Spinda there are so many of them
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- Thread starter dhelmise
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chatot cause we can both say the f slur
Unfortunately woke gamefreak stopped that in gen 6.
We can no longer put chemicals in the water to make our Politoeds gay anymore.
while this works for some religions that don't really have any explicit text of DON'T BE GAY, there are some where being homophobic is literally enshrined in the holy text, making it difficult for those who subscribe to that religion to really reconcile with not being homophobic when god himself tells them that being homophobic is Okay and Accepted, actually. theoretically, religious people shouldn't tell others/force their rules on others, but sometimes, a combination of being an Asshole and subscribing to said religion culiminates in a person that will in fact use religion to be homophobic— and in the eyes of their fellows they're the ones who are actually closely following the religion better than those who aren't homophobic.
i think i agree with you that it doesn't inherently make you homophobic, but some definitely teach you that homophobia's the way to go, and the thing about religion is that you can't question religion...
I am from a rather conservative, serbian-orthodox family and my parents were always very accepting of LGBT. My mother was friends with a transwoman in the 90s, when acceptance was much further behind than today, and when a relative of us came out as gay couple of years ago, they didn't really bat an eye
But yeah I've also met many homo/transphobic people who root their phobia in religion. Albeit, I've also met atheists who root their phobias on wanting to preserve conservative values, so idk
But yeah I've also met many homo/transphobic people who root their phobia in religion. Albeit, I've also met atheists who root their phobias on wanting to preserve conservative values, so idk
While this concept works on paper, in practice there are tons of mandates in every religious text that literally nobody follows. So the choice to cherrypick the ones that say "don't be gay" and ignore the ones that say "don't work on Sundays" or "don't mix fabrics" or "give all your shit away to the poor and wander the world spreading the word" or "don't judge other people you dipshits" has to be motivated by something external to the religion. As I said, religion can be a vehicle to bigotry, but it isn't the driving factor.
I wouldn't know anything about it in other religions, because i've only ever experienced it in mine. Im agreeable to your opinion though. it's just from personal experience, most of the people i know who are homophobic base it off the text. It's not even justification, they literally only hate gay people because of the text. Like, without it, they have mentioned that they wouldn't be homophobic. So I think I was reffering to something else.
For people in my community, they've always cherrypicked religion based on the fact that they would get arrested if they followed all the rules. I know deep down they wouldn't actually want to do it, either, but the justification for the cherry-picking, I've always heard stated as 'oh, I would do it, but I would get arrested by internal security' and from private conversations I've had with em, there's always an underlying sentiment of 'I'm quite jealous of the people who get to practice everything in the religion, etc. etc.'
I'm only really familiar with Abrahamic doctrines, my understanding of religions outside of that sphere is shaky at best, but I can quite confidently tell you there isn't a single Christian, Muslim, or Jew who follows their holy books literally to the word. It doesn't help that you can't follow a religious text to the word because in all cases some parts of it will contradict other parts of it. Thou shalt not kill but also sell your cloak and buy a sword and all that.
people always refer to the one part of the bible where it debatably says dont be gay, and ignore the part that says love thy neighbor, or he who is without sin, throw the first stone, or the part that says that sins will be forgiven. you know. the whole point of christianity. not to mention the fact that the new testament retconned half the stuff in the old testament. the bible doesn't teach homophobia, bad parenting and a lack of critical thinking do, they just use the bible as a half-assed excuse. also, the original bible is in a different language, one that i bet most people who quote the bible dont read. how do you know something wasnt mistranslated? god couldve just been saying ¨bro, dont be openly gay in 500BC, its a bad idea, people will kill you in cold blood because humans cant accept that some people are different, stay in the closet where some dumbass with a complex wont make up some stupid excuse for murder.¨
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This is ultimately my point. There are tons of things in the Bible that conservative evangelists ignore because it contradicts their worldview, so saying that the Bible says ”don’t be gay” is a really piss-poor excuse for homophobic rhetoric. Nobody is dying on the hill of mixing fabrics being a sin, so why are we choosing the part about not being gay?
A good few of my leftist friends were brought to their very left-leaning positions by their interpretations of the Bible, and it’s certainly something I can sympathize with. It’s not hard to imagine what someone who washed the feet of beggars and prostitutes, who fed the poor and healed the sick (for free by the way), who urged his followers to give all their worldly possessions to the needy and follow him to do charity work, and who showed contempt for those who use houses of worship as a way of making profit might think about some of his more conservative ostensible followers these days. “Jesus was a socialist” is kind of an overused meme in leftist circles, but he was undeniably a hell of a lot closer to one than he was to a Laissez-Faire capitalist.
I'm glad that the Bible can be interpreted that way. To be fair, I have a lot of issues with my religion, which might make me a bad candidate to be more open and accepting to religious queers (?), though I am trying to. For context, I am only familiar with the wonderful religion of Islam, the lovely so-called religion of peace. I understand many can reconcile with it and pick out the good parts, like many others do with other religions, but I have seen such severe anti-gay and trans rhetoric as well as other violent ideas all rooted in religion in my community that I find it hard to believe in said God myself.
Would you guys have any opinions on how I can learn to at least be more accepting or a bit more religion-blind?
Talking to lgbt and lgbt friendly religious members is a good way, and visiting friendly groups (churches, mosques etc) helps. I'm friendly with the rabbi of a jewish friend of mine whos a lesbian and hes been really kind into answering my questions and also is just really chill. I get invited sometimes to some events too since ive helped around the synagogue and the group size is pretty small
The bible states that homosexual people shall not be supported. Nowhere anyone says "hate them" or "insult them". Be peaceful os Also What bible stages in général. So i'm peaceful With you guys
Thanks, I guess? I mean I guess it's better than being openly hostile but I wouldn't pat yourself on the back for simply not being violent. That should be the expected norm.
you do realize thats still discrimination if we're under the assumption that heterosexual people are "supported" (which is very vague)
if you've felt discrimination for your ethnic and cultural background you should be able to empathize with lgbtq+ people, right? do you have any reason not to support us other than "the bible says so"? religion can be important to many people, but you shouldn't follow it blindly, as many religious leaders and groups use their power to direct oppression at marginalized groups, like those of other countries, races, sexualities, etc. i urge you to consider that!
I wonder how different this conversation would have been 150 years ago when verses like Ephasians 6:5 were being used to justify keeping Black people in slavery.
aw man cmon dont give them ideas
As a person whos father is a pastor, i feel like the bible on its own is not actually the problem with the correlation between Christians and being Homophobes as is just twisting messages in the bible and wrong interpretations. Just to start off with an interesting fact, the Old and New Testament iirc never mentions anything other than gay men in sexual acts, no passages on them loving each other romantically and on lesbian women. However, most of these "examples" are likely just wrong interpretations of something else that is much more serious (for example, the verses in Leviticus 18 and 20 that are basically "you as a man, shall not sleep with another man" is likely just a wrong interpretation of what is actually basically "you as a man shall not sleep with another man of your family" basically incest.) So there's nowhere in the bible where it states "you shall not support a gay person" or whatever, nor is there anywhere where they say to hate them.
More so i feel like the issue more so stems in the conservativeness of most christians. Also,
Kin+ak (✧∇✧) don't use christianity and the bible as an excuse to not support lgbt people. There is nowhere in the bible where it states that and saying “oh i don’t hate them but i cant support them” means nothing and is homophobia in my opinion.
More so i feel like the issue more so stems in the conservativeness of most christians. Also,
Kin+ak (✧∇✧) don't use christianity and the bible as an excuse to not support lgbt people. There is nowhere in the bible where it states that and saying “oh i don’t hate them but i cant support them” means nothing and is homophobia in my opinion.
Nah I was making excuses based on the bible sorry. The truth Is, i go at church Once iN two years. I live on china it's hard to support you With always somebody checking What you do on your phone, let's say I dont hate your community. I live With lots of homophobic people so we Never bring The topic iN a conversation cause we all know that my dad Will start to shout and menace everything from talking ever again. I Don't hate you, i Don't say aloud that I support you, be strong and affirm yourself iN your surroundings. I Never said discrimination isn't bad, i meant that you're probable strong enough. What do you want me to do about discrimination You endure
In general people who use religion for bigotry and hate really miss the point to begin with. Speaking as someone who has practiced Christian faith both in and out of a church setting (and am LGBTQ+ myself), conservative/fundamentalist Christians twist the use of the Bible and the real teachings of their own religion to act like they have the moral high ground, and from my own understanding, they are ironically going against everything Jesus ever stood for in doing so.
Like, in addition to what's already been stated, even if we were to assume that homosexuality hypothetically speaking was a "sin", that doesn't actually justify hating them and condemning them, much less not giving them love and compassion. The underlying theme of the Bible and its stories is that everyone is a sinner in some form, no exceptions, and that following Jesus and showing the selfless compassion he did to the people around us is the way, same with accepting him into our lives and that through his death, he bears the burden of the sins of all of us. In that sense fundamentalist/conservative Christians either don't really get that or don't care, and they instead twist it around to act like they have the moral high ground and that they will be saved and everyone else will be condemned: from what I've read, it would actually be the other way around. Those people would be the ones who would be condemned for being hateful and judgmental to others, which in and of itself *is* a sin based on it.
So really there is no value in using religion as an excuse for bigotry and hatred: if anything speaking from a Christian standpoint, fundamentalists who use their Christianity to spread hate are actually going against the core spiritual philosophy their own religion intends to teach in the first place. Really it should be the other way: spread love, compassion, and understanding, not hate. That is what Christianity truly stands for as far as I can tell.
Like, in addition to what's already been stated, even if we were to assume that homosexuality hypothetically speaking was a "sin", that doesn't actually justify hating them and condemning them, much less not giving them love and compassion. The underlying theme of the Bible and its stories is that everyone is a sinner in some form, no exceptions, and that following Jesus and showing the selfless compassion he did to the people around us is the way, same with accepting him into our lives and that through his death, he bears the burden of the sins of all of us. In that sense fundamentalist/conservative Christians either don't really get that or don't care, and they instead twist it around to act like they have the moral high ground and that they will be saved and everyone else will be condemned: from what I've read, it would actually be the other way around. Those people would be the ones who would be condemned for being hateful and judgmental to others, which in and of itself *is* a sin based on it.
So really there is no value in using religion as an excuse for bigotry and hatred: if anything speaking from a Christian standpoint, fundamentalists who use their Christianity to spread hate are actually going against the core spiritual philosophy their own religion intends to teach in the first place. Really it should be the other way: spread love, compassion, and understanding, not hate. That is what Christianity truly stands for as far as I can tell.
