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Goodra [QC 2/3]

Discussion in 'Locked / Outdated Analyses' started by darkie, Dec 17, 2013.

  1. darkie

    darkie mfw i see alison brie
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    Overview
    ########
    Goodra is a surprising addition to the crop of 600 BST pseudo-legendary Dragon-types. Unlike prior entries to this group, Goodra is not at all offensively focused, instead boasting a tremendous Special Defense stat with usable offenses and disappointing physical bulk. Despite her special bulk, however, Goodra lacks reliable recovery, which means she often compares negatively to another defensive Dragon-type: Latias. Unlike Latias, though, Goodra's lack of Ghost and Dark-type weaknesses means she can switch in and out with relative ease. Combined with a good movepool, decent offensive stats, and the many resistances afforded by her mono Dragon-typing, Goodra is a prime candidate for an Assault Vest. Goodra is not an uncommon sight as a bulky pivot on offensive teams and can also make use of Hydration on rain teams.


    Assault Vest Tank
    ########
    name: Assault Vest Tank
    move 1: Draco Meteor
    move 2: Fire Blast
    move 3: Thunderbolt / Earthquake
    move 4: Dragon Tail / Earthquake
    ability: Sap Sipper / Gooey
    item: Assault Vest
    nature: Quiet / Modest
    evs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 SpD

    Moves
    ========
    Draco Meteor is a mainstay on this set, being Goodra's strongest attack. With Draco Meteor at hand and an Assault Vest equipped, Goodra can survive any offensive Dragon-type's (for example, Latios) Draco Meteor in OU and OHKO back with a Draco Meteor of her own. Fire Blast gives the best neutral coverage alongside Draco Meteor and is chosen over Flamethrower for the amount of damage it can do. With Goodra's Special Attack, she needs all the help she can get to do damage and Fire Blast with outdamage the latter over time. Fire Blast hits Ferrothorn, Scizor, and other Steel-types that are littered throughout OU. Thunderbolt will hit Azumarill, immune to Draco Meteor, hard, as well as any other Electric-weak types who might consider switching in to or setting up on Goodra, such as Gyarados. Finally, the last slot is Dragon Tail, which gives Goodra utility as a phazer while doing some serious damage in the process, coming off a decent base 100 Attack. Earthquake is an excellent option that can go over either of the last two slots; without it, Heatran walls the entire set and can Toxic Goodra. With Earthquake, however, Goodra can easily 2HKO an unsuspecting Heatran.

    Sludge Bomb is another option that can fit over Thunderbolt. Together, Fire Blast and Thunderbolt will hit any Fairy-type who mighOt consider switching into Goodra at least neutrally. Sludge Bomb is an option to hit those Fairy-types as well, and has good utility with its 30% chance to poison, but Thunderbolt is otherwise more useful.

    Set Details
    ========
    The EVs on this set are relatively straight-forward. 248 HP gives Goodra the best defensive capability (while keeping HP odd), and max Special Attack allows her to function as a tank by being able to dish out a ton of damage. Choosing a Quiet nature reinforces this by ensuring Goodra does the most damage with all of her attacks, both special and physical. On the other hand, a Modest nature can also be chosen so eliminate the speed drop of Quiet. This allows Goodra to outspeed a few threats that sit in between, such as minimum speed Mega Scizor and Heatran. For slightly more defense and slightly less offense, Sassy and Calm can be picked instead.

    Sap sipper gives Goodra an immunity, which is extremely welcome on a pokemon with no recovery, and allows her to come in unscathed on a predicted grass attack. Sap Sipper also makes her immune to Spore, Stun and Sleep Powder, and Leech Seed, all the while powering up Earthquake and Dragon Tail.

    While Gooey can be quite useful to potentially turn the tide of the battle to your favor, the main downside of it is that in order to activate it, Goodra has to take a contact hit. Since most contact hits are physical (with few exceptions), letting Goodra take those hits in order to activate Gooey will drastically decrease her lifespan.
    That said, it can be helpful to switch in on random resisted contact hits or as a last-ditch effort to stop an opponent's sweep.

    Usage Tips
    ========
    Goodra makes a good pivot on offensive teams. Thanks to her many resistances, she can work well as a "glue Pokemon" who can really help pull a team together and lead to game-winning double switches.

    Liberal usage of Dragon Tail is also useful for inflicting chip damage (which can be quite considerable with Goodra's decent base Attack) while spreading around hazard damage.


    Team Options
    ========
    Goodra likes to switch in and out a lot, especially with Draco Meteor's attack drop, so teammates who can Rapid Spin or Defog are very appreciated. Wish support is also useful because of Goodra's complete lack of reliable recovery.

    Goodra has good defensive synergy with Heatran, who resists all of her weaknesses and together with Goodra forms a solid special defensive core. As a physically defensive partner, Scizor also works with Goodra, resisting Ice, Fairy, and Dragon.

    Because of Goodra's low physical defense, she works well with teammates who can burn potential physical threats, such as Rotom-W. Rotom-W also covers Goodra's Ice weakness, who in turn covers Rotom-W's Grass weakness (particularly Goodra with Sap Sipper).


    Specs
    ########
    name: All-Out Offense
    move 1: Draco Meteor
    move 2: Fire Blast
    move 3: Thunderbolt
    move 4: Focus Blast
    ability: Gooey / Sap Sipper
    item: Choice Specs
    nature: Modest
    evs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 SpD

    Moves
    ========
    The given moves are Goodra's best and most powerful attacks. With 3 of the 4 moves boasting a BP of 110 and higher, Goodra has the capability to deal a lot of damage while tanking the opponent's hits.

    Set Details
    ========
    248 EVs give Goodra's maximum odd HP to avoid the odd scenario where Goodra could faint just by switching into hazards a number of times.

    Since this Goodra does not carry a physical move, Gooey is preferred over Sap Sipper, but Sap Sipper's ability to make Goodra immune to Grass (and thereby, most sleep moves) is still very useful.


    Usage Tips
    ========
    While the AV set can sometimes hang around and take some hits while dishing a fair amount of damage, the Specs set prefers to switch in and out a lot more, while dealing a lot of damage in the process. Ideally, switch in on a resisted hit and then hit back with an extremely strong, Specs-boosted attack. With Gooey, switching in on a resisted physical attack could even lead Goodra to outspeeding the opponent on that next turn.

    Team Options
    ========
    Specs Goodra works well on an offensively minded or bulky offense team. For this reason, Heatran and Rotom-W are both good teammates. Scizor offers the ability to lure Fire-type attacks for Goodra to switch into. Rotom-W does the same with Grass-type attacks, and other Pokemon, such as Talonflame can do the same with Water and Electric-type attacks.


    Other Options
    ########
    Goodra has access to strong physical moves such as Outrage, Power Whip, and Aqua Tail. Thanks to her high Special Defense, Goodra can be quite hard to penetrate after a few Curses, making a physical set possible using some of the aforementioned moves (along with Earthquake).

    Goodra's lack of recovery can be slightly remedied by utilizing Rest and Sleep Talk. A CroCune-like set could be used with Rest, Sleep Talk, Curse, and a physical STAB move such as Dragon Tail or Outrage.

    Acid Armor can be used to boost Goodra's mediocre physical defense.


    Checks & Counters
    ########

    **Fast Physical Attackers**: Anything with strong physical attacks can check Goodra, particularly if they are faster and super effective. Examples include Garchomp, Mega Charizard X, Dragonite, Salamence, Zygarde, Mega Pinsir, and physical Kyurem-B. Bisharp is also a great choice, especially because Gooey will effectively give it a free Swords Dance.


    **Specially Bulky Physical Attackers**: Physical attacking special tanks are nearly perfect counters for Goodra. The most prominent of these is Assault Vest Conkeldurr who is 4HKOed by Goodra at most and can then heal itself back up with powerful Drain Punches. (Mega) Tyranitar is another good option who is 3-4HKOed by Earthquake and 2HKOes back with Stone Edge or Crunch.


    **Specially Bulky Stall Pokemon**: Examples include Fairy-types such as Florges, Togekiss, and Clefable, as well as common stall Pokemon like Chansey, Mega Venusaur, and Heatran. All of these Pokemon take little damage from Goodra and can proceed to cripple her with Toxic and paralysis and wear her down with super effective Fairy-type attacks.

    **Hazards and status**: With a lack of reliable recovery, Goodra despises damage inducing status effects such as toxic poison and burn; with her proclivity to switching in and out, Goodra also detests Stealth Rock and Spikes.
    Last edited: Apr 28, 2014
  2. G Royal

    G Royal

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    I use Rain/Rest Goodra, works great as another status absorber for my team and is a perfect switch into Rotom-w if you suspect a hydro pump, wow etc.
    I use a bulky stall set up so I can tank special hits and some physical ones
    252 hp, 252 sp def, 4 sp atk with a calm nature and a damp rock and hydration
    Thunder, Dragon Pulse, Rain Dance, Rest
    Thunder is preferred over tbolt since I'll be abusing rain and it also does hard hitting SE dmg on most mons that will also try to abuse the rain I'm setting up, D-Pulse for stab and provide pretty solid coverage against mons, only ones that I can think of of the top of my head that resist both are ferrothorn, excadrill, magnezone although excadrill and ferro are the only note worthy threats to this set.

    Ferro, excadrill well any steel mon appreciates this goodra as a partner as the rain support halves the SE fire hits they'll be taking, which makes filter on mega aggron even more impressive if it's partnered with goodra.
  3. Colonel M

    Colonel M I don't suck it's my team that sucks!
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    More OO material but it learns Acid Armor through breeding. Pretty much have to go through Muk -> Gastrodon -> Dragalge -> Goodra (wtflol). At least worth a mention since its Def is a weak stat.
  4. alexwolf

    alexwolf Rain Summoner
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    There is no reason to have two attacking sets. The first two sets are really similar and their only difference is an item and a move, so they can easily be merged. The natures you should have slashed are Quiet / Modest with Sassy in AC if using Assault Vest. This is how the set should be:

    name: Assault Vest Tank
    move 1: Draco Meteor
    move 2: Fire Blast
    move 3: Thunderbolt / Sludge Bomb
    move 4: Dragon Tail / Focus Blast
    ability: Sap Sipper / Gooey
    item: Assault Vest / Choice Specs / Leftovers
    nature: Quiet / Modest
    evs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 SpD

    Choose any two items out of the three i slashed, i don't really have a problem, and mention the other one in AC. Flamethrower goes to AC as well.
  5. darkie

    darkie mfw i see alison brie
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    i'm skeptical on having them merged into one set because i hate having too many slash, though admittedly the way you have it laid out is much more appealing than the slash-fest that appeared in goodra's preview. i will think on this. i think the new analysis format does not mind having a longer analysis because users can just click to the set that is relevant to their interests.
    Hollywood likes this.
  6. BurningMan

    BurningMan fueled by beer

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    Given that Goodra is an excellent Rotom-W switch-in i would at least mention somewhere that you can outspeed minimum spe Rotom-W with just 52 Spe EVs so you can hit it with Draco Meteor before it Volt-Switches out for free.
    Hibiki likes this.
  7. CoolStoryBrobat

    CoolStoryBrobat The hero Smogon needs, but not the one it deserves
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    Would a physical or physically-based mixed set ever be worth it? It's got a usable movepool, and Sap Sipper to boost Attack with. Outrage, Power Whip, Earthquake, and a workable base 100 Atk stat. At the very least I would probably mention Earthquake on set options as a viable alternative to one of its slashes on the offensive set since from my experience this Pokemon attracts Heatran very easily, who walls it without that move (At the very least it's more reliable than Focus Blast)
  8. Scoopapa

    Scoopapa
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    Is there any sense in including the Curse/Outrage/Sleep Talk/Rest set? I know running a monoattacker when your STAB has immunities against it is always going to raise some eyebrows, but it has a lot going for it otherwise. Leech Seed immunity and epic SpD are mostly what I'm thinking of, and in my experience you can pivot with it by threatening to setup midgame. The fact that you need a fairy lure does make it eccentric i guess but I figured I'd throw it out there for consideration.
    Doughboy likes this.
  9. Namso

    Namso
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    darkie

    Still working on this? 24 hours to respond.
  10. darkie

    darkie mfw i see alison brie
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    yeah I'm basically done with the skeleton locally. just need to finish up the checks/counters and copy paste into the OP.
  11. alexwolf

    alexwolf Rain Summoner
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    I think that a Rest / Dragon Pulse / Thunder / Toxic set should become a main set, with max HP and max SpD. It's a superb special wall that hits deceptively hard, can stall out for forever with Toxic + Rest, and has great synergy with Politoed. It's a great Pokemon to use in rain teams in general, and it could even go with LO + Rest + 3 attacks, but that's a different set all together.
    Johnny Rage likes this.
  12. Jukain

    Jukain fuck macle
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    Supporting the above, absolutely.
  13. TheWhitestLotus

    TheWhitestLotus

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    Might be worth mentioning that Goodra is a decent Curse user. Something like this:
    Goodra @ Leftovers
    Careful, Sap Sipper
    EVS: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
    Moves: Curse, Dragon Tail, Earthquake, Aqua Tail

    up to you. My buddy has had a lot of success with it. If you get some entry hazards set up it can be pretty hard to beat.
  14. darkie

    darkie mfw i see alison brie
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    Jukain alexwolf

    what kind of EVs have you guys used on the rain stall set?
  15. Adamant Zoroark

    Adamant Zoroark formerly LucaroarkZ

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    Goodra learns Sludge Wave, which is essentially superior to Sludge Bomb excluding Sludge Bomb's higher chance to poison, which, in my opinion, should not be considered (ESPECIALLY considering it's just regular Poison instead of badly Poison, and regular Poison is a relatively sucky status in comparison to Burn/Paralysis/etc. I don't want to get regular Poison on something I want burned or paralyzed) When you have an additional 5 Base Power with no real drawbacks, you have no reason not to use the move. Ergo, wherever Sludge Bomb is slashed/mentioned, Sludge Wave should replace it.
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2014
  16. Agent Gibbs

    Agent Gibbs

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    Having an extra 1/8 passive damage every turn is very helpful since it effectively reverses Leftovers and wears down many Pokemon when combined with hazard damage and other possible forms of passive damage (Life Orb recoil, weather damage, etc.). No one ever made a big deal about using Surf over Scald on bulky Water-types to avoid unwanted burns, even though many of the best Water resists of last generations (such as Latias and Rotom-W) couldn't care less about the Atk drop. Regardless of the fact that the 1/8 passive damage was the only way it hurt them, these specially-based Water resists still hated switching into Scald because that burn damage cut into their longevity, and that hasn't really changed. That extra poison damage helps against pretty much everything, and I have honestly rarely ever been in a situation where I was kicking myself over a Sludge Bomb poison because I absolutely needed to hit the opponent with a different status.
  17. alexwolf

    alexwolf Rain Summoner
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    I have been using this set:

    Hydration Wall
    ########
    name: Hydration Wall
    move 1: Dragon Pulse
    move 2: Thunder
    move 3: Rest
    move 4: Toxic
    ability: Hydration
    item: Leftovers
    nature: Calm
    evs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD

    Dragon Tail and Rain Dance could be slashed somewhere there, not sure.
  18. darkie

    darkie mfw i see alison brie
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    cool I'll try it out
  19. DestinyGallade

    DestinyGallade

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    i think you should be a bit more specific on goodras pros and cons and such in the overview, its very bland atm, i think maybe you should put dragon pulse as a slash for Draco meteor in the assault tank set
  20. Punchshroom

    Punchshroom para is worse than sleep
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    Yeah this was more or less what I had in mind when I thought of Goodra in my Rain Wallbreaking Dragonite analysis. Perhaps darkie could make a point on Nite and Goodra clashing on Rain teams? I dunno.
  21. Namso

    Namso
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    darkie

    Let me know if you can't finish this.
  22. darkie

    darkie mfw i see alison brie
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    actually I need a QC check
  23. Namso

    Namso
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    Would've helped if you changed the title and tag. :)
  24. darkie

    darkie mfw i see alison brie
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    heh I was literally about to do that once I got to class (and I'm in class now).
  25. mikelos

    mikelos

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    try a physically offensive sap sipper set

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