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Currently Unnamed

Discussion in 'BW Other Teams' started by TheVoid619, Jun 24, 2013.

  1. TheVoid619

    TheVoid619

    Joined:
    May 22, 2012
    Messages:
    38
    At a glance:
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    While this team isn't as focused on a single Pokemon like my previous team was, this team is still extremely good, currently going 32/11 thus far. I'll try to break this down, but for the most part, the roles of main sweeper can go to almost anything, depending on the opponent's team. That's the great thing about this team, it's extremely adaptable.
    Main Sweepers:
    [​IMG][​IMG]
    Handjobs (Ambipom) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Technician
    EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4 Def
    Jolly Nature
    - Fake Out
    - Last Resort
    Technician and STAB boosted Fake Out... 90 power, plus Ambipom's 299 atk power and Life Orb boost... that attack does A TON of damage. Last Resort has a, after STAB, 210 power, before Life Orb. I don't need to explain how often this OHKOs my opponent's pokemon. On top of that, there are very few people who see this coming, for some strange reason.
    Broomstick (Hitmonlee) @ Normal Gem
    Trait: Unburden
    EVs: 252 Spd / 252 Atk / 4 HP
    Adamant Nature
    - Close Combat
    - Fake Out
    - Earthquake
    - Stone Edge
    After using the Fake Out, Unburden makes Hitmonlee faster than a lot of common scarfers (according to the Smogon database, Hitmonlee outspeeds every relevent scarfer). This shows the threatening power of Hitmonlee. Once any Pokemon that's got Hitmonlee in check is gone, Hitmonlee becomes the broomstick. I end up sweeping with him more than anyone.
    Core/Support:
    [​IMG][​IMG]
    Flag (Gligar) @ Eviolite​
    Trait: Immunity​
    EVs: 252 Def / 252 HP / 4 Atk​
    Impish Nature​
    - Earthquake​
    - Roost​
    - Stealth Rock​
    - Toxic​
    Gligar is just an amazing wall, with immunity to toxic poison, the ability to set up rocks, and having a huge defensive stat. This thing can toxic stall for days, and can usually take a Chandelure's Fire Blast and deliver an Earthquake back. While this won't faint Chandelure, it'll bring it down low enough to allow it to die easily. All in all, however, Gligar is basically here for the same reason as Umbreon, because it's a beastly wall.
    Star (Umbreon) @ Leftovers​
    Trait: Synchronize​
    Shiny: Yes​
    EVs: 252 SDef / 252 HP / 4 Def​
    Careful Nature​
    - Wish​
    - Toxic​
    - Protect​
    - Foul Play​
    Wish support. Toxic stall. Never f*cking dies. Do I need to explain more? The only attack is Foul Play, because it allows Umbreon to not have to use its pretty low stats, but instead use the opponent's attack power against them.
    Rounding out the team:
    [​IMG][​IMG]
    Spook (Chandelure) @ Choice Scarf​
    Trait: Flash Fire​
    Shiny: Yes​
    EVs: 252 Spd / 252 SAtk / 4 SDef​
    Modest Nature​
    - Overheat​
    - Shadow Ball​
    - Fire Blast​
    - Energy Ball​
    Chandelure deals with a lot of ghost and steel type threats to my team, especially Sableye and Bronzong, as well as non-scarfed non-sub Chandelure. The only big threat that Chandelure doesn't deal with easily is an enemy Chandelure that sets up a Substitute. In this scenario, I usually sacrifice Chandelure to break the sub, then revenge kill with Broomstick. Energy Ball also allows Chandelure to 2HKO opposing Blastoise and usually OHKO opposing Swamperts, which is easy to do with some predicting.
    ThundrNuts (Raikou) @ Choice Specs​
    Trait: Pressure​
    Shiny: Yes​
    EVs: 252 Spd / 252 SAtk / 4 HP​
    Timid Nature​
    - Thunderbolt​
    - Hidden Power [Ice]​
    - Shadow Ball​
    - Volt Switch​
    ThundrNuts deals with Crobat, as suggested by Fat Jatul, which has potential to be an issue against my team. ThundrNuts allows me to deal with said Crobats without needing to unburden my Hitmonlee. On top of this, ThundrNuts also helps to deal with Chandelure, isn't effected by Sableye's Will-o-Wisp, etc. The major thing that I am considering for this Raikou set is changing Hidden Power to HP Grass to deal with Rhyperior.
    Threats:
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    Sub-Calm Mind Chandelure has proven to give me a lot of problems, and Scarf can also give me issues. It may be due to my play style and underestimating my Pokemon's natural bulk, but I feel like Chandelure can prove a major threat. My major responses to Chandelure is usually Umbreon. If it is not a scarf Chandelure, and not under a sub, Spook can handle it easy enough. As a back up, though risky (in the case of Timid nature), Broomstick can OHKO. Under a sub, I can usually take it down with ThundrNuts, or sacrifice ThundrNuts to get a revenge kill. A scarf variant requires either an unburdened Hitmonlee or outplaying my opponent.
    Crobat has the obvious super-effective STAB Brave Bird against my main of my two sweepers, taking out Broomstick in an easy OHKO. While Broomstick can easily deal with even a Scarf Crobat, it has a strong chance to miss with Stone Edge. I'm not 100% sure if a Stone Edge can OHKO 100% hp Crobat. Crobat also completely counters my physical wall.
    The only counters that I have to Rhyperior is Energy Ball from Spook. Close Combat from Broomstick is, at best, a 2HKO. Rhyperior has scary high natural power, and physical bulk, making this a serious threat to my team.
    Sableye is probably the second least, if not the least threatening of these Pokemon to my team. The big issue with Sableye is that a Will-0-Wisp cripples both of my main sweepers, Handjobs and Broomstick, whom are both physical sweepers. Chandelure does counter this easily, switching in on an easily predicted Will-o-Wisp, and firing off a Flash-Fire boosted Overheat will more-or-less OHKO/2HKO anything.
    Suggestions:
    Removed:
    [​IMG]
    Accelgor @ Leftovers​
    Trait: Hydration​
    Shiny: Yes​
    EVs: 252 Spd / 4 SAtk / 252 HP​
    Timid Nature​
    - Giga Drain​
    - Spikes​
    - U-turn​
    - Final Gambit​
    Accelgor's job is to deal with bulky walls, specificially steel types that resist Ambipom. The most important wall I need to kill with Accelgor is Bronzong. If there are no walls that Accelgor needs to take down, I will usually Final Gambit another big threat, or their lead to keep them from setting up rocks. The rest of the moveset is mostly for support, scouting, and allowing Accelgor to battle if needed.
  2. GenXXZ

    GenXXZ

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2013
    Messages:
    281
    Hey, interesting team, I don't think I've seen anything quite like it. That Hitmonlee set looks incredibly fun to use, nice work. Congrats on your success! Here's a couple things to mention:

    You seem to be pretty weak to ghosts in general. You mentioned your weakness to Sub Chandelure (which is extremely common in my opinion) but another weakness that I can see is OTR Cofagrigus. If Cofagrigus gets Trick Room going, you have no way to retaliate, as Chandelure would be 'outsped' and then OHKOd by a Shadow Ball. Umbreon's Foul Play would not hit Cofag very hard either. This is a problem I would suggest patching.

    You have a pretty good looking defensive core right now that I don't want to break. The Pokemon I'd reccomend scrapping is Accelgor; spikes aren't really needed that much since you have lots of options to stall teams out, and you have fast and powerful sweepers to hit incoming switches pretty hard as it is. Plus, I just don't see it doing much else. It's all up to what your experiences are. Anyways, have you ever considered an offensive dark type for this team? Sucker Punch Honchkrow might be a good option. Perhaps even Bisharp?
  3. Crimson

    Crimson

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2006
    Messages:
    131
    Considering that your main offensive threats are Ambipom with strictly normal moves and Hitmonlee, I would consider replacing something with the best Ghostbuster in the tier: CB Snorlax. Lead Ambipom draws Ghosts like moths to a flame, which means you can bring in Snorlax to smite it down.

    That leaves you with 2 powerful Normal type attackers and a strong, fast, Fighting type for the rest of their team. If they don't have a Rock or Steel type, they're in for a bad time.
  4. TheVoid619

    TheVoid619

    Joined:
    May 22, 2012
    Messages:
    38
    Crimson, will a CB Snorlax work against Cofagragus, which GenXYZ mentioned? I haven't had a big problem with trick room cofagragus, but then again, the only time I faced one, my Chendulre was tricked a rocky helmet, and paralyzed, so I outspeed it under trick room.
  5. Shuckleking87

    Shuckleking87 "Assault vest makes everything better" AV Seaking, BT
    is a Tiering Contributor

    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2012
    Messages:
    582
    Snorlax will pursuit trap any ghost for considerable damage. However, this team is also rediculously weak to CM raikou. For this, I would suggest a tank Swampert over gligar, as though gligar is a great wall, it is not doing much back. Raikou will kill gligar with hp ice, which it will not do to swampert.
  6. TheUeki

    TheUeki

    Joined:
    May 13, 2013
    Messages:
    57
    I'm not an UU expert, but I know quite alot about RU.

    I've used that Hitmonlee set lots of times, it's really good :)
    I think the team looks pretty solid, but I don't quite understand how Accelgor deals with those bulky walls you mentioned, could you detail him a little more?
  7. GenXXZ

    GenXXZ

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2013
    Messages:
    281


    This is a good suggestion, however I will add that there are some Raikou's, specifically the Life Orb set, that run HP grass over ice.



    Possibly, Crunch 2HKOs. If you run lowest possible speed on Snorlax, it'll actually speed tie with Cofagrigus. HP fighting might hurt a bit but it seems like a good counter.
  8. TheVoid619

    TheVoid619

    Joined:
    May 22, 2012
    Messages:
    38
    I've actually faced quite a few CM Raikous, and they've never really been a problem. Worst case scenario, I sac something to get a safe switch into Hitmonlee and OHKO with EQ. Usually, believe it or not, Umbreon can take 2 or 3 hits from even a +2 Raikou, healing off all the damage with a wish and protect. On top of that, I've seen more Raikous carrying grass than ice. That said, I do see your point, and may switch out Gligar, but I'm not sure what for.

    Aside from Umbreon, there are very very few walls in UU that can live a full HP Final Gambit. Sure it's a suicide, but its a tactical and unexpected suicide. That said, I'm testing the team with Snorlax over Accelgor.
  9. Jatul

    Jatul

    Joined:
    Apr 15, 2013
    Messages:
    185
    One thing.

    Crobat
    But in all seriousness. Both of your sweepers reley on flinching to get set up crobat can OHKO hitmonlee with brave brid and take a fake out and out speed ambipom

    Shuts down Gligar with Taunt and Umbreon can't ohko him with foulplay and wont appreciate a brave bird either.

    He outspeeds Accelgor so Final Gambit isnt an option which leaves chandelure to deal with him. I wouldnt really trust chandelure to deal with him because of its frailness. Just something to consider

    I honestly think Choice specs Galvantula or Raikou or support Rhyperior would help with these problems Galvantula can take brave birds and fire back with compund eyes thunder Raikou can tank hits from the winged beast and fire back with HP Ice to hit both the bat and those predicting the electric attack with their ground types. And Rhyperior can wall crobat for days.
  10. TheUeki

    TheUeki

    Joined:
    May 13, 2013
    Messages:
    57
    Unless Crobat is Scarfed, Hitmonlee beats him to a pulp.

    Also, since Accelgor is frail and not a very strong pokémon attack-wise, there are a few other bug types (I assume you need him to deal with psychic-types) who could fulfill a similar role.

    There's Durant, who is an amazing wall breaker, sitting at a 109 Base Speed stat, and after one Hone Claws, reaching 700 attack (factoring Hustle).

    Yanmega is also a powerful revenge-killer/wall breaker who can hit on the special side. Speed Boost makes him blazing fast, and after 2 or 3 he will outspeed any scarfed pokémon in the tier. Tinted Lens is also an amazing ability, but he will be sacrificing speed boost in order to get it.

    On a smaller extent, there's also Escavalier. He has pretty good defenses (105 each) and a great attack stat (135!). His biggest let down is his speed, since he will never be hitting first (unless under Trick room). There's another thing going for him - his typing. Just like Durant, he's Bug/Steel, which means toxic can't even touch him and his only weakness are fire type moves. If you keep him away from fire, he should do good, specially as a wall breaker, being immune to poison and having a gigantic attack stat.

    On a final note, Heracross is a possibility, since he sports a good attack stat, an amazing ability in Moxie and some pretty damn powerful STAB moves.
    His speed doesn't do him any good, and neither does his bulk, which means a scarf could be good on him.

    Considering your team, Durant or Escavalier seem like good options since they have amazing synergy with Chandy. When people see them they immediately try to get the first fire move they can, which will boost Chandy due to Flash fire, on a predicted switch.
    Beware that Durant can't take any neutral special hit, cause his sp-def sucks.
    Escavalier is also a great counter to Trick Room teams, since your team is really speedy.

    Good luck!
  11. TheVoid619

    TheVoid619

    Joined:
    May 22, 2012
    Messages:
    38
    You know what... shit you're right. I switched out Accelgor for Snorlax and am testing it atm before making it official, but hmm... how would Raikou work for this team? I'm thinking Calm Mind, Shadow Ball, Thunderbolt, HP Ice... Shadow Ball can deal with ghost types, Tbolt and HP Ice deal with Crobat, hmm...

    Edit: Actually, maybe just a Specs Raikou.
  12. TheVoid619

    TheVoid619

    Joined:
    May 22, 2012
    Messages:
    38
    Team updated, Raikou added over Accelgor and threats updated.
  13. ShinyShaymin

    ShinyShaymin

    Joined:
    Jul 9, 2013
    Messages:
    19
    I am a fan of ambipom; however, it draws ghosts and in my opinion, it hindering this team's potential.
    With issues such as Chandelure and Rhyperior, your team could use a water physical sweeper.
    Here are two suggestions to replace Ambipom:

    Sharpedo @ Life Orb
    Trait: Speed Boost
    EVs: 252 Spd / 252 Atk / 4 SDef
    Adamant Nature
    - Waterfall/aqua jet
    - Protect
    - Crunch
    - Earthquake
    With speed boost, Sharpedo is incredibly fast. Sharpedo can easily sweep threats with its massive attack.

    Kingdra @ Leftovers/Lum berry
    Trait: Sniper
    EVs: 252 Spd / 252 Atk / 4 SDef
    Adamant Nature
    - Substitute
    - Waterfall
    - Outrage
    - Dragon Dance
    Kingdra has an excellent typing and can be an easy switch in for certain situations. Dragon dance is great for setting up sweeps.

    Your team is very well thought out. ^^ I hope I helped you out. See you later.
  14. Jatul

    Jatul

    Joined:
    Apr 15, 2013
    Messages:
    185
    Crobat can ignore the flinch of hitmonlee and OHKO with brave bird. Inner focus too good

    I like Raikou I'd replace ambipom just because it really is terrible It's counterd by to many things and is just way too frail.
  15. Patrick1088

    Patrick1088

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2013
    Messages:
    804
    You know i faced this team on uu lol i have some good points for you...
    crobat/snorlax gives your team trouble on several levels as you pointed out. Crobats inner focus plus brave bird just eats ambipom and hitmonlee. May i suggest suicide lead lass over ambipom? Ambipom is shut down by cof sableye chandy bronzong etc. Froslass can set up spikes to aid your sweepers.. and can ko crobat with ice beam.
    1.hitmonlee is good, just watchout for powerfuk revenge killers like scarf shao and darm.
    2. Gligar/umbreon are a good core but do you really need them tbh? Im not trying to change your team but i think you would do better with other sweepers/walls like cof/lax core or rhyperior/roserade. I highly recommend roserade to absorb t spikes since you have no poison types which would give chandy raikou and lee a hard time.
    3. Dont run choice specs on raikou esp with shadow ball youll be at the mercy of snorlax and swampert. I think expert belt raikou with aura sphere/extrasensory/gidden power grass/thunderbolt would help a lot. Aura sphere can2hko snorlax with prior dmg 2hko roserade with extrasensory and hidden power grass blows swampert and rhyperior out of the water. Expert belt and the rash nature can give the illusion of choiced raikou but has a great element of surprise
  16. Moose V

    Moose V

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2012
    Messages:
    540
    I think your defensive core is pretty much fine but your offensive core could use a little work. Here's a few tips:
    • Ambipom is not a "sweeper". It doesn't have a set-up move nor can it even change up moves. This set gets totally walled by rhyperior, all ghost types, registeel, emploeon, gligar, bronzong, bisharp and cobalion. It also can't 2HKO and good defensive pokemon. I would highly recommend you not use this set as it gives a lot of threats to your team a free switch-in, in particular, Chandelure. If you really don't want to get rid of it, however, give it a silk scarf instead of a life orb. The reduction in power is almost nothing but you can't be life orb stalled.
    • Both Ambipom and Hitmonlee are pokes that mainly only do work against offensive teams. For that reason, I don't think you need both. I'd replace hitmonlee with something like bulk up scrafty or swords dance hera, two pokes that are good at tearing down walls. Guts hera would also help you out with sableye.
    • You already have toxic on gligar so I think heal bell might be a good substitute for toxic on umbreon and might help you with sableye burns.
    • I'd say chandy needs trick lest snorlax/umbreon shut down the special side of your team.

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