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Cyclohm Analysis Workshop v2.0

Discussion in 'Create-A-Pokémon Project' started by Stellar, Jun 16, 2009.

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  1. Stellar

    Stellar
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Super Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Battle Server Admin Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a CAP Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a SPL Winner
    Orange Islands

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    Well because everything that was written in the other analysis had not actually been tested at all, tennisace, Plus, and I (as well as some of the more prominent playtesters on the ladder: alive, macle, reyscarface, mag, LunarFang, numbah214) have restarted the analysis based on actual playtesting experience.

    [​IMG]

    • Rain Dance has been tested and deemed Other Options material.
    • All mixed and physical sets are relegated to Other Options.
    • The EVs on all sets have been adjusted through playtesting.
    • Flamethrower has been added to the Tank set.
    • Static has been relegated to other options.
    • Special thanks to Plus for writing most of the Life Orb set comments.
    • Special thanks to tennisace for writing the Choice Specs set comments.
    • Special thanks to Magmortified for writing the part of Counters and part of Other Options.
    • Special thanks to Deck Knight for writing part of the Other Options section.
    • I wrote Physical Tank, Team Options for Life Orb, part of Other Options, part of Counters, EVs, Team Options, and part of Opinion.
    • The Physical Tank set was deemed superior to the "Bulkyohm" set that was in the previous analysis so Bulkyohm has been replaced.

    [SET]
    name: Life Orb
    move 1: Draco Meteor
    move 2: Thunderbolt
    move 3: Hydro Pump / Flamethrower
    move 4: Slack Off
    item: Life Orb
    nature: Timid
    ability: Shield Dust
    evs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

    [Set Comments]

    <p>With an amazing movepool and a Special Attack stat of 112, Cyclohm's role as an offensive threat in today's metagame is not dealt with easily. By using this set, not many pokemon in OU will be able to easily switch into Cyclohm without being dented hard. Life Orb furthers its capabilities in the offensive department. Cyclohm makes even better use of this due to its bulk and recovery abilities. Cyclohm's typing also gives this set much more of a boost, as there are numerous resistances to switch into and shrug off, while instantly giving your opponent a scare with two excellent STAB types.</p>

    <p>With Hydro Pump, Cyclohm manages to 2HKO Max HP Tyranitar. Hydro Pump also proves useful in scoring an OHKO with Stealth Rock against Heatran, who would otherwise pose a threat to Cyclohm. Flamethrower deals more damage to Steel-types than Thunderbolt and is Cyclohm's most reliable option against Celebi, thus giving it an edge against the usual switch-ins to Cyclohm. Although Hydro Pump is the preferred option in this set, both Flamethrower and Hydro Pump have their merits. Slack Off is used to give this set a longer lasting presence in the game, allowing it to constantly switch in, hit a few pokemon quite hard, and switch out. Cyclohm is essentially a hit and run type of Pokemon, which is why Draco Meteor is much preferred over Dragon Pulse.</p>

    <p>A Timid Cyclohm can outspeed everything below 284 Speed, including Adamant Lucario, the standard Dragon Dance Kingdra, and Heatran. This also allows Cyclohm to speed tie with Mamoswine as well as the other base 80 Speed pokemon who would usually run max Speed.</p>

    <p>When using Cyclohm, Pokemon that do exceptionally well in weakening foes and crippling the opponent will make its job much easier. Scizor, in particular, can switch into many of Cyclohm's counters such as Blissey and Latias who would hope to either kill or wall Cyclohm. Scizor can also scout and significantly weaken the opposing team with U-turn when paired with Stealth Rock. Likewise, Scizor can lure in Fire attacks coming from Heatran while using Cyclohm to take a hit, and recover off damage. Jirachi is also a good pokemon to pair Cyclohm with, as it can paralyze foes with Body Slam or Thunder Wave while taking Ice and Dragon-type attacks aimed at Cyclohm. Calm Mind Jirachi is exceptional at weakening many of Cyclohm's counters such as Blissey. Max HP SubCM Suicune performs equally well in this respect. Empoleon can come in on Choice Salamence or Latias Dragon-type attacks aimed at Cyclohm and set up a sweep with its Torrent set. Gyarados is immune to Ground-type attacks and can take out the Special Walls that normally impede Cyclohm through a combination of Waterfall, Dragon Dance, and Ice Fang. Scarf Heatran can lure in Blissey and Explode or KO Latias with Dragon Pulse, opening the way for a Cyclohm clean-up. Close Combat + U-turn Infernape also does an excellent job of weakening or KOing Latias and Blissey while providing another offensive presence on your team. Like Jirachi, Lucario can come in on choice Dragon or Ice attacks, such as Scarf Latias' Draco Meteor after the Special Attack drop, and threaten a sweep with Swords Dance. Life Orb Metagross also performs excellently by KOing Blissey and Latias.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Physical Tank
    move 1: Discharge / Thunderbolt
    move 2: Dragon Pulse
    move 3: Flamethrower
    move 4: Slack Off
    item: Leftovers
    nature: Bold
    ability: Shield Dust
    evs: 180 HP / 212 Def / 108 SpA / 8 Spe

    [Set Comments]

    <p>With impressive HP and Defense, amazing typing, Slack Off, and Shield Dust, Cyclohm is more than capable of sponging hits from many of the game's top threats. Cyclohm can take a hit from Scizor, Metagross, Jirachi, and Gyarados and retaliate with an attack launched from base 112 Special Attack. For example, Choice Band Scizor can only do 31.34% - 36.82% to Cyclohm with U-turn. Jirachi cannot rely on Zen Headbutt or Iron Head to flinch Cyclohm due to Cyclohm's ability, Shield Dust, which prevents any secondary effects such as Flamethrower's 10% burn chance or Iron Head's 30% flinch chance. Cyclohm can also force Skarmory out before it can set up all three layers of Spikes. Unlike Zapdos, Cyclohm is not Stealth Rock weak and can therefore more easily switch in against Scizor, Metagross, and Jirachi. Cyclohm can normally switch in against Metagross with imputiny; however, it must be especially careful when faced with Life Orb or Choice Band Metagross using Earthquake. It should be noted that although Jolly Life Orb Lucario only has a 2% chance of OHKOing Cyclohm with +2 Close Combat, Adamant versions will always OHKO. Cyclohm is capable of OHKOing Jolly Lucario with Flamethrower after it drops its defenses with Close Combat. Cyclohm makes a good switch-in against Infernape due to Cyclohm's high Defense and resistances to Grass Knot and Fire Blast. Be wary of those Infernape packing both Overheat, which deals 42.54% - 50.00%, and Hidden Power Ice. However, Hidden Power Ice will fail to KO Cyclohm after Overheat's Special Attack drop.</p>

    <p>Due to Cyclohm's great Special Attack, it can more easily handle the previously mentioned Pokemon without relying on set damage moves like Seismic Toss or Night Shade. Flamethrower allows Cyclohm to dispose of Scizor, Metagross, and Jirachi and is Cyclohm's strongest option against Celebi and Bronzong. Scizor, of course, is OHKOed. Dragon Pulse is commonly used to hit switch-ins such as Tyranitar, Mamoswine, and Flygon for at least neutral damage. Discharge is the recommended Electric-type STAB option due to its 30% paralysis chance. The power drop is largely insignificant due to the fact that ResTalk Gyarados is still OHKOed and neither Metagross or Jirachi are KOed by a combination of Thunderbolt and Flamethrower. However, Thunderbolt still deals more raw damage when compared to Discharge.</p>

    <p>With 108 SpA EVs, Cyclohm 2HKOes max HP Metagross 100% of the time with Flamethrower. Similarly, those Jirachi that do not invest heavily in HP are 2HKOed. 8 Spe EVs allow Cyclohm to outspeed ResTalk Gyarados who sit at 197 Speed. The remaining EVs optimize physical defense.</p>

    <p>Defensively, Bronzong is Cyclohm's best partner due to its resistances to Dragon, Ground, and Ice-type attacks, its ability to set up Stealth Rock and Light Screen, and its ability to counter Mamoswine, one of Cyclohm's biggest threats. Cresselia also performs adequately in this department and can also counter Flygon and Salamence, two Pokemon that immediately threaten Cyclohm. ResTalk Gyarados makes a decent counter to Mamoswine and can take on Dragon Dance and Choice Band versions of Salamence as long as it is carrying Stone Edge or Avalanche. Special Defensive Metagross can come in on Ice and Dragon type attacks aimed at Cyclohm. With Pursuit, Metagross can KO Latias on the switch or at least critically damage it. With Bullet Punch, Metagross can more easily dispose of Mamoswine. Scizor with Light Screen and Roost makes an excellent partner for Cyclohm due to its resistances to Dragon and Ice and its ability to one-shot Mamoswine with Bullet Punch. Skarmory resists Ground and Dragon, making it an acceptable switch-in to Mamoswine. Skarmory also has the added advantage of stacking Spikes.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Choice Specs
    move 1: Draco Meteor
    move 2: Thunderbolt
    move 3: Surf
    move 4: Flamethrower
    item: Choice Specs
    nature: Timid
    ability: Shield Dust
    evs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>This set aims to take advantage of Cyclohm’s natural bulk, decent 80 base speed, and most importantly, its 112 special attack. This set can rip a huge hole in any wall not named Blissey with its raw power. Your main attack is Draco Meteor, which is pound for pound more powerful than a Specsmence Draco Meteor. It tears through walls such as Celebi and Swampert, in addition to frail sweepers who cannot KO it. Here are some calculations against common switch-ins.</p>

    <h3>
    <pre>
    Draco Meteor vs. 252 HP Celebi: 76.49% - 90.10%
    Draco Meteor vs. 252 HP Swampert: 83.42% - 98.27%
    Draco Meteor vs. 32 HP Scizor: 64.36% - 75.78%
    Draco Meteor vs. 176 HP Tyranitar: 53.25% - 63.12%
    Draco Meteor vs. 4 HP Tyranitar: 59.94% - 71.05%
    Draco Meteor vs. 252 HP / 120 SpD Calm Rotom: 77.96% - 91.78%
    </pre>
    </h3>

    <p>The only unsure 2HKO is Tyranitar, but it is guaranteed with Stealth Rock or prior damage.</p>

    <p>In addition to the sheer power of Draco Meteor, what sets Cyclohm apart from other Dragon-types is STAB Thunderbolt. It obliterates the usual switch-ins to Dragon-types, namely bulky Water-types such as Suicune, Vaporeon, and Empoleon. It also provides a neutral hit on most Steel-type switch-ins, save Magnezone.</p>

    <p>Surf and Flamethrower provide neutrality and specific type coverage on this set respectively, which is essential on a good choice item set. Surf hits Ground and Rock-type switch-ins for super-effective damage, in addition to Heatran who resists Draco Meteor. Flamethrower lays the hurt on Steel-types who dare to switch in expecting a Draco Meteor. </p>

    <p>The EVs allow a tie, at worst, with Jolly Mamoswine and it outspeeds all Adamant Mamoswine and Adamant Gyarados before a Dragon Dance. If you wish, you can run a bulkier spread with a Modest nature, however this is not recommended because you don’t gain any relevant 2HKOs.</p>

    <p>Specs Cyclohm should be paired at all times with Pokemon that cover its weaknesses: namely those Pokemon able to get around the likes of Snorlax and Blissey while being able to sponge Ground, Ice, and Dragon-type attacks. Bronzong is unable to beat Blissey or Snorlax without Explosion; however, it easily walls threats such as Mamoswine, in addition to being able to set up Stealth Rock and both screens. Cresselia can also perform the same role, while also shutting down Flygon, Salamence, and non-CM Latias, which are all large threats to Cyclohm. Next, special defensive versions of Scizor, Metagross, and Jirachi can all sponge Dragon and Ice-type attacks, and some weaker Ground-type attacks too. The main draw of using these three is the ability to beat Blissey and Snorlax while still maintaining an acceptable amount of bulk. A defensive Machamp may not resist Dragon and Ground-type attacks, but it is able to recover any damage taken with Rest, and absolutely destroys all of Cyclohm’s main checks.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>Static ability can be used if you want more chances to paralyze physical attackers. It is particularly useful for punishing pokemon that tend to U-Turn early and use more powerful attacks later, neutering Scarfed U-turners the rest of the match unless the opponent has a Cleric.</p>

    <p>Cyclohm has a multititude of viable support options that normally will not find their way onto a standard set due to "four moveslot syndrome". Cyclohm can Roar opponents away repeatedly at low cost utilizing its bulk, resistances, and reliable recovery. Haze can also remove opponent stat boosts, and is especially useful against Cursing opponents with Earthquake, who lose their Attack boosts before they strike.</p>

    <p>Taunt allows Cyclohm to stop slower setup pokemon before they can get too dangerous. Yawn can also be used as a method of psuedo-stat-up prevention. Thunder Wave and Stun Spore allow Cyclohm to paralyze incoming foes, Thunder Wave has 100% accuracy but Stun Spore can hit Ground-type switch-ins. Trick Room and Gravity are rarer field effects and Cyclohm tends not to share weaknesses with their more common users. Block can keep ineffectual opponents in on Cyclohm, but Cyclohm forces so many switches you often end in a bad position. Knock Off can rid opponents of pesky Choice items and Life Orb, especially handy if you can otherwise wall their unboosted attacks. Knock Off can significantly weaken the power of Metagross' and Tyranitar's attacks by removing their Choice Band or Life Orb. It also neuters Blissey and Latias by removing their Leftovers.</p>

    <p>Light Screen can cover Cyclohm's weaker special defense and Safeguard can prevent being statused.</p>

    <p>Curse provides a means to boost Cyclohm's impressive Defense, but usually the speed drop isn't worth it. Mixed sets with Curse are clunky to use, but not impossible. Dragon Dance's +1 Speed can be used to get the jump on many of Cyclohm's counters, but the +1 Attack is difficult to utilize effectively, as Volt Tackle, Outrage, and Earthquake still don't deal enough damage to significant targets.</p>

    <p>Rain Dance is notable for boosting both Thunder and Hydro Pump's usefulness, although Sunny Day and Flamethrower makes life much more difficult for Steel and Grass types that resist its Dragon and Electric STAB respectively.</p>

    <p>Vacuum Wave can be used if you need a last-ditch priority attack with decent power against SD Lucario. Overheat can be used over Flamethrower, but cannot be used in conjunction with Hydro Pump on the standard sets. Charge Beam is an effective means of boosting Cyclohm's Special Attack while maintaining the offensive and can set up a sweep given the right conditions.</p>

    [EVs]

    <p>As mentioned in the comments for the Physical Tank set, 108 Special Attack EVs allow Cyclohm to 2HKO max HP Metagross with Flamethrower. The 8 Speed EVs give Cyclohm enough speed to outpace and OHKO ResTalk Gyarados before it has the chance to move. The remaining EVs maximize physical defense while maintaining enough HP to take resisted special hits, such as Infernape's Fire Blast and Rotom-A's Thunderbolt.</p>

    <p>On the Choice Specs and Life Orb sets, max Special Attack is used in order to guarantee 2HKOs on Tyranitar with Surf and Hydro Pump respectively. Max Speed allows Cyclohm to outspeed Adamant Mamoswine and Lucario and KO with either Surf, Hydro Pump, or Flamethrower. Cyclohm also outspeeds all non-scarfed Heatran and can OHKO with either Surf on the Choice Specs set or Hydro Pump on the Life Orb set if Heatran has switched into Stealth Rock or Spikes.</p>

    <p>It is possible, although not highly recommended, to use a much bulkier Life Orb or Specs EV spread. Simply run max Special Attack and enough Speed EVs to outrun standard Agility Metagross. The remaining EVs should be funneled into HP or one of Cyclohm's defenses.</p>

    [Team Options]

    <p>There are two very distinctive ways to play Cyclohm and each method requires different team members to suit Cyclohm's needs. The first way to play Cyclohm is defensively, as a physical tank. When using Cyclohm defensively, it is best to use Pokemon that compliment and cover Cyclohm's type strengths and weaknesses instead of focusing on Pokemon that weaken Cyclohm's "counters". Bronzong is the best choice to fill such a roll due to its high defenses and resistance or immunity to all of Cyclohm's weaknesses: Ground, Ice, and Dragon. Bronzong is able to handle Dragon Dance Tyranitar, one Pokemon which Cyclohm has extreme trouble with, with STAB Gyro Ball with boosted power due to Tyranitar's increased Speed. Bronzong also makes an excellent counter to Flygon, which are normally scarfed and therefore take increased damage from Gyro Ball, and Mamoswine, two Pokemon that threaten Cyclohm immensely. Cresselia is able to handle Flygon, Mamoswine, and mixed or Choice Band Salamence as long as it invests heavily in its defenses and runs a set with Rest, Sleep Talk, and Ice Beam. ResTalk Gyarados is immune to Ground-type attacks and takes neutral damage from Dragon and Ice-type attacks. With an Impish nature and max HP and Defense, Gyarados is capable of weathering assaults from Mamoswine, Flygon, and Salamence; however, you should be extremely wary of boosted Draco Meteor from the latter. Bulky Steel types such as Jirachi, Metagross, and Scizor pair extremely well with Cyclohm due to their resistances to Cyclohm's weaknesses. Metagross can Pursuit or Bullet Punch threatening Latias, Scizor can Bullet Punch Mamoswine, Salamence, and Latias, and Jirachi can flinch all three with Iron Head. Be sure to note that Metagross and Jirachi share a Ground weakness with Cyclohm, so it is not a very good idea to switch directly from Cyclohm to one of these Pokemon when faced with a foe commonly known to carry Earthquake. Skarmory resists Dragon, is immune to Ground, and will take little damage from physical Ice-type attacks. It can also set up Spikes to further weaken the Pokemon Cyclohm is trying to counter.</p>

    <p>The second way to play Cyclohm, of course, is offensively. This can be accomplished by using either the Choice Specs or Life Orb sets. Both sets rely strongly on hit-and-run tactics. Due to this fact, it is advised that you pair Cyclohm a Pokemon that is able to weaken Cyclohm's counters or vice versa. Scizor can easily dispose of Latias and Blissey, two of Cyclohm's biggest counters through a combination of U-turn, Bullet Punch, and Superpower. However, Scizor should be wary of Choice Specs Surf or Thunderbolt from Latias or Flamethrower from Blissey. Calm Mind Jirachi or Suicune with 101 HP Substitutes also work well due to their ability to set up on and dispose of Blissey. With Blissey out of the picture, Cyclohm can more easily make quick work of its foes by launching powerful, boosted Draco Meteors. Empoleon can come in against Choice Dragon-type attacks from Latias or Salamence with its large defense stats and can set up a sweep with Substitute, Agility, Ice Beam, and Surf. Offensive Life Orb Gyarados with Ice Fang can dispose of both Blissey and Latias while being immune to one of Cyclohm's more obvious weaknesses, Ground. Scarf Heatran resists Dragon and Ice and can lure Blissey in to play before taking it out of the game with Explosion. Lucario can also perform adequately as a partner due to its resistances to Ice and Dragon and the ability to KO Blissey, Tyranitar, and Latias after it has Swords Danced. Machamp can take out Blissey and Tyranitar with DynamicPunch and Latias with Payback after switchin in using its high HP, Special Defense, and resistances to Rock and Dark. Life Orb Metagross can KO Latias, Blissey, and Tyranitar as well. Stealth Rock and Spikes are obviously recommended for use alongside Cyclohm due to their ability to turn 2HKOes into OHKOes. Forretress is an excellent user of both moves and can come in on predicted Dragon and Ice-type moves aimed at Cyclohm.</p>

    [Opinion]

    <p>Due to Cyclohm's base 112 Special Attack, it hits like a truck. With offensive options with high base power, such as Hydro Pump, Draco Meteor, and Thunderbolt, it is able to put a major dent into the majority of the OU metagame. Even Pokemon that resist Draco Meteor, such as Scizor, who takes upwards of 64% from Specs Draco Meteor, will take a huge chunk of damage.</p>

    <p>On the other hand, Cyclohm performs well as a tank due to its high defensive stats and numerous resistances. Shield Dust and Slack Off only further Cyclohm's ability to take hits from the likes of Jirachi, a Pokemon that relies on flinch from Iron Head or Zen Headbutt to make a mark on the opponent, Metagross, and Scizor.</p>

    <p>However, Cyclohm is not all sunshine and rainbows (just look at the thing). Cyclohm sports three weaknesses to some of the game's most common attacking types: Ground, Ice, and Dragon. Due to this, it is sometimes difficult to effectively fit Cyclohm into a team or switch it into play. Cyclohm also takes full damage from Spikes, Toxic Spikes, and Stealth Rock, further limiting its ability to wall certain threats such as U-turn Scizor. It also doesn't help that Tyranitar, one of the most common Pokemon in the game, can switch into defensive sets with impunity due to sandstorm's Special Defense boost and immediately threaten a KO with Choice Banded Earthquake or set up a sweep with Dragon Dance. Like most Pokemon, Cyclohm requires some support from its teammates to be used to its fullest potential.</p>

    [Counters]

    <p>Given Cyclohm's powerful attacks, incredible type coverage, and respectable 112 base Special Attack, very little can afford to keep coming in on the more offensive sets. Blissey can sponge up Cyclohm's attacks indefinitely, and can keep Cyclohm on a timer with Toxic. Snorlax can sponge up a few hits (though it will require heavy Special Defense investment to avoid being 2HKO'd by a LO Draco Meteor) and hit back with Earthquake. Swampert can also take hits from Cyclohm not named Draco Meteor and gets STAB on its Earthquake.</p>

    <p>Mamoswine can come in on a predicted Thunderbolt and OHKO all but the bulkiest Cyclohm with STAB Earthquake. Dugtrio can trap Cyclohm and hit it with Earthquake as well, though Cyclohm's bulk usually necessitates a little weakening before Dugtrio can safely knock it out. A Specially Defensive Tyranitar can usually afford to take a hit from Cyclohm and fight back with Earthquake, though it should be wary of Hydro Pump or Surf.</p>

    <p>Latias can absorb non-Dragon moves and hit Cyclohm on its weaker side with a Dragon-type attack of its own. Various other Pokemon with a strong super effective move can revenge kill Cyclohm, such as Salamence, Starmie, or Heatran, but should be careful to ensure that Cyclohm is within KO range before attempting to take it out.</p>
  2. Stellar

    Stellar
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Super Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Battle Server Admin Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a CAP Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a SPL Winner
    Orange Islands

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    And.... done. You are free to comment now. Please read about what has changed from the previous analysis at the top of the analysis.
  3. Raj

    Raj CAP Playtesting Expert

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    Awesome work by everyone who helped contribute to playtesting and creating sets for the analysis!
  4. jagged_angel

    jagged_angel

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    Great work guys - got me really excited about trying out Cyclohm.

    One miswording:

    <p>Cyclohm has a multititude of viable support options that normally will not find their way onto a standard set due to "four moveslot syndrome". Cyclohm can Roar opponents away repeatedly at low cost utilizing its bulk, resistances, and reliable recovery. Haze can also remove opponent stat boosts, and is especially useful against Cursing opponents with Earthquake, who lose their attack drops before they strike.</p>
  5. Elevator Music

    Elevator Music
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Site Staff Alumnusis a CAP Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus
    Moderator

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    This is a really great job guys, and I only have a few nitpicks. Feel free to disregard them though since I really don't do analyses ever and probably am wrong on a lot of this !_!



    Is this really necessary? I feel as if just leaving the explanation out would be best.

    Should be SpecsMence (maybe ?_?)

    The areas I bolded just sounded wierd in my head, though they are probably correct anyways. The second one could be "...with, thanks to.."

    Possibly put the "which are normally scarfed [...]" in parenthesis, or maybe right, "as well as Mamoswine. Both of these pokemon threaten Cychlom immensely." I just don't like how it flows currently, though my suggestion isn't much better either... >_>

    Should be Bulky Steel-types (right?)

    should be switching

    awkward phrasing...

    Perhaps put the part about how Jirachi relies on flinchax in parenthesis for an easier read.
  6. Umbreon Dan

    Umbreon Dan 〉λ=
    is a CAP Contributor Alumnus

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    I was about to point out is one as well. I suggest

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