Machamp just used what?

[Loetke]

Since some of you seem to be too elitist... NOBODY SAID THIS WAS GOING TO CHANGE THE WHOLE METAGAME. If you don't find this to be innovative enough, keep it to yourself until I see you coming up with something.

I logged in to AIM and received a PM from Gin. He said he had been considering something and wanted a second brain in on it. I must say, I’m pretty impressed with the results. There aren’t very many things that Machamp can’t hit exceptionally hard, but there are a few. We seem to have found a way to take care of some of the more common ones.
I have been using a Brave No Guard Machamp for quite a while now. He can work wonders with Dynamic Punch, Ice Punch, Stone Edge and a Life Orb. With Trick Room support he’s practically invincible. For a long time I didn’t know what to use in the last slot. I had tried Bulk Up, but that just wastes all your Trick Room turns and allows them to send in a special sweeper. I have tried Focus Punch to predict switches, but that doesn’t always work, and it doesn’t add confusion like Dynamic Punch.

Coming off of Machamp’s base 65 SpAtk with no SpAtk EVs it seems a bit ridiculous to even consider, but I think the numbers speak for themselves. This is a comparison of neutral damage Dynamic Punch and Super Effective Fire Blast.
Conceived by Gin, presented by Loetke
Keep in mind, the last slot is usually filler anyway, so we’re not losing anything here!

Machamp – Brave
No Guard @Life Orb / Expert Belt
252 ATK / 176 HP / 80 DEF
-Dynamic Punch
-Ice Punch
-Stone Edge
-Fire Blast

Damage Calculations for Dynamic Punch:
*Factoring in Leftovers, assuming minimum damage.
Max HP, Max Defense Impish Skarmory: Damage: 40.42% - 47.60% - 3 Hit KO
Max HP, Max Defense Impish Forretress: Damage: 38.14% - 44.92% - 3 Hit KO
Max HP, Max Defense Impish Scizor: Damage: 49.71% - 58.43% - 3 Hit KO
Max HP, Max Defense Bold Tangrowth: Damage: 36.39% - 42.57% - 4 Hit KO
Max HP, Max Defense Impish Leafeon: Damage: 42.81% - 50.30% - 3 Hit KO

Damage Calculations for Fire Blast:
*Factoring in Leftovers, assuming minimum damage.
Max HP, Max Defense Impish Skarmory: Damage: 64.37% - 75.45% - 2 Hit KO
Max HP, Max Defense Impish Forretress: Damage: 136.44% - 160.45% - OHKO
Max HP, Max Defense Impish Scizor: Damage: 112.21% - 131.98% - OHKO
Max HP, Max Defense Impish Tangrowth: Damage: 68.32% - 80.45% - 2 Hit KO
Max HP, Max Defense Impish Leafeon: Damage: 67.96% - 79.94% - 2 Hit KO

Against any of these 2HKO’s I would recommend using Dynamic Punch first to keep them out, then hit them with Fire Blast on turn 2 for a nice surprise.
In my opinion the addition of Fire Blast just makes Machamp an even more potent threat, while losing nothing.

 

[AgostonF]

That's pretty nice.. And without any SP atk EVs too..

 

[Bam]

I've spent the last ten minutes or so looking for anything that can easily switch in without getting hurt in some way, but there's nothing really that can do that. The only thing that I can think of is that a Spiritomb may switch in on a Dynamic Punch, and then Wisp you before you hit due to its base speed being much lower (In TR).

 

[Loetke]

Yeah, Dusknoir and Spiritomb will always be a problem, but they're going to be a pain for anything that doesn't like to get burnt. Prediction will save Machamp against them though. If you can hit them with a CH Stone Edge while they switch in, they're in trouble.

 

[FarmerWithShotgun]

Cresselia is obviously a counter too.

 

[Loetke]

Cresselia is obviously a counter too.

Thanks for pointing out the obvious. Are you here to discuss something, or are you posting just for the sake of having a post in this topic?

 

[cornflake]

Wow, I like this! No one will see it coming. I like the calculations, those steel physical walls are no longer safe. Obvious OHKOs on Forry and Scizor, they die to ember.

 

[Gin]

Yeah I usually hide this behind a sub and rape things like Forretress and Scizor with can usually switch without have to worry about any of Machamps attacks. For Skarmory I usually Dynamic Punch it first to create a false sense of security and for confusion but next turn I bust out 100% accuracy Fire Blast :)

 

[DMFG]

While this is nice, I'm not sure Machamp had that much trouble with those pokes anyway (except possibly Tangrowth).

Forretress can't do much to him except Explode, Skarm has the problem of being faster and thus Roost will cause DP to become SE.

Plus the high damage and confusion of DP is already a good deterrent against those physical walls.

That said, the last slot is pretty much filler as you say so I guess it's not really much of an issue.

 

[Loetke]

While this is nice, I'm not sure Machamp had that much trouble with those pokes anyway (except possibly Tangrowth).

Forretress can't do much to him except Explode, Skarm has the problem of being faster and thus Roost will cause DP to become SE.

Plus the high damage and confusion of DP is already a good deterrent against those physical walls.

That said, the last slot is pretty much filler as you say so I guess it's not really much of an issue.

I don't know about you, but I would much rather take these out in 1-2 hits rather than 3-4 or waiting for Skarm to Roost.

 

[sa17dk]

Very nice addition of Fire Blast. Although you'll probably be beating Skarmory most of the time, I just thought I'd point out that standard Skarmory (96 atk evs) will do 73.15% - 86.03% to Machamp with Brave Bird. So if Skarmory switches in on Ice Punch or Stone Edge and Trick Room is down, the birdie will go first and kill you if you have taken some Orb damage.

The above scenario is probably just a minor point, so its not too important.
Very nice moveset.

 

[Pikachu of Doom]

What about calcs for Metagross?

 

[Mario With Lasers]

I was just going to say adding Fire Blast on a physical pokémon just to stop Skarm and friends isn't a new idea, but only then I remembered Machamp has No Guard -_- And instantly I liked this set.

Yeah I usually hide this behind a sub (...)

Do you pass Machamp a Sub, or do you ditch a move for it?

 

[Loetke]

What about calcs for Metagross?

If I left anything out that means Dynamic Punch does the same or more damage to it.

 

[FarmerWithShotgun]

Thanks for pointing out the obvious. Are you here to discuss something, or are you posting just for the sake of having a post in this topic?

You didn't list any counters and the guy above said only spiritomb.

Sorry for trying to contribute.

 

[Shiny Crobat]

Well, I woudn't switch skarm in on a Machamp, I'd go with Cress or something. If you know a LO will do 47%, what will a CB do? I mean, that's ALOT with confusion, bit dumb IMO.

 

[Loetke]

Well, I woudn't switch skarm in on a Machamp, I'd go with Cress or something. If you know a LO will do 47%, what will a CB do? I mean, that's ALOT with confusion, bit dumb IMO.

Using Life Orb is dumb? I don't know about you, but I like to be able to change attacks at will while still doing massive damage. Besides, Skarm is a VERY common switch in to Machamp.

You didn't list any counters and the guy above said only spiritomb.

Sorry for trying to contribute.

I didn't list any counters because we're not talking about counters. We're talking about Fire Blast VS Dynamic Punch on some common walls.

 

[Shiny Crobat]

Using Life Orb is dumb? I don't know about you, but I like to be able to change attacks at will while still doing massive damage. Besides, Skarm is a VERY common switch in to Machamp.



I didn't list any counters because we're not talking about counters. We're talking about Fire Blast VS Dynamic Punch on some common walls.

No, switching skarm into that guy is dumb, you hit yourself in consion and get 2HKO'd anyway by CB dynamic punch

 

[Loetke]

No, switching skarm into that guy is dumb, you hit yourself in consion and get 2HKO'd anyway by CB dynamic punch

Oh, I see what you're saying now. Yes, that is true, but I'm not a fan of using CB on Machamp just because they know Dynamic Punch is coming and will switch to Gengar. When they're expecting CB DP, you can turn around and OHKO with Stone Edge. That's also a nice surprise.

 

[Shiny Crobat]

Oh, I see what you're saying now. Yes, that is true, but I'm not a fan of using CB on Machamp just because they know Dynamic Punch is coming and will switch to Gengar. When they're expecting CB DP, you can turn around and OHKO with Stone Edge. That's also a nice surprise.

True, but IMO you shoudn't switch skarm into it anyway. I'd switch to Dusknoir or cressie, then to gliscor or something. And is this set used for predicting or dynamic then FB?

 

[Drab Emordnilap]

Fire Blast on a physical sweeper isn't new.

Fire Blast on Machamp even isn't new. It was used occasionally in Advance, although admittedly without 100% accuracy.

It's an improvement on how it was in advance, but it's not something overwhelmingly groundbreaking.

 

[Raikou7]

I was just going to say adding Fire Blast on a physical pokémon just to stop Skarm and friends isn't a new idea, but only then I remembered Machamp has No Guard -_- And instantly I liked this set.



Do you pass Machamp a Sub, or do you ditch a move for it?

Lol Same right Here.

 

[9voltdude]

well the no guard thing with fire blast makes it pretty neat, even though physical walls have a annoying time already walling machamp because of the %100 confusion. dusknoir still walls the crap out of machamp though.

 

[Shiny Crobat]

well the no guard thing with fire blast makes it pretty neat, even though physical walls have a annoying time already walling machamp because of the %100 confusion. dusknoir still walls the crap out of machamp though.

Well, it's dead when Machamp has guts

 

[lincarnate]

I would run Naughty instead of Brave and go with 112 HP / 252 Attack / 20 Defense / 124 Speed for the EVs. That minimizes Life Orb damage (349 HP means 34 taken away by Life Orb), still maximizes attack and lets you outspeed Skarmory so it doesn't Brave Bird/Drill Peck you before you finish it off for a 2HKO. The only downside is that Machamp's decent Sp. Def takes a hit, but this set isn't meant to survive that long anyways.