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LC Onix

Discussion in 'Preliminary Pokedex' started by Heysup, Jan 5, 2014.

  1. Heysup

    Heysup Monsters are dangerous and kings are dying like flies.
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    Overview
    ########

    Onix is a niche Pokemon thanks to its unique stats and ability. Due to its Speed, it functions differently from Geodude, as it can Taunt and KO Pokemon faster than Geodude can. This is important when dealing with Sticky Web and Shell Smashers. Compared to Archen and other Stealth Rock users, Sturdy gives it the ability to reliably check a large amount of Pokemon, even ones that use super effective moves, such as Magnemite.

    Sturdy + Berry Juice
    ########
    name: Sturdy + Berry Juice
    move 1: Earthquake
    move 2: Rock Blast
    move 3: Stealth Rock
    move 4: Taunt / Dragon Tail / Roar
    ability: Sturdy
    item: Berry Juice
    evs: 76 HP / 236 Atk / 196 Spe
    nature: Jolly

    Moves
    ========
    Earthquake is Onix's main STAB attack. Rock Blast is a very useful secondary STAB attack to deal with opposing Sturdy Pokemon as well as Substitute users such as Torchic. Stealth Rock is one of the main reasons to use Onix. Thanks to its high Defense and access to Sturdy, it will have enough turns to set Stealth Rock up while also dealing damage or Taunting an opponent's setup Pokemon. Taunt makes Onix the perfect counter to Shell Smashers and RestTalkers, also preventing setup by Dwebble and status moves such as Will-O-Wisp from Vulpix. Roar can more reliably get Pokemon out if Onix isn't fast enough to Taunt them or strong enough to KO them, such as when against Misdreavus.

    Set Details
    ========
    The EVs are standard; maximum Speed is to outpace most middling Pokemon such as Dwebble or Tirtouga. Attack is maxed and 76 HP EVs brings Onix to 21 HP, which allows it to recover a full 20 HP from Berry Juice after Sturdy activates. It should be noted that at this Speed, Onix still Speed ties with Timid Surskit.

    Usage Tips
    ========
    Onix has two major ways of influencing a game. If there is a Pokemon that the team needs it to counter such as Fletchling, it can be kept alive and sent in whenever Fletchling makes an appearance to set up Stealth Rock. If there is not a Pokemon that Onix needs to be saved for or there is a Pokemon such as Spinarak or Dwebble that aims to set up on the first turn, Onix functions as an exceptional lead due to its ability to beat or damage Pokemon one-on-one while still getting Stealth Rock up.

    Team Options
    ========
    Onix is a Pokemon that works on just about any team in need of a reliable Stealth Rock user. It also has a fast Taunt, so it's quite useful for other Pokemon that rely on Sturdy and Focus Sash, such as Magnemite or Diglett. It gets forced out quite easily by Mienfoo after Stealth Rock is set up, so a switch-in to it such as Trubbish works nicely with Onix. Trubbish also deals with Grass-types quite well.

    Other Options
    ########

    A Curse + Dragon Tail set could probably be used, but it's outclassed immensely by most other Pokemon. Heavy Slam can be used to hit Fairy-types. Toxic can be used to hit bulky switch-ins such as Mienfoo. An offensive set with Rock Polish could also work, but Onix lacks the power to be threatening enough after a Speed boost. Stone Edge can be used over Rock Blast to hit specific Pokemon such as Archen without triggering Berry Juice. Explosion can be used as a last-ditch effort to KO a Rapid Spin or Defog user, but again, Onix suffers from a low Attack stat.


    Checks & Counters
    ########

    **Multi-Hit Moves**: Onix has the most trouble with certain setup sweepers that can either outpace it or have multi-hit moves. Shellder comes to mind as a Pokemon that can heavily threaten Onix. Though it can't set up due to Taunt, it can bypass Sturdy with Icicle Spear.

    **Bulky Fighting-types**: Onix has a very low Attack stat, so any bulky Fighting-type can switch into Earthquake and recover any lost HP with Drain Punch.

    **Bulky Grass-types**: Similar to Fighting-types, Grass-types can break Onix easily while healing themselves of any Earthquake or Rock Blast damage with Giga Drain.

    **Drilbur**: Drilbur is specifically very good at countering Onix due to Mold Breaker allowing it to KO through Sturdy and its ability to use Rapid Spin.
    Last edited: May 15, 2014
  2. Shaymin :D

    Shaymin :D

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    The overview should probably be in bullet points,like this
    • Has a niche in Sturdy and high defensive stats, which lets it set up SR more reliably than Gligar and other SR users.
    • Due to higher speed, it can outspeed and KO pokemon that Geodude can't, such as Dweeble and all the Sticky Webbers.
    • A horrible defensive typing is partly compensated by a Defense higher than Gligar's.
    • HP is low enough that Berry Juice will heal back up completely after Sturdy activates.
    • A surprisingly fast Taunt, along with good STABs, let it beat most leads 1 on 1.
  3. Expulso

    Expulso

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    You might want to mention that Surskit speed-ties with Onix if running a Timid nature (which it usually does), but that Onix can KO with Rock Blast, and that doing that from the start could be better than Taunting, althoug 90% accuracy is annoying.

    Also, Mold Breaker Drilbur speed-ties with it and has a 6% chance to OHKO with Earthquake (83% after Rocks!), as well as spinning away its rocks.

    In Team Options, put Rapid Spin / Defog support down as a way to ensure that it comes in with full health and Sturdy intact. Finally, a special wall helps guard it against its weaker SpD; specially defensive Spritzee works, as they only share a Steel weakness, and Spritzee can wish-pass to it, ensuring it can take a non-super effective hit and get back to full health, with sturdy intact. Or just mention wish-passing.

    Under Usage Tips, perhaps stress the importance of not switching into a Knock Off while you have Berry Juice, and so, perhaps, leading with it, as it is able to defeat many common leads, as you mentioned.

    Great job!
    Last edited: Jan 5, 2014
  4. Shaymin :D

    Shaymin :D

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    Cottonee should be mentioned as a counter, while Purrloin a check. Bulky Cottonee can wall Onix that don't carry Heavy Slam, Taunt it, take a hit if the Onix user predicts the Taunt, and can win the stall with GigaDrain. Cottonee can also switch into SR, encore it, and U-Turn to a sweeper. Purrloin can also Encore it and U-Turn out, but even Bulky sets are 2HKO'd by EQ.

    Also, as mentioned, Heavy Slam 2HKOs Cottonee, which makes HS partly viable and can be put in OO, but its your choice.
  5. Heysup

    Heysup Monsters are dangerous and kings are dying like flies.
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    OK. I'll make this QCable mow.
  6. Seismitoad

    Seismitoad

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    when mentioning the curse dragon tail set you are to general in saying its outclassed immensely by most other pokemon mention who exactly it is who outclasses onix as a curse+phazer
  7. Heysup

    Heysup Monsters are dangerous and kings are dying like flies.
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    I guess Lickitung is most notable but there's more that outclass it as a phazer rather than curse + phazer. I meant it's "not a good set and is outclassed by most things that aren't Curse+Dragon Tail Onix".
    Seismitoad likes this.
  8. Shaymin :D

    Shaymin :D

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    RestTalk Whirlwind Munchlax (along with Curse/Recycle/Whirlwind/Body Slam with BJ) is another good phazer. Vullaby is also good, I guess. imo they are both better than Lickitung, though Licky has Heal Bell.
  9. Darkamber8828

    Darkamber8828

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    Fake Out wrecks it. Especially Meditite and Mienfoo (who yeah you already mention), as they tank EQ and recover tons of health pack with Drain Punch (and Mienfoo can speed tie). Also it doesn't like hazards breaking Sturdy.

    236 Atk Onix Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 76 Def Meditite: 12-15 (63.1 - 78.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    Protect in OO, or maybe in the last slot? Sturdy phazing and Taunt are better, although you already beat non-Shellder Smashers with Rock Blast + Sturdy. ...Yeah, not worth slashing.
  10. macle

    macle ribbit
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    Little Cup Co-Leader

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    remove banned mons

    qc whatever / 3
  11. Goddess Briyella

    Goddess Briyella Unbreakable Heart
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    • Add Explosion and Stone Edge to Other Options.
    • Even though it's completely obvious, Onix's 4x weaknesses to Water and Grass still need to be mentioned. Croagunk not only comfortably walls the Fighting-types that can give Onix problems, but it also resists Grass and has an immunity to Water (and healing), thanks to Dry Skin. Poison-types in general are good partners for Onix, not just Trubbish; Koffing additionally covers Onix's Ground weakness by virtue of Levitate, and Tentacool resists Water and Fighting and can also punish Giga Drain and Drain Punch with Liquid Ooze. Sap Sipper Pokemon such as Deerling and Skiddo can get a nice Attack boost while covering Onix's Grass weakness and they also resist Ground and Water. All of these deserve a mention in Team Options.
    • Checks & Counters is really barren and should include just about every relevant Grass-, Water-, and Fighting-type. Cottonee can stop Onix's Stealth Rock from being used with Taunt, resists Earthquake, is immune to Dragon Tail, and hits Onix for a clean KO with Giga Drain (after Sturdy is broken by a hazard or something) while also restoring any health lost. Drilbur should get a special mention here as well for not only threatening Onix with a super effective STAB Earthquake, but also for being able to remove Onix's Stealth Rock with Rapid Spin and also likely have a turn to set up Stealth Rock of its own.


    QC 2/3
  12. Kavatika

    Kavatika is wary

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    briyella mentioned everything qc 3/3
  13. Heysup

    Heysup Monsters are dangerous and kings are dying like flies.
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    Been a long time since I've fully written an analysis, but this is written up.
  14. Legitimate Username

    Legitimate Username YAY I'M HELPING!
    is an Artistis a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon

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    Giant rock snake, same Attack stat as Butterfree.
    Additions
    Removals
    (Comments)
    Changes (open)
    Overview
    ########

    Onix is a niche Pokemon because of thanks to its unique stats and ability. Due to its Speed, it functions differently than Geodude, as it can due to it being able to Taunt and KO Pokemon faster than Geodude can. This is important when dealing with Sticky Web and Shell Smashers. Compared to Archen and other Stealth Rock users, Sturdy gives it the ability to reliably check a large amount of Pokemon, even ones that use super effective moves, such as like Magnemite.

    Sturdy + Berry Juice
    ########
    name: Sturdy + Berry Juice
    move 1: Earthquake
    move 2: Rock Blast
    move 3: Stealth Rock
    move 4: Taunt / Dragon Tail / Roar
    ability: Sturdy
    item: Berry Juice
    evs: 76 HP / 236 Atk / 196 Spe
    nature: Jolly

    Moves
    ========
    Earthquake is Onix's main STAB attack. Rock Blast is a very useful secondary STAB attack to deal with other opposing Sturdy Pokemon as well as Substitutes from Pokemon Substitute users such as Swirlix and (BANNED'D!) Torchic. Stealth Rock is one of the main reason reasons to use Onix. Due Thanks to its high defense Defense and access to Sturdy, it will have enough turns to set Stealth Rock up while also dealing damage or Taunting an opponent's set up setup Pokemon. Taunt makes Onix the perfect counter for to Shell Smashers and Restalkers RestTalkers, as well as preventing set-up setup by Dwebble or status moves such as Will-O-Wisp from Vulpix. Roar can more reliably get Pokemon out of if Onix isn't fast enough to Taunt them or strong enough to KO them, against Pokemon such as when against Misdreavus.

    Set Details
    ========
    EVs are standard; max Speed to outpace most middling Pokemon such as Dwebble or Tirtouga. Attack is maxed and 76 HP is useful because it lets EVs brings Onix hit to 21 HP, which allows it to recover 20 a full 20 HP from Berry Juice after Sturdy activates. It should be noted that at this Speed, Onix still Speed ties with Timid Surskit.

    Usage Tips
    ========
    Onix has two major ways to influence of influencing a game. If there is a Pokemon that the team needs it to counter such as Fletchling, it can be kept alive and sent in whenever Fletchling makes an appearance and set up Stealth Rock. If there is not a Pokemon that Onix needs to be saved for or there is a Pokemon such as Spinarak or Dwebble that aims to set up on the first turn, Onix functions as an exceptional lead due to its ability to beat, - or at least almost beat, many Pokemon one on one while still getting Stealth Rock up.

    Team Options
    ========
    Onix is a Pokemon that works on just about any team in need of a reliable Stealth Rock user. It also has a fast Taunt so it's quite useful for other Pokemon that rely on Sturdy and Focus Sash, such as like Magnemite and or Diglett. It gets forced out quite easily by Mienfoo after Stealth Rock is set up, so a switch-in to it such as Trubbish works nicely with Onix. Trubbish also deals with Grass-types quite well.

    Other Options
    ########

    A Curse + Dragon Tail set could probably be used, but it's outclassed immensely by most other Pokemon. Heavy Slam can be used to hit fairies Fairy-types. Toxic can be used to hit bulky Pokemon switch-ins such as Mienfoo. An offensive set with Rock Polish could also work, but Onix lacks the power to be threatening enough after a Rock Polish Speed boost. Stone Edge can be used over Rock Blast to hit specific Pokemon such as Archen without triggering Berry Juice. Explosion can be used as a last ditch effort to KO a Rapid Spin or Defog user, but again, Onix, again, suffers from a low Attack stat.


    Checks & Counters
    ########

    **Multi-Hit moves Moves**: Onix has the most trouble with certain set up Pokemon sweepers that either can outpace it or have multi-hit moves. Shellder come to mind as Pokemon who that can heavily threaten Onix wants to stay away from (remember, this section is written for the player looking to counter Onix, not the one using it). Though it can't set up with due to Taunt, it can bypass Sturdy with Icicle Spear.

    **Bulky Fighting-types**: Onix has very low Attack stat, so any bulky Fighting-type can switch into Earthquake and recover any lost HP via with Drain Punch.

    **Bulky Grass-types**: Similar to Fighting-types, Grass-types can break Onix easily while healing themselves of any Earthquake or Rock Blast damage with Giga Drain.

    **Drilburr Drilbur**: Drilburr Drilbur is specifically very good at countering Onix due to Mold Breaker KOing allowing it to KO through Sturdy and its ability to use Rapid Spin.
    Copypaste (open)
    Overview
    ########

    Onix is a niche Pokemon thanks to its unique stats and ability. Due to its Speed, it functions differently than Geodude, as it can Taunt and KO Pokemon faster than Geodude can. This is important when dealing with Sticky Web and Shell Smashers. Compared to Archen and other Stealth Rock users, Sturdy gives it the ability to reliably check a large amount of Pokemon, even ones that use super effective moves, such as Magnemite.

    Sturdy + Berry Juice
    ########
    name: Sturdy + Berry Juice
    move 1: Earthquake
    move 2: Rock Blast
    move 3: Stealth Rock
    move 4: Taunt / Dragon Tail / Roar
    ability: Sturdy
    item: Berry Juice
    evs: 76 HP / 236 Atk / 196 Spe
    nature: Jolly

    Moves
    ========
    Earthquake is Onix's main STAB attack. Rock Blast is a very useful secondary STAB attack to deal with opposing Sturdy Pokemon as well as Substitute users such as Torchic. Stealth Rock is one of the main reasons to use Onix. Thanks to its high Defense and access to Sturdy, it will have enough turns to set Stealth Rock up while also dealing damage or Taunting an opponent's setup Pokemon. Taunt makes Onix the perfect counter to Shell Smashers and RestTalkers, as well as preventing setup by Dwebble or status moves such as Will-O-Wisp from Vulpix. Roar can more reliably get Pokemon out if Onix isn't fast enough to Taunt them or strong enough to KO them, such as when against Misdreavus.

    Set Details
    ========
    EVs are standard; max Speed to outpace most middling Pokemon such as Dwebble or Tirtouga. Attack is maxed and 76 HP EVs brings Onix to 21 HP, which allows it to recover a full 20 HP from Berry Juice after Sturdy activates. It should be noted that at this Speed, Onix still Speed ties with Timid Surskit.

    Usage Tips
    ========
    Onix has two major ways of influencing a game. If there is a Pokemon that the team needs it to counter such as Fletchling, it can be kept alive and sent in whenever Fletchling makes an appearance and set up Stealth Rock. If there is not a Pokemon that Onix needs to be saved for or there is a Pokemon such as Spinarak or Dwebble that aims to set up on the first turn, Onix functions as an exceptional lead due to its ability to beat, - or at least almost beat, many Pokemon one on one while still getting Stealth Rock up.

    Team Options
    ========
    Onix is a Pokemon that works on just about any team in need of a reliable Stealth Rock user. It also has a fast Taunt so it's quite useful for other Pokemon that rely on Sturdy and Focus Sash, such as Magnemite or Diglett. It gets forced out quite easily by Mienfoo after Stealth Rock is set up, so a switch-in to it such as Trubbish works nicely with Onix. Trubbish also deals with Grass-types quite well.

    Other Options
    ########

    A Curse + Dragon Tail set could probably be used, but it's outclassed immensely by most other Pokemon. Heavy Slam can be used to hit Fairy-types. Toxic can be used to hit bulky switch-ins such as Mienfoo. An offensive set with Rock Polish could also work, but Onix lacks the power to be threatening enough after a Speed boost. Stone Edge can be used over Rock Blast to hit specific Pokemon such as Archen without triggering Berry Juice. Explosion can be used as a last ditch effort to KO a Rapid Spin or Defog user, but again, Onix suffers from a low Attack stat.


    Checks & Counters
    ########

    **Multi-Hit Moves**: Onix has the most trouble with certain set up sweepers that either can outpace it or have multi-hit moves. Shellder come to mind as Pokemon that can heavily threaten Onix. Though it can't set up due to Taunt, it can bypass Sturdy with Icicle Spear.

    **Bulky Fighting-types**: Onix has very low Attack stat, so any bulky Fighting-type can switch into Earthquake and recover any lost HP with Drain Punch.

    **Bulky Grass-types**: Similar to Fighting-types, Grass-types can break Onix easily while healing themselves of any Earthquake or Rock Blast damage with Giga Drain.

    **Drilbur**: Drilbur is specifically very good at countering Onix due to Mold Breaker allowing it to KO through Sturdy and its ability to use Rapid Spin.
    [​IMG]
    GP approved 1/2
    Last edited: May 12, 2014
  15. Heysup

    Heysup Monsters are dangerous and kings are dying like flies.
    is a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Forum Moderator Alumnus

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    Thanks. Can't believe I missed Swirlix...
  16. Calm Pokemaster

    Calm Pokemaster
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    Deletions
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    Comments

    Show Hide

    Overview
    ########

    Onix is a niche Pokemon thanks to its unique stats and ability. Due to its Speed, it functions differently from Geodude, as it can Taunt and KO Pokemon faster than Geodude can. This is important when dealing with Sticky Web and Shell Smashers. Compared to Archen and other Stealth Rock users, Sturdy gives it the ability to reliably check a large amount of Pokemon, even ones that use super effective moves, such as Magnemite.

    Sturdy + Berry Juice
    ########
    name: Sturdy + Berry Juice
    move 1: Earthquake
    move 2: Rock Blast
    move 3: Stealth Rock
    move 4: Taunt / Dragon Tail / Roar
    ability: Sturdy
    item: Berry Juice
    evs: 76 HP / 236 Atk / 196 Spe
    nature: Jolly

    Moves
    ========
    Earthquake is Onix's main STAB attack. Rock Blast is a very useful secondary STAB attack to deal with opposing Sturdy Pokemon as well as Substitute users such as Torchic. Stealth Rock is one of the main reasons to use Onix. Thanks to its high Defense and access to Sturdy, it will have enough turns to set Stealth Rock up while also dealing damage or Taunting an opponent's setup Pokemon. Taunt makes Onix the perfect counter to Shell Smashers and RestTalkers, as well as also preventing setup by Dwebble or and status moves such as Will-O-Wisp from Vulpix. Roar can more reliably get Pokemon out if Onix isn't fast enough to Taunt them or strong enough to KO them, such as when against Misdreavus.

    Set Details
    ========
    The EVs are standard; maximum Speed is to outpace most middling Pokemon such as Dwebble or Tirtouga. Attack is maxed and 76 HP EVs brings Onix to 21 HP, which allows it to recover a full 20 HP from Berry Juice after Sturdy activates. It should be noted that at this Speed, Onix still Speed ties with Timid Surskit.

    Usage Tips
    ========
    Onix has two major ways of influencing a game. If there is a Pokemon that the team needs it to counter such as Fletchling, it can be kept alive and sent in whenever Fletchling makes an appearance and to set up Stealth Rock. If there is not a Pokemon that Onix needs to be saved for or there is a Pokemon such as Spinarak or Dwebble that aims to set up on the first turn, Onix functions as an exceptional lead due to its ability to beat—or at least almost beat—many Pokemon one-on-one while still getting Stealth Rock up.

    Team Options
    ========
    Onix is a Pokemon that works on just about any team in need of a reliable Stealth Rock user. It also has a fast Taunt, (add comma) so it's quite useful for other Pokemon that rely on Sturdy and Focus Sash, such as Magnemite or Diglett. It gets forced out quite easily by Mienfoo after Stealth Rock is set up, so a switch-in to it such as Trubbish works nicely with Onix. Trubbish also deals with Grass-types quite well.

    Other Options
    ########

    A Curse + Dragon Tail set could probably be used, but it's outclassed immensely by most other Pokemon. Heavy Slam can be used to hit Fairy-types. Toxic can be used to hit bulky switch-ins such as Mienfoo. An offensive set with Rock Polish could also work, but Onix lacks the power to be threatening enough after a Speed boost. Stone Edge can be used over Rock Blast to hit specific Pokemon such as Archen without triggering Berry Juice. Explosion can be used as a last-ditch effort to KO a Rapid Spin or Defog user, but again, Onix suffers from a low Attack stat.


    Checks & Counters
    ########

    **Multi-Hit Moves**: Onix has the most trouble with certain setup sweepers that can either can outpace it or have multi-hit moves. Shellder comes to mind as a Pokemon that can heavily threaten Onix. Though it can't set up due to Taunt, it can bypass Sturdy with Icicle Spear.

    **Bulky Fighting-types**: Onix has a very low Attack stat, so any bulky Fighting-type can switch into Earthquake and recover any lost HP with Drain Punch.

    **Bulky Grass-types**: Similar to Fighting-types, Grass-types can break Onix easily while healing themselves of any Earthquake or Rock Blast damage with Giga Drain.

    **Drilbur**: Drilbur is specifically very good at countering Onix due to Mold Breaker allowing it to KO through Sturdy and its ability to use Rapid Spin.


    [​IMG]

    GP 2 / 2
    Last edited: May 15, 2014
  17. Heysup

    Heysup Monsters are dangerous and kings are dying like flies.
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    RIP copy/pastable gp checks. thanks tho :). Will add it in.
    Lord Alphose likes this.

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