makes a great avatar :P. But, yeah, he did a great job.

    tl;dr (open)
    Impish Hippowdon >>>>> Careful Hippowdon
    248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpD Roserade >>>>> 248 HP / 84 Def / 176 SpD Roserade


    Again, awesome team and congrats on the tour win :).

    EDIT: Whoops. I calc'd the damage LO Starmie Hydro Pump does to Rotom-H and it still 2HKO's. Even more reason to try 248 HP / 252 SpD Calm Roserade.
  8. Fakes

    Fakes
    is a Past SPL Winner

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2011
    Messages:
    204
    Oh dude
    Jirachi wasnt Spdef.
    It was Defensive Jirachi (220 Def or something) with Body Slam, Iron Head, Wish and Protect
  9. Lohgock

    Lohgock

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2010
    Messages:
    395
    Not much to say about this team, it's absolutly incredible. There are a few things you might try out, but no big changes to consider and I don't think you're playing this team anymore anyways.

    But the main reason for my post, beside telling you it's a fucking good team ofc, is to remind you to complete your shoutouts =>
  10. BKC

    BKC
    is a Tutoris a Smogon IRC AOPis a Tiering Contributoris a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis Smogon Frontier's Castle Valetis a Past WCoP Winneris the Smogon Tour Season 16 Champion

    Joined:
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    Messages:
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    testing twave celebi over roserade. it's pretty good, thanks lizard.

    other defensive teams with starmie are being real douchebags... maybe mix ttar > hippo and spiritomb > rotom? if i did this i'd throw a lot more defense on skarm for physical dragons/ddtar. sr would go on either ttar or celebi, maybe even over brave bird on skarm.

    will finish shoutouts later. thanks for the luvdiscs and compliments n shit
  11. LizardMan

    LizardMan A mo so true.
    is a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Past WCoP Winner

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    I feel like the Mixed Tyranitar Spiritomb version of the team is more anti metagame but it seems more weak to threats. Hippowdon checks a lot of things but Tyranitar doesn't.
  12. BKC

    BKC
    is a Tutoris a Smogon IRC AOPis a Tiering Contributoris a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis Smogon Frontier's Castle Valetis a Past WCoP Winneris the Smogon Tour Season 16 Champion

    Joined:
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    Messages:
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    i didn't like mixtar much so i went back to hippo. i like celebi + spiritomb over roserade + rotom a lot. offensive suicune is sort of an asshole though so i'm experimenting with different celebi sets to handle it better. timid, leech seed/recover/gk/hp fire with enough spe to hit a 297 stat is working well. tomb is an amazing pkmn :toast:

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