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Sun Team OU : Smart, yet subtle:

Discussion in 'BW OU Teams' started by CaliburnC, Aug 13, 2013.

  1. CaliburnC


    Aug 13, 2013
    火災 (Fi) (Ninetales) @ Air Balloon
    Trait: Drought
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 252 SDef / 252 HP / 4 SAtk
    Calm Nature
    - Flamethrower
    - Will-O-Wisp
    - Pain Split
    - Roar

    Ninetails is the backbone of my team. SpD based, allows me to take surfs without any worry. Balloon allows me to avoid pesky spikes/toxic spikes damage and Earthquakes for a single turn, until its popped. I prefer it over Leftovers, as my defenses are exceptionally low with this poke, and it can be OHKO'd by practically any earthquake.

    恐怖 (Fe) (Gliscor) @ Toxic Orb
    Trait: Poison Heal
    EVs: 252 Atk / 184 HP / 72 Spd
    Adamant Nature
    IVs: 30 Def / 30 SDef / 30 Spd
    - Fling
    - Roost
    - Earthquake
    - Acrobatics

    The nuisance of my team, it aims to utilise toxic orb with Poison heal, and fling it off, then pull off 110 STAB acrobatics and STAB earthquakes with 252 EV's in Atk. . Taking fling over toxic is a gamble, as steel types are everywhere in OU, so i can use feint a Fling, and instead using Earthquake, doing substantial damage. If tricked into holding a Choice specs, or a item that would hinder Gliscor, FLing also assists in being able to remove that threat, dealing damage with it.

    宗教裁判 (In) (Venusaur) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Chlorophyll
    EVs: 252 Spd / 252 SAtk / 4 HP
    Modest Nature
    - Growth
    - Giga Drain
    - Hidden Power [Fire]
    - Sleep Powder

    Ah Venusaur, how i love this poke on a sun team. Switch into a hydropump, Sun reduced and resisted, to deal mimimal damage, and growth to get a +2 in SpA, raising its stats into sweeping territory. Its heavy counter is the change of weather. I had SolarBeam instead of Giga Drain, but the reduced power from Giga Drain stopped me from dying due to Life Orb, which was a massive problem for me. HP Fire, allows me to fire off Sun boosted Hidden powers, if Giga Drain wont be effective.

    ウォール (Wa) (Skarmory) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Sturdy
    EVs: 232 Def / 252 HP / 24 Spd
    Impish Nature
    IVs: 30 Atk / 30 Def
    - Brave Bird
    - Roost
    - Stealth Rock
    - Whirlwind

    Phaser, and my wall to dragon-types, such as Salamence, Garchomp, and any Outrage user. Not to mention, my Stealth Rocks, phaser, and staller. As i dont have much Toxic/Will-o-wisp, it does not work as effective as i wish it, but the walling power of Skarmory was too good to pass up.

    燃やす (Bu) (Heatran) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Flash Fire
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Modest Nature
    - Fire Blast
    - Earth Power
    - Hidden Power [Ice]
    - Flash Cannon

    Flash fire, plus sun boosts, plus STAB, make Fire Blast a monstrosity to switch into. Baiting out a flamethrower onto venusaur, and letting Heatran take it, to boost its power even more, means that even Rain conditons will not stop it. Its almost impossible to switch into a 405 power Fire Blast, even for heavily resisted pokemon. However, the accuracy is low, and sometimes lets me down. Earth Power is slightly silly to have, as i have 3 ground moves on my team (Earthquake w/ Gliscor + Donphan, Earth Power w/ Heatran) HP Ice and Flash Cannon are simply for coverage.

    DISCUSSION: Life Orb or Balloon?

    ボール (Ba) (Donphan) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Sturdy
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 SDef / 252 Def
    Brave Nature
    IVs: 0 Spd
    - Rapid Spin
    - Ice Shard
    - Gyro Ball
    - Earthquake

    My rapid spinner, with Ice Shard to switch into Dragons and (hopefully) chunk their health. Rapid spin is extremely helpful as Ninetails takes 25% damage from Stealth Rocks, which i'd rather avoid as best as i can. Earthquake for stab, and taking out steel types like Forretress or Ferrothorn, that may want to set up against it.

    If you find any issues, tell me and i'll think about it :> ~Caliburn
  2. Ignus

    Ignus slowly falling apart as my jaw gapes wider
    is a Pre-Contributor

    Mar 6, 2011
    Hi! I'll do my best to give suggestions on your team. It's become a hobby of mine to do rates in the wee hours of the night. I'll do my best to help/make you think.

    First of all, I would like to mention how happy it make me feel that you are using a defensive set on ninetails. She's to pretty to die and is suprisingly bulky for a fire type! People underestimate it's bulk and try to kill it with measly surfs. Good on you!

    Now, I get to poke with your team. In general, it looks pretty solid! The first thing I can comment on, however, is a whopping weakness to the general structure of rain teams. Losing the weather battle, for your team especially, is devastating. With one water resist and 4 weaknesses, the inherent culture of rain teams will make you cry softly as Politoed caresses your face with 100 gallons of water. This, plus the fact that Sun teams must keep greater control on weather than either sandstorm or rain (both types of weather are worse then no weather for sun. It sucks.) puts you in a position where you have to either keep control of weather at all times or compensate with pokemon that do well in several kinds of weather. Both options work, but the latter tends to be more reliable in general due to it's versatility. Your pokemon, in general, have this problem, albeit in a strange offshoot. The problem stems from overlapping roles and ideas within your team itself. This makes your team function well in sunlight, but anywhere else they will preform in a lackluster way. Let me give an example.

    Gliscor is a strong asset to any team with it's amazing ability and strong physically defensive presence. However, it IS possible to use it offensively. And you do that! And it probably works most of the time! It's job, to put it simply, is to act as a pivot point for your team to turn around momentum and then push it in your favor.

    Donphan is a strong asset to any team with rapid spin and great offensive presence. It has high physical bulk and can revenge kill well with ice shard. It's job, to put it simply, is to act as a pivot point for your team to turn around momentum and then push it in your favor.

    Do you see the similarities?
    Even their typing is similar, even if the specifics are slightly different. As of now, they fulfill the same "basic" role. So: what are my suggestions to fix this? Well, you could:
    1. Try to swap around roles within your current pokemon by trying out new sets, new EV spreads, and being super duper
    2. Get rid of one of your three physically defensive walls and replace it with something stronger on the special side; thus supplementing your weakness to large amounts of water moving at high velocities
    3. Poop yourself and cry lots like tiny babby

    I would suggest the second one. Take a look at Jellicent if you want a special tank. It has a tendency to play extremely well with ninetails and works great as a utility counter. Or, maybe, a glance over in the direction of Starmie or Gengar if you want a fast offensive sweeper. Starmie especially does her job well, being able to replace Donphan as a rapid spinner if need be. However, if you're looking for a pivot, try Rotom-W. It's typing is great and will work in conjunction with Venasaur quite nicely!

    If you want other, more specific suggestions or disagree with something I said, feel free to mention it! I lurk these stupid forums in the dark of night when you poop like tiny babby. Good hunting!
  3. Lampent


    Jul 23, 2013

    Anyway, I'm gonna echo Ignus on the fact that your team gets raped by Water types. I would reccomend a Trapping Gotchitelle, as offensive Sun teams are mostly HO.

    Here's the set:

    Gotchitelle @ Choice Specs
    EVs: 252 SpAtk, 252 Spd, 4 SDef
    Modest Nature
    - Thunderbolt
    - Psyshock
    - HP Fire
    - Trick

    This allows you to trap and 1HKO any Politoed, which helps. With Sun up, your team doesn't fear Water as much.

    Hope I helped!

    - Lampent
  4. CaliburnC


    Aug 13, 2013
    If i follow what Lampent said, regarding Gothitelle, my heart goes to switching out Donphan, hence losing a Rapid Spinner in the process.

    However, now i have 3 pokes with SpA atk based! (Venusaur, Heatran, and Gothitelle). Is that bad? I 'try' to have 2 Physical/2SpA/2 Walls, however sometimes that doesnt work.

    However, it may work, so i'll trial run it, and hurry back!
  5. deadflame


    Oct 29, 2011
    You need Sunny Day on Ninetails for Politoed and Tyranitar switch ins. You Sunny Day on the switch then switch out, ruining their game plans. Replace Pain Split with Sunny Day.
  6. Stone Alchemist

    Stone Alchemist

    Jul 14, 2013
    Your team is very, and I accent very weak to rain teams. The only pivot you have is venusaur, who isn't that reliable at taking surfs when combined with Psyshocks or Ice Beams. Timid Heatrans with HP Ice and Earth Power are a pain in the ass for you too.

    DUGTRIO TIME! I would also reccomend adding a water resist.
  7. TheArchangle


    Aug 30, 2012
    ^Wobbuffet and Gothitelle are superior for taking out Politoed. This team is so unconventional though that I don't know what to replace them for lol
  8. Alfalfa


    Aug 31, 2012
    Why does your Skarmory have 30 Attack and Defense IVs instead of 31... It is not running HP Ice...
  9. Kingler12345

    Kingler12345 Reaching for a way out of this dream...
    is a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus

    May 26, 2013
    What the above people said, and try putting stealth rock on heatran instead of flash cannon because that's redundant coverage and put spikes on skarmory.
    Hope I helped.

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