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Monstrosity [MARK 2]

Discussion in 'BW Other Teams' started by Matt Tuck, Jun 15, 2013.

  1. Matt Tuck

    Matt Tuck

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2013
    Messages:
    33
    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]


    Introduction:

    Hi Smogon. This is my second RMT on the Smogon forums and my first Ubers RMT. I would describe the playstyle of this team as Sun Hyper offense. This team attempts to break through the oppositions walls and sweep with one of the teams members each of which is a powerhouse in its own right break right through the opposing teams core so that either of my sweepers may clean up late game.


    The Team:

    [​IMG]

    Groudon @ Leftovers
    Trait: Drought
    EVs: 240 HP / 168 Def / 100 Spd
    Impish Nature
    - Earthquake
    - Stone Edge
    - Stealth Rock
    - Roar

    This is a standard physically defensive Groudon set altered with some added investment in speed EV’s to out speed minimally invested base 90’s. Impish nature boosts its defensive whereas the current investment gives me decent bulk and speed and tanks physical hits fairly well. Edge Quake is standard on most Groudon and Stealth Rock needs no explanation. Roar is for phasing out stuff to get more hazards damage as this is now a hazards stacking team. With my speed investment I get the faster Roar over other common roarers such as Giratina. Leftovers provide me with valuable recovery.


    [​IMG]

    Ho-Oh @ Choice Band
    Trait: Regenerator
    EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Spd
    Adamant Nature
    - Sacred Fire
    - Brave Bird
    - Earthquake
    - Sleep Talk

    CB Ho-oh hits like a truck. It’s my main wallbreaker and helps smash through stall teams as well. Max Attack and Max HP is the standard spread on Smogon for this set so that I can fire off more brave birds. Adamant nature provides Ho-oh all the power it needs to smash stuff really hard. Sacred Fire and Brave Bird are its two main stabs whereas Earthquake lets me hit Dialga, T-Tar and the unusual Heatran for super effective damage. Sleep Talk allows me to absorb dark void and thus makes Ho-oh my check to Darkrai.


    [​IMG]

    Forretress @ Custap Berry
    Trait: Sturdy
    EVs: 252 Atk
    Brave Nature
    IVs: 0 HP / 0 Def / 0 SAtk / 0 SDef / 0 Spd
    - Gyro Ball
    - Spikes
    - Toxic Spikes
    - Rapid Spin

    It’s pretty simple how custap forretress works. You get as many hazards up as you can, spin the opponent’s hazards and the die making the rest of the team’s job easier to deal with threats after they are weakened on entry. This is the standard Smogon spread once again. Gyro Ball is the only attacking move on this set and with max Attack it hits for pretty decent damage when It has to. Spikes, Toxic Spikes are standard hazards and don’t need an explanation whereas Rapid Spins gets rid of the hazards on my field.


    [​IMG]

    Arceus-Ghost @ Spooky Plate
    Trait: Multitype
    EVs: 140 HP / 4 Def / 112 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature
    - Calm Mind
    - Judgment
    - Focus Blast
    - Recover

    Calm Mind Arceus-Ghost is a big threat in ubers with no sure fire counters to it. It’s my main special sweeper and acts as a spin blocker. The current spread provides me more offensive pressure than the standard 252 HP 252 Spd and gives me greater bulk than the 252 SAtk 252 Spd set. This spread also allows me to OHKO e-killer with Focus Blast after a single boost. Timid nature allows me to outspeed most e-killer and speed tie with other special attacker Arceus. Calm Mind is the standard boosting move for this set whereas Judgement and Focus Blast provide good coverage and Recover allows me to shrug off damage.


    [​IMG]

    Genesect @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Download
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Naive Nature
    - U-turn
    - Iron Head
    - Explosion
    - Ice Beam

    Standard physically based scarf Genesect is my main scarfer and check to Mewtwo as well as most Rayquaza. Max Attack Max Speed is standard on this set with naïve nature retain max speed. U-Turn is for scouting and Genesect’s main niche. Iron Head is a pretty powerful stab as well to hit stuff like CM Arceus Ghost who it otherwise can’t touch. Ice beam deals with dragons like Rayquaza whereas Explosion is used to weaken pokemon which the team can’t handle easily.


    [​IMG]

    Palkia @ Haban Berry
    Trait: Pressure
    EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Hasty Nature
    - Dragon Tail
    - Spacial Rend
    - Hydro Pump
    - Fire Blast

    Haban Berry Palkia is one of my favorite mons and is pretty powerful in its own right. Max Speed and Max Special Attack is standard with Hasty Nature over timid cause I run dragon tail. Spacial Rend and Hydro Pump are Palkia’s main stabs whereas Fire Blast hits pretty hard in the sun. Dragon Tail is a slight uncommon move but works pretty well as I can predict a switch and use Dragon Tail on the incoming pokemon to force it out and stack up more hazards damage on the opposing team. Haban Berry is the item I prefer since it let me take a dragon hit from other dragons such as opposing Palkia’s and allows me to hit them back with my own dragon move which usually kills unless the opponent has his own Haban Berry.


    Conclusion:

    Like any team, this one is not without its flaws which are why I’ve posted this team on the forums to get your suggestions on how to improve this team and make it better. Thanks for reading and I hope that you enjoyed the team. Feel free to rate, luvdisc, use this team.
  2. Piface

    Piface

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2013
    Messages:
    8
    Toxic on excadrill isn't that helpful as
    a) extreeme killer can carry lum berry, and before you use it, will ko with earthquake before you use toxic.
    b) Lugia is generally a parashuffler/wall and if parashuffler, it will have a substitute and if a wall, its team will have a substitue up/cleric.

    I suggest you replace it with swords dance or rock polish.
  3. Haruno

    Haruno I choose you!
    is a Tiering Contributor

    Joined:
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    Messages:
    1,998
    Am I the only one who noticed the massive kyogre weakness?
  4. Trainer Au

    Trainer Au Insert custom title here

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2012
    Messages:
    269
    I would keep Toxic, hitting things on the switch is great and you can Toxic Lugia as it Roosts.


    Haruno is right, you basicaly lose a pokemon every time ScarfOgre comes in.

    I suggest a Latias>Kyu-w, you still get a powerful dragon type and a nice Kyogre switch in.


    Latias' set:
    Show Hide


    Latias @Soul Dew
    168 HP / 144 SpAtk / 200 Spe
    Timid Nature
    Trait: Levitate
    -Draco Meteor
    -Roost
    -Hidden Power [Fire]
    -Grass Knot
  5. Donkey

    Donkey

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2011
    Messages:
    529
    dont listen to this guy, he has no idea what he is talking about, toxic is great on exca. however, this team is very kyogre weak. you may want to consider tentacruel instead of excadrill.
  6. Matt Tuck

    Matt Tuck

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2013
    Messages:
    33
    Thanks for the rates guys!

    Yeah i'm not listening to the guy who suggested to replace toxic as it functions very well in many cases.

    I acknowledge the weakness to kyogre. mostly what i do against kyogre is sack excadrill proceed to set up sun with groudon and switch to white kyurem to tank any hit other than a specs ice beam. This strategy is kinda gimmicky but works for quite a lot of kygore's except scarfogre which is a bitch to deal with.

    Coming to your suggestions latias seems like a decent idea to check kyogre though i might run a different spread and movement from the one you mentioned trainer Au.

    I'm kinda reluctant to use a tentacruel even though its a good spinner because like i said i need a spinner which doesn't kill offensive momentum and tenta does kill momentum so you get the general idea.

    Other changes which i have been thinking of which i would like you guys to comment or are:

    Switch to jolly nature on ho-oh and groudon or stick to adamant. (both have their advantages of hitting harder while sometimes jolly scarf ho-oh acts as shaky check to deal with kyogre). same bases for groudon but involves speed tying with +ve nature base 90.

    Palkia>Kyurem-W acts as a safer check to kyogre. provides more or less the same coverage and i was wondering to see how palkia would fit on this team. Either a specs or haban berry set seem interesting though if given an option i would rather stick to kyuem-w. same argument goes for latias as already mentioned above maybe a CM set or a straight up bulky offensive set when it comes to latias.
  7. Blue Jay

    Blue Jay The notorious J Lube
    is a Contributor to Smogon

    Joined:
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    The Ho-Oh spread I recommend is 64 HP / 252 Atk / 192 Spe Adamant. This maximizes your attack and gives you enough speed to always outrun Mewtwo. Unless I'm missing something, the only prominent Ubers threats 252 Spe Jolly would give you over this spread are other Scarf base 90s (and even that is only a speed tie unless they run a speed neutral nature) and Deoxys-A. I've personally found that Deoxys-A can rarely hurt Arceus-Ghost (Psycho Boost hits hard but becomes weak quickly and Shadow Ball/Dark Pulse seems uncommon), but if it worries you, feel free to run max speed or 52 HP / 252 Atk / 204 Spe Jolly, which outruns Deoxys-A. As for other Scarf users, the only common base 90 ones are Kyogre and Zekrom, against which your chances are pretty weak, so I don't consider trying to speed tie with them worth it.

    As for Groudon, I recommend running either 252 Spe Jolly or something like 196 HP / 252 Atk / 60 Spe Adamant. I feel like an Adamant nature is kind of a waste of 252 speed EVs if you still end up getting outsped. Alternatively, because a lot of sets run no investment or little investment (either to outspeed specific threats or to speed creep), something like 60 speed should allow you to outrun things quite often while also letting you get a good bit of extra bulk. I also checked through the Smogon sets for the base 90 Ubers, and hardly any of them ran anything other than minimal or 252 speed (and your Groudon won't beat something like Giratina-O anyway).

    As for the last slot, as much fun as I imagine Kyurem-W is, I do think a better check to Kyogre is necessary, considering how ubiquitous and potentially devastating it is. And you should find its replacements quite capable, though they may lack Kyurem-W's nuking ability.

    Palkia and Latias both sound good fits. Due to the offensive nature of your team, I would recommend Lustrous Orb or Haban Berry Palkia (Kyogre doesn't tend to stay in against Palkia, and it's nice if you aren't useless when you mispredict or become set up fodder at -2 SpA) or all-out attacker Latias. You could also consider Latios, because your team is highly offensive; it isn't as reliable against Kyogre, but very powerful, and between Latios, Zekrom and the rest of your team you should generally be able to deal with Kyogre.

    Also, if you find yourself missing having a Pokemon that just hits like a truck without a moment of set up, you could consider using Scarf Palkia as a Kyogre check and general revenge killer, freeing Ho-Oh of the latter role and allowing it to run choice band.
  8. Haruno

    Haruno I choose you!
    is a Tiering Contributor

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2012
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    I would advise using a bulkier groudon since you cannot afford to lose the weather war, since if your opponent packs a omastar/kingdra you essentially lose since you can do absolutely nothing to it while it proceeds to spam hydro pump/dpulse to sweep you and there's nothing you can do about it.
  9. Matt Tuck

    Matt Tuck

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2013
    Messages:
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    Thanks for all the suggestions guys!

    After listening to all your suggingestions and adding a few changes of my own i have made the following changes:

    Offensive Groudon ---> Defensive Groudon
    Scarf Ho-oh ---> Banded Ho-oh
    Bulky Excadrill ---> Custap Forretress
    Tailwind Zekrom ---> Scarf Genesect
    Specs Kyurem-W ---> Haban Berry Palkia

    So this is basically mark 2 of the team
    Looking forward to all your suggestions :]
  10. Haruno

    Haruno I choose you!
    is a Tiering Contributor

    Joined:
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    Messages:
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    Blaziken sweeps your team after a SD and considering how forry is just begging to be set up bait..... You can't really stop it. Since you're running sun you in turn have to run gira/-o simply because +2 252+ flare blitz mauls your whole team. Though as to how to patch holes, ill reply more in a later post. As of now

    Ghostceus => gira/o

    Gira will also allow you to somewhat check swift swim sweepers which is a nice boon to your team and provides more synergy than ghostceys does. I'd also change Ho oh's set as well since it is unreliable as hell. With no means of recovery outside of regenerator, Ho oh isn't lasting long. Add that to the fact that it is unbelievably slow and you have one mon that is essential deadweight that can never switch in with sr up. So for Ho oh I'd suggest changing the set to a non choiced version. In addition to that I'd also propose toxic > gyro ball on forry to nail the potential ghost switchins.
  11. Hack

    Hack I BELIEVE IN TRANSPARENCY IN DEMOCRATIC INSTITUTIONS
    is a Community Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon

    Joined:
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    ^ don't listen to this guy rambling about blaziken... Unless it leads vs forry (it isa suicide lead, it won't set up anywhere and even if it does, the sun isn't up, meaning after forretress dies (which can also gyro ball for a chunk) ho-oh can take an attack. And cb ho-oh is awesome, don't change pls. Do pump up the speed a bit. This is otherwise a good team, but groudon should either be more bulky or more offensive to
    deal with dialga. I'd go earth plate tbh, with a large speed creep and 220 attack evs. I cant get the set for you, since i am on a vacation. Anyway, I will luvdisc this. Good job!

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