1. Welcome to Smogon! Check out the Smogon Starters Hangout for everything you need to know about starting out in the community. Don't forget to introduce yourself in the Introduction and Hangout Thread, too!
  2. Welcome to Smogon Forums! Please take a minute to read the rules.

Masquerain

Discussion in 'BW NU' started by TheFrogMafia, Jan 12, 2013.

?

How helpful is Maquerain to you in NU?

  1. Love it! It gives great support for my team!

    11 vote(s)
    22.4%
  2. Eh, it's pretty good.

    12 vote(s)
    24.5%
  3. Not a fan.

    17 vote(s)
    34.7%
  4. NEVER USE THIS THING.

    9 vote(s)
    18.4%
  1. TheFrogMafia

    TheFrogMafia

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2013
    Messages:
    9
    MASQUERAIN

    [​IMG]

    Bug/Flying

    70 / 60 / 62 / 80 / 82 / 60

    At first glance, Masquerain doesn't look like much. It sports one of the worst typings in the game, which leaves it susceptible to most dominant types in NU, like Fire, Flying, and Rock. It's stats are mediocre at best, and with only 70 / 62 / 82 defenses, he won't be on the battlefield for long.

    However, there is light at the end of the tunnel for the little whatever-bug-it's-supposed-to-be. It has a great ability in Intimidate, somewhat prolonging it's lifespan with physical attackers, and has a skill which only Venomoth is the only other to boast: being able to Baton Pass a Quiver Dance.​

    Abilities:

    - Intimidate
    - Unnerve (DW Ability)


    Notable Moves:

    - Quiver Dance
    - Baton Pass
    - Bug Buzz
    - Air Slash
    - Hydro Pump
    - Ice Beam
    - Scald
    - Substitute
    - Roost
    - Giga Drain


    Viable Items:

    - Focus Sash
    - Leftovers
    - Charti Berry


    So what do you think? Is Masquerain viable? What sets can it run? What partners does it need to succeed? Can Masquerain find a place to call its own in the hectic, ever-changing metagame that is NU? Discuss below.
  2. FLCL

    FLCL
    is a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis Smogon Frontier's Salon Maidenis a Past SPL Winner

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2010
    Messages:
    2,382
    masquerain's biggest selling point is being able to baton pass quiver dance boosts to pokemon such as gardevoir and ludicolo to make them extremely threatening. intimidate is a good ability that can help masquerain do it's job more reliably.

    [​IMG]
    Masquerain @ Leftovers
    Trait: Intimidate
    EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature
    - Quiver Dance
    - Baton Pass
    - Bug Buzz
    - Roost

    this set can set up on choiced fighting and ground types, as well as walls such as alomomola, lickilicky, and misdreavus. once you grab enough boosts, you can get the heck out of there and sweep the opponent with a powerful attacker. pokemon that resist common attacking types that masquerian is weak to are usually better choices since they will likely take less damage when masquerain baton passes out to them. max defense is an option to set up on more pokemon, but one problem that you will run into is not being able to baton pass out fast enough when the opponent switches to a counter as you set up.

    don't try to sweep with this thing, it is far too slow and doesn't hit as hard. hydro pump is nice, but it doesn't really help against much due to the lack of viable fire-types in the tier. leave the sweeping to butterfree, which can put counters to sleep and muscle through pokemon that resist bug buzz with tinted lens.
  3. DTC

    DTC ˢᵉʳᶦᵒᵘˢ
    is a Smogon IRC SOPis a Battle Server Admin Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    May 8, 2011
    Messages:
    1,705
    I am actually very interested in using Masquerain. It seems like it is really good just because QuiverPass is such a potent combination. I imagine Seismitoad is an awesome partner to Masquerain. It has just the right Speed and Special Attack to be devastating after a Quiver Dance, and it also synergizes very well with Masquerain by resisting Fire, Rock, and Electric-type attacks.

    I will be making a team around Masquerain shortly and possibly sharing it with you guys once I play with it for a few matches. Has anyone here made a Masquerain team that they would be willing to share? Masquerain is pretty interesting in the sense that teams with it tend to be completely built around it because the support it provides is so damn good.
  4. Governess

    Governess A Beautiful Blossom Waiting to Bloom
    is a Researcher Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2012
    Messages:
    916
    Masquerain sounds like a very peculiar Pokemon. It has tricks up its 'sleeves', and with Quiver Dance, could be very useful in certain situations. Though, the Stealth Rock weakness is what repels me from it. I haven't used it, to date. I might in the future though.
    It's stats are average at best, and FLCL is right; it shouldnt be used for sweeping, more for BP'ing. Its like the lesser version of Ninjask, almost. o3o
  5. TheFrogMafia

    TheFrogMafia

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2013
    Messages:
    9
    For those interested (like you DTC) this is the team i've been experimenting with. I pass my Masq boosts to my bulky Exeggutor and use Masq as a lead.

    Show Hide
    Skuntank (F) @ Black Sludge
    Trait: Aftermath
    EVs: 252 HP / 220 SDef / 36 Spd
    Careful Nature
    - Poison Jab
    - Roar
    - Sucker Punch
    - Taunt

    Vanilluxe @ Expert Belt
    Trait: Weak Armor
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 144 Spd / 112 HP
    Modest Nature
    - Ice Beam
    - Flash Cannon
    - Autotomize
    - Protect

    Rapidash @ Life Orb
    Trait: Flash Fire
    EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd
    Adamant Nature
    - Flare Blitz
    - Wild Charge
    - Megahorn
    - Drill Run

    Masquerain @ Focus Sash
    Trait: Intimidate
    EVs: 252 Spd / 248 HP / 8 Def
    Timid Nature
    - Bug Buzz
    - Air Slash
    - Quiver Dance
    - Baton Pass

    Exeggutor @ Lum Berry
    Trait: Harvest
    EVs: 200 HP / 56 SpA / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature
    - Giga Drain
    - Psyshock
    - Hidden Power [Fire]
    - Sleep Powder

    Armaldo @ Leftovers
    Trait: Battle Armor
    EVs: 252 HP / 200 SDef / 56 Atk
    Adamant Nature
    - Rapid Spin
    - Stone Edge
    - X-Scissor
    - Superpower
  6. cbt

    cbt doom
    is a Pokemon Researcher

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2012
    Messages:
    1,405
    masquerain is a good quiver dancer that is best suited to baton passing such, as it lacks in sp atk for a sweeper. it has nice resistances/immunity and intimidate, but is let down by low defense and a sr weakness. i will attempt to make a team based around it as i have not used it before, and it may prove its worth.
  7. The Reptile

    The Reptile make it rain
    is a Pre-Contributor

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2011
    Messages:
    1,353
    whyisntthisthingwaterbuggoddamnitgamefreak

    Anyways, Masq is unique from the other Quiver Dancers due to Intimidate and it's access to Hydro Pump, although I'd agree that you're better off passing Quivers to other pokemon thanks to Intimidate and it's access to Quiver and Baton Pass. The set FLCL posted is probably the best set Masq could run, although an offensive set could be cool too (too bad it's SpAtk and Speed are not so great :[)
  8. Nyara

    Nyara

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2012
    Messages:
    287
    Actually, Bug-Flying have the power to check some threats, specially the myriad of Fighting-Type and Grass-Type Pokémon on the tier, thanks to it's x 4 resistance to both types, and it's ability; Intimidate, and it's STAB Air Slash + Quiver Dance, so, I don't use Masquerain with the unique objetive of passing Quiver Dance.

    - Air Slash
    - Hydro Pump
    - Quiver Dance
    - Baton Pass

    That's what I use, changing the EV's depending of the tier, on NU I tend to use 128 Def, 128 Spa, and 252 Speed, in that way it can outspeed after Quiver Dancing whatever thing on the tier, and still being able to hit hard and switching-in on any Fighting or Grass move (or Earthquake user without Rock attacks), and on whatever physical Bug move, and on any weak physical attacker or support Pokémon.

    Masquerain with Hydro Pump can hit really hard to any Rock or Ground Type Pokémon, specially once a Quiver Dance. I don't think putting Roost is a very good idea, anyway, Masquerain needs a lot of it's double type to actually being able to handle attacks, and the most probably you're losing a vital turn using Roost, while you can Quiver Dance, or Baton Pass. Yeah, you heal your Stealth Rock damage, but you should not use Masquerain if you can't mantain Stealth Rock out from the game because it will be just unnable to do anything with less of the half of it's HP, even x4 resisted hits with intimidate tends to deal 25%+ of damage.

    I also tend to use Bug Buzz + Bug Gem, it with some Spa investment hit's REALLY HARD after a Quiver Dance, and I hitted critical K.O's with it, and later just Baton Passed. The same can be did with Air Slash + Flying Gem against anything weak to it, but Bug Buzz hits harder to anything else. Giga Drain is an option replacing the place of Hydro Pump if you're not having Wish Support, and you really wants to heal Masquerain to make it able to Quiver Dance more, and it works decently after a Quiver Dance.

    I use this cute thing on OU anyway, it can be weird, but I think it's the best Baton Passer of Quiver Dance of the game, and with it's ability he's an excelent support there on middle or late game, too. This's also one of few Pokémon who can counter and check Breloom as long the Sleep Clause is already activated and it's not wearing Stone Edge (a rare move on him, lol), so, it's indeed a plus to me.

    Yes, I love this little bug, but I could have prefered it were Bug/Water. >:

    It's still funny how Masquerain have good sinergy with almost any Wish user except Alomomola, for example Wigglytuff lures Fighthing attacks all the time, and Masquerain can intimidate them, and resist x 4 them, lol.

    Masquerain Tank can also be used, with 252 EV's of HP and Defense, it can handle really, really wonderful any physical attacker that doesn't is a Bird or have Rock attacks, and it's the unique way you can stack 2 or more Quiver Dance with Masquerain, but it's kinda situational. 252 Hp and 128 on each defense tends to work better for tank sets, anyway.
  9. ADHLAS

    ADHLAS

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2011
    Messages:
    27
    The times I've used it, my item of choice was always a focus sash, paired with my usual-lead max-speed Spikes/Taunt/Filler/Explosion Glalie, guaranteeing no rocks on the field and an intact sash on Masquerain as it comes in. From there, it nearly always managed to pass at least one Quiver dance to whoever needed it.

    There aren't too many counters to Masquerain if it comes in with an intact sash - Cincinno used to be able to massacre it with Rock blast, but it's gone, and there aren't any things left with multi-hit moves fast enough to outspeed a +1 Masquerain. Electrode can outspeed and Taunt any variation, but doesn't like being hit by that +1 Bug buzz at all (2HKO'd with neutral natures, unless it's Soundproof rather than Aftermath for some odd reason, and due to the sash, Masquerain still wins)

    Phazers and Hazers and the odd perish song still shut Masquerain down hard, though.
  10. BlackLightAttack

    BlackLightAttack

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2010
    Messages:
    75
    I'm amazed nobody has mentioned Stored Power yet.

    It's a pretty high risk, high reward team setup. If the pokemon using Stored Power doesn't receive a baton pass, SP is next to useless. This is a pretty common risk considering Masquerain's typing and stats. However, receiving a single Quiver Dance brings Stored Power up to the same base power as Psyshock. 2 Quiver Dances makes it base 140, and 3 makes it 200. This is usually with STAB factored in. 200 Base Power SP with STAB at +3? Yespls.

    The following NU pokes can learn Stored Power:

    Clefable
    Natu
    Gardevoir
    Musharna
    Flareon
    Glaceon
    Togetic
    Chimecho
    Swoobat

    Musharna can still be easily outsped even at +3, Natu's stats are too low to make use of Quiver Dances, Chimecho is outclassed in every way by Gardevoir, and Swoobat already buffs its own Stored Power well enough with Simple Calm Mind, but the rest are viable targets for this gimmick. For funsies, I've been testing this out with Chimecho. However, this set can be pulled off exactly the same by Gardevoir, only better. +2 Gardy is harder to outspeed (only something odd like Scarfed Swellow will outpace it) and has better stats, almost point-for-point.


    [​IMG]
    Gardevoir @Ganlon Berry
    Trace

    Stored power
    Shadow Ball
    HP Fighting/HP Ground/Thunderbolt/Focus Blast
    Wish/Psychic/Heal Bell

    Modest
    252 Def
    4 SpA
    252 Spe

    So, obviously, if Gardy can receive 2 or more QDs, she's mostly set to sweep. Sucker Punch is the main reason for all of the Def investment and the Ganlon Berry (although this was also for funsies, probably better replaced with Leftovers, Expert Belt, or Lum Berry). Sucker Punch from a fully invested Skuntank only has a 6.75% to OHKO. Wish provides critical sustainability. Priority threatens to whittle you down but keep in mind how specially bulky Gardevoir is with even just 1 QD. It also gives Gardy a support option in case it doesn't receive its QDs, as well as a non-attacking option to throw off Sucker Punch. Psychic retains some damage-dealing capabilities in the same situation in lieu of support. Heal Bell can be used to prevent status from ruining your sweep.

    The choice between HP Fighting, HP Ground, and Thunderbolt is up to you. Fighting handles most Dark and Steel Types without an issue, but the main weakness to this is Skuntank. Skuntank has a chance to survive even a +3 HP Fighting, resists Shadow Ball, and is completely immune to Stored Power. HP Ground OHKOs him, but leaves you with no option to hit other Dark-types, and notably nothing to hit Murkrow or Cacturne neutrally. Thunderbolt has a 50% chance to OHKO 252 HP Murkrow even without a boost, but once again leaves you with no neutral option against Cacturne. Focus Blast can take care of all of these threats, providing you survive a Sucker Punch, but it's Focus Blast.

    Here are 2 videos from me with the same set on a Chimecho:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJ-kXsCUCr0
    http://www.pokemonshowdown.com/replay/nu7633497

    Other options:

    Flareon -
    Can utilize a forgotten, but usable, 95 SpA stat, good bulk, decent special movepool, and access to Wish. No STAB on Stored Power, low physical defense, and weakness to SR, but Flamethrower is great and a lack of Weakness to Sucker Punch is even better. Item choice is the same as Gardevoir's, just make sure not to use Guts if you're carrying a Lum Berry.

    [​IMG]
    Flareon @Leftovers/Expert Belt/Lum Berry
    Flash Fire or Guts

    Flamethrower
    Stored Power
    Wish
    Shadow Ball/HP-Fighting/Hyper Voice/HP-Rock

    Modest
    4 HP
    252 SpA
    252 Spe

    Glaceon -
    Mostly the same ups and downs as Flareon, but with a good defense to complement its buffed SpD and a better base SpA, allowing it to take advantage of good all-around bulk once receiving the pass. Its movepool is a bit more lacking, basically forcing it to rely on HP-Fighting to cover Steel-types.

    [​IMG]
    Glaceon @Leftovers
    Ice Body

    Ice Beam
    Stored Power
    Shadow Ball
    HP-Fighting

    Modest
    252 HP
    4 SpA
    252 Spe

    Togetic -
    Its speed is too low to be a full-out sweeper, but it's annoyingly bulky on its own even before receiving +2 or +3 SpD. This is the Bulky Attacking receiver, working with Eviolite, a usable base 80 SpA, and a great movepool to stay in longer despite possibly taking a few hits.

    [​IMG]
    Togetic @Eviolite
    Serene Grace

    Stored Power
    Air Slash
    Roost
    Flamethrower/Thunder Wave

    Modest or Calm
    252 HP
    4 Def
    252 SpA


    Clefable -
    Yes, Clefable. I'm seriously tempted to try this. 1) No weakness to SR or Sucker Punch. 2) Access to Moonlight, far better than Wish 3) Classic Normal-type amazing special movepool, including BoltBeam 4) Usable all-around stats - more solid bulk than the others and surprisingly okay 85 SpA. 60 Spe can work with investment and 2-3 QDs. Downsides are, of course, no STAB Stored Power, Normal typing, and a distinct lack of usefulness if it doesn't receive its Baton Passes.
    Thanks to sickweare for pointing out Clefable is RU, I always get it mixed up with Wigglytuff. I'll still be trying this by bringing Masquerain to RU.


    Something viable to think about, or just a gimmick? You can't deny the power of a 140 base STAB Stored Power at +2 from Gardevoir, but there are a million and 1 ways to counter it.
  11. sickweare

    sickweare

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2012
    Messages:
    191

    Just a little nitpick, but Clefable is RU. The other way to utilize stored power is with clefairy who generally isn't amazing in this meta.


    I can also attest to what someone wrote earlier about the stored power pass. I made an almost clean sweep with Chimecho. Here's a replay:
    http://www.pokemonshowdown.com/replay/nu8070763
  12. BlackLightAttack

    BlackLightAttack

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2010
    Messages:
    75
    Actually that's a pretty huge nitpick. How could I have missed that? *headsmack*

    I was probably confusing Clefable for Wigglytuff again.

    Oh well, that just means I'll have to bring Masquerain into RU, I guess. I'll edit the original post.

Users Viewing Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 0)