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So there is a Best in something..

Discussion in 'Archives' started by Aeroblacktyl, Apr 6, 2006.

  1. Aeroblacktyl

    Aeroblacktyl The pizza doesn't scream in the oven! LOL!
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    That would be me, in everything, but anyways..

    Due to the flurry of recent what is the "best" <Insert Topic>, I figure I'd just stick a list of every single best thing in here, which would help newcoming battlers make a starting team easier too.
    Best Rapid Spinners.

    Starmie @ Leftovers
    Trait: Natural Cure
    EVs: 172 HP / 176 Spd / 160 SAtk
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Rapid Spin
    - Recover
    - Surf
    - Thunderbolt/Ice Beam/Psychic

    Here is a more defensive Starmie, with 341 speed to get in that little hit to finish off Modest Raikous and to gurantee outspeed Adamant Dugtrio. It's more defensive because it's not really going to put a chunk into any Special walls and will still regardless give out chunks to Gengar/Milotic etc.

    Donphan (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Sturdy
    EVs: 252 HP / 96 Atk / 160 Def
    Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
    - Earthquake
    - Rapid Spin
    - Roar
    - Hidden Power [Rock]

    384 HP combined with 346 Defense will let it switch into nearly any phsyical attack and makes a great Aerodactyl counter and whatnot. With 300 attack, it could be dealing some hefty damage to Dusclops switching in, especially if you have your own Spikes. You could have other moves over Roar such as Rest if you have a more stalling team.

    Claydol @ Leftovers
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 236 HP / 16 Atk / 216 Def / 8 Spd / 16 SAtk / 16 SDef
    Relaxed Nature (+Def, -Spd)
    - Earthquake
    - Ice Beam
    - Rapid Spin

    Notice this thing only has 3 moves, because the last spot can have so many things to help it out. You could always add Light Screen or Reflect, helping your team out, maybe add a Toxic, since most Dusclops have Pain Split and WILL NOT like being Toxic'd. You could also add in Explosion, although killing your Rapid Spinner isn't a good idea, however it's always useful when your opponent doesn't even have a Spiker. The last spot can also be used for Rest or even Psychic for novelty, 304 HP and 330 Defense, great DDTar counter.

    Well in general, those are the best one trick ponies. You could consider the two-trick ones, ones that's able to Rapid Spin AND Spikes. Speaking of, the best Spikers follow as...

    Skarmory (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Sturdy
    EVs: 252 HP / 16 Atk / 192 Def / 48 Spd
    Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
    - Hidden Power [Flying]
    - Spikes
    - Substitute
    - Whirlwind

    Not the BEST Spiker seeing as how it gets owned by Magneton, however, it is the most useful, thanks to it's phsyical abuse taking ability. I feel as if Substitute is necessary on ALL Skarmories, preventing automatic Magneton switch-ins, not to mention able to stop Donphan from Rapid Spinning it, as well with 187 speed to outspeed non-ev'd Claydols.

    Forretress (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Sturdy
    EVs: 244 HP / 72 Atk / 192 Def
    Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
    - Earthquake
    - Explosion
    - Rapid Spin
    - Spikes

    This thing doesn't really do anything that well, seeing as how it can still get stop by Magneton with HPFire and usually is a sitting duck to Gengar and flyers, but it's 2-in-1 deal with it's ability to Rapid Spin. Tanks resistented phsyical attacks better than Skarm due to higher HP.

    Cloyster (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Shell Armor
    EVs: 252 HP / 16 Def / 176 SAtk
    Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
    - Ice Beam
    - Rapid Spin
    - Spikes

    IMO this it the best Spiker, how ever it's the least usable Pokemon due to it's subpar HP and not as good phsyical attack absorber due to horrible typing. However, it's able to hit pretty well with it's STAB'd attack, doesn't get trap by Magneton like the others, can own the other Spikers one on one. Also, there's 66 unused EVs on that set, so you could add the extra to more Special attack, some speed or even add Explosion in the set and use it on attack.

    If you look at the list of Spikers, you've noticed that all of them are horrible at taking a Special hit, concluding the list to just regular Special Attackers.

    Zapdos @ Leftovers
    Trait: Pressure
    EVs: 124 HP / 136 Spd / 248 SAtk
    Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
    - Hidden Power [Grass/Ice]
    - Rest
    - Sleep Talk
    - Thunderbolt

    One of the best Special Attacker there is. You could do a Timid to get that 307 Speed to outspeed Sala and friends, but 270 is fine for Meta/Magnet/Hera/Gyara and co. Packs a huge hit, with HP according to how you want it. There are other variants of Zapdos, but Sleep Talking ones are arguably the best ones for just pure Special attacking.

    Gengar (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 100 HP / 60 Atk / 212 Spd / 136 SAtk
    Lonely Nature (+Atk, -Def)
    - Explosion
    - Hypnosis
    - Ice Punch
    - Thunderbolt

    One of the most unpredictable and annoying Pokemons to face. 309 Speed is always nice, along with a respectable 330 Special Attack and ability to sleep anything as well as blow something else up, Celebi/Blissey/Snorlax/Swampert/Heracross/Zapdos, whatever your team has problems to.
    However, if you feel as if Special Attacking straight up doesn't give you the boost you need, maybe you'd like to upgrade to a Stat Upping Special Attacker.

    Raikou @ Leftovers
    Trait: Pressure
    EVs: 80 HP / 176 Spd / 252 SAtk
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Calm Mind
    - Hidden Power [Grass]
    - Substitute
    - Thunderbolt

    With the right support, this thing can and will tear teams apart. It has enough speed just to outspeed those Adamant Dugtrios, allowing it the extra use for a little more HP'd Subs to help setting up against other Special Attackers.

    Jirachi @ Leftovers
    Trait: Serene Grace
    EVs: 252 HP / 96 Def / 108 Spd / 36 SAtk / 16 SDef
    Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
    - Calm Mind
    - Psychic
    - Substitute
    - Thunderbolt

    If your opponent doesn't have a Claydol or Steelix, chances are, they'll be in some deep trouble. With Serene Grace, after a Calm Mind and this will scare anything, including Swampert/Tyranitar/Metagross, who all fear getting Special Fall'd or Paralyzed while taking 40% Tbolts. Substitute allows it to have the advantage on Blissey, which not many other pure Special attackers can say that as well as JUST enough Defense to survive Dugtrio's EQ, but be sure to get that Calm Mind on the switch or you won't be able to KO it back. =/

    You might be thinking where is Celebi and Suicune, but they're also two-tricked ponies who you'll see futher along. Anyways, in order to stop these fags, you have to have a special wall of some kind...

    Regice @ Leftovers
    Trait: Clear Body
    EVs: 204 HP / 148 Def / 4 Spd / 96 SAtk / 56 SDef
    Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
    - Ice Beam
    - Psych Up
    - Rest
    - Thunder

    Stops Raikou and Roarless Suicune COLD. Not to mention it could deal out some decent damage along the way even without the Psych Up boosts.

    Snorlax (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Thick Fat
    EVs: 140 HP / 172 Atk / 56 Def / 140 SDef
    Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)
    - Double-Edge
    - Earthquake
    - Rest
    - Sleep Talk

    Not many things outside of Suicune would like to go head to head with this beast. With 300ish Attack Double-Edge will devestate. This pretty much will stop any Special Attacker period, save Ghosts.

    Blissey (F) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Natural Cure
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spd
    Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
    - Aromatherapy
    - Seismic Toss
    - Softboiled
    - Thunder Wave

    Boring but effective nonetheless. =/ IMO, for more fun, replace Aromatherapy if you can for something more fun such as Counter or IB. It'll suprise the crap out of people.

    Inconjunction to Special walls, you have to have your Physical walls. Skarmory is already been listed above, so the exact set above will be best...

    Suicune @ Leftovers
    Trait: Pressure
    EVs: 252 HP / 212 Def / 46 Spd
    Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
    - Calm Mind
    - Rest
    - Roar
    - Surf

    This thing is just monster. Absolutely annoying. Even more so if you want to add Toxic or Reflect over Calm Mind/Roar. This has the potential to sweeps teams as last poke, and if that happens, it's been an ugly battle. 404 HP 350 Defense.

    Swampert (F) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Torrent
    EVs: 240 HP / 16 Atk / 156 Def / 4 Spd / 76 SAtk / 16 SDef
    Relaxed Nature (+Def, -Spd)
    - Earthquake
    - Hydro Pump
    - Ice Beam
    - Roar

    Can switch into so many things it's not even funny. However the last move is up for grabs. You could have Rest if you're willing to risk it or if you carry a heal beller. The last move can also be Counter, which will greatly suprise Zapdos, but then you'll have a near useless Swampert. Curse is even an option or HPBug if you find that Celebi pisses you off too much.

    Milotic (F) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Marvel Scale
    EVs: 212 HP / 244 Def / 8 Spd / 44 SAtk
    Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
    - Hypnosis
    - Ice Beam
    - Recover
    - Surf

    If you're using Salamence, Aerodactyl and Metagross, this is prehaps the most annoying thing to face, seeing as Swampert can't heal as easily. With Marvel Scale it's a beast getting 420 Defense off near 300 HP. P.S. Anything less than 384/280 will get 2HKO'd by CBMence.

    Steelix (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Sturdy
    EVs: 180 HP / 176 Atk / 4 Def / 12 Spd / 136 SDef
    Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
    - Earthquake
    - Iron Tail
    - Rest
    - Roar

    One of the most underrated and underappreciated Phsyical wall. This thing will even take down those carrying EQs such as Metagross and Tyranitar. It's also a great switch in to Hera/Aero/Meta and what not. It can also hang with Zapdos and Raikou, but you might want HPRock for that.

    Weezing (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 244 Def / 8 Spd
    Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
    - Will-O-Wisp
    - Haze
    - Pain Split
    - Sludge Bomb

    You could have Will-O-Wisp, but with all those Hera/Milo, would you really want to? Possible Fire Blast over it to deal with Skarm who thinks all Weezing can do is burn it, or even TBolt if you have a slight Gyara problem. It's such a whore to deal with when you're using a fighter.

    To have a reason to carry Phsyical walls, you must have phsyical Pokemons. Which also leads to the greatest fear of Stat uppers.

    Salamence (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Intimidate
    EVs: 84 HP / 252 Atk / 32 Def / 140 Spd
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - Dragon Dance
    - Earthquake
    - Hidden Power [Flying]
    - Rock Slide

    Tyranitar (F) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Sand Stream
    EVs: 252 HP / 60 Atk / 16 Def / 180 Spd
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - Dragon Dance
    - Earthquake
    - Rock Slide
    - Substitute

    Self explanitory for the two above, with preference moves such as Fire Blast over Rock Slide and Taunt over Substitute on Sala and Tar respectively.

    Or you can go with just basic CB'ers who hit hard and run...

    Heracross (M) @ Choice Band
    Trait: Guts
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - Brick Break
    - Facade/Sleep Talk/Focus Punch
    - Megahorn
    - Rock Slide

    This could be Jolly, but I personally like that extra boost of Attack. There is no 100% way to kill this thing unless you sacrifice something first for Dugtrio to come out, and if they don't have a Dugtrio, pair this thing up with a Magneton and you potentially sweep an entire team build around this monster. Facade is more filler while Focus Punch is more for prediction. Sleep Talk is there in case you needed a Sleep Absorber, which also means Hera gets 831~ attack while sleeping btw.

    Aerodactyl (M) @ Choice Band
    Trait: Rock Head
    EVs: 6 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Double-Edge
    - Earthquake
    - Hidden Power [Flying]
    - Rock Slide

    Save this thing for late game and omg you'll love it. Being one of the fastest thing allowed in OU, combine it with STAB'd Rock Slide off that 400+ attack, and you have a hacking machine.

    Salamence (M) @ Choice Band
    Trait: Intimidate
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - Earthquake
    - Hidden Power [Flying]
    - Rock Slide
    - (Fire Blast/Flamethrower)/Brick Break

    Argubly one of the best CB'er there is. It's fast (299). It's strong (605). And it has a great movepool plus a great trait(Intimidation). With some Wish support, this is one of the easiest thing to switch in and greatly hurt something.

    Metagross @ Leftovers
    Trait: Clear Body
    EVs: 76 HP / 252 Atk / 96 Def
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - Earthquake
    - Explosion
    - Meteor Mash
    - Agility/Thunderpunch/Rock Slide/Shadow Ball/Sludge Bomb

    You could add CB and it's still great, but it's attack is so great combined with Meteor Mash, the freedom is better, plus you don't get owned by Magneton. You also still have 86 evs to go wherever you want it to go to help.

    Dugtrio (M) @ Choice Band
    Trait: Arena Trap
    EVs: 248 Atk / 220 Spd / 40 SDef
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - Aerial Ace
    - Earthquake
    - Hidden Power [Bug]
    - Rock Slide

    Sacrifice and kill. Rinse and repeat. Not much to it.

    There's also many Normals who you can just stick a Choice Band on and wreck havoc seeing as how they're generally all fast and have the simliarly the same movepool (Slaking,Tauros, Dodrio).

    Well, sometimes, you might not like the amount of damage those Pokes do due to constant walling. However, you could add on some Baton Passers to help you out. General rule of thumb is that if you can pull it off, you're most likely have the advantage and SHOULD win.

    Ninjask (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Speed Boost
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - Baton Pass
    - Silver Wind
    - Substitute
    - Swords Dance

    One of the easiest Baton Passers to use due to instant speed, however with so many counters around, you might want to pack a Magneton and some other Anti-Weezing/Suicune Pokes.

    Zapdos @ Leftovers
    Trait: Pressure
    EVs: 164 HP / 168 Spd / 176 SAtk
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Baton Pass
    - Hidden Power [Grass]
    - Substitute
    - Thunderbolt

    Probably the best Baton Passer there is due to it's mobility and ability to get in into other Pokes easily as well as scaring off common Phazers. Not to mention it can pack a punch.

    Celebi @ Leftovers
    Trait: Natural Cure
    EVs: 236 HP / 124 Def / 148 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Baton Pass
    - Calm Mind
    - Psychic
    - Recover

    It can pretty much Pass effective as well as wall. Kind of boring but eh, it works. Sometimes.

    Vaporeon (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Water Absorb
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spd
    Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
    - Baton Pass
    - Ice Beam
    - Substitute
    - Surf

    100+ Subs anyone?

    Umbreon (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Synchronize
    EVs: 212 HP / 68 Def / 228 Spd
    Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
    - Baton Pass
    - Mean Look
    - Taunt
    - Wish

    Pull this off and you can potentially sweep a team. However Hera's could cause problems, but if you know it's not CB'd, pass to a DDMence and just x6 dd if you can and you esentially win. Works for a lot of things like that.

    http://www.smogon.com/community/showthread.php?t=6161

    I got lazy. Maybe finishing it later.

    P.S. How the hell did Mekkah ever find all that time to write the teambuilding guide. =/
  2. Raikou21

    Raikou21
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    Max HP on Steelix.
  3. The.Lost.Hylian

    The.Lost.Hylian I'll have what you're drinking
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    You mentioned puting Sub on Skarm so that Donphan can Rapid Spin it. Since when did Sub block Rapid Spin?
  4. Nate

    Nate
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    Dunno but it does

    Which is why something that can break skarms subs is a better spinner than something that cannot (see forretress)
  5. Delta

    Delta

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    Milotic needs a mention between Swampert and Suicune

    Also, i believe thunderbolt > thunder on Regice

    Edit: Exploding Weezing isnĀ“t that good, it just lets you wins with curselax, no questions asked
  6. Qzahk

    Qzahk

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    You should also mention that spec. gengar sets can vary along with the unpredictability comment. Also, gyarados is a good DD'er, and you still forgot celebi. good article idea

    yes, sub does block rapid spin.
  7. moomoonerd

    moomoonerd

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    Where is Heracross?

    I don't personally like Rest, but standards for Claydol, Donphan, and Swampert usually have it.

    Exploding Weezing isn't all that useful... I think it should have WoW or Flamethrower/Thunderbolt there.

    Regice has T-Wave sometimes, Snorlax should maybe suggest Shadow Ball if team can't handle Gengar, sometimes Starmie has BoltBeam, Jirachi can also be a Wisher but then the EVs get different... Mr. Mime isn't all that common, so I think Roar+Drill Peck could make its way on Skarmory. All this is just minor stuff though...

    If you plan on expanding this, it might be a nice idea to include the things on the Team Building guide (i.e. best status-absorber, etc.)
  8. Aeolus

    Aeolus Bag
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    This is really good MoP. Once all the kinks are worked out and everything is added...I wouldn't mind formatting it and adding it to the site.
  9. m800_runner

    m800_runner

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    Pretty amazing analysis here, just one suggestion though...I dont know if it is a good idea to explode an excellent tank such as Weezing with all the arse resitances. IMO, Pain Split shows the ass within you :))
  10. david stone

    david stone Fast-moving, smart, sexy and alarming.
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    I'll fix up the EVs later, because some of them are bad. :( But other than that, good.
  11. dynamo

    dynamo

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    gj MoP.

    For Blissey's EV's, imo 212 is better since it gives her max leftovers recovery, and you can use the last few EV's to bring up her SAtk or SDef a bit.
  12. Hazerider

    Hazerider

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    I find it stupid that you're only posting random articles to get the article badge, but anyway...
    I don't like this... thing, whatever it is, because new people will use only these Pokemon if they read it (I MUST USE THEM THEY'RE THE BEST BLAGH BLAGH BLAGH I DONT GET IT). But since that pretty much sums up the entire Advance metagame, whatever.
  13. Steelicks

    Steelicks Come here and Battle me!
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    plus, there isnt really a best pokemon for anything if it doesnt work well in a team...

    edit: uh ok i just saw that obi made the exact same point in another thread
  14. Hipmonlee

    Hipmonlee Have a rice day
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    Thinking about it, I actually like this article. I mean, those are the best special walls.. It is useful to know that.. (I would add Celebi as a special wall btw)

    Like, if you did build a team out of just these pokes it would suck, but it is stupid to try to encourage newbies to use uu shit in standard battles because they just aren't good enough. Let them learn the game first, then they can try and be original..

    [Edit] - Also I think with guides like this, you should stick to the standard sets.. IE rest on pert, WoW on Weezing.. Like I said, let people be creative after they have learned the game..

    Have a nice day.
  15. Aeroblacktyl

    Aeroblacktyl The pizza doesn't scream in the oven! LOL!
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    P.S. someone do some EVs please.
  16. Raikou21

    Raikou21
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    The EVs aren't really that bad, you just forgot max HP before going defences on some of the pokemon, like: Claydol, Forretress, Regice, Milotic, Swampert, Steelix, Celebi, and Umbreon, also move the Def EVs on Salamence/Metagross into HP. And IIRC Dugtio needs 44 SDef EVs to live through Raikou's HP Ice/Grass BEFORE CM.
  17. Mekkah

    Mekkah
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    Timid Raikou at that.
  18. Black Leather Jacket

    Black Leather Jacket

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    You should add CBTyranitar.
  19. david stone

    david stone Fast-moving, smart, sexy and alarming.
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    Dugtrio currently has 330 speed with HP Bug (and don't say max speed HP Bug, because that just lowers attack and defense, and you have to make up the attack with 4 EVs, so the net change is -1 defense). It should have 332 to outpseed Adamant DDtar after it DDs once.
  20. X-Act

    X-Act np: Biffy Clyro - Shock Shock
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    In my opinion Jolteon should be included as a Baton passer that works very similar to Baton Pass Zapdos. And maybe Medicham in the CBers list. Just my opinion.
  21. dayren

    dayren

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    imo, the dder list needs gyarados, the bp list needs jolteon, and medicham should defitenately be in the cb list.
  22. Jibaku

    Jibaku Not taking FS requests atm.
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    Mention HP Rock or Rock Slide on Steelix, and Protect on Swampert
  23. lockon

    lockon

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    hp rock > rs on tar imo, hp grass is an option instead of psychic on celebi.
    imo vap doesn't need max hp, just more than 420
  24. Aeroblacktyl

    Aeroblacktyl The pizza doesn't scream in the oven! LOL!
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    Urgh, I guess I'll actually finally try to update/do a finalized version or some shit of this soon. =/
  25. moomoonerd

    moomoonerd

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    I don't know if you already planned to do this, but I think it would be much easier to find things if you bolded headers saying "Rapid Spinners", "Spikers", etc.

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