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Mixed OU Team

Discussion in 'BW OU Teams' started by Stumpen, Mar 8, 2011.

  1. Stumpen

    Stumpen

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2011
    Messages:
    12
    So, this is the team I use right now in Gen 5, mainly in WiFi. I´m still quite new to the metagame, so I hope to get some professional advice here ;)
    I started off with Garchomp, whom I wanted to try (never used him before), and went on from that, also adding the defensive core Nattorei/Burungeru (I know, original), which partly supports him and also covers his weaknesses. I wanted sandstorm for Chomp and chose Tyranitar over Hippowdon for more offensive power. Heatran, being a superb Pokemon anyway, pairs very nicely with Nattorei. And Gliscor... I´ve forgotten why exactly I chose him. But he fits well into the team. Anyway, here it is:

    [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]



    In Detail:

    [​IMG]

    Tyranitar (M) @ Expert Belt Trait: Sand Stream
    EVs: 56 Atk / 252 SAtk / 200 Spd
    Naive Nature (+Spd, -SDef)
    - Flamethrower
    - Ice Beam
    - Thunderbolt
    - Superpower


    My offensive lead. The mixed version appealed to me, as it is very versatile and I´m not intending to use T-Tar as my main sweeper. A big plus about him is that I am sometimes able to lure steel types which Garchomp hates. But he always does quite well, as he can be hard to predict. I have thought about giving him more special bulk or maybe a STAB move (especially for Rankurusu, I guess, my team really does not like him).

    Right now I´m simply using the EVs given on smogon.
    His weaknesses are covered by Gliscor (fighting, bug, ground), Burungeru (water, fighting), Nattorei (water, grass) and Heatran (bug, grass).





    [​IMG]


    Gliscor (M) @ Toxic Orb
    Trait: Poison Heal
    EVs: 252 HP / 40 Def / 216 Spd
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Earthquake
    - Aerial Ace
    - Protect
    - U-turn

    This is a mix between a more stallish set and a more aggressive one, i guess, I don´t know if I´ve seen it anywhere else. Earthquake is my STAB move, Protect gives me the possibility to scout and to regain HP, U-Turn is also for scouting and overall useful. Aerial Ace counters CM-Birijion, with whom I had big problems before, and also helps to pick off weakened and/or unboosted Roobushin (a major pain in the ***, this one).
    I use the EVs for maximum bulk and to be able to outspeed Lucario, although I haven´t really seen it that often.
    Gliscor´s weaknesses are covered by Heatran (ice), Burungeru (water, ice) and Nattorei (water, ice).



    [​IMG]

    Heatran (F) @ Leftovers Trait: Flash Fire
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Naive Nature (+Spd, -SDef)
    - Substitute
    - Fire Blast
    - Earth Power
    - Hidden Power [Electric]/Hidden Power [Grass]/Dragon Pulse


    I like Heatran, it has great typing and awesome special attack (and the ability to check a whole sun team if it´s unprepared). I bring him in against something that´s helpless against him and use Substitute, which eases prediction and somewhat remedies Heatran´s average speed. Fire Blast and Earth Power give nice coverage and Hidden Power dents water types (and can surpise Gyarados if it switches in). I´ve thought about HP [Grass] for Quagsire, though, and Dragon Pulse for overall coverage (but I don´t really think the latter is worth the slot, somehow. I haven´t tried, though.).
    EVs are pretty straightforward.
    Weaknesses are covered by Gliscor (fighting, ground) and Burungeru (fighting).



    [​IMG]

    Nattorei (M) @ Leftovers Trait: Iron Barbs
    EVs: 252 HP / 60 Def / 196 SDef
    Sassy Nature (+SDef, -Spd)
    - Spikes
    - Stealth Rock
    - Thunder Wave
    - Power Whip


    In my opinion, Nattorei is one of the best Pokemon for stall there is. Good defenses, great typing, nice movepool and a nice ability when facing physical attackers. What I do not really like is that I try to use it for two things at once, which doesn´t always work: Laying out Stealth Rock and Spikes (obviously, as early as possible) and spreading paralysis with Thunder Wave. I usually go with TW first, to cripple possible counters. If the opponent doesn´t switch in a counter, i can lay down entry hazards, but if he does, I usually have to switch out and hope I can come back for SR later. And that isn´t always the case. I might give T-Tar Stealth Rock, but I don´t know what to replace.
    Well, anyway, the EVs I got from Smogon, mostly specially defensive.
    Weaknesses covered by: Burungeru (fighting, fire), Heatran (fire), Gliscor (fighting), Garchomp (fire) and T-Tar (fire).


    [​IMG]

    Burungeru (M) @ Leftovers Trait: Water Absorb
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef
    Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
    - Boil Over
    - Recover
    - Night Shade
    - Toxic

    I added Burungeru to my team after testing it for a while (don´t ask me what I replaced ^^) and realising it had a huge fighting weakness. I got raped by a choice banded Terakion after losing Gliscor once. He also provides an ice-resistance for Garchomp and Gliscor. Together with Toxic, Boil Over can support the stallish part of my team by inducing status, Recover for survivability, Night Shade mainly for substitute users, I guess.
    I had a specially defensive EV-spread first, but i suppose i have got special staller with Nattorei. Plus, people I battled told me that defensive Burungeru simply is better. Period. (So far, I haven´t got to know why, though.)
    His weaknesses are covered by Tyranitar (dark), Heatran (grass, dark, ghost), Nattorei (electric, water, ghost, dark = all of them) and by Gliscor and Garchomp (electric).


    [​IMG]

    Garchomp (F) @ Choice Band Trait: Sand Veil
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Outrage
    - Earthquake
    - Dragon Claw
    - Stone Edge/Fire Fang

    So. Garchomp, more or less the star of the team (or at least, he´s supposed to be). As Garchomp can outspeed most non-scarfed Dragons (bar Latios/-as I believe), I decided to give him a Choice Band, which gives him 538 Attack! Dragon/Ground give nice coverage, complented by either SE of FF. I added Fire Fang recently, but haven´t really tested it yet. Garchomp benefits from Nattorei´s spikes and especially the paralysis support, which eliminates many threats.
    The concept more or less is: eliminating steels with T-Tar/ a surprise fire fang by Garchomp/ any other way, crippling as many of the opponent´s team members as possible with TW and then wreaking havoc with a choice banded Outrage.
    EVs are straight, i use jolly to outspeed Pokemon like Sazandora.
    The weaknesses are covered by Heatran (dragon, ice), Nattorei (dragon, can also take most ice attacks) and Burungeru (ice).



    Threats:

    I haven´t got a OU checklist or something like that, but the main threats i´ve come across are Roobushin and Rankurusu.
    The only thing that comes close to a Roobushin counter is Gliscor. As I said above, I had problems with fighting types. I can´t switch Garchomp into one safely, so Gliscor and Burungeru are basically my only options, but in this case, Payback eliminates my water/ghost tank. Gliscor is also my main counter for Dooryuuzu (and he also can handle threats like Blaziken and Birijon well), so he is actually one of the most important pokemon on my team.

    Rankurusu is even worse when he starts calm minding. The thing that does the most damage is Garchomps Outrage, which 2HKOs, but I have to switch him in first. If Rankurusu uses Psycho Shock, Garchomp is in serious trouble, otherwise, something Heatran can come in and attack with Dragon Pulse.

    And I don´t know if Shinboraa is a problem (?), I´ve hardly seen it.

    Oh, and Weavile hurts, since it learns Brick Break (/Low Kick) and can hurt both my fighting resistances with super effective STAB moves. If T-Tar is at full health, it can take a Brick Break and then OHKO, but otherwise I have to rely on smart switching, and more or less on residual damage.

    [EDIT]: I made the experience that DD-Zuruzukin can rip through my entire team. What´s the best way to handle him?

    This is all I can think of for the moment, maybe I will edit this later on.


    Possible Changes...

    ...that I consider have to some extent already been mentioned, that is, switching moves for coverage or the like.

    Maybe giving Garchomp a Choice Scarf instead, which would make him a great revenge killer, but somehow defeat the purpose of trying to build a team around CB-Chomp (and it wouldn´t help against weavile´s Ice Shard, come to think of it).



    I hope this suffices to rate this team properly (or is it even too much?).
    I´ll be happy about anyone who rates, comments or criticizes (team, grammar, style, whatever).

    Thank you.
  2. SmileZ

    SmileZ

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2010
    Messages:
    107
    Hi Stumpen,

    Interesting team you have. I like the use of the Jellicent / Ferrothorn / Gliscor as your defensive core. i know it's quite common but is no doubt effective. I have issues with some of your sets and choices which I would like to bring up. First though, I would like to highlight a couple of threats to your team.

    • Threats
    Birijion
    Reuniclus

    You mention that you can use Gliscor to take on Birijion but they often carry Hidden power Ice and always outspeed. After one Calm Mind it becomes a massive threat to your team. While Reuniclus doesn't pose the same Super Effective coverage that your team fears, once set up it can be a real menace. In order to effectively take both of these threats on, I wanted to suggest a Specially Defensive Swords Dance Scizor.

    Scizor (open)

    [​IMG]
    Scizor (M) @ Lum Berry
    Trait: Technician
    EVs: 248 HP / 64 Atk / 188 SDef / 8 Spd
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - Swords Dance
    - Bullet Punch
    - Bug Bite
    - Roost


    Scizor can Swords Dance as either of the above 2 Calm Mind and either cleanly beat Birijion with Bullet Punch or Bug Bite Reuniclus for the OHKO. The only Attack which is feared from both is Focus Blast hence the SDef Ev's. The Speed is there to outspeed 0 and 4 Spd Scizor. You wouldn't be staying in against it either way but it's nice to know.

    I wish I could suggest who to replace but I'll have to leave that up to you. I'm guessing you want to keep you core in place,

    I also want to suggest some small changes to your Ferrothorn and Tyranitar sets.


    TTar and Fthorn sets (open)

    [​IMG]

    Tyranitar (M) @ Expert Belt
    Trait: Sand Stream
    EVs: 252 HP / 176 SAtk / 80 SDef
    Quiet Nature (+SAtk, -Spd)
    - Flamethrower
    - Ice Beam
    - Crunch
    - Stealth Rock


    [​IMG]
    Nattorei (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Iron Barbs
    EVs: 252 HP / 60 Def / 196 SDef
    Sassy Nature (+SDef, -Spd)
    - Spikes
    - Leech Seed
    - Thunder Wave
    - Power Whip


    [​IMG]

    Gliscor (M) @ Toxic Orb
    Trait: Poison Heal
    EVs: 252 HP / 40 Atk / 216 Def
    Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
    - Protect
    - Earthquake
    - Fling
    - Acrobat



    The above changes allow you have a slightly more effective TTar ensuring Sand is up and providing you with an effective Speical wall which can counter the likes of the Latios/as and play with Drizzle teams with less worry.

    The Tyranitar change allows you to free up a slot on Ferrothorn for Leech Seed with provides extra annoyance and passive damage which always helps with a sweep late game.

    The Gliscor set is pretty standard now. It allows you to combat alot of the physical Fighting types once the Toxic Orb has been flung which should be at the earliest opportunity.

    The biggest worry for the team though is a lack of direction.. What exactly is your plan with the team? I know you say you are planning to sweep with Outrage but that plan isn't enough when you mention taking out Steel types with Tyranitar, who has an issue with Steel types in a metagame which favours them carrying alot of SDef.

    Try the changes and let me know if they help at all.
  3. Stumpen

    Stumpen

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2011
    Messages:
    12
    Hi SmileZ, thanks for the reply.

    I haven´t thouroughly tested the changes on the sets yet, but they definitely seem to make sense^^ (I can edit this post, right? I´ll let you know later)

    I´m not sure about adding Scizor. If I want to keep my core in place, as you said, I´ll have to remove one of the more aggressive team members to fit him in, and I don´t know how effective he is as a sweeper this gen (it would seem weird to choose him just to counter two threats)(?).
    Regarding the direction of the team...I guess you´re right about that^^ Is it possible to have a core which is more or less hyper defensive and then, I don´t know, just add some powerful sweepers with the right synergy? Or if I still want to use Garchomp as main sweeper, as SDer maybe, does he even get the support he needs with a defensive core or is that the wrong way when battling with Chomp?
    (or would this change so much that it´s practically a new team?)
    I think you really pointed out the biggest problem with this :D I don´t quite know where to go.
    Well, I´ll come back to this thread after some testing, I guess.
  4. SmileZ

    SmileZ

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2010
    Messages:
    107
    I think SD chomp could work but you still need to address the issue of removing his counters. Faster Special attackers who use Ice attacks, Steel types and bulky physical walls. No Steel type has yet to break base 100 Spe and the most common Scarfed Steel types are Jirachi and Heatran, who could both carry Ice type attacks. Latios and Latias should be covered by Tyranitar if you change the set to the one I suggested. You could move some HP EV's to Atk and run Pursuit to ensure that you can remove them all of the time. Try the below set:


    Garchomp (open)

    [​IMG]

    Garchomp (F) @ Yache Berry
    Trait: Sand Veil
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Swords Dance
    - Outrage / Dragon Claw
    - Earthquake
    - Fire Fang


    Give the above set a try with all the other changes. Consider the Scizor change as well. He checks and counters so much in the current Metagame.
  5. Stumpen

    Stumpen

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2011
    Messages:
    12
    Okay, I´m back after some testing.
    I think Scizor definitely has a place in this team, he really covers up some of its main weaknesses (e.g. Weavile). He took Heatran´s place fits in pretty well. If I find the time I´ll update the main post.
    But I think I still don´t quite know how to use Garchomp (I use the SD set, it´s quite fun :). I usually keep him back a bit and don´t want to risk anything with him, but sometimes I complete a whole battle without him in this way. Is it best to bring him in as early as possible and fire away anyattack and see with what the opponent tries to counter him with and then just try to dispose of these counters or are there smarter ways?
  6. RAM

    RAM

    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2010
    Messages:
    28
    I see you have recieved an abundence of help already but i know you will lose your choice band but i would actually recommend using brightpowder as an item so you get sand veil evasivness raise and bright powder evasivness raise, makes Chomp way harder to hit

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