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Free Tree

Discussion in 'BW Other Teams' started by ebeast, Dec 24, 2012.

  1. ebeast

    ebeast she's probably sexting nprtprt
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

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    [​IMG]
    Introduction

    Hiya, ebeast back with another NU RMT this time focused on NU's newest addition in Snow Warning Snover, who also happens to be the current suspect to be voted on very soon. Free Tree is actually an evolution of my original Hail team built from the experiences I had using it. My original Hail team was incredibly weak to Emboar and Duosion, to the point that it drove me to making another team from scratch. I knew how much of a pain the aforementioned Pokemon caused me so I when I started my team instantly had: Snover (Hail Inducer), Rotom-F (Hail Abuser), Alomomola (Death to Boar & Wish Passer), and Skuntank (Death to Duosion and Mushy). The inclusion of Alomomola and Skuntank helped against my weaknesses to a lot of common Pokemon and Alomo's Wish support in general was extremely useful for keeping Snover and Skuntank healthy. From there I knew I wanted to have an Emboar of my own to check opposing Hail teams and take advantage of Rotom-F's ability to break walls such as Alomomola and Altaria. The last slot was probably the hardest to choose as Golurk and Regirock both held traits that my team would appreciate. Golurk would provide another check to Duosion and Sawk and give me a way to beat Pinsir. Regirock on the other hand would make my team less weak to Sunny Day Charizard and give me a buffer against Birds. Ultimately I went with Golurk because Regirock wouldn't help against Special Boar anyways and I felt the extra check to Sawk and Duosion was much more important. That's how Free Tree was born!

    In terms of the ladder, I battled with this team for the Council Vote up until I reached 1907 points and ended up with 46-4 and a W/L ratio of 11.5. I could have peaked higher than that, maybe to 1960's or so, but Annoyer begged me to stop laddering so we could have the same score. :>


    Team Strategy

    Basically Snover, Alomomola, Skuntank, and Golurk form the backbone of my team due to their ability to defeat my main weaknesses alongside many prominent threats including Samurott, Ludicolo, Duosion, Musharna, Pinsir, Emboar, Braviary, Swellow, Sawk, Piloswine, Golurk, and others. Alomomola's Wish support is huge in keeping this team alive as it makes sure Snover, Skuntank, and Golurk stick around long enough to beat what they need to. Keeping Snover alive easily with Wish makes up for its crippling Stealth Rock weakness and gives me more chances to get the weather in my favor in the cases I have to pit Snover against Ludicolo. My offensive backbone comes from Rotom-F and Emboar who help each other in breaking things apart. Rotom-F easily threatens and destroys a lot of teams including the Alomomola and Dragon-type Pokemon that give Emboar trouble. On Emboar's side it easily threatens Piloswine, Regice, and the like to allow Rotom-F to break through easier. While I mainly consider Skuntank to be part of my defensive backbone, I can also consider it part of my offensive core due to it's good Attack stat and Sucker Punch. Priority in Sucker Punch helps tons against dangerous Pokemon such as Swellow and Skuntank ability to Pursuit trap can even make spamming Emboar easier when it doesn't have to worry about a Musharna or Duosion being capable of tanking its attacks.​

    At a Glance
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]


    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    "Champion Tree" The Snover ---Water-type check & Death Fodder
    [​IMG] / [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    @ Eviolite [​IMG]
    ~EVs: 248 HP / 32 Def / 220 SpD / 8 Spe
    ~Nature: Calm (+SpD -Atk) ~Ability: Snow Warning
    Final Stats (open)
    [​IMG] 323 HP / 144 (216) Def / 160 SpA / 232 (348) SpD / 118 Spe [​IMG]

    - Leech Seed / Protect / Toxic / Giga Drain

    People are always talking about how useless Snover is, but I don't think that this is always the case. Snover's Grass/Ice typing and good Special Defense with Eviolite gives it the ability to counter prominent Pokemon such as Gorebyss, Ludicolo, and Samurott while access to Leech Seed and Toxic allow it to wear down walls and other dangerous Pokemon such as Emboar. Between Leech Seed, Toxic, and Protect, Snover can cause a lot of chaos and force a lot of switches, further racking up damage with Stealth Rock and Hail. Protect allows Snover to scout for attacks which helps to determine what my initial switch to threats such as Emboar or Sawk should be. Toxic is pretty major in particular because it's the only way that Snover can actually beat Ludicolo as its Rain boosted Hydro Pump deal a big chunk. Giga Drain allows Snover to defeat SubSmash Gorebyss as otherwise it would be capable of setting up on Snover's Blizzard. Even though Snover has weak stats, I'm often impressed by its special bulk that Eviolite provides and in many situations it has made a big difference. Regardless, if my opponent doesn't have anything that Snover can deal with, it makes for a great death fodder for my team to gain back some momentum with a free switch to one of my other Pokemon.

    EVs: My 248 HP EVs are set so that Snover can switch into Stealth Rock at least 4 times throughout the match while the 220 SpD give Snover a Special Defense jump point. The 32 Def EVs allow Snover to take a Megahorn from a Life Orb Timid Samurott easier and the 8 Spe EVs allow me to outspeed opposing base 40 Speed Pokemon such as opposing Snover and Gurdurr so I can land a Toxic or Leech Seed, respectively, before I die.​


    "Cirno" The Rotom-F ---Offensive Hail Abuser & Revenge Killer
    [​IMG] / [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    @ Choice Scarf [​IMG]
    ~EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    ~Nature: Timid (+Spe -Atk) ~Ability: Levitate
    Final Stats (open)
    [​IMG] 241 HP / 251 Def / 309 SpA / 250 SpD / 298 Spe [​IMG]

    - Volt Switch / Blizzard / Thunderbolt / Trick

    Rotom-F is the face of Hail and possibly the most threatening abuser the archetype has to offer. With STAB Boltbeam in the form of Thunderbolt and Blizzard, it puts the hurt onto basically anything that wants to come in. Rotom-F's main job on the team is to take down Emboar counters so that Boar can clean up, but it generally does much more than that. Thanks to the Flying-type resist I can use Rotom-F as a check to Braviary, which is especially useful against the SubBU set which Alomomola has no chance of beating. Emboar even helps Rotom-F take down Piloswine and Regice so that Rotom has more freedom to break apart everything. Alomomola's Wishes also allow it to stay alive if it gets too low on health and it doesn't have an opportunity to Pain Split. The Choice Scarf on Rotom-F helps a lot to revenge kill dangerous threats such as +2 Gorebyss and Sawsbuck. Trick also helps out if I need to cripple a defensive wall or set up sweeper such as Duosion or Musharna.

    EVs: The EVs are standard with max Speed to make the most out of Rotom-F's Choice Scarf, max Special Attack to hit as hard as possible, and 4 Def EVs over HP to allow Rotom-F to switch into Stealth Rock at least 4 times.​


    "Nitori" The Alomomola ---Physical Wall & Wish Passer
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    @ Leftovers [​IMG]
    ~EVs: 248 HP / 244 Def / 16 Spe
    ~Nature: Impish (+Def, -SpA) ~Ability: Regenerator
    Final Stats (open)
    [​IMG] 533 HP / 186 Atk / 282 Def / 126 SpD / 170 Spe [​IMG]

    - Wish / Protect / Toxic / Waterfall

    I've never really been too much of an avid Alomomola user, however I really have to say that it fits this team extremely well. Emboar is a massive threat to Hail teams everywhere and Alomomola is the one Pokemon that handles it best. Not only does it beta Emboar, but quite a large portion of physical attackers in the tier. Wish is amazing for this team as it allows Snover to stay alive longer and keep setting the weather while also healing the rest of my team so they can keep going on the offense. Wish + Skuntank keeps my team pretty safe from Duosion or Musharna that like to set up on Alomomola as well. Regenerator + Wish is a fantastic combination on Alomomola as it rarely has to actually stay in to accept it's own Wish, preventing it from taking away my momentum as much as other Wish users would. Toxic is Alomomola main form of damage, but honestly on a Hail team it's enough as Stealth Rock coupled with Toxic and Hail Damage wears down most opponents pretty quickly. Residual damage from Hail and possibly Toxic also makes it harder for opponents to set up on Alomomola. While the residual damage from Hail also affects Alomo, Regenerator will usually be more than enough to make up for it.

    EVs: 248 HP decreases the damage taken from Stealth Rock, while 16 Speed allows Alomomola to outspeed standard Golurk. The extra Speed allows me to hit Golurk with Waterfall or Wish before it can touch me.​


    "Pepe Lé Pew" The Skuntank ---Ghost and Psychic check & Priority User
    [​IMG] / [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    @ Black Sludge [​IMG]
    ~EVs: 20 HP / 248 Atk / 240 Spe
    ~Nature: Adamant (+Atk -SpA) ~Ability: Aftermath
    Final Stats (open)
    [​IMG] 352 HP / 312 Atk / 170 Def / 158 SpD / 264 Spe [​IMG]

    - Sucker Punch / Taunt / Pursuit / Poison Jab

    Skuntank is my teams best answer to annoying Pokemon such as Haunter, Gardevoir, Musharna, and Duosion while providing general utility in the form of Taunt. Skuntank's Poison-typing also helps with absorbing Toxic Spikes, which could be a major problem for this team if it weren't for Skunk. Sucker Punch is excellent priority that allows me to pick off dangerous Pokemon such as Cinccino and Swellow when they are at low health as well as giving me a stronger weapon against Psychic-type Pokemon than a switch-less Pursuit. Between Taunt, Sucker Punch, and Pursuit, Psychic- and Ghost-type Pokemon are hardpressed to beat Skuntank and having them gone makes it easier for Emboar to star spamming its attacks. Poison Jab allows Skuntank to hit Gurdurr, Sawk, and Emboar on the switch and is Skuntank's most reliably STAB attack. Aftermath is always helpful if you need a last minute stop to a weakened sweeper. Sucker Punch + Aftermath + Hail damage takes massive chunks on a rampaging sweeper, which cuts their attack short.

    EVs: 20 HP gives Skuntank a Leftovers number, while 240 Speed allows my Skunk to outspeed opposing Skuntank using the standard 236 Speed spread.​


    "Okuu" The Emboar ---Wallbreaker & Hail Check
    [​IMG] / [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    @ Leftovers [​IMG]
    ~EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    ~Nature: Timid (+Spe -Atk) ~Ability: Blaze
    Final Stats (open)
    [​IMG] 361 HP / 167 Def / 299 SpA / 166 SpD / 251 Spe [​IMG]

    - Substitute / Fire Blast / Focus Blast / Hidden Power [Electric]

    Revamped from my older version of the team, Special Emboar is one of the Pokemon gaining in popularity due to its ability to destroy most Hail teams--and teams in general--thanks to its great STABs and Ice-type resist. The main special walls in NU, Lickilicky and Regice, are weak to Emboar's STABs, making Emboar very hard to switch into. The Substitute set in particular makes a fantastic lure for Alomomola and takes advantage of the many switches that Emboar forces. As Scarf Rotom-F is not capable of threatening Alomomola + Amoonguss on its own with its Choice Scarf, Emboar takes its place. Fire Blast and Focus Blast are STABs that destroy a large portion of the metagame on its own and Hidden Power Electric is for Water-type Pokemon. HP Electric was chosen over HP Grass due to the ability to hit Mantine, whose Rain Dance set can cancel out the Hail and destroy my team from there with its fantastic Water + Flying STAB coverage. Timid Emboar outspeeds standard Mantine which means it can take advantage of Mantine's false security to strike before Mantine can even do anything. Against more defensive Mantine variants, a combination of Stealth Rock, STAB, and Hidden Power Electric is enough to take it down however these don't pose as much of a threat as Rain Dance does.

    EVs: Like Rotom-F, the EVs chosen for Emboar are pretty standard for a special attacker. The main thing to note is that max Speed with a Timid nature allows Emboar to outspeed Adamant Absol.​


    "Yuyuko" The Golurk ---Stealth Rock User & Offensive Tank
    [​IMG] / [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    @ Leftovers [​IMG]
    ~EVs: 72 HP / 252 Atk / 184 Spe
    ~Nature: Adamant (+Atk -SpA) ~Ability: Iron Fist
    Final Stats (open)
    [​IMG] 337 HP / 381 Atk / 196 Def / 196 SpD / 192 Spe [​IMG]

    - Stealth Rock / Earthquake / Shadow Punch / Ice Punch

    Golurk is the final member of my team and provides a lot of useful resistances and access to Stealth Rock. Golurk's Ground/Ghost provides a ton of useful resistances such as Fighting and Rock, which are capable of completely demolishing Hail teams if left unchecked. Golurk also gives me another check to Sawk, Duosion, and Pinsir who all threaten my team while providing a use Rock-type resist that helps against Golem and Regirock. Golurk's bulk is good enough that it can avoid getting OHKOed by Skuntank's Sucker Punch and proceed to take it down with an Earthquake. Even if that situation comes, thanks to Alomomola's Wish it is possible to get Golurk back up to full if I play it correctly. Golurk being my choice as a Stealth Rock user is pretty beneficial as Sawk is able to take out most of the other Stealth Rock setters with Close Combat. In fact Golurk makes for a pretty great long lasting check to Sawk as it's immune to Sawk's STAB Close Combat and Alomomola provides it with a constant supply of health via Wish. Golurk also makes a great check to Garbodor, whose Spikes are a huge pain to deal with on this team even with Wish support.

    EVs: Max Attack allows Golurk to pack a punch while 184 Spe EVs allows it to outspeed Alomomola, opposing Golurk, and Garbodor. The added bulk allows Golurk to make use of its great typing and 72 HP EVs give Golurk a Leftovers number.​


    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    IMPORTABLE (open)

    Champion Tree (Snover) (M) @ Eviolite
    Trait: Snow Warning
    EVs: 248 HP / 32 Def / 220 SDef / 8 Spd
    Calm Nature
    - Leech Seed
    - Protect
    - Toxic
    - Giga Drain

    Cirno (Rotom-F) @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 4 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature
    - Volt Switch
    - Blizzard
    - Thunderbolt
    - Trick

    Nitori (Alomomola) (F) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Regenerator
    EVs: 248 HP / 244 Def / 16 Spd
    Impish Nature
    - Wish
    - Protect
    - Waterfall
    - Toxic

    Pepe Lé Pew (Skuntank) (M) @ Black Sludge
    Trait: Aftermath
    EVs: 20 HP / 248 Atk / 240 Spd
    Adamant Nature
    - Sucker Punch
    - Taunt
    - Pursuit
    - Poison Jab

    Okuu (Emboar) (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Blaze
    EVs: 4 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature
    - Substitute
    - Fire Blast
    - Focus Blast
    - Hidden Power [Electric]

    Yuyuko (Golurk) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Iron Fist
    EVs: 72 HP / 252 Atk / 184 Spd
    Adamant Nature
    - Stealth Rock
    - Earthquake
    - Shadow Punch
    - Ice Punch


  2. ShadowAbra

    ShadowAbra

    Joined:
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    Messages:
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    The team composition is well constructed however I see you having problems with giant crustacean from the Paleolithic Era that is a huge threat and it just about tears apart your team. To counter this I suggest using 3.50 thank you and best of luck
  3. Friar

    Friar

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2008
    Messages:
    615
    I'm happy you posted this team EBeast. I haven't played a lot this round but just this morning thought "man, Alomoloa hail would probably mess stuff up." Seems someone else was thinking along the same lines :)

    As for team nitpicks, I think you should switch roles between Rotom-F and Emboar as you had been contemplating. While it doesn't shore up any immediate weaknesses, I believe it serves you better when you think about normal battle conditions. For instance, Gorebyss causes you huge problems if Snover is unable to handle it. If you're caught off guard by Signal Beam Gorebyss (or for any reason have a weakened Snover), it has a real chance to sweep you. If Alomomola is at all weakened, you risk taking serious damage from Normals and Flyers like Zangoose, Cincinno, and Swellow. Scarf Rotom-F really shores up your defense, ensuring nothing sweeps you, while still causing major problems through powerful Blizzards, Volt Switch, and Trick. Trick I don't think can be discounted as quite an asset to this team, as it really helps you break down stall, set up Pokemon, and in last mon situations. It especially helps against annoying walls like Regice and Miltank, who look pretty awful to face if paired with an Emboar stop (discounting that Emboar wears itself down pretty fast in hail). You lose little power because CB Emboar still hits like a truck, and with SR and hail everything on the opposing side is slowly losing health the entire battle, so Rotom-F can eventually break through.

    Great team, best of luck with it!
  4. morningsun

    morningsun

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2012
    Messages:
    103
    Great Team! I just have a few suggestions.

    Firstly, on Snover, I'd recommend that you replace Toxic with Substitute. SubSeed is popular for good reason. The only Pokemon whom your Snover can't hurt a lot with a Sub set is Ludicolo. However, if you want, this can be easily remedied by running 252 SpA, not that I'd advise it, but if Ludicolo is that huge a problem than it should be considered. 252 SpA allows you to have a 2HKO 50% of the time after SR damage. The Sub will help you more effectively stall other, more powerful pokes and is usually well-worth the sacrifice. Secondly, I feel that because Emboar is a cleaner and because you have Wish support, you have no reason to not run Reckless on Emboar. Emboar does not need longevity in the role that it's been given. It would much rather be able to net KOs on various different Pokemon. Finally, you may want to consider running 172 HP/ 168 Atk/ 168 Spe on Golurk, allowing it to outspeed opposing Golurk while still allowing it to hit very hard off of its 124 base Atk and giving it a bit of extra bulk to help out against Skuntank.
  5. ium

    ium dein haar riecht gut
    is an official Team Rateris a Forum Moderatoris an Artist Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus
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    snover / subsplit rotom-f / alomomola / skuntank / choice scarf emboar / golurk

    i think friar brought up something a little interesting about "swapping" rotom-f and emboar's roles. having choice scarf rotom-f would be a nice extra check to charizard and swanna should you face weather teams while also checking something like +2 carracosta or gorebyss much better. volt switch is great as always while trick can dump a choice scarf on very common switch-ins such as regice and piloswine to make your time much easier. on the other hand, instead of using choice band, substitute + three special attacks emboar would be another interesting wallbreaker that benefits greatly from alomomola's wish. it lures in stuff like opposing alomomola, carracosta, and some rock-types which is neat.

    finally, something you could think about is a jolly nature on skuntank since offensive variants of gardevoir do have a chance at 2HKOing skuntank and troubling the rest of your team, but the loss in power is a bit of a nuisance so i don't know how you feel about that.

    summary:
    snover / choice scarf subsplit rotom-f / alomomola / jolly adamant* skuntank / sub special choice scarf emboar / golurk
    * optional

    this is obviously a great team; i'm just doing really minor changes that are only for testing out since your current sets fit your team well enough as is. it's a shame you are incredibly weak to the loch ness monster; i'm afraid even i can't help you against that! :toast:
  6. ebeast

    ebeast she's probably sexting nprtprt
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    @morningsun
    Thanks for the rate, but Substitute just chips away at Snover's health even further and not being able to hurt Ludicolo is a very very big deal. Snover's ability to beat Ludicolo is one of the few things it actually has going for it and SubSeed in general is not a very effective strategy.

    My Emboar does not have Reckless because it is Boar's Dream World ability and is Unreleased. Your EV spread on Golurk only has a few more points in HP from my spread and the Speed EVs on your set don't really accomplish anything. My spread already speed creeps the standard Golurk which runs 84 Speed.

    @Friar
    Thanks for the rate. My main beef with changing over Rotom-F and Emboar's roles is that it makes my team weaker to Alomomola as it can easily just scout Rotom-F and switch into something appropriate. Rotom-F is much weaker without a Life Orb so my main force of Offense would have to come from CB Boar who isn't very fast. Scarf Emboar outspeeds and takes down Zangoose and Cinccino just as effectively as Scarf Rotom-F, although it does in fact fail to outspeed Swellow. It's kind of a matter of preference, but I'll give changing their roles a try too. I think that if I decide to stick with LO Rotom-F and Scarf Boar I should definitely go with Giga Drain Snover to beat Gorebyss. What do other people think about this?

    EDIT: @ium
    Thanks for the rate, cutie. Ah adding in Special Boar, now that sounds like a fun idea! I definitely find it more comfortable that if I'm going to use Scarf Rotom-F I go with Special Boar rather than Physical since I'm not boned nearly as much by Alomomola. Much thanks for the interesting suggestion! I think I'll go with Giga Drain Snover anyways too to have another check to Gorebyss.

    PS: I need to stop giving that god damn loch ness monster tree fiddy. :|
  7. FLCL

    FLCL
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    friar and ium already covered the fact that the role switch between rotom-f and emboar would be better in order to cover subsmash gorebyss better. opposing hail teams carrying sub protect glaceon could be troublesome for you to face since rotom-f will eventually kill itself with life orb recoil and can't pain split if glaceon is under a sub while everything else can be stalled out or hit extremely hard. you might want to look into a mixed defensive alomomola with max def and spdef, but that certainly cuts into your ability to wall stuff like cb sawk and normal-types. in any case, special emboar is definitely the better choice between the two. i don't think giga drain on snover will fix this team's gorebyss weakness since it is easily worn down by hazards.
  8. WhiteDMist

    WhiteDMist PU! We don't stink though!
    is a Community Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Team Rater Alumnus

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    Hey EBeast! This is another excellent team from you (third Hail RMT this round is the charm). Like all the raters before me have said, I feel that switching the roles of Emboar and Rotom-F is an agreeable idea, especially the Special Emboar. This gives your team much appreciated Speed (stuff like Scarf Cinccino and Haunter can be annoying, but at least they can also be worked around) and a check to Gorebyss. Emboar would be able to take care of many Special walls that trouble Rotom-F with the drop in power.

    With that settled, I actually feel that you can keep Blizzard on Snover, since Rotom-F is able to handle Gorebyss pretty well. If you are really afraid of SubSmash Gorebyss getting a Sub up, feel free to (though Alomomola is still set up bait for it then). As for the Loch Ness monster (wtf is that? Carracosta?), you'll need to have a Sub up but you can probably beat it.

    Other than repeating what everyone else said, I have nothing much to add, though having 180 Speed EVs on Golurk will help to outpace standard Garbodor. You still have enough bulk to take Skuntank's Sucker Punch, and you can't live LO Jolly Absol's Sucker Punch even with your current bulk. Stopping Garbodor from setting up Spikes easily will help maintain your team's longevity since 2/3 of your team takes damage from your own Hail, along with other residual damage (though Emboar no longer fears Rocky Helmet mons).

    Changes:

    Special Emboar
    Scarf Rotom-F
    180 Spe Golurk

    Great team EBeast!! As a present for you, you get a Luvdisc! Merry Christmas to you!!
  9. ebeast

    ebeast she's probably sexting nprtprt
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    Thanks for the rate FLCL. I'm definitely going with the Scarf Rotom-F & Special Boar change, thanks for the suggestion guys. Mixed Defensive Alomomola could work, however I really rely on it a lot against physical attackers that I don't think I should tweak around its EVs. Giga Drain won't completely fix my Gorebyss weakness, but I think it would be a lot better than not being able to do anything to a SubSmash Byss at all with Snover.

    Anyways I updated the RMT with the suggestions! Thanks again guys and Happy Holidays!

    EDIT: I take too long to respond to these.

    @WhiteDMist

    Thanks for the rate! :) Ok the extra Speed on Golurk to outspeed Garbodor sounds great. I think someone suggested the same thing, but they didn't mention Garbodor as the speed creeping target or I would have taken it. Making that change now!

    Oh and WhiteD, about that loch ness monster:
    [youtube]9cn7xfBpZ3M[/youtube]

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