RMT Team Erosion

[Kycap]

This is a team I recently made in order to take advantage of both of the most common weather conditions: sandstorm and rain. The team seemed unpredictable to all of its opponents so far; when I tested it out against a few people, it won 100% of the time. I haven't been playing the team long enough to know if it's completely flawless, or if the idea of playing two weather types is a downright stupid and risky idea...but that is why I'm posting this RMT in the first place. This is my first time posting a new thread on Smogon, so I don't know how to do all that image bullshit :/

Bold Rotom-C w/ Damp Rock
252 Hp, 252 Def, 4 Sp.Atk

Leaf Storm
Will-o-wisp
Rain Dance
Pain Split

Rotom is my primary lead. Leaf Storm ensures that it's not Taunt-bait. Wisp lets it wall like a beast. Rain Dance nullifies the Fire weakness, and supports some of my team. Pain Split is the recovery move. It can be used offensively with the right prediction. For example, getting hit by Choice Band Scizor's U-turn gives Rotom-M an 89% chance of living with 1-43 Hp, so Pain Split becomes a big fat Recover and Seismic Toss all in one turn.

Modest Omastar w/ Life Orb
Trait: Swift Swim
252 Sp.Atk, 252 Speed, 4 Hp

Surf
Ice Beam
Earth Power
Substitute

Sub +3 Attacks sets rarely fail. Especially not with a decent 361 Sp.Atk, epic coverage, and a Speed stat of 400+. Omastar is the team's Special sweeper for early game, given that Rain is in play, and not too many turns have passed. I have yet to try a Shell Smash set with Omastar because I thought it would be too risky with all the Mach Punchers in gen 5, so Substitute is meant to block such priority moves. Ground Gem is used over Life Orb here because it provides some extra power against Water and Steel types that resist the Ice Beam-Surf combination, and it doesn't kill me after 6 turns of attacking. Omastar's role is very simple: speed and coverage.


Careful Bronzong w/ Lagging Tail
Trait: Levitate
248 Hp, 196 Def, 62 Sp.Def

Trick
Stealth Rock
Confuse Ray
Gyro Ball

Trick-zong is by far the most epic way to set up Stealth Rock IMO. It is Taunt-bait to some extent. Aside from that, Trick is beneficial no matter what the recipient is, bar Choice users. After a Trick, more than likely Bronzong got his grubby paws on some Leftovers, or an important item that cripples the opponent when they aren't holding it, like Light Clay, Life Orb, Toxic Orb, or Focus Sash. With the opponent's moves all being -1 Priority thanks to Lagging Tail, Confuse Ray and Gyro Ball will always land first, thus threatening to slowly kill anything that doesn't resist Steel or have a means of recovery. Bronzong also benefits from both weather effects as well, being that he loses his Fire weakness with Rain in play, and can increase his damage output with Sandstorm in play. I will often use Bronzong as an alternative lead if the opponent seems like he/she will be leading with something that can easily kill Rotom-C.

Bold Jellicent w/ Water Gem
Trait: Cursed Body
252 Hp, 252 Def, 4 Sp.Def

Hydro Pump
Will-o-wisp
Taunt
Recover

Here is where I may be going too far with the Gems. With Rain in play and Water Gem equipped, Hydro Pump hits like a fire hose on crack. Simply put, not too many things will get back up after a shot of 300 Base Power off of 200 Sp.Atk. Water Gem powered Hydro Pump is meant to be a way of killing off a switch-in that threatens Jellicent's ability to wall and stall with Wisp and Recover. Will-o-wisp is being used as a status move--again--to increase bulk, but also as a means of stalling and wearing down the opponent. Taunt is for other walls who want to play the same game, and perhaps set up hazards or inflict Toxic on Jellicent. Unless speed is invested in the opponent's walls and support Pokemon, they are likely to be outrun by Jellicent, thus being rendered useless in the face of the taunting pink jellyfish of justice. Recover is recover. Take it or leave it.

Careful Tyranitar w/ Leftovers
Trait: Sandstream
248 Hp, 200 Def, 60 Sp.Def

Payback
Curse
Rest
Sleep Talk

Tyranitar is only meant to set up Sandstorm, but it has been able to pull off many late game sweeps with Curse. Payback deals in 150 STAB damage assuming you're going last with your abysmal speed after a Curse or two. Curse is the boosting move which makes Tyranitar nearly invincible in the absence of any STAB Fighting moves. Rest is to recover health after the opponent attempts a 3 or 4 KO, and Sleep Talk is there so you can do things as you snooze. There is a 2/3 it will pick something useful, so there's nothing wrong with it at all.

Jolly Excadrill w/ Air Balloon
Trait: Sand Rush
252 Speed, 252 Atk, 4 Sp.Def

Earthquake
Rock Slide
X-Scissor
Swords Dance

Another late game sweeper; If Tar fails, Excadrill prevails. Sand Rush boosts its speed to 604, easily outrunning anything that doesn't use priority. EQ is the typical STAB. Rock Slide helps with Flying type Pokemon, namely Thundurus, and Zapdos. X-Scissor is for more coverage against Psychic and Dark bulky Pokemon like Reuniclus, Cresselia, Uxie, Latios, Latias, and Umbreon, which would otherwise stop Excadrill in its tracks. Swords is the final move. In case the opponent's current Pokemon does not possess an attack that immediately threatens Excadrill, then it can increase its chance of sweeping by using Swords Dance. Not often have I seen myself forced to use Swords Dance, because mostly any super-effective hit off of 369 Atk is an OHKO. Scizor, Empoleon and Ferrothorn may need a Swords Dance to kill with Earthquake, or a couple Swords can be used to KO Skarmory with Rock Slide, but by the time the late game comes around Jellicent or Omastar may have already dealt with them.


Please tell me what you think. I'm open to any criticisms, praise, or suggestions.
Peace :)

 

[Zeroblue92]

awesome

Its a great team idea. It can surprise people that arent use to creativity, since this is smogon, where creativity doesnt matter! anyways, im betting that you can own some ou teams with an omastar or excadril sweep.:happybrain::justin2::kongler::justin::jump::doom::adam::chaos::cloud::avatar2::avatar::nerd::naughty:

 

[Penance]

Don't use Gems. Use Life Orb instead. MowTom isn't good either. I'd use HP Fire/Ice over Confuse Ray.

 

[Howard]

Dual weather teams aren't really that effective this generation. Rotom-C isn't really that great either. I recommend rethinking your team entirely...

 

[New World Order]

Dual weather teams aren't really that effective this generation. Rotom-C isn't really that great either. I recommend rethinking your team entirely...

I disagree about the first part, Rotom-C is garbage, true. But, regular weather teams need to build like half their team to ensure their weather summoner doesn't die first. Dual weather allows you to not only have a second chance of winning the weather wars, but also play the weather that gives you the best chance of winning depending on your opponents team. For example, you run both sun and sand. You take a look at your opponent's team: Starmie, Bronzong, Celebi, Terrakion, Gliscor, Latias. Latias is the only one that isn't a complete failure agianst sun. Whereas the other 5 are gonna give Ttar and crew a shitload of problems. So play sun for this game.

An important thing about running Weather Control is to ensure you have 4 abusers members that can help or at least hold their own in both weathers. For sun+sand Rapid Spin Excadrill is a great example. Sweep as usual in sand, but in sun, use him to keep Ninetails and crew from getting fucked by SR. An example of a pokemon who can hold its own in both weathers is Terrakion.

I'll provide an in depth rate later, since Weather Control is by far the most complicated playstyle in the metagame.

 

[Ebondragonx]

I disagree about the first part, Rotom-C is garbage, true. But, regular weather teams need to build like half their team to ensure their weather summoner doesn't die first. Dual weather allows you to not only have a second chance of winning the weather wars, but also play the weather that gives you the best chance of winning depending on your opponents team. For example, you run both sun and sand. You take a look at your opponent's team: Starmie, Bronzong, Celebi, Terrakion, Gliscor, Latias. Latias is the only one that isn't a complete failure agianst sun. Whereas the other 5 are gonna give Ttar and crew a shitload of problems. So play sun for this game.

An important thing about running Weather Control is to ensure you have 4 abusers members that can help or at least hold their own in both weathers. For sun+sand Rapid Spin Excadrill is a great example. Sweep as usual in sand, but in sun, use him to keep Ninetails and crew from getting fucked by SR. An example of a pokemon who can hold its own in both weathers is Terrakion.

I'll provide an in depth rate later, since Weather Control is by far the most complicated playstyle in the metagame.

Please explain to me how Terrakion is "a complete failure agianst sun."

 

[His Eminence Lord Poppington II]

dual weather is pretty fucking stupid, running single weather even struggles for teamslots required to support and take advantage of it; never even mind dual weather

 

[SpoeMeister]

Dual weather is not stupid at all. He can abuse swift swimmers since he doesn't have drizzle but can still take advantage of opponent's who do have drizzle. If politoed is absent, he still has a rain inducer.

However, here's my suggestion. put rain dance on bronzong instead of Confuse Ray and change your Rotom to the wash-version. That way you still wall rain teams and you have a STAB water attack. give it hidden power grass as it will otherwise be walled by gastrodon (the reason why I think you wanted to use mowtom in the first place).

The moveset I suggest is a secondary tricker:

Rotom @ choice scarf
Timid 112 HP 252 SpA 144 Spe
- Trick
- Will-o-Wisp
- Hydro Pump
- Thunder

Two powerfull STABs to abuse, trick to cripple defensive pokemon and baton pass teams and will-o-wisp off course to cripple physical attackers.

Lastly I think you should switch your jellicent for an allround weather counter. Latias does this pretty well and can set-up some calm minds.

I hope this helps.

 

[Howard]

Because everyone at the top of the ladder uses Dual Weather. Oh wait, that's Baton Pass and Stall. I get them mixed up.

 

[Kycap]

Its a great team idea. It can surprise people that arent use to creativity, since this is smogon, where creativity doesnt matter! anyways, im betting that you can own some ou teams with an omastar or excadril sweep.:happybrain::justin2::kongler::justin::jump::doom::adam::chaos::cloud::avatar2::avatar::nerd::naughty:

Thanks man. I was afraid everyone on Smogon would despise creativity to the core. I expected criticism and got praise. Awesome.

Don't use Gems. Use Life Orb instead. MowTom isn't good either. I'd use HP Fire/Ice over Confuse Ray.

I will try Life Orb over Ground Gem on Omastar. I'm extremely skeptical about it's effectiveness due only being able to attack a set amount of times before dying (thus being incapable of team sweeping), but I'd just wind up switching out anyway when the Rain ends, so Life Orb sounds okay.

It would be nice if you told me WHY MowTom is bad.

HP Fire/Ice over Confuse Ray? On Careful Bronzong? I guess I could run Sassy and have Gyro Ball and HP Ice (Dragons, Gliscor), because it sounds like a good idea. I will definitely try that.

Dual weather teams aren't really that effective this generation. Rotom-C isn't really that great either. I recommend rethinking your team entirely...

So far I found that this team works surprisingly well, despite what you say. I'm not entirely convinced that Rotom-C is trash, but I'll try a different Rotom form if that is what you are suggesting. Rotom-W would dominate in Rain, so I'll go with that.

@ New World Order: I look forward to your in-depth rating. Thanks.

Dual weather is not stupid at all. He can abuse swift swimmers since he doesn't have drizzle but can still take advantage of opponent's who do have drizzle. If politoed is absent, he still has a rain inducer.

However, here's my suggestion. put rain dance on bronzong instead of Confuse Ray and change your Rotom to the wash-version. That way you still wall rain teams and you have a STAB water attack. give it hidden power grass as it will otherwise be walled by gastrodon (the reason why I think you wanted to use mowtom in the first place).

The moveset I suggest is a secondary tricker:

Rotom @ choice scarf
Timid 112 HP 252 SpA 144 Spe
- Trick
- Will-o-Wisp
- Hydro Pump
- Thunder

Two powerfull STABs to abuse, trick to cripple defensive pokemon and baton pass teams and will-o-wisp off course to cripple physical attackers.

Lastly I think you should switch your jellicent for an allround weather counter. Latias does this pretty well and can set-up some calm minds.

I hope this helps.

I've been told that Rotom-W is a far more efficient choice than Rotom-C. I'll definitely try this out. I would like to mention that the main reason I was using Rotom-C was so I could defeat opposing Rotom-W's, but your suggestion focuses on weather abuse rather than a dubiously preforming counter. I'll definitely try this, mainly because I like using Trick.

I'll think about the Bronzong idea. It'll definitely make Rotom-W work very well, but I'm not sure whether to run Damp Rock or Lagging Tail. Lagging Tail would still be better to Trick, but Damp Rock would help Omastar and Rotom-W substantially. Interesting proposal. I may try it out.

 

[New World Order]

Here's my take:

Rotom-C: This is a completely gay way to get rain up. I suggest using a Tornadus. Who not only does a better job of getting rain up. But also can abuse the rain itself. With Prankster, you're guaranteed to get rain up. With 125 SpA Hurricane, you can absolutely shred shit apart.

Hide

Tornadus @ Damp Rock
Prankster
Naive
252 SpA/ 252 Spe/ 4 Atk
Rain Dance
Hurricane
Hidden Power Ice
Hammer Arm

Omastar: Rain abuser who gets a SpD boost from the sand. Nothing to see here move along.

Bronzong: Bronzong is technically a fantastic pokemon in both. In the rain, you have literally 0 weaknesses. In sand, it has an immunity. However, you are not using Bronzong to its fullest potential: A way to check sand teams and dragons. Definately go with the standard set. It also gets up SR for you to boot. Don't want a Dragonite fucking you over do you? A viable option is to run rain dance instead of SR in case Tornadus goes down.

Hide

Bronzong @ Leftovers/ Damp Rock
Levitate
Sassy
252 Hp/ 84 Atk/ 80 Def/ 92 SpD/ 2 Speed IVs
Stealth Rock/ Rain Dance
Gyro Ball
Earthquake
Hidden Power Ice

Jellicent: ATM. Your team abhorrs fighting types and stall teams. Normally, I would just edit the Jellicent set. However, I think in this case you will find Reuniclus will do wonders. It takes no damage from Sandstorm, thats perhaps the biggest reason why. Your team also desperately needs a status absorber thats not a cursetar. Just take out Scizor and Tyranitar, which can be accomplished by anyone on your team besides Bronzong and you have an instant win against stall. In fact, take out Jirachi and Tricksters and you have an instant win period.

Hide

Reuniclus @ Leftovers
Magic Guard
Bold
252 Hp/ 252 Def/ 4 SpD
Calm Mind
Psychic
Focus Blast
Recover

Tyranitar: Your team despises Thundurus and Latios. Cursetar sucks because every team on earth carries a fighting type. What do you do? Swap to a Scartar.

Hide

Tyranitar @ Choice Scarf
Sand Stream
Jolly
252 Atk/ 252 Spe/ 4 Hp
Stone Edge
Crunch
Pursuit
Superpower

Excadrill: Slap on an Air Balloon and use rapid spin. This is so Thundurus doesn't kill itself switchin into stealth rocks every time. Chople Berry isn't going to help you survive jack shit. Just use the Air Balloon and avoid Spikes.

 

[New World Order]

Please explain to me how Terrakion is "a complete failure agianst sun."

Loses to every Chlorophyll sweeper in existence. Even fucking Exeggutor.

dual weather is pretty fucking stupid, running single weather even struggles for teamslots required to support and take advantage of it; never even mind dual weather

You do realize that tons of shit that appears in one weather also often appears in another right? Rotom-W/ Ferrothorn/ Scizor/ Latios/ Jirachi for both sand and rain. Dragonite/ Latios/ Jirachi for both rain and sun. Heatran/ Gliscor/ Jirachi/ Latios for both sun and sand. There's more out there, I just named the guys in top 10 usage, there's more out there. There's also pokemon that could wreck shit in one weather and assist another through support like Excadrill. and pokemon that could wreck shit in all weathers like Latios.

Because everyone at the top of the ladder uses Dual Weather. Oh wait, that's Baton Pass and Stall. I get them mixed up.

Wait, Baton Pass is at the top of the ladder? Dual weather is definately an effective strategy. My sun+sand team got to 1286 CRE (note: my personal best is 1329). Even a crappy player like myself who has no skills other than teambuilding can make a dual weather team that can hover around 300ish on the ladder. I'm sure there's guys out there that can get higher than me with one.