[STABmons] Togekiss [QC 3/3] [GP 0/2]

Status
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QC: Unfixable / Eevee General / The Reptile
GP: X / X

[Overview]

Packing possibly the most potent setup move in Geomancy, Togekiss is arguably the most dangerous special setup sweeper in the meta game, able to gain double Speed, Special Attack, and Special Defense a single turn. On top of this, Togekiss's good natural bulk, typing, and access to Oblivion Wing allow it to exploit many common Pokemon, such as Garchomp and Landorus-T, and avoid being revenge killed by common unboosted Fake Out + Extreme Speed users. However, Togekiss is very one-dimensional in what it can do effectively, relegated to exclusively the setup sweeper role. Geomancy's nature as a two-turn move means that it usually will only have one chance to actually set up, and is extremely crippled if it gets phazed out in the process. Additionally, it's typing makes it vulnerable to other common Pokemon such as Scizor, Tyranitar, and Thundurus, which can sometimes make it hard to find opportunities to set up. Overall, Togekiss's ability to break through teams with only a single free turn needed makes it one of the best win conditions a team can have, as well as one of the best late game cleaners in the tier.
[Set]
name: Geokiss
move 1: Geomancy
move 2: Oblivion Wing
move 3: Aura Sphere / Moonblast
move 4: Fire Blast / Moonblast / Substitute
item: Power Herb
Ability: Super Luck
nature: Modest
evs: 128 Hp / 4 Def / 252 SpA / 124 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========
Geomancy grants Togekiss a one-shot chance to be able to sweep through the opponents team with double speed, special attack, and special defense. Oblivion Wing serves as the main attacking move on the set, and allows Togekiss to recover off any residual damage and stay out of KO range of various Extremespeed revenge killers. Aura Sphere is the primary coverage option, since it ensures that Togekiss can beat non-Roar Heatran's 1v1, as well as provide good neutral coverage with Oblivion Wing. Moonblast could be used in this slot in order to give Togekiss a second, more powerful STAB option that it needs just to power through bulky pokemon like Assault Vest Slowking and Meloetta, as well as being able to 2HKO a Specially Defensive Sableye after a Topsy-Turvy.The final slot goes to whatever type of move you feel should round the set out. Fire Blast works as an additional coverage option, and is the only move Togekiss has to beat Aegislash, as well as guaranteeing an OHKO on Scizor, Ferrothorn, and Skarmory (after Sturdy is broken). Moonblast would be run here if power is preferred over the additional coverage. Substitute provides an extra layer of protection against Fake Out + Extremespeed, Gear Grind from a bulky Scizor, priority status and Topsy-Turvy, and blocks Transform Chansey entirely.

.
Set Details
========

The evs given guarantee that you outspeed choice scarfed jolly Excadrill and the unboosted tier (bar Deoxys-S) after a Geomancy, while also maximizing your special attack, with the rest invested in bulk. Power herb is necessary to enable Geomancy, otherwise Togekiss becomes too vulnerable while attempting to use it. Modest is the only listed nature because the extra speed provided from timid becomes mostly irrelevent at +2. The only exception is if it is very necessary that faster choice scarf users must be outsped (positive base 108s, most notably Terrakion), then a timid max speed set would be acceptable. Super Luck is the preferred ability because the extra chance to land a critical hit on something that would normally be able to take a boosted hit is much more rewarding than a special attack drop or burn given from Serene Grace Fire Blasts and Moonblasts.

Usage Tips
========

Due to Geomancy being a two-turn move means that you must believe that using it will result in you either sweeping through your opponents team, or putting them into a position that will make it impossible for them to come back, since you'll only have one chance to setup. This reliance on power herb also means that you must be aware about switching into possible knock offs, since those will immediately cripple Togekiss. Togekiss can easily set up on defensive Landorus-T, Garchomp, Slowbro, unboosted Darkrai, and any grass type in the tier (the last two provided that their sleep move has already been used elsewhere). Since Togekiss sweeps best when it can maintain full health through Oblivion Wing, it is advised that you bring it in on free switches so that you are able to best maximize its bulk and keep it from taking unnecessary damage. If for some reason Togekiss loses its Power Herb before it can use Geomancy, a taunt will cause the move to fail if Togekiss gets taunted before using BOTH turns of Geomancy. For example, a Deoxys-S Knocks Off the power Herb as you attempt to go for Geomancy, than Taunts you to stop it from succeeding. Be wary of trying to set up on fast Taunt and Dark types for this reason. If using a Substitute variant, setting Sub can be used to buy time to allow a second Geomancy to be used, or for it to be used after losing your Power Herb, since it takes, in most cases, multiple turns to break the Sub and start damaging Togekiss. Firing off attacks before setting up can be smarter if you know you can't break through a wall yet, and just want to deal damage without losing your Herb, and this can be a good way to weaken walls so that you can sweep past them later.

Team Options
========

The two best checks to Togekiss, Heatran and Aegislash, are both beaten by Garchomp, who can also provide entry hazards that help it break sashes and muscle through some bulkier threats. Additionally, Magnezone and Gothitelle work as trappers for the steels or other things that Togekiss can't get around, such as Clefable, Chansey, Scizor, and Heatran. The Deoxys forms and Espeon can provide dual screens and lunar dance support which makes Togekiss have an easier time setting up, and possibly even get two chances. Espeon's advantage is in Magic Bounce, so it can't be taunted, as well as providing sleep through Lovely kiss, while the Deoxys forms set up entry hazards. Other things that make Togekiss have an easier time setting up are VoltTurnShot users, such as Scizor, Sableye, and Thundurus, or hazard control like Defog Landorus-I or Scrappy Rapid Spin Stoutland. Pairing Togekiss with other sweepers such as Belly Drum Stoutland or Kangaskhan works as both threats will need to be revenge killed, and one FakeSpeeder is not usually sufficient to beat both sweepers.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

A support set that takes Togekiss's access to moves like tailwind, defog, encore, dual screens, heal bell, and the ability to have Thunder Wave + Serene Grace Air Slash could be used, but Togekiss's typing and stats don't tend well to making it either a physical or special wall, due to electric, rock, steel, and ice weaknesses, as well as the luck based nature of the strategy. Air Slash could be used over Oblivion Wing on the main set alongside the Serene Grace ability and a bulkier ev spread that isn't as strong, but has more inevitability with flinches. This is less reliable than just outright KO'ing things, so it is advised against being used. Baton pass is a possible fourth move as well, but Togekiss is usually the best possible sweeper in most situations, and Geomancy can't be passed more than once, making this option subpar. However an upside is that baton pass can be used to scout and build momentum, taking an opponent by surprise when you aren't yet prepared to try and sweep. If baton pass is used, nasty plot is also a possible alternative to Geomancy, but this is a major downgrade. Choice specs could be used to provide raw power immediately, but low speed stat, subpar physical bulk, and a Stealth Rock Weakness makes this set less useful than the Geomancy versions.Combined with Super Luck, Aeroblast can be used and hit 50% chance for a critical hit, but this is mostly a gimmick, and while the extra power is nice, it isn't nearly as useful as hp recovery or coverage

Checks and Counters
===================

  • **Bulky Special Walls**: Essentially only Chansey and Clefable, although Assault Vest Meloetta and Mega Sableye WITH Topsy-Turvy, ON THE TURN it mega-evolves work here as well to an extent. Clefable will always beat Togekiss eventually, while Chansey can transform into it and try to sweep itself. However, whirlwind is the only way for Chansey to reliably beat a substitute variant, and this only works if Togekiss is not the last pokemon
  • **Sableye**: While all Sableye variants lose to Togekiss once they are set up, Parting shot and Topsy-Turvy keep it from sweeping through the rest of the team, and Dark Void can actually make it so something else on the team be able to deal with it. Sableye also works as a deterent, because the presence of Sableye means that the Togekiss user will try to delay setting up, attempting to maximize Togekiss' value.
  • **Steel Types**: Most Steel Types that resist Flying will be able to beat Togekiss if it is a Substitute variant, but will lose to it if it is carrying either of the listed coverage moves. Specially Defensive Heatran walls sets not carrying Aura Sphere, while Aegislash can Setup on sets not carrying Fire Blast. Scizor can also work as a decent check to Togekiss that don't carry Fire Blast, provided it is bulky enough to live a boosted Oblivion Wing and fast enough to outspeed after a Shift Gear or strong enouigh to KO with Gear Grind + Bullet Punch through a substitute.
  • **Revenge Killing**: There is no FakeSpeeder in the tier that is guaranteed to KO Togekiss at full health without any type of boosts. Ursaring and Zangoose however, come closest, being able to KO if their abilities are already activated, and get high damage rolls. Magic Guard Focus Sash Alakazam is the single most reliable way to beat Togekiss, able to Heart swap away any accumulated boosts, and then OHKO with a boosted Psystrike. Fast Choice Scarf users, Such as Terrakion, also can effectively revenge kill slower variants of Togekiss. Priority paralysis or sleep from pranksters can also be used to stop Togekiss from sweeping. Choice Banded Scizor can also semi-reliably revenge kill the set, given Togekiss is not behind a Substitute
 
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Hey Ellipse! This analysis looks pretty solid right now. Here are my suggestions.

Overview
  • There's a huge flaw that Togekiss has: it's a one-hit wonder. If you don't pull off a Geomancy, it's left too slow and weak. If you do pull off the Geomancy, but you are forced out, then you're left weak and slow because you've used the Power Herb. That should be mentioned.
  • Mention how common Togekiss' weaknesses are: Rock, Ice, Electric, are all very common and should definitely be noted as a flaw. I think flaws as a whole needs a bit more expansion because Togekiss certainly has them!
Set
  • Alright. The eternal debate: what coverage to run on Togekiss? I've compiled this to show what each coverage can do:
    • Oblivion Wing / Moonblast / Aura Sphere hits 407 SE, 4 R, and 367 NE
    • Oblivion Wing / Moonblast / Fire Blast hits 318 SE, 3 R, and 458 NE
    • Oblivion Wing / Fire Blast / Aura Sphere hits 395 SE, 0 R, and 383 NE
    • Oblivion Wing / Fire Blast / Void (Substitute) hits 248 SE, 47 R, and 483 NE
    • Oblivion Wing / Aura Sphere / Void (Substitute) hits 366 SE, 11 R, and 401 NE
    • Oblivion Wing / Moonblast / Void (Substitute) 254 SE, 35 R, and 489 NE
    • Moonblast / Aura Sphere / Fire Blast hits 421 SE, 16 R, and 341 NE
    • Moonblast / Aura Sphere / Void (Substitute) hits 271 SE, 73 R, 433 NE, 1 I
    • Moonblast / Fire Blast / Void (Substitute) hits 303 SE, 51 R, 424 NE
      • SE = Super Effective, R = Resisted, NE = Normal Effectiveness, I = Immune
  • This may be a bit confusing, so let me break it down for you. The coverage with the most SE hits is Flying / Fairy / Fighting. The one with the least is Flying / Fire / Void. The one with the lease R is Flying / Fire / Fighting. However, the above chart... isn't relevant to selecting coverage. It shows statistically which is best, but I want you to determine how this effects the tier. I'm personally not a fan of Moonblast, I don't see what it adds at all. Oblivion Wing is mandatory, and the last slot is somewhat sketchy. I'd like to see the slashes as Geomancy | Oblivion Wing | Aura Sphere / Moonblast | Fire Blast / Substitute. Running Substitute + Fire Blast offers poor coverage, so I slash Aura Sphere in the third slot instead. Moonblast has merits I guess, but it should for sure be the second slot and not the first. Flying + Fighting coverage is really good, especially when coupled with Fire Blast. It's up to you to decide, I prefer that one.
  • Fix your EVs. It should be 128 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA / 124 Spe. HP / Atk / Def / SpA / SpD / Spe for future reference. Not SpAtk.
  • Do you think it's a good idea to bump EVs to outspeed Landorus-T? It might come in handy because Dragon Ascent does a lot and Togekiss may not be at 100% health while it is trying to sweep.
  • Also, rename set to GeoKiss. :]
Set Comments
  • Your Moves section is really good. The only thing I think I would add is a slight mention of which Extreme Speeders in particular and when. Can it live a +6 Extreme Speed at full health thanks to Oblivion Wing? I'm not sure, but that should be detailed because it is a common scenario. Can Oblivion Wing KO at +2? I don't know!
  • Under Set Details, perhaps think about my last mention under Sets. Besides that, it looks pretty solid. Though, mention why Super Luck is preferred over Serene Grace. It may not be obvious considering Moonblast and Fire Blast have secondary effects.
  • Usage Tips needs a bit more expansion in general. What can Togekiss come in on? What should Togekiss try and set up on? Should you use Togekiss early game? When should Togekiss avoid setting up? And so on. Answer those in Usage Tips!
  • Team Options looks solid. Garchomp also beats Aegislash, another top check to Togekiss. Mention VoltTurn here (Mega Scizor, Landorus-T, Raikou, etc) because pivoting into Togekiss is a good idea.
Strategy Comments
  • Mention a Choice Specs set in Other Options. I've used it to lots of success, and it's good at brute force right off the bat and more reliable throughout the match if Geomancy isn't executed correctly. Possibly mention Nasty Plot for the Baton Pass, this affords you Leftovers recovery. Geomancy is kinda still better though, lol.
  • Checks & Counter needs to be in the following format:
    • **Check / Counter**: Why
  • So be sure to make it that. Here's how I see Togekiss' as:
    • **Steel-types**:
    • **Clefable**:
    • **Revenge Killing**:
  • Steel-types is weird, yes, because you're running a coverage move, but be sure to expand as to why not running Aura Sphere means Heatran beats it, but running Aura Sphere means Scizor and Aegislash are better checks, etc.

Implement all of that and you have...


QC 1 /3
 
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Changes implemented, ready for QC 2. I didn't put any mention of what stage of a game Togekiss should be used in because its explosiveness and sheer power can result in teams being swept by a U-turn into Geomancy turn 3 if they aren't well equipped to stop a Togekiss. Slashed in Fire Blast in move 3, since its the move I'd feel most comfortable running over Moonblast in a substitute variant. in checks and counters, I changed Clefable to specially defensive walls in general, since Chansey and a few other select pokemon work there as well.
 

EV

Banned deucer.
Overview
  • I don't think it's the most effective special sweeper, considering it relies a lot on the correct coverage to sweep. I'd say "one of the most dangerous" for its ability to turn into a deadly sweeper in just one turn. Not much else gains +2/+2/+2 that quickly.
  • I'd add it's a great win condition once all the opponent's phazers are removed or as your last Pokemon when it can't be phazed out by Chansey or Heatran anymore.
Moves
  • Good
Set Details
  • Can we just say Excadrill instead of base 88s? It's the only base 88.
Usage Tips
  • Mention that you can wear down checks like Heatran by Subbing and attacking with Aura Sphere before they Roar you out so you don't burn the Power Herb early.
  • Also include that if you lose the Herb, getting up a Sub can help you Geomancy again later because it takes a turn to break the sub, buying you some time.
  • I'd explain how a faster Taunt stops non-Power Herb Geomancy even on the second turn. (Example: Sableye switches into Geomancy's charge turn. Turn 2 is uses Taunt, which cancels the move before it can get to +2/+2/+2.)
Team Options
  • Mention hazard removal because Togekiss doesn't want to lose any more HP than necessary, i.e. at 50% after SR and Sub the same bulky Scizor's Gear Grind it used to stomach now KOs.
OO
  • Aeroblast stacks critical hits with Super Luck.
  • Mention that Baton Pass can also scout. It doesn't have to pass its Geomancy boosts.
Cs & Cs
  • Isn't Mega Sableye KO'd by Moonblast before it can Topsy?
  • With the special walls mention again how they can't WW it away if it's the last Poke (Kl4ng uses this tactic.)
  • Under revenge killing add CB Scizor's Bullet Punch. (It has an 87.5% chance to OHKO this set, guaranteed with Rocks.)

QC 2 of 3
 
Added/ fixed all the suggestions and issues that you talked about eevee, EXCEPT for those in the overview. In terms of being arguably the best special sweeper in the tier, it's better than basically any given shell smasher (FakeSpeed says hi) and M-Diancie, and its about on par with Serperior and Darkrai. I did change the wording to clarify "setup sweeper" to distinguish it from something like Scarf Boomburst Meloetta or Landorus-I (not relevant anymore, but its a good example of an alternative). The note about phazing seemed not relevant enough to be mentioned both in the overview and the checks & counters section, so I left it just in C&C.
 

EV

Banned deucer.
Regarding Aeroblast's critical hit chance, they do 1.5x now not 2x.

Time to put this in full analysis format (complete sentences, no bullets) and then ask for the 3rd QC.
 
My bad, usually better at remembering my mechanics. I don't even remember typing that. Will start writing tommorow.
 

canno

formerly The Reptile
Overview
  • I agree with Eevee here - while I think it is currently the most dangerous Special Sweeper I wouldn't call it the most effective due to its one-time boost
  • I think you should add more to its flaws section. Due to how sacred its set-up option is and due to how much offensive pressure top threats can put on it I would mention how setting up at the right time isn't the easiest thing. For example, SG Scizor can set-up a boost but then switch out to do it again if something wasn't accounted for or if you needed the Speed / Power to get a KO. Togekiss doesn't have this luxuray. Finally, I think its weakness to phazing should be emphasized more.
  • You should also mention that Togekiss works very well as a late-game cleaner and one of the best win-conditions in the meta. Also, mention its utility in a last-mon situation due to phazing immunity.
  • Some letters are missing on words, such as the "r" Scizor and the "n" in unboosted.
Moves
  • I personally would put Fire Blast first and then Moonblast - having the most coverage for what's arguably your most important STAB move / recovery move is much more important than a secondary STAB in my eyes. Beating things such as Aegislash and KOing Skarmory at +2 after Sturdy (SR) before it can Whirlwind you out is important, along with giving you the ability to always have an OHKO on Mega Scizor (who can potentially live a +2 Oblivion Wing, especially if it has SpDef investment) is important. Of course, Moonblast is really good too for the mentioned reasons, but I feel like Fire Blast should be first.
  • At the very least, mention more in-depth why Fire Blast is a good option.
  • Everything else looks good.
Set Details
  • Everything here looks good.
Usage Tips
  • Mention how Togekiss should be used as both a late-game sweeper / cleaner and a win-condition
  • Also mention how Togekiss can use its coverage to damage and apply pressure to its checks so it can sweep later
Team Options
  • Looks good here
OO
  • Remove mentions of Chatter - if I recall correctly, its not allowed to be used by anything that isn't Chatot. Everything else looks good.
Cs & Cs
  • Add Pranskter Sableye - even though you can 2HKO and damage it with Moonblast its presence doesn't allow you to set-up properly in fear of Tospy-Turvy. Even if you severely damage it, Tospy Turvy basically leaves you useless. Sableye also can Parting Shot and weaken you to the point where you can't do much damage - a problem, considering that you can't Geomancy again safely because its a 2-turn move.
  • I would put Steels over Bulky Special Walls in the order, but this is a minor nitpick
  • Everything else looks good

QC 3 of 3 [PENDING]

EDIT: tagging ellipse so he can get a notification

#firstQC
 
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QC 3 implemented, just some notes:
  • Rearranged all the slashes under moves to reflect Fire Blast being more important than Moonblast.
  • Didn't add the last pokemon phazing scenario to the overview since it seems too specific too be part of something as general as the overview
  • Didn't add the point about win-con / cleaner, since when Togekiss comes out and sets up, it becomes the late game, and if your using it to clean up the opponents remaing 4 pokemon, its the win con. Essentially, on a set like this, when it is performing either of those roles, you cannot tell that it isn't performing the other.
  • Didn't switch the order between steels and bulky special walls, since if you use all the preferred slashes, then it should have no trouble with steels because its running double coverage.
 

Lumari

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[Overview][OVERVIEW]

Packing possibly the most explosive potent setup moves move in Geomancy, Togekiss is arguably the most dangerous special setup sweeper in the metagame, (remove space) able to gain double Speed, Special Attack, and Special Defense after in a single turn. On top of this, Togekiss's good natural bulk, typing, and access to Oblivion Wing allow it to exploit many common Pokemon, such as Garchomp and Landorus-T, and then avoid being revenge killed by common unboosted FakeSpeeders Fake Out + Extreme Speed users. However, Togekiss is very one dimensional (remove hyphen) in what it can do effectively, relegated to exclusively the setup sweeper role. Geomancy's nature as a two-turn (add hyphen) move means that it Togekiss usually will only have one chance to actually set up (RC) and is extremely crippled if it gets phazed out in the process. Additionally, it's its typing makes it vulnerable to other common Pokemon such as Scizor, Tyranitar, and Thundurus, which can sometimes make it hard to find opportunities to set up. Overall, Togekiss's ability to break through teams with only a single free turn needed makes it one of the best win conditions a team can have (RC) as well as one of the best late-game (add hyphen) cleaners in the tier. (or probably just remove the late-game cleaners bit cause it's pretty much the same thing)
(space)

[Set][SET]
name: Geokiss
move 1: Geomancy
move 2: Oblivion Wing
move 3: Aura Sphere / Moonblast
move 4: Fire Blast / Moonblast / Substitute
item: Power Herb
ability: Super Luck
nature: Modest
evs: 128 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA / 124 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========
Geomancy grants Togekiss a one-shot single chance to be able to sweep at sweeping through the opponent's team with double Speed, Special Attack, and Special Defense. Oblivion Wing serves as the main attacking move on the set (RC) and allows Togekiss to recover off any residual damage and stay out of KO range of various Extreme Speed (add space) revenge killers. Aura Sphere is the primary coverage option, since it ensures that Togekiss can beat non-Roar Heatran's 1v1, as well as provide one-on-one and provides good neutral coverage with Oblivion Wing. Moonblast could be used in this slot in order to give Togekiss a second, more powerful STAB option that it needs just to power through bulky Pokemon like such as Assault Vest Slowking and Meloetta, as well as being able to and 2HKO a specially defensive Sableye after a Topsy-Turvy.(space)The final slot goes to whatever type of move you feel should round the set out. Fire Blast works as an additional coverage option (RC) and is the only move Togekiss has to beat Aegislash, as well as guaranteeing an OHKO on Scizor, Ferrothorn, and Skarmory (after Sturdy is broken). Moonblast would can be run here if power is preferred over the additional coverage. Substitute provides an extra layer of protection against Fake Out + Extremespeed, Gear Grind from a bulky Scizor, priority status, (AC) and Topsy-Turvy, and it blocks Transform from Chansey entirely.

.
Set Details
========

The given EVs given guarantee that you allow Togekiss to outspeed Jolly Choice Scarfed jolly Excadrill and the unboosted tier (bar Deoxys-S) after a Geomancy (RC) while also maximizing your its Special Attack; (SC) with the rest are invested in bulk. Power Herb is necessary to enable for immediate use of Geomancy, otherwise Togekiss becomes too vulnerable while attempting to use it. Modest is the only listed nature because the extra Speed provided from by Timid becomes mostly irrelevent irrelevant at +2. The only exception is if it is very necessary that to outspeed faster Choice Scarf users must be outsped (positive base 108s, most notably Terrakion); (SC) then if that's the case, a set with a Timid nature and maximum Speed investment set would be acceptable. Super Luck is the preferred ability because the extra chance to land a critical hit on something that would normally be able to take a boosted hit is much more rewarding than a Special Attack drop or burn given from Serene Grace Fire Blasts and Moonblasts and Fire Blasts.

Usage Tips
========

Due to Because Geomancy's being a two-turn nature move means that you'll only have one chance to set up, you must believe make sure that using it will result in you Togekiss either sweeping through your opponents team (RC) or putting them into a position that will make it impossible for them to come back, since you'll only have one chance to setup. This reliance on Power Herb also means that you must be aware wary about switching Togekiss into possible Knock Offs, since as those will immediately cripple Togekiss it. Togekiss can easily set up on defensive Landorus-T, Garchomp, and Slowbro, as well as on unboosted Darkrai (RC) and any Grass-type if Sleep Clause is active in the tier (the last two provided that their sleep move has already been used elsewhere). Since Because Togekiss sweeps best when it can maintain full health through Oblivion Wing, it is advised that you bring it in on free switches so that you are able to best maximize its bulk and to keep it from taking unnecessary damage. If, (AC) for some reason, (AC) Togekiss loses its Power Herb before it can use Geomancy, a Taunt will cause the move to fail if it hits Togekiss gets taunted before using BOTH turns of Geomancy the move is fully executed. For example, a Deoxys-S Knocks Off the power Herb as you attempt to go for Geomancy, than Taunts you to stop it from succeeding. Be wary of trying to set up on fast Taunt users such as Deoxys-S and Dark types for this reason. If using a Substitute variant, setting the Substitute can be used to buy time to allow use a second Geomancy to be used, or for it to be used use it after losing your Togekiss's Power Herb, since as it takes, in most cases, multiple turns to break the Sub and start damaging Togekiss's Substitute. Firing off attacks Outright attacking before setting up can be smarter if you know you Togekiss can't break through a wall yet (RC) and just want to deal damage without losing your its Power Herb, and this can be a good way to weaken walls so that you Togekiss can sweep past them later.

Team Options
========

The two best checks to Togekiss, Heatran and Aegislash, are both beaten by both lose to Garchomp, who which can also provide entry hazards that to help it break Focus Sashes and muscle through some bulkier threats. Additionally, Magnezone and Gothitelle work as trappers for the steels or Steel-types and other things Pokemon that Togekiss can't get around, such as Clefable, Chansey, Scizor, and Heatran. The Deoxys formes and Espeon can provide dual screens and Lunar Dance support, (AC) which makes allows Togekiss to have an easier time setting up (RC) and possibly even get two chances. Espeon's advantage is in Magic Bounce, so it can't be which prevents it from being Taunted, as well as providing its ability to inflict sleep through Lovely Kiss, while the Deoxys formes can set up entry hazards. Other things that ways to make Togekiss have an easier time setting up are VoltTurn and Parting Shot users, such as Thundurus, Scizor, and Sableye, and Thundurus, or hazard control like and entry hazard removers such as Defog Landorus-I or Landorus and Scrappy Rapid Spin Stoutland. Pairing Togekiss with other sweepers such as Belly Drum Stoutland or and Kangaskhan works as because both threats will need to be revenge killed (RC) and one FakeSpeeder Fake Out + Extreme Speed user is not usually sufficient to beat both sweepers.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

A support set that takes advantage of Togekiss's access to moves like Tailwind, Defog, Encore, dual screens, and Heal Bell (RC) and the ability to have combination of Thunder Wave + Serene Grace Air Slash could be used, but Togekiss's typing and stats don't tend lend themselves well to making it either a physical or special wall (RC) due to electric, rock, steel, and ice its weaknesses to Electric, Rock, Steel, and Ice (RC) as well as the luck-based (add hyphen) nature of the strategy. Air Slash could be used over Oblivion Wing on the main set alongside the Serene Grace ability and a bulkier EV spread that isn't as strong, but has more inevitability with flinches. (can you word this more clearly? cause idk what to make of it :[ ...) This is less reliable than just outright KO'ing KOing things, so it is advised against being used using it is discouraged. Baton Pass is a possible fourth move as well, but Togekiss is usually the best possible sweeper in most situations, and Geomancy can't be passed more than once, making this option subpar. However, (AC) an upside is that Baton Pass can be used to scout and build momentum, taking an opponent by surprise when you aren't yet prepared to try and sweep with Togekiss. If Baton Pass is used, Nasty Plot is also a possible alternative to can be run over Geomancy, but this is a major downgrade. Choice Specs could be used to provide raw power immediately, but Togekiss's low speed stat, subpar physical bulk, and a Stealth Rock Weakness makes this set less useful than the Geomancy versions.(space)Combined with Super Luck, Aeroblast can be used and hit has a 50% chance for a critical hit in tandem with Super Luck, but this is mostly a gimmick, and while the extra power is nice, it isn't nearly as useful as hp recovery or coverage. (AP)

Checks and Counters (remove bullet points and put a space after each item)
===================

**Bulky Special Walls**: Essentially, (AC) only Chansey and Clefable can wall Togekiss adequately, (or something like that) although Assault Vest Meloetta and Mega Sableye, (AC) WITH if it runs Topsy-Turvy, ON THE TURN it mega-evolves and hasn't Mega Evolved yet, (AC) work here as well to an extent. Clefable will always beat Togekiss eventually, while Chansey can Transform into it and try to sweep itself. However, Whirlwind is the only way for Chansey to reliably beat a Substitute variant, and this only works if Togekiss is not the last Pokemon. (AP)

**Sableye**:
While all Sableye variants lose to Togekiss once they are set up, Parting Shot and Topsy-Turvy keep it from sweeping through the rest of the team, and Dark Void can actually make it so something else on the team be able allow a teammate to deal with it. Sableye also works as a deterent, because the presence of Sableye means that the Togekiss user will try to delay setting up, attempting to maximize Togekiss' value.

**Steel Types**: Most Steel-types that resist Flying will be able to beat Togekiss if it is a Substitute variant (RC) but will lose to it if it is carrying either of the listed coverage moves. Specially defensive Heatran walls sets not carrying Aura Sphere, while Aegislash can Setup set up on sets not carrying Fire Blast. Scizor can also work as a decent check to Togekiss that don't carry Fire Blast, provided it is bulky enough to live a boosted Oblivion Wing and fast enough to outspeed after a Shift Gear or strong enouigh enough to KO with Gear Grind + Bullet Punch through a Substitute.

**Revenge Killing**: There is no FakeSpeeder Fake Out + Extreme Speed user in the tier that is guaranteed to KO Togekiss at full health without any type of boosts. Ursaring and Zangoose, (AC) however, come closest, being able to KO if their abilities are already activated (RC) and they get high damage rolls. Magic Guard Focus Sash Alakazam is the single most reliable way to beat Togekiss, able to Heart swap take away any accumulated boosts with Heart Swap (RC) and then OHKO Togekiss with a boosted Psystrike. Fast Choice Scarf users, such as Terrakion, also can also effectively revenge kill slower variants of Togekiss. Priority paralysis or sleep from pranksters Prankster users can also be used to stop Togekiss from sweeping. Choice Banded Scizor can also semi-reliably revenge kill the set, given provided Togekiss is not behind a Substitute.



GP 1/2
 
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EV

Banned deucer.
Is togekiss still viable enough to warrant an analysis?
Not in the capacity you have right now. Geokiss can only run Dazzling Gleam and Air Slash with coverage, but that's still *viable*, just not as good as it used to be. Otherwise I've found it to be a good supporter and it's a hard stop to any Garchomp (pretty common.)

Do you want to start over or just tweak the Geo set?
 
I don't think that "tweaks" will be drastic enough to make enough changes to reflect its new niche in the tier, since as you said it's good as a Garchomp counter, but I have 0 faith in NeoGeoKiss. I think even if I were to continue with this analysis, it would need to restart the QC process, and I don't want to redo all that, so just put Togekiss back on the list (or don't since it should probably be a lower priority analysis than other more viable things now).
 
This is not getting an analysis until some further discussion... Be on the lookout for getting this if it is to go back up for reservation!

(Eevee General you can lock this now.)
 
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