KONY 2012

[vonFiedler]

Who the hell is being peer pressured over the internet? Seriously think before you keep calling people sheep.

Yeah there is a video. Yeah there is criticism of it. Debate doesn't stop there. It'd be convenient if it did because then you don't have to feel bad about not doing anything. It'd be convenient if everyone who saw the video immediately bought into it without looking up the facts. It'd be convenient if you could rationalize IC into some evil organization. It'd be convenient if you can pretend that slacktivism, slight good applied by a massive amount of people, was no good at all. That's where real ignorance comes from; rationalization your existing worldview. Do something inconvenient, look at the responses to criticism from IC and other experts instead of just repeating what you heard on reddit.

 

[waterwarrior]

Id also like to say that, due to all this information, it's really quickly turning into one if these (except with a valid point):
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dihydrogen_monoxide_hoax

Unfortunately can't link to Penn and Teller doing it due to my iPhone being a dick, but you get the idea.

People are always swept up by new, radical things, even if it's really old news. It's just human nature, and this whole thing is no different. If it sounds bad, and is backed up by a few 'facts,' which may or may not be true (or they're half-truths), people will get worried about it and act up. Slacktivism is actually hurting here. What will the US gain from sending thousands of troops to Africa (they don't even know what country Kony is in, remember), to have them search for months or years, then what? Pull the trigger on his child soldiers?

 

[vonFiedler]

Look guys, I was moved by the video when I saw it on Smogon sure, but immediately you started linking articles criticizing IC. And I don't trust every charity or activist group, so I read them. The fact of the matter is your arguments are either addressed in the video or by IC. They have already counterattacked and I see no one addressing that yet, probably because the people who have used reddit to rationalize their apathy are already self-satisfied. Now there are a ton of charitable causes in the world and no one has the time and money to devote to all of them, so it's entirely in a person's rights to say "I just don't think this is the best use of my efforts", but when you call people sheep or spread labels like slacktivism it only reveals you as a person who really doesn't fucking care about people coming together to try and accomplish something. This isn't even a mindlessly inane one day thing like the changing your facebook pic, this is exactly the sort of thing we were trying to protect when we organized the same way to stop SOPA.

 

[iDunno]

To be honest, I don't think this problem can be fixed through charity beyond what we already do. These people need much more than food and water. It would require extensive military intervention in order to both take down the corrupt leadership AND rebuild the government - ESPECIALLY since there are so little resources to capitalize on in order to sustain a prolonged military habitation of the area. Furthermore, World War 3 is poking it's nose around the corner and the world economy is threatening collapse, so I think the first world governments are a bit busy at the moment, regardless. They might send in secret agents into the area in order to infiltrate the system, but that's all I can really see happening right now. I mean, the guy DOES have like a million child hostages if I'm correct...

 

[az]

just had to delete a ton of posts and infract

keep it on topic, but more importantly keep it respectful

 

[moot]

invisible.tumblr.com/post/18929372614/thank-you-for-reading-this-and-doing-further

IC retorts

 

[Codraroll]

Okay, I get that the organization is apparently a little dubious, if you want to put it that way.

Still doesn't change the problem. It's not like they've found a random bad guy in Africa to target for their own profit, Joseph Kony made the "Top 10 most wanted" list for a reason (currently sitting at #9). He is indicted for war crimes by the guys at the Hague. I agree that the approach of the campaign is a little sketchy, but the aim still is no less valid: Bringing an end to the atrocities in Uganda/Congo/Sudan by going for the roots of the LRA. Kony is the face of the LRA, he's easy to "sell", but focus on him means focus on the problem as well. The campaign hopes to raise awareness above all things.

An intervention would probably mean the death of children soldiers. Not intervening would certainly mean the death of children soldiers. It's only a matter of who kills who. Imagine your basement being slowly filled with sewage because of a clogged pipe: If you want to fix it, you will have to get your hands dirty. On the other hand, letting the problem continue, and perhaps learning to live with the increasing smell, will let you live on with spotless hands.

It's problematic to approach the Ugandan politicians, partly because Kony doesn't stay within the borders of any one country, and Congolese and Sudanese military doesn't like Ugandan military intervening on their ground, partly because of widespread corruption. The LRA probably have a couple of well-paid moles in the local governments. At least the US is a common ally that can coordinate operations in the afflicted countries, and give aid to the local military whenever needed. Particularly things like raw intelligence data, which for instance Congo might be reluctant to share with Uganda, and vice versa. If those data are analyzed by American advisors before being sent over the borders, the countries won't have to give away more than they need to, while the recipient gets the info they need to move more efficiently.

All in all, good idea, mediocre execution, stupid public whining about the details.

 

[Darkaxis]

people are misinformed
people are succumbing to peer pressure
people are crawling all over KONY 2012 like a herd of sheep

Truer words have never been spoken.

People are always swept up by new, radical things, even if it's really old news. It's just Society, and this whole thing is no different. If it sounds bad, and is backed up by a few 'facts,' which may or may not be true (or they're half-truths), people will get worried about it and act up.

Fixed it for you. And anyways it's getting kind of annoying with all the people posting about it on Facebook. I mean, yeah I posted the video, but holy shit people are updating their statuses every single minute. As it was mentioned several times in the thread propaganda can do so much, but it helps mainly because you can't grab a weapon get on a plane to Uganda or whatever country Kony is and hunt him down.

 

[Neonian]

Okay, I get that the organization is apparently a little dubious, if you want to put it that way.

Still doesn't change the problem. It's not like they've found a random bad guy in Africa to target for their own profit, Joseph Kony made the "Top 10 most wanted" list for a reason (currently sitting at #9). He is indicted for war crimes by the guys at the Hague. I agree that the approach of the campaign is a little sketchy, but the aim still is no less valid: Bringing an end to the atrocities in Uganda/Congo/Sudan by going for the roots of the LRA. Kony is the face of the LRA, he's easy to "sell", but focus on him means focus on the problem as well. The campaign hopes to raise awareness above all things.

An intervention would probably mean the death of children soldiers. Not intervening would certainly mean the death of children soldiers. It's only a matter of who kills who. Imagine your basement being slowly filled with sewage because of a clogged pipe: If you want to fix it, you will have to get your hands dirty. On the other hand, letting the problem continue, and perhaps learning to live with the increasing smell, will let you live on with spotless hands.

It's problematic to approach the Ugandan politicians, partly because Kony doesn't stay within the borders of any one country, and Congolese and Sudanese military doesn't like Ugandan military intervening on their ground, partly because of widespread corruption. The LRA probably have a couple of well-paid moles in the local governments. At least the US is a common ally that can coordinate operations in the afflicted countries, and give aid to the local military whenever needed. Particularly things like raw intelligence data, which for instance Congo might be reluctant to share with Uganda, and vice versa. If those data are analyzed by American advisors before being sent over the borders, the countries won't have to give away more than they need to, while the recipient gets the info they need to move more efficiently.

All in all, good idea, mediocre execution, stupid public whining about the details.

I agree with this sentiment. I don't support Kony 2012 directly but I most certainly support their campaign against Kony.

I don't get why people seem to think that Invisible children being a little shady somehow invalidates the fact that Kony is a bad man.

 

[Cartoons!]

So this is a hugely complicated issue, and I'm not sure throwing military at the problem wouldn't exacerbate the problem. There are non-Rambo alternatives we can all participate in, though, which involve empowering grassroot Ugandan organizations.

No one knows the situation better than the people directly affected, and no one is more motivated to affect the wisest courses of action too. Before you advocate responses that would likely lead to greater bloodshed and suffering, please consider supporting people on the field who are already making a real difference despite the lack of press.

Concerned Parents Association
as the name would imply, formed by parents affected by LRA abductions.

Concerned Children & Youth Association
seems easier to donate to

Art For Children Uganda
a children's support group

Mind you these organizations are based in Uganda, though the scope of the problem is much larger. The method may be slower, and don't lead to Kony's head on a platter, but I think the long term results would be more fruitful. I'll be making regular donations starting today.

 

[X5Dragon]

Am I the only one sick about seeing this everywhere I surf on the net? I knew about the LRA before most of these advertisers knew where to point out Uganda, Sudan or any other African country.

It's sad when it takes a preppy youtube video to make you start caring about other people's miseries.

 

[Galladiator]

Saw this video last night at church. Extremely moving.

I understand that people might think IC is a bit shady; I myself think that there are better ways to go about bringing his crimes against humanity to light than walking around slapping posters on every vertical surface. This doesn't change the fact that Kony and all those like him have to be stopped, the sooner the better.

If somebody in, say, England or Germany or the US was abducting children to form a personal army, there would be an international media uproar. The guy would find himself on the wrong end of an electric chair within days. But since it's Africa, that apparently gives us an excuse to ignore it? People are people, regardless of where they live.

Again, I don't agree with IC's methods, but I do think something should be done.

 

[Zacchaeus]

there are more important issues than this, really can't believe how the media has blown up this seven-year-old problem so much (yea this nigga been taking kids for ages, there was a movie back in 2005 about it but i guess nobody watched it since twitter and facebook didn't exist in 2005)

This is my thought along with the fact that nobody actually cares enough to do anything other than go around saying "aww how sad" and post it all over their social networks to make people think that they're thoughtful

 

[Surgo]

This is my thought along with the fact that nobody actually cares enough to do anything other than go around saying "aww how sad" and post it all over their social networks to make people think that they're thoughtful

Then please inform us how to actually do something about it.

 

[Seneschal]

This is my thought along with the fact that nobody actually cares enough to do anything other than go around saying "aww how sad" and post it all over their social networks to make people think that they're thoughtful

This is cynicism for the sake of cynicism. If you'd bothered to watch the video, you'd know that the point of raising awareness was to show the people who actually could do something about the problem to actually do something about it. The people who made the video weren't reaching out to ordinary joes in order to say 'Hey, what are you doing sitting on your ass when you could be taking a plane to Africa and shooting this guy', they were simply trying to get them to demonstrate that they were interested and thus show decision makers that people do care about this issue, care about it enough to show some small token of their support. In some ways the campaign is as much about the principle of using social media to generate action as it is about Kony himself, as explained in the video (which also clarified that Kony was no longer in Uganda, a point most people seem to have ignored in lambasting the video. The reason they continue to support the Ugandan army is explained on their website).

Now, I'm glad that not everyone has taken the video or the charity at face value. Even though I was quite moved by the video, I was slightly disturbed by some of its manipulation techniques (using your infant son as a sort of moral arbiter is ridiculously manipulative; I shouldn't really need to explain why, but if you do want a summary then there's a good one in the #1 entry here: http://www.cracked.com/article_18680_political-cartoons-lowest-form-communication_p2.html.)
It's certainly important to question the efficiency of such charities, too. After all, we don't want our donations to go to waste, which is a notorious problem regarding charities who principally work in Africa, e.g. Live Aid. However, people seem to think that now the charity has been cast by some in a dubious light, it's somehow OK to deride all the people who cared enough to raise awareness of the issue, as if somehow showing that you care is worthy of scorn. It's disheartening to say the least.

 

[vonFiedler]

it's somehow OK to deride all the people who cared enough to raise awareness of the issue, as if somehow showing that you care is worthy of scorn. It's disheartening to say the least.

This.

I've been seeing Kony 2012 in the top youtube comments all day and it's a damn welcome replacement to "arrow to the knee". There's certainly something to be said about feeling the need to complain about a viral campaign working exactly as planned, but I probably already escaped one infraction today so I'll leave it at that.

 

[xenu]

raising awareness should be a tool, not a strategy in and of itself.

 

[az]

it is a strategy because america is a democracy -- getting something in an issue in the minds of the majority of voters makes it in a nation's interest to act

the tool is in itself a strategy

 

[Headpunch]

I would like to address Senschal's comment about how sad it is that scorn is shown towards those who cared enough to spread awareness. I think we agree that it is unhelpful to display contempt to those you are debating and does nothing to further communication and understanding, but for those scorning the scorners- realize that their feelings are completely understandable.

If you are an American youth who supports U.S. intervention in world affairs and can't identify the country you want to force your neighbor's husband, wife, son, daughter, paycheck or any combination of the above to on a world map, you have some learning to do. Many of these people can't show you Afghanistan on a world map (http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2002/11/1120_021120_GeoRoperSurvey.html), what hope do they have of finding Uganda? Geography is the most basic knowledge you can have about a culture's history, and there are a whole host of other, more relevant, facts beyond that! If it is so great to have the public involved in foreign policy, I think the public then should at least have enough information about affairs in the target area to think critically about it and contribute to a solution instead of swallowing whatever someone tells them is best. Here, scorn is held for those who betray their good intentions with their apathy for understanding. If you did your research and believe IC is the best venue for providing support and advocacy, we disagree, but I respect your informed stance.

Something else that is shameful is how easily people are made to hate a man based solely on one other man's word (video). Before they saw the video, many viewers had never heard the name and now they talk about assassinating him? These are serious accusations that need verification, and while you're at it, find out what's going on and why he does what he does! The Kony 2012 video essentially contains the plot to a superhero cartoon where the bad guy is bad because he likes to be bad, and the good guy is the incorruptible saviour of the helpless.

Finally, there is no excuse left for those who attempt to discredit/disregard actual Ugandans speaking out in protest of the Kony 2012 video. One young lady was audacious enough to suggest that those protestors were not affected very much by Kony and so don't know the real story, so blinded was she by IC's 30-minute brainwash. Please watch this video to understand the feelings of people closer to the conflict: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=KLVY5jBnD-E#!

Remember: Awareness is not necessarily a good thing if it leads to uninformed action and destructive policy.

 

[Eos]

Stop Kony

Seriously though, the documentary was very inspirational. However, only 34% of the donations go to the cause and, as stated before, this has been going on for years. Why has this one viral video sparked all this media? It's because videos like this are easy to pass around, and once they pick up, they're like wildfire. Most people don't investigate anything, and just listen to that one source. This leads to false hope for something that won't get as much help as most people think.
Just my two cents.

edit: after just researching it more: yeah its all bs lol

 

[Badal]

I think KONY 2012 not only aims at bringing down someone as bad as Kony, but also is a huge push to showing how the new world, the 21st century, with all our technology and stuff, is still a world where change occurs, where people care. And thanks to our technology, people act. This is an important message to the whole world about the power of the internet. 76 million views, in a week. It is popular in pretty much every country. It would be really sad, and would be an extreme disappointment if this just fizzles out and nobody cares about it in a few months.

If Kony is brought to justice, not only will the world be a better place, it will be a place where the true power and reach of a medium such as the Internet is shown to the world. The youth will be the biggest vector in this process.

That's my 2 cents.

 

[Alan]

If Kony is brought to justice, not only will the world be a better place, it will be a place where the true power and reach of a medium such as the Internet is shown to the world.

I am certain the world is well aware of the power of the internet, that's why they always try to censor and control it any way possible.

 

[Badal]

True, but it is not seen as a medium of revolution (or wasn't until the egypt, etc revolutions). And it is interesting to see it be used both as a recreational, entertainment based service and as a medium to make a social change.

 

[iDunno]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2116184/Kony-2012-video-director-Jason-Russell-arrested-drunk-performing-sex-act-public.html

 

[Badal]

Their response

I really see no logical explanation for this. There was too much stress, so he decided to run around naked and masturbate? The campaign will loose a lot of its support this way.