CaP 19 Pre-Evo - Part 1 - Typing Discussion

[DHR-107]

Hi there guys! I know this has been a while coming, but it is time to get down to business! I know a lot of the guys who love this process know the rules, but just remember a few things.

There are only a couple of rules for the prevo process, number one of which is this is a completely flavour based project. The whole prevo process is just for fun! Some of the critters we have made in the past have been adorable but deadly! Competitive reasoning is thrown out of the window here, and all flavour based reasoning is perfectly valid. "It just makes sense" is just as much an opinion as any other. This is a place where anyone can come in and help us decide what Plasmanta should evolve from.

As the title of this thread suggests, here we will be discussing the type of Plasmanta's prevo. Naturally, Electric/Poison is already instantly slated as that is what Plasmanta's type is. Feel free to suggest other viable alternatives and discuss them. Please don't try and be clever by suggesting something like Fire/Flying or something... It'll make you look like an idiot.

Plasmanta turned out to be a behemoth Pokemon which attempts to discourage it being KO'd by the foe. It's preform is totally free to almost be what it likes!

Please also remember these are likely to never be implemented onto the server or used apart from in CaPASB. This is supposed to be a fun process. It's a great time for newcomers to get their feet wet in CAP, a great place for CAP regulars to keep making Pokemon during the downtime, and overall just a cool project to work on during the Policy Review stage of the CAP process. The primary purpose of this is to have fun, so let your imaginations run wild devising the most intricate and logical arguments!

The Avalanches has asked to help me out during this process, so he and I will be discussing the merits of options put forth. If I'm not around, I trust him to do a good job leading the discussion.

 

[Amitghosh]

I would like to suggest Poison/Water for the Plasmanta-Pre-Evo's typing. Stingrays generally live in the water, so Water type would be ideal for it. Wikipedia says that Stingrays are similar to sharks, sharks not having the poison touch. But if I were to base this typing on the sharks, it woukd be pure water. Instead, I based this on both Stingrays and Sharks. As Stingrays poison are more dominant in them than the electricity, based on the majority of both Shark and Stingray, I didnt put electric in this typing instead of Poison.

 

[colourcodedchaos]

I'd like to suggest Electric/Poison for the typing. HBEevee is wrong about sharks not having the "electric touch" thing; electroception is very common in sharks, most famously in the rather distinctive hammerhead shark. Rays also possess electroception, and I think it's a bit much to shift the primary typing. Personally, however, this might be a little bit biased on my part; I want another poison-type cutemon, dammit. =]

 

[Mova]

Electric/Poison is my favorite choice, even considering the fact that Brattler, Cawdet, and Volkritter keep their typing upon evolution. Not much to say, other than this: Four in a row, please!

 

[P3DS]

I'd prefer to actually have a Part water typing. Electric/Water -> Electric/Poison is pretty nice. It could be not poisonous when young, but become more poisonous as it evolves. I mean, Plasmanta looks graceful, but a really cute Prevo would be adorable ^-^

 

[Phione]

I would like to see Electric/Water for one. Plasmanta is an aquatic animal, and I'd like to see the preform go back to its roots. Plus, Plasmanta is a powerful Pokémon that doesn't need that Water typing to survive, but this baby might have to swim a lot rather than "glide". As P3DS said, baby Plasmanta might become more poisonous later, and probably can't swim in poisoned waters yet.

 

[FMD]

Out of the 26 fully-evolved Poison typed Pokemon, all but one of them were Poison typed in every stage of evolution, the exception being Dustox. Out of the 24 fully-evolved Electric types, all but one were Electric in all stages of evolution, the exception being Jolteon. Furthermore, Jolteon stands out as the only Electric Pokemon that does not share the exact some typing as all of its evolutionary relatives. The precedent overwhelmingly supports the notion that Plasmanta would have had Poison/Electric typing prior to having evolved.

 

[Phione]

I always hear these precedent arguments, but we're not ENTIRELY BOUND by the examples of Pokémon GameFreak gives us. I agree that precedent is important, but that doesn't mean we can't take our own paths once in a while.

 

[Dogfish44]

For those concerned with part-Water and stuff like Surf, I'll redirect ye to Surskit.

For the time being, I'm going to suggest Plasmicra take Poison/Water or Poison.

 

[The Avalanches]

Figure I might throw my hat in the ring here.

Dragonblaze052 actually made a point that I was going to refer to, in that keeping our junior CAP an Electric / Poison type carries a lot of precedence, as all dual-typed Electric-types share their typing with their evolutionary lines.

However, I could be convinced into changing it's typing, after all, it IS a marine animal, and I think that an Electric/Water or Water/Poison typing could also be valid, you could argue that its Poison or Electric powers are underdeveloped. Plasmanta has something of a shortage of a Water-movepool, but I believe that Water Pulse, Rain Dance and Haze are accommodating enough for us if we choose to go down that path.

Mono-Electric and Poison could be considered too, for the same reasons as Water/(Poison/Electric).

Those five typings make the most sense to me right now, and I'm pretty impartial at this point but I would be more than happy to hear some other suggestions, if they make enough sense from a flavour-perspective.

 

[GoldNinja]

I normally like to try and be creative by breaking precedent, but for Plasmanta's prevo I see no reason to change it. Electric/Poison has my support because I feel like in order to change its typing, the design would have to change somewhat dramatically. If it becomes Electric/Water, Poison/Water, or especially mono-Water, I imagine that the color scheme would be primarily blue, which would look odd considering Plasmanta's coloring and Poison typing. Of the three aforementioned type combinations, Poison/Water makes the most sense, but then why does it suddenly produce electricity when it evolves? We could still be creative by having the prevo have both poison and electric abilities as long as we follow the Espurr (and others I'm forgetting) route where the power exists, but is just uncontrolled. I feel like following that route also provides for some interesting design choices. It just makes the most sense IMO if we keep the Electric/Poison type for the prevo.

 

[P3DS]

Out of the 26 fully-evolved Poison typed Pokemon, all but one of them were Poison typed in every stage of evolution, the exception being Dustox. Out of the 24 fully-evolved Electric types, all but one were Electric in all stages of evolution, the exception being Jolteon. Furthermore, Jolteon stands out as the only Electric Pokemon that does not share the exact some typing as all of its evolutionary relatives. The precedent overwhelmingly supports the notion that Plasmanta would have had Poison/Electric typing prior to having evolved.

If you use that logic, plasmanta should have got volt switch, since all fully evolved electric types get volt switch (Excluding CAPs). That is the only flaw in the logic, and as plasmanta defies logic, so could it's typing.

 

[sunny004]

I'd prefer to actually have a Part water typing. Electric/Water -> Electric/Poison is pretty nice. It could be not poisonous when young, but become more poisonous as it evolves. I mean, Plasmanta looks graceful, but a really cute Prevo would be adorable ^-^

Alternatively, you could do Water/Poison (Whoa there, bringing out that Qwilfish cousin) because electricity would probably need more development then poison, which would probably be in poison glands from birth.

 

[FierceDeity1]

I do agree that Electric/Poison would be a great choice, but if we wanted to add water in there, it would not be unprecedented. Both Surskit and Skrep lose the Water typing upon evolution. I would be okay with either keeping Electric or going Water/Poison.

 

[Mova]

Most of you may already be aware, but Plasmanta's typing on the Pokemon Showdown! Pokedex is listed as Electric/Poison, rather than vice-versa. Not sure if it matters unless the Prevo is getting a change in typing. I'm not fond of Electric/Water because of Krilowatt's existence and the redundancy, but that's just me.

 

[Pikachu315111]

If it's not Electric/Poison (which is my vote) I would go for for pure Electric. It still sort of help sets up for a powerful Water-type (or any type strong against Ground) as Electric-types only weakness is Ground. Sort of make it like an imperfect Plasmanta. Also being young its poison sacs haven't fully developed/are that potent yet but its electrical attributes still exist as that's how it imagines it uses to sense its environments (that said it can still learn plenty of Poison- and Electric-type attacks, just talking flavor-wise).

 

[Unsee]

I think that Water/Poison should be the type combo for Plasmanta's prevo. I like to think that it's, well, a pre-evolved version of Plasmanta, in that it hasn't acquired the ability to produce electricity yet, and is just a Qwilfish waiting to become epic (a metaphor, of course). Maybe it can have some Electric-type attacks, but I'd recommend against the same typing as its elder.

 

[The Avalanches]

P3DS makes a good point in pointing out that Plasmanta not having access to Volt Switch is already a break in precedence, as it is the only fully-evolved Electric-type without the move. So, if we're feeling particularly renegade-ish, giving our Pre-Evo a different typing isn't straying too far from tradition.

Most of the flavour-reasoning behind the type combos so far has been very sound and well-thought out, the explanations have been quite convincing. Water/Poison makes our Pre-Evo comparable to Skrelp, another Water/Poison sea creature that receives a different typing upon evolving, so we have precedence here. Electric/Water is also a viable pick, the flavour argument of it having underdeveloped toxins is a solid one. While I feel mono-Poison and mono-Electric are a little dull, they also have solid reasoning behind them.

I have a few less likely typings to discuss also, Electric/Flying and Poison/Flying, which make some sense from a precedence perspective, given that Mantine and Mantyke both have Flying as a secondary typing. However, a lack of any Flying-type moves could make those typings difficult to justify. I'd still be happy to hear what you guys think of them, though.

 

[sunny004]

P3DS makes a good point in pointing out that Plasmanta not having access to Volt Switch is already a break in precedence, as it is the only fully-evolved Electric-type without the move. So, if we're feeling particularly renegade-ish, giving our Pre-Evo a different typing isn't straying too far from tradition.

Most of the flavour-reasoning behind the type combos so far has been very sound and well-thought out, the explanations have been quite convincing. Water/Poison makes our Pre-Evo comparable to Skrelp, another Water/Poison sea creature that receives a different typing upon evolving, so we have precedence here. Electric/Water is also a viable pick, the flavour argument of it having underdeveloped toxins is a solid one. While I feel mono-Poison and mono-Electric are a little dull, they also have solid reasoning behind them.

I have a few less likely typings to discuss also, Electric/Flying and Poison/Flying, which make some sense from a precedence perspective, given that Mantine and Mantyke both have Flying as a secondary typing. However, a lack of any Flying-type moves could make those typings difficult to justify. I'd still be happy to hear what you guys think of them, though.

I have yet to know a pokemon that does not have an attacking stab of some type (Excluding Magikarp, Feebas, and Unown) and I feel like adding a flying stab would throw off the whole CAP process.

 

[The Avalanches]

I have yet to know a pokemon that does not have an attacking stab of some type (Excluding Magikarp, Feebas, and Unown) and I feel like adding a flying stab would throw off the whole CAP process.

I agree, it would be quite a stretch justifying a typing like that, but it would be good to discuss it, even if only to rule it out. If it got something like Wing Attack + Defog, it would be a bit more worth considering.

 

[boxofkangaroos]

Nobody has brought up Normal/Poison yet. I think that would be a very interesting combo to work with. It also makes sense, as the Pokémon's electrical powers would take a long time to develop.

 

[sparktrain]

Right now I'm leaning towards either mono Electric or Electric/Posion. I wouldn't be too opposed to Water being included in the typing since it is a marine creature (although barely learning any Water moves is weird), but Flying seems like too much of a stretch.

 

[munchyoshi]

Can we not do normal/something or water/something please? Very rarely do real Pokemon do what has been done on many caps, I can only think of Surskit and Skorupi. We don't need to be "unique" every time we make a prevo. Though you could argue this is more fun if we do it this way. I would personally just like Poison/Electric, but Electric or Poison seem fine. I would not be very strongly opposed to Poison/Water, but personally I'd rather not.

 

[The Avalanches]

I'm really not feeling Normal/Poison. Aside from Flying, Normal is very rarely paired up with other types, and those Pokemon who do have Normal as a secondary type are generally land animals (Girafarig, Bibarel, Heliolisk) so Normal doesn't really do it for me on a sea creature. Flying really doesn't either. And while a lack of Water-type moves might seem prohibitive, Plasmanta still has access to Rain Dance, Water Pulse, Aqua Tail and Haze, moves which are commonly seen on Water-types.

 

[Absolclaw]

As tempted as I am to suggest pure Electric, if only so we can laugh at a purely electrical being swimming in the ocean, I think pure Poison works fine. I personally see Plasmanta as the type who is poisonous at heart, and its electrical abilities being secondary, possibly stemming from the way its poison interacts with other beings/inside of itself (Science? Pfft, it just sounds cool to me). So it being a pure Poison which eventually learns to control Electricity seems to make the most sense to me.

I don't really like the idea of Poison/Water, since changing from manipulating water to electricity seems like too big of a change to me. Two similar Pokemon who lost their Water typing, Surskit lost its water typing as it moved from living in the water to the sea, and personally I still kind of see Dragalge as a Water-type at heart - it simply became too badass for its nature as an aquatic creature being worth mentioning. Then again, that logic could easily carry over here, but I dunno ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Plasmanta just never seemed like a purely aquatic being to me, kind of like Stunfisk or Eelektross (They do live in the water, don't they?), if that makes sense. Of course, that all depends on what we do with the thing, lol.

... and then I just remembered Plasmanta is Electric/Poison, so predominantly Electric. Derp. Oh well.