Mismagius [QC 1/3]

Martin

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Overview
########

[Pros]
  • Nice Spe and SpA stats.
  • Utility moves in Thunder Wave, WoW, Taunt, and Destiny Bond.
  • Good offensive movepool.
  • Decent at NP boosting
  • Decent offensive spinblocker.
[Cons]
  • Really poor HP and Def stats
  • Knock Off and Sucker Punch exist
Offensive
########
name: Offensive
move 1: Shadow Ball
move 2: Dazzling Gleam
move 3: Nasty Plot / Destiny Bond
move 4: Destiny Bond / Taunt
ability: Levitate
item: Colbur Berry / Life Orb
evs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
nature: Timid

Moves
========
  • Nasty Plot boosts SpA to high levels for sweeping
  • Shadow Ball for strongest special STAB
  • Dazzling Gleam gets a stronger hit on Dark-types like Malamar, Panda and Liepard (all notable ones except for Pawniard, in fact) than HP Fighting while still hitting most Normal-types for decent damage.
  • Hidden Power Fighting can be used to hit Normal-types like Pyroar and Audino hard. It also hits Pawniard super effectively. However, it requires an imperfect speed IV, meaning that Mismagius can no longer speed tie with opposing positive base 105s like Scyther and opposing Dazzling Gleam Mismagius, which is too big to warrant its use outside of Tailwind teams.
  • Dbond lets you get a surprise KO when Mismagius reaches the end of its "life"
  • Taunt is great for setting up against stall, and it prevents phazing from Roar and Whirlwind, which is always a plus.
  • Wisp is great for crippling physical attackers, but it struggles to fit it onto the moveset.
Set Details
========
  • Max Speed Timid because Missy needs to outspeed as much as possible. Max SpA for strong damage output, especially after NP
  • Colbur Berry is recommended so Mismagius can spinblock to the greatest effect, but it is also notable for making Knock Off and Sucker Punch far less threatening to Mismagius, and allowing it to beat Dark-types reliably.
  • LO should only be used alongside Substitute (or Will-O I guess) as it lets Mismagius reliably play around Sucker Punch. It boosts the power of Mismagius' attacks.
  • 4 def to give a SR HP number
Usage Tips
========
  • The main purpose of the set is to come in mid-to-late game and punch holes in the opposing team.
  • Walls are great for setting up on. Just so long as they lack Night Shade you should be fine
  • Spinblocking is a big reason to use Mismagius over other Nasty Plot users, but it can't be done effectively without its Colbur Berry still in-tact. Therefore, ensure you preserve it until you absolutely need to consume it.
  • If Mismagius isn't required for spinblocking (i.e. the opponent has no Rapid Spin user), play Mismagius agressively. If it is required to spinblock, however, play Mismagius far more conservatively, as you need to preserve it until you can either sweep successfully or the Rapid Spin user is gone.
Team Options
========
  • Fighting-, Psychic-, and Dark-types (Throh, Sawk, Kadabra, Pawniard etc.) have good synergy
  • Anything which can take Knock Off (for when Colbur Berry has been consumed
  • Will-O/Intimidate support (Granbull, Weezing etc.)
  • Hazzards help Mismaguius in its role of punching holes in the opposing team, most notably Spikes to hit grounded Steel-types like Probopass hard. This means that Mismagius works will on spikes stacking teams, making spikes stackers like Crustle good teammates for it.
  • Defog blockers/discouragers like Pawniard and Wigglytuff cause spikes stacking

Stallbreaker
########
WIP

Other Options
########
  • Sub to beat Sucker Punch and ease prediction/aid setup
  • T-bolt has good coverage with Shadow Ball and can be used if your team is weak to Feraligatr/Kingler or something, but it doesn't hit anything else notable that isn't already hit hard by Shadow Ball or DG
  • Energy Ball to hit spinners like Kabutops and Sandslash super effectivey. However, it has poor coverage with Mismagius' other moves and fails to hit common checks like Pyroar and Pawniard.
  • CM, but outclassed by Spiritomb and even Misdreavus
  • Defensive, but once again outclassed by Spiritomb and Misdreavus
  • Scarf, but outclassed by Rotom

Checks & Counters
########
**Knock Off and Sucker Punch:** Knock Off and Sucker Punch are problematic for Mismagius once it has lost its Colbur Berry as all common users KO with said move after the damage from a Colbur Berry-weakened move. This makes common users like Pawniard, Cacturne, and Kangaskhan a big issue for Mismagius.

**Faster Dark-types:** These apply under the same circumstances as Knock Off and Sucker Punch in that they can KO with their STAB moves once Mismagius' Colbur Berry has been consumed. This means that Pokemon like Sneasel and Liepard are problematic for it.

**Pyroar:** Pyroar is a common switch-in as it is immune to Shadow Ball and it resists Dazzling Gleam.

**Bulky Normal-types:** Bulky Normal-types are immune to Mismagius' STAB, meaning that specially-bulky Normal-types like Lickilicky and Audino do an effective job at checking Mismagius.

**Stat-Boost Clearance:** Phazing through the use of Roar, Whirlwind, and Dragon Tail clear Mismagius' Nasty Plot boosts, although the former two can be dealt with using Taunt. This makes of said moves like Rhydon decent checks. Similarly, Haze and Clear Smog clear Mismagius' boosts, although the most common user of said moves—Weezing—can't tank hits from Mismagius.
 
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Shouldn't colbur berry be mentioned, I mean, its basically what makes mismagius a semi decent spin blocker in the first place since knock off does nothing when you have that berry. I would slash it alongside life orb
 
Yeah, colbur berry should be main item on the set imo. It prevents mismagius from dieing to litterally any sucker punch and spinblock sandslash and do something against tomb. Also, i have used scarf with shadow ball | dazz gleam | trick | wow / nasty plot to good success. However, it has the potential to become set up bait for some dangerous pokes such as pawniard and scarf rotom is arguably better. So, idrk.
In team options, you should emphasize how good it is on hazard stacking teams.
 

scorpdestroyer

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Nasty Plot
########
name: Nasty Plot
move 1: Nasty Plot
move 2: Shadow Ball
move 3: Dazzling Gleam
move 4: Destiny Bond / Taunt
ability: Levitate
item: Colbur Berry / Life Orb
evs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
nature: Timid

This should be the main set. I'm not sure if Life Orb deserves a slash atm but I'll just leave it there for now. Colbur Berry allows Mismagius to defeat Dark-types at full HP and spinblock more effectively, which is awesome.

252+ Atk Black Glasses Spiritomb Sucker Punch vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Colbur Berry Mismagius: 204-241 (78.1 - 92.3%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252 SpA Mismagius Dazzling Gleam vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Spiritomb: 282-332 (92.7 - 109.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

252+ Atk Pawniard Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Colbur Berry Mismagius: 196-232 (75 - 88.8%) -- 12.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252 SpA Mismagius Dazzling Gleam vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Pawniard: 204-240 (88.3 - 103.8%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

Taunt is great because it allows Mismagius to take down a lot of stall Pokemon with Taunt + NP, while Destiny Bond just works really well in general vs offense.

also because Colbur Berry is on the set don't hype up Knock Off so much please...

I'll check back some time after.
 

Martin

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Nasty Plot
########
name: Nasty Plot
move 1: Nasty Plot
move 2: Shadow Ball
move 3: Dazzling Gleam
move 4: Destiny Bond / Taunt
ability: Levitate
item: Colbur Berry / Life Orb
evs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
nature: Timid

This should be the main set. I'm not sure if Life Orb deserves a slash atm but I'll just leave it there for now. Colbur Berry allows Mismagius to defeat Dark-types at full HP and spinblock more effectively, which is awesome.

252+ Atk Black Glasses Spiritomb Sucker Punch vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Colbur Berry Mismagius: 204-241 (78.1 - 92.3%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252 SpA Mismagius Dazzling Gleam vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Spiritomb: 282-332 (92.7 - 109.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

252+ Atk Pawniard Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Colbur Berry Mismagius: 196-232 (75 - 88.8%) -- 12.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252 SpA Mismagius Dazzling Gleam vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Pawniard: 204-240 (88.3 - 103.8%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

Taunt is great because it allows Mismagius to take down a lot of stall Pokemon with Taunt + NP, while Destiny Bond just works really well in general vs offense.

also because Colbur Berry is on the set don't hype up Knock Off so much please...

I'll check back some time after.
OK. I've implemented all your changes. I've decided to remove LO altogether as it is definitely not worth it to forgo Colbur for it and LO is too team-specific.
 

Ares

Fool me...can't get fooled again
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Wow scorpdestroyer way to use Spiritomb for your calcs ;o

Not sure I would say it struggles with Pawnaird a lot, in fact playing mind games with it I've beaten it one on one a bunch of times. Also 252 SpA Mismagius Dazzling Gleam vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Pawniard: 102-121 (43.9 - 52.1%) -- 15.2% chance to 2HKO, Pawniard wont be switching in more than once on Missy so I would remove that from the cons, maybe switch it to needs at least one boost to sweep or something like that.

I think Will-O-Wisp deserves a mention in moves.

Need to expand out usage tips, right now its pretty generic.

Your formatting is off for C&C, it should look like:

Checks & Counters
########

**Dark-types**: line about dark types

etc. etc.
 

Martin

A monoid in the category of endofunctors
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Wow scorpdestroyer way to use Spiritomb for your calcs ;o

Not sure I would say it struggles with Pawnaird a lot, in fact playing mind games with it I've beaten it one on one a bunch of times. Also 252 SpA Mismagius Dazzling Gleam vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Pawniard: 102-121 (43.9 - 52.1%) -- 15.2% chance to 2HKO, Pawniard wont be switching in more than once on Missy so I would remove that from the cons, maybe switch it to needs at least one boost to sweep or something like that.

I think Will-O-Wisp deserves a mention in moves.

Need to expand out usage tips, right now its pretty generic.
Ive done all of this except the usage tips bit, which I'll do tomorrow cause its 10 pm and my parents are insistent on making me come off.
Your formatting is off for C&C, it should look like:

Checks & Counters
########

**Dark-types**: line about dark types

etc. etc.
this isn't required at the skeleton stage, although I appreciate you thinking about that kind of thing.
 

Ares

Fool me...can't get fooled again
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Tag me when you have done the usage tips. Also you should have formatting done in the QC stage. Make sure you edit your title to include [QC 0/3]
 

Punchshroom

FISHIOUS REND MEGA SHARPEDO
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Hidden Power Fighting can be slashed before Dazzling Gleam, as it hits Normal-types such as Pyroar and Audino, as well as Pawniard. Dazzling Gleam can still be used to land stronger hits on other Darks such as Malamar, Pangoro, and Liepard.
 
The checks and counters section does not have to be fully formatted before the second QC check.

In any case, where Will-o-Wisp is mentioned in the "Moves" section, I'd emphasise that it isn't just to cripple physical attackers, but also to avoid Sucker Punch from Pokemon such as Kangaskhan and Pawniard, which often Sucker Punch in case of a Hidden Power Fighting. This enables Mismagius to beat these Pokemon in a 1v1 scenario.
 

Martin

A monoid in the category of endofunctors
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Sorry I took so long to get around to this cause I'm lazy, but hopefully this should look a little less generic now Montsegur
 

Punchshroom

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Mention that Colbur Berry also weakens Sucker Punch.

Mention that Hidden Power Fighting requires an imperfect Speed IV, meaning HP Fighting Mismagius cannot speedtie opposing base 105s (non-HP Fighting Mismagius and Scyther).

Energy Ball in OO to hit spinblockers such as Kabutops and Sandslash, but has poor coverage against common Mismagius checks such as Pyroar and Pawniard.

QC 1/3
 

Martin

A monoid in the category of endofunctors
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Mention that Colbur Berry also weakens Sucker Punch.

Mention that Hidden Power Fighting requires an imperfect Speed IV, meaning HP Fighting Mismagius cannot speedtie opposing base 105s (non-HP Fighting Mismagius and Scyther).

Energy Ball in OO to hit spinblockers such as Kabutops and Sandslash, but has poor coverage against common Mismagius checks such as Pyroar and Pawniard.
QC 1/3
Ok. Done. I have moved HP fighting to the second slash for now as missing out on tying with opposing base 105s is really important. Should I unslash it again and leave it in moves, or is it fine where it is?
 

soulgazer

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Hidden Power Fighting is kinda bad and is just situational (hits Pyroar and some Steels), just mention it in Moves. (remove the slash)

gamer boy

EDIT: I also think that a Stallbreaker sets deserves to be on the analyse, what do you guys think?

FLCL Hollywood Punchshroom scorpdestroyer Montsegur

something like shadow ball taunt wisp pain split and enough speed for like base 90s or 95s
 

Martin

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Ok. Moved it to the "moves" section.

also no need to tag me as I'm watching the thread, so I should get alerts whenever someone posts in here
 

Ares

Fool me...can't get fooled again
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I could see that getting a set, however don't have to much experience with it. If you have tested it Soulgazer and feel like it deserves a set, than I'll go with that.

  • Struggles with Pawniard... a lot...
Still need to remove this, with Colbur berry Missy can survive a sucker punch and OHKO's with HP fighitng and can OHKO with +2 Dazzling Gleam. Pawniard is a pretty decent check but not a hard counter as this point implies.

  • Don't set up on Liepard.
This is kind of obvious isn't it? I mean Liepard can hit hard with a STAB Knock Off or Sucker Punch and it has priority Encore. Remove this point.

Checks & Counters
########
  • Entry hazzards help Mismagius sweep, most notably Spikes to hit grounded Steel-types like Probopass for heavy damage. Mismagius works well on spikes-stacking teams, making users of the move like Omastar good partners
  • Knock Off is a big problem for Mismagius, forcing it to run Colbur Berry to work effectively
  • other Dark-types
  • bulky Normal-types (SpD Miltank/Lickilicky/Audino notably)
  • Haze/Clear Smog
This still needs to be formatted, reason for that is in NU you dont write up until the 3rd QC check. So we need to make sure you have all information down before you write up. TRC is right for other tiers who have the analysis written up on the 2nd check. Please fix this.
 

ryan

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Colbur Berry needs to be not the main item anymore. It was pretty much for Spiritomb with the added niche of helping against the two other Sucker Punch users that don't outspeed it (kektus/pawn). I'd rather have Life Orb, Leftovers, Lum, whatever really. And Sub is fine on NP now.

Shadow Ball / Wisp / Taunt / Pain Split should definitely be added.
 

Martin

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Colbur Berry needs to be not the main item anymore. It was pretty much for Spiritomb with the added niche of helping against the two other Sucker Punch users that don't outspeed it (kektus/pawn). I'd rather have Life Orb, Leftovers, Lum, whatever really. And Sub is fine on NP now.
Actually, Colbur Berry is really useful to help it in the role of spinblocking as it means that it can take a Knock Off from Sandslash. Also, why would it matter if a Sucker Punch user outpaced or not if Sucker Punch has +1 priority? IMO, the only time another item ever has any utility over it is when you're running will be when you're running Will-O-Wisp imo to screw Sucker Punchers over. Will a good way of going about it be to slash Life Orb in and to also slash Will-O in? Edit: actually Sub basically does the same as Will-O except it is better for setting up. I'll slash sub and LO in.
Shadow Ball / Wisp / Taunt / Pain Split should definitely be added.
Could this be done seperate to the main analysis? I have no experience with the set, so I feel that it would be done better by someone with more experience with it.

also implemented Montsegur
 
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soulgazer

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Actually, Colbur Berry is really useful to help it in the role of spinblocking as it means that it can take a Knock Off from Sandslash. Also, why would it matter if a Sucker Punch user outpaced or not if Sucker Punch has +1 priority? IMO, the only time another item ever has any utility over it is when you're running will be when you're running Will-O-Wisp imo to screw Sucker Punchers over. Will a good way of going about it be to slash Life Orb in and to also slash Will-O in? Edit: actually Sub basically does the same as Will-O except it is better for setting up. I'll slash sub and LO in.

Could this be done seperate to the main analysis? I have no experience with the set, so I feel that it would be done better by someone with more experience with it.

also implemented Montsegur
There's no rush, so you have the time to test it out lol. It fits well on balanced teams that needs a spinblocker that can prevent entry hazards and break stall by itself, so it shouldn't be too hard to make a team or two and test it on the ladder :)

Hollywood as long as Colbur Berry is mentionned on the NP set im fine with it

also what the heck is that LO + Substitue mention? Subsitute is honestly really bad so just remove that

Also Nasty Plot Mismagius's goal most of the time isnt to sweep, but to punch holes in the opponent's team for its teammate as it is usually played in the early to mid game.

Main set should only be

Shadow Ball
Dazzling Gleam
Nasty Plot / Destiny Bond
Taunt / Destiny Bond

Yes, Taunt + Destiny Bond works. Just name the set 'Offensive' or something.
 

Martin

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Implemented. Could I have an EV spread for Stallbreaker to help me get started on it and to save time? If so that'd be great.
 

Ares

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Stallbreaker Mismagius:
This is a great set. For anyone confused about what I'm referring to here, I'm talking about the Shadow Ball / Will-O-Wisp / Taunt / Pain Split set. This set is still done decently well by Misdreavus, but it doesn't mind Knock Off as much and has passive recovery with Leftovers and better Speed. You should also run more Speed on this set. Mismagius's main niche in this role is its great Speed, and not utilizing that doesn't make much sense to me. How much Speed you run is up to you and what your team needs, but outrunning Adamant Kabutops is a good start, as this set makes for a fine spinblocker.
Haven't run the set myself before, but keep in mind what Hollywood said, that the biggest thing going for Mismagius is its speed.
 

soulgazer

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Implemented. Could I have an EV spread for Stallbreaker to help me get started on it and to save time? If so that'd be great.
252 HP / 80 Def / 176 Spe with a Timid Nature is enough to outspeed base 95s iirc. Mismagius is quite versatile with its evs: it can go bulky and outspeed base 80s, 85s, or sacrifice some bulk to outspeed 90s, 95s, and 100s.

tldr the spread usually depends on what your team needs, but the best one in my opinion is the one for 95s
 
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