Niche Discovery

[InfernapeTropius11]

Mega Lopunny is great in Monotype. With its high speed it is able to revenge kill most non-Scarfers, as well as put a dent in other Pokemon with its high-powered STABs that are unresisted when combined with Scrappy. This is its standard set:

Lopunny @ Lopunnite
Ability: Limber
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Fake Out
- Return
- High Jump Kick
- Ice Punch/Encore/Power-Up Punch

Fake Out is great as it buys you free turns, is STAB, and can't be blocked by incoming Ghost types. Return and HJK are high BP STABs that hit very hard. Ice Punch can be used in the last slot for Gliscor/Landorus/Garchomp, Encore buys moretime to batter stuff, or allows a teammate to come in and set up, while PuP is handy for setting up on weakened opponents, and the attack boost is often helpful.It can also run a Sub/Encore/PuP/HJK that buys set up opportunities on Encore locked opponents before sweeping with HJK. It is currently A Rank on mono-normal.

Meanwhile, Diggersby also has niches: in monotype, STABmons, and Hidden Type.
In monotype it functions as a great wallbreaker for offensive normal teams, but it can also be used as a revenge killer or sweeper.

Diggersby @ Choice Band/Choice Scarf/Life Orb
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Return/Quick Attack
- Earthquake
- Wild Charge/Knock Off
- U-Turn/Swords Dance

If you want a wallbreaker, Band is your item. Scarf makes it a revenge killer, and SD+LO turns it into a sweeper. Return is your main STAB, but Quick Attack is certainly a viable option for some priority. EQ is your other STAB. Wild Charge hits Skarmory while Knock Off hurts Chansey and annoying levitating Ghost such as Gengar. U-Turn is for momentum, or, as previously mentioned, LO can be used with SD to have a setup sweeper. Diggersby is A Rank on mono-normal.

I'm not an expert in STABmons, but I'm pretty sure this is the main set:

Diggersby @ Silk Scarf
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly/Adamant Nature
- Fake Out
- Extremespeed
- Precipice Blades
- Wild Charge/Knock Off

The first two moves are boosted by Silk Scarf and form the easily spammable FakeSpeed duo. Precipice Blades is a strong STAB to back it up. Wild Charge hits Skarmory/Aerodactyl, while Knock Off is for annoying Ghosts, such as Gengar, Gourgeist, and Golurk.

In Hidden Type, it is an amazing revenge killer affectionately referred to as Dark Death Diggersby for its tremendous killing Power. This is being suspected in STABmons right now.

Diggersby @ Choice Scarf/Choice Band
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly/Adamant Nature
- Foul Play
- Return
- Earthquake
- Knock Off/U-Turn

STAB Huge Power boosted Foul Play simply nukes everything, even if they are special attackers, as long as they have a decent attack stat. Scarf is used with Jolly to be able to revenge kill D-Nite after Rocks+one DD. Band is used for a wallbreaking nuke, that 2HKOs pretty much every viable physical wall, such as Mega Aggron, Gliscor, and Hippowdon. You will almost always just spam Foul Play, but Return/EQ are nice alternate STABs, and then Knock Off also takes advantage of your new typing to also kill stuff, or U-Turn offers momentum. This little bunny is A Rank in Hidden Type, just because of the nuke that is STAB Foul Play.

Azumarill once again is amazing in Monotype. It generally uses its standard BD+Huge Power set, but Sap Sipper+Band is also really good on Water to provide an immunity to your team and be a full stop to Breloom and Serperior.

Azumarill @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Belly Drum
- Aqua Jet
- Play Rough
- Knock Off/Ice Punch/Superpower

This set is very simple: BD, then sweep. Aqua Jet is STAB priority since you are slow asf. Play Rough is a hard-hitting STAB. The last slot is simply more.coverage for what you want to hit--adjust it to fit your team. The last 4 are in Speed to always outspeed Chansey and other base 50s and bop them first.

Azumarill @ Choice Band
Ability: Sap Sipper
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Aqua Jet
- Play Rough
- Knock Off
- Ice Punch/Superpower

This set is used on Water teams to completely stop Breloom and Serperior while gaining a boost and hitting back hard against other Pokemon. Aqua Jet+Play Rough are STABs, Knock Off hits hard and is generally annoying, and Ice Punch is for Grass types, although Superpower is an option for normal types. EVs once again hit as hard as possible with some bulk, and a little speed to outpace Chansey and other base 50s.

Azumarill also seems like it would be good in STABmons, as it gains Swords Dance, Shell Smash, Water Shuriken, Crabhammer, Fake Out, and Extremespeed to go with its existing movepool of Play Rough, Belly Drum, Superpower, Ice Punch, and Knock Off. Perhaps something like this:

Azumarill @ Life Orb
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Fake Out
- Extremespeed
- Water Shuriken/Crabhammer
- Play Rough

It could act as a good revenge killer with FakeSpeed+Water Shuriken for priority and Play Rough for another STAB, or Crabhammer over Water Shuriken for more power. It could be great, especially if Diggersby ends up banned.

Pachirisu sadly has horrible stats, which is a shame because it is so cute :> It could be good to inherit from in Inheritance however, as it has a decent support movepool including Nuzzle, Toxic, Light Screen, Super Fang, Charm, ResTalk, Volt Swith, and U-Turn, as well as some good (although admittedly limited) offensive moves such as Thunder Punch, Gunk Shot (how does a cute electric tree squirrel learn Gunk Shot?), Seed Bomb, Nuzzle, and U-Turn. It also has Volt Absorb, so Flying and Water types may want to inherit from it. Maybe something like Skarmory would be a good inheritors? It grants it an immunity to Electric, Light Screen to fix up its poor SpD, Nuzzle to annoy, and then U-Turn to switch back out. Or, Ion Deluge+Volt Absorb shenanigans :^) Another option may be Breloom, with Seed Bomb/U-Turn/Gunk Shot/Nuzzle. This seems really annoying and unpredictable. This is just theorymon, but I can't think of anywhere else that Pachirisu is any good :s
Actually, it could have a niche in mediocremons. In mediocremons it is actually one of the fastest Pokemon, and has some nice utility. Perhaps a set like this:
Pachirisu @ Leftovers
Ability: Volt Absorb
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Nuzzle
- U-Turn
- Light Screen
- Charm/Super Fang

It seems like a neat support Pokemon. Nuzzle paralyzes and annoys opponents, U-Turn offers momentum and switches you out so you don't have to take too many hits. Light Screen raises your SpD, while Charm neuters physical attackers and forces switches. Super Fang is an option to do some damage to walls before switching out to something else to finish off. Charming to force something out then U-Turning on the switchin to an appropriate counter actually seems like a decent strategy. Best paired with some Electric weak Pokemon so it has more opportunities to safely get in, recover health, and do its job.

 

[canno]

Lopunny is a monster in Hidden Type.

Lopunny @ Lopunnite
Ability: Limber
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 30 SpA
- Return
- High Jump Kick
- ThunderPunch / Ice Punch / Fire Punch
- [Utility Move] / Ice Punch

Can run effectively:
Electric (my personal favorite)
Ice
Fire
Ghost

[Utility Move] can include the following:
Healing Wish (my choice)
Heal Bell
Encore
Heal Bell
Magic Coat
Fake Out
Baton Pass
Endeavor

This thing is here to take lives. Ghost is very common on anything that's Normal for obvious reasons, but I find Electric much more useful, as it lets you live Talonbird's non-CB Brave Bird and tank M-Pinsir's Quick Attack. It also gets STAB TPunch to smack Flytan, although HJK does a lot to it anyways. The main draw of Electric is that Hippo destroys it with EQ now, but nothing is perfect. Another good option is Ice since a lot of things are weak to it - it getting the abysmal defensive typing of Normal / Ice / Fighting doesn't matter that much since its not a defensivemon and the biggest concern, considering what you want Ice Punch for, of the Rock weakness isn't even there. Hell even Fire is an option to hit Steel-types that don't care about HJK (not much exist), plus it gives you a lot of resists and a burn immunity. What makes Lopunny so good is Scrappy - it can smack shit that uses Ghost to bypass its Fighting weakness (Chansey, TTar, and Bisharp are all examples. Flytar and Flysharp don't like HJK either). Return, HJK, and TPunch are all STABmoves to run, and they have pretty good coverage together thanks to Scrappy. Last slot has a ton of options, and basically just comes down to preference. The main things though are either a utility move of your choice or Ice Punch if you're not already running it (i.e. if you're not Ice-type).

~~~

WALL O CALCS

252+ Atk Sharp Beak Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Electric Mega Lopunny: 198-234 (73 - 86.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Aerilate Mega Pinsir Quick Attack vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Electric Mega Lopunny: 102-121 (37.6 - 44.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 Atk Aerilate Mega Pinsir Return vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Electric Mega Lopunny: 261-307 (96.3 - 113.2%) -- 75% chance to OHKO
252 Atk Aerilate Mega Pinsir Quick Attack vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mega Lopunny: 204-242 (75.2 - 89.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Electric Mega Lopunny Thunder Punch vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Flying Heatran: 176-210 (45.7 - 54.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Mega Lopunny High Jump Kick vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Flying Heatran: 102-120 (26.4 - 31.1%) -- 32.2% chance to 3HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

~~~


So yea Lopunny is a cool mon in Hidden Type with a lot of variety.

 

[InfernapeTropius11]

Lopunny is a monster in Hidden Type.

Lopunny @ Lopunnite
Ability: Limber
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 30 SpA
- Return
- High Jump Kick
- ThunderPunch / Ice Punch / Fire Punch
- [Utility Move] / Ice Punch

Can run effectively:
Electric (my personal favorite)
Ice
Fire
Ghost

[Utility Move] can include the following:
Healing Wish (my choice)
Heal Bell
Encore
Heal Bell
Magic Coat
Fake Out
Baton Pass
Endeavor

This thing is here to take lives. Ghost is very common on anything that's Normal for obvious reasons, but I find Electric much more useful, as it lets you live Talonbird's non-CB Brave Bird and tank M-Pinsir's Quick Attack. It also gets STAB TPunch to smack Flytan, although HJK does a lot to it anyways. The main draw of Electric is that Hippo destroys it with EQ now, but nothing is perfect. Another good option is Ice since a lot of things are weak to it - it getting the abysmal defensive typing of Normal / Ice / Fighting doesn't matter that much since its not a defensivemon and the biggest concern, considering what you want Ice Punch for, of the Rock weakness isn't even there. Hell even Fire is an option to hit Steel-types that don't care about HJK (not much exist), plus it gives you a lot of resists and a burn immunity. What makes Lopunny so good is Scrappy - it can smack shit that uses Ghost to bypass its Fighting weakness (Chansey, TTar, and Bisharp are all examples. Flytar and Flysharp don't like HJK either). Return, HJK, and TPunch are all STABmoves to run, and they have pretty good coverage together thanks to Scrappy. Last slot has a ton of options, and basically just comes down to preference. The main things though are either a utility move of your choice or Ice Punch if you're not already running it (i.e. if you're not Ice-type).

~~~

WALL O CALCS

252+ Atk Sharp Beak Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Electric Mega Lopunny: 198-234 (73 - 86.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Aerilate Mega Pinsir Quick Attack vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Electric Mega Lopunny: 102-121 (37.6 - 44.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 Atk Aerilate Mega Pinsir Return vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Electric Mega Lopunny: 261-307 (96.3 - 113.2%) -- 75% chance to OHKO
252 Atk Aerilate Mega Pinsir Quick Attack vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mega Lopunny: 204-242 (75.2 - 89.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Electric Mega Lopunny Thunder Punch vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Flying Heatran: 176-210 (45.7 - 54.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Mega Lopunny High Jump Kick vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Flying Heatran: 102-120 (26.4 - 31.1%) -- 32.2% chance to 3HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

~~~


So yea Lopunny is a cool mon in Hidden Type with a lot of variety.

Power-Up Punch could also be used to set up on slower Pokemon that can't hurt you and then sweep. But yeah, Mega Lopunny is really good in Hidden Type, can't believe I forgot to mention it <.<

 

[Akumeoy]

Azumarill once again is amazing in Monotype. It generally uses its standard BD+Huge Power set, but Sap Sipper+Band is also really good on Water to provide an immunity to your team and be a full stop to Breloom (and if you're lucky you can get to +5!!!) while also handling Serperior.

Bullet Seed doesn't trigger Sap Sipper multiple times.

 

[InfernapeTropius11]

Bullet Seed doesn't trigger Sap Sipper multiple times.

Oh, I thought it did, whoops, I'll fix that, thanks. You still get one boost and counter both of those Pokemon though.

 

[Ghoul King]

Well, Azumarill got banned from Stat Switch. 100 Speed, 100 Attack+Huge Power, and the only cost was a measly 1/3rd of its HP. (Well, realistically you're Speed-specced rather than bulk-specced, which exaggerates the difference, but even so)

I didn't fiddle around with it much in Stat Switch Ubers, alas, and I really ought to do more of that, but I feel it remains a usable wallbreaker/stallbreaker just because Stat Switch Ubers is slanted heavily toward Stall. How about some calcs?

252+ Atk Huge Power Azumarill Play Rough vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Mega Mewtwo X: 306-362 (73.5 - 87%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Note that Stat Switch Mega Mewtwo has 190 Defense (And Special Defense!) backing its 106 HP.

252+ Atk Huge Power Azumarill Play Rough vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Primal Kyogre: 160-190 (39.6 - 47%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

Primal Kyogre has 180 Defense (and Speed!) backing its 100 HP in Stat Switch. Banded this would be a 2HKO, though honestly Azumarill with max Speed investment won't outspeed Primal Kyogre with no Speed investment, so you've got to be concerned about being hit back.

252+ Atk Huge Power Azumarill Play Rough vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Mega Rayquaza: 320-378 (77.2 - 91.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Mega Rayquaza also has 180 Defense. (And 180 Special Defense)

252+ Atk Huge Power Azumarill Waterfall vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Deoxys: 169-199 (33.5 - 39.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

Yes that's Deoxys Normal Forme. No, I'm not joking. It's got 150/150/150 defensive stats. You might want to run Knock Off, which looks more like...

252+ Atk Huge Power Azumarill Knock Off vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Deoxys: 182-216 (36.1 - 42.8%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

... this. Which. Um. Is not much of an improvement, honestly, but at least it'll let you get its Leftovers off of it.

Now, these might seem like they're kind of bad news for Azumarill (And it's certainly the case that it has to worry about being outsped by some of these ridiculously bulky things), but the fact is that Azumarill hits harder than everything except Mega Mawile. (Which, while it has 85 base HP to Azumarill's 50 and 125 Speed to Azumarill's 100, is only 5 base Attack ahead) So really this more shows how insanely bulky these other Pokemon are -100 base Attack+EVs+IVs doubled by Huge Power is approximately equivalent to a fully invested 247 base Attack Pokemon. (Well, at level 100 it's more like 249, and higher the lower level you go, but that's complicated and irrelevant to the point)

Rather this goes to show that Azumarill retains a clear role in Stat Switch (Ubers) as a wallbreaker -you can go for the Banded set, or, since you don't need to worry about Unaware, go for the Belly Drum sweep. ("sweep" status not guaranteed, no refunds)

Sample sets

Azumarill @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Waterfall
- Play Rough
- Knock Off/Aqua Jet/Superpower
- Belly Drum

Belly Drum set. Kill everything! Or more likely do horrible damage and then have Kyogre outspeed you and kill you without effort. Either or.

Azumarill @ Choice Band
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Waterfall
- Play Rough
- Knock Off
- Aqua Jet/Superpower

Choice Band set. It looks like OU. It's not OU.

Please note that Superpower is basically specifically useful against Dialga and not much else in Stat Switch Ubers. (Well, maybe also Regice) It's a clean OHKO even without the Band or Belly Drum if Dialga has maxed HP, and with the Band/Belly Drum even Physically Defensive Dialga dies instantly. Dialga is also a stall lightweight in Stat Switch Ubers anyway (It's got its regular Ubers defensive stats, which are laughable compared to some of the ridiculous stuff running around), so it's debatable whether it's worth specifically preparing for it.

 

[Snaquaza]

Thanks for the responses everyone! We'll go on to the next week.

Uselesscrab

These are all the Pokemon which can learn Crabhammer! Does this move give them an advantage in battle? Anyhow, how do they functions in OMs, and are they better than in standard? What causes these Pokemon to be buffed by the OMs? Do they need a new movepool, new typing, a new ability or even something entirely arbitrary! Feel free to discuss them, post sets and tell us why you'd want to use them!

 

[MegaGallade]

I discovered Kingler gets interesting stats in Stat Switch.

Kingler @ Life Orb
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA
Modest Nature
- Ice Beam
- Scald
- Ancient Power
- Hidden Power [Electric]

Stats: 55/50/115/130/130/75

Kingler becomes much more bulky in Stat Switch- 115/130 Defenses are very good defensive stats. Unfortunately the 55HP isn't that good, so when making a bulky offensive set I maxed out the HP for that reason.
One other interesting thing Kingler gets is Sheer Force. With 130 Base Special Attack, Kingler has the third highest special attack a Sheer Force user has in Stat Switch, and is possibly the best as Hariyama and Conkeldurr (who are the highest and second highest respectively) lack decent special movepools that use Sheer Force.

Kingler doesn't have the best special movepool either, but I made it the best I could. Ice, Water, Rock and Electric is perfect neutral coverage- and I chose Electric specifically as Keldeo would otherwise resist every move Kingler can pull off. I don't think I need to explain the set any further, but I'll leave it with a few calcs.

252+ (Base 130) SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Kingler Ancient Power vs. 252 HP / (Base 170) 0 SpD Kyurem-B: 153-182 (33.7 - 40%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252+ (Base 130) SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Kingler Scald vs. 252 HP / (Base 140) 252+ SpD Archeops: 276-328 (77.9 - 92.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ (Base 130) SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Kingler Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / (Base 125) 252+ SpD Tangrowth: 226-268 (55.9 - 66.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ (Base 130) SpA Life Orb Kingler Hidden Power Electric vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Keldeo: 205-242 (63.2 - 74.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

 

[n64lord]

Crawdaunt can put in a lot of work in monotype

Crawdaunt @ Life Orb
Ability: Adaptability
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Knock Off
- Crabhammer
- Aqua Jet
- Swords Dance

Crawdaunt is the kind of pokemon that can only be dealt with by attacking it, as even it's "not very effective" attacks tend to 2HKO, notably on things like 252 hp/ 0 def azumarill and 0 hp / 0 def mega altaria. It can even kill things while burned or through reflect fairly often, as they still can't switch out to a pokemon with more momentum, which lets it SD and take out even mega sableye. Does manage to live an unboosted secret sword from keldeo at full health. While it's max adamant speed isn't particularly high, it does creep completely uninvested walls, especially in monotype where it is tempting to max out your zapdos or rotom-w defense due to not having any other pokemon capable of filling their role. It fits in well on both water and dark, as the presence of a wall breaker of this level can back up stall water against opposing stall, and dark can use it to smash through bulky offensive teams that give it trouble.

The other crabs can only be used on water teams, but while they have a lot of wall breaking power as well, they have no point being used over crawdaunt or keldeo (and to a lesser extent, azumarill and feraligatr). 2HKO a full health skarmory unboosted if it tries to switch in for a scared partner is too much to pass up, especially since most people don't recognize that skarmory isn't a viable switch in due to their "universal physical wall" mindset.

Smeargle is okay in monotype

Smeargle @ Focus Sash
Ability: Own Tempo
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Sticky Web
- Spore
- Stealth Rock
- Memento
Normal teams are known for their defensive prowess, but pokemon like lopunny, meloetta, and diggersby can make a blistering offense as well, which is where a hazard lead smeargle comes in. It isn't limited too having to be in the lead slot either, despite what people claim, as it you can wait for a forced double switch to a defensive mon like tentacruel, ferrothron, or swampert and use spore to disable it before doing it's thing.

On the other hand using smeargle for baton pass isn't particularly effective, as even though with splendid neutral coverage on the likely reciepents of the boost, they don't get particually far without hazard support or prior damage, which conflicts with both how early you want to use smeargle in a typical game, and with how few other normal types can viably use stealth rock (basically just chansey).

 

[imas]

Inheritance/AAA:

Crawdaunt @ Life Orb
Ability: Swift Swim
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Aqua Jet
- Waterfall
- Knock Off

I ran this on a rain team, it did okay. It inherits from kabutops. The same set can be used in aaa rain since crawdaunt gets all these moves in regular play and can just run swift swim instead.


Inheritance:

Kingler @ Choice Band
Ability: Swift Swim
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Stone Edge/Ice Punch
- Waterfall
- Earthquake
- Superpower/Ice punch

Inheriting from mega swampert, i used this in the same rain team. I chose this because of it's amazing attack + rain boosted banded water fall (i've also been meaning to use kingler in some om).

 

[InfernapeTropius11]

Clawitzer gets Origin Pulse in STABmons, am I done yet?

Clawitzer @ Assault Vest/Choice Specs/Life Orb
Ability: Mega Launcher
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Origin Pulse
- Aura Sphere
- Dark Pulse
- Dragon Pulse

Basically, spam Mega Launcher-boosted STAB Origin Pulse, and coverage if necessary, because Origin Pulse hits really hard. That's basically it :I It can hit harder than Mega Blastoise with Specs/LO, and doesn't take up your Mega slot, but it is pretty slow so it will usually have to tank a hit first (which is why Assault Vest is slashed). It is a decent wallbreaker, although it is very predictable, and there is really no other reason to use it besides Origin Pulse.

 

[imas]

well to make up for that last mistake, here's STABmons crawdaunt (haven't used it myself so it's probably bad)

Lobster done two ways (stabmons)
Crawdaunt @ Life Orb
Ability: Adaptability
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Substitute
- Swords Dance
- Sucker Punch/ Knock Off
- Waterfall or Crabhammer/ Water Shuriken

or

Crawdaunt @ Life Orb
Ability: Adaptability
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Substitute
- Knock Off
- Sucker Punch
- Crabhammer

This is basically what i think crawdaunt could run in stabmons. Adaptability lets it hit extremely hard and it gets 2 new toys here in sucker punch and water shuriken.For the first set, first order of business would be to setup sub (to avoid getting fakespeeded) and then either setup a swords dance and spam high bp STAB or priority of choice or just use STAB move of choice (in the case of fake speeder switching in on your sub). Or if using the second set, set up sub and just spam STAB moves then watch things die.

pros: Hardest hitting knock off in the game making nothing wanna switch in, Adaptability boosted high bp (for the most part) STAB priority

cons: not bulky or fast, prone to being revenged by fakespeed without sub, troubled by azumarill which is a lot more common now

Also i thought up an alternative set

Crawdaunt @ Choice Band
Ability: Adaptability
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Knock Off
- Waterfall/Crabhammer
- Sucker Punch/ Parting Shot/ Superpower
- Water Shuriken

This is mainly to take advantage of STAB Adaptability water shuriken to revenge things like aero, ttar, lando, landoT.. basically anything weak to it. Since it's a band set the hp evs could be used in speed intead. Parting Shot is slashed with sucker punch because sucker punch is very unreliable, especially with band, and crawdaunt's bound to force lots of switches. This lets you switch out of the opponent's answer to daunt while nerfing it's attacks in the process. Superpower is slashed to hit ferrothorns on the switch.

here have some calcs

some things it's supposed to revenge
252+ Atk Choice Band Adaptability Crawdaunt Water Shuriken (3 hits) vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Landorus: 336-408 (105.3 - 127.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
-1 252+ Atk Choice Band Adaptability Crawdaunt Water Shuriken (3 hits) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Landorus-T: 168-204 (43.9 - 53.4%) -- approx. 0.4% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
-1 252+ Atk Choice Band Adaptability Crawdaunt Water Shuriken (3 hits) vs. 0 HP / 24 Def Landorus-T: 228-276 (71.4 - 86.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Adaptability Crawdaunt Water Shuriken (3 hits) vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Heatran: 300-360 (77.7 - 93.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Choice Band Adaptability Crawdaunt Water Shuriken (3 hits) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Heatran: 300-360 (92.8 - 111.4%) -- approx. 81.3% chance to OHKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Adaptability Crawdaunt Water Shuriken (3 hits) vs. 0 HP / 44 Def Mega Aerodactyl: 336-408 (111.6 - 135.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO

some things that'll be switching in on it
252+ Atk Choice Band Adaptability Crawdaunt Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Skarmory: 188-222 (56.2 - 66.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Choice Band Adaptability Crawdaunt Crabhammer vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Skarmory: 192-228 (57.4 - 68.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Choice Band Crawdaunt Superpower vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Ferrothorn: 242-286 (68.7 - 81.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Choice Band Adaptability Crawdaunt Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Ferrothorn: 196-232 (55.6 - 65.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Choice Band Adaptability Crawdaunt Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 88 HP / 4 Def Azumarill: 197-232 (54.2 - 63.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (crabhammer does more)
252+ Atk Choice Band Adaptability Crawdaunt Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 240 HP / 0 Def Azumarill: 198-233 (49.3 - 58.1%) -- 97.7% chance to 2HKO

 

[InfernapeTropius11]

well to make up for that last mistake, here's STABmons crawdaunt (haven't used it myself so it's probably bad)

Lobster done two ways (stabmons)
Crawdaunt @ Life Orb
Ability: Adaptability
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Substitute
- Swords Dance
- Sucker Punch/ Knock Off
- Waterfall/ Water Shuriken

or

Crawdaunt @ Life Orb
Ability: Adaptability
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Substitute
- Knock Off
- Sucker Punch
- Waterfall

This is basically what i think crawdaunt could run in stabmons. Adaptability lets it hit extremely hard and it gets 2 new toys here in sucker punch and water shuriken.For the first set, first order of business would be to setup sub (to avoid getting fakespeeded) and then either setup a swords dance and spam high bp STAB or priority of choice or just use STAB move of choice (in the case of fake speeder switching in on your sub). Or if using the second set, set up sub and just spam STAB moves then watch things die.

Crabhammer is probably better than Waterfall, as it has higher BP and the flinch chance doesn't matter too much as you are outsped by pretty much everything anyway.

 

[imas]

i prefer waterfall for the accuracy, that's the only reason that's there.

 

[EV]

i prefer waterfall for the accuracy, that's the only reason that's there.

20 more BP with a higher chance to crit is worth the risk imo. Dark Void can be slashed as well to disable a check/counter while you setup but Subs are generally safer and combo nicely with Sucker Punch.

I think the biggest selling point is the strong dual STAB priority Crawdaunt has which means you don't need to invest in Speed in most cases.

 

[imas]

Edited in crabhammer as the only option in the sub + 3 moves set and slashed it in the sub sd set, i kept waterfall there because missing after a setup would be really really sad. Also edited in band crawdaunt, which could be good too in a different role.

 

[Snaquaza]

Suggestions by Eevee General! The theme of the new Niche Discovery will be picnicking!

What are the niches of these Pokemon? Please discuss what they can do, since most of them are usually pretty bad. Especially Vanilluxe and Vespiquen are generally underused, so I'm interested in what niches you can come up with!

 

[Peef Rimgar]

Reserving Garbodor and Beedrill for Tier Shift, the other two are bad lol

 

[skies]

STABmons

Mega Beedrill isn't extremely common in STABmons, and for a good reason. Firstly, Mega Beedrill comes with a large opportunity cost. Making niches for it that warrant a use over say Mega Aerodactyl is very difficult to do. Secondly, Beedrill is a very poor Pokemon, and you will have a hard time getting it in. That one turn you Mega Evolve is killer, and it puts a massive wrench in Beedrill's side. Finally, Mega Beedrill's moves are low accuracy, requiring Coil to make them actually hit. This is a detriment mainly because Mega Beedrill doesn't have that much room to set up. Its STAB moves are quite poor as well, and don't have the best coverage. So, why would you ever consider running this? Well, friend, it does have a few solid niches that warrant its use.

The first of these niches is just how insanely powerful Mega Beedrill is. Lets compare its Gunk Shot to one of the most powerful attacks in the tier:

252 Atk Adaptability Mega Beedrill Gunk Shot vs. 4 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 384-454 (59.8 - 70.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Aerodactyl Dragon Ascent vs. 4 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 357-420 (55.6 - 65.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

That's pretty legit if you ask me! Besides power, Mega Beedrill is fast. Really fast. Coil | Gunk Shot | Megahorn | Drill Run is a pretty solid set as well, and is the set I believe warrants it a niche. However, despite this power, I would not recommend running Mega Beedrill. Its flaws are way too noticeable, and it requires a ton of team support to work. Instead, try out another Mega!

 

[InfernapeTropius11]

Mega Beedrill is pretty good on offensive Poison and Bug monotypes, especially VoltTurn Bug mono teams. With Adaptability it hits like a truck, and is a solid wallbreaker and revenge killer due to its ability and speed.

Beedrill @ Beedrillite
Ability: Swarm
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- U-Turn
- Poison Jab
- Knock Off
- Drill Run

Protect is an option to safely Mega evolve, although I prefer coverage. You shouldn't be bringing it into Mega evolve something that outspeeds it anyway. It's job is to spam U-Turn for massive damage so something else canfinish up, but the coverage is handy to annoy Eviolite mons, Steel and Rock types, and Poison Jab just hits insanely hard with Adaptability as wellfor Fairies.

I've also been trying out MegaBee in Inheritance, and it functions well as slate-game cleaner, once priority is gone (very hard however, as Gale Wings/ESpeed spam is everywhere).

Beedrill @ Beedrillite
Ability: Speed Boost
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Megahorn
- Poison Jab
- Earthquake
- Protect

Functions similarly to Mega Shark in reg play, but better imo. Megahorn and Poison Jab are powerful spammable STABs and EQ is for Steel types and Rock types such as Doublade and Diancie. Can't be revenge killed via Scarfers, since +1 MegaBee outspeeds everything, but it really hates priority and hazards, as well as really bulky Pokemon, so it is a niche late-game cleaner that is decent on HO teams that can support it, but generally its opportunity cost and the support it needs make it a poor choice.

 

[Leafshield]

Almost Any Ability

Vanilluxe @ Life Orb
Ability: Adaptability
EVs: 252 SpA / 180 Spe / 76 HP
Modest Nature
- Autotomize / Taunt
- Freeze-Dry
- Ice Beam / Blizzard
- Hidden Power [Ground] / Water Pulse / Explosion

Ice cream guy is abysmal but there was a time where I made a gimmick team and it put in a little work if I do say so. It's pretty fast and if it somehow gets a chance to set up when there's no priority on the opposing team it could put in work.

Autotomize is basically used to clean up late game when priority is removed. The set is bopped by Gale spam but does resist frige-speed for what it's worth. (252 Atk Choice Band Refrigerate Genesect Extreme Speed vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Vanilluxe: 92-108 (32.3 - 38%) -- 97.1% chance to 3HKO). Honestly though, while doing some calcs and stuff I see Vanilluxe as more of a gimmick wallbreaker than sweeper, which is why I decided to slash taunt in with Autotmize: you can stop stuff like non-bounce chans/mew/clef from doing stuff as they switch in expecting to tank your decently strong ice move and end up either switching or taking a hefty hit.

You pretty much need Modest / Adapt for this thing to hit anything hard; Ice STAB, however, is pretty good when you have freeze dry, hitting a ton for neutral damage. Basically Ice Beam vs. Blizzard breaks down to how real you are. HP Ground hits magnezone, Doublade, tran harder than whatever else you have but if you're like randomly paranoid about levitran/leviblade you can do Water Pulse. Explosion is for lords only on the Chansey switchin (crisp 2HKO if you run neutral attack nature hehe boy). You can probably run Flash a Cannon too somewhere to smack Diancie / Clefable for SE damage, but idk. Probably more useful than Water Pulse tho.

Honestly LO Adapt Blizzard is just really hard to switch into. Blizzard does like 36% to Cune and then it gets cleaned up by F-D. Couple high rolls and some lucking and you can beat PH cress too.

C A L C B O Y Z

Hide

252+ SpA Icicle Plate Adaptability Vanilluxe Freeze-Dry vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Suicune: 316-376 (78.2 - 93%) -- 37.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

252+ SpA Life Orb Adaptability Vanilluxe Blizzard vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Doublade: 178-211 (55.2 - 65.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock (HP Ground finishes it off. Or another blizzard #real)

252+ SpA Life Orb Adaptability Vanilluxe Blizzard vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Zapdos in Strong Winds: 255-302 (66.4 - 78.6%) -- 25% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

252+ SpA Life Orb Vanilluxe Hidden Power Ground vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Heatran: 234-276 (60.6 - 71.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery (Poor ice cream :[. Chip damage from blizzard and rocks can potentially put it overtho

252+ SpA Life Orb Adaptability Vanilluxe Blizzard vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Mew: 221-260 (54.7 - 64.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252+ SpA Life Orb Adaptability Vanilluxe Blizzard vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Ferrothorn: 268-317 (76.1 - 90%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery


252+ SpA Life Orb Adaptability Vanilluxe Blizzard vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Entei: 192-227 (51.7 - 61.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
(HP ground cleans)

252+ SpA Life Orb Adaptability Vanilluxe Blizzard vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Umbreon: 185-218 (46.9 - 55.3%) -- 15.6% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

252+ SpA Life Orb Adaptability Vanilluxe Blizzard vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Victini: 153-181 (44.8 - 53%) -- 28.9% chance to 2HKO

252+ SpA Life Orb Vanilluxe Hidden Power Ground vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Lucario: 224-265 (79.7 - 94.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Just a few calcs i did of prominent walls that it could break / some more offensive resists like Entei and Tini. Honestly unless you have a Chansey or something it can be really hard to switch in to. It's still kind of weak to priority, Gale spam, the like. Maybe if you feel like a real man you can run Naughty nature and Ice Shard, put 4 EVs into attack and 2hko brav and Staraptor lol.

 

[CactusCacti]

AAA:

Vespiquen @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic guard
Evs: 252 hp / 200 def / 56 spdef *
Calm Nature *
- Defend Order
- Infestation
- Roost
- Toxic / Defog / Air slash / Filler

*can be tweaked accordingly, maximun defense allows the quen to survive gale wing spam bit better physically.

Vespiquen, unfortunantly, does not have much going for it due of its lack luster stats and terrible typing.
However, it can run this set, also known as slow death.
Being able to trap a stall mon with infest and then buff ups already decent defensive stats up with defend order, allows it to become one hell of a tough cookie to take down.
Even with ton of weaknesses, if you reach +6 to both defenses, you're gonna have to pray for a crit if you're not packing a adapt rhyperior or something to take this bee queen down, hell even +2 is a great start, which you're likely to reach if you manage to trap a mon that cannot deal super effective damage directly.
Last slot is up to user preference, if you do not trust the bee, defog gives support, toxic allows it to wear down other mons faster and air slash is a decent stabmove to speed up infestations damage on mons that cannot be toxiced.

Defensive power calculations;

Hide

252+ Atk Braviary Brave Bird vs. +2 252 HP / 200 Def Vespiquen: 168-200 (48.8 - 58.1%) -- 58.6% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Braviary Brave Bird vs. +6 252 HP / 200 Def Vespiquen: 84-102 (24.4 - 29.6%) -- 0% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Tough Claws Victini V-create vs. +2 252 HP / 200 Def Vespiquen: 290-344 (84.3 - 100%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO
252+ Atk Tough Claws Victini V-create vs. +6 252 HP / 200 Def Vespiquen: 146-174 (42.4 - 50.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Thundurus Thunderbolt vs. +2 252 HP / 60+ SpD Vespiquen: 122-146 (35.4 - 42.4%) -- 93.4% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Latios Draco Meteor vs. +2 252 HP / 60+ SpD Vespiquen: 180-212 (52.3 - 61.6%) -- 97.7% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Choice Band Adaptability Rhyperior Stone Edge vs. +6 252 HP / 200 Def Vespiquen: 312-376 (90.6 - 109.3%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO <-- TOLD YOU DAWG

So as you can see; this bee has potential to become THE PAIN to take down and make you yell "NO NOT THE BEES" once +6 has been reached.
You will have to play really damn well to reach that tho, and eat your lucky charms so all that doesnt go down the drain once crit walks in the door.

 

[JaxOh1]

I have a request, cause I cant find it myself: Why would anyone use Beautifly...when Butterfree has roughly same stats and a wider movepool?

But on current task:

The INVERSE Abomasnow!
Resist almost everything passively, only weak now to Ground, Electric, Grass and Water (and neutral to Normal), Can be an effective tank now with some support (perfurably an electric to handle grass/ground/eletric and provide paralyzation to slow down others, and maybe even a SipSapp and/or WaterAbsorb and/or Volt Absorber to take the 3/4 Super effectives)
Soundproof for the common Sound users in teir, or just live with the natural hail.

-Energy Ball/Wood Hammer/Seed Bomb/Grass Knot (depending if Physical or Special, the standard stab for everything but Ground/Rock/Water)
-Leech Seed (grants recovery and way to where down walls, as well as help it wall)
-Substitute (Combine with leech seed to wear down its counters)
-Ice Attack (to hit water/2ndary stab, but can't touch ground)/ Return Or Hidden Power:Fire/Poison (covers water/rock/ground) / Secret Power or Stomp (Helps Paralyze or FlinchHax enemies to stall for subseeding)

 

[Snaquaza]

Thanks for the replies everyone, the next week will be Eeveelutions #1.

Not much to say honestly, I think you guys know the drill.

 

[Ghoul King]

Espeon is an excellent Protean inheritor (I prefer Greninja as a donor, personally, but Kecleon offers Recover, Stealth Rock, Thunderbolt, and other goodies. No Scald though) in Inheritance, with high Speed, solid Special Attack, decent Special bulk, and to an extent the advantage of surprise -people really don't expect a STAB Scald to smack their Dark or Steel type that "should" have walled it, and if they get Burned you have decent odds of surviving a Physical assault. It can also slip in Spikes or Toxic Spikes (I prefer Toxic Spikes for Toxic immunity against walls, but Spikes can be used to laugh off a Thunderbolt, so they're both solid choices) against enemies expecting a straight attacker, or Stealth Rock if you are running Kecleon, though that offers no convenient immunities, more's the pity.

In general it's a flexible attacker and even supporter, including you can run U-Turn if inheriting from Greninja to scout, poor Attack or no. Note that anything faster than it is more fragile or hits less hard or both!

Some calcs.

252 SpA Espeon Scald vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Landorus-T: 318-374 (99.6 - 117.2%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO

So one of the most popular Inheritance Pokemon cannot safely switch in on Espeon. If it's running bulk -which they sometimes do- it still doesn't like risking the Burn! Most anything Landorus-Therian does is a OHKO back, mind, but the only way it's getting that second move is if it's got priority of some kind. (Most likely Gale Wings, though Protean does show up and is plenty threatening)

252 SpA Espeon Grass Knot (100 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Suicune: 216-254 (53.4 - 62.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

A Specially Defensive Suicune is 2HKOed by Grass Knot, which is absolutely a valid move choice. (And incidentally makes you resistant to their own Scalds) That's the other S rank threat scared of Espeon!

252 SpA Espeon Dark Pulse vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Cresselia: 210-248 (47.2 - 55.8%) -- 20.7% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Not as good, particularly if it gets a Calm Mind off, though even then you may Flinch it to death, and it's iffy for it to switch in on Espeon, especially since a Burn from Scald is not going to be appreciated by any non-Magic Guard set. Note that Cressellia is A+ rank.

252 SpA Espeon Scald vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Terrakion: 288-338 (88.8 - 104.3%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO

252 SpA Espeon Grass Knot (120 BP) vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Terrakion: 428-506 (132 - 156.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Another A+ rank threat that Espeon can kill very easily. Not only that, but Grass Knot will render you immune to Spore if it happens to be Breloom Terrakion, so even if it's some bizarre Specially Defensive set it's not going to be happy. And no Mach Punch doesn't do real damage to Espeon if it's still Psychic... or even if it's a neutral typing. Now, a Protean set can potentially deal with Espeon, assuming it manages to switch in safely...

252 SpA Espeon Grass Knot (120 BP) vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Gyarados: 195-231 (49.6 - 58.7%) -- 71.1% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Note that this is a bulky regular Gyarados, and thus it's neutrally effective. Gyarados cannot switch in on Espeon to prep for a Shell Smash sweep, even aside from the potential to be Burned by Scald. And Gyarados is another A+ rank threat.

252 SpA Espeon Scald vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Heatran: 182-216 (47.1 - 55.9%) -- 19.9% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

This is a bit shaky, since many Heatran are Desolate Lands, but the non-Desolate Lands ones cannot switch in on Espeon in safety. Even being Specially Defensive with Leftovers still leaves the possibility of being 2HKOed! And Heatran is an A-ranked threat.

252 SpA Espeon Dark Pulse vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Eviolite Doublade: 192-228 (59.6 - 70.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

4 Atk Doublade Shadow Sneak vs. 0 HP / 4 Def (Psychic) Espeon: 144-170 (53.1 - 62.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Obviously the second hit will do a quarter of the first, if we assume they both lead and Doublade Shadow Sneaks while Espeon Dark Pulses. Bad trade for Doublade, worse if it used Shadow Claw instead. Another A-rank threat that hates Protean Espeon.

252 SpA Espeon Grass Knot (120 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Tyranitar in Sand: 224-266 (65.6 - 78%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252 SpA Espeon Grass Knot (120 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Tyranitar: 392-464 (114.9 - 136%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Yikes. Mega Tyranitar can potentially take on Espeon -in particular, if it has Sucker Punch it can OHKO if Espeon isn't currently a resistant type- but regular Tyranitar is in dire trouble if it's not running a Sandstream based set! (Which they basically never run) A- rank threat that hates Espeon.

252 SpA Espeon Grass Knot (60 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Greninja: 260-308 (91.2 - 108%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO

Now this is just silly. Another A- threat, though to be fair one of its more common sets is Scarf Primal Kyogre, in which case it will outspeed... though even then if Espeon is currently a resistant type you get

252 SpA Greninja Water Spout (150 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Espeon in Heavy Rain: 164-193 (60.5 - 71.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

a surprisingly weak hit!

Now, Espeon hates anything with priority, and if you're inheriting from Greninja your only recovery is basically to be running Leftovers, so Espeon isn't liable to actually sweep a team, but it's an excellent choice for punching a hole in the enemy team and getting out, maybe dropping some hazards real quick when you see an opportunity.

Sample set

Espeon) @ Leftovers
Ability: Protean
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Scald/Thunderbolt
- Dark Pulse/Flamethrower
- Taunt/Grass Knot/U-Turn/Stealth Rock
- Toxic Spikes/Spikes/Recover

The bolded examples moves are potential suggestions for a Kecleon set.

And remember: Espeon is better than Alakazam in every way that matters, and that's sad. :(