RMT for a newbie to the game. B/W OU

[S Chubbak]

Hey guys, first rmt and first post here. I read all the required readings so I hope my rmt thread is up to standards with the smogon community. If not, I won't take offense and I'll try harder to make it up to standards.

I've been playing competitive pokemon for all of 2 weeks during which for the majority of it I've been using different variations of this team, constantly tweaking. I'm pretty happy overall with this team, it has a few weaknesses but nothing major. Still, maybe you guys can show me some faults with this team that I've overseen.

The theme behind this team is to trap the opponent with Wobbuffet, encore and then switch to Dugtrio if they use a non-attacking move. If they use an attacking move then I'll use either counter or mirror coat. Once I've gotten rid of all their counters and weakened their team I can sweep with Alakazam.

So without further ado here's the team:

Wobbuffet (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Shadow Tag
EVs: 252 HP / 164 Def / 92 SpD
Sassy Nature (+SpD, - Spe)
0 Spe IVs
- Encore
- Counter
- Mirror Coat
- Safeguard

Wobbuffet is such a boss. Wobbuffet will rarely ever go a game without claiming a ko, he usually gets two and sets at least one up for Dugtrio. As a lead he is especially dangerous, if they lead with something like Landorous I'm set. If they U-Turn I can counter and get a guaranteed kill unless they have a ghost. If they lead with something like Forretress I can encore and switch to Dugtrio to get the kill. The 0 speed IVs are so that I can always get the full three turns out of an encore. The only usable set so nothing can be changed with Wobbuffet except maybe the EVs but I think my team would be best with a balanced Wobbuffet.

Dugtrio (M) @ Choice Band
Trait: Arena Trap
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 HP
Jolly Nature (+Spe, -SpA)
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Night Slash
- Sandstorm

Wobbuffet's partner in crime. The synergy between him and Wobbuffet has caused many many rage quits. If my opponent decides to setup on Wobbuffet then I'll encore it, switch to Dugtrio and decimate the opponent. As long as Dugtrio can 3hko the poke I'm set. During turn 1 of encore I switch into Dugtrio, during turns 2 and 3 I attack while they're using their setup move and since Dugtrio is faster than most pokes I attack before them on the third turn and hopefully ko them. 9/10 the best move to use is Earthquake, the other moves are there just in case. Again, this Dugtrio is very standard and there's not much leeway in movesets or EV spread with this guy. I briefly considered a life orb set replacing sucker punch with stealth rock because I think entry hazards on this team would be beneficial but the damage would build off if I encored a toxic and/or the opponent set up entry hazards already. Plus Dugtrio usually dips out once he gets the kill so being able to switch moves isn't that great.

Alakazam (F) @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 SpA / 252 Spe / 4 HP
Timid Nature (+Spe, -Atk)
- Trick
- Torment
- Psychic
- Shadow Ball

I love this poke so much. If I'm not leading with Wobbuffet then I'm leading with Alakazam. Alakazam is so damn versatile. Depending on my opponent's team Alakazam can either function as a strong as shit sweeper that will never get outsped, a wall breaker by tricking a scarf, a poke to force switches by tormenting after Wobbuffet encores, or a suicide kill by tricking and then switching to Wobbuffet after they kill Alakazam (or switch to him if Alakazam is still alive). The best part about Alakazam is magic guard so he somewhat alleviates my teams weakness to entry hazards AND he can take encored will-o-wisps and toxics that I don't want my Dugtrio to take. You may think that I should replace Torment with anther attacking move on Alakzam but I don't really need it, plus I get a lot of use out of torment. It's especially good if they're down to their last pokemon.

Gliscor (F) @Toxic Orb
Trait: Poison Heal
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Atk
Relaxed Nature (+Def, -Spe)
0 Spe IVs
- Protect
- Toxic
- Earthquake
- U-Turn

Now comes the part of the team that I'm not as confident about. Gliscor is good at absorbing hits and countering Tyranitar but not much else. He stalls out a few pokemon but there are too many steel pokemon out there to make toxic be of much use. His main use is performing a slow u-turn so that he absorbs hits and I can keep Wobbuffet healthy or switch Dugtrio into a pokemon that he counters 100% of the time. 0 Speed IVs are there to ensure that he will almost always take the hit but he still outspeeds Tyranitar so that's a plus. Don't get me wrong, Gliscor isn't completely useless, he sets up for Wobbuffet very well and can stall out when the situation arises but I feel like another pokemon or different set would be better. Some help with this slot would be much appreciated though.

Chansey (F) @ Eviolite
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Toxic
- Softboiled
- Seismic Toss
- Healing Wish

Everyone here knows just how tough Chansey is. She can tank hits like a fucking boss, even physical hits. Nothing gets past Chansey. Unfortunately Chansey can't get past much either. She serves basically the same exact role of Gliscor except for Special hits. If they have a lot of steel or ghost pokemon then she pretty much has no use so help on an alternate set is needed. Healing wish is here to stay though, I can't describe in words how great of a move healing wish is. I need to have a healing wish user on this team. I already told you how Wobbuffet usually takes out at least one pokemon, with healing wish he'll take out two, maybe three pokemon. Basically, I toxic everything in sight and once Chansey has served her purpose I just sac her with healing wish. I get momentum on my side, I instantly get Wobbuffet on the field and I will have most likely killed another one of their pokemon. Great move.

Forretress (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Sturdy
EVs: 248 HP / 132 Def / 120 SpD / 8 Atk
Relaxed Nature (+Def, -Spe)
0 Spe IVs
- Stealth Rock
- Rapid Spin
- Gyro Ball
- Volt Switch

My stealth rock setter/spinner. I'll lead with Forretress every once in a while. His main purpose is to set down rocks but he does have a few surprising uses as a counter to certain pokemon. This team is very gengar weak so I can switch Forrestress in, take around 30% damage and gyro ball for over 50% or break a sub. I'll most likely lose my Forretress but I then get a free switch to Alakzam and force Gengar to switch and take stealth rock damage upon re-entry. Volt switch is there for scouting purposes. Forretress is not important to my team once I get rid of their stealth rock and set up my own so I can play recklessly with him. I'll often switch him into pokemon when I don't know if they have HP Ice or HP Fire so that Forretress can take the fall instead of Gliscor and I can learn more about their moveset. Once the rocks are set up he pretty much serves the same purpose as Gliscor, tank hits and switch out.



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The teams biggest weakness in order from most threatening to least are: Skarmory, Gengar, Steel types, and pranksters. Skarmory because it takes a lot of prediction skills to kill it. I either have to trick a scarf onto it, play around it until the very end after which I can shell smash twice and 1hko it, or torment it, then switch to Wobbuffet and hope he doesn't switch before I get to Wobbuffet. My counters all work in conjuction with each other so if I lose one of them Skarm becomes exponentially harder to deal with. Unfortunately if I send in Wobbuffet without tormenting first then I'll encore. They'll use either spikes, whirlwind, or roost and then just stall the fuck out of me.

Gengar is another pain in the ass, nothing switches in safely on it except for Chansey and Chansey can't do shit to Gengar. The only pokemon that can beat Gengar is Alakazam so if I lose Alakzam then I'm fucked. Likewise if I'm dealing with a sub Gengar then I'm similarly in trouble.

Update: Gengar is not much of a problem anymore now that I added Forretress to my team.

Steel types give me trouble only because Alakazam can't do much to them and Gliscor and Chansey can't stall them out. Gliscor has earthquake but with no attack EVs it doesn't do as much as you would think. They aren't that hard to deal with because typing makes no difference to Wobbuffet and Dugtrio can usually beat them out. The exception to this is Scizor who I have to play around until I can find out what set he's running. If I get lucky and get a scarf on him I'm good though.

Pranksters aren't impossible to deal with but still annoying. Them tricking items onto me can really fuck with my plans and they usually have taunt so my Wobbuffet can't do shit to them. Plus they can substitute so Gliscor and Chansey have nothing on them.

The thing I like about this team is that for the most part it tears through the meta. Heatran, Rotom, Landorous, Thunderus, Haxorous (once I know his set), and other popular pokemon have absolutely nothing on this team.

 

[S Chubbak]

Reserved for threat list

 

[Draycos7]

Hi, I really like this team. I think it's innovative and interesting. A change I reccomend is to replace Cloyster or Gliscor with:
Rotom-W @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Volt Switch
- Hydro Pump
- Hidden Power [Fire]/Hidden Power [Ice]
- Trick
Volt Switch will OKHO Skarm and scarfed Rotom outspeeds and kills Gengar with Hydro Pump. You DEFINITELY need SR here to kill both of these. SR (get rid of HW on Chansey for rocks) will help this team hugely.
Good luck!

 

[Porii Sames]

Similarly, you can run Magnezone if your really want to deal with Skarm.

Yeah.

Also, you dont need Toxic on Chansey that bad. Consider replacing it with Heal Bell or Wish.

 

[Smilodon]

Interesting team, I think a few things could be improved.

- HP Fire on Alakazam instead of Torment. Obviously it helps against Scizor, and other annoying steal types. Alakazam is really quick with a scarf, Modest might be netter than Timid.

- Wish could be interesting on Chansey, as Healing Wish can just be used once, and don't make you sacrifice a good pokemon. Maybe Protect, SR or Heal Bell instead of Softboiled if you choose Wish.

- With Wobbuffet's help to give him free turns to set up, Dugtrio might appreciate a set with Subsitute, Hone Claw, Earthquake and Stone Edge, who can be a real threat for many unprepared team. Notice that if you can trap an opponent locked on an electric moove, toy reach easily +6 under a substitute, hard to deal with...

- Your team really needs SR. And you miss some more than useful resistances : none of your pokemons resist Dragon, Fire nor Steal and Dark, four quite common offensive types. I think a Steal pokemon could help fixing some of this issue. Jirachi, with his great movepool (SR, wish, U-turn, iron head, body slam...) can do many usefull things for your team, even if he brings an annoying fire weakness. Heatran also brings usefull resistances, SR, and powerfull attacks.

 

[S Chubbak]

Thanks for the help guys! I've received some pretty good advice so far.

Hi, I really like this team. I think it's innovative and interesting. A change I reccomend is to replace Cloyster or Gliscor with:
Rotom-W @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Volt Switch
- Hydro Pump
- Hidden Power [Fire]/Hidden Power [Ice]
- Trick
Volt Switch will OKHO Skarm and scarfed Rotom outspeeds and kills Gengar with Hydro Pump. You DEFINITELY need SR here to kill both of these. SR (get rid of HW on Chansey for rocks) will help this team hugely.
Good luck!

Two tricks on one team with a Wobbuffet, I like. I'll replace Gliscor with him. Do you think Rotom is bulky enough to perform Gliscor's role though? More than anything I need a bulky poke to absorb physical hits. Also I'm going to change your set a little and replace HP with thunderbolt.

Similarly, you can run Magnezone if your really want to deal with Skarm.

Yeah.

Also, you dont need Toxic on Chansey that bad. Consider replacing it with Heal Bell or Wish.

You're right, I don't need toxic. I'm going to replace it with stealth rock. Now she's going to be pretty much 100% wall with little way to do damage so I don't know if it will work but I'll see. Stealth rock is really essential though so it's prolly gonna stay this way.

I'm gonna use Rotom instead of Magnezone though, I feel like Rotom is better for my team.

Interesting team, I think a few things could be improved.

- HP Fire on Alakazam instead of Torment. Obviously it helps against Scizor, and other annoying steal types. Alakazam is really quick with a scarf, Modest might be netter than Timid.

- Wish could be interesting on Chansey, as Healing Wish can just be used once, and don't make you sacrifice a good pokemon. Maybe Protect, SR or Heal Bell instead of Softboiled if you choose Wish.

- With Wobbuffet's help to give him free turns to set up, Dugtrio might appreciate a set with Subsitute, Hone Claw, Earthquake and Stone Edge, who can be a real threat for many unprepared team. Notice that if you can trap an opponent locked on an electric moove, toy reach easily +6 under a substitute, hard to deal with...

- Your team really needs SR. And you miss some more than useful resistances : none of your pokemons resist Dragon, Fire nor Steal and Dark, four quite common offensive types. I think a Steal pokemon could help fixing some of this issue. Jirachi, with his great movepool (SR, wish, U-turn, iron head, body slam...) can do many usefull things for your team, even if he brings an annoying fire weakness. Heatran also brings usefull resistances, SR, and powerfull attacks.

I originally had HP Fire instead of torment but I found I rarely ever used it. Torment believe it or not gets much more use.

I also originally had wish instead of healing wish, wasn't a big fan of it.

The Dugtrio suggestion is very interesting, I am definitely going to try it out. By setting up a sub I'll be able to damage their switch in pretty heavily. What item would you suggest though? It can't be life orb or choice band, what else is there? I also want to still be able to 3hko a lot of the same threats. I'm gonna put earth plate on him for now unless suggests something better.

Agreed on both fronts and taken care of. I don't have a dark or dragon resist but I did get the fire and steel resist. Can't put Jiraichi on my team because I'm replacing Gliscor and so I need a poke with a ground immunity.



So based on these new suggestions I'm going to test out the team with these changes and tell you what I think.

Stealth rock will replace toxic on Chansey.

Substitute and hone claw will replace shadow claw and sucker punch. Earth plate will replace choice band.

Rotom-W will replace Gliscor.

 

[Draycos7]

If T-Tar is what you're worried about, ScarfTar can usually only manage a 2HKO on Rotom, and with the scarf you can outspeed and 2HKO with Hydro Pump (without sand it's an OHKO). Dugtrio can revenge-kill anyways. The key is to get a safe switch-in. If bulk is what you need you can move a few speed EVs to defense (as many are needed for a 3HKO) and change the nature to Bold.
I also reccomend Wish on Chansey over HW to help heal other things.

 

[S Chubbak]

Did some testing:

Rotom-W doesn't tank hits nearly as well as this team needs it to, put Gliscor back on the team.

Hone claw Dugtrio doesn't work too well because he fails to 3hko too many pokemon.

Stealth rock was definitely needed on this team but not on Chansey. Chansey can't threaten pokemon unless she has toxic and seismic toss. I added Forretress instead.


Cloyster just wasn't cutting it as a rapid spinner when he takes 25% from stealth rock. That made his defenses so much worse than they could have been. Instead I have Forretress now who is a surprisingly effective counter to Gengar. Stealth rock is necessary on this team so he carries that as well.

Lately I've been having trouble with weather teams, especially hydration Vaporeon so I'm trying sandstorm on Dugtrio. I rarely use sucker punch so no big loss. With how easily my team takes out Ninetales and Politoed I can likely beat weather teams by defeating their permanent weather starter and then setting up sandstorm forever taking away their weather. Hopefully it works.

 

[Draycos7]

Are you sure about Sandstorm with CB on Dugtrio? Just saying.

 

[S Chubbak]

Yea, I know but sun/rain teams can be really annoying. Plus with Wobbuffet encoring I can get an easy sandstorm up and basically cripple their team. It allows me to take Vaporeon down easier and allows me to take flamethrowers easier. Then I can switch back to Wobuffet after setting up sandstorm and encore another move. It's situational but I've probably used sucker punch less than five times in my life so not a big loss.

 

[uberheracross]

If your running sandstorm on trio, use life orb over choice band. that way your not stuck with dugtrio on sandstorm and be able to attack without needing to switch.

 

[S Chubbak]

The damage incurred from life orb is too much of an issue for me to give it to Dugtrio plus it doesn't give him enough power. I'm never going to be using sandstorm anyway so it's not a big deal. Sandstorm is just there for if I HAVE to get rid of weather. I'll probably use it once every twenty games so sandstorm on a choiced dugtrio is a non-issue.