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Past Gen RNG Research

Discussion in 'Wi-Fi' started by mingot, Sep 12, 2009.

  1. LightningFusion

    LightningFusion
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    There are wild pokemon where the dogs are located. The closet you can get before making the dogs start to run are on the steps. You can still encounter pokemon there. So I am assuming he used repels and just forgot about it still advancing.
  2. ForumN00b

    ForumN00b

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    Hi, I've been testing out a few ways and also trying to confirm a few ways to advance frames.
    According to my experience, on a thursday at the hours 6 and 7 the bottom right radio station had the channel that plays the goldenrod city theme and detuning it made the frame advance by 1.
    However, in the same day at a different hour another channel was broadcasted and it seemed to not move the frame at all.
    I've been stuck at 3 badges for quite awhile trying to rng abuse for shiny raikou hp grass high hp bp and shiny entei.
    I tested the radio advancing over here. I saved at the staircase that is one step away from releasing the dogs.
    I tried testing it by saving before going to the basement where morty and eusine are those types of characters that can move and advance the frame (sorry forgot what you ppl call it in short)
    I saw eusine turn 4 times and then I moved my character to go downstairs but Eusine moved twice during the climbing and I'm unaware if that moving affected the frames either. Morty was off-screen so I couldn't see his movements but later Raikou's offset was 7 so I strongly agree with the fact these two characters can help to advance the frame if your target time and day doesnt have the reliable goldenrod theme channel.

    In short:
    1- I have confirmed that the radio channel(s) vary with time.
    2- I have confirmed that the characters who don't have a fixed pattern of walking/turning still advance the frames.

    Note how I met a Raikou with an offset of 7 and I saw eusine move 6 times. Morty does move slowly as compared to Eusine. And I saw eusine move 4 times b4 I started the climbing downstairs process, which while doing that I saw eusine move 2 more times. This will need testing from someone with access to save states.

    I successfully caught a shining Raikou with hp grass 68 bp and a shining Entei and now have 4 badges and plan on contributing something in the future =)

    I have just tested walking 128 steps on the basement floor with 4 pkmn in party with repel and it made raikou's offset 252.

    I tested the walking and turning frame advancements again. This time, steps and turns combined, had 5 total prior to releasing the dogs. But when I captured Raikou, its offset was 8. There is a possibility that turns and walking in pkmn areas have distinct frame advancement in hgss.

    According to my recent test, which was performing only 13 turns, Entei's offset was 18, and Raikou's was 13. When I caught my shinies I had and even now my save position was facing towards the front. This proves that the turn towards the left (where the step would release the dogs) does not advance the frame. It is now safe to say that 1 turn in wild pkmn territory (excluding that direction for that position) still advances the frame by 1. The steps need testing, however.

    I just tested 4 turns and 4 steps. Raikou's offset was 8 and Entei's 13. MY turns and steps were in this sequence (assuming you know my starting position): up turn, step up, right turn, step right, down turn, step down, left turn (towards the dogs), step left (the staircase b4 the step that releases the dogs)

    This has given me the idea that either the step to the stair doesnt count or the turn towards the left doesnt count. If anyone has tried to rng abuse for heatran by running in the stairs up to heatran's room in DPPt, then that stair experience may become handy. I will conclude that its the same as DPPt when it comes to advancing through steps/turns in wild pkmn inhabited areas (with the exception of left turns in the b1 area of burnt tower until further investigation). However, my offset of 252 for Raikou earlier isnt explained. 128 steps would be 128 frames according to this info. But the amount of turns was not even close to half of 128 (128 x 2 is 256 anyways so forget about it even if it was half). It is possible for turn counting error, but forget counting, its obvious that if you run from the bottom then turn and go to the top (in b1 of burnt tower approximately 40 steps) and repeat until 100 and do the rest at the little space next to the stair towards the dogs, theres no way you cudve even turned 40 times, which is less than half. So how is offset nearly double? (256-5+251) More research needed

    Also, I was wondering if I am allowed to post my experiences here. Thanks
  3. Red_Phoenix

    Red_Phoenix

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    @ForumN00b: The burnt tower contains NPCs iirc, so...

    Latest tests:

    Dratini:Its starting frame is 1.
    Lapras:Its starting frame is either 1 or 2 (I have removed the roamer frame this time...). Also, the room where lapras is has one trainer who keep moving, which is why I'm not sure about the starting frame, while the other two don't.
    Ho-oh:Its starting frame is 1. You can't use the radio to advance the frame here, only way to do it are the 128 steps or going down the ladder and advance it with steps and turn (using repels), but this is risky since the 128 steps can still mess your calculations.

    Also, I fainted raikou before defeating the pokemon league and I saved before the champion.
    I defeated him (writing down the hour and minute I loaded the game) and I caught raikou. Its spread was on frame 5.
  4. ClikC

    ClikC

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    Interesting that Raikou's re-spawn frame is 5. Probably reflecting the exact same amount of RNG calls for Mespirt of Cresselia in D/P/Pt. Also confirming my suspicion that it would be a spread from the first seed you get after beating the game. How many tests did you run on Raikou? Still confirms that you can only really abuse one of the dogs the very first time to release them, so I guess we just have to live with that for cartridge based abuse.

    I think it's pretty safe to say the starting frame for lapras is 1, if it was going to be a starting frame of 2, you would never get a result on the first frame. Just the NPC messing you up most likely.
  5. Syberia

    Syberia [custom user title]
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    I wonder if the starting frame gfor the re-spawned dogs is always 5, or if it fluctuates like Suicune and Ho-oh did for me

    Also, I assume that Raikou was checked after capturing the other two dogs?
  6. ClikC

    ClikC

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    I thought I'd have a play with Latias, see if I could find her Starting frame. As it would appear to be with the rest of HGSS though, it couldn't be that simple...

    For those who might not have gotten this far in game, in order to release your in-game Lati, you need to collect the copycat girls clefairy doll from the guy in the pokemon fanclub. When you leave the building, you automatically trigger the event to release the Lati.

    Method 1 Frame 9
    Two Roamers out

    Method 1 Frame 8
    No Roamers out

    Method 1 Frame 9
    No Roamers out (Waited a whole minute before leaving the building).

    Method 1 Frame 9
    No Roamers out (Moved save location so i pressed down and immediately left the pokemon fan club)

    Method 1 Frame 7
    No Roamers out (Moved around in building, presumably not far enough to trigger 128 step Advancement)


    Now I'm taking a wild stab in the dark, but I think it might be down to RNG calls made when leaving the building, but could equally also be linked to Syberia's issue with starting frames. But I have no way at this time to confirm or deny any of those suspicions. Probably should have made a note of which seeds I got each time as well.
  7. LightningFusion

    LightningFusion
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    I didn't see this when it got posted, so I'm going to reply now.

    When I was doing my dogs, I was going for a frame of 41 I believe, or 46. Either way, I had to, in the end to 39 steps/turns, which makes no sense. So there is something weird happening there with advancements I believe.


    Was bored so I did some latias test. All with 2 runners (Raikou and Entei)
    1 - Frame 11
    2 - Frame 11
    3 - Frame 10
  8. Red_Phoenix

    Red_Phoenix

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    Ok, found out how to abuse of raikou (or any roamer) after the pokemon league. Obviously, you need to faint it before you even start fighting the E4.
    I've tested many times and its starting frame is always 1, when I got 5 it was because of the 128 steps thing.
    In-fact the only way to advance the frame for these kind of pokemon is to walk for 128 steps (I did this in front of the champion).
    First, I saved just before entering the room with the first trainer with 5 pokemon in my team.
    I did a save state as soon as I entered the world, so I could verify my seed by catching a pokemon in the Victory road.
    When I hit my seed I loaded the save state and defeated the 4 trainers, then I did a save state in front of Lance.
    I fighted him and won, I went to catch raikou and its frame was 6 (that's because by the time I got to him, I already walked for 128 steps).
    Finally, I loaded the save state, I walked for 8x128 steps (since my target frame was 46).
    I defeated Lance again and I got my shiny raikou.

    I guess HG/SS RNG is almost impossible to abuse without save states, I hope we can make everything easier.

    EDIT:The radio and the phone don't work in these rooms.
    Also, to be clear, the roamers are respawned after you beat the champion and see the credits at the end.
  9. Skytt

    Skytt

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    How much does the Phone and Radio advance the Frame by? :/
  10. ClikC

    ClikC

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    It's looks to be random, determined by date and time and what is being played on the radio. I've had moderate success with using the lower right hand station by de-tuning and selecting it again, advancing the offset one by one.
  11. Skytt

    Skytt

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    Hmm... I might be able to help you with RNG'ing. I'm not using a Rom/r4 so I can't do any save states, but I can try and help anyway.
  12. Syberia

    Syberia [custom user title]
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    A flash cart and save states are pretty much required for any reasonable degree of testing, as they allow you to keep pretty much all other variables the same.
  13. Skytt

    Skytt

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    What do you mean by keeping all the other variable the same?
  14. Red_Phoenix

    Red_Phoenix

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    You keep the same seed every time, without having to hit that again.
  15. Skytt

    Skytt

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    It doesn't matter, I can just keep trying to hit the same seed. It's just like RNG in DPPt except with no Coin Flipping to check.
  16. Pokerealm

    Pokerealm

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    Just want to let you know I succesfully RNG'd a Shiny Chikorita from Elm ^^
    It was a hard task, as my frame just got some random numbers (93, 97, 105, 112, 124 etc). As I got 97 most of the times, I used it as my target frame.
    I had a hard time getting my delay, and I had to switch to 2006 to get it, but it worked =D

    I just used Method 1 to find a shiny spread, and did the same as in D/P/Pt.

    But yeah, even when you do hit your delay, chances are the frame is different.

    Also, I didn't use save states or anything.
  17. mingot

    mingot free agent
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    NO ROM TALK ON THE FORUMS.
  18. Pokerealm

    Pokerealm

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    I'm not the only one talking about R4/flashcarts in this thread.
    And, was it necessary to remove the ENTIRE post? You can also remove the rom part..

    Ahwell, seems like what I did wasn't good enough or something, though I'm pretty sure I'm the first to abuse the RNG for a shiny HG/SS starter.

    I'm sorry for the rom thingy.
  19. mingot

    mingot free agent
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    I know, and you will notice it did not say "POKEREALM, NO ROM TALK". It was addressed to everyone. Anyhow, I will undelete your post, edit it quickly.
  20. Red_Phoenix

    Red_Phoenix

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    I was testing the starters too and I got consistent results.

    Chikorita:Its starting frame is 1.
    Cyndaquil:Its starting frame is 5.
    Totodile:Its starting frame is 9.

    They're generated as method 1 pokemon.

    But the problem is: How can we increase the frame without the radio or anything else?

    EDIT:
    @LF:The 128 steps don't work since you don't have pokemon in your team.
    I tried to walk for 128 steps and my starting frame was the same, I will try again just to confirm.
  21. LightningFusion

    LightningFusion
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    The most reliable way is walking 128 steps unfortunately. Have you checked out the other 3 starters? I am assuming it is the same order based on type, bulbasaur, charmander, squirtle, which is also the pokedex order.

    Something that could be attempted, is battling in grass then walking to that place righting down the number of steps and what frame you are on after the battle. I don't know if it could work but it would be a lot faster than walking.


    For the radio, if you want to use it, I think we will have to set our time and date to the time we plan on abusing at. Start the game and see how much each one advances it. Then we can reset and go for our seed and using the radio for how we need it. I don't know if you can use the radio in the building wherever, but if you can't, try standing outside then walking in on one SR and see if it advances because of the step counter.
  22. Pokerealm

    Pokerealm

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    That's weird..

    My starters were at frames as 93, 97, 112 etc.
    I managed to get a Shiny Chikorita at frame 97, so I wonder what could be the cause of that then?

    Also, I just got a Shiny Dratini in Dragon's Den (method 1), frame 2 as I have Latios roaming.
  23. Skytt

    Skytt

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    Does anyone know what Suicune's Frame is? :/
  24. LightningFusion

    LightningFusion
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    This isn't a question and answer thread. Suicune like most of the other stationary legends are all method K.


    Pokerealm - Do you have the RNG reporter with HG/SS delay options. Maybe you don't and your seed happens to be found on a higher delay but the frames are off a lot.
  25. Pokerealm

    Pokerealm

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    I use the most recent reporter, 7.01.

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