Double Battle Metagame.

[Vhind]

Also, what's wrong with Skill Swap teams? They kick ass...although that combo really isn't all that great...

I suppose I've never seen a good Skill Swap team. lol. Those I have seen, however, are quite obvious and can then be disrupted easily because I know which Pokemon to stop.

4v4 is what they used at the showdown
6v6 is what most battles on wifi are (i think)
and stadium mode (see your opponents 6, then choose 4 to battle with) was used for JAA and is used on PBR.

so you can just choose what you like best

Just to get a general idea, which style do you all prefer?

 

[False [old]]

I'll go either way. 4v4 is certainly easier to plan out, but 6v6 will give more coverage. It depends on how long of a battle you want, and how faithful we want to be to fiascoes like JAA and the Showdown.

 

[Vhind]

What exactly are JAA and the Showdown?

 

[False [old]]

Nintendo-sponsored tournaments that have happened in the past. Journey Across America used Emerald, the more recent Showdown used Diamond and Pearl. Both were Double Battle, and both were 4v4.

 

[Kittymew]

Yes I know that people (including myself) own action replays. But, it is so inconvinient even with AR to continually make new teams. Also, the people who play wi-fi are
A. Bad
B. Hard to find
or C. too few

Or D. Cheat, as everyone just about admitted in the cheating thread last week. >_>

 

[StarmanXL]

Well, I've only made one Skill Swap team ever--my current team--and don't usually run into them, but it seems that they're useful so long as you don't try some overly complicated Skill Swap chain and if you use it to screw over the opponent (stealing Dry Skin from Toxicroak on a RD team, taking away Bronzong's or Gengar's Levitate right before the opponent EQs, snatching an Intimidate from the opponent and weakening them, that sort of thing).


EDIT: Oh, and also, I'm more comfortable with 6v6, although I suppose that's because I rarely get a chance to play the other.

 

[lati0s]

Just to get a general idea, which style do you all prefer?

i prefer stadium mode because you can create a strategy without worrying about your opponets strategy screwing you over and forcing you to switch one or even both of your pokemon. switching can be very costly in doubles.

 

[Vhind]

I'm most used to PBR 4v4 because it is readily available and you can create a strategy based off of the knowledge of their team.

I love it when I'm able to switch in doubles and it screws over the other team!

 

[StarmanXL]

Er, no, Intimidate only works one time per pokemon possessing it: I can bring in a Gyarados, Intimidate the opponent, Skill Swap with Gyarados and Intimidate again, but if I skill swap Intimidate back onto Gyarados nothing will happen.

Also, can you Skill Swap Shadow Tag? Or is it Wonder Guard that's un-Swapable?

 

[False [old]]

Wonder Guard is un-Swappable. Shadow Tag is swappable.

EDIT: Would a Perish Song team work? It would be a major gambit, because all four pokemon out would be affected. You could couple Mismagius and Dugtrio, so you don't even have to use Mean Look.

 

[Vhind]

It may be difficult but a Perish Song team could work. That's a really cool idea though.

And before we go off on another (awesome) tangent, I have a question over Skill Swapping. Does the Skill Swapped Pokemon retain its new ability after switching out. Say if Slaking gains Intimidate and switches out, will it still have Intimidate when it comes back in?

 

[StarmanXL]

No, abilities reset upon switching out.

 

[Dalevl]

From what I have faced on PBR, no they don't stay. So you could Skill Swap an Ability and on the Same Turn U-Turn to another Pokemon to get Two Pair of abilites that would work great together on better suited pokemon or just to spam an Ability, such as Intimidate. You would send in a Pokemon with Intimidate and a Skill Swapper, Skill Swap Intimidate to activate again while you U-Turn with your former Intimidator to bring another one while still keeping the same pokemon in play.

 

[Vhind]

Hmm...that would be an interesting idea to tool around with.

 

[False [old]]

Looking into the Perish Song idea some more, now that Mean Look isn't part of the equation, you don't even really have to stick with Mismagius. You could go with a study pokemon like Lapras, or perhaps Altaria so Dugtrio can keep using Earthquake without worrying about collateral.

 

[StarmanXL]

Not to derail the topic further, but has anyone used Deoxys-E in doubles or had it used against you? Since voting's coming up, I became interested in how it affects 2v2 metagame, but so far I've only been able to encounter it once so I really don't have enough to solidly go on.

 

[Vhind]

The only problem with Arena Trap is that a large majority of Pokemon can escape...
What if a variant of Wobbuffet were used instead?


EDIT: Deoxys-S is quite prominent online and I face them all the time with no difficulty.

 

[Dalevl]

I'm sure that under gravity or with an Iron Ball , Arena Trap would work.
If 1vs1 Tiers are really seperate from Doubles, the status change of Deoxys-S shouldn't affect the metagame as whole and if the Nintendo Rules are followed then it really should concern us. Whether Screens reduce the Damage on your teammate from Wide Range moves should be tested though.

 

[False [old]]

The only problem with Arena Trap is that a large majority of Pokemon can escape...
What if a variant of Wobbuffet were used instead?

If Wobbuffet is allowed, I'd probably try him over Dugtrio, although Dugtrio still gets precedence in my book because he can use Protect.

 

[lati0s]

but wobuffet can take a hit, on dugtrio unless you get 3 protects in a row you're not likely to survive

 

[Vhind]

O.o
I had no idea Wobbuffet didn't know Protect. Nevertheless, Wobbuffet has never truly been banned in doubles, despite its Uber tier in singles. Because of the nature of doubles, Wobbuffet appears less often and can be combatted more easily. I doubt he'll ever be truly feared in doubles.

 

[False [old]]

This is true, especially since Counter and Mirror Coat only hit the last pokemon that struck Wobbuffet. He'd probably be using less of those and more of Charm and Safeguard.

 

[Darkmalice]

Here's a legal double set.

Azelf - Naughty - 252 Speed, 252 Attack, 4 SpcAtt - Choice Scarf
Explosion
Protect
Flamethrower
Trick

Gengar - Hasty - 252 Speed, 252 SpcAtt, 4 Hlth - Focus Sash
Explosion
Counter
Shadow Ball
Hypnosis

This set requires LOTS of prediction. It is important to know exactly what your opponent will do.

Here's a list of what you might do

• Trick an opponent who has Focus Sash e.g. Smeargle or Weavile, Azelf can then survive Gengar's Explosion
• Gengar will Hypnosis a threatening Pokemon
• Gengar will Counter while Azelf Explodes, leaving an enemy Steelix alive.

 

[Wes]

Like it was said before in the thread, chewy, OHKO + No Guard only work if you use the OHKO moves on Machamp itself. So it's not a viable strategy.

@Darknessmalice

 

[POKEMONBATTLEBRAIN]

Yeah, Machamp's ability only works for himself and moves aimed at him. The other requires a lot of prediction and knowledge of the opponent's team, which most of the time you don't have, especially at the beginning of a match.


I doubt you will be seeing Steelix in a double battle, lol. And even if you did you could just Flamethrower it with Azelf if it's still alive.