Monotype Viability Rankings

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all falls down

thanks ugly god
is a Tiering Contributor Alumnus
Week 2:

This will end on October 4th

Things to think about while ranking:
-Does this Pokemon need to stay, move up, or down?
-How does this Pokemon fare in the metagame?
-What is this Pokemon walled by? Can your teammates successfully check / counter it?
-What is this Pokemon's role. Is it outclassed by other Pokemon? Is this role useful for its type?
-Is its ability beneficial? Do other Pokemon outclass it?

This Week's Pokemon!

(Flying) Zapdos (Currently A Rank) Original Post

(Normal) Staraptor (Currently A Rank) Original Post
(Bug) Pinsir (Currently A Tier)
Original Post
What I have to say about Zapdos has been summed up by other people, I agree with S Rank.

Staraptor in my extensive experience with normal monotypes is easy S rank alongside Chansey because it is pretty much essential for every competitive normal team.

The main reason, along with its typing, is Staraptor is normal's only viable hazard remover with defog, and because normal is best played as semi-stall, it is extremely important to keep hazards off the field. Staraptor can play the role of a bulky defogger effectively due to its fantastic ability Intimidate that will greatly boost its ability to tank moves, even with its average defensive stats. A few examples of its defensive potential:

-1 252+ Atk Heracross Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Staraptor: 127-150 (33.9 - 40.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

-1 252+ Atk Conkeldurr Drain Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Staraptor: 85-102 (22.7 - 27.2%) -- 47.9% chance to 4HKO

+1 252+ Atk Technician Breloom Mach Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Staraptor: 145-172 (38.7 - 45.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO (Swords dance then intimidated)

252 SpA Choice Specs Keldeo Secret Sword vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Staraptor: 186-220 (49.7 - 58.8%) -- 74.2% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Staraptor also has a phenomenal choice scarf set that can dismantle fighting teams and break pesky walls, and forms a good offensive core with diggersby, along with revenge killing. A choice band set can also be used, and while it is good, the other two sets are too good to give up on. ((I always wish I could use two Staraptors on the same time, one for defog one for scarf, staravia doesn't cut it))

These are three amazing, perfectly viable sets that easily allow Staraptor to go to S rank.


I am impartial with Mega Pinsir because on one hand it is obviously an offensive powerhouse that tears through teams like Water, Bug, and Fighting, but on the other hand it compounds Bug's stealth rock and rock type weakness and also uses the valuable mega slot which can be used by two other amazing pokemon (Scizor and Heracross), so for now I'll say it deserves A Rank.
 
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all falls down

thanks ugly god
is a Tiering Contributor Alumnus
My issue with Murkrow, especially that set, is while you're setting up mean look, things can easily taunt you into struggle. It's more likely for people to shutdown Murkrow than it is for them to suspect you have like Pursuit or something, assuming Murkrow ever rarely carry one attack move.

That being said, I don't think it's worthy of D Rank.

D Rank: Reserved for Pokemon that are outclassed in almost every single way. These Pokemon are only used for one of their moves, or for their typing / ability. Even so, they are generally second rate Pokemon meaning that they can be only brought in once or twice to perform their role. These Pokemon rarely adapt to the metagame.

I feel like the definition of C Rank fits Trollburd better:

C Rank: Reserved for Pokemon that are only used to check a threat once or twice. These Pokemon often run unorthodox sets since their primary niches are outclassed by other Pokemon. Since they run unorthodox sets, some Pokemon can set up on them without fear. These Pokemon need a lot of support (which may be hard to give) for them to function. These Pokemon have a hard time adapting to the metagame.

Sableye most definately outclasses Murkrow on Dark with prankster recover and WoW Spamming, and people know they can't 100% of the time get away with taunting it since it carries a damaging move often, usually Knock Off.

And while it doesn't have Prankster, Eviolite Staravia, or even just BulkyRaptor are fairly better featherdancers than Murkrow, since on switch in they already get that -1 Attack from intimidate.

So since both types have an arguably better, (Though not completely viable) option, it's hard for me to suggest Murkrow any higher. Therefore I say C Rank.

Just a note, Murkrow gets prankster taunt that it can use in place of feather dance, so it can taunt other non prankster taunters before it gets taunted(hue)
I would also say that it is D rank because its only niche is psuedo perish trapping, when for the most part neither Flying nor dark have trouble eliminating walls. (Besides Clefable, which Murkrow can force out after three turns, but is destroyed by moonblast.)

((although i love it so much))
 
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my votes
Zapdos Flying Vote
Zapdos @ Leftovers

Ability: Pressure
EVs: 240 HP / 252 SpD / 16 Spe
Calm Nature
- Discharge
- Roost
- Defog
- Heat Wave/Toxic

Zapdos @ Leftovers

Ability: Pressure
EVs: 240 HP / 252 Def/ 16 Spe
Bold Nature
- Discharge
- Roost
- Defog
- Heat Wave/Toxic



Before you come at me and say some shit hear me out. First of all Zapods along with skarm are best deffogers in for flying. Zapdos having access to reliable recovery and heat wave to beat some of its counters. The main thing what makes zapdos an S Rank poke imo is the ability to be physically of specially defensive pokemon. Also having discharge (which paras all the frickin time) 30% of the time simiiar to scald. Zapdos also does not rely on much support to function if its specially defensive then switch in on a special move. It gets so many opportunities to defog its crazy. Every flying user with a brain uses a Zapdos with defog on their team so overall my Vote goes to S Rank for defog support reliable recovery move and good last slot moves (Toxic and Heat Wave) and also one more thing it is only weak to 2 types with its typing rock and ice.
Starpator Normal Vote
Staraptor @ Choice Scarf

Ability: Reckless
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Double-Edge
- U-turn
- Brave Bird
- Close Combat
Staraptor @ Choice Band

Ability: Reckless
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Double-Edge
- U-turn
- Brave Bird
- Close Combat

Staraptor @ Leftovers

Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Brave Bird
- Roost
- Defog
- Feather Dance

Staraptor helps normal with fighting the hardest matchup for normal. It also gives normal defog support and has the decent natural bulk. Either it cna hit hard or be an exl wall and defogger which is one of very few viable ones. Alaso it igves normal a very fast attacker that hits like a truck ovcerall my vote is staraptor goes to S Rank for normal.
Also one thing i think we should have a vote on gastro for ground type :).
 
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Also one thing i think we should have a vote on gastro for ground type :).
Ditto to this. I feel like Gastrodon brings enough to Ground Mono teams that is seriously needed against Monos such as Water and Ice to merit more than a B rank. I don't have time to go into detail, maybe later.
 

Freeroamer

The greatest story of them all.
is a Community Contributoris a Top Tiering Contributor
As I'm sure you guys have noticed, a lot of people have put sprites into their sig to link to their own analysis (props to Acast being the trendsetter here) and this is a great advertisement for everything we've done in the thread so far. However I know a couple of people have had issues linking the sprites to the posts so I thought I'd make this post to help out ^_^

I assume you all know how to get sprites, if you don't just PM me here or on PS! and I'll run you through it.

In terms of linking the sprites to the posts, you can't just use the link button in the toolbar as for some reason it'll only link the first or last one you do and leave the rest unlinked. You need to use some simple BB codes to be able to link your sprites instead :)

First thing to do is to be able to find the post URL that you want linking to the sprite. This is really easy as it's simply a case of clicking the post number which will be in the bottom right hand corner of the post eg. this one is #584. Once you click on this, you want to go to the lower text box and copy everything in between the first two square brackets [ ] including the brackets. Then you need to paste this on the left hand side of the sprite you want to link to that post so it should look like [URL=post link] **sprite here** so far. From here, you simply need to add [/URL] on the right hand side of the sprite to wrap the sprite and you're done!

An example: I'll just make one quick so you can see the format, this would link the Vaporeon sprite to it's analysis at the top of the page if the stars are removed.

[*URL="http://2ww.smogon.com/forums/thread...heck-posts-3-375.3517737/page-24#post-5769634"*]
[*/URL*]

Without stars:

If you're interested in other BB codes on Smogon, check this out.

Feel free to PM me if this is confusing in any way, here or on PS!
 
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Zappy Bird for S Rank

As a generic user, I know the worth of Zapdos. W/o it, I'd be screwed in so many ways, with access to Defog and Roost, Zapdos can be a long term Defogger which Flying needs. Also, unlike Skarmory, Togekiss, Mandibuzz and a plethora of other "defoggers" Zapdos has a neutrality to Electric moves. So even the strongest of Electric moves can't 2HKO specially invested Zapdos. Also, unlike Togekiss and Mandibuzz, it gets Heat Wave which lets it muscle past stuff like Ferrothorn or Skarm. Toxic is another solid choice since you can easily stall out stuff.
Zapdos also forms a brilliant core w/ Skarmory and Togekiss :]

https://www.replay.pokemonshowdown.com/frost-oumonotype-1011970 luls, I almost did the same w/ DM earlier but hax :[

Staraptor for S Rank

I cry inside whenever I see a Normal team w/o a Staraptor. This thing along, can 6-0 a majority of Physical Fighting types with a combination of Intimidate, Roost, Feather Dance, and Brave Bird. Or you can run an alternate set w/ a Scarf + Brave Bird. Either way, it's an awesome addition for Normal.

Pinsir for A Rank

Although it's one of the best things out there / on a majority of Bug teams, it's just not good enough to be S Rank. W/ a crippling 4x weakness to Stealth Rock after mega evolving, it's more of a one time use thing. Bug, also has a pretty hard time Defogging / Rapid Spinning so it'd be kinda hard to provide the support that it needs. Also, Pinsir has a hard time setting up most of the time, and a majority of types have some sort of solution to it naturally, meaning that they don't have the go out of their way to counter it. (Skarm (Steel Flying) / Zapdos (Flying Electric), Rotom-H (Fire) / Rotom-W (Water), Mandibuzz (Dark), Mega Aggron / Rhyperior (Rock), Hippodown (Ground) etc.)
 
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Marowak (D Rank) for Ground


The Good:

Marowak is blessed with an item that is, almost entirely, vital for its viability. Its evolutionary line-exclusive Thick Club doubles its base 80 attack, making it very threatening offensively to many Pokemon. Bonemerang, one of its signature moves, is an alternative to ever-reliable Earthquake with the ability to get through substitutes and focus sash. Coverage moves, including Stone Edge and Fire Punch, help remedy Ground resistance, and it has access to moves such as Knock Off and Smack Down that aren't too common on semi-viable Ground types. It has access to two relatively decent abilities in Rock Head (which, although really only has use for Double-Edge, 0 recoil is worth it), and Battle Armor (blocking crits).


The Bad:

The Bone Keeper Pokemon finds itself generally outclassed offensively by Excadrill and defensively by Hippowdon. While Marowak is able to deal more damage than Excadrill, it lacks the speed to allow it to attack its target twice, and Hippowdon has higher HP and reliable recovery moves to match its defenses. Even if running Assault Vest, Marowak is highly vulnerable to prevalent special attackers such as Keldeo and Greninja, and certainly doesn't have the speed to strike first against them and other S-tier threats. It doesn't help that its weaknesses in Water, Grass, and Ice are mainly special-based, and that Marowak generally cannot safely switch out to teammates besides Gastrodon against Water. Worst of all, however, is the fact that Marowak simply doesn't have the movepool or stats to set it apart from other Ground types or to properly check its threats.

Marowak @ Thick Club
Ability: Rock Head
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake / Bonemerang
- Double-Edge
- Stone Edge / Smack Down
- Knock Off / Fire Punch

The choice between Earthquake and Bonemerang depends entirely on your preference on either getting 100% accuracy or breaking subs and sashes. Double-Edge is a solid choice with Rock Head, preventing recoil damage completely. Stone Edge combats Flying and Bug types that normally resist or are immune to Ground attacks, while Smack Down is a fun little move that gets rid of Ground immunity completely.The always-useful Knock Off can deplete Pokemon that are very dependent on their item (i.e., Marowak), and Fire Punch provides more coverage against Grass and Ice.

 
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Marowak (D Rank) for Ground


The Good:

Marowak is blessed with an item that is, almost entirely, vital for its viability. Its evolutionary line-exclusive Thick Club doubles its base 80 attack, making it very threatening offensively to many Pokemon. Bonemerang, one of its signature moves, is an alternative to ever-reliable Earthquake with the ability to get through substitutes and focus sash. Coverage moves, including Stone Edge and Fire Punch, help remedy Ground resistance, and it has access to moves such as Knock Off and Smack Down that aren't too common semi-viable Ground types. It has access to two relatively decent abilities in Rock Head (which, although really only has use for Double-Edge, 0 recoil is worth it), and Battle Armor (blocking crits).


The Bad:

The Bone Keeper Pokemon finds itself generally outclassed offensively by Excadrill and defensively by Hippowdon. While Marowak is able to deal more damage than Excadrill, it lacks the speed to allow it to attack its target twice, and Hippowdon has higher HP and reliable recovery moves to match its defenses. Even if running Assault Vest, Marowak is highly vulnerable to prevalent special attackers such as Keldeo and Greninja, and certainly doesn't have the speed to strike first against them and other S-tier threats. It doesn't help that its weaknesses in Water, Grass, and Ice are mainly special-based, and that Marowak generally cannot safely switch out to teammates besides Gastrodon against Water. Worst of all, however, is the fact that Marowak simply doesn't have the movepool or stats to set it apart from other Ground types or to properly check its threats.

Marowak @ Thick Club
Ability: Rock Head
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake / Bonemerang
- Double-Edge
- Stone Edge / Smack Down
- Knock Off / Fire Punch

The choice between Earthquake and Bonemerang depends entirely on your preference on either getting 100% accuracy or breaking subs and sashes. Double-Edge is a solid choice with Rock Head, preventing recoil damage completely. Stone Edge combats Flying and Bug types that normally resist or are immune to Ground attacks, while Smack Down is a fun little move that gets rid of Ground immunity completely.The always-useful Knock Off can deplete Pokemon that are very dependent on their item (i.e., Marowak), and Fire Punch provides more coverage against Grass and Ice.



Still makes me wonder why he isn't blessed with Rock Polish. Anyway D rank seems fitting for a mon that can easily be viable just doesn't have the needed tools sadly.
 
Nidoqueen for (poison) B rank, and (ground) D rank



Nidoqueen @ Focus Sash
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 248 HP / 240 Def / 20 Spe
Bold Nature
- Ice Beam
- Earth Power
- Stealth Rock
- Roar

The classic nidoqueen from past generations. Roar is generaly more reliable than dragontail, mostly (although 90 accuracy dosen't help it's case either) because of things that will sub on nidoqueen, rather than immune fairies. 20 speed allows it to outrun uninvested base 80 pokes. Gets rocks up with it's bulk in neutral and good match ups, and with sash otherwise. Roars out things that lead against it hoping for free setup on a non offensive mon.

Nidoqueen @ Life Orb
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 128HP / 252 SpA / 128Spe
Modest Nature
- Roar
- Earth Power
- Stealth Rock
- Ice Beam

A quick /ds poison type, stealth rock revels that the king and queen are the only users poison has. If you plan to build a team around stallbreaker access, then the great hazard becomes very nice for the defensive core of poison. Modest differentiates it from nidoking, although it still outspeeds 252+nature base 60s, offensive suicune, and fully defensive base 90 pokemon. The modest nature powers it up as a wall breaker for all of these, and it's ability to force switches helps get the rocks up, especially since nidoqueen can go 1vs1 with practically any defogger, as it can tank a hit if needed.

Nidoqueen is still the 4th best special attacker for ground teams (after nidoking, lando-I, and mega-garchomp). It functions similiarly to Nidoking and has the ability to run fire coverage as well if it wants specifically beat ferrothorn. Like Nidoking, it receives the rare move disable, and taunt, although nidoking's greater speed makes them more suitable to him as a 4th suprise move and more feasible. It's massive physical movepool is less worth exploring (even with scolipede support) than nidoking's due to it's emphasis on defensive stats.
 
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Cloyster (Ice) B rank and (water) C rank



Cloyster @ White Herb
Ability: Skill Link
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Shell Smash
- Icicle Spear
- Rock Blast/hidden power fire
- Hydro Pump

He sets up, preferably behind dual screens( he only really wants reflect and good choosing in opponet though), and then proceeds to sweep the opponent. Can't take special attacks at all, but if it sucessfully remains at full health it can live priority moves through his fat defense stat. Coverage is either against water teams or the ferrothorn clan. Some people prefer to bet on king's rock, but I prefer the classic.

Cloyster @ Nevermeltice
Ability: Skill Link
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Shell Smash
- Icicle Spear
- Rock Blast
- Ice Shard

An optional build primarily for water teams rather than ice, it allows skymin to be checked and allows you to ohko the scarf latios preffered on higher dragon teams despite not out speeding it after you shell smash. (NevermeltIce is neccesary with jolly, otherwise you get a 50% OHKO chance rather than 100%.)

Cloyster @ Focus Sash
Ability: Skill Link
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Icicle Spear
- Rapid Spin
- Shell Smash
- Explosion

Jolly is usually superior as it gives Cloyster the ability to outrun all threats up to Choice Scarf Terrakion after a Shell Smash, whereas Adamant Cloyster is outrun by base 95 Choice Scarf users and up, such as Kyurem-W. A sash cloyster excels at wiping out opposing leads and then spinning away to die when they send out something cabable of walling him. Against several types, this can mean that you permenantly remove their ability to lay hazards. It cannot be overstated how much the ice match up appreciates this. Explosion can be replaced with spikes for some help bringing things down into kyurem-W's OHKO range. If avalugg's in reserve, it can use 2 attacks+hazard (spikes help so much more than toxic spikes though) to hit a slightly larger amount of the metagame.

Cloyster is a pokemon that lives on the edge, either providing one time (hopefully worth while support) or letting it's teamates support it(either by drawing out one of the few things it can set up on or screens) and sweeping itself. It's relatively hard to prepare for and sees work against many teams. However, a fully defensive bold/calm spread is completely outclassed by the more reliable starmie/avalugg/tentacruel. It also finds it's coverage stopped by a handful of defensive heavyweights, and has multiple KO's that it requires one turn of spikes or 2 turns of SR to get. Sometimes it can opt for the extreme power of LO to shatter even ferrothorn instantly with it's icicle spear. Some people even remember when it had an adamant scarf set, which made up for losing to other scarfed pokemon and base 115 +nature pokemon by pretending to be medicham two generations before it's time. Sometimes It's lead set's will swap out sash for lum berry or mental herb for teams that feel weak to taunt leads or expect opponet's to know how to react to standard cloyster. Naive >Jolly gets no new relevant OHKOs from +2 hydro pump without rain support.
 
Gourgeist (Ghost) for A rank
Hello guys! Today im going to talk about a very defensive, sizable, and Halloween-like pokemon! Its Gourgeist!


Super-Sized Defender
252 HP/252 Def/ 4 Atk
Leech Seed
Light Screen
Will-o-wisp/toxic
Shadow Sneak

Explanation: Gourgeist-Super has good HP and great Defense, making it a great physical staller. It's unique typing and movepool gives Gourgeist alot of coverage over her weaknesses. She also makes a great defensive core with Jellicent, switching onto Wild Charge and Power Whip, while Jellicent can switch in to Ice Beam, Fire Blast, and Specs Air Slash.
Set Details: Leech Seed helps Gourgeist gain huge amounts of HP recovery while damaging HP invested Walls like Alomomola and Eviolite Chansey. Gourgeist can also use Will-o-wisp to boost her high defense, or toxic to poison those nasty Fire types/Water Veil Pokemon. Gourgeist can also boost her tiny Special Defense with Light Screen, earning her more defensive coverage. Last but not least, Gourgeist can use Shadow Sneak to finish off her foes and not be Taunted and Struggled to death. Gourgeist is SO defensive that it can take these moves:

252+ Atk Choice Band Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Gourgeist-Super: 294-348 (78.6 - 93%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

+1 252+ Atk Charizard Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Gourgeist-Super: 302-356 (80.7 - 95.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

252+ SpA Abomasnow Blizzard vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Gourgeist-Super through Light Screen: 196-232 (52.4 - 62%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after hail damage and Leftovers recovery

252+ SpA Aegislash-Blade Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Gourgeist-Super through Light Screen: 202-238 (54 - 63.6%) -- Wait, who runs special Aegislash?
Anyway, guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
 

Sae

In the midst of Orre
is a Tiering Contributor
Nidoqueen for (poison) C rank, and (ground) D rank


Nidoqueen @ Life Orb
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 128 HP / 252 SpA / 128 Spe
Modest Nature
- Sludge Wave
- Earth Power
- Stealth Rock
- Ice Beam

A quick /ds poison type, stealth rock revels that the king and queen are the only users poison has. If you plan to build a team around stallbreaker access, then the great hazard becomes very nice for the defensive core of poison. Modest differentiates it from nidoking, although it still outspeeds 252+nature base 60s, offensive suicune, and fully defensive base 90 pokemon. The modest nature powers it up as a wall breaker for all of these, and it's ability to force switches helps get the rocks up, especially since nidoqueen can go 1vs1 with practically any defogger, as it can tank a hit if needed.

Nidoqueen @ Life Orb
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Sludge Wave
- Earth Power
- Substitute
- Disable

Outclassed by gengar and nidoking, who have speed or typing to come in on far more threats, like them however, it easily catches many pokemon by surprise and leads to more and more switches from your opponet.

Nidoqueen @ Black Sludge
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 248 HP / 240 Def / 20 Spe
Bold Nature
- Ice Beam
- Earth Power
- Stealth Rock
- Dragon Tail
Nidoqueen as a wall is just problemic in monotype. It can't receive wish support on its types, and additionally, no one will direct fighting attacks at a poison mono, ground has bulky chomp, hippodon, and the rare lando-t which are signifigantly better . However on a poison mono, it can absorb thunder waves directed at fast pokemon, and can stall out dual screens by chasing the screener with it's still decent attacks, and then dragon tailing the set up poke when it tries to get in free boosts. 20 speed allows it to outrun uninvested base 80 pokes.

Nidoqueen is still the 4th best special attacker for ground teams (after nidoking, lando-I, and mega-garchomp). It functions similiarly to Nidoking and has the ability to run fire coverage as well if it wants specifically beat ferrothorn. Like Nidoking, it receives the rare move disable, and taunt, although nidoking's greater speed makes them more suitable to him as a 4th suprise move and more feasible. It's massive physical movepool is less worth exploring (even with scolipede support) than nidoking's due to it's emphasis on defensive stats.
*Just a note I put a hide tag on your sets so it wouldn't fill up the entire page when you click expand from the reply tag.

Okay so I'm gonna have to say while I do agree with your ranking for Nidoqueen for Ground, but I have to disagree with you on it's ranking for Poison. Nidoqueen for B rank on Poison.

Here's the main reason: it's the only viable Stealth Rocker. You could argue that Nidoking could Stealth Rock but it isn't viable at all. Also Nidoqueen can setup Toxic Spikes or let Scolipede use them with Spikes to make a really annoying hazard stacking core. In that case Dragon Tail and Roar are options, but most people won't be using a hazard stacking core besides Toxic Spikes but it's still out there. Honestly the best set for Nidoqueen is either a Sash lead to get up rocks with 3 attacks or change the item for a LO. Yeah you lose power with Nidoqueen if you have a Sash but quite frankly that's not the point of Nidoqueen. It's role is to get up Stealth Rock through its better bulk than Nidoking, and if it can't tank a hit that's what the Sash is for. Nidoking's role is to sweep slower mons, Nidoqueen is to provide that extra support.

Ground is self-explanatory. It doesn't do anything worthwhile.

So yeah B rank Poison, D rank Ground.
 

Acast

Ghost of a Forum Mod & PS Room Owner
is a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Staff Alumnus
Gourgeist (Ghost) for A rank
Hello guys! Today im going to talk about a very defensive, sizable, and Halloween-like pokemon! Its Gourgeist!


Super-Sized Defender
252 HP/252 Def/ 4 Atk
Leech Seed
Light Screen
Will-o-wisp/toxic
Shadow Sneak

Explanation: Gourgeist-Super has good HP and great Defense, making it a great physical staller. It's unique typing and movepool gives Gourgeist alot of coverage over her weaknesses. She also makes a great defensive core with Jellicent, switching onto Wild Charge and Power Whip, while Jellicent can switch in to Ice Beam, Fire Blast, and Specs Air Slash.
Set Details: Leech Seed helps Gourgeist gain huge amounts of HP recovery while damaging HP invested Walls like Alomomola and Eviolite Chansey. Gourgeist can also use Will-o-wisp to boost her high defense, or toxic to poison those nasty Fire types/Water Veil Pokemon. Gourgeist can also boost her tiny Special Defense with Light Screen, earning her more defensive coverage. Last but not least, Gourgeist can use Shadow Sneak to finish off her foes and not be Taunted and Struggled to death. Gourgeist is SO defensive that it can take these moves:

252+ Atk Choice Band Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Gourgeist-Super: 294-348 (78.6 - 93%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

+1 252+ Atk Charizard Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Gourgeist-Super: 302-356 (80.7 - 95.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

252+ SpA Abomasnow Blizzard vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Gourgeist-Super through Light Screen: 196-232 (52.4 - 62%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after hail damage and Leftovers recovery

252+ SpA Aegislash-Blade Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Gourgeist-Super through Light Screen: 202-238 (54 - 63.6%) -- Wait, who runs special Aegislash?
Anyway, guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
I'm sorry but Gourgeist has already been reserved and finished for both Ghost and Grass.
 

Acast

Ghost of a Forum Mod & PS Room Owner
is a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Staff Alumnus
I apologize in advance as I am going to be a little harsh with this one.

You will never ever see Pidgeotto used unless your intention is to run a team of gimmicks. And even then, Staravia is far better. Intimidate effectively makes Staravia more physically bulky than Pidgeotto regardless of stats. Pidgeotto does take special attacks better than Staravia, but that's all that Bird Jesus Jr. has over Staravia. Also, something to consider is that we're talking about Flying. The type that has a ridiculous number of options and can pull off almost any kind of team from Hyper Offensive to outright stall and has the ability to run an entire team of OU Pokemon and still have 3 OU options that were left off the team. C rank is far too high for Pidgeotto, especially on a Flying team, and I personally think it's even a bit of a stretch to put it in D rank. I'm more inclined to place Pidgeotto in E rank.

The post that this is in response to was deleted, so ignore this.
 
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Pidgeotto should be Unranked actually.
E rank is for horrible pokemon but that can still offer something unique (keeping in mind that "unique" =/= "useful") such as Shedinja.
Pidgeotto is as generic as it gets, and not worth ranking.
 
Sableye Dark type A rank
Why A rank well one world prankster.
Sableye prankster ability
nature bold or impish
leftovers
EV's
set 1 set 2
252 hp 252 hp
0 atk 0 atk
252 def 4 def
0 Sp Atk 0 sp atk
4 Sp Def 252 sp def
0 spd 0 spd

moves are the same for both sets
Taunt
will o wisp
recover
foul play/ knock off

When using Sableye there are a few things to keep in mind:
1. immune to normal fighting and psychic
2. only weakness is x2 Fairy
Now when you see that it makes Sableye seem really strong but you have to remember that its base stat total is only 380 its base stats are very low the highest being def and atk at 75.
Sableye is very frail use it's priority taunt to stop set up or supportive Pokemon.
Burn physical attackers and all Pokemon you can burn use will o wisp to do then use knock off or foul play to chip the opponents health and recover to stall them to death.

Sableye will die if he gets hit by very powerful stab moves or a move from a Pokemon who has already set up.
Sableye needs help to deal with fire type as it can't burn them so try to have a toxic user ready to help and remember Heatran is one of your worst match ups.
 
This week's Pokemon:

Gastrodon: A necessary Pokemon on any serious Ground team, Storm Drain allows it to not only absorb Water attacks (a dreaded scenario for Ground) but to raise its special attack, allowing for moves such as Scald and Earth Power to hit well and hard. Ice neutrality is also a nice bonus, and the fact that it can be switched in to counter many offensive threats such as Keldeo (not running sub), Kyurem-B, and non-Grass Knot Greninja makes it a very reliable option, and gives it very unique presence on Ground mono. While Grass attacks are a sore spot, there are at least a few decent Ground Mons that can switch in to take a Giga Drain or Grass Knot. Toxic + Recover stall is another role Gastro can perform if needed, though shouldn't be set up on for the fact that it won't take +2 neutral hits well, and is too slow to Recover quickly enough to keep the stall going when attacked with powerful hits.

It will mainly be taken advantage of by anything that has Grass moves or uses sub, but it fills its advantageous role on Ground very well, and for that reason I'm going to give it A Rank.

I'm not well versed with Crobat and Lanturn, so I'll pass on those for now unless I get some better knowledge and experience with them.
 

DoW

formally Death on Wings
Sableye Dark type A rank
Why A rank well one world prankster.
Sableye prankster ability
nature bold or impish
leftovers
EV's
set 1 set 2
252 hp 252 hp
0 atk 0 atk
252 def 4 def
0 Sp Atk 0 sp atk
4 Sp Def 252 sp def
0 spd 0 spd

moves are the same for both sets
Taunt
will o wisp
recover
foul play/ knock off

When using Sableye there are a few things to keep in mind:
1. immune to normal fighting and psychic
2. only weakness is x2 Fairy
Now when you see that it makes Sableye seem really strong but you have to remember that its base stat total is only 380 its base stats are very low the highest being def and atk at 75.
Sableye is very frail use it's priority taunt to stop set up or supportive Pokemon.
Burn physical attackers and all Pokemon you can burn use will o wisp to do then use knock off or foul play to chip the opponents health and recover to stall them to death.

Sableye will die if he gets hit by very powerful stab moves or a move from a Pokemon who has already set up.
Sableye needs help to deal with fire type as it can't burn them so try to have a toxic user ready to help and remember Heatran is one of your worst match ups.
I think that Sableye's immunity to fighting needs more emphasis on dark teams, as it's the only thing that stops HJK Medicham from sweeping a significant portion of the team:
252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham High Jump Kick vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Mandibuzz: 246-291 (58.1 - 68.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Other than that, good analysis ^-^
 
I think that Sableye's immunity to fighting needs more emphasis on dark teams, as it's the only thing that stops HJK Medicham from sweeping a significant portion of the team:
252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham High Jump Kick vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Mandibuzz: 246-291 (58.1 - 68.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Other than that, good analysis ^-^
Your also forgetting it stops keldo from clean sweeping dark teams.
 

all falls down

thanks ugly god
is a Tiering Contributor Alumnus
Anttyaz said:
Week 2:

This will end on October 4th

Things to think about while ranking:
-Does this Pokemon need to stay, move up, or down?
-How does this Pokemon fare in the metagame?
-What is this Pokemon walled by? Can your teammates successfully check / counter it?
-What is this Pokemon's role. Is it outclassed by other Pokemon? Is this role useful for its type?
-Is its ability beneficial? Do other Pokemon outclass it?

This Week's Pokemon!





GASTRODON (Ground) -> S RANK (persuade me for A rank)
EDIT: I've changed my mind and think S is a stretch, A is good.

To explain this I'll start by listing Ground Pokemon immune to water moves:

Palpitoad - NFE

Wooper - NFE

Quagsire - Quagsire is known for unaware, and unaware is its only niche. Its defensive stats are mediocre at best (95/85/60) as well are its attacking stats (85/65) leaving it outclassed and not viable (as a water absorber) for ground. It would probably be C rank on Ground for being used in conjunction with other Pokemon as an unaware user, but elevating the grass weakness.

Seismitoad - Access to stealth rock and better bulk than Quagsire (100/75/75), but still poor attacking stats (95,85) , and no reliable recovery, meaning it cannot repeatedly switch in, it would probably be D rank on ground.

Gastrodon - Highest overall bulk of all of these Pokemon (111/62/82), still mediocre attacking stats (83/92), but highest special attack of these, which is what Ground appreciates the most. Reliable recovery in recover, can be a nuisance to teams without grass coverage or status. Storm Drain is also arguably more beneficial than Water Absorb because with a boost it will allow Gastrodon to not be setup fodder (For example, if Gastrodon switches on SubCM Keldeo and gets a +1 boost, its earth power can consistently break the substitute, even after a Calm Mind boost.) Gastrodon is Ground's premier specially defensive Pokemon, and is seen on pretty much every Ground team.

To end my argument, Ground without a water immunity is like Steel without a fire immunity; you can use a neutral Pokemon like Swampert for Ground or Empoleon for Steel, but they will be worn down very easily by strong moves, not to mention their lack of recovery.


CROBAT (POISON) -> B RANK
CROBAT (FLYING) -> D RANK

Poison:
Crobat's physical movepool is terrible, allowing it no means of boosting its stats without lowering speed (curse), and no coverage for an offensive set other than its STABS which happen to be awful neutral coverage, being hard walled by every steel-type and rock-type Pokemon. Crobat's attack stat is also mediocre, meaning that most dedicated physical walls like Slowbro can easily take it on. Flying, offensively, is similar to poison offensively, providing redundant coverage for a Poison team. Defensively, Fighting-type, Bug-type, and Grass-type moves are easily sponged by other Pokemon on a Poison team.

Crobat admittedly proves to the most useful for Poison as a late-game sweeper against Bug teams and Fighting teams, as Pokemon like Volcarona are big threats, but Pokemon like Scarfed Genesect, Scarfed Heracross, Scolipede, Galvantula, Terrakion, and Genesect can easily dispose of Crobat.

Crobat as a defogger is notable, but is not a unique quality as other Pokemon have defog like Skuntank, who has a bigger niche with its Psychic immunity, and access to STAB sucker punch and pursuit.

Flying:
Flying has far better users of flying STAB. Staraptor, Honchkrow, Togekiss are all examples.
Flying has far better defoggers. Zapdos, Togekiss, Skarmory, Mandibuzz are all example.
Crobat is outclassed and weak offensively and defensively, with a poor move pool.



I don't have much experience with Lanturn so I won't say anything, although I feel like it's fine where it is in A rank along with all the hundreds of bulky water Pokemon.

*
Okay so I'm gonna have to say while I do agree with your ranking for Nidoqueen for Ground, but I have to disagree with you on it's ranking for Poison. Nidoqueen for B rank on Poison.

Here's the main reason: it's the only viable Stealth Rocker. You could argue that Nidoking could Stealth Rock but it isn't viable at all. Also Nidoqueen can setup Toxic Spikes or let Scolipede use them with Spikes to make a really annoying hazard stacking core. In that case Dragon Tail and Roar are options, but most people won't be using a hazard stacking core besides Toxic Spikes but it's still out there. Honestly the best set for Nidoqueen is either a Sash lead to get up rocks with 3 attacks or change the item for a LO. Yeah you lose power with Nidoqueen if you have a Sash but quite frankly that's not the point of Nidoqueen. It's role is to get up Stealth Rock through its better bulk than Nidoking, and if it can't tank a hit that's what the Sash is for. Nidoking's role is to sweep slower mons, Nidoqueen is to provide that extra support.
I agree with Sae, Nidoqueen (Poison) B rank and Nidoqueen (Ground) D Rank


Also Anttyaz, you ended the last week's discussion and updated the 3rd post, but not the Pokemon in the actual viability list, just letting you know in case you forgot :toast:
 
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