Spore and sleep powder are relative rarities. In addition, you can't really compare spore with glare. Sleep is very different from paralysis, and paralysis can be applied to a whole team. Serperior is also very different from amoonguss, being fast and powerful, if frail, and amoonguss being slow and moderately bulky.
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np: UU Stage 2.1 - You Are Invited
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You said Victini could get pursuit trapped but that didnt stop it from nuking shit, which I totally agree with. That goes the same way for serp...if you want to bring in a revenge killer like a scarfer or aero you need to sack something first and THEN it gets revenged killed. You cannot hold that against serp when it happened to a broken mon like victini as well. That is simply just revenge killers doing there job. While I also agree with that serp cannot burst through certain checks like amoonga, bat, and rosy (AV entei isnt too relevant). It does however pressure those checks to a very high extent. amoonga simply cant ohko it and if it is switched in you can just follow it up with 2 hp ices or fires, same goes to roserade. As for crobat, it is really scared to come in due to glare and or rocks being on the field. Like Ive said before rocks being on the field forces crobat to defog or roost which lose any and all momentum for your team putting you at a disadvantage. And any offensive check must be brought in after something dies as leaf storm 2hkos a lot of serps offensive checks like CB entei the more relevant one, heracross, and aero certainly does not want to switch into a storm. I do agree it can be dealt with but it is just simply unhealthy for the tier as it puts fear into players while they are team building. Even in an extremely over prepared meta like this one Ive still seen it do large amounts of work on the ladder and you all saw what it did to an unprepared meta..not one bit healthy.
I never said Serp didnt put pressure on the opposing team. Its not a pushover thats weak. Tini nuking things meant that only a handful of mons could literally switch in, which anybody who played that meta can tell you. You could predict the VC, switch in Rhyperior or Swampy and grt nailed in the face by GK, thus getting rid of the one or two mons tbat couldcheck tini. Serps LS cannot outright KO most mons in UU. The mons it cant beat, it relies on hp for coverage.
Dont get me wrong, im most likely voting ban (since it is able to sweep unless you carry multiple checks), its not versatile like Tini. id argue the closest definitions to Versatile are Hydreigon and Infernape. They have the ability to run multiple sets and the stats to back up most sets. My postvwas really focusing on that aspect moreso than anything else
If people start making arguments that moves like Glare make a mon broken, you start down a slippery slope that could to a complex ban. Its a great asset, to say the least, but the main argument that pushes serp over the edge is a high BP move that acts as a NP. Its a booster with no set up required. If it were a lower BP move, then things may be different, but you need a quad resist to not take massive damage after the boost, which is why youbare seeing Crobat, amoongus and roserade as ideal checks.
ya I agree victini was by far more broken then serp I just don't think it is healthy for the tier..you make some decent points tho.
Hi, so I didn't post my thoughts on Serperior until after I had gotten reqs because I hadn't played UU during the time Contrary was released, but now that I have played both with and against Serperior, I can say that it very well has a negative presence on the metagame. As many people have mentioned before, Serperior's brokenness comes from what is essentially a 130 BP STAB Nasty Plot + its excellent Speed tier and decent bulk for an offensive Pokemon. While there are plenty of Pokemon that can check Serperior offensively (Mega Pidge, Scarf Chandy/Ape, Crobat, Mega Aero, Entei, etc.), most of them are crippled by Glare or take a hefty chunk from even a resisted Leaf Storm, leaving them unable to continue checking Serp. Defensive checks such as Blissey are shut down by the Taunt + Synthesis set (which is also quite fun) or just require a little bit of prior damage before they are swept as well (Mega Aggron/Bronzong). It does have some reliable counters, such as Spdef Amoonguss, Roserade, and Sap Sipper Goodra (the latter can be worn down very easily though), but lacking one of these makes it so that you have to play very cautiously around Serperior or risk losing at least one Pokemon before Serp dies. This makes teambuilding very restrictive, and good opponents can easily take advantage of the caution one must use if facing Serperior without a dedicated counter. Overall, Seperior's impact on the metagame is quite harmful and I would vote to ban it.
As for retesting Victini, please NO. Victini was and will be ridiculous in the UU metagame. Very few things can switch in comfortably on V-Create, and those that can are demolished by Bolt Strike and/or Grass Knot, making it terrifying for slower, bulkier teams. Victini can also leave its mark on offensive teams with ease, as its decent Speed and excellent bulk allows to get off at least one hit, which is more than enough to send most offensive Pokemon packing.
Just imagine if Victini got Contrary l0l!
As for retesting Victini, please NO. Victini was and will be ridiculous in the UU metagame. Very few things can switch in comfortably on V-Create, and those that can are demolished by Bolt Strike and/or Grass Knot, making it terrifying for slower, bulkier teams. Victini can also leave its mark on offensive teams with ease, as its decent Speed and excellent bulk allows to get off at least one hit, which is more than enough to send most offensive Pokemon packing.
Just imagine if Victini got Contrary l0l!
After getting reqs, I think I can finally talk about Serperior. The set that I mainly used on the Suspect Ladder was the Sub + Glare set, sometimes with Dragon Pulse over Sub, and I found it quite underwhelming to be honest. I think one of its biggest challenges is switching in safely. Even once it manages to get in, it is usually forced out again by almost everything faster than it, and most scarfers as well. For example, if Serperior manages to get in on a Blastoise lacking Ice Beam, it can then Leaf Storm to get the kill, but an opposing Beedrill, Aerodactyl, or Crobat can easily switch in and revenge kill it. Another problem with it is the fact that unlike other broken pokemon, its checks and counters are not obscure. In fact, most of them are among some of the most used pokemon in the tier, so in that fact it has no real constraint on team building, in the sense you usually do not have to dedicate a slot to a Serperior check/counter. All in all, I do not see that Serperior is as broken as people are making it, and will most likely vote No Ban, when the time comes around.
To quote the user above me(Priyanka Chopra <3,also NU tour when fite ;-;) now that I have reqs, I think I can talk about Serperior. It puts immense pressure on stall teams due to its recently release ability Contrary and is only check on offense by Pokemon with blazing speed tiers such as Mega Pidgeot,Mega Aerodactyl,and Crobat, as well as various scarfers, but its performance versus offense isn't really suspect worthy.
What is suspect worthy and in this case broken is how it invalidates stall.. I feel that it puts unnecessary pressure on the stall playstyle and forces it to run relatively useless Pokemon such as Goodra solely for it, but then again don't UU staples like CroCune do the same? They do but the thing that is different is that Serperior does not just boost, it has an attack that gives it a free +2 which very quickly snowballs especially against stall, also it puts in work even versus offense due to its blazing speed tier inspite of being checked by the aforementioned Pokemon, it is very hard to play around and due to its solid defenses(not so much if it has the LO set which it usually does) it can be a pain to get rid of.
Serperior is one of those Pokemon that can sweep inspite of having checks as showcased by the rise of Glare Serperior which totally invalidates fast checks such as MPidgeot,MAero,and Crobat. I feel that the Glare, and Taunt/Synthesis sets are what tips Serperior over to the broken pool and not so much the LO set which gets worn down a bit too quickly for my tastes,. feel Serperior just centralizing to a large degree and definitely worth a suspect test, and frankly feel that UU is better off without Serperior.
What is suspect worthy and in this case broken is how it invalidates stall.. I feel that it puts unnecessary pressure on the stall playstyle and forces it to run relatively useless Pokemon such as Goodra solely for it, but then again don't UU staples like CroCune do the same? They do but the thing that is different is that Serperior does not just boost, it has an attack that gives it a free +2 which very quickly snowballs especially against stall, also it puts in work even versus offense due to its blazing speed tier inspite of being checked by the aforementioned Pokemon, it is very hard to play around and due to its solid defenses(not so much if it has the LO set which it usually does) it can be a pain to get rid of.
Serperior is one of those Pokemon that can sweep inspite of having checks as showcased by the rise of Glare Serperior which totally invalidates fast checks such as MPidgeot,MAero,and Crobat. I feel that the Glare, and Taunt/Synthesis sets are what tips Serperior over to the broken pool and not so much the LO set which gets worn down a bit too quickly for my tastes,. feel Serperior just centralizing to a large degree and definitely worth a suspect test, and frankly feel that UU is better off without Serperior.
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So I've been waffling a lot on how I'm going to vote, but in the end, I think I've made my decision. Here's my reasoning:
Contrary Serperior is far from the most broken thing UU has ever seen. It's certainly a threat, but it doesn't totally demolish the tier the way Terrakion or Mega-Medicham did. Against unprepared teams it is absolutely devastating, of course, but the same is true for things like Luke or Mence, and I don't feel like either of those are too much for UU.
Breaking things down a little bit further, with even a little bit of preparation, offense doesn't really have too much trouble with Serp. 75/95/95 defenses are far from bad, but they're not earth-shattering either, and there are a lot of offensive checks to Serp. Most decent offensive teams will pack two or three things that outspeed and will chase Serp out or OHKO it, preventing it from doing too much work. It's still dangerous, but no more so than, say, Moxiemence, who can also sweep an offensive team after a single boost if they aren't prepared. Glare sucks, yeah, but it can be played around. This is a pretty good time for offense in general, with staples like MAero hitting the spotlight while other things like M-Beedrill coming into their own finally (seriously, I've seen more decent Beedrill teams on the suspect ladder than I had seen in pretty much all of ORAS prior). Better yet, now that offense has a bullet in their gun that can reliably stop Suicune without killing momentum, it's a great time for the playstyle despite the fact that Aerodactyl is on like half of all teams.
Stall teams have sort of a mixed bag right now. I've heard a lot of people saying that stall is really weak right now, but I'm not sure I agree. On the one hand, the Taunt/Synthesis set really is a fantastic stallbreaker. On the other hand, stall is probably the one archetype that can afford to run some of the more niche Serperior counters. It also helps that many of Serp's checks also help against another major threat to stall, Guts Heracross. Stall needs to build carefully around Serperior to avoid a sweep, but it can afford to do so in a way that a lot of other playstyles can't. So yeah, Contrary Serperior hurts stall more than it hurts offense in my opinion, but it's not insurmountable.
And then we have balance. Here is where Serperior is most deadly. Balance will regularly have at least one answer to Serperior - Crobat, Pidgeot and Aerodactyl are all fairly common choices for balance teams, after all, and many Scarfed mons can check Serperior - but they can rarely fit more than one solid answer and one soft check. The more niche answers like Amoongus tend to be momentum sinks, and the easiest checks to fit on the team are pretty much all weak to rocks. Worse still, most of them crumple to things like Pursuit MAero or Krook, both common partners for Serp. Balance is still doable, but building a balance team is more constrained than it has been in a long time. A lot of the top balance teams right now all kind of look alike. They're good teams, no doubt about it, but there's not a ton of variation.
So is Serperior centralizing? Absolutely. After having played and watched an awful lot of games on the suspect ladder, there is no doubt in my mind that Serperior is one of the most centralizing mons currently in the tier. It's at least as centralizing as Suicune and Mega-Aerodactyl, who are almost certainly the two best mons in the tier. It constrains teambuilding at least as much as those two, although obviously in different ways. In many ways it reminds me of Mega-Diancie, whose bleh defensive typing, mediocre bulk and solid but not God-tier Speed meant it had a ton of offensive checks, but who would absolutely tear through teams with the right support. Slapping it on your team doesn't mean you're automatically going to win, but if it stays in the tier it's going to sit right up there with Aerodactyl and Suicune as one of the most dangerous mons to build around.
So all of this was a really long way around me saying that I could go either way re: banning or not banning. Serperior is centralizing and dangerous, but not necessarily overwhelming if you teambuild with it in mind. So in the end, I'm going to base my decision on one simple (and utterly subjective) fact: I find the tier less fun with Serperior in it. Maybe it's because I'm bored of MAero/Crobat/Serp teams everywhere as the suspect ladder equivalent of the Easy Button, or maybe I just have a bad personality. Whatever it is, that's how I feel. If I didn't also think that Serp was one of the most centralizing mons in the tier I wouldn't argue a ban on fun alone, but I do, so them's the breaks. When the test ends, I'm going to be voting to ban Serperior.
Contrary Serperior is far from the most broken thing UU has ever seen. It's certainly a threat, but it doesn't totally demolish the tier the way Terrakion or Mega-Medicham did. Against unprepared teams it is absolutely devastating, of course, but the same is true for things like Luke or Mence, and I don't feel like either of those are too much for UU.
Breaking things down a little bit further, with even a little bit of preparation, offense doesn't really have too much trouble with Serp. 75/95/95 defenses are far from bad, but they're not earth-shattering either, and there are a lot of offensive checks to Serp. Most decent offensive teams will pack two or three things that outspeed and will chase Serp out or OHKO it, preventing it from doing too much work. It's still dangerous, but no more so than, say, Moxiemence, who can also sweep an offensive team after a single boost if they aren't prepared. Glare sucks, yeah, but it can be played around. This is a pretty good time for offense in general, with staples like MAero hitting the spotlight while other things like M-Beedrill coming into their own finally (seriously, I've seen more decent Beedrill teams on the suspect ladder than I had seen in pretty much all of ORAS prior). Better yet, now that offense has a bullet in their gun that can reliably stop Suicune without killing momentum, it's a great time for the playstyle despite the fact that Aerodactyl is on like half of all teams.
Stall teams have sort of a mixed bag right now. I've heard a lot of people saying that stall is really weak right now, but I'm not sure I agree. On the one hand, the Taunt/Synthesis set really is a fantastic stallbreaker. On the other hand, stall is probably the one archetype that can afford to run some of the more niche Serperior counters. It also helps that many of Serp's checks also help against another major threat to stall, Guts Heracross. Stall needs to build carefully around Serperior to avoid a sweep, but it can afford to do so in a way that a lot of other playstyles can't. So yeah, Contrary Serperior hurts stall more than it hurts offense in my opinion, but it's not insurmountable.
And then we have balance. Here is where Serperior is most deadly. Balance will regularly have at least one answer to Serperior - Crobat, Pidgeot and Aerodactyl are all fairly common choices for balance teams, after all, and many Scarfed mons can check Serperior - but they can rarely fit more than one solid answer and one soft check. The more niche answers like Amoongus tend to be momentum sinks, and the easiest checks to fit on the team are pretty much all weak to rocks. Worse still, most of them crumple to things like Pursuit MAero or Krook, both common partners for Serp. Balance is still doable, but building a balance team is more constrained than it has been in a long time. A lot of the top balance teams right now all kind of look alike. They're good teams, no doubt about it, but there's not a ton of variation.
So is Serperior centralizing? Absolutely. After having played and watched an awful lot of games on the suspect ladder, there is no doubt in my mind that Serperior is one of the most centralizing mons currently in the tier. It's at least as centralizing as Suicune and Mega-Aerodactyl, who are almost certainly the two best mons in the tier. It constrains teambuilding at least as much as those two, although obviously in different ways. In many ways it reminds me of Mega-Diancie, whose bleh defensive typing, mediocre bulk and solid but not God-tier Speed meant it had a ton of offensive checks, but who would absolutely tear through teams with the right support. Slapping it on your team doesn't mean you're automatically going to win, but if it stays in the tier it's going to sit right up there with Aerodactyl and Suicune as one of the most dangerous mons to build around.
So all of this was a really long way around me saying that I could go either way re: banning or not banning. Serperior is centralizing and dangerous, but not necessarily overwhelming if you teambuild with it in mind. So in the end, I'm going to base my decision on one simple (and utterly subjective) fact: I find the tier less fun with Serperior in it. Maybe it's because I'm bored of MAero/Crobat/Serp teams everywhere as the suspect ladder equivalent of the Easy Button, or maybe I just have a bad personality. Whatever it is, that's how I feel. If I didn't also think that Serp was one of the most centralizing mons in the tier I wouldn't argue a ban on fun alone, but I do, so them's the breaks. When the test ends, I'm going to be voting to ban Serperior.
I don't see the logic behind this post. Sure, you can say Serperior is forced out by things that are faster than it, but that's the whole point of Glare. Glare should be used on the switch, not Leaf Storm. You kill something with Serperior, then get out until faster things are either a.) hit by Glare or b.) killed later on in the match. Mega Beedrill, Mega Aerodactyl, and Crobat can switch in but risk the Glare hitting them. Also, Mega Beedrill is slower than Serperior the turn it Mega Evolves, so it can be donked with a boosted Leaf Storm (which KOes at +4 after Stealth Rock, btw). What counters are you talking about specifically? Stall has an incredibly tough time dealing with it because Leaf Storm overwhelms Blissey. This, alongside Synthesis / Substitute, are what make Serperior so tough to manage. You know people are dedicating a slot to counter it when you're running into Sap Sipper Goodra, amongst other Sap Sipper Pokemon. Serperior's ability to walk on Stall, KO nearly everything with Leaf Storm, and cripple its counters with Glare are what make it so powerful.
I'll have to respectfully disagree with this; sorry. Whether a Pokemon's checks or counters are viable is not the sole factor to determining its brokenness or lack thereof. For example, Aegislash's #1 check, Bisharp, was (and still is) one of the best Pokemon in the metagame, while other checks such as Mandibuzz and Chesnaught are also plenty viable in OU. While Mandibuzz and Chesnaught aren't as good in OU as Beedrill, Aero, and Crobat are in UU, they're far from obscure, and Aegi still managed to get banned. Also, Serp typically won't attempt a sweep if the opponent's Beedrill Aero, or Crobat is still fresh. Even if it does attempt to sweep, it can paralyze those three with Glare, meaning they'll be easy to eliminate and pave the way for a Serp sweep. Moreover, though Serp does not restrict teambuilding per se, thanks to Glare, its checks won't stop it from sweeping- you need to run a dedicated counter if you want Serp to not demolish your team. That's why I've been seeing at least one of those 3 mons on damn near every team, and even then, it's not enough to stop Serp from plowing through teams, thus proving that it is a centralizing force. Whether or not it's overly centralizing is up to interpretation, but I find it to be overwhelming. I've just recently started playing UU again, and I feel that bringing Serperior back into the tier would be a mistake.
Edit: Wow unfixable way to ninja me completely. Not your fault though :P
I came into this test thinking Serperior would be stupidly broken due to its offensive presence, and I was slightly let down. Its offensive presence is obviously there, but the checks/counters dedicated to it usually can recover health and force a switch. However, something I found is that it can manage those checks/counters, as well as ruin balanced and stall teams that aren't prepared with not much effort, due to the option of spamming LO Leaf Storm or using Glare on the switch in to cripple the counter/check reserved for Serperior. Being paralyzed makes it risky and could cost you the game if paralyzed at the wrong time, and is the main reason why this thing is deadly as it can cripple some dedicated checks/counters heavily with paralysis. Some of those include scarfers, as they don't appreciate the speed drop, meaning they most likely can't check Serperior anymore. With that said, people have argued Serperior can be worn down due to LO recoil / priority moves, but some Serperior carry Synthesis which replenishes its health, meaning it will be around a lot longer and can 1v1 a weaker tank, eventually killing it and opening a window to sweep if no faster pokemon/priority is around. Not to mention Giga Drain, which also gives back health whilst damaging the enemy pokemon simultaneously. I think the fact that if you aren't prepared for this and you come against it, the matchup is definitely not in your favour by a large margin, showcasing how overwhelming it can be. With this, I believe Serperior is far too centralizing and requires for extensive preparation on every team, reducing diversity of the overall metagame. I will be voting ban.
Finally got reqs after deciding that I wanted them 2 days ago, and finishing with a 5 hour marathon session of trying to beat the deadline. I believe that my perspective of Serperior in the UU metagame will be an interesting one, as these last 2 days were the first time that I've actually laddered in UU for any metagame and I hope to provide a fresh perspective.
This being said, I whole-heartedly agree that Serperior is unhealthy for the UU metagame and when the time arises, I will be voting to Ban. What Serperior brings to the table is great speed, which allows it to outpace most of the relevant metagame, A 130 BP STAB Nasty Plot, enough offensive coverage for it to pick and choose its checks, and a pretty incredible support movepool that lets it bypass some of its presumed counters. Alongside all of these qualities is the fact that Serperior can run a multitude of sets that can beat both offensive teams (Offensive w/ Glare) and defensive teams (Taunt + Synthesis) which further enhances how centralizing this mon is on the tier. Another thing that makes Serperior such an over-centralizing threat in the tier is how well the current UU metagame fares for it. Pretty much every team is forced to run a Bulky Water and/or Bulky Ground that Serperior can force out and get up a free +2 on with relative ease.
tl;dr In my honest opinion, Serperior's incredible speed and respectable bulk, access to an extremely powerful STAB move that also acts as one of the best set-up moves in the game, alongside the ability to get past it's checks and counters with the right moveset as well as the fact that it can beat both Stall and Offensive with relative ease, makes it too much for the UU metagame and I will be voting Ban
This being said, I whole-heartedly agree that Serperior is unhealthy for the UU metagame and when the time arises, I will be voting to Ban. What Serperior brings to the table is great speed, which allows it to outpace most of the relevant metagame, A 130 BP STAB Nasty Plot, enough offensive coverage for it to pick and choose its checks, and a pretty incredible support movepool that lets it bypass some of its presumed counters. Alongside all of these qualities is the fact that Serperior can run a multitude of sets that can beat both offensive teams (Offensive w/ Glare) and defensive teams (Taunt + Synthesis) which further enhances how centralizing this mon is on the tier. Another thing that makes Serperior such an over-centralizing threat in the tier is how well the current UU metagame fares for it. Pretty much every team is forced to run a Bulky Water and/or Bulky Ground that Serperior can force out and get up a free +2 on with relative ease.
tl;dr In my honest opinion, Serperior's incredible speed and respectable bulk, access to an extremely powerful STAB move that also acts as one of the best set-up moves in the game, alongside the ability to get past it's checks and counters with the right moveset as well as the fact that it can beat both Stall and Offensive with relative ease, makes it too much for the UU metagame and I will be voting Ban
I resently got reqs and I took some things into consideration. The truth is that serperior is not the only over powered thing in uu. There are other things that can sweep quite easily if running theright moveset against the right team. Now the question is "Does serperiors presence relinquesh any constrictions on teambuilding?" The truth is yes it does. It is much easier to deal with suicune and meta walls with serperior. But... does serperior hurt teambuilding more than it helps? At first it was all about how much I hated the suicune team building constrictions. But the sad thruth is that serperior will have you put a goodra or a crobat or some other stupid shit like sap sipper zebstrika. Pokemon is about chosing the pokemon you like to try to defeat your opponent. Its not right for the meta to constrict what you pick to an overwhelming extent. THATS COMMUNISM! Just because we have other over powered pokemon in uu doesnt mean we can have another one. I was thinking like Sindrome in the incredibles, "if everyones super then no one is." Unfortunately this awesome disney knowledge can not be used relevently in poKemon uu meta. Pls ban serperior. If I want to run dd wishcash or assault ryperior, I dont wanna worry.
Edit: Im not being sarcastic. I want the glaring snake to be banned.
Edit: Im not being sarcastic. I want the glaring snake to be banned.
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I can't tell if you're being sarcastic or not or what your stance on Serperior even is.
I'm never going to be able to get reqs in time so I'll just post my opinion. Serperior should definitely be banned. This thing is a pain even in OU, and with less capable walls that for the most part are weak to grass, and its ability to boost so easily and access to a 100% accuracy para move makes this thing just too powerful. Blissey can't stop it, and can be 2HKOed after 3 Leaf Storms, and Florges can only 3HKO with Moonblast on its defensive set , and is still murdered by Serp. Serp forces you to have Goodra or something to specifically wall it, limiting team building. Bulky waters are annoying, but I would much rather have them than Serperior.
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Also I want to compliment Can-Eh-Dian on a very eye openning post. Serperior provides itself with some very overpowering aspects such as he explained. If serperior didnt have glare, this suspect test would be very different.
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Mystifield
Banned deucer.
YEAAAAAAAAAH
Serp isn't hard to deal with, just run AV Azelf or whatever stupid shit you suggested a few pages ago on your post about how Serp isn't broken at all.
Pick and choose from your counters+checks list!!!
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Did someone seriously suggest AV Azelf? This is just flat-out absurd. Just run AV Entei.
Why you gotta be a dick man? His opinion has changed through experience, to match yours no less.
poke-ego obv
Residual Kokoloko energy.
Ban that Grass Snake, places too much pressure on Balance, Stall and even HO which lacks a fast Revenge killer(which would be your own fall if you lack one). I'm sure that everyone has explained already how overwhelming Serpeior is for the tier so I won't go into much detail. So in summation Serpeior should be Banned.
I explained my previous position and why I used to stand for the non-ban. Serperior choses what it looses to so the other 5 pokemon on your team fan deal with the checks and or counters. I was wrong about countless checks. Thomas Edison was wrong countless times before he was right. It is not a sin to be wrong. And its not wrong to learn through experience. So why do you feel the need to point out my past positions?
Oh and just fyi, I never once said av azelf
Ok so here is my obligatory post-reqs thoughts on this beautiful grass snake.
So as I laddered, I didn't see too many snakes, but I contribute that to the fact that people knew of its brokeness and decided they weren't going to use it. But for me, personally, I am looking at one thing when it comes to my vote on Serperior: the combination of Contrary + Leaf Storm.
First off, does this make Serperior centralizing? Hell yea it does. In a tier filled with Bulky Waters, Serperior not only can be an amazing answer to them, it can also boost fairly easily against them as well. And with it being able to scare out every bulky Water-type in UU is proof of how centralizing this thing is. The other problem is that while Serperior has many checks, all those checks have to be faster or otherwise they have to fear Serperior setting up thanks to its access to some great support moves such as Taunt, Synthesis, and Glare, which brings me to my next point.
Does Contrary + Leaf Storm allow Serperior to run other moves that can easily bring forth a sweep? The simple and obvious answer is yes. With Serperior having a boosting + attacking move all in one, this frees up a precious moveslot for it take advantage of the moves it has. Want an offensive Serperior? Run Synthesis + 3 Attacks (Leaf Storm, Dragon Pulse, Hidden Power of choice). Want a surefire way to break stall and sweep? Run Synthesis + Taunt Serperior to break stall and easily set up. Want a way to cripple switchins and still be threatening? Run Synthesis / Sub + Glare. Overall, Contrary allowed Serperior to have a move that can hit hard (not initially but with a +2 backed by a Meadow Plate, which is my personal favorite, or a Life Orb it hits p hard) and allows it to set up is too much in my honest opinion. This easily freed up a slot that allows Serperior to have the utility it needs to bypass its checks. It isn't comparable to other setup sweepers either as they have to run the setup move of choice + an attacking move + coverage while Serperior gets all of the former in one moveslot and can use its other three moveslots for coverage, recovery, or stallbreaking moves.
Lastly, the combination of Contrary + Leaf Storm is a very abusable combo because even if the opponent has a resistance to Leaf Storm, Serperior still gets an ez +2 boost, meaning it can overpower the switchin, if it is slower, with its coverage moves.
Now while I would happily welcome any Pokemon that changes the meta, it needs to change the meta for the better. And in all honesty, I truly believe Serperior makes the meta not fun at all which is why I will be voting ban.
So as I laddered, I didn't see too many snakes, but I contribute that to the fact that people knew of its brokeness and decided they weren't going to use it. But for me, personally, I am looking at one thing when it comes to my vote on Serperior: the combination of Contrary + Leaf Storm.
First off, does this make Serperior centralizing? Hell yea it does. In a tier filled with Bulky Waters, Serperior not only can be an amazing answer to them, it can also boost fairly easily against them as well. And with it being able to scare out every bulky Water-type in UU is proof of how centralizing this thing is. The other problem is that while Serperior has many checks, all those checks have to be faster or otherwise they have to fear Serperior setting up thanks to its access to some great support moves such as Taunt, Synthesis, and Glare, which brings me to my next point.
Does Contrary + Leaf Storm allow Serperior to run other moves that can easily bring forth a sweep? The simple and obvious answer is yes. With Serperior having a boosting + attacking move all in one, this frees up a precious moveslot for it take advantage of the moves it has. Want an offensive Serperior? Run Synthesis + 3 Attacks (Leaf Storm, Dragon Pulse, Hidden Power of choice). Want a surefire way to break stall and sweep? Run Synthesis + Taunt Serperior to break stall and easily set up. Want a way to cripple switchins and still be threatening? Run Synthesis / Sub + Glare. Overall, Contrary allowed Serperior to have a move that can hit hard (not initially but with a +2 backed by a Meadow Plate, which is my personal favorite, or a Life Orb it hits p hard) and allows it to set up is too much in my honest opinion. This easily freed up a slot that allows Serperior to have the utility it needs to bypass its checks. It isn't comparable to other setup sweepers either as they have to run the setup move of choice + an attacking move + coverage while Serperior gets all of the former in one moveslot and can use its other three moveslots for coverage, recovery, or stallbreaking moves.
Lastly, the combination of Contrary + Leaf Storm is a very abusable combo because even if the opponent has a resistance to Leaf Storm, Serperior still gets an ez +2 boost, meaning it can overpower the switchin, if it is slower, with its coverage moves.
Now while I would happily welcome any Pokemon that changes the meta, it needs to change the meta for the better. And in all honesty, I truly believe Serperior makes the meta not fun at all which is why I will be voting ban.
- Status