Gen 3 OU RMT

[Actaeon]

Hello fellas, here is a team that I have been using a lot lately, and it has few problems but the problems it has are huge... Both Dusclops {Focus Punch, Shadow Ball/Night Shade, Will-o-Wisp and Rest} and stall teams (which usually contain a Dusclops) rape it totally. Blissey is also very hard to deal with if it has Thunder Wave and Seismic Toss.
Maybe you have solutions for these problems?

Zapdos @ Leftovers ** Khosoplae
Trait: Pressure
EVs: 128 HP / 160 Spd / 220 SAtk
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Baton Pass
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Substitute
- Thunderbolt

Makes a good start against a lot of Pokémon and if the opponent's lead is Tyranitar I can Baton Pass to see if it's going to use Focus Punch and if it does, I pass to Gengar. Substitute is very handy to pass to Tyranitar lategame as well as helping the team. Hidden Power for Flygon and Salamence because Swampert has a lot of things to do already. It outspeeds Neutral Nature outmaxed 100 BS speed Pokémon.

Regice @ Leftovers ** Thanderobley
Trait: Clear Body
EVs: 252 HP / 112 Def / 28 Spd / 116 SAtk
Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
- Ice Beam
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
- Thunderbolt

My special wall and my Zapdos counter. I also switch it in on things like Jolteon, Magneton and Gengar. It absorbs status very well.

Gengar (M) @ Leftovers ** Teskacks
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 236 Atk / 248 Spd / 24 SAtk
Mild Nature (+SAtk, -Def)
- Explosion
- Giga Drain
- Sludge Bomb
- Thunderbolt

Giga Drain for Swampert and it dents Tyranitar switchings, Sludge Bomb to hurt Blissey for round 30% and it poisons other switchins occasionally which suits the team. Thunderbolt for denting bulky waters other than Swampert and for Skarmory and Forretress. Explosion when I need to get rid of something like Curselax. I am thinking to make this a CB Gar, but then I have huge Swampert problems since Zapdos has HP [ice].

Forretress (M) @ Leftovers ** Socklefrock
Trait: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 176 Atk / 80 SDef
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Explosion
- Hidden Power [Bug]
- Rapid Spin
- Spikes

A physical wall, with a not too defensive spread to 2hko Starmie and Claydol and put a big dent in Curselax. It still stops Metagross and other Snorlax without Fire Blast cold. Enough Special Defense to counter Tyraniboah for the time being if Swampert is hurt.

Swampert (M) @ Leftovers ** Rain Acne
Trait: Torrent
EVs: 252 HP / 124 Def / 12 Spd / 120 SAtk
Relaxed Nature (+Def, -Spd)
- Earthquake
- Hydro Pump
- Ice Beam
- Protect

Standard mixpert with a lot of Special Attack, to threaten the big three and Aerodactyl and make holes in Skarmory, Forretress and Weezing if they decide to stay in or switch in. Works very well.

Tyranitar (M) @ Liechi Berry ** Rechioever
Trait: Sand Stream
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Double-Edge
- Dragon Dance
- Earthquake
- Rock Slide

My late game sweeper. If it is at full health, it can use Dragon Dance when a full health Swampert switches in, then use Double-Edge which will deal about 45%~50% Damage and then eat an Earthquake or Surf to activate the Liechi Berry. Works very well with a Substitute from Zapdos. I try to avoid early use of Tyranitar to make use of Leftovers more in my team.

In this team, I have tried to make a perfect balance between offensive and defensive activities. But against stallteams, the offensive part still falls short. Normally, I can explode on things I really want to get rid of but Dusclops resists it and I can switch nothing in on it.

I would greatly appreciate any comments that would do this team good :P
thanks in advance

 

[Heysup]

Hello fellas, here is a team that I have been using a lot lately, and it has few problems but the problems it has are huge... Both Dusclops {Focus Punch, Shadow Ball/Night Shade, Will-o-Wisp and Rest} and stall teams (which usually contain a Dusclops) rape it totally. Blissey is also very hard to deal with if it has Thunder Wave and Seismic Toss.
Maybe you have solutions for these problems?

Zapdos @ Leftovers ** Khosoplae
Trait: Pressure
EVs: 128 HP / 160 Spd / 220 SAtk
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Baton Pass
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Substitute
- Thunderbolt

Makes a good start against a lot of Pokémon and if the opponent's lead is Tyranitar I can Baton Pass to see if it's going to use Focus Punch and if it does, I pass to Gengar. Substitute is very handy to pass to Tyranitar lategame as well as helping the team. Hidden Power for Flygon and Salamence because Swampert has a lot of things to do already. It outspeeds Neutral Nature outmaxed 100 BS speed Pokémon.

Boring, but works....You COULD put agility over hp ice and put some HP evs in instead of speed to make your subs harder to break, but its not needed.

Regice @ Leftovers ** Thanderobley
Trait: Clear Body
EVs: 252 HP / 112 Def / 28 Spd / 116 SAtk
Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
- Ice Beam
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
- Thunderbolt

My special wall and my Zapdos counter. I also switch it in on things like Jolteon, Magneton and Gengar. It absorbs status very well.

Im usually the last person to say this but....Blissey maybe? Or to deal with your dusclops problem you could put a SD shadowball recover Baton pass Celebi in, can also help ttar sweep.

Gengar (M) @ Leftovers ** Teskacks
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 236 Atk / 248 Spd / 24 SAtk
Mild Nature (+SAtk, -Def)
- Explosion
- Giga Drain
- Sludge Bomb
- Thunderbolt

Giga Drain for Swampert and it dents Tyranitar switchings, Sludge Bomb to hurt Blissey for round 30% and it poisons other switchins occasionally which suits the team. Thunderbolt for denting bulky waters other than Swampert and for Skarmory and Forretress. Explosion when I need to get rid of something like Curselax. I am thinking to make this a CB Gar, but then I have huge Swampert problems since Zapdos has HP [ice].

Not bad, but if you are going this way anyway, id suggest even MCgar to help with your blissey problem that you stated. MCgar(subpunch+2 special attacks) also loves a Substitute from zapdos. Or if you are against that then you can put Shadowball over Sludgebomb to deal with Dusclops.

Forretress (M) @ Leftovers ** Socklefrock
Trait: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 176 Atk / 80 SDef
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Explosion
- Hidden Power [Bug]
- Rapid Spin
- Spikes

A physical wall, with a not too defensive spread to 2hko Starmie and Claydol and put a big dent in Curselax. It still stops Metagross and other Snorlax without Fire Blast cold. Enough Special Defense to counter Tyraniboah for the time being if Swampert is hurt.

This is Mag bait but if you are good at predicting this then it works, you may want to consider EQ over explosion or hp bug.

Swampert (M) @ Leftovers ** Rain Acne
Trait: Torrent
EVs: 252 HP / 124 Def / 12 Spd / 120 SAtk
Relaxed Nature (+Def, -Spd)
- Earthquake
- Hydro Pump
- Ice Beam
- Protect

Standard mixpert with a lot of Special Attack, to threaten the big three and Aerodactyl and make holes in Skarmory, Forretress and Weezing if they decide to stay in or switch in. Works very well.

You and everybody else who plays ou.

Tyranitar (M) @ Liechi Berry ** Rechioever
Trait: Sand Stream
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Double-Edge
- Dragon Dance
- Earthquake
- Rock Slide

My late game sweeper. If it is at full health, it can use Dragon Dance when a full health Swampert switches in, then use Double-Edge which will deal about 45%~50% Damage and then eat an Earthquake or Surf to activate the Liechi Berry. Works very well with a Substitute from Zapdos. I try to avoid early use of Tyranitar to make use of Leftovers more in my team.

You are correct to keep this in your back pocket untill the end, because its a one time use thing. Double edge strategies tend to fail alot because your standard TTar counters wont mind taking a DE, and you may not be able to kill them even with a +2 attack, but it has the element of surprise because no one is expecting you to have a Strong normal attack. You could also put Sub or taunt over that to help with Dusclops.

In this team, I have tried to make a perfect balance between offensive and defensive activities. But against stallteams, the offensive part still falls short. Normally, I can explode on things I really want to get rid of but Dusclops resists it and I can switch nothing in on it.

I would greatly appreciate any comments that would do this team good :P
thanks in advance

Pretty Standard team, nothing i havent seen before. But if you are having a problem with it you could Put Snorlax or physical celebi in over regice. Or even blissey, then make TTar or Gengar counter it. The trouble with mixed teams is that you have to make sure your offense is well placed, and has enough firepower to break a stall team.

 

[Actaeon]

Thanks for your reply, HeYsUp

Replacing Regice with Physical Celebi sounds great, as does replacing it with Snorlax. The advantage with Snorlax is that I have a Pokémon that counters Raikou and can hurt the opponent's team more than Celebi, but Celebi can make the Tyranitar very deadly... Celebi is better for my Dusclops weakness I think because it has more flexibility with Natural Cure (Snorlax would have to keep Resting and losing functionality).

About Gengar, if I use sub/punch/giga drain/tbolt I would lose explosion and I want to keep the 2 special moves. A solution for this may be using no substitute and use the one of Zapdos.

Without Regice I would have no sleep absorber but I guess I can work without it.

 

[keloggsequent]

are you yp

edit: in reference to the yp vs. heysup arguement: let's not turn this into verbal attacks such as:

For someone who cant read past their nose

You obviously lack the reading comprehension to understand my post

all this shows me is that you've got nothing else to show so you need to resort to shit like this. i have seen yp use this team for a long time and have seen him deal with all of these "threats" that you've listed using the methods that he has shown. stop intentionally trying to be difficult. all im getting from your posts are you telling what each individual pokemon is countered by and ignoring the team as a whole.

ps, i heard that skarmory gets raped by mag but can take it one on one if mag doesn't have thunderbolt and skarm has hp ground.

 

[Cerivious]

And yes what the fuck that is my team where did you get it from

PS: Hi kelogger ^__________^

 

[Ranz]

Why Hydro Pump? I suggest you use surf.. Accuracy> Power

 

[Heysup]

Why Hydro Pump? I suggest you use surf.. Accuracy> Power

Lolno.

On a Sweeper yes, on a mixed pokemon/wall no.

As for the Gengar thing, Yea you could do that, i just find Explosion on gengar somewhat useless because even with EVs, his attack is still less then sub par, it may blow up a Blissey or Snorlax but in either case, Why not focus punch them (or hypnosis/willowisp snorlax) into hell and then keep your special abilities, EQ and normal immunity pokemon alive? It probably wont kill snorlax anyway.

The Celebi thing i agree, if someone is trying to sleep you, just stay in and hurt them, you will eventually win that war, Or let them sleep gengar.

If you are that concerned with sleep and status, you could always make swampert Rest talker because you have gengar to absorb explosions anyway.

There are many directions you can go with this team.

 

[Umby]

Why Hydro Pump? I suggest you use surf.. Accuracy> Power

Generally Surf is more accetable, but at times a player can choose to make trade offs for generally greater rewards. For example, in a case where an opposing Skarmory may decide that Swampert is not a threat and attempts to lay down numerous sets of Spikes, Swampert threatens to 2HKO Skarmory with Hydro Pump instead of 3HKO with Surf or 4HKO with Ice Beam. The trade off in accuracy for power can also help out with the increased power already caused through Swampert's Torrent.

 

[Actaeon]

@ Cerivious: I am sorry as I had no idea that this team or maybe a team that was very similar to it, was yours. Maybe you have other ideas for dealing with the aforementioned problems like Dusclops?

I have tried Celebi instead of Regice now but I find that Jolteon and Zapdos hit pretty hard with super effective hidden powers. Also Gengar is slightly harder to wall now. However, it does solve the Dusclops problem pretty well and it is handy against Jolteon passing a Substitute to Hariyama as Regice's Ice Beam wouldn't break it.

Bulky Roar Zapdos on stall teams nullifies this Celebi though...

Hydro Pump indeed, for higher power, especially combined with torrent if Ttar manages to bring me at 25% or for Giga Drain Gengars who will then be ohko'd with Hydro Pump. It also hurts the incoming Zapdos a little more. The occasional miss does not make me lose the game in unspecific situations anyway.

 

[Rubberbandman]

In order to stop dusclops, which you say you have a problem with, is to put Taunt on T-tar for one of your attacks, most likely Double Edge.

 

[Heysup]

Bulky Roar zapdos should get hit pretty hard by shadowballs if it tries to roar.

 

[Cerivious]

@ Cerivious: I am sorry as I had no idea that this team or maybe a team that was very similar to it, was yours. Maybe you have other ideas for dealing with the aforementioned problems like Dusclops?

I have tried Celebi instead of Regice now but I find that Jolteon and Zapdos hit pretty hard with super effective hidden powers. Also Gengar is slightly harder to wall now. However, it does solve the Dusclops problem pretty well and it is handy against Jolteon passing a Substitute to Hariyama as Regice's Ice Beam wouldn't break it.

Bulky Roar Zapdos on stall teams nullifies this Celebi though...

Hydro Pump indeed, for higher power, especially combined with torrent if Ttar manages to bring me at 25% or for Giga Drain Gengars who will then be ohko'd with Hydro Pump. It also hurts the incoming Zapdos a little more. The occasional miss does not make me lose the game in unspecific situations anyway.

Ya ok so apparently I gave you this team(?) a long time ago on NB as YP. This team has my nicknames ffs.

Anyway Clops isn't really much of a problem for me. I see that you've changed Bold on Ice to Calm, so you could be taking a little more damage from Focus Punch. Either way, the method I usually use to deal with Clops is to get Ice in (preferably when sand is up), absorb the burn, IB once or twice (that is if it doesn't switch out) to bring it near resting HP, try to Rest yourself on the same turn that it Rests. If it's Focus Punch it won't be Resttalk, so you can bring Zapdos in, Thunderbolt once, then Substitute on the attempted burn. The Substitute usually doesn't break from a min Attack Shadow Ball (with Night Shade then you have a bit more of a predicting work to do). Basically, see if Clops is more defensively oriented on the physical or special side (even Max/Max Careful gets 3HKO'd from Bolt in sand though) and either continue Thunderbolting with Zapdos or pass a Sub to TTar (preferably on the Rest, which shouldn't be much of a problem) and set up from there.

TWave and SToss Bliss is easily stalled out by Regice. Or you can get Ice in, take the TWave, take two tosses and Rest, then switch to Gengar, and immediately go to Forry and spike up, possibly exploding it if Blissey gets cocky and stays in.

The thing that gives this team the biggest headache is actually Raikou, and to a slightly less extent Jynx. For Raikou, I will usually try to get the Sand up asap (duh). Kou usually comes in on Forry or Zapdos, and to a lesser extent Gengar. Most Kous Sub first, so if its Zapdos or Forry I switch to TTar (to get the sand up), if I predict a CM then Ttar EQs, if I predict a Bolt then I would go to Ice. If the Sand is already going, I would HP Bug/Sludge Bomb with Forry/Gar and then switch to Regice, and switch directly to Ice if it's Zapdos. In most cases, Regice should be able to kill Raikou (albeit sustaining serious damages both to HP and PP in the process).

For Jynx, I would try to get it to LKiss Ice, then get Forry in. The problem with a smart user of Jynx though, is that he would start CMing up on Ice, in which case I would most likely sacrifice either Gengar(Faster and kills with SB with a minimum of 76%) or Forry (Resists both IB and lol Psychic and OHKOs with Bug) to get the other in and kill. Of course, I could also elect to do a double switch (Ice>Forry>Ice) to hope that Jynx takes the bait to sleep.

Boring, but works....You COULD put agility over hp ice and put some HP evs in instead of speed to make your subs harder to break, but its not needed.

If it's not needed, then why say it in the first place.

You are correct to keep this in your back pocket untill the end, because its a one time use thing. Double edge strategies tend to fail alot because your standard TTar counters wont mind taking a DE, and you may not be able to kill them even with a +2 attack, but it has the element of surprise because no one is expecting you to have a Strong normal attack. You could also put Sub or taunt over that to help with Dusclops.

Let's see what are the standard DDTar "counters"
Swampert - If you get a minimum of 1 layer of spikes up, 404/292 Pert (that's the most defensive Pert I've used, at least) is killed (provided that it doesn't have Hydro Pump) if you DD on the switch in.

Flygon - +1 DE does 89%-100% to 4/0 Flygon. Any prior damage (RS on the switch, switch out, and come back later) and it's killed.

Skarmory - Lol counter but ok, the most it can do is Roar you out, and it takes an absolute minimum of 36% to do so. One or two flinches and its gone.

Claydol - DD'd DE does 48%-56% to Max/Max +Nature Dol (note that most won't even be this defensive). 2x DE Recoil + 1 EQ from the Standard Claydol won't even kill Ttar (as a bonus it knocks you into Liechi range)

Heracross - People think they can switch Hera into DD, survive the RS and Horn back, DE gives them a nasty surprise.

Breloom - Same as Heracross, just beware of the odd Mach Punches.

So all in all, almost all of it's "counters" (save for Donphan, and that's like, where?) are fucked by DE, I really don't see how they won't mind taking a 120BP hit.

 

[Heysup]

Well to start, the agility is another option so dont get so defensive.

For the TTAr thing, i said i agree with the fact that it can surprise some ttar counters and Ko, but it can also let other standard ones deal with it better. For instance dusclops can Wisp without trouble, I know skarmory is only a temporary Counter(unless it has counter) but it can roar you out and your pokemon can take spike damage and also, they will know your ttar is DD, and no substitute/taunt.

Keep in mind, MAYBE 1/3 swamperts doesnt carry hydro pump, its very common to see one, and are you proposing that you would stay in to DE a flygon? any sort of flygon will ko you with earthquake if you do that. It also cant switch into any sort of attacks or your calcs are all off.

And on to raikou, Celebi solves that problem :D.

 

[Cerivious]

Well to start, the agility is another option so dont get so defensive.

And you are going pass Agility to what exactly? You said it yourself that it "was not needed", stop being dumb. If you don't get this team, then don't make bullshit suggestions.

For the TTAr thing, i said i agree with the fact that it can surprise some ttar counters and Ko, but it can also let other standard ones deal with it better. For instance dusclops can Wisp without trouble, I know skarmory is only a temporary Counter(unless it has counter) but it can roar you out and your pokemon can take spike damage and also, they will know your ttar is DD, and no substitute/taunt.

As I have CLEARLY outlined how to deal with Clops, I don't see the reason that I have to keep TTar in unless I can kill it. And anyway, how does Substitute even help with Skarmory?

Keep in mind, MAYBE 1/3 swamperts doesnt carry hydro pump, its very common to see one, No it isn't.

and are you proposing that you would stay in to DE a flygon? any sort of flygon will ko you with earthquake if you do that. It also cant switch into any sort of attacks or your calcs are all off.

You clearly have not even READ my post. How the fuck is Flygon going to kill me if 1) I'm faster than ALL of them with 332 speed and 2) I can kill it with minimum prior damage?

And on to raikou, Celebi solves that problem :D.

And it opens up other problems, I really don't need more Dugtrio bait on this team. Also may I remind you that HP Ice (or Crunch) Raikou is about as common as a Hydro Pump Pert.

 

[Heysup]

Im bored so i will argue.

To start, you can pass agility to TTar, which allows you to outspeed Aerodactyl/jolteon/dugtrio/starmie/raikou as opposed to DD, which does not if im correct.

Which brings me to why you need to save this TTar for later, on top of having sandstorm anoy some of your pokemon it can get forced to switch by alot of faster pokemon even if you kill its "counter" with double edge.
e.g. a starmie can just walk in after you DD and surf you, If you Double edge him you both die, rock slide will leave an offensive starmie alive for him to kill you in the next hit. Its sort of the same case for others, but they get OHKOd so they need you to be sort of weakened, which you may be if you play him earlier in the battle.

Also what i was saying about the skarmory, Sub wont help vs skarmory, just if DDtar has sub, its always used first as opposed to just DDing first, so then skarm can either try to spike, or whirlwind you after the first time, and he wont be afraid to try to status you(making dusclops a problem or even gengar cause its faster).

Now dont take this wrong, its not that i dislike your TTar, i actually like DE/berry strategies. I was origionally saying for the OP that he could change those if he had a dusclops problem.

The point of suggesting agility was another option because you have so many evs in Speed that your subs would break to some attacks that with max hp wouldnt. Its a nice bonus if your oppenent lets you BP as well. "Not needed" means its fine as it, but its there just in case you feel like trying it. About dusclops, your dusclops plan imo seems unrealistic that everything will go exactly as planned like that, without switching out(not that you find him as a problem).

 

[Actaeon]

Reading Cerivious post about how he deals with problems really solved very much for me...

If Starmie switches in on the turn that Tyranitar uses Dragon Dance it can just take the Surf and use Dragon Dance in the same turn, making it faster than Starmie and making it able to OHKO it?
Actually then a standard Rapid Spin Starmie (240 HP/0 Def) has an approximate 7% change to survive Rock Slide, or 8% with the chance that it misses calculated in. I think that's not enough to be a serious trait.
Oh I forgot the chance that a Critical Hit would occur, that makes it 7.5% chance but whatever, since Starmie has a crit rate as well.
Or did I have a misunderstanding in your last post, HeYsUp?

This team took me a while to take fully control of but it is reallly an excellent team.

If I use your team I will naturally use your nicknames, if i'm allowed.
What do they mean, anyway? Or are they just random words? I like them actually.

Thanks everybody for analyzing this team and yes YP, I believe you gave it to me once but I forgot it was you ;)

 

[Heysup]

Well starmie can also paralyze you, as can any of those pokemon i stated. The point was, not having taunt/sub makes it more difficult to use effectively, but it still works well. Taunt/Sub are just options.

 

[Cerivious]

Im bored so i will argue.

To start, you can pass agility to TTar, which allows you to outspeed Aerodactyl/jolteon/dugtrio/starmie/raikou as opposed to DD, which does not if im correct.

And because all of these pokemon stated above will stay in on a +2 Speed TTar I suppose? How the hell is +2 speed alone going to help you in killing Swampert/<insert usual Ttar counter>?

Which brings me to why you need to save this TTar for later, on top of having sandstorm anoy some of your pokemon it can get forced to switch by alot of faster pokemon even if you kill its "counter" with double edge.
e.g. a starmie can just walk in after you DD and surf you, If you Double edge him you both die, rock slide will leave an offensive starmie alive for him to kill you in the next hit. Its sort of the same case for others, but they get OHKOd so they need you to be sort of weakened, which you may be if you play him earlier in the battle.

Max Modest Surf doesn't even OHKO, so like what Actaeon has said in the post below yours, you can just DD again, Liechi activates, and sweep from there.

About dusclops, your dusclops plan imo seems unrealistic that everything will go exactly as planned like that, without switching out(not that you find him as a problem).

I've been using this team for what, 4 years? (Added BP on Zapdos after XD came out, tweaked a few things here and there, but this is still the essence of the team) And that's always how I've dealt with Dusclops, I have never found it to be a very serious threat at all.

If I use your team I will naturally use your nicknames, if i'm allowed.
What do they mean, anyway? Or are they just random words? I like them actually.

Ya ok fine you can use it. The nicknames have a long story basicallly involving a drunk Ugly_Duckling >___>

 

[Heysup]

Im just saying it is now weak to Status/phazing, and that Double-Edge is a good move for TTar, if you save him for later in the game when pokemon are weak enough to die from DE without being able to Phaze/status.

The Sub/Taunt was for the OP if he had his "dusclops" problem, this would fix it to some extent.

Your dusclops plan DOES work, if i was using the dusclops and i saw zapdos, id go to blissey snorlax or regice. But assuming you have = skill with your opponent, is he going to walk into that? Remember he already knows your zapdos has substitute, and why wouldnt he predict the Focus punch switch to Regice, as you are clearly not able to Substitute the burn?

 

[Cerivious]

Im just saying it is now weak to Status/phazing, and that Double-Edge is a good move for TTar, if you save him for later in the game when pokemon are weak enough to die from DE without being able to Phaze/status.

"It's a good move" and "It takes up a moveslot which makes TTar weak to blahblahblah" don't really go well together.

The Sub/Taunt was for the OP if he had his "dusclops" problem, this would fix it to some extent.

I REALLY don't think switching Clops on TTar (any kind really) is a good idea at all, but to each his own.

Your dusclops plan DOES work, if i was using the dusclops and i saw zapdos, id go to blissey snorlax or regice.

And I Thunderbolt for free and switches accordingly the next turn. Big deal. And Spikes are probably down as well since the things that Clops is most likely switching into are either Forry or Gar, and to a lesser extent Pert.

But assuming you have = skill with your opponent, is he going to walk into that?

Probably yes. Over the years that I've used this team I'd say the overwhelming majority of Dusclops did just that.

Remember he already knows your zapdos has substitute,

Not necessarily.

and why wouldnt he predict the Focus punch switch to Regice,

He can, and I can predict his Focus Punch, still a 50/50. And Regice isn't even 2HKO'd with Bold which I use. No idea about Calm.

as you are clearly not able to Substitute the burn?
Huh?

 

[Heysup]

If you didnt split everything up in between sentances it would make more sense.

What i said Double-Edge is good move IF you save it for the end, as it has no staying power or status block.

And the last comment, Your Tyranitar obviously doesnt have substitute, and your opponent knows this, so he can easily predict you will taunt(not knowing/caring if you have DE because it doesnt work on ghosts) or Switch rather then taking the burn.

 

[Cerivious]

If you didnt split everything up in between sentances it would make more sense.

What i said Double-Edge is good move IF you save it for the end, as it has no staying power or status block.
And what IS the end? When 3 pokemons are dead? 4? Double Edge is a great move regardless of when I use it. Heck, I can choose to BP straight up and DD up and kill something with it, switch out, and come back later. You keep saying how crucial it is to keep Ttar alive (well you don't say it per se, but that's what it appears to be) but you fail to see that Ttar is NOT vital to the success of the team. Ttar merely speeds up the process of winning.

And the last comment, Your Tyranitar obviously doesnt have substitute, and your opponent knows this, so he can easily predict you will taunt(not knowing/caring if you have DE because it doesnt work on ghosts) or Switch rather then taking the burn.
So I assume your hypothetical scenario is as follows.
Ttar comes in on whatever.
Ttar DD's on the switch to Dusclops
He knows that Ttar no Substitute, and will predict a taunt/switch so he uses FOCUS PUNCH???
A DD'd RS 2HKOs Clops, the safer way would be to burn me. He has a 10% chance to win (RS Miss) if he Focus Punches, and a 55% chance to win if he Wisps (accounting for RS Miss/Flinch/WoW Miss). Which route would you take? (Actually I won't switch Clops into Ttar at all it REALLY isn't smart)

 

[Heysup]

You are missing the point.

Tyranitar can shine(better) when its counters are weak, especially the DE build, because they can be less weakened for it to sweep. If your oppenent has a swampert, tyranitar shouldnt show its face untill swampert is in killing range, unless there is a shadowball snorlax that wants you to come in, or something to that effect.

Sandstorm hinders your team silightly as well, but thats not a huge issue. Tyranitar can kill many pokemon with the moveset, but is pretty much useless with after if there are pokemon that outspeed it/can take a +2 hit as switching it out is useless due to no recovery.

The question would be("would" because i know the answer, as you claim to be successful in doing so), are you able to keep tyranitar from getting slowly widdled down by a stall team before you take out its counters? If Ttar falls vs a stall i dont see how you could possibly knock down a snorlax or any sort of pokemon that can shrug off unboosted SpAs (blissey, regice).

Not to mention, how do you even kill a swampert anyway?

 

[Cerivious]

You are missing the point.

Tyranitar can shine(better) when its counters are weak, especially the DE build, because they can be less weakened for it to sweep. If your oppenent has a swampert, tyranitar shouldnt show its face untill swampert is in killing range, unless there is a shadowball snorlax that wants you to come in, or something to that effect.
It's not like I'll know that the opponent has a Swampert before I use Tyranitar in every single game. And this Tar is designed to kill its counters with minimal damage, and maintain its sweep after that.

Sandstorm hinders your team silightly as well, but thats not a huge issue. Tyranitar can kill many pokemon with the moveset, but is pretty much useless with after if there are pokemon that outspeed it/can take a +2 hit as switching it out is useless due to no recovery.
Few things can do what you said, but ok. I wouldn't switch it out anyway.

The question would be("would" because i know the answer, as you claim to be successful in doing so), are you able to keep tyranitar from getting slowly widdled down by a stall team before you take out its counters? If Ttar falls vs a stall i dont see how you could possibly knock down a snorlax or any sort of pokemon that can shrug off unboosted SpAs (blissey, regice).
"Widdled" down by what, exactly? Blissey/Regice is easily taken care of by my own Regice, and Snorlax, depending on its set, is usually killed by Boom from either Gar or Forry + Another attack.

Not to mention, how do you even kill a swampert anyway?
Ice beam with Ice? Giga Drain with Gar? Hydro Pump with Pert? Gosh have you even read the team?

 

[Actaeon]

Say the opponent starts off with Snorlax which appears to be a Curselax when you switch Forretress in...
Then would you directly use Explosion or switch to Tar to see if it has Earthquake by switching to Gengar?
Because 2 Curses means around 60% Damage from Forretress Explosion so then you would have to go Dragon Dancing with Ttar I guess... And if it has Earthquake just keep Gengar around.

I find Curselax and CM Raikou (HP grass) in one team the hardest team to be met with when using this team, although I guess you could wear them down...

Also, If you had to blow up either Gengar of Forretress, not knowing their team yet, would it be Gengar or Forretress to blow up?