Could use a little help (OU edition)

[Smallarf]

Okay, threw a team together, and thought it would do....well, lets say better then it did. And leave it at that. That being said, any help would be appreciated. original plan was for something stallish, so many pokes are (very) defensive. I think this may be part of the problem, as I spend all day block and not killing while i get worn down. Edits in red.

Vaporeon @ Leftovers
Bold - Water Absorb
252 HP/252 Def/4 SpD

Scald
Toxic
Wish
Protect

Scald is her main attack, with toxic being added to help punish anything that tries to come in (I'm looking at you Jellicent). Wish is for self healing and/or wish passing, and protect should be obvious here. Problem here is, my defensive pivot is dying. A lot. With the introduction of Forretress (who is now Scolipede), who is a actual lead, Vaporeon has been surviving a lot longer. Better prediction has been helping here too, along with learning the movesets a little better (I'm sorry vappy! I didn't know it learned thunderbolt! I'm sorry!)When it doesn't die, it works pretty well. I had used this when I played in Gen. 4 with HP Elec to counter Gyarados, which worked amazingly well. Gotta love water absorb.

Scolipede @ Focus Sash
Jolly - Swarm
252 Spe/252 Atk/4 HP

Megahorn
Rock Slide
Spikes
Toxic Spikes

Forretress is replacing Ferreothorn. Who has now been replaced by Scolipede. He was added as a fast spiker with some better offensive options at the sacrifice of some defense. This will hopefully give me the option of getting toxic level spikes up more often.Megahorn and rockslide hit the two priority taunters hard and give scolipede some offense.

Gliscor @ Toxic Orb
Impish - Poison Heal
252 HP/184 Def/72 Spe

Earthquake
Ice Fang
Substitute
Protect

Notice a theme yet? Protect to heal with poison heal and stall for more toxic damage. Ice Fang and Earthquake give good coverage together. his was one of the last editions to my team. He looked good and, seeing as he was great with toxic stalling, I grabbed him. Toxic has been replaced with Sub, as Forretress is now packing toxic spikes. However, my games have been switch happy, and I haven't really gotten much use from him yet. Possible change here?

Reunculous @ Life Orb
Bold - Magic Guard
252 HP/252 Def/4 SpA

Psychic
Focus Blast
Calm Mind
Recover

Calm mind up and try to sweep with Psychic and Focus Blast (haven't worried too much about the low acc.) Recover as needed. I've been on the wrong end of one of these that set up (along with a +4 Atk Garchomp, but thats a different story all together) and it hurt. A lot. Like, game over lot. He's one of my favorites from the new generation. He's great with all the fighting types out and about. All hail the Jelly Bear Fetus!

Rotom-H
Modest - Levitate
252 SpA/252 Spe/4 HP

Thunderbolt
Overheat
HP Ice
Trick

Sneaky little guy. He loves hugging ferreothorns (with fire) and electrocuting random water that try to predict the overheat (don't ask me why, but that politoad should probably see a psychologist or something). Shadowball helps with coverage. Trick is there to screw around with my opponent. (Whats the matter? You mean Conckledor doesn't want a pair of choice specs? Why not?) No complaints here. Shadow Ball dropped for HP Ice on the advice that it helps with coverage.

Breloom @ Toxic Orb
Jolly - Poison Heal
252 Atk/252 Spe/4 HP

Mach Punch
Seed Bomb
Stone Edge
Spore

At the advice that mach punch would save me a lot of headaches, I started looking around. Concklederp was suggested, but Im not that big of a fan of him. Then I remember that Breloom learns it. So I looked into that. Breloom was the first poke that I EV trained, so I have no issues with him (Effect Spore, Adamant, wild catch with a 4 atk IV! Amazing find, I know). Tried him outin place of Salamence for a few battles and, so far, he's been very helpful, almost always scoring at least 1 kill. General plan is to switch in and Spore whatever comes in to counter. Attack accordingly. Mach punch helps me with my priority issue and Seed Bomb/Stone Edge for coverage. As with Salamence, I wouldn't mind a Techni-loom, but no dreamworld, so thats out of the question.


So, there you have it. I'd like to get some priority on this team, as there have been some times when it would of REALLY helped, but I'm not sure where to get it. Breloom has been introduced to fix the no priority problem. Spore is also amazing. No dreamworld suggestions either, please. Thanks for the help.

 

[SteelPokemonFan]

These EVs might be much better for Salamence: 232 Atk / 24 SpA / 252+ Spe (Naive)

You might consider changing Reuniclus' nature to Bold, but I haven't used Modest Reuniclus, so I don't know what Modest can OHKO / 2HKO with as opposed to Bold.

Also, perhaps you should use a Mach Puncher such as Conkeldurr, because a +2 LO Excadrill can OHKO all of your Pokemon except for Gliscor, which can sometimes by 2HKOed by Rock Slide (with 252/184+ without Poison Heal) and always 2HKOed by Return (with 252/252+ and Poison Heal). These calcs were done w/o SR.

 

[Smallarf]

These EVs might be much better for Salamence: 232 Atk / 24 SpA / 252+ Spe (Naive)

Okay, thanks. The Salamence spread, like I said, was random. Really random.

You might consider changing Reuniclus' nature to Bold, but I haven't used Modest Reuniclus, so I don't know what Modest can OHKO / 2HKO with as opposed to Bold.

....Not sure why that reads Modest. It is indeed Bold. Fixing typo.

Also, perhaps you should use a Mach Puncher such as Conkeldurr, because a +2 LO Excadrill can OHKO all of your Pokemon except for Gliscor, which can sometimes by 2HKOed by Rock Slide (with 252/184+ without Poison Heal) and always 2HKOed by Return (with 252/252+ and Poison Heal). These calcs were done w/o SR.

Yes, Excadrill hurts. Any other suggestions for mach puncher? Would breloom work? Spore is helpful. And who would be best to drop for this?

 

[soiherduliekmudkipz]

I'm not sure who you would want to switch out, but with the stall-centric theme of your team, you'd probably do better with toxic spikes down.
I'm thinking maybe switching Ferrothorn for Foretress? Like I said, toxic spikes would really help you wear people down more, and you've got Reuniclus to counter poisons that would absorb them, and Rotom to murder any steels that dont take toxic damage.
Just my two cents.

 

[Smallarf]

I'm not sure who you would want to switch out, but with the stall-centric theme of your team, you'd probably do better with toxic spikes down.
I'm thinking maybe switching Ferrothorn for Foretress? Like I said, toxic spikes would really help you wear people down more, and you've got Reuniclus to counter poisons that would absorb them, and Rotom to murder any steels that dont take toxic damage.
Just my two cents.

I had considered getting toxic spikes a when i made this team, and forretress would be my choiced spikes layer. I might try that. Thanks.

 

[Minacciosa]

Vaporeon staying alive as long as possible and passing wishes is critical for a stall team - it should never lead. Toxic Spikes want to be set-up ASAP, just like all hazards basically. I would also put Toxic over Ice Beam, as it helps you stall better and gives you something to damage other water types.
Possible replacement for Forretress: Scolipede is a fast Toxic Spiker, which means you can get the cruicial second layer in (because regular poison is fairly useless), which Forretress usually cannot without being forced out, taunted, KOed, or set up on. HP Ice on Rotom gets way better coverage than Shadow Ball.

 

[Smallarf]

Vaporeon staying alive as long as possible and passing wishes is critical for a stall team - it should never lead. Toxic Spikes want to be set-up ASAP, just like all hazards basically. I would also put Toxic over Ice Beam, as it helps you stall better and gives you something to damage other water types.
Possible replacement for Forretress: Scolipede is a fast Toxic Spiker, which means you can get the cruicial second layer in (because regular poison is fairly useless), which Forretress usually cannot without being forced out, taunted, KOed, or set up on. HP Ice on Rotom gets way better coverage than Shadow Ball.

Well, since the introduction of Forretress, Vappy has not led. That has (happily) become the job of Forretress. Not sure I'm up for dropping Ice Beam, as I then lack any Ice Move (see below on Rotom). Due to me also dropping Salamence, these seems to leave me out in the cold against any dragons. I'm not really sure thats worth the risk. Additionally, is it worth the trade off of one of my bulkier poke's and my rapid spinner to get faster t-spikes? I'll try HP Ice on Rotom though, his set was copied from my ingame one, who lacks the proper Hidden Power. Would this work as my only ice move then? ie, trade Ice Beam for Toxic (or would the original HP Elec work better?) and trade Shadow Ball for HP Ice.

 

[Minacciosa]

Gliscor also has Ice Fang, so it wouldn’t be your only ice attack. Toxic serves as a backup in case you cant get down two layers, which seems really likely. If you want to keep Ice Beam, it’s okay, but only Ice Beam or Toxic are all that worth it - Vaporeon usually wins against Gyarados without Taunt.
Sometimes, even in stall teams, its useful to have a lead that is able to fulfill its function sucessfully: Azelf and Aerodactyl were basically always able to either Taunt or get Stealth Rocks up as leads in Gen. Foretress is such an easy set up, and virtually walls nothing - as most every common attacker has something to hit it with neutrally. Basically, my point is that with Toxic Spikes, you NEED that second layer to do anything worthwhile, and I just find that employing a lead to get that done can be really worthwhile.

 

[Smallarf]

Gliscor also has Ice Fang, so it wouldn’t be your only ice attack. Toxic serves as a backup in case you cant get down two layers, which seems really likely. If you want to keep Ice Beam, it’s okay, but only Ice Beam or Toxic are all that worth it - Vaporeon usually wins against Gyarados without Taunt.

Not sure how I missed Ice Fang, I even looked over to make sure i didn't. Okay, I guess I'll try toxic. Would probably help against Jellicent, as they were giving me trouble (almost always switched into vappy and forced me out as I couldn't touch them) Toxic it is then.

Sometimes, even in stall teams, its useful to have a lead that is able to fulfill its function sucessfully: Azelf and Aerodactyl were basically always able to either Taunt or get Stealth Rocks up as leads in Gen. Foretress is such an easy set up, and virtually walls nothing - as most every common attacker has something to hit it with neutrally. Basically, my point is that with Toxic Spikes, you NEED that second layer to do anything worthwhile, and I just find that employing a lead to get that done can be really worthwhile.

Although I've been loving forretress thus far, you do have a point about the t. spikes. So, scolipede would do it better? Okay then, I'll try him out. This set off the analysis seems right (with a slight alteration).

move 1: Spikes
move 2: Toxic Spikes
move 3: Megahorn
move 4: Rock Slide
item: Black Sludge
nature: Jolly
ability: Poison Point
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

 

[Minacciosa]

The Scolipede Evs / Nature look fine, but change Poison Point to Swarm. Swarm is generally better than regular poison. I would replace the Black Sludge for Focus Sash, otherwise you aren’t surviving too much. 252 HP / 252 Speed is fine for longevity, as you still hit things hard enough, and you can virtually always get another set of TS in. Additionally, Swarm activates when you’re at Focus Sash, so you’ll have a strong Megahorn regardless. Spikes are not super necessary, as you will be hard-pressed to get two layers of Toxic Spikes and layer of Regular spikes in. But keep it is its better for you, Pursuit is very viable for a lead role - EQ lets you do reasonable damage to Terrakion, Heatran and Infernape, while Payback is really only useful for hitting Gengar.

I mainly mentioned Scolipede because it’s the fastest Toxic Spiker, as 112 Speed is great for beating Gengar, Espeon, Lati@s, etc. Roserade is very viable too, with Sleep Powder and Toxic Spikes - good Special bulk, it can also work - and probably can last longer than Scolipede. It just depends what you find works better for your team. Something like Toxic Spikes/ Sleep Powder / Leaf Storm or HP Fire/Ice / Leech Seed.

 

[Smallarf]

Thanks a ton for the help. I'll try Scolipede out for a while but keep Roserade in mind as a back up. Also, Swarm/Focus Sash changes make perfect sense.