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FU ORAS FU Metagame Discussion (old)

Discussion in 'ORAS PU' started by Gary, Jun 12, 2014.

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  1. Gary

    Gary Can be abrasive at times (no joke)
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    [​IMG]ORAS Forgot to Use[​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Credit to brightobject for the amazing banner!
    [​IMG]Introduction[​IMG]

    Welcome to the FU Metagame for X&Y! Because PU wasn't enough, Forgot to Use allows all the PU Pokemon that are 3.4% or lower in the 1760 usage stats to be used. Surprisingly, there are quite a lot of decent Pokemon available to use.

    Forgot to Use is playable by simply challenging your friends on Pokemon Showdown (simply select PU on Pokemon Showdown and make sure that both players are aware that they should be using Forgot to Use teams). You can easily go on SynIRC and join #xyfu to chat in real time with fellow Forgot to Use players and maybe find battles. Because the PU meta is still very young, tier shifts will happen every month until the ladder is stabilized in order to keep this tier interesting.

    Forgot to Use Co Leader: Mambo
    Forgot to Use Council:
    unfixable


    Forgot to Use follows all standard Smogon clauses and bans.

    Banlist:
    http://pastebin.com/tZyGYezM By usage
    Vigoroth
    Regice
    Stoutland
    Machoke
    Sticky Web
    Ursaring
    Barbaracle
    Chatot

    A team cannot have any of the Pokemon found in the following tiers: PU, NU, BL3, RU, BL2, UU, BL, OU, and Ubers.


    threatlist (open)

    Ariados
    Articuno
    Bastiodon
    Beartic
    Butterfree
    Clefairy
    Delibird
    Ditto
    Dodrio
    Dragonair
    Driftblim
    Dusclops
    Dwebble
    Electabuzz
    Electrode
    Flareon
    Fraxure
    Frogadier
    Gabite
    Gigalith
    Glaceon
    Gogoat
    Gourgeist-Small/Large
    Hippopotas
    Huntail
    Hypno
    Kingler
    Klang
    Lairon
    Lampent
    Lapras
    Leavanny
    Lickitung
    Linoone
    Lumineon
    Luxray
    Magcargo
    Magmar
    Masquerain
    Meganium
    Meowstic-M/F
    Metang
    Murkrow
    Octillery
    Pineco
    Politoed
    Purugly
    Quilladin
    Rampardos
    Raticate
    Relicanth
    Regigigas
    Scraggy
    Seaking
    Servine
    Seviper
    Shedinja
    Shelgon
    Simisage
    Simisear
    Slaking
    Sliggoo
    Solrock
    Spritzee
    Staravia
    Swalot
    Swanna
    Swoobat
    Tropius
    Vullaby
    Wailord
    Walrein
    Wartortle
    Whirlipede
    Whiscash
    Yanma
    Zweilous


    Viability Rankings (open)
    http://piratepad.net/6CRSpQzHdS

    S Rank: Reserved for Pokemon that are amazing in the Forgot to Use metagame. These Pokemon are usually able to perform a variety of roles effectively, or can just do one extremely well. Their use has low risk involved and high reward[​IMG] exerted. Pokemon in this rank have very few flaws that are patched up by numerous positive traits.

    S+ rank

    [​IMG] Electabuzz
    [​IMG] Fraxure

    S Rank

    [​IMG] Murkrow

    S- Rank

    [​IMG] Articuno
    [​IMG] Simisage


    A Rank: Reserved for Pokemon that are fantastic in the Forgot to Use metagame, and can sweep, support, or wall significant portions of the metagame. These Pokemon require less support than most others to be used effectively and have few flaws that can easily be compensated for when compared to their positive traits.
    A+ Rank

    [​IMG] Clefairy
    [​IMG] Dodrio
    [​IMG] Lairon
    [​IMG] Metang
    [​IMG] Quillidin
    [​IMG] Raticate
    [​IMG] Simisear
    A Rank

    [​IMG] Gogoat
    [​IMG] Golduck
    [​IMG] Huntail
    [​IMG] Kingler
    [​IMG] Krokorok
    [​IMG] Rampardos
    [​IMG] Seviper
    [​IMG] Swanna
    A- Rank

    [​IMG] Dusclops
    [​IMG] Electrode
    [​IMG] Flareon
    [​IMG] Gabite
    [​IMG] Gigalith
    [​IMG] Gourgeist-S
    [​IMG] Lapras
    [​IMG] Marshstomp
    [​IMG] Persian
    [​IMG] Politoed
    [​IMG] Regigigas
    [​IMG] Stunfisk
    [​IMG] Swoobat
    [​IMG] Wartortle
    [​IMG] Zweilous

    B Rank: Reserved for Pokemon that are great in the Forgot to Use metagame. These Pokemon have more notable flaws than those above them that affect how they function in the tier. Their positive traits still outshine their negatives, but they require a bit more team support to bring out their full potential.
    B+

    [​IMG] Butterfree
    [​IMG] Ditto
    [​IMG] Dwebble
    [​IMG] Illumise
    [​IMG] Linoone
    [​IMG] Luxray
    [​IMG] Meowstic-M
    [​IMG] Purugly
    [​IMG] Relicanth
    [​IMG] Servine
    [​IMG] Solrock
    [​IMG] Spritzee
    [​IMG] Vibrava
    [​IMG] Vullaby
    [​IMG] Whiscash
    [​IMG] Wigglytuff

    B Rank

    [​IMG] Bastiodon
    [​IMG] Beartic
    [​IMG] Bellossom
    [​IMG] Carbink
    [​IMG] Dragonair
    [​IMG] Fearow
    [​IMG] Frogadier
    [​IMG] Girafarig
    [​IMG] Glaceon
    [​IMG] Gourgeist-L
    [​IMG] Klang
    [​IMG] Leavanny
    [​IMG] Magcargo
    [​IMG] Mothim
    [​IMG] Noctowl
    [​IMG] Seaking
    [​IMG] Staravia
    [​IMG] Venipede
    [​IMG] Whirlipede

    B- Rank

    [​IMG] Chimecho
    [​IMG] Delibird
    [​IMG] Furfrou
    [​IMG] Hippopotas
    [​IMG] Lumineon
    [​IMG] Meowstic-F
    [​IMG] Octillery
    [​IMG] Scraggy
    [​IMG] Shedinja
    [​IMG] Swalot
    [​IMG] Wormadam-Trash

    C Rank: Reserved for Pokemon that have notable niches in the Forgot to Use metagame, but have just as many notable flaws that prevent them from being effective. Pokemon in the C tier often require significant support to be effective. Pokemon from this rank tend to face a lot of competition with the more commonly used Pokemon.

    C Rank

    [​IMG] Anorith
    [​IMG] Diglett
    [​IMG] Emolga
    [​IMG] Carvanha
    [​IMG] Lampent
    [​IMG] Lickitung
    [​IMG] Magmar
    [​IMG] Magnemite
    [​IMG] Natu
    [​IMG] Slaking
    [​IMG] Slowpoke
    [​IMG] Snover
    [​IMG] Sudowoodo
    [​IMG] Tentacool
    [​IMG] Unfezant
    [​IMG] Yanma

    D Rank: Reserved for Pokemon that are mediocre in the Forgot to Use metagame, but are viable enough to justify their use on select teams. These Pokemon are either usable but have no real niche, or are only capable of doing their specific task and fail at doing anything more than that. Pokemon from this rank have multiple crippling flaws that prevent them from being successful a majority of the time, and are often severely outclassed because of it.

    D Rank

    [​IMG] Marill
    [​IMG] Sandshrew

    E Rank: Reserved for Pokemon that are near unviable in the Forgot to Use metagame, and are only ranked because of an extremely minute niche that very rarely makes them useful on select teams. A few Pokemon in this rank aren't even considered viable at all, and are only placed in this rank because they have no where else to go.

    [​IMG] Dustox
    [​IMG] Furret
    [​IMG] Unown



    Sample Sets (open)


    Speed Tiers (open)


    Have fun!
    Last edited: Jul 3, 2015
  2. VanGru

    VanGru

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    Wow, there are certainly a few pokemon that really don't deserve to be here :/ sawsbuck really? :/
  3. Pikachuun

    Pikachuun better be a good mon
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    I was going to do this you monster D:
    Also maybe Pikachu could be viable this time, with its big brother Raichu out of the tier it is essentially one of the only Electric types in the tier (besides Stunfisk and Electabuzz), and considering all of the Flying and Water types in the OP it could be at least decent. Then again, it has to have Light Ball, so it'll probably be outclassed by Electabuzz. But hey, ExtremeSpeed is still cool!
    Adestria likes this.
  4. Ranger Mike

    Ranger Mike

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    Lol I like how we have kricketune offense will also be far superior due to missy being in the meta and being the godly stall breaker she is. Anyways I'm gonna start off with saying that a linoone suspect is p important as because meowstic m is somehow in this thing it can support linoone with dual screens and twave. If anyone can name a stop to Linoone that is within the threatlist that can switch into linoone's attacks and wall it I will withdraw this statement. Also I don't wanna be too suspect heavy but CB zweilous seems impossible to switch into and the fact that it has webs only makes it so much better, with the right predictions zweilous can beat all it's checks, maybe it could run life orb just to make it so that it doesn't rely so heavily on predictions. Also nvm about that stall thing roselia is in the tier LOL WUT. Webs seems like the best playstyle in the meta cause it has so many pokemon that benefit from it such as wailord who can spam specs boosted water spout.
    Vertex likes this.
  5. Anttya

    Anttya

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    Staravia <3

    Although it'll be facing competition w/ Prinplup, Murkrow, and Vullaby and maybe Bananasaur. Staravia gets Intimidate, and reliable recovery (Unlike Prinplup and Bananasaur.) Bird spam looks pretty viable as well. Also, Linoone's going to be a big threat since it can kill / outspeed Gourgiest w/ Shadow Claw. Everything else gets obliterated by Extremespeed or Shadow Claw

    Edit: Tfw Linoone has 100 base speed and Gourgiest-Small has 99... I think it was meant to be :[
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2014
  6. Palpitoad707

    Palpitoad707

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    This definitely looks like an interesting meta, taking the worst of the worst of the worst. Webs will probably be dominate, just because of the amount of Pokemon that can abuse them. You don't even really need a spinblocker, because the only spinner in the tier is Delibird, and it's 4x weak to rocks. This looks like it will be a meta of defoggers, and there a few decent ones, like Prinplup, Murkrow, Staravia, and Vullaby. One thing that probably definitely needs to be banned is Linoone. If it sets up, it's basically over. Nothing can really switch in on it, and it reaches a crucial base 100 speed, outspeeding practically everything. This meta does look like a lot of fun though!
  7. Jac

    Jac If you need to learn how to talk to a lady, ask your mum.
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    I literally tried to think of something that wants to be in on Linoone.

    Nobody. Wants. To. Deal. With. That.

    ESpeed / Shadow Claw / Seed Bomb is perfect coverage literally no one wants this mon to hit them.

    +6 252+ Atk Linoone Shadow Claw vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Eviolite Metang: 298-352 (92.2 - 108.9%) -- 50% chance to OHKO
    +6 252+ Atk Linoone Shadow Claw vs. 248 HP / 252 Def Eviolite Metang: 236-278 (73 - 86%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    +6 252+ Atk Linoone Seed Bomb vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Carbink: 274-324 (90.1 - 106.5%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO

    and then i found these glorious calcs

    +6 252+ Atk Linoone Extreme Speed vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Klang: 95-112 (29.3 - 34.5%) -- 8.1% chance to 3HKO
    +6 252+ Atk Linoone Shadow Claw vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Klang: 111-131 (34.2 - 40.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
    +6 252+ Atk Linoone Seed Bomb vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Klang: 63-75 (19.4 - 23.1%) -- possible 5HKO

    GO KLANG GO
  8. Sergeant Spooky

    Sergeant Spooky

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    Sawsbuck and Victreebel stand out to me right away. Both are some of the best Chlorphyll Sweepers (I mean there's not a lot of competition, but still,) and there's Meowstic-M notably who has Prankster Sunny Day. Some other stuff could use Sunny Day too I guess idk.

    No Fire types really stand out, aside from Simisear cause of its speed tier. Considering it gets Nasty Plot, it might end up being a pretty good Pokemon and frighteningly powerful under sun.

    So yeah Sun could be stronk.

    By the way 10/10 name for the tier. After we figure out the top threats we need some artist to make a logo of them flipping the bird.
  9. Ranger Mike

    Ranger Mike

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    B-b-b-b-but rocks since this tier has even shittier removers than pu cause there are obviously less mons, tbh you can just assume rocks +3 spikes with every calc lol.
    Jaguar360 likes this.
  10. Quote

    Quote Cautiously Optimistic
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    I remember wanting to get into PU but I never did. Maybe FU is what I needed to play all along...

    I see some fun Pokemon to use in that list, like Scraggy/Missy, but Jumpluff could also be fun to play with.
    Imanalt and Minus like this.
  11. tennisace

    tennisace cardiac cats
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    Articuno, Vullaby, Swanna, and Prinplup are all viable Defog users in this tier. Also lets not talk about suspects for a while unless something proves to be absolutely ridiculous with playtesting. The tier has literally been in existence for ~1 hour, cool your jets please.
    Karxrida, Montsegur, Vertex and 7 others like this.
  12. ante

    ante
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    feeling that Huntail is gonna be a shitty pain the neck once again
  13. Lord Wallace

    Lord Wallace Hentai Connoiseur
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    Zweilous is going to be a threat [: nice Hustle Outrage with basically no Fairy types in the tier
    Shiruba likes this.
  14. Jaguar360

    Jaguar360

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    So, spinners...we have Spinda, Delibird, Tentacool, Staryu, Anorith, Bergmite, Shellder, Drilbur, Pineco, Kabuto, Sandshrew, Tyrouge and Squirtle...that's really bad. I guess Tentacool, Staryu, bulky Drilbur and Anorith could possibly be decent at the job, but Defogging seems 100% better unless you have a team that really needs to keep hazards up.

    And just how are Swanna and Articuno FU anyway? And Kricketune? Use these more in PU people.
  15. Imanalt

    Imanalt I'm the coolest girl you'll ever meet
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    So i've been playing with some people for a couple days now, and so far regice has been ridiculous. It doesn't die to anything at all, and hits like a truck. your average special attacker can do maybe 20% (things like specs fire blast from octillery don't even 2hko regice running 0 sdef investment...). Basically the only way to kill it is keep rocks up (which is hard because there aren't many good rocks setters) and have multiple physical attackers who outrun and have SE stab... Unfortunately the list of those is VERY short. Regice definitely looks to be the number 1 threat to prepare for and a possible future issue if the meta doesn't shift to deal with it

    Also interesting so far has been scarf krokorok, which is a very good check to swoobat, able to outrun and ohko, as well as revenging other threats such as simisear. And that's before we get into its ability to sweep lategame with moxie, or cripple stall by knocking off eviolites and/or pursuittrapping mons like grumpig. Basically it does good things against all teams other than webs, so use it :O

    EDIT: oh the other thing i forgot to mention was quilladin. It has insane physical bulk, spikes, recovery, phazing, etc. It is a bit of a momentum killer, but its also one of the best physical walls in the tier, should be a staple on most stall teams.
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2014
    sugarhigh likes this.
  16. Hot N Cold

    Hot N Cold
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    stall looks op.


    np
    Plulax, mariner3579, Amaluna and 11 others like this.
  17. Goddess Briyella

    Goddess Briyella Banned deucer.

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    Bring on the 4x Stealth Rock-weak Defogger lol

    Yea, I'm curious as to how it's allowed THIS LOW. I haven't really played PU or anything yet, though, so ehh...



    I'm really shocked to see Walrein, Sawsbuck, and Electabuzz this low as well.
    Ransei and Amaluna like this.
  18. ante

    ante
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    Walrein and Regice will be really nice special walls, and I'm not sure which will be more fun to use. If I recall from Gen 4/5 NU, Regice is hugely more offensive than Walrein, though ToxicSub should make for easy pickings in the low-ish offense environment, apart from things like Huntail, Sawsbuck, and Electabuzz, with proper support.

    also I don't think Articuno should be defogging, if anything it's the FU version of RU Moltres. no point in slapping the move on something that's going to be half dead using it already. leave that to Vullaby or Prinplup
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2014
    Goddess Briyella likes this.
  19. Melons-N-Soda

    Melons-N-Soda

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    This tier does seem like fun. (It seems to have a lot of broken shit though) Though I do have to say something:
    | 56 | Slaking | 3.50075% | 13877 | 4.886% | 11198 | 4.778% |
    Why?
    Jaguar360 likes this.
  20. Cobracorp

    Cobracorp

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    As mentioned before Hazards look they will be play quite a big part in the tier. Huntail and Sticky web is going to be a real pain to take on. I'm honestly surprised that Drifblim is going to be in this tier. I really hope Prinplup manages to hold up as a decent defogger otherwise let the hazard spam commence.
  21. astromund

    astromund

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    [​IMG]

    Autisticat (Meowstic-F) (F) @ Life Orb
    Ability: Competitive
    EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    Timid / Modest Nature
    - Psyshock
    - Thunderbolt
    - Signal Beam
    - Substitute

    I can see Meowstic-F becoming an extremely important mon in this tier given how dominant hazards look right now. LO Competitive discourages any attempts at webs or defogging, since +2 psyshock destroys just about everything that's not a bulky psychic or dark type. Tbolt wrecks almost every single hazard remover mentioned in this thread (most of which are water or flying), and Signal Beam covers darks and psychics. Base 104 speed puts it far ahead of almost everything bar scarfers and sucker punch users, the latter of which can be avoided with substitute. You could even go Sub/CM or give it fake out for a (super dumb) anti-lead if you really wanted to.
    Jaguar360 likes this.
  22. Imanalt

    Imanalt I'm the coolest girl you'll ever meet
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    What does walrein have over lapras? Lapras has better bulk, better offensive presence because of its movepool, and has better support moves with heal bell and perish song.
  23. Dylan1244

    Dylan1244

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    | 101 | Wigglytuff | 1.43700% | 6777 | 2.386% | 5386 | 2.298% |

    So , is wigglytuff FU? i really love this thing <3
  24. The Reptile

    The Reptile ( ̄^ ̄)ゞ
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    Butterfree looks neat here - for once, it's happy to have a Flying-typing because it can just fly about those pesky Sticky Webs.
    Shiruba likes this.
  25. ante

    ante
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    it's also faster than Masquerain and Dustox and gets Sleep Powder, so it's probably the most effective Quiver Dancer in the metagame. I was talking with some people and we think that despite Dustox's pretty subpar offenses, it can run a QD/Roost/Sludge Bomb/Shadow Ball spread to cover its bases quite effectively. it will have problems with things like Magmar by virtue of type matchup but the coverage is decent and given a few boosts, it might be able to truck through obstacles
    RyanKoopa, The Reptile and Shiruba like this.
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