Some people don't like to sit through over 100 turn long battles? I mean a lot of people I know including myself don't have the time for that...
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Some people don't like to sit through over 100 turn long battles? I mean a lot of people I know including myself don't have the time for that...
lol I forgot to post yesterday xD
Base Stats: 78 HP / 81 Atk / 71 Def / 74 SpA / 69 SDef / 126 Spe
Ability: Gale Wings
Alright, this week's victim will be Talonflame (aka Smogon Bird)! Looking at Talonflame's stats, you may think that it is a very bad pokemon. However, don't judge a book by it's cover. Talonflame's ability, Gale Wings, gives priority to Flying-type moves, such as Roost and Brave Bird. This makes it one of OU's best revenge killers. It also has a very high speed stat, allowing it to run an attack boosting nature. Talonflame does have lots of flaws however, the main one being that it has a 4x weakness to Stealth Rock. Combine this with the fact that it's main moves are recoil moves, and it is very easily worn down. Let's discuss!
Base Stats: 78 HP / 81 Atk / 71 Def / 74 SpA / 69 SDef / 126 Spe
Ability: Gale Wings
Alright, this week's victim will be Talonflame (aka Smogon Bird)! Looking at Talonflame's stats, you may think that it is a very bad pokemon. However, don't judge a book by it's cover. Talonflame's ability, Gale Wings, gives priority to Flying-type moves, such as Roost and Brave Bird. This makes it one of OU's best revenge killers. It also has a very high speed stat, allowing it to run an attack boosting nature. Talonflame does have lots of flaws however, the main one being that it has a 4x weakness to Stealth Rock. Combine this with the fact that it's main moves are recoil moves, and it is very easily worn down. Let's discuss!
Talonflame, tbh, is extremely over-hyped. This is a bit of a rash statement, but just because of its ability, people are going crazy over it. I mean, it's a fantastic ability, but its typing leaves a lot to be desired, that Attack stat is pretty bland and it's really frail. In my opinion, Talonflame shouldn't be used with a Choice Band. Ever. It's got a load of awesome support moves like Taunt, Tailwind, Will-O-Wisp, Roost, and so on. Having the fasted Taunt in the game outside of Thundy is super redeeming. The stall breaking set is easily it's best set in my opinion. I don't know, the CB set seems really underwhelming when I use it. Maybe I'm just not using it right, but idk. The SD set is also a better option.
Will add more later.
Will add more later.
Personally I don't really like Talonflame, but it's really good in OU, I think that it is one of the best revenge killer in the metagame.
Maybe it's only flaw is the x4 weakness to the Stealth Rocks and the not so much high Atk, but when you have a priority of 120 BP that also gets STAB and access to SD, who cares.
It can also have different sets, so he can fit in many teams with a different role, he can be a revenge killer if he holds a Choice Band, he can be a sweeper thanks to the high speed, SD and +1 priority Brave Bird, he can even be a stallbreaker thanks to Taunt.
He can also ruin some of his checks: Landorus-T risks a Will-O-Wisp on the predicted switch in, Rotom has to be careful of Liechi Berry+Natural Gift, Heatran and Tyranitar of Salac Berry+Natural Gift, but I don't see these sets very often on the ladder, so Rotom-W, Tyranitar and Heatran still do a very fine job on checking Talonflame.
Talonflame @ Choice Band
Ability: Gale Wings
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Brave Bird
- Flare Blitz
- U-turn
- Roost
If you want to only crush things, this is this best set to my advice, sadly it has no more attack moves, so the fourth slot has to be a status move, and I think that Roost is the best, but you can also run Sleep Talk to avoid Spore, since Talonflame can easily switch in on all the users of that move (Breloom, Mega-Venusaur, Amoonguss)
Talonflame @ Sharp Beak
Ability: Gale Wings
EVs: 120 HP / 252 Atk / 136 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Brave Bird
- Flare Blitz
- Roost
- Swords Dance
Honestly this is my favourite set, you boost with Swords Dance once you eliminate all the Pokémons that walls it and then you destroy the entire team of your opponent thanks to Brave Bird and Flare Blitz
Talonflame @ Leftovers
Ability: Gale Wings
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpD / 8 Spe
Careful Nature
- Brave Bird
- Taunt
- Roost
- Will-O-Wisp
Talonflame @ Leftovers
Ability: Gale Wings
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpD / 8 Spe
Careful Nature
- Bulk Up
- Brave Bird
- Roost
- Taunt/ Will-O-Wisp
These two sets are also worth to mention, the first one is a really good stallbreaker thanks to Taunt and Will-O-Wisp
The last (but not least) is similar to the stallbreaker one, but it runs Bulk Up to gain physical bulk and boost his attack, and when you powered up enough, you can start sweeping with Brave Bird
Maybe it's only flaw is the x4 weakness to the Stealth Rocks and the not so much high Atk, but when you have a priority of 120 BP that also gets STAB and access to SD, who cares.
It can also have different sets, so he can fit in many teams with a different role, he can be a revenge killer if he holds a Choice Band, he can be a sweeper thanks to the high speed, SD and +1 priority Brave Bird, he can even be a stallbreaker thanks to Taunt.
He can also ruin some of his checks: Landorus-T risks a Will-O-Wisp on the predicted switch in, Rotom has to be careful of Liechi Berry+Natural Gift, Heatran and Tyranitar of Salac Berry+Natural Gift, but I don't see these sets very often on the ladder, so Rotom-W, Tyranitar and Heatran still do a very fine job on checking Talonflame.
Talonflame @ Choice Band
Ability: Gale Wings
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Brave Bird
- Flare Blitz
- U-turn
- Roost
If you want to only crush things, this is this best set to my advice, sadly it has no more attack moves, so the fourth slot has to be a status move, and I think that Roost is the best, but you can also run Sleep Talk to avoid Spore, since Talonflame can easily switch in on all the users of that move (Breloom, Mega-Venusaur, Amoonguss)
Talonflame @ Sharp Beak
Ability: Gale Wings
EVs: 120 HP / 252 Atk / 136 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Brave Bird
- Flare Blitz
- Roost
- Swords Dance
Honestly this is my favourite set, you boost with Swords Dance once you eliminate all the Pokémons that walls it and then you destroy the entire team of your opponent thanks to Brave Bird and Flare Blitz
Talonflame @ Leftovers
Ability: Gale Wings
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpD / 8 Spe
Careful Nature
- Brave Bird
- Taunt
- Roost
- Will-O-Wisp
Talonflame @ Leftovers
Ability: Gale Wings
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpD / 8 Spe
Careful Nature
- Bulk Up
- Brave Bird
- Roost
- Taunt/ Will-O-Wisp
These two sets are also worth to mention, the first one is a really good stallbreaker thanks to Taunt and Will-O-Wisp
The last (but not least) is similar to the stallbreaker one, but it runs Bulk Up to gain physical bulk and boost his attack, and when you powered up enough, you can start sweeping with Brave Bird
Steel Wing is actually a solid choice in ORAS where many offensive teams rely on mega Diancie as their talonflame check.
Yeah I actually posted steel wing talonflame in the underrated sets forum, can't believe I forgot about my own suggestion lol
Wow guyz come on innovate what is this Tailwind filler move trash
Steel wing plz fuk Mega Diancie
252+ Atk Choice Band Talonflame Steel Wing vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Diancie: 260-308 (85.5 - 101.3%) -- 12.5% chance to OHKO
die nigga thats a CB adamant max attack 4x SE move almost guaranteed KO after SR
yeah but thats reg Diancie so yea if he's smart he won't mega evo trollfreak why u give this guy such trash attack
amoonguss has higher attack stat lolwut?
yeah only reason for using this thing is
btw SD is actually not bad in this meta
edit: wow got sniped
252+ Atk Choice Band Talonflame Steel Wing vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Diancie: 260-308 (85.5 - 101.3%) -- 12.5% chance to OHKO
die nigga thats a CB adamant max attack 4x SE move almost guaranteed KO after SR
yeah but thats reg Diancie so yea if he's smart he won't mega evo trollfreak why u give this guy such trash attack
amoonguss has higher attack stat lolwut?
yeah only reason for using this thing is
btw SD is actually not bad in this meta
edit: wow got sniped
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I like to pair Talonflame up with another powerful priority user because this puts a lot of pressure on offensive teams with frailer mons - you can revenge a lot of things if they've been weakened at all and often a duo like this can sweep in endgames.
You can still run a stallbreaker set for bulkier teams and Azumarill or Scizor can also break through bulkier pokemon so this strategy isn't only effective against offense.
Also I tried running U-Turn with a Sharp Beak set and it's ok. The problem is that it's very useful to bluff a Choice Band and thus you might end up making a few hard switches early on after initially selecting Brave Bird or Flare Blitz. I think SD is a better move for this reason.
You can still run a stallbreaker set for bulkier teams and Azumarill or Scizor can also break through bulkier pokemon so this strategy isn't only effective against offense.
Also I tried running U-Turn with a Sharp Beak set and it's ok. The problem is that it's very useful to bluff a Choice Band and thus you might end up making a few hard switches early on after initially selecting Brave Bird or Flare Blitz. I think SD is a better move for this reason.
If your game lasts over 100 turns either you are using stall yourself, or you have lost long ago and simply refuse to quit. If you can't break an opposing team's defensive core don't waste everyone's time suiciding your team. Quit the battle, enter the teambuilder, and modify your team so that never happens again.
I used a roost taunt SD set recently and kinda enjoyed it, it is awesome in HO teams to keep up the pressure preventing opponents from recovering and also basically transforms Tran into a setup bait. It is very good at preventing the opponent from setting rocks up because it is usually forced out by common setters that take advantage of that free turn to place rocks
The fun thing about tailwind is using it against weather Rain Teams as a surprise speed boost to turn the tables against them, at least that is how I end up using it.
I find Choice band useful when running a Volt-turn team since it becomes a great insurance on the off chance the opponent manages to set up, it becomes a clutch so to speak. Or at least Talonflame would deter set up sweepers. Since Volt-turn teams don't really carry a phaser or anything that would necessarily stop set up once it has begun the best you can do is revenge kill it, and CB Talonflame is the best member for this.
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I've never used the spreads shown in the stall-breaker sets Wolflink posted. I wonder though, have people actually found it beneficial to run max SpDef instead of Atk on the stall-breaker sets? I've been using a similar set with Brave Bird, WoW, Taunt and Roost with 192 HP/252+Atk/60 Spe and I find myself relying on strong Brave Birds for revenge killing and late-game cleaning. It really doesn't need all of that special bulk to be an amazing stall-breaker and win condition.
Tbh I don't think the common wow/taunt/roost/bb stall breaking set is as good as it was in xy seeing as all stall teams basically have mega eye which can beat it eventually whittling it down. Personally, I would run this set.
talonflame @ leftovers
ability : gale wings
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- sd
- roost
- taunt
- BB
with two sds, burd gets a 2HKO, so Sab can't beat it unless it sets up on the switch. The reason why I like this set is that it is a taunter that can beat eye which makes it a better stall breaker than things like stall breaker mew and gar whicih gives it a huge advantage. It also sets on common stall mons like chesnaught clef skarm ferro tran and some altaria so it can sweep stall teams with ease. wow can be useful to beat random stuff like sharp and scizor but this set is better vs stall in general.
talonflame @ leftovers
ability : gale wings
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- sd
- roost
- taunt
- BB
with two sds, burd gets a 2HKO, so Sab can't beat it unless it sets up on the switch. The reason why I like this set is that it is a taunter that can beat eye which makes it a better stall breaker than things like stall breaker mew and gar whicih gives it a huge advantage. It also sets on common stall mons like chesnaught clef skarm ferro tran and some altaria so it can sweep stall teams with ease. wow can be useful to beat random stuff like sharp and scizor but this set is better vs stall in general.
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Talonflame is on my current team (ignore my sig and About Me section. Haven't updated yet.) And after using it for a while, it is a great Pokemon. While it's true that it has weak stats (fucking Ferrothorn has higher Attack), a 4x weakness, and common HARD counters (Heatran, Rotom-W, Tyranitar), it also has the tools to be arguably the best late game cleaner. In addition to great cleaning abilities, it decimates Mega Pinsir, Scolipede, Ferrothorn (who can also be setup bait for the SD set), Scizor, Scolipede, and in general anything that has low defenses or is it Supereffectively bu one of Talon's STABs. In the OU Viability thread, it is ranked A+, and considering just how much of OU Talon checks, I agree with that rank completely.
As far as sets, I agree with previous posts. Don't use Choice Band. SD is better, and it can even run a surprise support set. Wil-O-Wisp, Taunt, and Tailwind can throw a player off guard and set your team up for victory. Did I mention priory recovery? Yea. Talonflame gets that too. Stop reading. Fucking use Talonflame.
EDIT: Band's not THAT bad, though. It's actually pretty good. I just find SD beter.
As far as sets, I agree with previous posts. Don't use Choice Band. SD is better, and it can even run a surprise support set. Wil-O-Wisp, Taunt, and Tailwind can throw a player off guard and set your team up for victory. Did I mention priory recovery? Yea. Talonflame gets that too. Stop reading. Fucking use Talonflame.
EDIT: Band's not THAT bad, though. It's actually pretty good. I just find SD beter.
I still think SD is the better set since it doesn't lock you into a move and can allow Talonflame to achieve a late-game sweep.
Plus, priority Roost is, IMO, too good to pass up.
Plus, priority Roost is, IMO, too good to pass up.
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So what are some good partners for Talonflame? I think moldbreaker excadrill could do pretty well considering that it wrecks all of smogon bird's counters with moldbreaker earthquake, because moldbreaker removes levitate from rotom-w. Excadrill can also spin for talonflame, and they have decent synergy, except for water type attacks. Bulky waters would kind of be a problem though, so maybe slap on a thundurus.
For anti-hazard support Excadrill and the Latwins are the best, they have decent sinergy, Excadrill beats Talonflame's main checks such as Rotom-W (if it has Mold Breaker), Heatran and Tyranitar.
The Latwins take care of Rotom-W, Thundurus and non scarfed Landorus-T.
You could also use Pinsir for a double birdspam core to hit really hard and wear down each other's checks and counters.
Breloom has pretty good synergy with Talonflame since it can be effective against the water types that Talonflame dislikes dealing with. Poison Heal variants can absorb paralysis or Scald and Talonflame counters grass types that switch into Spore. Technician variants soften up many of Talonflame's checks and counters. Spore can help set up a sweep for Talonflame too.
By virtue of sharing the same typing as Breloom, Chesnaught is also a good partner that can eat up attacks meant for Talonflame and whittle away its checks. Both Breloom and Chesnaught resist all 3 of Talonflame's weaknesses.
Rotom-W is a good partner who checks things like Landorus-T and Tyranitar with Will-O-Wisp, can Volt Switch on physically bulky water types like Slowbro and carries Hydro Pump for Heatran.
By virtue of sharing the same typing as Breloom, Chesnaught is also a good partner that can eat up attacks meant for Talonflame and whittle away its checks. Both Breloom and Chesnaught resist all 3 of Talonflame's weaknesses.
Rotom-W is a good partner who checks things like Landorus-T and Tyranitar with Will-O-Wisp, can Volt Switch on physically bulky water types like Slowbro and carries Hydro Pump for Heatran.
IT'S SO FLUFFY
Mega Altaria
Base Stats: 75 HP / 110 Atk / 110 Def / 110 SpA / 105 SDef / 80 Spe
Abilities: Natural Cure ==> Pixilate
Alright, this week's victim will be Mega Altaria (suggested by Recreant)! Mega Altaria has great stats all across, and an interesting ability in Pixilate. This ability changes all Normal-type moves into Fairy-type, and gives it STAB too. Altaria also has a great defensive typing, giving it lots of resistances, 1 immunity, and a few weaknesses. It can be an offensive Dragon Dancer, or run a special set consisting of Hyper Voice, Draco Meteor, and Fire Blast. Altaria is also a good offensive cleric, with access to Heal Bell. However, Altaria faces competition from other DDers like Charizard Mega X, and Mega Gyarados. It also is relatively weak without any boosts, and is also quite slow before boosting. Let's discuss!
Mega Altaria
Base Stats: 75 HP / 110 Atk / 110 Def / 110 SpA / 105 SDef / 80 Spe
Abilities: Natural Cure ==> Pixilate
Alright, this week's victim will be Mega Altaria (suggested by Recreant)! Mega Altaria has great stats all across, and an interesting ability in Pixilate. This ability changes all Normal-type moves into Fairy-type, and gives it STAB too. Altaria also has a great defensive typing, giving it lots of resistances, 1 immunity, and a few weaknesses. It can be an offensive Dragon Dancer, or run a special set consisting of Hyper Voice, Draco Meteor, and Fire Blast. Altaria is also a good offensive cleric, with access to Heal Bell. However, Altaria faces competition from other DDers like Charizard Mega X, and Mega Gyarados. It also is relatively weak without any boosts, and is also quite slow before boosting. Let's discuss!
Let's discuss some good partners for mega altaria!
Magnezone is great because it can trap all the steels etc, while also having that slow volt switch. They also have near perfect synergy, and altaria is a good physical attacker, while magnezone is a good special attacker.
What are other good partners for mega altaria?
Magnezone is great because it can trap all the steels etc, while also having that slow volt switch. They also have near perfect synergy, and altaria is a good physical attacker, while magnezone is a good special attacker.
What are other good partners for mega altaria?
Heatran / Tentacruel / Empoleon have great synergy with our cotton bird and maybe Talonflame who can clean some of his counter very easily.
They are some dragon dancer who can be good with Altaria like CB or just DD Dnite , not really for the synergy but Dnite with fire punch and Espeed can easily take out Ferro/Scizor/Tflame/Megagross who can beat Altaria if he lacks of Fire blast/DM.
They are some dragon dancer who can be good with Altaria like CB or just DD Dnite , not really for the synergy but Dnite with fire punch and Espeed can easily take out Ferro/Scizor/Tflame/Megagross who can beat Altaria if he lacks of Fire blast/DM.
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