hey, all i need to know how to do with ike is to change from smash to those awkward moves that happen when you hold the control stick in one direction and press the punch button, and use quick draw/aereth. with that i am truly a masterful ike user.
-
Welcome to Smogon! Take a moment to read the Introduction to Smogon for a run-down on everything Smogon, and make sure you take some time to read the global rules.
-
Congrats to the winners of the 2023 Smog Awards!
Super Smash Bros. Brawl: Character and Tier Discussion
- Thread starter Firestorm
- Start date
- Status
I seriously doubt that. Quick Draw is a horrible move when used to attack and Aether has it's moments with mind games to the stages edge, but otherwise is a failure against any competent player. I take it your referring to tilts in your post, in which case it's not difficult to learn them. Punch button? Why not just refer to it as attack? Jab canceling has become popular with Ike as seen from a lot of Kirk's recent videos, and pivot grabbing mind games are always useful when you can fool someone into a well placed fsmash or ftilt. I believe so far there are no masters of Ike or most other characters. So please refrain from saying things like that.
;_;
i dont use quick draw to attack, as i said earlier, i use it to appoach. aereth, i dont beleive there are many good uses for aereth other than attacking an opponent approaching from the air and getting to the ledge, and i will honor your request to refrain from using the term "master x player".
i dont use quick draw to attack, as i said earlier, i use it to appoach. aereth, i dont beleive there are many good uses for aereth other than attacking an opponent approaching from the air and getting to the ledge, and i will honor your request to refrain from using the term "master x player".
I don't think either of them belong in low tier, seeing as how they're one of my many secondaries. Even the mid tier characters of Brawl are comparatively horrible at tournies. I never said that a good Ness player couldn't beat a high tier player, either. MK is still #1.
I main Fox, and he is in the middle tier. He doesn't belong there though ui find him alot better than any Wolf. Wolf may have a better blaster and has a better ground game but oh boy Fox does own him in air IMO! I think that maining Low Tier characters (or middle) is more challenging than High Tier and Top Tier ones.
An example of my experience: I first started to train alot with Fox, learning his Advanced Techniques, going on smashboards etc. After 2 1/2 months i finally started to get good with him, and now i kick ass :P Now, i am starting to play alot with Marth, and he's an awesome character i gotta say, but how long did it take for me to get good with him? 1 week lol. This happened 1 week ago so i'm not really that good with him yet, but i start to get the feeling on how a Marth player should play (Footstool Spike) and all that.
An example of my experience: I first started to train alot with Fox, learning his Advanced Techniques, going on smashboards etc. After 2 1/2 months i finally started to get good with him, and now i kick ass :P Now, i am starting to play alot with Marth, and he's an awesome character i gotta say, but how long did it take for me to get good with him? 1 week lol. This happened 1 week ago so i'm not really that good with him yet, but i start to get the feeling on how a Marth player should play (Footstool Spike) and all that.
Dude, no way. You can play any character well. Thats like saying some noob picking up MetaKnight would kick someones ass who mains well a 'low tier and waste of time' of a character.
Maku I'm gonna have to call you out. I haven't played you in a while and don't know why people are pole jocking you so hard.
I still love you though. <3.
edit: Also, because recent discussion is retarded:
Once again, the tier list is not based on the fact that just because someone can do very well with Ganondorf, or Ike, or Sonic, or some other trash character, doesn't mean they deserve to be higher up do to the fact. Understand that A) This is an organized list, and whether you like or not, someone is going to be above someone who is above someone who is above someone who is at the bottom. B)This list is based on how each character does against the rest of the cast in general. So yes, Yoshi could probably go even with Meta Knight(I don't really know if this is true and whether or not the Yoshis are still arguing with MKs over this, but it serves my purpose) but the concept of tiers isn't based on how well a character does against some of the "better" characters. So needless to say, if a characters has a number of bad matchups that pair up with his/her already disadvantageous attributes (not to mention tournament placings), then of course they will end up in a lower tier.
Ike sucks.
Sonic sucks.
Fox is mediocre.
I don't like Wolf and think he should die.
Yoshi is kawaii.
Ness is top tier.
Lucas is garbage.
[insert other unnecessary sarcastic remarks here]
I still love you though. <3.
edit: Also, because recent discussion is retarded:
Once again, the tier list is not based on the fact that just because someone can do very well with Ganondorf, or Ike, or Sonic, or some other trash character, doesn't mean they deserve to be higher up do to the fact. Understand that A) This is an organized list, and whether you like or not, someone is going to be above someone who is above someone who is above someone who is at the bottom. B)This list is based on how each character does against the rest of the cast in general. So yes, Yoshi could probably go even with Meta Knight(I don't really know if this is true and whether or not the Yoshis are still arguing with MKs over this, but it serves my purpose) but the concept of tiers isn't based on how well a character does against some of the "better" characters. So needless to say, if a characters has a number of bad matchups that pair up with his/her already disadvantageous attributes (not to mention tournament placings), then of course they will end up in a lower tier.
Ike sucks.
Sonic sucks.
Fox is mediocre.
I don't like Wolf and think he should die.
Yoshi is kawaii.
Ness is top tier.
Lucas is garbage.
[insert other unnecessary sarcastic remarks here]
KAWAII NEKO YOSHI-SAMA ISU MAI LORDO-SAMA NEKO DESU
^____________________________________^;
Anyways yes Umby is correct, this discussion is getting stupid.
^____________________________________^;
Anyways yes Umby is correct, this discussion is getting stupid.
See, this is EXACTLY why I didn't want to be placed so high!!! >.<
PEOPLE, I DON'T KNOW WHY I'M #1! YES, I THINK I'M A FAIRLY GOOD PLAYER, BUT #1? ME NO THINK SO!! =/
@Umby: I think that placement is what's giving me soo much hype man. In all honesty, I really don't want it! I greatly appreciate everyone's opinions of me, but I don't feel I live up to all of them.
@one~winged~angel: Hehe, thanks a lot man for your comments concerning my Puff usage, but could you tone it down a bit? I don't want any extra pressure or have to live up to set expectations. ^^ (GO PUFF!!!)
@Minwu: Yeah, I'd say that low tier characters are where they are because of their learning curve as well! That's a good way of putting it. =3
Anyhoo, being placed as #1 still TOTALLY baffles me (are you reading this Dunk....), but I'll do what I can regardless. I totally agree with YK on Skill>Tier. As for characters and such, I play with Lucas and Jiggly because they are the ONLY two characters who I can really groove with. I don't have to FORCE my way into their fighting styles. Listen people, I DON'T research on how to use a character, adv techs or matchups. I just play the game. I don't underestimate ANY character, for I know losing is always a possibility.
There are a bunch of people on the Top 15 list who I totally wipeout against, and if it makes anyone feel better about Ike.....I so FEAR him! His slow movements are EXACTLY what trick me up. I'm used to figthing semi-quick characters, and trying to dodge Ike can end up in fail. Jiggly does not like Ike, for he can kill her.....uh...relatively quickly. >.>
*Sorry for not being around all that much; bright side is, it's almost over (yeah, I'm talking to you finals)! >.>
PEOPLE, I DON'T KNOW WHY I'M #1! YES, I THINK I'M A FAIRLY GOOD PLAYER, BUT #1? ME NO THINK SO!! =/
@Umby: I think that placement is what's giving me soo much hype man. In all honesty, I really don't want it! I greatly appreciate everyone's opinions of me, but I don't feel I live up to all of them.
@one~winged~angel: Hehe, thanks a lot man for your comments concerning my Puff usage, but could you tone it down a bit? I don't want any extra pressure or have to live up to set expectations. ^^ (GO PUFF!!!)
@Minwu: Yeah, I'd say that low tier characters are where they are because of their learning curve as well! That's a good way of putting it. =3
Anyhoo, being placed as #1 still TOTALLY baffles me (are you reading this Dunk....), but I'll do what I can regardless. I totally agree with YK on Skill>Tier. As for characters and such, I play with Lucas and Jiggly because they are the ONLY two characters who I can really groove with. I don't have to FORCE my way into their fighting styles. Listen people, I DON'T research on how to use a character, adv techs or matchups. I just play the game. I don't underestimate ANY character, for I know losing is always a possibility.
There are a bunch of people on the Top 15 list who I totally wipeout against, and if it makes anyone feel better about Ike.....I so FEAR him! His slow movements are EXACTLY what trick me up. I'm used to figthing semi-quick characters, and trying to dodge Ike can end up in fail. Jiggly does not like Ike, for he can kill her.....uh...relatively quickly. >.>
*Sorry for not being around all that much; bright side is, it's almost over (yeah, I'm talking to you finals)! >.>
Technically this is true. If you're playing to win you should use/learn how to use the best character, as doing so maximizes your chances of winning. Simple as that really.
eh, I wouldn't use maku to back that statement up. If he was winning tourneys with jiggly that statement would make sense.... but he's not (neither am I for that matter :P). It is true that some characters are underrated..... though I can't see any of the current low tiers moving up to high tier any time soon (though it may happen in time, who knows).
Minwu didn't say that at all <____>. Of course skill >>>>> tiers... that's common sense.
No projectile, that should be fairly obvious.
But Meta Knight doesn't have a projectile and he's at the top of the top tier.
Or does he just not need one?
Projectiles are definitely advantageous, but most of the time I forget to use them and still come off the winner.
i honestly only find most of the projectiles useful as halts. they dont do enough damage for much else.
He just doesn't need one, never did. Projectiles whether they do much damage or not can immobilize an opponents momentum, whether it's a flury of attack towards you whatever they're doing, and will allow you to get into a position to kill the opponent. Most of the time they just rack up damage over time, which can add up pretty quick in some match ups.
Why is game&watch in the top tier? He is destroyed by links wide range of powerful upward attacks and any character with decent arial capabilities. Also, his pojectile is too awkward to be used well. The bucket and hammer are the only things he has going for him.
What game have you been playing? Link's utilt doesn't destroy G&W considering he can't juggle him with it. His upsmash will only kill if it connects and if G&W is at certain percents, and G&W's game is based on not letting that happen. His uair is predictable and easily evaded.
The bucket and hammer are the only things going for G&W? How about he can spam his bair relentlessly, his dair has high priority and almost no cool down lag, his parachute has good priority and comes out fast, his smashes kill at early percents and the hitboxes linger.
That's only a few of the good things about G&W. Good aerial game doesn't really destroy G&W considering his air game is pretty beast itself.
Links uair is predictable, but only easily evaded considering Game&watch is capable of evasion at the time. His parachute will screw up a landing because of how much it swings. I forgot about dair and it is a fairly usefull move. Hit boxes is predictable. His smashes are only decent. His aerial game is anly good if you don't destroy trying to evade land attacks.
He doesn't need to evade land attacks since his aerials out prioritize a lot, if not all, ground moves. The swing doesn't happen much unless you just let him float down, and he doesn't stay in it long without attacking. All hit boxes can be predictable but that won't stop them from hitting Link. His dsmash is really good coming out quick and sending others at a low trajectory.
I didn't think so, but refering to Marth agian, had he been given a projectile, would he really have a better chance of being Top Tier even if all it did was immobilize an opponent's momentum?
Hit boxes, being predictable, are always evaded by a simple roll. Game&watch has to manage to get into the air before using air moves to out prioritize ground moves. Parachute still leaves him vulnerable. His dsmashes are shield fodder.
G&W only needs to Short Hop his aerials. After that, the aerials come out almost instantly.
Parachute leaves him vulnerable after his invincible start up, after which he can attack.
Dsmash can be spammed easily, as there's low cool down lag.
- Status