Northern Illinois University

[Max]

How sad. :( I wish the best for the victims' families.

 

[Taylor]

That's very, very upsetting for everyone involved in the scene, their families and the University.

All I can do is wish for the best to whom were involved.

 

[Deck Knight]

No, vespa. No. American gun laws are retarded and they are exactly the thing that allows tragedies like these to occur because there is no legal barrier stopping someone from obtaining a gun and pulling the trigger. It's a case of people closing the well after the calf has drowned. My question is: How many shootings will it take to a) see that violence does not solve problems b) for the US government to realise that making firearms publicly available is a bad idea c) for schools to realise the necessity of proper psychological care and attention for those who are sorely starved for it?

It is not the first time a stray person picks up a gun and vents his misery on innocents. It is not the first time that the law allows this to happen. It is not the first time that we, as a society, do not realise the need of our fellow compatriots and that we do not act upon the veiled signals being given out. It won't be the last time, either.

It is things like these that make me fear for the future of our world: it isn't the war in Iraq. It isn't global warming. It isn't nuclear bombs that will destroy us. If we want to change this world and make it a better place to live, it's these small-scale incidents we need to prevent first. We, as a society, are still ill-equipped to provide our neighbours with their social needs; and it is not war with other cultures that will finally be the kiss of death. It's a war with ourselves.

If only NIU weren't a GUN-FREE ZONE.

Guns are banned at NIU.

It seems though, that criminals don't respect the law. It seems the deranged don't remember the law at the time of their derangement.

The only thing the Gun Free Zone did was insure one more deranged maniac gets to shoot unarmed fish in a barrel.

I guarentee you if even one person in that room was armed, a lot of lives would have been saved. When a maniac comes in intent on killing spree, you blow the asshole away and question his motives later.

Of course, some people respond by demanding that everyone in the nation be disarmed by draconian gun control laws that take the ability to defend out of the hands of individuals and into the protection of the state.

Criminals will still smuggle guns in. Truly deranged people will still find a way to get them, or they'll go with some other weapon, an aluminum baseball bat, a machete, a golf glub, homemade explosives, whatever. And people will have to rely on a limited number of law enforcement officials to save them. And that's just fine for some people, who will ignore any time these incidents keep happening after they ban guns, because the cognitive dissonance is too great to bear.

All we can do at this point is pray for the families.

 

[sbc]

I'm sure that psychos don't only exist in the US, but I've never heard of this stuff happening elsewhere, at least on a non-isolated basis.

Maybe the real question should be "why the fuck can any psycho get a gun?"

 

[blastoiselover100]

I'm sure that psychos don't only exist in the US, but I've never heard of this stuff happening elsewhere, at least on a non-isolated basis.

Maybe the real question should be "why the fuck can any psycho get a gun?"

The second ammendment in the Constitution allows them to do that. The Right to Bear Arms. The ability to acquire a gun actually ususally depends on the state.

I heard that no one expected the gunman to do something like this. It is very unfortunate. So that is three major school shootings in recent history. I guess that is what America is coming to.

 

[NESgamer]

I'm sure that psychos don't only exist in the US, but I've never heard of this stuff happening elsewhere, at least on a non-isolated basis.

That's my point, and why only on schools?. Is not like "the mugglers will get the guns anyway", well these are not mugglers so crime is not the issue, these are students or regular people that get access to these guns and go crazy.

That's the problem to solve, to find a way they don't get access to these guns, or even better stop them from going crazy.

 

[blastoiselover100]

Easier said than done. The second ammendment allows them to get them. The gun laws vary from state to state, and who said he got it legally anyways?

 

[jc_rcw]

It's not like you know what the person you are selling a gun to is going to do with it. Also they don't really act psycho until they shoot a place up.

 

[blastoiselover100]

I guess no one here has ever purchased a gun. You have to fill out a BUNCH of forms. Then, usually depending on what you said in the forms, there will be a waiting period of X days. Most of the time, it is two weeks, but say you have a fellon, then you have to wait like another week. In some states they will not even allow a fellon to purchase a gun.

That is the legal process. There is also a serial number on the gun to keep track of who owns it if it found. If it is bought illegally, the person selling it just wants their money.

 

[spies]

post

The problem isn't that he got it in, it was that he had the gun in the first place.

Sucks, the amount of cases like this is ridiculous and at least in the information we receive down here I don't see anything being done about it.

 

[gorm]

The only thing the Gun Free Zone did was insure one more deranged maniac gets to shoot unarmed fish in a barrel.

are you proposing arming students to defend themselves against potential gunmen?

 

[Justin8649]

I think it is more of a proposal to allow people with CCLs to actually have their guns in universities. It is currently illegal for people with a CCL to have their gun in most universities even though they can carry them into a church or pretty much anywhere else.

 

[Glen]

If only NIU weren't a GUN-FREE ZONE.

Guns are banned at NIU.

It seems though, that criminals don't respect the law. It seems the deranged don't remember the law at the time of their derangement.

The only thing the Gun Free Zone did was insure one more deranged maniac gets to shoot unarmed fish in a barrel.

I guarentee you if even one person in that room was armed, a lot of lives would have been saved. When a maniac comes in intent on killing spree, you blow the asshole away and question his motives later.

Of course, some people respond by demanding that everyone in the nation be disarmed by draconian gun control laws that take the ability to defend out of the hands of individuals and into the protection of the state.

Criminals will still smuggle guns in. Truly deranged people will still find a way to get them, or they'll go with some other weapon, an aluminum baseball bat, a machete, a golf glub, homemade explosives, whatever. And people will have to rely on a limited number of law enforcement officials to save them. And that's just fine for some people, who will ignore any time these incidents keep happening after they ban guns, because the cognitive dissonance is too great to bear.

All we can do at this point is pray for the families.

lol is this post for real

first you say guns being so easily accessible is a non-issue, then you say the problem would be solved if MORE people had guns, then you say that the only thing that you can do to attempt to fix the problem is pray? is this even WORTH refuting?

 

[Justin8649]

Nobody is saying anything about more people having guns. Just the people that have CCLs be allowed to have their guns in the school...

 

[blastoiselover100]

The problem with this whole thing is trying to stop it from happening a FOURTH time. We should console the families, but we cannot sit back and watch more people be slaughtered.

 

[Justin8649]

So these rare shootings that get so much press and take so few lives are a larger issue than the medical errors that cause so many deaths every year? Why doesn't that stuff get any press? Why aren't we all raging about ways to prevent doctors from fucking up so much?

http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/11856.php

 

[Glen]

Nobody is saying anything about more people having guns. Just the people that have CCLs be allowed to have their guns in the school...

i truncated that point to make it seem like it was less of a run-on sentence, i assumed it was implied that i was pointing out the absurdity of allowing more guns in school to help prevent school shootings

 

[Justin8649]

Why is it absurd to allow somebody with a CCL to have their gun in a college? They are allowed to carry it everywhere else. They have to go through a lot of testing before they are allowed to obtain a CCL. It isn't like it is just some random person with a gun.

 

[Glen]

So these rare shootings that get so much press and take so few lives are a larger issue than the medical errors that cause so many deaths every year? Why doesn't that stuff get any press? Why aren't we all raging about ways to prevent doctors from fucking up so much?

http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/11856.php

speaking of absurdity, what the fuck does this have to do with anything? why aren't we talking about the fifty thousand children that die of starvation every day? oh right, because it's not the issue at hand (and because its something we refuse to concern ourselves with, of course)

 

[blastoiselover100]

We cannot be everywhere at once. We need to take care of what effects us at the moment. Right now, it is the high number of shootings. Who is to say it will not be worse next time? Who says the next person will not throw a pipe bomb into a crowd? We need to do all we can to prevent that.

 

[Justin8649]

To Glen: It has to do with everything. The media is always trying to bring up a silly gun issue when this stuff rarely ever happens. You never ever hear about all of the deaths that happen due to medical errors. I hear about starvation all the time though. That isn't something as easy to prevent. Medical errors are very very easy to prevent.

If you want to prevent starvation in the US you should find a way to stop people from having sex who cannot (either mentally or physically [with money]) support a child.


To blastoise: How in the world do you plan on stopping somebody from throwing a pipe bomb in a crowd? Seriously, you cannot stop this stuff. The best option is to allow people who are capable of defending themselves and others to do so.

 

[blastoiselover100]

Well, you can prevent people like that from acquiring the materials needed to make a pipe bomb and you could help prevent them from losing it. Then, you could put much stricter security into public places. BTW has VA tech taught you nothing?

 

[Deck Knight]

lol is this post for real

first you say guns being so easily accessible is a non-issue, then you say the problem would be solved if MORE people had guns, then you say that the only thing that you can do to attempt to fix the problem is pray? is this even WORTH refuting?

"So easily accessible?" Look Glen, if you're going to troll, try harder and don't put words into people's mouths.

Fact is to get a gun you have to pass a criminal background check.

Here, lets enlighten everyone on how "easily accessible" they are instead of yet another Starbucks wait-line worthy spew.

http://www.isp.state.il.us/docs/ptfire.pdf

Unless specifically exempted from UUW, a person commits a Class 4 Felony if he or she violates the UUW law

in the Criminal Code (i.e., unlawfully carries on their person or illegally transports a firearm in a vehicle) AND
one or more of the following aggravating factors apply:
(1) The firearm possessed was uncased, loaded, and immediately accessible at the time of the offense;
(2) The firearm possessed was uncased, unloaded, and the ammunition for the weapon was immediately
accessible at the time of the offense;
(3) Does not have a valid FOID card;
(4) Was previously adjudicated of a felony as a juvenile;
(5) Was engaged in a misdemeanor violation of the Cannabis Control Act or the Controlled Substances Act;
(6) Is a member of a street gang;
(7) Has had an order of protection against them in the last two years;
(8) Was engaged in the commission or attempted commission of a misdemeanor involving the use of violence
against another person or the property of another; or
(9) Is under 21 years of age and in possession of a handgun, unless the person is engaged in hunting activities
under the Wildlife Code.

FOID card requirements:

http://crime.about.com/od/gunlawsbystate/p/gunlaws_il.htm

Purchase
A buyer is required to show his Firearms Owner’s Identification Card (FOID) when purchasing any firearms or ammunition. Any seller is required to withhold delivery of any handgun for 72 hours, and of any rifle or shotgun for 24 hours, after the buyer and seller reach an agreement to purchase a firearm.

The waiting period does not apply to a buyer who is a dealer, law enforcement officer, or a nonresident at a gun show recognized by the Illinois Department of State Police.

The seller must retain for 10 years a record of the transfer, including a description of the firearm (including serial number), the identity of the buyer, and the buyer’s FOID number.

A federally licensed dealer must contact the Department of State Police for a background check, for which there is a $2.00 fee. Any sales at gun shows, including dealers and private parties, must contact the state police for a background check.

Private parties selling firearms at gun shows must ensure the buyer has a FOID card and the buyer must undergo a background check. It is unlawful to sell or give any handgun to a person under 18, or any firearm to a person who is not eligible to obtain a FOID.

Requirements for Foid
Application for a FOID is made to the Illinois State Police, FOID, P. O. Box 19233, Springfield, IL 62794-9233. Application forms can be obtained online at http://www.isp.state.il.us or by calling the Firearm Owners IdentiAn applicant is entitled to a FOID if he:

* Is over 21 years of age. If under 21, he must have the written consent of his parent or guardian. In such case, the guardian himself must not be ineligible for a FOID, and the applicant must never have been convicted of a misdemeanor or adjudged a delinquent.

* Has never been convicted of a felony.

* Is not a narcotics addict.

* Has not been a patient in a mental hospital in the preceding five years.

* Is not mentally retarded.

* Is not an alien who is unlawfully present in the United States.

* Is not subject to an existing order of protection prohibiting the possession of a firearm.

* Has not been convicted within the past 5 years of battery, assault, aggravated assault, violation of an order of protection, or a substantially similar offense in another jurisdiction, in which a firearm was used or possessed.

* Has not been convicted of domestic battery or a substantially similar offense in another jurisdiction committed on or after January 1, 1998.

* Has not been convicted within the past five years of domestic battery or a substantially similar offense in another jurisdiction committed before January 1, 1998.

An applicant for a FOID must consent to the Department using the applicant's digital driver's license or Illinois ID card photograph, if available, and signature on the FOID, and must furnish the Department with his driver's license or Illinois ID card number.

The Department must approve or deny the FOID within 30 days and is authorized to deny the FOID only if the applicant does not meet the listed qualifications. The FOID is valid for five years from the date of issuance. The Department shall forward to each FOID holder, a notice of expiration and a renewal notice application, 60 days prior to expiration.

A FOID may be revoked and seized if the holder made a false statement on the application, is no longer eligible, or whose mental condition poses a clear and present danger to self, others, or community.

Yes, so easily accessible. As long as you are over a certain age, have never committed a felony, and wait up to 30 days for the state of Illinois to approve your FOID, then wait 72 hours for your handgun.

That's just begging for criminals to come and pick up their easily accessible handguns.

 

[Catamaran]

I guarentee you if even one person in that room was armed, a lot of lives would have been saved. When a maniac comes in intent on killing spree, you blow the asshole away and question his motives later.

One person in that room was armed... that is exactly the problem. None of those people would have needed to protect themselves if he couldn't get his hands on a gun in the first place.

 

[Justin8649]

And how in the world do you plan on preventing him from getting a gun? Banning guns? That sure did help in the UK. Also take a look at prohibition in the United States...that sure did work well! Criminal activity only skyrocketed in the US during that time! Banning these kinds of things NEVER works. It usually makes it worse. If somebody wants something, they will get it. Legality is not going to stop a person who wants to do something bad.