The Prince of The Sea Makes His Glorious Return...Suspect RMT

[IcyMan28]

Hey everyone, I'm back with another team for rating. I've been playing suspect for about a week now, and have hammered out some of the issues with this team, though there are still a few that remain. So let's get into it - its a wifi team, by the way.

At A Glance

The Team-Building Process​

It goes without saying that Manaphy is the focus of the team. I decided that I'd focus on the Tail Glow sweeper set, thanks to its combination of speed, power, and bulk. It has great STAB, too, which is a bonus. And while I wanted Manaphy to be the focus of my offensive-style team, I didn't want a rain team, so that wouldn't be an issue. My first task was to come up with a list of counters. I settled on Starmie, Latias, Gengar, Blissey, Celebi, Zapdos, Jolteon, and Magnezone as the primary threats, all capable of wielding powerful electric and grass attacks, and of course Blissey who could just sit there and wall (though not for long).

So the mandatory metal bug found its way onto the team. With an EV spread focusing more on special defense than general bulk, it would be able to trap and kill Starmie, Latias, Gengar, and Celebi. Its powerful physical attacks could spell Blissey's demise, while it could simply U-turn out of potential threats like Zapdos and Magnezone. Moreover, it and Manaphy can take grass and fire attacks for each other, respectively. But I needed an Electric resist.

So Flygon, one of my favorite pokemon, found its way onto the team. It could easily take electric attacks aimed at Manaphy and fire attacks aimed at Scizor, while using a U-Turn of its own to flee from ice and dragon attacks. I have both bulk and speed so far, but a revenger never hurts - Scarf Flygon it was, with powerful dual STAB at its disposal.

I realized that I was accumulating sweepers that hit hard from either end of the spectrum, but none of which could break walls without some considerable effort. At first I considered Salamence, but I didn't like the Stealth Rock weakness, and I felt that another Ice weakness could be a liability. I finally settled on Infernape - both of its most commonly preyed on weaknesses are resisted by at least one of my other pokemon, and it kept the offensive momentum with fast, hard-hitting special attacks. And consequently, it had little difficulty luring out the likes of Latias and Starmie, pokemon that could potentially cause Manaphy trouble. Its place was solidified on the team.

I felt that I had reached a happy medium between being able to take on stall and opposing offensive teams, as well as balanced teams. Manaphy and Scizor have the bulk to take hits, while Flygon and Infernape could assert their presence with wall-breaking moves and U-Turn. I could see that I was rapidly building a weakness to SDLuke (seems to happen with many of the teams I make, sadly), and I also felt like some extra insurance against stall could never go wrong. That's how I came to the conclusion of Gliscor, the stallbreaker set. Even better, it made my third U-Turner, and one that has great synergy with my other U-Turners at that, water being the only type that none of the three particularly like. So now all that was left was the lead. I needed a water resist, definitely, and also Stealth Rock. Since many teams rely on gaining the momentum with their leads, I felt that taking them down with ease was crucial. My choice was clear.

Empoleon provides me with the sheer force required to topple other leads, and at the same time gave me a reliable Stealth Rocker. Its bulk allows it to often come back in later in the game and fire off an attack or two before going down, which was a plus. Its effectiveness will be explained shortly.

Empoleon@Chople Berry
Modest; 156 HP / 252 SpA / 100 Spe

Aqua Jet

Grass Knot

Hydro Pump

Stealth Rock

Empoleon is more than capable of dealing with the majority of the Top 10 leads, setting up Stealth Rock as it does so. The speed EVs allow it to outpace the likes of Metagross, while the HP EVs give it considerable bulk. Maximum special attack allow it to punish foes with its Hydro Pump or Grass Knot. Because of its natural bulk, the only way it can be OHKOd by the top ten leads are with fighting attacks, making the Focus Sash redundant, and the Chople Berry ideal.

Top Ten Leads
Here is a list of how Empoleon fares against the Top 10 leads. Names in Green indicate a win, leads in Orange indicate troublesome pokemon, and leads in Red are highly problematic.

• 
  Azelf: Empoleon has little difficulty here, as well. If it taunts, it is knocked out by Hydro Pump + Aqua Jet, letting Empoleon live to fight another day and preventing their Stealth Rock. Should they set up rocks, the same outcome results, but they get rocks up.
  
• 
  Metagross: Empoleon generally wins here, forcing the opponent to pick their poison. Should they set up Stealth Rock first, they are succinctly 2HKOd by a powerful Hydro Pump. If they Earthquake, Empoleon is reduced to Torrent range, causing Hydro Pump to reach upwards of 85% damage, and then being picked off by Aqua Jet.
  
• 
  Swampert: Easy for Empoleon to deal with. It OHKOs with Grass Knot over 55% of the time, meaning that Swampert takes a large risk if it decides to stay in. I can easily set up Stealth Rock after the kill.
  
• 
  Aerodactyl: Yet another victory. They know they will lose, so they set up rocks immediately and are killed by Hydro Pump + Aqua Jet. No issues here.
  
• 
  Jirachi: Annoying, as usual. Trick means that I can either choose to 2HKO with Hydro Pump, or go for the Rocks immediately. I usually choose the latter.
  
• 
  Infernape: Destroyed. Fake Out doesn't concern me, as I don't have a Sash anyway. Instead, the Chople Berry allows me to take the CC that follows, blast it with a Hydro Pump, and pick it off with priority of my own - Aqua Jet.
  
• 
  Roserade: Very annoying, only because it puts Empoleon to sleep - not before I break its sash with Aqua Jet, though. Toxic Spikes are more of an issue for Infernape than anyone else, as they resist or are immune (save Manaphy, but it has leftovers). Usually, I'll just go to Infernape to pick it off with Fire Blast, Scizor to Bullet Punch, or Gliscor for Taunt.
  
• 
  Heatran: Easily KOd by Hydro Pump, while it fails to KO back with Earth Power.
  
• 
  Smeargle: Annoying as usual. It often carries Spore regardless of Sash or Scarf, so Aqua Jet is the way to go, then react accordingly.
  
• 
  Hippowdon: Hydro Pump makes it all to easy to deal with, as it can't OHKO with Earthquake.

Gliscor@Leftovers
Jolly; 252 HP / 40 Atk / 216 Spe

Taunt

Roost

U-Turn

Earthquake

Stallbreaker Gliscor with a few attack EVs for good measure. It keeps the momentum flowing with its U-Turn, and has reliable recovery in the form of Roost. Earthquake is strong and staple as always, while Taunt decimates stall with little difficulty. It is my only fighting resist, although it does provide a secondary electric immunity for Manaphy and Empoleon. Speaking of, it has perfect synergy with Empoleon, the two resisting each of the other's attacks perfectly. It stands in the way of Lucario and Tyranitar, and has proved useful to me so far.

Infernape@Life Orb
Timid; 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

Nasty Plot

Grass Knot

Focus Blast

Flamethrower

Infernape finds itself on the team due to its ability to break walls wide open. This is the classic set, with Focus Blast over Close Combat, and it really doesn't need too much explanation. The real utility of Infernape lies in its ability to lure out Latias, Gengar, Starmie, Jolteon...and similar pokemon that are checks to Manaphy. In the case of the first three, Scizor becomes an excellent choice, Pursuing them all to their graves. Jolteon can be dealth with by Scarf Flygon. With Focus Blast in its aresenal, Infernape is capable of OHKOing Manaphy and Vaporeon in addition to those things that it already KOs with Close Combat, while Grass Knot provides more reliable damage versus the likes of Swampert and Suicune.

Flygon@Choice Scarf
Jolly; 6 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

U-Turn

Outrage

Earthquake

Stone Edge

A fast revenge killer is always an asset to have on the team, and Flygon is no exception. Its excellent dual stabs allow it to inflict hefty damage on pokemon that may switch in, and potentially sweep late-game. U-Turn is great for scouting, and i find myself using it often alongside Gliscor and Scizor. Because Skarmory isn't an issue for Manaphy or Infernape, Stone Edge gets the nod of Fire Blast / Punch, as it allows me to revenge Gyarados and Zapdos without needing to rely on Outrage. Jolly is necessary to revenge the few boosted Salamence that don't run max speed, and to force a speed tie with those that due (luring it into outrage in the process). An added benefit to using Flygon is its resistance or immunity to all three variations of entry hazards, which is huge, since it switches in and out quite often. A valuable asset for any team.

Scizor@Choice Band
Adamant; 152 HP / 196 Atk / 160 SpD

U-Turn

Pursuit

Superpower

Bullet Punch

The typical CB Scizor, with a more specially defensive spread. It still allows Scizor to OHKO a fleeing Latias with Pursuit, but that same Latias has a mere .33% chance of 2HKOing Scizor with Thunderbolt, even if it holds a Life Orb. This allows Scizor to come in more easily to support Manaphy, although Gengar is more problematic. As per usual, U-Turn is the main move used here, while Bullet Punch helps me revenge the likes of DDMence.

Manaphy@Leftovers
Timid; 6 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

Surf

Tail Glow

Ice Beam

HP Electric

Manaphy is the team's core, the star, the leader. The other members work to make sure that Manaphy can sweep by eliminating the things that threaten it, and then Manaphy can take care of the rest. Leftovers provide it with much more bulk than a LO version would, which compliments its typing and defenses. Surf, TG, and Ice Beam are self explanatory, the latter removing the likes of Celebi and Zapdos with ease. HP Electric was chosen over Grass Knot or Energy Ball because it provides the best coverage, OHKOing Gyarados like Grass Knot would, but still 2HKOing opposing Manaphy like Energy Ball would accomplish. However, I am considering using an alternative EV spread of 252 HP / 80 SpA / 176 Spe. The additional bulk prevents Specs Latias from checking me with Draco Meteor, while I don't seem to lose any significant KOs. More testing will be required, I guess.

Miscellaneous​

• Entry hazards are not too much of a concern for the team. 2 of my 6 pokemon resist it, and the other 4 take neutral damage. Toxic Spikes only affect 2 of my 6 pokemon, while spikes doesn't affect 2 of them.

• The team has a good combination between bulk and speed, while all of the pokemon can hit relatively hard (except for maybe Gliscor, but its more utility than anything else).
• While I feel that I have the large majority of threats covered, I might be a bit underprepared against Manaphy. Although I've generally been able to deal with it thanks to my own Manaphy and Scarf Flygon, I'm concerned about whether or not I need an extra check.
• Credit goes to http://www.serebiiforums.com for the front sprites and PMD headshots, while http://www.gtsplus.net gets the credit for the sugimori are and type signs.

 

[IcyMan28]

The threats below are those that are prominent in the metagame, and thus need to be accounted for in some way. Again, non issue pokemon will be Green, pokemon that are minor to moderate issues will be in Orange, and highly problematic pokemon will be highlighted in Red.

Offensive Threats

Azelf is not that big of an issue for the team at all. Since they are normally in the lead position, they are easily killed by my Empoleon. Sweeper Azelf are taken down with Aqua Jet, Bullet Punch, or ScarfGon.

Breloom is often an issue because of the mere fact that is uses sleep tactics. However, once a pokemon has been put to sleep, it can be dealt with by Gliscor or Scizor's Bullet Punch. If it lacks a sub, Manaphy's Ice Beam and Infernape's Flamethrower work as well.

Celebi can be dealt with quite easily by the team. 3 U-Turners mean that it has multiple opportunities to be hit hard...Infernape has Flamethrower, and Manaphy's boosted Ice Beams really hurt it. Empoleon is really the only thing it comes in on with impunity. Meanwhile, Infernape and Scizor take its Grass attacks for the kill.

Dugtrio, while it can't be countered, has difficulty switching in. It can't trap Flygon or Gliscor (Latias), is weak to Empoleon and Manaphy, and takes loads of damage from any of Scizor's attacks. Infernape is all that it can come in on for the revenge kill. Not a big deal.

Electivire has no electric attacks to switch in on, save Manaphy's HP Electric. Thus, it is outsped and killed by Infernape, Manaphy, and Flygon (regardless of a motor drive boost. Gliscor also outspeeds neutral speed versions, such as mixed and Adamant Electivire.

Empoleon can be a bit of an issue with its SubPetaya set. Although U-Turn generally allows me to gain the advantage against it, it can outspeed much of my team and wreak havoc. My own Empoleon and Manaphy's HP Electric are typically all that stand in the way of a sweep. However, ScarfFlygon is capable of outspeeding even after an Agility and KOing it with Earthquake.

Flygon is not too much of an issue, to be honest. With its bulk, Gliscor can often lure it into an Outrage, allowing Empoleon or Scizor to revenge it with Bullet Punch or Hydro Pump. My own ScarfGon kills all but opposing Jolly ScarfGon, which force a speed tie. Manaphy does well with it, too, blasting it with an Ice Beam. STAB Outrage can only manage so much, when its all said and done.

Gengar is and has always been an issue. Fortunately, I have my ways around it. It is devastated by Flygon's Outrage, and even takes hefty damage from Stone Edge. Scizor's Bullet Punch and Empoleon's Aqua Jet prove troublesome for it, too.

Gliscor is definitely a non-issue. Offensive Gliscor lacking Ice Fang are actually walled by Flygon, while Manaphy can deal with any other version thanks to its water-type STAB. It doesn't like powerful special attacks from Infernape, either.

Gyarados doesn't cause too many issues, surprisingly. Manaphy's HP Electric is devastating, and Flygon can revenge boosted Gyara with Stone Edge. Infernape's NP-boosted Grass Knot presents it some issues as well, especially when combined with Stealth Rock.

Heatran is generally easy to deal with. Manaphy and Empoleon can take on its hits and fire back with super effective attacks. Manaphy, Infernape, and Gliscor outspeed slow versions, while Flygon deals with speedy ScarfTran.

Heracross can be handled by Gliscor, on the rare occasion that I should meet one. Infernape and Flygon do a number on it with their powerful attacks, and Scizor's Bullet Punch hurts it too. It is generally too slow to do anything to much of my team if it lacks a scarf.

Infernape is very versatile...so it can be tricky to deal with. Flygon outspeeds non-scarf versions, while those that do carry a scarf are handled pretty well by Manaphy. Despite the resistance, Scizor's Bullet Punch still does significant damage to Infernape, not to mention Empoleon's Aqua Jet. LeadApe are also killed by Empoleon.

Jirachi, too, is versatile - but it can be dealt with. CM versions with Flash Cannon can be stopped by Infernape, while Scizor can use its much bulkier SpD spread to U-turn if it needs to break a sub, going to Flygon or Infernape. Scarf versions can be easily played around due to the weak base power of the moves, as well as several steel-resistant team members.

Kingdra is problematic. Although Empoleon fares decently against it, I often find myself relying on the ability to stall out the rain so that I can outspeed and kill it. Manaphy can take an Outrage and fire back an Ice Beam if necessary. I feel that if I replaced Gliscor, I could use Latias to deal with it as well, provided that rain isn't falling.

Latias has become a staple of many teams, and I am even considering it on mine. It is, however, dealt with. Scizor can trap and kill those Latias that don't carry HP-Fire, and Flygon outpaces Scarfless Latias. Manaphy's Ice Beam can catch it on the switch, though Recover remedies that. A Latias of my own could potentially help to check it as well.

Lucario falls prey to Gliscor's superior speed and its ground typing, eliminating it. Everything besides Empoleon and Scizor outspeed it, and the both of them have priority that can severely dent it while resisting its Extremespeed.

Machamp is annoying with that dynamicpunch, but Gliscor can deal with that. It has difficulty switching in, as all of my pokemon can either hit it hard or U-Turn to something that can.

Magnezone isn't all that threatening at all. Scarf Magnezone won't like to meet Gliscor's Electric immunity (or Latias's resist if I choose to incorporate it), and it can't take powerful Hydro Pumps from Empoleon. Scizor U-Turns out to ScarfGon for the kill with Earthquake.

Mamoswine is somewhat more difficult to deal with as switching in can be a task. Otherwise, everything bar Flygon and Gliscor can punish it, especially Scizor and Infernape.

Metagross is renowned for its bulk, but even that can't save it from the team. Gliscor, Flygon, and Infernape all sport supereffective attacks, while Empoleon and Manaphy fire off powerful water assaults. Lead Metagross are soundly dealt with by Empoleon, while sweeping Metagross must choose either Ice Punch for Gliscor or Thunderpunch for Manaphy.

Ninjask doesn't fare too well in this metagame, for good reason. Scizor's Bullet Punch and Empoleon's Aqua Jet haunt it, especially the former. Stealth Rock...punishes it to say the least, should it try to come in mid game in an attempt to not instantly reveal the team's strategy.

Porygon-Z is dealt with by priority and faster pokemon...which would include all of the pokemon in my team. Normal attacks go to Empoleon and Scizor, who can then strike back powerfully. It doesn't really have too many switch-in opportunities, to be honest, thanks to low defenses.

Rhyperior finds itself in a similar situation. Every one of my pokemon carries attacks that are supereffective against it, most notably Manaphy, Empoleon, and Infernape, who attack from the special end of the spectrum.

Roserade, as stated above, isn't really a loss or a win. Sweeper Roserade must rely on grass and poison attacks as their primary method of offense, and their frailty leaves them prone to status. Infernape and Manaphy have no problem outpacing non-scaved versions, while Flygon could care less. So while it generally is successful as a lead, it doesn't fare so well against the rest of the team.

Rotom-A overwhelmingly presents itself in its Heat form, so Flygon makes a fine choice for absorbing fire and electric attacks. Without a Scarf, it falls to boosted attacks from Manaphy and Infernape. And because this is a wifi team, it won't be something that I need to deal with at all.

Salamence isn't something that can easily be dealt with. Ascertaining the set is often key, so I go to Empoleon first, getting in a light hit with Aqua Jet on DD versions and taking Draco Meteor from MixMence. ScarfFlygon can force a speed tie and lure it into Outrage, which allows me to follow up by going to Scizor for Bullet Punch. Stealth Rock plays a big part in checking this.

Scizor usually spends its time U-Turning, so going to a resist is often the best bet. Manaphy, Empoleon, Infernape, Gliscor, and Scizor itself are all good candidates.

Snorlax isn't something I come across too often. Offensive versions usually hold a Choice Band, it seems, so Empoleon takes the mandatory normal attack. After that, its a matter of outspeeding and killing it, which I usually do with Infernape or Gliscor.

Starmie is fast and hits pretty hard, as far as LO and Scarf versions are concerned. Scizor's Pursuit helps here against scarf versions, and Flygon can outpace LO versions. Manaphy can take LO Thunderbolt pretty well actually, and strike back with HP Electric.

Suicune has more bulk than power; it takes a while for it to start hitting to hard to handle. Crocune is often taunted by Gliscor, who I am willing to Sacrifice so that Manaphy can come in and begin to boost up for the eventual kill. CM + 3 Attacks and Subcune are much less bulky, and can be hit hard by Grass Knots and HP Electric. The things it likes to switch in on all carry U-Turn, meaning that it really doesn't have too easy of a time coming in.

Togekiss is pretty slow...so Thunder Wave is almost required on it. Gliscor can outpace and Taunt it before U-Turning to something like Manaphy or Flygon, who can KO with SE attacks.

Tyranitar is also powerful, but I have several checks in place. All of my pokemon can hit it super effectively, with Gliscor getting special mention for its bulk, Roost, and STAB Earthquake to hit it on the weaker defense.

Weavile can easily be handled by Bullet Punch. It only has Brick Break against Infernape, really, and Manaphy can take a Night Slash. Stealth Rock shaves off a nice 25% of its HP, as well.

Yanmega is often more dangerous when it has tinted lens + specs, IMO. Fortunately, Empoleon's Aqua Jet and Scizor's Bullet Punch do significant damage on Speed Boost versions. Flygon and Manaphy can deal with those that don't have Speed Boost, and Infernape can come in on Tinted Bug Buzz...though it is risky.

Zapdos of the offensive variety don't really have the means to take down Flygon, as they typically run HP Grass for Swampert. Speaking of, the dragon can use Stone Edge along with Stealth Rock to deal with it, and Manaphy's boosted Ice Beam does significant damage. Infernape's Flamethrower hurts, too.

Defensive Threats

Blissey presents little issues to the team. Scizor and Flygon's U-Turn keep the pressure on, while Infernape can rip through it with ease. Seismic Toss is an inefficient means of defeating Manaphy, meaning that it can TG up if necessary to 2HKO with Surf.

Bronzong, too, is dealt with quite simply. It can't take strong water attacks, and Flygon and Gliscor can U-Turn to a pokemon that can deal damage to it. Lack of recovery puts it on a timer, as well.

Celebi is often hailed as one of the premier defensive pokemon in the game, but its prospects are less than stellar at best. 3 U-Turners are an issue for it, hurting it and removing those that choose to Leech Seed. Infernape and Manaphy have powerful supereffective attacks too, so Celebi won't wall much of anything for long.

Cradily is rarely seen, even less so outside of Sand, but it can be dealt with. Scizor's Bullet Punch is a great choice against it, as is U-Turn (I mention this move quite a bit). Infernape's Focus Blast is a powerful STAB move that decimates it, and Taunt by Gliscor prevents Recovery or Stockpile.

Cresselia, despite its excellent HP and defensive stats, merely sits there and takes hits until its time is up, unfortunately. It poses little, if any, threat to Manaphy, and flees at the prospect of Scizor's Pursuit / U-Turn mindgame.

Crobat is fast, but it doesn't take hits well enough to outstall the team. Empoleon's Hydro Pump is a great tool against it, as are Flygon's Stone Edge and Manaphy's Ice Beam. Scizor's Bullet Punch is a useful tool against it as well.

Donphan has made a new home for itself in UU, so I've been seeing less and less of these. It really fails to do anything to Infernape or my water types, and Gliscor can alternate between Earthquake and Roost to take it down, as its Ice Shard does pitiful damage.

Drapion, too, is rarely seen. It can't take any unresisted special attacks from the likes of Empoleon and Infernape, and quickly succumbs to Flygon and Gliscor's STAB Earthquakes.

Dusknoir's lack of reliable recovery hurts it here, as well. Infernape can use it as setup fodder if it lacks Earthquake, then blast it with Fire Blast. Manaphy can do the same, though it needs to be wary of Thunderpunch.

Empoleon on the defensive are much less threatening than offensive versions. They are quite vulnerable to the physical attackers on my team, unable to sustain repeated damage from Earthquake and Focus Blast.

Forretress's lack of recovery is the main reason why it fails to wall the team. The fact that all 3 physical attackers have U-Turn means that getting in a special attacker in one motion is quite easy, and it means bad news for Forretress. Moreover, it holds little offensive presence other than Explosion.

Gliscor can be dealt with by Manaphy with ease, since it is outsped. It is surprisingly sturdy, though it definitely cannot take Infernape's Flamethrower- it does severe damage even without a boost.

Gyarados is another offensive threat turned defensive. Fortunately, Manaphy's HP Electric allows me to bypass it, and Gliscor's Taunt prevents it from resting. Stealth Rock helps, as usual.

Hariyama, though rarely seen, is surprisingly effective at dealing with the team. Thick Fat means that Infernape's fire attacks can't bypass its defenses, and its access to all three punches makes my choice a difficult one. However, Empoleon and Manaphy can often break through it with powerful water moves.

Heatran fares even worse defensively than it does offensively, because it loses much of its punch. It retains that 4x weakness to EQ, though, while Focus Blast and water attacks still give it a headache.

Hippowdon is also relatively easy to deal with. Gliscor can Taunt it then chip away at its health with Earthquake. If I want a more direct approach, I go to Empoleon or Manaphy, the former of which often takes it on as a lead.

Jirachi, defensively speaking, isn't too much of an issue to deal with, the only problem being paralysis. Hitting it with powerful attacks, or ground moves, generally works best.

Latias can be quite the nuisance defensively, thanks to its typing and bulk. If it lacks HP Fire, Scizor can deal with it well, and ScarfGon can take it on relatively well, too. Manaphy is much less threatened by it, as well, allowing it to TG up and kill with Ice Beam.

Ludicolo is an annoying niche counter to Manaphy, unless I opted for Signal Beam or something. However, that is the extent of its success - U-Turns from my physical attackers, notably Scizor, is often the key to victory.

Machamp finds itself on the list thanks to its bulk, but it also has decent power if it is a Guts ResTalk set. Fortunately, its coverage is limited...as is its likelihood of attacking. Hitting it with Infernape's Focus Blast or Empoleon's Hydro Pump is often best, usually the latter as it is more expendable once it is done with its work in the lead slot.

Magnezone on the defensive is usually the Sub set, meaning that it will often fall to Gliscor or Flygon. Once the sub is broken, I can simply choose which of the two I want to use to take it down.

Mesprit has nice all around bulk and access to a variety of moves. Unfortunately, its Psychic typing lets it down. It can be easily outsped and killed by Manaphy, or, even worse, Pursued by Scizor. It, too, hates U-Turn. I'm not sure why more people don't use it though, as it can provide a nice check to Gyara and Mence at the same time. *Shrugs*

Metagross often finds itself in the lead position, and defensive versions seem to emphasize the physical side. That said, the use of Manaphy and Empoleon's water attacks, as well as Infernape's Fire, is key. Moreover, defensive versions can often be messed with by Gliscor thanks to Taunt and Roost.

Milotic has fallen out of favor, and for good reason - it can't really take physical hits unless Marvel Scale is activated. Milotic won't like taking hits from any of my special sweepers, and even my physical ones have high base power STAB attacks to deal with the siren.

Miltank is not something I've come across yet. Thick fat would be useful, except that Infernape gets Focus Blast anyway. It can't do too much to Manaphy outside of Thunderpunch, which is still relatively weak coming off of base 80 attack and unSTABed.

Porygon2 is a niche pokemon who doesn't have too much business trying to wall this team. I guess it could Trace Levitate as it comes in on Flygon's Earthquake, but that's about it. It gets hit too hard otherwise to effectively wall.

Regirock makes most of its appearances in Sand, but even then it can be dealt with. Manaphy can simply rip through it with boosted Surf, while Gliscor's Taunt + EQ is always helpful. Scizor's Bullet Punch is quite useful too.

Registeel would be a great defensive pokemon if it had some useable recovery move. Unfortunately, that isn't the case, and it's pure steel typing means that it takes plenty of damage from Ground and Fighting moves, not to mention NP-boosted Flamethrower or Focus Blast.

Rhyperior has excellent defense, and an even better addition in the form of Solid Rock. Unfortunately, that is easy to bypass with strong Water and Grass attacks on its weaker defense. U-Turning to Empoleon as it comes in is usually the best way to deal.

Rotom-A can be an issue. Infernape's Flamethrower and Manaphy's TG Surf are my best answers to it, but both require some form of boost to KO. Fortunately, this is a wifi team, not shoddy (despite my use of it for testing).

Salamence I feel is much easier to deal with when it is more bulkily built. Manaphy can now be sure to outspeed, and the same goes for Flygon. Stealth Rock hurts it as well, forcing it to waste a turn Roosting if it wants to remain a relevant defensive threat.

Scizor are not really played defensively...they're just bulky (and mostly on the physical side). Water and Fire attacks prove useful on it, although it usually U-Turns anyway.

Shaymin is like Celebi, though it doesn't share the Pursuit weak. Regardless, U-Turn is a big way for me to deal with it, as are Fire Blast and Ice Beam. And without reliable recovery, my task is made easier.

Shuckle succumbs to Bullet Punch, Taunt, Stone Edge, Hydro Pump, and TG Surf like no other.

Skarmory would be a problem for me if I didn't have such great special attackers. Infernape, Manaphy, and Empoleon all deal with it, while my physical attackers merely U-Turn to said pokemon when necessary. Specially defensive Skarmory is useless as well.

Slaking isn't something I've battled yet, honestly. Truant is to be exploited, naturally, and Gliscor has the defense to take a hit or two, Roosting off the damage on the loafing turn. Slaking's special defense isn't all that great either.

Slowbro hates U-Turn, especially when it is followed by a switch to Scizor or Manaphy, both of which can strike with SE attacks.

Snorlax can have its special defense bypassed by attacking its physical defense. Gliscor prevents its instant recovery with Taunt, Infernape beats it down with Focus Blast, etc. Offensive versions are more threatening, IMO. Curselax is also stopped by Taunt.

Spiritomb has no weaknesses, but isn't thrilled to take high-powered attacks, nor does it strike back too powerfully. Taunt, U-Turn, and Infernape (thanks to its Will-o-wisp immunity) break it.

Starmie tend to run Rapid Spin and some HP / Def EVs on their defensive sets, making Scizor the prime candidate for the job. Because it doesn't hit as hard, Flygon's U-Turn to Manaphy can help to finish it off with less risk of damage to myself.

Suicune is, in my opinion, the epitome of a defensive pokemon, and can often bring offense to a screeching halt with its bulk. I find myself often sacrificing Gliscor for Taunt so that I can set up Manaphy or Empoleon, who strike with Grass Knot or boosted HP Electric. Infernape can Grass Knot in a pinch, and Scizor's U-Turn helps to dent it bit by bit.

Swampert finds itself on more and more teams these days thanks to its combination of bulk, power, and typing. Unfortunately, it isn't nearly as adept at taking special attacks, and I oftentimes pick it off in the early stages of the match with Empoleon's Grass Knot. It has little impact on Manaphy's ability to sweep regardless, so it's a non-issue.

Tentacruel also lacks recovery, and usually it wastes its HP trying to lay the semi-effective (against my team) Toxic Spikes. Earthquake is highly effective against it, and Manaphy can use it to set itself up.

Togekiss has lower defense than special defense, so focusing on that is key. However, super effective and boosted special attacks can still do harsh damage, so I often find Manaphy taking it on with TG and Ice Beam.

Tyranitar usually focuses on HP and SpD when played defensively so as to better deal with the likes of Latias, Starmie, and Gengar, so exploiting those physical weaknesses is the best way to take it down. Fortunately, all of my physical attackers have supereffective STAB attacks for it. Moreover, Gliscor has Roost to buy itself a Rock resist and to restore any damage it may take.

Umbreon has great defensive stats and wish, but it can't deal with stat boosters too well. Scizor preys on its lower defense with U-Turn, while Infernape uses Focus Blast to put it out of commission. Umbreon, as bulky as it may be, cannot take TG boosted Surfs repeatedly, and fails to create an offensive presence with Curse due to Gliscor's Taunt.

Vaporeon, on the other hand, uses its superior defensive typing and moves to more effectively take on my team. It is a surefire counter to Mixape (although it takes 70% from a boosted Grass Knot), but the damage it takes in the process can be exploited by Empoleon to complete the kill. Usually, Scizor's U-Turn can dent it pretty severely, while Manaphy can power up with Tail Glow before ending it with HP Electric. Sadly for it, Infernape's boosted Focus Blast is a quick OHKO.

Walrein can't wall too much outside of Hail, a problem amplified by its Stealth Rock weakness. It dislikes Empoleon's Grass Knot, Flygon's Stone Edge, or Manaphy's boosted HP Electric, and crumbles under the force of Scizor's Superpower. Furthermore, it isn't too common to begin with.

Weezing isn't too common either, its lack of a viable recovery move and its low special defense relegating it to the UU tier. While Scizor, Gliscor, and Flygon don't have too much fun with it, Empoleon, Manaphy, and Infernape don't care about it, and merely continue with what they were doing.

Zapdos can be an issue when it is defensive. As it stands, Flygon isn't even guaranteed to OHKO offensive versions with Stone Edge following Stealth Rock, and defensive versions are that much more bulky. It fares well against Gliscor and Scizor, so it falls to my special attackers to deal with it. Infernape can Flamethrower it to allow Manaphy to Ice Beam, and if Empoleon survived the lead match well, it can take a Thunderbolt and strike back with Hydro Pump or Aqua Jet. Naturally, 308 speed defensive Zapdos are much easier to deal with due to the considerably lower investment in defense.

 

[Wharz0r]

Hey icy, nice team you have got....i would only ask this one question...Why draco Meteor on Life orb Latias? Dragon pulse is overall better on LO set, as you can, after KOing something, KO another something with another move, i know Draco Meteor sheer power is just plain awesome, and we all get boners when we see something switching and dying to it, but consider pulse, you dont have to worry about that -2 SpA.

btw, luke cant come into latias, as he will be utteraly damaged by Tbolt or Surf and his sweep will be hindred, which later can be fully stopped by Flygon or Scizor bullet punch

My 2 and a half cents

 

[IcyMan28]

Hey icy, nice team you have got....i would only ask this one question...Why draco Meteor on Life orb Latias? Dragon pulse is overall better on LO set, as you can, after KOing something, KO another something with another move, i know Draco Meteor sheer power is just plain awesome, and we all get boners when we see something switching and dying to it, but consider pulse, you dont have to worry about that -2 SpA.

btw, luke cant come into latias, as he will be utteraly damaged by Tbolt or Surf and his sweep will be hindred, which later can be fully stopped by Flygon or Scizor bullet punch

My 2 and a half cents

I appreciate the input.

As far as Latias goes, it is still merely an option that I am considering, and Draco Meteor provides the immediate power needed to soften up the opponents early game. I will definitely consider Dragon Pulse over Draco Meteor or even Recover.

And while Luke can't come into Latias, the issue is dealing with Luke that are already set up. Though it has difficulty setting up, it can do significant damage with its Extremespeed - never a good thing.

 

[panamaxis]

I like how you've put in a lot of effort for this RMT, nice job.

Okay so Infernape, Focus Blast is a better option then grass knot in this metagame, OHKOing manaphy and vaporeon, which grass knot fails to do. If you use focus blast you are probably better off replacing close combat with vaccuum wave to help deal with offense more (scarftar, dd tar, lucario, revenging other infernapes), although if this doesn't appeal to you dropping close combat for focus blast and keeping grass knot is okay too. Obviously with this change you would drop the attack EVs on infernape. However, sweeping with two moves with less then perfect accuracy isn't really my cup of tea so maybe you could run flamethrower instead of fire blast?

That's about it, good luck with the team.

 

[IcyMan28]

^Thanks, I appreciate it! Now onto the rate...

I'll give some consideration to Focus Blast over Grass Knot for the reasons stated, but I'm not too convinced yet on Vaccuum Wave > Close Combat. As it stands, I already have 2 priority users and a Scarved revenge killer, so I'm not sure if the added priority will be necessary in the end. Flamethrower over Fire Blast is another option, since I agree about sweeping with 2 less than accurate priority moves. This way, I can keep the security of Flamethrower, have the benefit of Grass Knot for the likes of Suicune, and Gyarados, and then use Focus Blast for Vappy, Blissey, and Manaphy.

Nasty Plot / Flamethrower / Focus Blast / Grass Knot.

I'd like a second opinion on the suggestion, however, before I test it out.

 

[haunter]

Tbh, I see no reasons to not run a physical Infernape, the only Pokemon that may cause it troubles are Hippowdon and Gliscor, and you have them quite covered with Manaphy and Latias, if you decide to add it (which I suggest). With a set of: swords dance, close combat, stone edge, fire punch - jolly, 252 Atk\ 4 Def\ 252 Spe, you can still sweep quite effectively and will comfortably deal with Manaphy as a max Atk close combat will always 2hko it (meaning that if it comes in on a SD it's a goner). You're still walled by Latias, but with Scizor on your team that shouldn't be such a problem.

You might also opt for fire blast over fire punch, in this case I suggest an EV spread of: 252 Atk\ 60 SpA\ 196 Spe with a naive nature. Fire blast will take care of the aforementioned walls better than fire punch, without hindering your physical sweeping ability.

As stated above I'd also implement Latias on this team, as it would serve as an insurance against opposing Infernape while providing another strong special sweeper, and a check to Manaphy. I wouldn't replace Glsicor though, as it's your only hope against Lucario, should it set up on a pursuit locked Scizor. I'd rather replace Flygon, or Empoleon (moving Gliscor as your lead, with SR over u-turn).

Just some thoughts, good luck with your team.

 

[IcyMan28]

I've taken into consideration both pieces of advice, and I think I'll go with Panamaxis' suggestion of Focus Blast over CC on Infernape, since it OHKOs both Vaporeon and Manaphy (and Blissey too). I feel that Flygon already provides me with a check against opposing Infernape, and Manaphy and Infernape provide excellent special attackers already. Additionally, I don't like that fact that Latias often finds itself as little more than Pursuit bait :(

Thanks for the advice everyone - I'm pleased with where the team is at and will update if I want further assistance.

 

[Cooltrainer]

You've got a very offensive team with a bit of bulk. I like that. However, this bulk only works against the neutral attacks. Sure, Scizor and Flygon, both bulky, as well as Manaphy and Gliscor can take the neutral Close combats .. once. But when a super effective move is thrown at them, they go down. I'm not going to suggest a revamp - if this is your style, then so be it.

But if you ever happen to use HP electric on a gyarados (which I assume is one of the main reasons its there) from Manaphy - then you're looking at an Electivire sweep Koing your entire team with Thunderbolt/Earthquake/Flamethrower/Icepunch/hpice.
Specs Latias (or any other solid 300+ stat poke) will deal immense damage to Scizor. I like the sp def investment, but over time it will deplete your health (unless you pursuit, but then you're open to that Lucario weakness mentioned before).

Again, I don't mean to downgrade your team, I just dont like that you consider a 252/252 Flygon a "check" to Infernape. It can't take all that much, especially without recovery. That, like the bulk of your team, cannot.

 

[Vapor Trails]

Infernape@Life Orb
Naive; 62 Atk / 252 SpA / 192 Spe

Fire Blast

Nasty Plot

Grass Knot

Focus Blast

With Focus Blast in its aresenal, Infernape is capable of OHKOing Manaphy and Vaporeon in addition to those things that it already KOs with Close Combat, while Grass Knot provides more reliable damage versus the likes of Swampert and Suicune.

I don't think the description stated above fits with the actual stats.
You have no physical moves, yet there are Atk EV's anyway.
Flamethrower is better than Fire Blast, due to the better reliability.
You might want to go with these EV's, if you want to keep eveything else the same.
4 Atk (useless dump of extra Ev's) / 252 Sp.Atk / 252 Speed.
Nasty Plot might be better served by Hidden Power [Ice], since you, according to the description, will be switching out a lot.
Ohterwise, 7/10 team overall.

 

[IcyMan28]

You've got a very offensive team with a bit of bulk. I like that. However, this bulk only works against the neutral attacks. Sure, Scizor and Flygon, both bulky, as well as Manaphy and Gliscor can take the neutral Close combats .. once. But when a super effective move is thrown at them, they go down. I'm not going to suggest a revamp - if this is your style, then so be it.

But if you ever happen to use HP electric on a gyarados (which I assume is one of the main reasons its there) from Manaphy - then you're looking at an Electivire sweep Koing your entire team with Thunderbolt/Earthquake/Flamethrower/Icepunch/hpice.
Specs Latias (or any other solid 300+ stat poke) will deal immense damage to Scizor. I like the sp def investment, but over time it will deplete your health (unless you pursuit, but then you're open to that Lucario weakness mentioned before).

Electivire is still pretty much a non-issue...I don't fight too many of them anyway, and they can't outspeed Flygon regardless of nature or EVs. Their weak defense leaves them susceptible to priority by Empoleon and even Scizor, and without a speed boost everything bar the former two pokemon outspeed it. The Lucario weak is dealt with by Gliscor...

Again, I don't mean to downgrade your team, I just dont like that you consider a 252/252 Flygon a "check" to Infernape. It can't take all that much, especially without recovery. That, like the bulk of your team, cannot.

I'm questioning your understanding of the word check...it doesn't have to be able to switch in, but it should pose some level of threat to force it out afterward. See "Latias checks Salamence," etc. Flygon can come in on SD or NP, and outspeed for the kill with EQ. It resists fire attacks, too. ScarfNape can't deal with Manaphy since they lack the power to do so.

I don't think the description stated above fits with the actual stats.
You have no physical moves, yet there are Atk EV's anyway.
Flamethrower is better than Fire Blast, due to the better reliability.
You might want to go with these EV's, if you want to keep eveything else the same.
4 Atk (useless dump of extra Ev's) / 252 Sp.Atk / 252 Speed.
Nasty Plot might be better served by Hidden Power [Ice], since you, according to the description, will be switching out a lot.
Ohterwise, 7/10 team overall.

My apologies - I forgot to edit the actual moves and EVs when I incorporated the changes...not too sure what exactly I was thinking. I'll switch to the max / max spread and a Timid nature immediately. I'm not really sure where I say that Infernape will be switching alot - NP Focus Blast OHKOs Mence after Stealth Rock anyway, so HP Ice would be for getting a hit in on incoming Latias (who Scizor will end up taking on one way or another anyway).

Manaphy works a lot better with rain up,
so I think this set might be better for you Scizor.
Scizor @ Damp Rock
-Technician
252 HP/252 Atk/4 Spe
-Rain Dance
-U-turn
-Roost
-Bullet Punch
Hope it helps!

Like I said...I'm not looking for a Rain Team, and Manaphy can function quite well without Rain - the weather condition is merely an added bonus. Thanks though.