The Current ShoddyBattle Metagame

DEL337ED

Yeah I guess stall-teams could fall into strategic teams, but most people I see with it just throw together bliss/skarm/cressy/swampert etc. I watch battles every now and then to get a feel of what people are doing/using, and I'll never forget that MixApe sweep lol. Btw, in that game most of the walls were at 60% or lower (cressy, his only main counter for MixApe was at 20%). It didn't even have to set-up, everything was just being OHKO'd because they were weakened.

I agree that Specs Lucario and Tyraniboah are excellent wall-breakers. I still prefer T-bolt for the Skarm/Bliss coverage, but Ice Beam can help against Hippowdon and Donphan. And STAB Choice specs Aura Sphere even hits Blissey really hard.
 
Kietharr

Kietharr

Choice scarf Machamp is an awesome lead. He can 3HKO even the most defensive swamperts with dynamicpunch, outspeeds and kills nonscarf garchomps and salamences, and can actually take a physical hit or two. The only things that really scare him are Aerodactyl and Yanmega.

As far as the metagame goes, I see shittons of Yanmega and Swampert leads, and tons of CMcresses, nothing pisses me off more than every match turning into a stall war between my blissey or cress and another blissey/cress. Neither of us wants to switch out because it would give the other an advantage, so we keep STing until we're out of PP. Cresselia is just amazingly fucking annoying to kill unless you carry a specialized counter, I'm considering switching out my gyaravire combo in favor of jumzard combo in order to get around her annoying defenses.
 
Burn Jack

Burn Jack

Surgo said:
Substitute/Focus Punch/Ice Beam Tyranitar will destroy almost everything on a stall team (add Crunch or Dark Pulse for Cresselia).
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It seems to do pretty well against anything you care to mention, really. The number of people who seem to have totally forgotten that Tyranitar learns Ice Beam is, frankly, alarming; and also extremely helpful.

Kietharr said:
Cresselia is just amazingly fucking annoying to kill unless you carry a specialized counter
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Sandstorm owns it horribly, mind. It's surprising that so many choose to use Moonlight when there are so many Sandstorm teams running around at the moment.
 

Phatkav

I don't know about you guys, but so far I have been running a pure sweepers team. It has been doing pretty good. I have something like over 30 wins with it so far.

The thing is that the team seems to surprise a lot of people. Most of the times when they get the chance to kill 2-3 sweepers, most of their walls will be weak so that my other 2 sweepers can finish the job easily. And usually only Vaporeon is used to take hits and provide Wish support.

As for leads, I have seen a lot of Ninjask, Bronzong, and the likes of Swampert.
 
Burn Jack

Burn Jack

Ninjask leads are terrible in this world of Stealth Rock. They use Protect on the first turn and then get phazed very quickly by any half-competent player. Ninjask leads need to use Swords Dance on the first turn and hope for the best if they want to do anything useful.
 
Bologo

Bologo

Have fun with birds and bees.
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Burn Jack said:
Ninjask leads are terrible in this world of Stealth Rock. They use Protect on the first turn and then get phazed very quickly by any half-competent player. Ninjask leads need to use Swords Dance on the first turn and hope for the best if they want to do anything useful.
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Not every team has a phazer y'know. Even if they do, it's not usually their lead, so if the user predicts the switch, they can just Swords dance while they're switching to their phazer and Baton Pass. The only phazer I see as a lead, is Swampert and even it rarely has Roar for me.
 

Shiny Crobat

Bologo said:
Not every team has a phazer y'know. Even if they do, it's not usually their lead, so if the user predicts the switch, they can just Swords dance while they're switching to their phazer and Baton Pass. The only phazer I see as a lead, is Swampert and even it rarely has Roar for me.
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If you BP they phaze you anyway, it's just after the bp.
 
Ancien Régime

Ancien Régime

washed gay RSE player
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The thing with stall teams is that a suprise KO on a wall can be devastating.

Suppose the team is Hippowdon, Skarmory, Cresselia, Blissey, Tyranitar, Dusknoir. (IIRC this was Ace777's Shoddy tourney team)

I have Explosion LO Azelf, Mixed Infernape with NP, Flamethower, Nasty Plot, and CC, and Garchomp.

If I were to explode with Azelf on, say, Cresselia, then the team suddenly becomes a lot more vulnerable, as the only pokemon that is not OHKOed immediately is Dusknoir, which is still vulnerable to consistent boosting pounding.

I find that most players in that situation (Cressy v.s Azelf) will go for the para, rather than try to block Explosion.

If Cresselia gets slept, then it becomes vulnerable as well, as assuming it doesn't wake quickly, Infernape can NP on it, Garchomp can SD on it, etc.

In the end, offense will win out, but it will require much smarter play then we have generally seen.
 

oPlaiD

Melodius Trueheart said:
In the end, offense will win out, but it will require much smarter play then we have generally seen.
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I think this statement might be true. I've been running a team I just threw together and win 90% of the battles on Shoddy despite having a few big holes because I simply play better than most people on there. Granted, there are plenty of strong players I've faced quite a few times, but in general the competition is pretty poor. and that sucks; I don't feel like I really get any better when I keep battling most of the time.

I think that makes any perception of a real "metagame" quite skewed. If the people you're facing are not playing their teams correctly or are designing teams with gigantic flaws, if you are a better player with a decent stall team of course you'll win almost every game.

That said, maybe stalling IS better in D/P, but I don't think we'll ever really know until there have been some more tournaments with strong players.
 

CardsOfTheHeart

Hmm, what about a Tangrowth lead? I'm trying to run the numbers on it, but I'm pretty certain that Power Whip will OHKO an Impish Swampert with max. Hp & Def IV/EVs. I don't know about 'Tar yet, though...

Still, the Knock Off set would do well to counter that. And personally, it could satisfy my Gyarados hate...
 

General Tso

Reviving this topic.

So apparently, almost every team I run into carries both Cresselia and Blissey. Bitches to take down seeing as I would think they would be seperated.

In other news, no one really expects me using P2 or Jolly CB Floatzel, both of whom have served me well.
 

ChronoSquare

Personally, I love my Swampert as a lead. People see that and think, "Oh, I know what they're going to do. I'll just switch to my grass user and kill that thing while he SRes up." They switch, I SR. Heh, they think, predictable. And then I absolutely LOVE IT when I wipe the smirk off their face with Rindo Berry + Mirror Coat KOing their pokemon after Rindo weakens the move and allowing me to live. The most common grass moves are Energy Ball, Grass Knot, and HP Grass, all of which are special, and mirror-coat prone. Physical grass moves like a Power whip from Tangroth ruin the fun, but that's what a team's for ;)

I need to incorporate a wisher for him, so he can surprise for another day...
 

ODDish

ChronoSquare said:
Personally, I love my Swampert as a lead. People see that and think, "Oh, I know what they're going to do. I'll just switch to my grass user and kill that thing while he SRes up." They switch, I SR. Heh, they think, predictable. And then I absolutely LOVE IT when I wipe the smirk off their face with Rindo Berry + Mirror Coat KOing their pokemon after Rindo weakens the move and allowing me to live. The most common grass moves are Energy Ball, Grass Knot, and HP Grass, all of which are special, and mirror-coat prone. Physical grass moves like a Power whip from Tangroth ruin the fun, but that's what a team's for ;)

I need to incorporate a wisher for him, so he can surprise for another day...
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Surely it is not going to be much of a surprise now that you've posted your strategy though ... ?
 

Dan Dan

Maybe I don't play enough Shoddy (only like 5 battles a day, I've got a life), but I rarely see Cresselia or Blissey anymore. The Blisseys I do see are usually Aromatherapy/Twave ones, which is great for my team.
 
Endeby

Endeby

General Tso said:
Reviving this topic.

So apparently, almost every team I run into carries both Cresselia and Blissey. Bitches to take down seeing as I would think they would be seperated.

In other news, no one really expects me using P2 or Jolly CB Floatzel, both of whom have served me well.
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You told me that it was your fun team....:pirate:

well one topic: what happened to weavile? i saw alot of them but it looks like theyre gone...which is a good thing because most of my team only got one counter for him.

Also sandstorm team is kinda uncommon...
 

Justice_X

I think my Pika lead is very good. If your opponent is slower than you, you sub. It can inflict massive damage to any Pokemon that isn't Blissey or Regice. Bellyzard is very good too. With shoddy you can test out numerous options for it in a short amount of time.
 

Thunderclasm

I've seen mostly Yanmega's and Swamperts leading, lately. (Though it's been about three days since I've last had the chance to play.) Personally, I've been using a scarf'd Cham, which has worked fairly decently, though I'm building a new team to be more strategy oriented - as was pointed out before, my current team is really just a collection of sweepers and walls. Works well sometimes, but it just isn't making the cut - relies too much on what I'm up against, rather than what I can do independently. Which is precisely what's wrong with such teams, I believe.

Another thing I've noticed on shoddy is what seems to be an abundance of Tangrowths - not as leads, but just on teams in general. Starting to get some more respect for 'em. >_>
 

Dragontamer

I'm noticing more Weather teams... then again, a weather team more or less demolishes my current hail team strategy.

As such, I've been seeing more Ludicolo and Kingdra lately. The (IMO) obvious choice of Rain-Dance floatzel I have not come across yet.

I have also noticed the decline of Weavile. Funny thing is how strong this thing is.

Cresselia / Blissey is massive. Nearly every team has one.
 
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